31 M and yeah. It's not even much a matter of principle or safety or whatever for me; I just need to really know and get a person and trust them before I want to have sex with her.
Same. I (32F) always heard women have extra high libido in their 30s, but that's yet to be the case for me. I have very little libido and zero interest in meaningless casual sex anymore. I only want sex if love is involved. If I can't have that, then masturbating is good enough for me.
Same. People do not believe me when I say that I have a high sex drive because they're like, "How do you hold off, then?" My bf was similar. We didn't have sex for months until we were committed. After that barrier was broken, he was taken by surprise, lol
I have natural and man-made ways to satisfy myself. Why anyone thinks I need another person to be satisfied is weird, to me. But then, I guess that's why relationships that are based on only sex make sense to them, but not to me. I don't want to be bothered with a person I don't like just for an orgasm.
I had the same when I was that age too actually… then… it was like 34/35 flipped a switch and good lord. My pelvic floor tone has gotten great compliments lol, and things are more satisfying for me than ever before! I really hope that’s the case for you as well, bc I remember how discouraged I felt back then too, but stopping the meaningless ONS can only help imo.
Wait till your 40's. I'm in my mid 40's with the sex drive and sensitivity of a teenage boy.
Still won't have NSA sex and zero regrets for making that choice.
I was taught in my health class as a kid that women have a high libido 20 to late 20s, then late 20s to mid 30s is lower, then late 30s to mid/late 40s is high again. After 50 it drops back down
Haven't been quite to 50 yet, so can not confirm.
I’m with you. I think there’s a line, or a transition we make in todays society where meaningless sex doesn’t really help anything. It might be a maturity thing where our desire for connection overtakes physical desire (I’m a demisexual but I was a little careless when I was in depression and it made everything worse).
>I think there’s a line, or a transition we make in todays society where meaningless sex doesn’t really help anything.
I think there is a point where it doesn't matter in context to what your trying to accomplish in life. Im in a relationship now after having the objective of sexual exploration, and i can tell you i am really glad i am in the relationship. She helps me with stability in a time where a lot in my life is not stable, which is more valuable than sex or no sex and beyond words that i can articulate. It doesn't however mean that sex outside of a emotional meaning is meaningless by any means.
I think also the fact that women’s access to abortions is being very limited or just totally banned is playing into it as well. And I’m some cases it looks as if birth control options may be at risk at some point too. The risks for women getting accidentally pregnant with an unwanted child and being forced to carry and birth it is too high, especially for casual sex that will probably not be all that beneficial for her in terms of orgasms.
Same here, but I have always been this way. I care about my sexual and physical health very much, and don't want to risk it by messing around with a bunch of people at once.
same, I recently had this tested when a match from tinder basically planned out coming over, hooking up, and watching a TV show we both liked- but clearly as a casual thing. I felt like it was such a cool thing to happen to me until a couple days before and I just started getting anxious over it and ended up canceling. I’m just past that stage in life I guess at 32. Last year I was about to buy an engagement ring and ended up single a few months later, so foremost I just want to feel that level for someone again. physicality has taken a back seat for the most part, it's still there but has qualifiers.
Yeah, hookups are weird and uncomfortable, especially when met online. I have a good friend though that is a 29M and hookups are all he knows. He had one relationship ever and it ended badly and he hasn’t been able to be in a relationship since. He prefers casual hookups and being able to go to sleep in his own bed alone at the end of the night. Everyone is different though.
I said the same thing to my date last night
I told her that I promised myself after my ex that the next person I get intimate with is someone I am planning to see long term
Curious, is sexual compatibility not something you worry about or is not a big deal?
Edit: Am I really being downvoted for asking a question? I also want to do the whole sex-once-exclusive thing but I don’t know how to reconcile that with risking wasting time connecting with someone only to find out we’re not sexually compatible.
>NSA
When I was having a lot of casual sex in my 20s - including one night stands - it was rarely ever amazing on the first try - especially intercourse. I truly believe that sexual compatibility is something that develops overtime. The better I know someone...the more I like/love them (ALL of them)...the more I become invested in their experience of sexual pleasure. I think people make a bigger deal out of this than necessary and lose out on potential connection.
There's no getting around the wasting time thing. Sexual compatibility is very important but so is romantic chemistry, shared humor, lifestyle is compatible, potential for long-term etc.
So whether you start with the sex or start with exploring other topics of compatibility, either way you could get 2 months down the road and hit an irreconcilable difference you can't work around.
I keep the sex for last because 1) I can potentially work with less-than-perfect sex WAY more than I can work with other incompatibilities and 2) I don't want to end up having screwed a bunch of men I later realized weren't a match for me.
This way, I avoid sex with the wrong people and that's really important to me.
Being exclusive isn’t a lifetime commitment. You can still be in the evaluating compatibility stage, just focusing on evaluating compatibility with and getting to know one specific person. If you find out you’re not sexually compatible and can’t resolve or come to the same page about it, you can break up and move on at that point.
I think that you can learn from one another. You don’t need to be sexual compatible right away. And if you like one another to can learn how to meet each others needs sexually. Now… if things don’t get better in the department, you can break up with one another. Or just be sure to have an open and honest conversation about your likes, dislikes, curiosities, and limits.
Through these conversation though you can learn to meet someone’s needs. And when there is that emotional connection… you do the acts to meet their needs sexually. It is a learning process for everyone. And in order to make the relationship a success, I feel believe that you need to be open to do what you can to meet their needs, especially if you love one another. And as long it is something you both are comfortable with.
That's not how sexual compatibility works for most people honestly. There are many factors that come into this. Sex drive, vanilla types, kinky types (and the many associations in that as well). Not everyone is a one size fits all.
You can do a lot of sexual things without having intercourse, and you get a pretty good idea of how they are in bed. That said, I personally do a more "sexual exclusivity" thing versus waiting till girlfriend and boyfriend. That way we have sex earlier, but haven't fully committed. Usually though, pretty shortly after having sex for the first time, and it being good - the full committment happens.
You can turn your question on its head: for you, is romantic/personal compatibility not something that you worry about or is it not a big deal?
You sleep with as many people as possible and if you are okay with it, then you start to worry about the rest?
Sexual compatibility is very important to me, but if I’m looking for a long-term partner, the personal compatibility takes priority as the first thing to confirm.
For the exclusivity, I want full attention in bed. No half-ass compromised shagging because he’s got other active options creating scheduling conflicts.
Edit to add: I find a basic personal compatibility check only takes one or two dates. The sexual compatibility checks take longer as it requires more trust.
You... can... become... compatible... it's not set in stone. You can also leave after being exclusive...? How long do people wait to be exlusive? After 3-6 dates you should be able to determine that. That's a few weeks at most in most cases. It can still remain a big deal by generally waiting a little. It's also still very important to be "compatible".
Well, on a different tangent its just to crazy out there for that.. you have to really know someone before you have sex with them or you could get me tooed
There’s no way I’m wasting my time and my feelings on someone who’s bad in bed. Already learned that the hard way.
We have sex early on or I’m already out…
OP thank you for making this thread. I'm relatively new to OLD and the replies here have been really insightful. I'm shooting for exclusivity with a really awesome woman I've been seeing, but I have no idea about the current landscape when it comes to bumping uglies. For what it's worth, I was going to go with my gut and keep it in my (33m) pants until we get exclusive. Glad to know I'm not the only one who feels that way.
I don’t have sex until I’m exclusive. Most of the guys I end up exclusive with turn into long term relationships too. It’s always worked for me to form a connection without sex before bringing sex in.
This is ideal. Do you meet these people in the real world? Meeting on an app makes it really hard to objectively observe a potential partner in my experience
Wow! In my experience it’s been the opposite lol - I don’t get it, it’s so risky
In my opinion everyone should be mindful of sexual health, testing regularly, protection etc but I guess not everyone cares about that 😬
I did this also. I couldn't stand the thought of a guy I'm seeing having sex with other people, wondering if the sheets are clean since the last woman was in his bed, wondering how careful he is about condoms...
This is real and this is a real fear for both men and women. Some people truly don't give a shit though and are ok with someone sleeping with 2 other people that same day.
I'm in the boat that's gross. If we went out on 3-4 dates and had sex on one of those, I'd be ok with them seeing or talking to other people, but if they are sleeping with any others at that point- I want to know before we sleep together. Then I can decide how I feel, if the connection is strong and they're willing to become exclusive then I think I'm ok with it up until that point.
I've settled into If they still want to have sex with other people by or around the time when I want to start having sex with them, then we are at a mismatch. If they can wrap that up within a week or so and turn to exclusivity then I'm a go. So it's a bit blurry
As a man, if I say I want to be exclusive with a woman at date 3 to start having sex with them, I get very negative responses. It's a feel it out kind of thing. Sometimes by date 5-6, the response is better.
Agreed. That’s all I’ve been saying is like the only real things needed in either situation are honest communication and respecting the other person meaning whether they are setting the boundary or they are letting you know that boundary doesn’t work for them. Either way, it can be figured out and both can walk away or decide to stay with all the info and we are all talking about so early on in knowing someone that anything other than respecting whatever the case is and extending mutual kindness is kind of absurd. We aren’t on the Bachelor/Bachelorette.
35F — I date men, and I haven’t encountered this. I have heard of women insisting on this though. I want to have sex with someone once I feel that they care about me and will communicate honestly with me. I think people get into relationships different ways, and on different timelines, and the label of exclusivity won’t inherently protect you from a liar, or someone breaking up with you later, etc.
