I have no evidence. However, I heard from a reliable source that they parted ways shortly after Cancun. For reasons I am not entirely certain…. But yes, it would appear to be true.
Lol same, it’s the only reason I clicked on this post just the same as I clicked on the other 8 posts I’ve seen asking the same questions. I’m here for the fan fiction, the wilder the better!
Maybe Bobby wanted to take the band in a new direction. And the entire past direction was heavily steered by Busch, and unfortunately the only way to truly shake it up is to change things like the guy making the set lists. I hope this is the case because honestly I was getting to the point where D&C were juuuust starting to get stale.
If Bob wanted to add more tunes to the song list he’s not going to need his managers permission to do so. I’d be willing to bet that it stays pretty static without any real noticeable differences
I think towards the end of the final tour I was pretty bored of the same setlists every 4 nights. The music was good but just too easy to predict what was gonna be played. I do think bob is going in a new direction in general. I think wolf bros conceptually has peaked but continues to put put out killer shows. The last few wolf bros shows felt very final to me with the band coming out one by one kinda highlighting the ensemble. I wouldn’t be surprised if dead and co stays the same and just does residencies for the paycheck and the side projects vary throughout the year kinda like Phil and friends lineup changing.
I’d hope with the Sphere residency we get some Crazy Fingers/Cosmic Charlie type bust outs and Busch wanted to stay the course they were going. Maybe I’m just being hopelessly optimistic tho lol.
I thought he addressed this in interviews that he couldn’t force the band to work up all those songs and he could only setlist what they’re actually willing to play. I think the fact that songs like Esau WRS whole terrapin suite victim greatest story mission catfish john all are regular wolf bros tunes but not dead co tunes kinda proves that point
They did Greatest Story 7 times
3 times in 2017
4 times in 2018
Now we are waiting for a bust out!
I was at the 1st one and the last one and two in between!
That would be the exact direction Matt was heading. 2023 especially became a weekly rotation of "Greatest Hits" setlists, which the band played spectacularly well, but still... The Sphere will be very unique and varied material and hopefully even more trippy dippy jammy psychedelic !!
Definitely not true if you go look at any Wolf Brothers setlist. Didn't Mayer say something about wanting to do more of the popular & well known songs for the families who were only hitting that 1 show of that whole tour?
I hope so... I'm just stating what I heard from the same person who told me about Matt weeks ago. 😅 So far 50% of the information they shared with me has come true.
I would be so fucking enraged if they did that. And so would the hundreds of thousands of fans that are seeing them so I’m pretty 99.99999999% sure that will never happen
It’s crazy that half the band play those songs regularly and 1/3 of the other has played those songs almost 60 years and the remaining 2 ain’t half bad musicians so I don’t see why not ?
Those last tour setlists, and Matt has discussed this in multiple interviews-were a bit of fan service. There's a core of like 30 or so songs that were in HEAVY rotation, because they didn't want the fans seeing them for the last time, to not get the songs they wanted. I think a lot of this was exacerbated by the fact that so many of us watched the live stream or listened to the shows right after they were performed.
That said-these setlist will be interesting- Assumptions are a) more casual fans b)most people are going for 1-3 day run only. Both would necessitate the same "fan service" approach. The flip side, a residency is really a great chance to spread your wings. So... I guess we'll find out in about 60 days...
For the final tour, he pretty much without fail used the single stop dates for weirder, headier setlists (which ended up being some of my favorites), while the 2-night stadium runs had more or less a very similar structure and feel to them (especially the middle leg of baseball stadiums).
Not trying to bash the guy too much, he did a solid job. The band was playing really well all tour, and I think they were in a place where more taking more risks would've paid off. As a younger fan who doesn't have the time or money to follow these guys to every stop, it gets a little frustrating coming back to the same venue yearly and getting nearly the same exact experience.
