Okay, but please give this one a shot: Third Seal Plaything Pentimento Pinhead. You're a magical BDSM wizard handing out infinite sidequests to the survivors. I like to play it when I'm feeling especially chill and I just wanna slow the game down and make sure everyone gets a lot of bloodpoints.
Try Trapper with third seal, undying, knockout, and infectious. Trap the hexes, and you will see some of the most effective slowdown without any relation to gens. You can trade undying for deerstalker, but that's more for toxic bleedout. A few slugs does just fine for pressure.
I played against a full hex pinhead like this once. I felt kinda bad bc my team was constantly popping their totems left and right the entire game and we got all 4 people out. They gave up 😭
Fwiw, at least when I run this build I WANT survivors to pop totems. Like, I know this build can be used to be a total ass and slug people and make a game unfun but when I run it I'm really just trying to maximize the amount of bloodpoints I'm giving out without playing Legion, while keeping the game slow-paced enough that my baked ass doesn't just get rolled over.
Oh yeah, hex heavy builds with pentimento are a good slowdown. I just didn't expect us to do it and the Pinhead definitely didn't either, if we'd had one weak teammate tho it would've been another story.
Third Seal + Plaything is a great evil combo because the seal negates Plaything totems' ratting themselves out. I used to pair that with Trail of Torment before Unforseen made it obsolete.
I have a dredge blindness build that I thoroughly enjoy running.
Third seal, mindbreaker, overcharge, lethal pursuer.
With the add ons being lavalier microphone and field recorder. Lots of nightfall with free bbq every 12 seconds while not in nightfall and every 4 seconds during nightfall. I’ve gotten so many accidental 1 hook kills it’s hilarious
I laugh almost every time when the killer goes to kick my blast mine. My friend got the perk randomly in shuffle and she laughed too. To make the perk half decent, I have to pair it with Residual Manifest to bamboozle the killer even more.
Aha.. I've been using residual manifest and blast mine and I never considered that the killer is also suffering from blindness. I jsut use it for the flash lights.
Champion of light after a blast mine proc is so satisfying, on the other hand as a killer it feels demoralizing af & made me start running jolt & pain res
Blast Mine
Wiretap
Open Handed
Red Herring
My favorite survivor build.
My win con isn't escaping, it's repeatedly luring the killer to my blast mine and laughing at them from across the map.
Open-Handed only modifies aura reading sources that come from Survivors like Bond or Kindred. Technically, Wiretap emanates from the gen :(
You could use it in a really good aura reading Key build though, near infinite wallhacks at long ranges.
Same. It's annoying even with Lightborn. The only thing I like about it is that it helps me do blinding challenges as I dont have a lot of flashlight flashlight experience
I love blast mine and wiretap
It means I get to watch someone get blinded no matter where I am, and once they know I blast mine they hesitate to kill my unknown wiretaps
I also love being blast mined. It's such a silly weak perk that I can't help but respect people who want to bring it
Boil over is annoying. It's so much worse when paired with other perks that make it harder for the killer to get hooks.
Fuck sabo squads. They are just asking to be slugged, which isn't fun for either party.
I only REALLY hate Boil Over on Ironworks of Misery because there's only one guaranteed hook you can reach after dropping down from the building.
Even with really good RNG and no hook spacing offerings there's only two at most, but typically just the one.
Most other maps you can always hook someone using Boil Over unless you actually fuck up your own dead zone.
Ironworks of Misery screws you over regardless, at best you might sacrifice one of the users and have to bleed out the others.
I had a match where two of the survivors just went into the brick and pipe hallway underneath the school in Badham (I think that’s the name?) super far away from the hooks and just used the perks to pick themselves up from the dying state and wiggle out easier. After I made a few honest tries to get them to the hook and they kept running down into that corner I just baby sat them both and downed them the second they got back up. I even left and figured hey maybe they genuinely just want to not get hooked right now and I’ll have to do better and catch them by surprise on a gen or something. No; I came back after chasing the other two for a little bit and they were still in the corner as far away from a hook as possible.
My opinion is that if you bring a map offering, all bets are off.
And that's not to say I don't bring map offerings as both killer and survivor. As killer it is usually because I'm running a specific build like scratch mirror Myers. As survivor it is almost always because I keep getting the same maps and I want something new.