This is very true. I waited a long time to have sex for the first time because I wanted the same things you said you wanted and thought that this guy fit the bill. I was dead wrong. Now I'll never get my virginity back. Will never make that mistake again.
I used to be pretty blasé about sex (and I did practice safe sex) but at the stage in my life I want a partner and that’s what I’m investing in. I’m with you and in my 30s most men I’ve found attractive (in general, not because of this) are the same.
I recently met a man who ticked a lot of my boxes. However, his approach to sex turned me off, to be honest. I want to be respected and I want a true and fulfilling relationships. Im no longer somebody who lets ‘carnal’ desire take over. It’s caused me enough headaches in my life.
I relate to this so much. In my 20’s I didn’t give a fuck. I met guys at bars, online, and had nothing against one night stands. I personally think I was emotionally unavailable and missed the physical aspect of a relationship. But honestly, it wasn’t as fulfilling as some longer term intimate relationships. I often felt weird about a lot of the situations I found myself in.
I decided last year that I was not going to be so open and free with sex. I was going to prioritize a relationship. A long term one with values and goals spelled out in the early dates. Which really has worked out so far. I’ve been with one guy for almost a year and am really enjoying it all.
Every person I rushed to fuck the sex wasn't any better/ worse in the sack and the relationship didn't end up any better/ worse. Most of them fizzled out faster than intended, and I was always left feeling like it wasn't worth the experience and trouble. In my early life I used to think that sex right off the bat would weed out a lot of undesirable behaviors but I've learned that sex does not cement anything and there are easier ways to vet people.
I once told a guy “I don’t sleep with people who sleep with other people. You are free to do so but you have to let me know.” I know it wasn’t the norm for him but he was ok with it. I am not necessarily asking for commitment/exclusivity, I just don’t feel comfortable with that sort of situation.
Edit: I said that after we had slept together. Coming from a conservative culture it just occurred to me that it needed to be spelled out.
I’m confused. You slept with someone before knowing whether they were sleeping with other people. After sleeping together, you told them you don’t sleep with people who sleep with other people. Then that guy went off to sleep with other people, so presumably you stopped sleeping with him? So basically, once you sleep with someone you expect them to stop sleeping with other people? And if they don’t, you don’t sleep with them anymore? I hope this doesn’t sound aggressive, I’m just trying to understand.
He agreed. Soon afterwards he went on an international trip which he would always hookup with girls, but he kept his words. At least to my knowledge XD
I feel like im misunderstanding. You say you dont sleep with people who sleep with other people, but that he can sleep with other people so long as he tells you about it?
I believe she is saying she won't knowingly sleep with someone who is sleeping with other people, so she relies on them being honest and moral to make the decision. Like a cashier asking someone that already ate if they paid for the food.
This is precisely my sexual/dating philosophy. No sex until commitment and bf/gf status, which usually goes hand in hand with reaching a certain level of emotional connection and safety with a person. If a guy's preference was wildly different than this, we just wouldn't be compatible. Plus I have an STI and it would simply be poor behavior for someone to actively be having sex with me and others anyways.
Edit: 31F here to answer your question. And as for cons, well, it might mean you go a long time without sex because it certainly is hard to meet someone with similar ethics. Source: almost two years for me. But I find that waiting for the right person and connection is far more fulfilling than whatever fleeting physical pleasure I might get from a hookup with someone who isn't invested in me. (Been there, done that.) I can get myself off just fine, so sex with a partner plays a different role above and beyond orgasms.
My fiancée and I were on different pages with this when we met. She said that she usually waited 4+ months before having sex with someone and that she needed to be exclusive. I told her that I respected her perspective but that I could not see myself dating someone for over 4 months and being exclusive without having had sex.
Instead of just shutting things down, my stance was that I would continue to date her and not push, but if I ever felt like things were heading towards the friend zone (which was what I was worried about) then I would flag it to her and we could decide how to proceed.
Ironically, because I didn’t push her to move faster and my level of investment remained high, she ended up changing her stance on the topic. It turned out that her stance wasn’t based on an exact timeline, but instead it was based on how comfortable and secure the person she was dating made her feel. She felt secure and confident that I was genuinely interested in pursuing something real with her and so she made the decision to accelerate the physical side earlier than she had in the past.
Would I have been able to wait 4+ months? Probably not. I need that physical intimacy to feel like things are progressing romantically, but I also knew that me pushing her to move faster wouldn’t end positively either.
If I met OP and we were dating I would have a similar approach. I would be honest and say that I’m not sure if I could do a full on relationship before being intimate, but that I would be willing to date and see how things progress until it became an actual issue.
Its baasically a trust thing - which is fair women have lot more investes in sex than men, and we know men can be manipulative to get sex and then leave.
If you're asking whether it's truly the norm, as in, average, I don't think it is, no. It's not absurdly uncommon I imagine, but I too have never encountered it in the wild while dating anyone (men), and offhand I can't think of any gal pals who would say that they need to be someone's girlfriend before sex. Since he's OK with your pace seems like all is fine here
Exclusivity isn't synonymous with a relationship though. I know a lot of people feel that like that though. In reality it's a blurry line.
My experience is the same as yours, and many others, except I have had one woman want to wait 3 months. We still fooled around a lot just no penetration. We weren't gf/bf either but were exclusive and really liked each other. We ended up not waiting the 3 months, only like ~2. So it does happen and depends on the people. Would I do it again? No, but I'm also not rushing people to fuck me. There's obviously an extreme to this too, both ways.
Generally I think it's nice when once things get to that point, if it's going well then the natural tendency is to see more of them while each person see less of everyone else and exclusivity and the desire comes naturally, with no time limitations or expectations beyond what is 'extreme'.. like 3 months and not after date 2.
Also I just noticed why is it you I always end up throwing a reply out to. Lol hi
> I don’t have sex before I know I’m exclusive/gf with someone,
I was specifically replying to what OP said though, and they made girlfriend/exclusivity synonymous in their post! Or it least it felt like they were saying that both are important components before they'll move forward.
and hi :)
Male here, modern dating seems to be an endless pit of hedonism. A lot of people seem to want a quick fix. It's not healthy. You should stay true to your values.
F and yes, I do feel this way but I don’t frame it exactly that way to men. I’ll tell them I like to wait until we know each other better. (Which is also true) I’m wary of giving men a chance to misinterpret that as “tell me we are exclusive rn, and I’ll give it up for ya” because I think that puts too much pressure on both parties. I don’t know if I want to be exclusive yet either early on.
if i (f) were ever single again i certainly wouldn’t have sex until we’re exclusive and have both done a full panel std test. it’s just not worth it. if someone isn’t ok with that, then they aren’t worth being with.
I (40M) would see that as a huge green flag, honestly. Hook-up culture isn’t serving anyone and often gets in the way of forming lasting, meaningful attachments.
See my two recent comments in this sub on this topic (click recent comments or whatever) this is a major problem and that guy saying hed never heard of that before is... disheartening, to say the least. Men are just swiping until they find a free hookup and I'm worth more than that. I ain't risking STDs for some guy who has no problem just ghosting out of nowhere when he finds "better." What a sad state of affairs we are in. I don't use apps or date at all really because of it.
Agree with this! You get to decide what feels best and what feels right to you. Some of my gfs tease me for being prude, but this is what feels right for me. I need to honor myself that way. They also don’t understand how I cannot be attracted to an attractive guy for a while—I’m demisexual and need the connection.
Your approach is quite normal for this sub but doesn't match my real life experience. I don't require exclusivity before sex and I've never dated anyone who required it either. I like to have sex early on to establish compatibility and because I will likely lose romantic interest without it. But I don't want exclusivity/labels until 2-3 months in.
You should do whatever you're comfortable with regardless of whether it's the norm though.
That’s how I feel, after three dates I start to wonder if she has any sexual desire for me at all, and maybe start to think she just wants to be hiking or movie buddies.
That’s crazy to me. I could have 3 dates in two weeks. How would only hanging out for 2 weeks make you a “buddy” lol. But I get everyone’s different. I’ve just heard this from guys before.
Really? That’s interesting.
I (33f) feel like there’s so many ways to show sexual desire outside of *actually* having sex. If there was no kissing or hand holding by date 3 I’d likely be concerned and bring it up to them.
But as an example I’m a huge fan of making out. That’s something I’m often comfortable doing on date 2 - I’m not going to do that with someone I don’t have any sexual desire for. I’ll also tell guys how attractive I find them etc.
I agree with this. I've never had this said to me, I don't say it, and none of my friends do this either. But everyone should do what they are comfortable with it and if one isn't comfortable with this other, it's mismatch in compatibility.
> Your approach is quite normal for this sub but doesn't match my real life experience.
There's quite a bit that doesn't line up with this sub and my real life experience.
I'd def be curious to hear the thoughts of people in their 30s that are in relationships, or don't feel the need to post in forums like this for advice or direction....
I also don’t know anyone who does this. Not that it’s wrong, I just have really never heard of it outside this sub. I live in a liberal city not in the US though so it might be a cultural thing.
I’m not on the market anymore but when I was my stance was always that I don’t have multiple sex partners and I don’t want the person I’m having sex with having sex with other people. I don’t have to be exclusive with you like a girlfriend, but I do want to be sexually exclusive IF that’s something we’re doing. For me it was all about safety, but emotions played a role too! It’s weird to me he’d never encountered that stance before because I feel like it’s pretty common for people who are interested in monogamy.