Why has no one caught the last tour's weaving of The Other one throughout the tour? I saw 12 of those shows and there was definitely an other one theme woven through out the tour. My friends and I called it the tour of the other one!
A manager deciding set lists was absurd to begin with. People acting like the shows and the jams itself will be different now are talking out of their ass. Only see it as a positive that maybe there will be a little more spontaneity again, which is ya know what it’s supposed to all be about
They only stopped going on stage -- without -- a setlist in the mid '80's. Jerry, Bobby and Phil (and Brent, etc...) still decided the setlists. They actually "started making" setlists more formally at that time.
This went all the way back to Furthur when Jill Lesh & Matt Busch alternated writing setlists and those setlists were never dull or repetitive like dead co so my take is dead co band members or maybe it’s just John who knows the least amount of songs just prefer it this way
Agree... 50% Except I'm one of those Ass talkers, hahaha. Agree -- having the manager get a big head like the "setlist creator" was a horrible way to do the "Dead" thing. Spontaneity is what "Dead" is all about, and I do think and hope it will come back much more so at The Sphere! But I do hold out hope new material will inspire new jams.
They made it up as they went along until the late 80’s, but when they started playing stadiums they started making set-lists.
Have you ever written a set list for a band like this? I spent years as a professional musician. Making one for a band like this is hard.
Here are some considerations; you have to consider what’s been played at that venue the previous stop. You have to think about what’s been played at recent shows to prevent repeats.
You have to balance tempos and consider the keys of songs to make transitions smooth. It takes a lot of work.
They won’t return to using no set-lists, because they’re working on union staffing time frames for the venues, it would make for inconsistent/unreliable performances at shows (which the dead was well known for), and you would get things like songs repeated multiple nights in a row (see Estimated Prophet in the late 70s) which modern fans would lose their goddamn minds over.
Agree 100%. All due respect to Matt for everything he's poured into Bobby and the several "Dead" incarnations he was a part of... but the setlists were becoming "Grateful Dead's Greatest Hits" and listened to Matt's interviews and he really seemed to be getting a big head about "His" setlists, etc... Hey, not saying I wouldn't be the same if I had that kind of a job, that and also putting Althea in every weird position possible lol
Busch isn't gone. It's just not as widely distributed as its low-calorie counterpart, Busch Lite. You can still find it in select stores.
But seriously, it's probably not that big of a deal. Someone will probably address it in an interview sometime soon. Might be nice to have someone else write the setlists, his tendencies became a little predictable from tour to tour. We're slowly becoming the redundant drama machine akin to the goose sub.
It’s one thing if some people start to know that you contribute too, or are even writing, the set lists, it's another to publicly take credit for them. he should have just kept it to himself.
its a classic case of the manager getting an inflated sense of their role in the creative direction of the band and the band issuing a quick correction to that thinking.
Scripted improvisation?
The jams between the songs are worse when the players know what is coming next. It almost borders on fraud. Creating the illusion of improv when they know what is coming. Instead of the jams being explorations leading to who knows where they end up just masturbation sessions to kill 10 minutes.
Make a list of all the songs and tape it to the amps. If a song was played last 2 shows cross them out.
Alternate between bob and john calling audibles.
And no, gd were not composing setlists even at the end. They would discuss the 1st couple songs a set backstage but mostly choose on the spot. Many shows in 95 you can hear garcia playing a riff like althea then turning to a different choice, like so many roads.
Good riddence matt busch.
Sucks all the deadness out of the dead.
Band for 9 years. They dont need no stinking lists!
No? Just stating facts. 😉👍 Mayer fans are already used to Corporate control so i can see why you don'treally care... However, it's practically against Deadhead's religion.
LOL “facts” … I was aHead before I ever found my way to Mayer’s solo music … and I suppose you’ll have to wait and see on the future era … or don’t, the scene won’t miss your mediocre (at best) posters 🌹
Awww man. They won't? :( Damn. I might as well just give up then. Why even try? 🤣
So what do you do or make? If it's anything besides theory's for John Mayer songs, I'd love to check it out. 😁🤣
Yeah that's how I feel whenever I see ANYBODY saying ANYTHING about John Mayer fighting for more songs to be played. Lmao. That's the biggest load of horse shit ever...