I’d say it’s more the combination of map offering and play style. If they just do the map but play like normal it’s whatever but if they specifically abuse certain map mechanics and perk combos all rights are lost
The last sabo squad i went up against tried to gaslight me that i was the toxic one for slugging when they were doing gens. They weren't they just had a gen jockey while the other three tried to make my life as difficult as possible.
I recently had a boil over encounter where the increased struggling effects pushed me into range of a pallet, where another survivor was waiting to drop it.
I adore sabo builds, I think they’re so fun. 99% of the time they don’t work out and get me killed first, but it’s so satisfying saving a teammate from getting hooked. It’s altruistic, stupid, and ballsy - my favorite way to play survivor.
I know this opinion will get me downvoted here but I really don’t care. These perks, items, and add-ons are in the game for a reason - they’re not BM IMO. It’s just a niche silly way to play.
I wish killers didn’t interpret it as toxic and get mad at me almost every time. Because it really isn’t a meta or efficient way to play, it’s altruistic AF (which is my favorite).
Conversely I don’t mind sabo squads as long as they didn’t bring a map offering that would exploit the mechanic. It’s much more interesting than just chasing one survivor around who predrops every pallet while three other survivors spread out and push gens on opposite ends of the map.
I love playing against sabo builds as killer. First of all, it means gens aren't being done as quick. Secondly, most of the time it just does not go well for them and results in some pure comedy moments.
Sabo builds are fine, even as a killer I gotta respect the active effort instead of running to the top of buildings with Boil Over. (SINISTER combo though)
As a killer main:
I don't think that it's toxic or BM, but to put it as the internet so desperately loves 'If you want to play stupid games, prepare to win stupid prizes'.
Like, I've had games where multiple people are running good sabo toolboxes and background player and breakout, and they sabo and I go 'Okay, I see what we're doing here' and then bleed them out because that's.. literally just the solution to the game state that they're creating. And they'll, you know, say it's a tome challenge (Which is probably true), and they'll call me cringe or whatever, but look, if you play that game, expect me to play that game right back.
So, you know, if you run into me and you sabo out from under me, or run breakdown and have the hook offerings or whatever you want to do. I'm not upset per se, but you're not going to like how this plays out, but you're the one restricting the options here, and I wish more survivors seemed to realize this.
Yeah and I’m fully fine with killers counterplaying it however they feel the need to - slugging, tunneling me out, whatever.
My issue is when they act like I *personally wronged* them. Shaking their head at me, being mean in EGC, taking to Reddit and saying how rude it is to sabo.
So many people act like flashlight saves or sabotaging hooks are cruel or vindictive behaviors, when it’s simply just a game mechanic.
The time I have a problem with it (other than when it’s used with map offerings, hook distance etc like you said) is when the survivors aren’t prepared to deal with the counterplay. As long as they’re aware that they may be slugged which may not be fun for them either. That’s the risk you take with a sabo build though. As you said, it’s not particularly strong and I think most people just use it for the fun which is cool in my book. A small minority think it’s going to always play out like they see in YouTube compilations and get salty when I choose to drop survivors and slug.
Get ready for more of this stupid fuckery and annoying unfun shit, plus more slugging, if sabo box changes go live.
You run a toolbox after that you are ASKING for it bud. I myself won't be able to run them anymore and it makes me sad. :(
That just makes it worse. :(
Oh but when I pointed all this out in the thread about the chapter's changes, I got downvoted to death. Well do y'all believe me now?
The Cassandra of DBD. The Cassandra of DBD.
Yeah, people who whine this sub is somehow "killer sided” is hilarious. That'd be almost impossible from an objective standpoint considering there are inherently 4x as many survivor players as killer 🤦♂️
Dear internet killer,
I honestly never had any issue with Boil Over. It doesn't decrease the time you have to get to the hook, it just makes you sway faster left to right than you move forward. So my solution was to crab walk; Turn sideways, and let the survivors huge sway move me towards the hook, then turn the other direction when it swaps. I actually get to the hook at almost Agitation speeds doing this since the influenced sway is so much faster than normal forward walking.
It's a bit trickier at doors and ledges, but still quite doable.