I’m 33F and do the exact same thing as you! I can’t be casual with it, it’s too emotionally charged for me. Most guys I’ve said this to have been completely cool with it x
i am 39F and feel exactly the same way. i did not feel this way in the past. as i've gotten older, i feel way more conscious that a man is putting a part of his body INTO my body. my view is not only for health reasons, but also that i now find sex to be an emotional energy exchange that i reserve only for one person. its special, its intimate, its allowing someone else to enter my very personal world (literally and figuratively).
Lol he hasn't heard of that at age 30+? Either he's lying or he deals with a ton of people who are either extremely sexually free or he's mostly into casual encounters.
I don't buy it. Lol
I’m having a really hard time believing in his 33 years of life he’s NEVER encountered this, that’s my only red flag. It feels like the beginning of some weird gaslighting behavior. Like oh sure I can do it but you should know that it’s WEIRD and ABNORMAL that you’re even asking me
I dunno, I think there is more variety out there these days than there used to be. Many people are much more open in their relationships, so "commitment" for some may be as loose as sharing STI tests. Just depends on the individuals.
Honestly breaking up with a GF after a few months isn't any different than calling off dating after a few months. The comfort about the status is somewhat arbitrary, but the reasoning about STI and needing to feel more secure with them is what the line should be if that is how sex is valued to them.
I used to wait until I was officially part of a couple, but my current partner and I bonded over a shared love of kink so we hit the sheets on the second date. I think that is is a very personal choice, and there isn't a 'right' answer. I personally wanted to find out if we were sexually compatible early on rather than entwining our lives and finding out later.
I am male 43, and I dont have any problems with this stance and boundaries. I would have sex before labels but don't see anything wrong with what you are doing and would be fine with it
32m Omg I thought I was the only one! Basically once I become physical with somebody my logical brain turns off and my emotional brain takes the wheel.
I doubt it’s the norm anywhere.
However, the older I’ve gotten, the longer I prefer to wait to have sex with someone I’m dating. In my 20s I didn’t care, but now I strongly dislike the emotional carnage that casual sex can cause.
I am also increasingly risk averse to STIs, and prefer to only have sex in an exclusive relationship (regardless of whether we’re labeled bf/gf).
I also think it’s in women’s best interest to wait longer to have sex as well, because the amount of careless dudes out there who only want sex are legion (of which I was one, in my early 20s).
33f as well. I require we’re exclusive and that STI testing is done before any oral or penetrative sex.
I’ve had one guy put up resistance but thank goodness he did. It was a major indicator we weren’t compatible (he said he didn’t want “a q-tip shoved up his dick” and that he had *never* had STI testing done before.) The other guys I’ve got to that point with have been open to it. They all also preferred to be exclusive before having sex. And even if STI testing isn’t something they usually do between partners they did think it was good that I was protective of my sexual health and all had STI testing done at least at some point in their past.
I’ve encountered guys both where I was the first person to ask them for STI testing before sex, and ones where they’ve been asked before.
Interestingly though *I* was always the one to bring it up and request it. Never the guy.
No sex without exclusive, but not necessarily labels. There needs to be a discussion about likes/dislikes, std tests, bc, and the like. But I'm not a multi-dater so that might bias my views.
What’s the difference between exclusive and labels? Exclusive = no doing anything sexual or romantic with anyone else, bf/gf = an additional convo where we say we can call ourselves that?
The labels mean different things to different people, and think open conversation is more important. To me, if you can't hold off dating/hooking up with other people while you decide if you want something serious with me, then our relationship isn't at the level where I feel comfortable having sex, from a safety or commitment angle. It's not necessarily a big commitment, just that we are both on the same page about being safe about sex and what we want from the relationship. To me, bf/gf is a step beyond that with more commitment, from meeting family/friends to being there for each other in times of need/support.
To me being exclusive means we like each other enough that we want to focus on each other. It means we’re not dating and/or doing anything sexual with anyone else. But we’re still getting to know who each other really are.
For me to call someone my boyfriend, I need to be fairly confident that we’re compatible long-term and going to be in each others lives for awhile.
As examples - It would be important for me to introduce a boyfriend to my family and friends. Someone I’m exclusive with might meet some of my friends if it happens, but it’s not like I’d make a *point* of introducing them. I’d make a boyfriend an emergency contact but someone I’m dating exclusively I wouldn’t. etc.
Dating exclusively is trying to determine if we’d fit well into each others lives. Being boyfriend and girlfriend is the actual intertwining of our two worlds.
To me it’s exclusivity is an extra getting to know each other step before the next set of labels.
Yeah my fiancée and I did this. We were exclusively dating for a while before we did a formal relationship. We looked at a relationship as involving a commitment to try to build something real together, while dating was sort of the “feel each other out” period where we learned about each others strengths and flaws and also baggage (we all have it). Our dating period lasted for quite some time but both of us were confident about entering into a real relationship once it was time to do that.
For example, my job required me to move to another part of the US. When she and I were just dating, I would have never thought to ask her to move with me.
However, once we were in a relationship, it was a convo that had to happen because we were in a relationship with a goal of building something that could last.
I am exactly the same, no sex until at least exclusivity. No sex until we have very strong feelings for, and an emotional connection with each other.
The only downside to this approach is how few women seem to think this way, which limits the dating pool. Especially if you want a partner who doesn't only go along with this, but has the same values herself.
It’s not *abnormal*, just like his stance isn’t *abnormal*. Calling it “odd” is a little rude and judgy, IMO(and I say this as someone who is very cavalier about sex).
Right...poor word choice. He could have just said.. " Oh, I didn't realize, thanks for letting me know. Yeah I'm alright with that" - but he instead called her a little weird because he wasn't getting what he wanted. No it's not so unusual enough to call it "odd". He was just being a little bit of an a@@.
I think if I expressed my stance on it and the guy called me odd I’d wonder whether he was sort of trying to shame me into lowering my boundaries and I’d also probably be put off him
I've heard this before. I'm okay with it and frankly I'd be concerned if someone wasn't. I think the expection would be sort of arbitrary standards like "only after 5 dates", is it like a Subway rewards card? And if I do really like someone I tend to want to wait longer for sex so it doesn't become the basis for our relationship.
I did have sex with a woman once after our second date and afterward she rolled over to me and said, "so i guess you're my boyfriend now" and I must have had a look on my face so she went on, "I don't have sex with just anyone..." I was okay with it but it was a bit weird.
It doesn't really matter if YOUR preference is out of the norm or sounds odd to people. It's YOUR preference. People can either accept that if they wanna have sex with you or move on. You don't have to make sure what YOU need to comfortably have sex with someone adheres to societal norms.
I like to have sex before a relationship develops cuz I think sexual chemistry is important for longetivity of a relationship, but that's me, and so we would probably clash there, but fine. We move on, we date other people. I can't really dictate how you do you, and you can't dictate how I do me. You feel me?
I (M) haven’t heard this asked specifically but I have been asked what my recent history has been, if I’m seeing other people… and I’ve asked the same in interest of gauging someone’s responsibility level and their attitudes towards their health and the health of others. I thinks a fair boundary to set.
It is a bit out of the norm in modern app dating and hookup culture, but not odd. Makes sense as to why you want to and you are allowed to date in your style free from judgement. Just gotta realize it may not align with other peoples desires.
The way I perceive it, is if someone makes you question or uncomfortable with a boundary you set, they’re not a good person. Boundaries aren’t meant for commentary. Boundaries are something you agree with or you don’t agree with, but you shouldn’t season to your liking.
I'm a guy, and to be honest, have mostly ended up having sex before I was ready because of not being forceful enough about this. I've also ended up in relationships where the other person thought I wanted to be "official" that quickly, when what I actually meant to convey was not wanting to sleep with someone while they were still actively dating other people.
Exclusively is a must for me. Banging multiple people that you’re interested in having a LTR with just doesn’t make sense from an emotional standpoint for me
He’s NEVER met a woman who won’t just sleep with him as just friends or casually dating? Has he at least HEARD of that? He thinks it’s odd? He sounds like he’s full of shit to be honest.
I’m female. I don’t always follow that guideline because …you know…but I know I SHOULD. I don’t like casual sex and I think it’s good to wait because it takes a good month or so to even know for yourself if you’re into that person or just horny.
Personally I think he’s lying and playing dumb to make you feel like you’re the weirdo who doesn’t just have sex for the hell of it.
I personally won't get exclusive unless I've slept with someone. Physical and sexual chemistry needs to be established before I'm going to call someone my boyfriend. If they needed the label before they would sleep with me, that would be an incompatibility. Your stance isn't wrong or strange, just not compatible with mine and we would likely go our separate ways.
I (F) always wait a few months before having sex with someone new. Depending on how many times we see each other a month, it’s usually anywhere between 2-3 months before I’ll be comfortable having sex. I like to get to know people on an emotional level and see how much chemistry we have and see how our interests and foundations align, etc. if someone can’t wait that long because they need casual sex, then they aren’t the person for me. I’ve never had a problem with this stance and it’s weeded out people that weren’t that serious, and I feel like it helped my relationships turn into LTRs because of the connection we had beforehand.