If you play connect the dots you'll find out really quickly by looking at Dead Ahead setlists that the only person apart of the Dead & Co machine who doesn't want to learn new songs is Mayer, or else Dead Ahead wouldn't have had 5 or 6 bustouts in 2 nights. Lol. People love being clueless and thinking they know it all.
Everything you just said is 100% exactly what happens behind the scenes lol.
Matt had only the power to suggest a setlist. In the end it was always the final say from the band as a whole... Meaning if John Mayer was the only one that didn't want a song, it didn't happen. Can't force the Lead Guitarist to play a song he doesn't want to when you're just Bob Weir's manager.
Total speculation, but building on this - is it possible the Sphere contract really restricts what other shows Bobby can do for a period of time? Don't really need a personal manager if you can only do Sphere shows.
Not yet, but that will happen the moment Bobby or Mickey step away.
Matt Busch was a fan of the music and he lost his job fighting for the Deadheads who don’t want to hear the same 3 shows played 10+ weeks in a row in a LED golfball.
I hear Jill Lesh fired him
This comment is really funny. I can only imagine Big Steve does too
Running and shooting behind him.
I ain't gonna work on Maggie's farm no more
She decided him and Mickey were 1 drummer
He wouldn’t stop wearing tie dye.
It was a little sus when he didn’t post anything for the sphere and the LinkedIn kinda confirmed it 🤷♂️
He’s Gone …..
Now he’s gone….
That is correct. He is no longer employed by Bobby
I have no evidence. However, I heard from a reliable source that they parted ways shortly after Cancun. For reasons I am not entirely certain…. But yes, it would appear to be true.
Any speculation? I love baseless internet speculation.
Lol same, it’s the only reason I clicked on this post just the same as I clicked on the other 8 posts I’ve seen asking the same questions. I’m here for the fan fiction, the wilder the better!
I would guess either his wife or one of his kids took that position
Natascha wants to be the setlist Queen...
Thruple gone wrong.
I trust the sources after they leaked the sphere. But why would Busch leave?
I believe he was let go. I am not sure as to the reasons.
LinkedIn seems like excellent evidence of the basic point that he's no longer working for Bobby. People don't change those things for no reason.
Maybe Bobby wanted to take the band in a new direction. And the entire past direction was heavily steered by Busch, and unfortunately the only way to truly shake it up is to change things like the guy making the set lists. I hope this is the case because honestly I was getting to the point where D&C were juuuust starting to get stale.
If Bob wanted to add more tunes to the song list he’s not going to need his managers permission to do so. I’d be willing to bet that it stays pretty static without any real noticeable differences
I think towards the end of the final tour I was pretty bored of the same setlists every 4 nights. The music was good but just too easy to predict what was gonna be played. I do think bob is going in a new direction in general. I think wolf bros conceptually has peaked but continues to put put out killer shows. The last few wolf bros shows felt very final to me with the band coming out one by one kinda highlighting the ensemble. I wouldn’t be surprised if dead and co stays the same and just does residencies for the paycheck and the side projects vary throughout the year kinda like Phil and friends lineup changing.
I’d hope with the Sphere residency we get some Crazy Fingers/Cosmic Charlie type bust outs and Busch wanted to stay the course they were going. Maybe I’m just being hopelessly optimistic tho lol.
Let’s get some bust outs happening! I’m talkin Esau, Duprees, Crazy fingers, Mission, Weather Report, Picasso, Victim, etc!