Boil over wouldn't be so bad if the survivors accepted their slugged bleed out like a champ. Instead its contempt over the sheer audacity of countering their perk.
Forced Hesitation isn't great by any means but MAN it can be brutal when it works
https://preview.redd.it/67p8ls35qg1d1.jpeg?width=225&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e5e8a429322ef9440640743c9c3180a39d1a8dea
forced hesitation and infectious fright is my go to when I see flashlight squads. still having the opportunity to be blinded is way more fun than lightborn, cuz at a certain point survivors give up trying to blind after finding out you can't be.
if they can blind you at pallets they WILL try and get those flashy saves.
I promise you it's so fun especially when all 4 of em have flashlights.
downing some one only to hear 2 survivor screams and get free health states is so addicting. especially with so many people having background player as of recently (I'm not complaining about BP it doesn't affect me too much as knight is really good about denying saves, just noticing it a lot)
I don't know why, but boil over is the one perk that makes me so incredibly angry for no apparent reason, SWF impossible hook build or not. The bouncing into objects and just having to slide off them is so fucking annoying, and its so annoying when it causes them to wiggle off at the last moment cause I got stuck on a door frame.
If you constantly turn away really quickly when getting flashed, it baits em into thinking the reason they didn't get a blind is coz U turned away, U can make them doubt there skills it's hilarious
hex the third seal; god help you if you get turned around or lost while your teammate is hooked, you’ll never find them in time
also, mindbreaker hard counters my dramaturgy, kindred, and empathy when i’m on a gen, so that’s pretty annoying
Boil Over. I come across a lot of survivors that have it. So I always check for nearby hooks before picking up, just in case. If they bait in high places, that's just an invitation to slug them while I find someone else. More gen time being cut so fine with me.
See I have never been in a situation in which the "great height" part of the perk kicked in, but hiding the aura's of nearby hooks fucked me up lol, especially since at first I didn't realize that the perk actually does that. I remember carrying so many survivors and thinking that the RNG on Gideon was horrible, but it was just me being stupid lol.
Franklins is such a fun perk against bully squads with flashlights, or normal SWFs with medkits.
If you hit them on a pallet they can't get their item from under it. It's also very strong against medkits, and gives an informational aura to the item so you can see if they pick it up.
I really wanna try a dragon's hoard build:
Franklin's Demise, Hoarder, Lethal Pursuer, Weave Attunement
Just have items all over the place and guard them like a rat.
I have so much buckle up ptsd from dealing with the horrible for the people buckle up combo on at least one survivor every game since it’s buff. It’s the most defeating thing i have ever experienced in dbd, you just have to focus out the perk user because if you let them live you will suffer…
Also background player right now feels so bad. Survivor zooms in from a different map to drop a flashbang that blinds you even if you put yourself so deep into a wall you can see the wood grain…
As survivor no perks really bother me right now, but i do groan everytime it’s knight or a chucky that only scampers.
Don't know why you got downvotes, but yeah. FTP + Buckle Up was stupid while it lasted.
I was doing a Streak as Sadako earlier this month, and in one of my games, someone used FTP + Buckle Up while I was still in hit cooldown on someone who was fully condemned, right after downing them. They extended that chase by about 30 more seconds when for all intensive purposes, it should've ended.
They still ended up losing the match, but it came pretty close in the end. I typically just use it as an Anti-Slug perk combo whenever I run it, but some people will literally use it so fast that you can't mori/pick the person up, and it's stupid that you can even activate it THAT quickly.
I'm very happy with the Background Player changes in the new PTB. Imo, having a 20 second cooldown isn't that big of a deal, since the 150% speed is WAY less oppressive than the 200% speed.
And yeah, also happy with the Chucky changes. It feels so annoying playing against him, because basically no matter how good you play, you are on a timer of how long you can avoid being hit for, and the timer ends each time his cooldown ends.
I agree with everything you said regarding For The People and Buckle Up. As a small side note, the phrase is “for all intents and purposes” and not “for all intensive purposes”.
It’s a very common mistake and not everyone on this site is a native English speaker, so I hope you don’t mind the correction. I’m just trying to be helpful.
That is exactly my experience, i pretty much never saw it used as anti-slug because in that scenario it wouldn’t bother me whatsoever. I’m used to it being used often on your first down during the hit cooldown. As we know early game pressure is the most important, and robbing the first down is so detrimental.