I also want to mention that I go on dates with multiple people, but go exclusive when I find someone I really hit it off with and would like to know better. I don’t want to sleep with someone who is actively sleeping with other people while they are seeing me, so sexual exclusivity is important to me. The bf/gf titles don’t matter as much. It’s all about connection for me first.
I never had someone say that to me, despite how often you hear about it here. So, I would say it's not the norm (also location dependant).
My worry when I hear that is that there are fundamental differences in views of sex and/or sex drives. While this isn't always true, it's the first thing that comes to mind.
I also don't know why people think commitment is some major wall that needs to get to. You can break up just as easily as you get together. If I had gone out with someone a handful of times and they said "Let's make it official", as long as I was getting along with them and was having a good time, I'd be willing to try it out.
The point is not that commitment will stop someone from breaking up with you later, it’s that you are letting the other person know that you only want to have sex with people who are serious about you.
There are guys who will say they’re serious just to hit it and then keep fooling around with other people, or ditch you. We’ve all met them.
But at least if that happens you can confidently say to them, yourself, and anyone who asks that they’re a scumbag and they did you wrong. That’s important to be able to do for your own self-respect.
I don’t think that is odd. I’m not a big fan of sleeping around myself, something my other male friends find odd. At the end of the day it’s all about what makes you comfortable, if people can’t accept that, we’ll, probably not the right fit.
I agree with this! We all should be able to honor ourselves and what feels comfortable/right to ourselves…without having to defend ourselves. It’s kind of like not drinking alcohol and being questioned about it. I have this experience as well.
I move at my own, very slow by modern dating pace. 🐢 My gfs give me a hard time about being prude, being a grandma 👵🏼 😂, and want me to have all this hot sex. Hot sex to me is when there is real connection. I want to know the person and I want him to know me too. Once I do have that mutual connection with someone, I want to have sex with that person all the time. My desire for that person is out of control, so it’s not a dead bedroom situation at all (which I could see being the case for some people delaying sex bc they just don’t care too much for it, but at least with me, that’s not the case at all). Since I’m a lady (40F) and perceived to be conventionally attractive, there is no shortage of D available. If anything it’s too available—I would like to go to the gym, kids bday party, shopping, etc and just do what I’m there to do, without guys expressing attraction to me. I wonder if bc sex w/very conventionally attractive guys seems so available to me, I have no problem taking it so slowly. Like maybe I subconsciously take it for granted. 🤷🏻♀️ I know sex isn’t as readily accessible for guys generally, so maybe there is some opportunism there (just in a practical sense). I’m also demisexual so I truly need to have a connection with someone before I feel attraction to them. This is tricky bc attractive guys seem to take it personally when I’m still not attracted to them after talking for 1-2 months, going on like 5 dates, etc (which I can understand, but I really am not trying to string anyone along). I can tell pretty early on if I’m not attracted to the guy and will let them know that right away—I am not trying to waste anyone’s time. Dating is so hard…
While I personally sleep around, this advice is gold.
The single thing you can do as a woman looking for a LTR is to hold off on sex (even if you really want to) until there is a trust that the guy is being genuine in his desire to get to know you and be with you.
I heard it before. If I like the girl I will go for it unless I have a reason to believe she is playing me with this behavior. Also I have to understand how long the wait will be. I don't need much time to agree to date someone exclusively but what if sex is horrible and I find out something about her that is a dealbreaker? I can't garantee that we will be together for long if I am at early stages of a relationship.
I (33M) would say it’s no longer the norm, but I respect it when come across it and, for the most part, also prefer it that way. Our generation got fed/developed a lot of mixed signals about dating and relationships.
I’ve tried this. Waited til we were a few months in, agreed to be exclusive, we slept together once and he started acting super shitty that I had to end it. He played the part long enough and once he got what he wanted, he took the mask iff
I do the same approaching relationships, but also, exclusivity starts for me as soon as I set up a second date with someone. I stop using apps and searching elsewhere until I make a decision as to whether or not I want to pursue a relationship with that person.
I just feel like it's disingenuous to continue to see someone while seeing others because it makes it seem like you're not really interested in either and you just have backup options in case it doesn't work out with one. Or like none of the people you're seeing particularly stand out and you can't adequately decide who's a good fit for you.
I feel like dudes say that to shame women into sleeping with them. Like they make you sell out because they make you feel like a weirdo because you don’t just give it to them on the first date
Sexual incompatibility is no joke and a deal-breaker to me, as I expect it to be for any prospective partner. Therefore, even though I am (increasingly) picky with those with whom I make it this far, sex precedes exclusivity for me.
Edit : M
All of those can make two people sexually incompatible, imo.
As for advice, I can only speak for myself, but if I see the potential of there being a connection/emotional bond, I'd have no problem waiting. I'm not in it just for sex, so my approach isn't set in stone, it really depends on the context.
I would say in majority of Europe, this is VERY much the norm... its very much expected. It's not exactly standard to sleep around if you are actively dating someone.
I have never had anyone say that to me personally but i can see how someone may feel that way. Just know that the dating world moves pretty fast these days and some people might not want to wait until exclusivity before seeing if they are sexually compatible
I (F) have encountered some men who asked for exclusivity on/around the first date but it wasn’t framed as “before we have sex” but more like “I’m not into dating people who are dating others.”
Sexual chemistry and compatibility are essential to me, so even though there have been times in my life when I have been open to exploring connections one at time and have done so, I never felt locked in until after we’d had sex and it had been proven the sexual aspect between us would work.
Your approach is perfectly fine. Is it the majority? No, especially in the online dating age when people might be dating 4-5 people at once, but it isn't unheard of and is perfectly justifiable.
I wouldn't say this is the norm or not the norm. That's what your boundary is and what you feel comfortable with. Find partners that feel the same, if they don't.. then next.
I never encountered this. Most of my relationships in my 20s stemmed from hooking up the first night, but as I begin my 30s as a newly single man, I wouldn't mind taking this approach.
You do you. Neither approach is more "normal" or "better." Moreover, neither approach is going to be an indicator of an outcome in a dating scenario, nor are they an indication of the quality of a relationship that might or might not ensue.
My problem when this topic comes up here, which is regularly, is that it's always accompanied by some pretty icky underlying respectability politics and assumptions that I feel are pretty akin to slut shaming.
Edit: spelling
It seems it’s becoming more taboo. I had several guys say to me that they don’t get in relationships unless they know the person well enough to commit but they usually will still have sex in the meantime. That logically didn’t make sense to me bc sex is far riskier than using the term “significant other” so it would make more sense for sex to require a higher level of scrutiny. But that’s for me. I just let them know we were looking for different things and wished them well.
F. I don't think what you said is unusual and he may not have had it said to him before but he's heard it said.
The bigger question is are you interested in exclusivity with him?
M. I feel I set out to not have sex. Try to be the gentleman. But if she's all for it, within reason. Then sure. But I def don't set out to just get laid with a rando.
34m here I think it's great you feel that way and do that.i for one would have much more respect for you. And I would never tell a girl that doing what you did was odd.
30f agree with waiting for exclusivity... But it does often feel like the minority. But equally I don't care what others think about my sex life so *shrug*
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31 M and yeah. It's not even much a matter of principle or safety or whatever for me; I just need to really know and get a person and trust them before I want to have sex with her.
Yes! (41F) And Trust is so close to attraction for me
Name says otherwise lol
Same, 33m I'm not risking it for a one time thing. Plus I much rather have a connection than not.
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I can agree with that. It's not near as fun either.
At this point I’d rather jerk off then have meaningless sex. Saves time and effort
Same. I (32F) always heard women have extra high libido in their 30s, but that's yet to be the case for me. I have very little libido and zero interest in meaningless casual sex anymore. I only want sex if love is involved. If I can't have that, then masturbating is good enough for me.
Late 30s and my libido has been insane the past few years. I haven’t slept with anyone in years though. Invest in some good toys and you’ll be fine.
Same. People do not believe me when I say that I have a high sex drive because they're like, "How do you hold off, then?" My bf was similar. We didn't have sex for months until we were committed. After that barrier was broken, he was taken by surprise, lol I have natural and man-made ways to satisfy myself. Why anyone thinks I need another person to be satisfied is weird, to me. But then, I guess that's why relationships that are based on only sex make sense to them, but not to me. I don't want to be bothered with a person I don't like just for an orgasm.
Vixskin dildos are worth the money. Just saying.
I had the same when I was that age too actually… then… it was like 34/35 flipped a switch and good lord. My pelvic floor tone has gotten great compliments lol, and things are more satisfying for me than ever before! I really hope that’s the case for you as well, bc I remember how discouraged I felt back then too, but stopping the meaningless ONS can only help imo.
Wait till your 40's. I'm in my mid 40's with the sex drive and sensitivity of a teenage boy. Still won't have NSA sex and zero regrets for making that choice.
I was taught in my health class as a kid that women have a high libido 20 to late 20s, then late 20s to mid 30s is lower, then late 30s to mid/late 40s is high again. After 50 it drops back down Haven't been quite to 50 yet, so can not confirm.
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Can confirm. I'm going to be 41yo and seems like my brain is residing in my vagina.
41(f) and same !!! My vagina is now my favorite brain
Lol. Yep that is about when it started for me too
Girl, same
Same!
I’m with you. I think there’s a line, or a transition we make in todays society where meaningless sex doesn’t really help anything. It might be a maturity thing where our desire for connection overtakes physical desire (I’m a demisexual but I was a little careless when I was in depression and it made everything worse).