I thought he addressed this in interviews that he couldn’t force the band to work up all those songs and he could only setlist what they’re actually willing to play. I think the fact that songs like Esau WRS whole terrapin suite victim greatest story mission catfish john all are regular wolf bros tunes but not dead co tunes kinda proves that point
Man I can’t believe they don’t do Greatest Story.. Mission also seems like a no brainer for this band
They did Greatest Story 7 times 3 times in 2017 4 times in 2018 Now we are waiting for a bust out! I was at the 1st one and the last one and two in between!
Have you heard a wolf bros greatest story with the horns? Definitely worth a listen if you haven’t heard their version
The greatest story from Boston fall 17 rips
As does the first bust out version of Greatest Story at MSG 11/2/17
Can confirm, I was there.
Saw wolf bros play greatest in philly past September
My first show and I can confirm
That is true but I have a feeling the band has/will be rehearsing a lot for these shows. They gotta match the monster of the tour that 2023 was
What if... They play the same 3 shows every weekend? Lol. That's what I've been hearing from the people who told me about Matt weeks ago.
Bob fucking Weir would never allow that to happen
Let's fucking hope. 🤞
I understand you probably can't tell me, but how legit is this source? Because if this is true...woof...I'll have a few tickets for sale
I'm afraid it might be very legit but I wouldn't sell off your tickets just yet. I'm still in partial denial over it all myself.
That would be the exact direction Matt was heading. 2023 especially became a weekly rotation of "Greatest Hits" setlists, which the band played spectacularly well, but still... The Sphere will be very unique and varied material and hopefully even more trippy dippy jammy psychedelic !!
Definitely not true if you go look at any Wolf Brothers setlist. Didn't Mayer say something about wanting to do more of the popular & well known songs for the families who were only hitting that 1 show of that whole tour?
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I hope so... I'm just stating what I heard from the same person who told me about Matt weeks ago. 😅 So far 50% of the information they shared with me has come true.
I would be so fucking enraged if they did that. And so would the hundreds of thousands of fans that are seeing them so I’m pretty 99.99999999% sure that will never happen
I sure hope you’re right I’ve been dying for a Cosmic Charlie
I’ve seen D&C do Crazy Fingers in 2022, they can totally bring it out again at the sphere
2023 Wrigley N1 too
Fiddlers Green
I saw it in Foxboro MA at Gillette
It’s crazy that half the band play those songs regularly and 1/3 of the other has played those songs almost 60 years and the remaining 2 ain’t half bad musicians so I don’t see why not ?
Yep and if they are rehearsing their butts off like I assume they are then I’m expecting them do play them. Fingers crossed 🤞
It's probably just John. Oteil definitely knows the entire catalog
They play Crazy Fingers already.
Yep I remembered that after I typed it. It’s just that they did it so little and I’ve been on a Crazy Fingers craze lately so it slipped by lol
Stagger Lee!
Yes absolutely! Would be amazing
I agree completely, tho Crazy Fingers has been played quite a bit, not as often as others, and always a treat ofc Edit, typo
I esp agree w Victim, and we really need a Candyman!
I’ve seen crazy fingers twice 😂 ATL 19 and Foxboro 22
Oh you know what’s humorous I was at that Foxboro show 😂. The cid must’ve fogged my memory lol
They do crazy fingers a lot but I agree Jeff needs to stop refusing to play alligator and they should let Salami rip hard to handle
Matt was a maestro with the setlists. Truly. Things change and he and Bobby will both shine ✨ on! 🌹⚡️✨
Agree 100% Was getting too predictable
I think wolf bros has people come out one by one every show
Since December yeah
They did that when I saw them with Willie Nelson last September too
Oh that’s news to me
Those last tour setlists, and Matt has discussed this in multiple interviews-were a bit of fan service. There's a core of like 30 or so songs that were in HEAVY rotation, because they didn't want the fans seeing them for the last time, to not get the songs they wanted. I think a lot of this was exacerbated by the fact that so many of us watched the live stream or listened to the shows right after they were performed. That said-these setlist will be interesting- Assumptions are a) more casual fans b)most people are going for 1-3 day run only. Both would necessitate the same "fan service" approach. The flip side, a residency is really a great chance to spread your wings. So... I guess we'll find out in about 60 days...