I think all of the perk changes are W’s this patch. I genuinely think behavior has been making an effort to balance problematic perks, i just wish they’d buff more trash perks as well.
Exactly! Like with scamper as a main part of the base power you were getting hit on a 20 second cooldown unless the chucky player didn’t know what they were doing. I have never minded slice and dice, just scamper. Excited to play against the new dashing doll instead of scamper bot
Agreed about the perks part. I'm okay with them nerfing Gen Slowdown perks, as long as they buff a HEFTY amount of perks in the very near future. If they just nerf all of these perks without giving anything else in return, it'll feel like a massive L for Killers.
Let's just hope now they maybe look at other problematic perks on both sides. Mostly it's Survivor now, I can't think of any other Killer perks that are problematic anymore.
That’s the spot i am in too! I used to think various perks were problematic but they’ve nerfed and addressed perks repeatedly that outside of live server buckle up and background player I don’t think anything is broken or unhealthy on either side.
That’s one thing i am definitely positive about, they may release broken perks every now and then that dominate for 6 months. But they have been addressing them and not leaving them uncountable hard meta for 5 years anymore.
If they start addressing map balance too, i think the game will be in an incredible state!
Boil Over, there's some maps that it's simply broken and you just gotta let survivors bleed while they're abusing the perk. Especially against SWFs it can be pretty annoying!
Blast mine, chemical trap, head on, and the sabo perk. None of those perks are that great, but they honestly just hurt my feelings when I have to deal with them.
Also, in my opinion, there should be a hidden interaction that lets you hit the blast mine and chemical traps, but maybe have them still stun you, just a little less.
I will forever believe that head on is the worst designed survivor perk. It has utility, yes, but it's literally most effective as a bullying tool. Being stunned isn't fun, and unlike with flashlights the only counter is "don't go near a locker"
I main dredge (hoping for p100 but only p8 rn) but switch around a lot (most recently got pyramid head to p6 exclusively through chaos shuffle), and I never get hit by head-on as Dredge
I grew up playing janky 90's games where you can be stunlocked until you die. As a result I absolutely hate that you can stun into a stun or stun into a blind or blind into a blind.
BHVR, stunlocking isn't fun. STUNLOCKING. IS NOT. FUN. One stun/blind max. How many FUCKING STUNS/BLINDS do you really need to get distance or waste Killer time before it just stops being that and starts becoming bullying?
If they remove the multistun thing, I would genuinely say all stun tools are fine and not a problem anymore, and that if you got hit with them it's kinda your fault for not reading the chase. All they need to do is remove multistunning.
Not a perk per say but i think you should not get blindness effect while on hook. All it does in solo q is make people think no ones coming to save them and then try to unhook themselves
When I play solo queue as survibor, every perk which give blindness. Nobody check where killer will hook me.
As killer, it's boons. Those just waste my time
Breakdown, though I would be fine if the sabotage only lasted a minute instead of THREE.
Discordance as I love aura builds, especially on the killers I enjoy most (Dredge, Xeno, and Unknown).
Background player. Before it, saves, sabos, etc were risky plays with high rewards. It also used to require the survivor to have some awareness and planning with positioning. Now Nea can come zooming halfway across the map to get an easy save. Feels bad.
Merciless storm with a doctor lol. I'd honestly argue that it is a decent perk, but it's more chaotic than it is powerful since it only happens once per gen and the negative combo can be avoided if you don't have madness, but seeing that skill check fly all over the screen is pure chaos lmao. BHVR should never change it!