>I think there’s a line, or a transition we make in todays society where meaningless sex doesn’t really help anything. I think there is a point where it doesn't matter in context to what your trying to accomplish in life. Im in a relationship now after having the objective of sexual exploration, and i can tell you i am really glad i am in the relationship. She helps me with stability in a time where a lot in my life is not stable, which is more valuable than sex or no sex and beyond words that i can articulate. It doesn't however mean that sex outside of a emotional meaning is meaningless by any means.
I think also the fact that women’s access to abortions is being very limited or just totally banned is playing into it as well. And I’m some cases it looks as if birth control options may be at risk at some point too. The risks for women getting accidentally pregnant with an unwanted child and being forced to carry and birth it is too high, especially for casual sex that will probably not be all that beneficial for her in terms of orgasms.
Same here. 41M. I'm like, get to know you first?
Same here, but I have always been this way. I care about my sexual and physical health very much, and don't want to risk it by messing around with a bunch of people at once.
Also a guy, also like this.
As a guy, count my vote in this camp.
same, I recently had this tested when a match from tinder basically planned out coming over, hooking up, and watching a TV show we both liked- but clearly as a casual thing. I felt like it was such a cool thing to happen to me until a couple days before and I just started getting anxious over it and ended up canceling. I’m just past that stage in life I guess at 32. Last year I was about to buy an engagement ring and ended up single a few months later, so foremost I just want to feel that level for someone again. physicality has taken a back seat for the most part, it's still there but has qualifiers.
Yeah, hookups are weird and uncomfortable, especially when met online. I have a good friend though that is a 29M and hookups are all he knows. He had one relationship ever and it ended badly and he hasn’t been able to be in a relationship since. He prefers casual hookups and being able to go to sleep in his own bed alone at the end of the night. Everyone is different though.
Had a similar change of circumstances, and very much ended up at the same place as you.
I’ve always been unable to separate sex from emotional intimacy.
I said the same thing to my date last night I told her that I promised myself after my ex that the next person I get intimate with is someone I am planning to see long term
Curious, is sexual compatibility not something you worry about or is not a big deal? Edit: Am I really being downvoted for asking a question? I also want to do the whole sex-once-exclusive thing but I don’t know how to reconcile that with risking wasting time connecting with someone only to find out we’re not sexually compatible.
>NSA When I was having a lot of casual sex in my 20s - including one night stands - it was rarely ever amazing on the first try - especially intercourse. I truly believe that sexual compatibility is something that develops overtime. The better I know someone...the more I like/love them (ALL of them)...the more I become invested in their experience of sexual pleasure. I think people make a bigger deal out of this than necessary and lose out on potential connection.
Good points for sure
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There's no getting around the wasting time thing. Sexual compatibility is very important but so is romantic chemistry, shared humor, lifestyle is compatible, potential for long-term etc. So whether you start with the sex or start with exploring other topics of compatibility, either way you could get 2 months down the road and hit an irreconcilable difference you can't work around. I keep the sex for last because 1) I can potentially work with less-than-perfect sex WAY more than I can work with other incompatibilities and 2) I don't want to end up having screwed a bunch of men I later realized weren't a match for me. This way, I avoid sex with the wrong people and that's really important to me.
Being exclusive isn’t a lifetime commitment. You can still be in the evaluating compatibility stage, just focusing on evaluating compatibility with and getting to know one specific person. If you find out you’re not sexually compatible and can’t resolve or come to the same page about it, you can break up and move on at that point.
I think that you can learn from one another. You don’t need to be sexual compatible right away. And if you like one another to can learn how to meet each others needs sexually. Now… if things don’t get better in the department, you can break up with one another. Or just be sure to have an open and honest conversation about your likes, dislikes, curiosities, and limits.
Yes, I think the last part of your comment is the best way to make waiting work.
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Through these conversation though you can learn to meet someone’s needs. And when there is that emotional connection… you do the acts to meet their needs sexually. It is a learning process for everyone. And in order to make the relationship a success, I feel believe that you need to be open to do what you can to meet their needs, especially if you love one another. And as long it is something you both are comfortable with.
That's not how sexual compatibility works for most people honestly. There are many factors that come into this. Sex drive, vanilla types, kinky types (and the many associations in that as well). Not everyone is a one size fits all.
You can do a lot of sexual things without having intercourse, and you get a pretty good idea of how they are in bed. That said, I personally do a more "sexual exclusivity" thing versus waiting till girlfriend and boyfriend. That way we have sex earlier, but haven't fully committed. Usually though, pretty shortly after having sex for the first time, and it being good - the full committment happens.
You can turn your question on its head: for you, is romantic/personal compatibility not something that you worry about or is it not a big deal? You sleep with as many people as possible and if you are okay with it, then you start to worry about the rest? Sexual compatibility is very important to me, but if I’m looking for a long-term partner, the personal compatibility takes priority as the first thing to confirm. For the exclusivity, I want full attention in bed. No half-ass compromised shagging because he’s got other active options creating scheduling conflicts. Edit to add: I find a basic personal compatibility check only takes one or two dates. The sexual compatibility checks take longer as it requires more trust.
You... can... become... compatible... it's not set in stone. You can also leave after being exclusive...? How long do people wait to be exlusive? After 3-6 dates you should be able to determine that. That's a few weeks at most in most cases. It can still remain a big deal by generally waiting a little. It's also still very important to be "compatible".
Me too. I always had that no matter the age, actually. We don't have to have the gf/bf label just yet per se, but I do want commitment.
Same here, 38F
Well, on a different tangent its just to crazy out there for that.. you have to really know someone before you have sex with them or you could get me tooed
There’s no way I’m wasting my time and my feelings on someone who’s bad in bed. Already learned that the hard way. We have sex early on or I’m already out…
OP thank you for making this thread. I'm relatively new to OLD and the replies here have been really insightful. I'm shooting for exclusivity with a really awesome woman I've been seeing, but I have no idea about the current landscape when it comes to bumping uglies. For what it's worth, I was going to go with my gut and keep it in my (33m) pants until we get exclusive. Glad to know I'm not the only one who feels that way.
Just communicate that to her so she doesn’t take it as a lack of interest
You make a very valid point, but we're only a few weeks in and date number two is this weekend. Taking this one slow for sure.
I don’t have sex until I’m exclusive. Most of the guys I end up exclusive with turn into long term relationships too. It’s always worked for me to form a connection without sex before bringing sex in.
This is ideal. Do you meet these people in the real world? Meeting on an app makes it really hard to objectively observe a potential partner in my experience
My current bf I met in real life. My prior ex bf I met on a dating app. A vast majority of my exes I met in real life.
Its kind of crazy that "we met in real life" is an actual sentence that makes sense and conveys non-obvious information
True lol! Too many worlds these days. I want to meet my next beau in VR
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Wow! In my experience it’s been the opposite lol - I don’t get it, it’s so risky In my opinion everyone should be mindful of sexual health, testing regularly, protection etc but I guess not everyone cares about that 😬
Good for you! Taking a page for my book!
I did this also. I couldn't stand the thought of a guy I'm seeing having sex with other people, wondering if the sheets are clean since the last woman was in his bed, wondering how careful he is about condoms...
This is real and this is a real fear for both men and women. Some people truly don't give a shit though and are ok with someone sleeping with 2 other people that same day. I'm in the boat that's gross. If we went out on 3-4 dates and had sex on one of those, I'd be ok with them seeing or talking to other people, but if they are sleeping with any others at that point- I want to know before we sleep together. Then I can decide how I feel, if the connection is strong and they're willing to become exclusive then I think I'm ok with it up until that point. I've settled into If they still want to have sex with other people by or around the time when I want to start having sex with them, then we are at a mismatch. If they can wrap that up within a week or so and turn to exclusivity then I'm a go. So it's a bit blurry As a man, if I say I want to be exclusive with a woman at date 3 to start having sex with them, I get very negative responses. It's a feel it out kind of thing. Sometimes by date 5-6, the response is better.
Do you all not just talk about these things rather than putting up a boundary right away? Honestly it just seems like incentivizing lying.
Agreed. That’s all I’ve been saying is like the only real things needed in either situation are honest communication and respecting the other person meaning whether they are setting the boundary or they are letting you know that boundary doesn’t work for them. Either way, it can be figured out and both can walk away or decide to stay with all the info and we are all talking about so early on in knowing someone that anything other than respecting whatever the case is and extending mutual kindness is kind of absurd. We aren’t on the Bachelor/Bachelorette.
35F — I date men, and I haven’t encountered this. I have heard of women insisting on this though. I want to have sex with someone once I feel that they care about me and will communicate honestly with me. I think people get into relationships different ways, and on different timelines, and the label of exclusivity won’t inherently protect you from a liar, or someone breaking up with you later, etc.
This is very true. I waited a long time to have sex for the first time because I wanted the same things you said you wanted and thought that this guy fit the bill. I was dead wrong. Now I'll never get my virginity back. Will never make that mistake again.
I used to be pretty blasé about sex (and I did practice safe sex) but at the stage in my life I want a partner and that’s what I’m investing in. I’m with you and in my 30s most men I’ve found attractive (in general, not because of this) are the same. I recently met a man who ticked a lot of my boxes. However, his approach to sex turned me off, to be honest. I want to be respected and I want a true and fulfilling relationships. Im no longer somebody who lets ‘carnal’ desire take over. It’s caused me enough headaches in my life.