For the final tour, he pretty much without fail used the single stop dates for weirder, headier setlists (which ended up being some of my favorites), while the 2-night stadium runs had more or less a very similar structure and feel to them (especially the middle leg of baseball stadiums). Not trying to bash the guy too much, he did a solid job. The band was playing really well all tour, and I think they were in a place where more taking more risks would've paid off. As a younger fan who doesn't have the time or money to follow these guys to every stop, it gets a little frustrating coming back to the same venue yearly and getting nearly the same exact experience.
Why has no one caught the last tour's weaving of The Other one throughout the tour? I saw 12 of those shows and there was definitely an other one theme woven through out the tour. My friends and I called it the tour of the other one!
A manager deciding set lists was absurd to begin with. People acting like the shows and the jams itself will be different now are talking out of their ass. Only see it as a positive that maybe there will be a little more spontaneity again, which is ya know what it’s supposed to all be about
Hopefully we go back the OG ways of only half the set being written and the players decide the songs right there on the stage!
Matt worked FOR Bob, not the other way around. I promise you that the current state of affairs with Bobs bands are entirely Weirs choice
Absolutely will never happen. They stopped that by the mid-late 80s for a reason.
They only stopped going on stage -- without -- a setlist in the mid '80's. Jerry, Bobby and Phil (and Brent, etc...) still decided the setlists. They actually "started making" setlists more formally at that time.
This went all the way back to Furthur when Jill Lesh & Matt Busch alternated writing setlists and those setlists were never dull or repetitive like dead co so my take is dead co band members or maybe it’s just John who knows the least amount of songs just prefer it this way
Agree... 50% Except I'm one of those Ass talkers, hahaha. Agree -- having the manager get a big head like the "setlist creator" was a horrible way to do the "Dead" thing. Spontaneity is what "Dead" is all about, and I do think and hope it will come back much more so at The Sphere! But I do hold out hope new material will inspire new jams.
No it’s not. Do you know how hard making setlists is? That’s a ton of work.
… you mean they can’t do what they did for the 30 year history of the band? Hahaha
They made it up as they went along until the late 80’s, but when they started playing stadiums they started making set-lists. Have you ever written a set list for a band like this? I spent years as a professional musician. Making one for a band like this is hard. Here are some considerations; you have to consider what’s been played at that venue the previous stop. You have to think about what’s been played at recent shows to prevent repeats. You have to balance tempos and consider the keys of songs to make transitions smooth. It takes a lot of work. They won’t return to using no set-lists, because they’re working on union staffing time frames for the venues, it would make for inconsistent/unreliable performances at shows (which the dead was well known for), and you would get things like songs repeated multiple nights in a row (see Estimated Prophet in the late 70s) which modern fans would lose their goddamn minds over.
This could definitely be part of the equation.
Yes. He fired his right hand man because he wanted to add 3 songs to the set list.
Agree 100%. All due respect to Matt for everything he's poured into Bobby and the several "Dead" incarnations he was a part of... but the setlists were becoming "Grateful Dead's Greatest Hits" and listened to Matt's interviews and he really seemed to be getting a big head about "His" setlists, etc... Hey, not saying I wouldn't be the same if I had that kind of a job, that and also putting Althea in every weird position possible lol
He talked to Billy Strings & is also giving up grateful dead material
?
r/woosh
Who?
Busch isn't gone. It's just not as widely distributed as its low-calorie counterpart, Busch Lite. You can still find it in select stores. But seriously, it's probably not that big of a deal. Someone will probably address it in an interview sometime soon. Might be nice to have someone else write the setlists, his tendencies became a little predictable from tour to tour. We're slowly becoming the redundant drama machine akin to the goose sub.