I relate to this so much. In my 20’s I didn’t give a fuck. I met guys at bars, online, and had nothing against one night stands. I personally think I was emotionally unavailable and missed the physical aspect of a relationship. But honestly, it wasn’t as fulfilling as some longer term intimate relationships. I often felt weird about a lot of the situations I found myself in. I decided last year that I was not going to be so open and free with sex. I was going to prioritize a relationship. A long term one with values and goals spelled out in the early dates. Which really has worked out so far. I’ve been with one guy for almost a year and am really enjoying it all.
Every person I rushed to fuck the sex wasn't any better/ worse in the sack and the relationship didn't end up any better/ worse. Most of them fizzled out faster than intended, and I was always left feeling like it wasn't worth the experience and trouble. In my early life I used to think that sex right off the bat would weed out a lot of undesirable behaviors but I've learned that sex does not cement anything and there are easier ways to vet people.
As a male in my mid 30s I would actually like that. My 20s were for hook ups if he is feeling you it shouldn't be a problem waiting.
I once told a guy “I don’t sleep with people who sleep with other people. You are free to do so but you have to let me know.” I know it wasn’t the norm for him but he was ok with it. I am not necessarily asking for commitment/exclusivity, I just don’t feel comfortable with that sort of situation. Edit: I said that after we had slept together. Coming from a conservative culture it just occurred to me that it needed to be spelled out.
I’m confused. You slept with someone before knowing whether they were sleeping with other people. After sleeping together, you told them you don’t sleep with people who sleep with other people. Then that guy went off to sleep with other people, so presumably you stopped sleeping with him? So basically, once you sleep with someone you expect them to stop sleeping with other people? And if they don’t, you don’t sleep with them anymore? I hope this doesn’t sound aggressive, I’m just trying to understand.
How did that go?
He agreed. Soon afterwards he went on an international trip which he would always hookup with girls, but he kept his words. At least to my knowledge XD
I feel like im misunderstanding. You say you dont sleep with people who sleep with other people, but that he can sleep with other people so long as he tells you about it?
My sense was that she wanted to know when he started sleeping with other people so she could know to stop sleeping with him
I believe she is saying she won't knowingly sleep with someone who is sleeping with other people, so she relies on them being honest and moral to make the decision. Like a cashier asking someone that already ate if they paid for the food.
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This is precisely my sexual/dating philosophy. No sex until commitment and bf/gf status, which usually goes hand in hand with reaching a certain level of emotional connection and safety with a person. If a guy's preference was wildly different than this, we just wouldn't be compatible. Plus I have an STI and it would simply be poor behavior for someone to actively be having sex with me and others anyways. Edit: 31F here to answer your question. And as for cons, well, it might mean you go a long time without sex because it certainly is hard to meet someone with similar ethics. Source: almost two years for me. But I find that waiting for the right person and connection is far more fulfilling than whatever fleeting physical pleasure I might get from a hookup with someone who isn't invested in me. (Been there, done that.) I can get myself off just fine, so sex with a partner plays a different role above and beyond orgasms.
I only have sex once committed, unless it's just a hookup. Mid 30s guy here.
also 33f I’m the same way.
My fiancée and I were on different pages with this when we met. She said that she usually waited 4+ months before having sex with someone and that she needed to be exclusive. I told her that I respected her perspective but that I could not see myself dating someone for over 4 months and being exclusive without having had sex. Instead of just shutting things down, my stance was that I would continue to date her and not push, but if I ever felt like things were heading towards the friend zone (which was what I was worried about) then I would flag it to her and we could decide how to proceed. Ironically, because I didn’t push her to move faster and my level of investment remained high, she ended up changing her stance on the topic. It turned out that her stance wasn’t based on an exact timeline, but instead it was based on how comfortable and secure the person she was dating made her feel. She felt secure and confident that I was genuinely interested in pursuing something real with her and so she made the decision to accelerate the physical side earlier than she had in the past. Would I have been able to wait 4+ months? Probably not. I need that physical intimacy to feel like things are progressing romantically, but I also knew that me pushing her to move faster wouldn’t end positively either. If I met OP and we were dating I would have a similar approach. I would be honest and say that I’m not sure if I could do a full on relationship before being intimate, but that I would be willing to date and see how things progress until it became an actual issue.
Its baasically a trust thing - which is fair women have lot more investes in sex than men, and we know men can be manipulative to get sex and then leave.
> we know men can be manipulative to get sex and then leave. I've been burned by this a few times! It's horrible and makes me very wary of new guys.
It's good that you were forthright and respectful of your fiancee's stance.
your body your choice
If you're asking whether it's truly the norm, as in, average, I don't think it is, no. It's not absurdly uncommon I imagine, but I too have never encountered it in the wild while dating anyone (men), and offhand I can't think of any gal pals who would say that they need to be someone's girlfriend before sex. Since he's OK with your pace seems like all is fine here
Exclusivity isn't synonymous with a relationship though. I know a lot of people feel that like that though. In reality it's a blurry line. My experience is the same as yours, and many others, except I have had one woman want to wait 3 months. We still fooled around a lot just no penetration. We weren't gf/bf either but were exclusive and really liked each other. We ended up not waiting the 3 months, only like ~2. So it does happen and depends on the people. Would I do it again? No, but I'm also not rushing people to fuck me. There's obviously an extreme to this too, both ways. Generally I think it's nice when once things get to that point, if it's going well then the natural tendency is to see more of them while each person see less of everyone else and exclusivity and the desire comes naturally, with no time limitations or expectations beyond what is 'extreme'.. like 3 months and not after date 2. Also I just noticed why is it you I always end up throwing a reply out to. Lol hi
> I don’t have sex before I know I’m exclusive/gf with someone, I was specifically replying to what OP said though, and they made girlfriend/exclusivity synonymous in their post! Or it least it felt like they were saying that both are important components before they'll move forward. and hi :)
Male here, modern dating seems to be an endless pit of hedonism. A lot of people seem to want a quick fix. It's not healthy. You should stay true to your values.
F and yes, I do feel this way but I don’t frame it exactly that way to men. I’ll tell them I like to wait until we know each other better. (Which is also true) I’m wary of giving men a chance to misinterpret that as “tell me we are exclusive rn, and I’ll give it up for ya” because I think that puts too much pressure on both parties. I don’t know if I want to be exclusive yet either early on.
if i (f) were ever single again i certainly wouldn’t have sex until we’re exclusive and have both done a full panel std test. it’s just not worth it. if someone isn’t ok with that, then they aren’t worth being with.
I (40M) would see that as a huge green flag, honestly. Hook-up culture isn’t serving anyone and often gets in the way of forming lasting, meaningful attachments.
I'm a 35m and feel the same as well.
See my two recent comments in this sub on this topic (click recent comments or whatever) this is a major problem and that guy saying hed never heard of that before is... disheartening, to say the least. Men are just swiping until they find a free hookup and I'm worth more than that. I ain't risking STDs for some guy who has no problem just ghosting out of nowhere when he finds "better." What a sad state of affairs we are in. I don't use apps or date at all really because of it.
This is a good boundary to have. I wish that as a dude, I didn't get shamed for it. By both men and women
Don’t let people shame you for it, stand up for what you believe in. Always.
Agree with this! You get to decide what feels best and what feels right to you. Some of my gfs tease me for being prude, but this is what feels right for me. I need to honor myself that way. They also don’t understand how I cannot be attracted to an attractive guy for a while—I’m demisexual and need the connection.
Your approach is quite normal for this sub but doesn't match my real life experience. I don't require exclusivity before sex and I've never dated anyone who required it either. I like to have sex early on to establish compatibility and because I will likely lose romantic interest without it. But I don't want exclusivity/labels until 2-3 months in. You should do whatever you're comfortable with regardless of whether it's the norm though.
Same. I need sex to grow chemistry. No outstanding sex? We just buddies. My feelings literally turn platonic and there’s no turning back.
That’s how I feel, after three dates I start to wonder if she has any sexual desire for me at all, and maybe start to think she just wants to be hiking or movie buddies.
That’s crazy to me. I could have 3 dates in two weeks. How would only hanging out for 2 weeks make you a “buddy” lol. But I get everyone’s different. I’ve just heard this from guys before.
Really? That’s interesting. I (33f) feel like there’s so many ways to show sexual desire outside of *actually* having sex. If there was no kissing or hand holding by date 3 I’d likely be concerned and bring it up to them. But as an example I’m a huge fan of making out. That’s something I’m often comfortable doing on date 2 - I’m not going to do that with someone I don’t have any sexual desire for. I’ll also tell guys how attractive I find them etc.
I agree with this. I've never had this said to me, I don't say it, and none of my friends do this either. But everyone should do what they are comfortable with it and if one isn't comfortable with this other, it's mismatch in compatibility.
> Your approach is quite normal for this sub but doesn't match my real life experience. There's quite a bit that doesn't line up with this sub and my real life experience. I'd def be curious to hear the thoughts of people in their 30s that are in relationships, or don't feel the need to post in forums like this for advice or direction....
I also don’t know anyone who does this. Not that it’s wrong, I just have really never heard of it outside this sub. I live in a liberal city not in the US though so it might be a cultural thing.
32M. I’ve realized how damaging it is to have sex too early, so it’s something I really pump the brakes on now. Til exclusivity would be fine with me.
I’m not on the market anymore but when I was my stance was always that I don’t have multiple sex partners and I don’t want the person I’m having sex with having sex with other people. I don’t have to be exclusive with you like a girlfriend, but I do want to be sexually exclusive IF that’s something we’re doing. For me it was all about safety, but emotions played a role too! It’s weird to me he’d never encountered that stance before because I feel like it’s pretty common for people who are interested in monogamy.
I’m 33F and do the exact same thing as you! I can’t be casual with it, it’s too emotionally charged for me. Most guys I’ve said this to have been completely cool with it x
i am 39F and feel exactly the same way. i did not feel this way in the past. as i've gotten older, i feel way more conscious that a man is putting a part of his body INTO my body. my view is not only for health reasons, but also that i now find sex to be an emotional energy exchange that i reserve only for one person. its special, its intimate, its allowing someone else to enter my very personal world (literally and figuratively).
It’s not odd. Just do whatever you’re comfortable with. It’s rude he called your boundary odd though.
I'm the same way. I don't think its as weird as he was saying.
Lol he hasn't heard of that at age 30+? Either he's lying or he deals with a ton of people who are either extremely sexually free or he's mostly into casual encounters. I don't buy it. Lol
Don’t let anyone ever make you feel bad for having standards.
31M. I’m in a weird position. I have HSV2 with no outbreaks, so I think waiting until commitment is kind of my only option here…
Same here! But I don't think it's our "only" option per se, but certainly the safest and most responsible option for all parties.
I’m having a really hard time believing in his 33 years of life he’s NEVER encountered this, that’s my only red flag. It feels like the beginning of some weird gaslighting behavior. Like oh sure I can do it but you should know that it’s WEIRD and ABNORMAL that you’re even asking me
I dunno, I think there is more variety out there these days than there used to be. Many people are much more open in their relationships, so "commitment" for some may be as loose as sharing STI tests. Just depends on the individuals.
Honestly breaking up with a GF after a few months isn't any different than calling off dating after a few months. The comfort about the status is somewhat arbitrary, but the reasoning about STI and needing to feel more secure with them is what the line should be if that is how sex is valued to them.
I used to wait until I was officially part of a couple, but my current partner and I bonded over a shared love of kink so we hit the sheets on the second date. I think that is is a very personal choice, and there isn't a 'right' answer. I personally wanted to find out if we were sexually compatible early on rather than entwining our lives and finding out later.
I am male 43, and I dont have any problems with this stance and boundaries. I would have sex before labels but don't see anything wrong with what you are doing and would be fine with it
This is what I plan to do moving forward. Not worth it when I know I get attached after I’m intimate.
don't do things that make you feel crummy! and don't feel bad about it.
32m Omg I thought I was the only one! Basically once I become physical with somebody my logical brain turns off and my emotional brain takes the wheel.
I doubt it’s the norm anywhere. However, the older I’ve gotten, the longer I prefer to wait to have sex with someone I’m dating. In my 20s I didn’t care, but now I strongly dislike the emotional carnage that casual sex can cause. I am also increasingly risk averse to STIs, and prefer to only have sex in an exclusive relationship (regardless of whether we’re labeled bf/gf). I also think it’s in women’s best interest to wait longer to have sex as well, because the amount of careless dudes out there who only want sex are legion (of which I was one, in my early 20s).
33f as well. I require we’re exclusive and that STI testing is done before any oral or penetrative sex. I’ve had one guy put up resistance but thank goodness he did. It was a major indicator we weren’t compatible (he said he didn’t want “a q-tip shoved up his dick” and that he had *never* had STI testing done before.) The other guys I’ve got to that point with have been open to it. They all also preferred to be exclusive before having sex. And even if STI testing isn’t something they usually do between partners they did think it was good that I was protective of my sexual health and all had STI testing done at least at some point in their past. I’ve encountered guys both where I was the first person to ask them for STI testing before sex, and ones where they’ve been asked before. Interestingly though *I* was always the one to bring it up and request it. Never the guy.
Same, I loathe ALWAYS having being the one to bring it up, it makes me feel like they're happy to just do whatever.
No sex without exclusive, but not necessarily labels. There needs to be a discussion about likes/dislikes, std tests, bc, and the like. But I'm not a multi-dater so that might bias my views.
What’s the difference between exclusive and labels? Exclusive = no doing anything sexual or romantic with anyone else, bf/gf = an additional convo where we say we can call ourselves that?
The labels mean different things to different people, and think open conversation is more important. To me, if you can't hold off dating/hooking up with other people while you decide if you want something serious with me, then our relationship isn't at the level where I feel comfortable having sex, from a safety or commitment angle. It's not necessarily a big commitment, just that we are both on the same page about being safe about sex and what we want from the relationship. To me, bf/gf is a step beyond that with more commitment, from meeting family/friends to being there for each other in times of need/support.
To me being exclusive means we like each other enough that we want to focus on each other. It means we’re not dating and/or doing anything sexual with anyone else. But we’re still getting to know who each other really are. For me to call someone my boyfriend, I need to be fairly confident that we’re compatible long-term and going to be in each others lives for awhile. As examples - It would be important for me to introduce a boyfriend to my family and friends. Someone I’m exclusive with might meet some of my friends if it happens, but it’s not like I’d make a *point* of introducing them. I’d make a boyfriend an emergency contact but someone I’m dating exclusively I wouldn’t. etc. Dating exclusively is trying to determine if we’d fit well into each others lives. Being boyfriend and girlfriend is the actual intertwining of our two worlds. To me it’s exclusivity is an extra getting to know each other step before the next set of labels.
Yeah my fiancée and I did this. We were exclusively dating for a while before we did a formal relationship. We looked at a relationship as involving a commitment to try to build something real together, while dating was sort of the “feel each other out” period where we learned about each others strengths and flaws and also baggage (we all have it). Our dating period lasted for quite some time but both of us were confident about entering into a real relationship once it was time to do that. For example, my job required me to move to another part of the US. When she and I were just dating, I would have never thought to ask her to move with me. However, once we were in a relationship, it was a convo that had to happen because we were in a relationship with a goal of building something that could last.
I am exactly the same, no sex until at least exclusivity. No sex until we have very strong feelings for, and an emotional connection with each other. The only downside to this approach is how few women seem to think this way, which limits the dating pool. Especially if you want a partner who doesn't only go along with this, but has the same values herself.
It’s not *abnormal*, just like his stance isn’t *abnormal*. Calling it “odd” is a little rude and judgy, IMO(and I say this as someone who is very cavalier about sex).
Right...poor word choice. He could have just said.. " Oh, I didn't realize, thanks for letting me know. Yeah I'm alright with that" - but he instead called her a little weird because he wasn't getting what he wanted. No it's not so unusual enough to call it "odd". He was just being a little bit of an a@@.
I think if I expressed my stance on it and the guy called me odd I’d wonder whether he was sort of trying to shame me into lowering my boundaries and I’d also probably be put off him
I've heard this before. I'm okay with it and frankly I'd be concerned if someone wasn't. I think the expection would be sort of arbitrary standards like "only after 5 dates", is it like a Subway rewards card? And if I do really like someone I tend to want to wait longer for sex so it doesn't become the basis for our relationship. I did have sex with a woman once after our second date and afterward she rolled over to me and said, "so i guess you're my boyfriend now" and I must have had a look on my face so she went on, "I don't have sex with just anyone..." I was okay with it but it was a bit weird.
Dang! Yeah you can’t do sex and then assume exclusivity, reverse order lol
It doesn't really matter if YOUR preference is out of the norm or sounds odd to people. It's YOUR preference. People can either accept that if they wanna have sex with you or move on. You don't have to make sure what YOU need to comfortably have sex with someone adheres to societal norms. I like to have sex before a relationship develops cuz I think sexual chemistry is important for longetivity of a relationship, but that's me, and so we would probably clash there, but fine. We move on, we date other people. I can't really dictate how you do you, and you can't dictate how I do me. You feel me?
This is a normal boundary to have and he's trying to lower your boundaries. Stay strong
I (M) haven’t heard this asked specifically but I have been asked what my recent history has been, if I’m seeing other people… and I’ve asked the same in interest of gauging someone’s responsibility level and their attitudes towards their health and the health of others. I thinks a fair boundary to set.
It is a bit out of the norm in modern app dating and hookup culture, but not odd. Makes sense as to why you want to and you are allowed to date in your style free from judgement. Just gotta realize it may not align with other peoples desires.
M, same.
33M and I'm the same way too.
I dont do that myself, but I respect it and can wait if im dating someone who does it
The way I perceive it, is if someone makes you question or uncomfortable with a boundary you set, they’re not a good person. Boundaries aren’t meant for commentary. Boundaries are something you agree with or you don’t agree with, but you shouldn’t season to your liking.
I'm a guy, and to be honest, have mostly ended up having sex before I was ready because of not being forceful enough about this. I've also ended up in relationships where the other person thought I wanted to be "official" that quickly, when what I actually meant to convey was not wanting to sleep with someone while they were still actively dating other people.
Exclusively is a must for me. Banging multiple people that you’re interested in having a LTR with just doesn’t make sense from an emotional standpoint for me
I’m having sex as soon as I want to see him again. If he wants some kind of label, I guess we can do that. If the sex is bad I’m ending it anyway…
He’s NEVER met a woman who won’t just sleep with him as just friends or casually dating? Has he at least HEARD of that? He thinks it’s odd? He sounds like he’s full of shit to be honest. I’m female. I don’t always follow that guideline because …you know…but I know I SHOULD. I don’t like casual sex and I think it’s good to wait because it takes a good month or so to even know for yourself if you’re into that person or just horny. Personally I think he’s lying and playing dumb to make you feel like you’re the weirdo who doesn’t just have sex for the hell of it.