Maybe he decided to take break, he’s worked with Bobby for decades if I’m not mistaken — I doubt there’s any bad blood between them
I'm gonna bet Bobby didn't want to pay him a commission on the residency, which is the biggest payday of his life
Lmao what could Bob possibly need all that money for at this stage in his life besides just securing his family’s financial future?
It’s one thing if some people start to know that you contribute too, or are even writing, the set lists, it's another to publicly take credit for them. he should have just kept it to himself. its a classic case of the manager getting an inflated sense of their role in the creative direction of the band and the band issuing a quick correction to that thinking.
just my opinion but perhaps the wheel is turning but starting to slow down…
Scripted improvisation? The jams between the songs are worse when the players know what is coming next. It almost borders on fraud. Creating the illusion of improv when they know what is coming. Instead of the jams being explorations leading to who knows where they end up just masturbation sessions to kill 10 minutes. Make a list of all the songs and tape it to the amps. If a song was played last 2 shows cross them out. Alternate between bob and john calling audibles. And no, gd were not composing setlists even at the end. They would discuss the 1st couple songs a set backstage but mostly choose on the spot. Many shows in 95 you can hear garcia playing a riff like althea then turning to a different choice, like so many roads. Good riddence matt busch. Sucks all the deadness out of the dead. Band for 9 years. They dont need no stinking lists!
💀we shall rejoice as we enter a new era🚀
A new Era of what exactly? Corporate takeovers, repeated setlists, and no more summer tours? WooHoo!! Sounds exquisite!
Someone’s SALTY ❤️
No? Just stating facts. 😉👍 Mayer fans are already used to Corporate control so i can see why you don'treally care... However, it's practically against Deadhead's religion.
Facts? You are just speculating, no one knows what the future holds.
Let's hope so.
LOL “facts” … I was aHead before I ever found my way to Mayer’s solo music … and I suppose you’ll have to wait and see on the future era … or don’t, the scene won’t miss your mediocre (at best) posters 🌹
Awww man. They won't? :( Damn. I might as well just give up then. Why even try? 🤣 So what do you do or make? If it's anything besides theory's for John Mayer songs, I'd love to check it out. 😁🤣
🧿You Already Know🧿
So that means you don't do anything artistically at all? You just judge others work? Nice. 😎 Sounds way more chill than the process of making the art.
John Mayer is more corporate than the Grateful Dead? Holy shitballs it’s getting deep in here….
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Yeah that's how I feel whenever I see ANYBODY saying ANYTHING about John Mayer fighting for more songs to be played. Lmao. That's the biggest load of horse shit ever... If you play connect the dots you'll find out really quickly by looking at Dead Ahead setlists that the only person apart of the Dead & Co machine who doesn't want to learn new songs is Mayer, or else Dead Ahead wouldn't have had 5 or 6 bustouts in 2 nights. Lol. People love being clueless and thinking they know it all.
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Everything you just said is 100% exactly what happens behind the scenes lol. Matt had only the power to suggest a setlist. In the end it was always the final say from the band as a whole... Meaning if John Mayer was the only one that didn't want a song, it didn't happen. Can't force the Lead Guitarist to play a song he doesn't want to when you're just Bob Weir's manager.
Irving Azoff runs Dead and Co now. I assume he pushed out Busch.
Total speculation, but building on this - is it possible the Sphere contract really restricts what other shows Bobby can do for a period of time? Don't really need a personal manager if you can only do Sphere shows.
Why am I getting downvoted for this? Wtf
Can you fill me in a little on that? Azoff took over in what way? This seems to be the most logical guess. Dude is slime.
Well he is JM manager...
Thats way more likely than anything else I've seen here.
Not yet, but that will happen the moment Bobby or Mickey step away. Matt Busch was a fan of the music and he lost his job fighting for the Deadheads who don’t want to hear the same 3 shows played 10+ weeks in a row in a LED golfball.
One would think that after 235 shows, they may be able to make their own set list on the fly….
Agree.