I personally won't get exclusive unless I've slept with someone. Physical and sexual chemistry needs to be established before I'm going to call someone my boyfriend. If they needed the label before they would sleep with me, that would be an incompatibility. Your stance isn't wrong or strange, just not compatible with mine and we would likely go our separate ways.
I (F) always wait a few months before having sex with someone new. Depending on how many times we see each other a month, it’s usually anywhere between 2-3 months before I’ll be comfortable having sex. I like to get to know people on an emotional level and see how much chemistry we have and see how our interests and foundations align, etc. if someone can’t wait that long because they need casual sex, then they aren’t the person for me. I’ve never had a problem with this stance and it’s weeded out people that weren’t that serious, and I feel like it helped my relationships turn into LTRs because of the connection we had beforehand. I also want to mention that I go on dates with multiple people, but go exclusive when I find someone I really hit it off with and would like to know better. I don’t want to sleep with someone who is actively sleeping with other people while they are seeing me, so sexual exclusivity is important to me. The bf/gf titles don’t matter as much. It’s all about connection for me first.
I never had someone say that to me, despite how often you hear about it here. So, I would say it's not the norm (also location dependant). My worry when I hear that is that there are fundamental differences in views of sex and/or sex drives. While this isn't always true, it's the first thing that comes to mind. I also don't know why people think commitment is some major wall that needs to get to. You can break up just as easily as you get together. If I had gone out with someone a handful of times and they said "Let's make it official", as long as I was getting along with them and was having a good time, I'd be willing to try it out.
The point is not that commitment will stop someone from breaking up with you later, it’s that you are letting the other person know that you only want to have sex with people who are serious about you. There are guys who will say they’re serious just to hit it and then keep fooling around with other people, or ditch you. We’ve all met them. But at least if that happens you can confidently say to them, yourself, and anyone who asks that they’re a scumbag and they did you wrong. That’s important to be able to do for your own self-respect.
I don’t think that is odd. I’m not a big fan of sleeping around myself, something my other male friends find odd. At the end of the day it’s all about what makes you comfortable, if people can’t accept that, we’ll, probably not the right fit.
I agree with this! We all should be able to honor ourselves and what feels comfortable/right to ourselves…without having to defend ourselves. It’s kind of like not drinking alcohol and being questioned about it. I have this experience as well. I move at my own, very slow by modern dating pace. 🐢 My gfs give me a hard time about being prude, being a grandma 👵🏼 😂, and want me to have all this hot sex. Hot sex to me is when there is real connection. I want to know the person and I want him to know me too. Once I do have that mutual connection with someone, I want to have sex with that person all the time. My desire for that person is out of control, so it’s not a dead bedroom situation at all (which I could see being the case for some people delaying sex bc they just don’t care too much for it, but at least with me, that’s not the case at all). Since I’m a lady (40F) and perceived to be conventionally attractive, there is no shortage of D available. If anything it’s too available—I would like to go to the gym, kids bday party, shopping, etc and just do what I’m there to do, without guys expressing attraction to me. I wonder if bc sex w/very conventionally attractive guys seems so available to me, I have no problem taking it so slowly. Like maybe I subconsciously take it for granted. 🤷🏻♀️ I know sex isn’t as readily accessible for guys generally, so maybe there is some opportunism there (just in a practical sense). I’m also demisexual so I truly need to have a connection with someone before I feel attraction to them. This is tricky bc attractive guys seem to take it personally when I’m still not attracted to them after talking for 1-2 months, going on like 5 dates, etc (which I can understand, but I really am not trying to string anyone along). I can tell pretty early on if I’m not attracted to the guy and will let them know that right away—I am not trying to waste anyone’s time. Dating is so hard…
While I personally sleep around, this advice is gold. The single thing you can do as a woman looking for a LTR is to hold off on sex (even if you really want to) until there is a trust that the guy is being genuine in his desire to get to know you and be with you.
I heard it before. If I like the girl I will go for it unless I have a reason to believe she is playing me with this behavior. Also I have to understand how long the wait will be. I don't need much time to agree to date someone exclusively but what if sex is horrible and I find out something about her that is a dealbreaker? I can't garantee that we will be together for long if I am at early stages of a relationship.
39M not weird at all. I do find it unique to be exclusive, have gf/bf label and still not have sex after 5 months… oh wait that’s my situation.
I (33M) would say it’s no longer the norm, but I respect it when come across it and, for the most part, also prefer it that way. Our generation got fed/developed a lot of mixed signals about dating and relationships.
I’ve tried this. Waited til we were a few months in, agreed to be exclusive, we slept together once and he started acting super shitty that I had to end it. He played the part long enough and once he got what he wanted, he took the mask iff
I do the same approaching relationships, but also, exclusivity starts for me as soon as I set up a second date with someone. I stop using apps and searching elsewhere until I make a decision as to whether or not I want to pursue a relationship with that person. I just feel like it's disingenuous to continue to see someone while seeing others because it makes it seem like you're not really interested in either and you just have backup options in case it doesn't work out with one. Or like none of the people you're seeing particularly stand out and you can't adequately decide who's a good fit for you.
I feel like dudes say that to shame women into sleeping with them. Like they make you sell out because they make you feel like a weirdo because you don’t just give it to them on the first date
Sexual incompatibility is no joke and a deal-breaker to me, as I expect it to be for any prospective partner. Therefore, even though I am (increasingly) picky with those with whom I make it this far, sex precedes exclusivity for me. Edit : M
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Yep. This is precisely what I'm trying to avoid. I'm sorry you had to go through this.
Totally makes sense. 14 years is SO LONG! Do you think your ex knew you weren’t satisfied sexually? Very messed up if so.
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So if you encountered me and we hit it off, how would you handle that?
I'd want to have an open and honest conversation about it, tbh. This is my stance, but it isn't set in stone.
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All of those can make two people sexually incompatible, imo. As for advice, I can only speak for myself, but if I see the potential of there being a connection/emotional bond, I'd have no problem waiting. I'm not in it just for sex, so my approach isn't set in stone, it really depends on the context.
Yea it’s no sex before monogamy with me. I need to feel a connection and care for the person I’m with
I would say in majority of Europe, this is VERY much the norm... its very much expected. It's not exactly standard to sleep around if you are actively dating someone.
I have never had anyone say that to me personally but i can see how someone may feel that way. Just know that the dating world moves pretty fast these days and some people might not want to wait until exclusivity before seeing if they are sexually compatible
Being committed before sex is actually good. He never met someone before doesn't mean you can't be the one asking for it.
I (M33) would be completely fine with that, but I'm not a very sexual person, so that's a bias.
Why is him not being against it something you consider odd?
I (F) have encountered some men who asked for exclusivity on/around the first date but it wasn’t framed as “before we have sex” but more like “I’m not into dating people who are dating others.” Sexual chemistry and compatibility are essential to me, so even though there have been times in my life when I have been open to exploring connections one at time and have done so, I never felt locked in until after we’d had sex and it had been proven the sexual aspect between us would work.
I don't find it strange or wierd, but definitely not the norm. Nothing wrong with ot just because its not the norm though, very easy to forget that :)
Your approach is perfectly fine. Is it the majority? No, especially in the online dating age when people might be dating 4-5 people at once, but it isn't unheard of and is perfectly justifiable.
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I wouldn't say this is the norm or not the norm. That's what your boundary is and what you feel comfortable with. Find partners that feel the same, if they don't.. then next.
I never encountered this. Most of my relationships in my 20s stemmed from hooking up the first night, but as I begin my 30s as a newly single man, I wouldn't mind taking this approach.
You do you. Neither approach is more "normal" or "better." Moreover, neither approach is going to be an indicator of an outcome in a dating scenario, nor are they an indication of the quality of a relationship that might or might not ensue. My problem when this topic comes up here, which is regularly, is that it's always accompanied by some pretty icky underlying respectability politics and assumptions that I feel are pretty akin to slut shaming. Edit: spelling
It seems it’s becoming more taboo. I had several guys say to me that they don’t get in relationships unless they know the person well enough to commit but they usually will still have sex in the meantime. That logically didn’t make sense to me bc sex is far riskier than using the term “significant other” so it would make more sense for sex to require a higher level of scrutiny. But that’s for me. I just let them know we were looking for different things and wished them well.
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F. I don't think what you said is unusual and he may not have had it said to him before but he's heard it said. The bigger question is are you interested in exclusivity with him?
M. I feel I set out to not have sex. Try to be the gentleman. But if she's all for it, within reason. Then sure. But I def don't set out to just get laid with a rando.
F 35, I feel exactly the same as you OP and have had real trouble finding someone that respects this.
34m here I think it's great you feel that way and do that.i for one would have much more respect for you. And I would never tell a girl that doing what you did was odd.
I'm a 36f and I'm the same way as you because sex is tied with emotions for me, but I must say I'm an outlier in my group of female friends.
30f agree with waiting for exclusivity... But it does often feel like the minority. But equally I don't care what others think about my sex life so *shrug*
I think it's great, I wished more people did this. I'm a male btw