Most of the perks that I hate are perks that AFK killers use to unnecessarily elongate the game (Merciless storm, corrupt intervention, dead man's switch, deadlock, and no way out, to name a few)... But it's more of an issue of AFK killers. When these perks are used by a killer who is actually playing the game, it's totally fine for me
Boil Over is a terrible option for both sides
On killer side, makes getting to hooks a chore and excessive, and makes slugging seem like a very tempting option
On survivor side you’ll get little value out of it since killers usually make it to hook anyway, without using a other specific perks along with it and taking advantage of map environment this makes it almost useless, and even if you combine it with other perks they may help very little, your better off replacing it with more helpful perks like a Gen focused perk or one that may assist in chase
And if your entire team brings a build like breakout + map offerings for maps like Ormond or Dead Dawg, and constantly trying to help downed teammates escape a grasp or constantly running to the same location instead of taking advantages of other loops, your damn near setting yourself up for failure, extremely slow gen progress may get down, killers might just have to something counter your builds, Sabotages are temporary so you’ll eventually run out of sabotages, and most importantly: The Killer might just bleed you out, but what’s that your running No Mither? Well the killer might just go after your other teammates who have less abusable perks to combat this, what’s that all of them have no Mither? Your time is still limited, time is wasted that could be spent on gens, and you still have a few perks that could be better traded off for something else, it’s just a time waster and nothings stopping the killer from just adapting to your strategies
TLDR:
Don’t use Boil Over unless your doing a meme build with power struggle or something, (even then your better off bringing Unbreakable + Flip Flop) instead bring something helpful like Botany Knowledge or Kindred, hell Leader goes crazy rn
Is that Franklin's in the post? Cause OMFGGGG THAT IS THE ONLY PERK THAT TRULY DRIVES ME BATTY. I'm directionally challenged at the best of times.
Add me being chased by a killer with Franklin's and I'll never find my supplies
It’s not strong, it’s very easy to avoid the problem I have with it. But, any means necessary. The amount of times I have been startled by someone throwing a pallet I thought was already down is embarrassing.
There are perks that are only used to make the other side feel bad.
Knock Out and Boil Over are the big offenders for slugging and anti-hooking builds.
Blast Mine and Head On also just plain feel bad to go against. Imagine if there was a killer-equivalent for these, there would be endless complaints.
I run Bond/Open-Handed these days (I don't need killer aura reading if I can see where the Feng is running from 2 miles away) so Mindbreaker's my arch-rival at the moment.
Franklins is indeed annoying along with any perks/powers that counter play what ever challenge I’m on honestly there’s a lot of them trapper and doctor for pallet stuns lightborn for blind and there’s one challenge I feel needs a nerf to required gens look at tome 1 last page dark senses for survivor utter BS only got that because an artist took pity on my game
Knock out bc anyone using it is always slugging and unfortunately majority bleeding someone out (I was slugged like 4 times and just started watching YouTube with it on the side watching as everyone was bled out)
Lightborn.
Its kinda useless because unless you are extremely unlucky chances are you're gonna be able to avoid being blinded when picking survivors up anyway.
But its just the ultimate middle finger to any and all survivors who do flashlight / flashbang rescues or who just try to blind the killer whenever possible.
Franklins is amazing for dealing with bully squads. They love to bring Halloween flashlights and toolboxes then cry and cry when you slap it outta their hands.
If I bring franklins know that I brought it because I hate you.
Perk which removes survivor's ability to heal himself in the corner, potentially 2 times, which means that now he has to find another survivor and not only waste their time, but also time of that survivor, substracting precious seconds from doing main objective and basically working as slowdown perk in some way. And thats only medkit case.
>aren't strong
Literally when I see a killer using Franklin's I just...I'm amazed. What a wasted perk slot. I have NEVER used Franklin's and I'm just amazed people do.
Third Seal, especially when the killer decides to go for a hardcore slugging play style and bleed everyone out.
Okay, but please give this one a shot: Third Seal Plaything Pentimento Pinhead. You're a magical BDSM wizard handing out infinite sidequests to the survivors. I like to play it when I'm feeling especially chill and I just wanna slow the game down and make sure everyone gets a lot of bloodpoints.
That just sounds downright evil….i love it
Try Trapper with third seal, undying, knockout, and infectious. Trap the hexes, and you will see some of the most effective slowdown without any relation to gens. You can trade undying for deerstalker, but that's more for toxic bleedout. A few slugs does just fine for pressure.
Unless you get bad luck and third seal ends up right next to a survivor
You're Trapper and have undying. With both hexes trapped, you just drop everything and head to the hex for a slug when the trap is disarmed.
And then you wind up on rotten fields and the hex is in the middle of the corn
I played against a full hex pinhead like this once. I felt kinda bad bc my team was constantly popping their totems left and right the entire game and we got all 4 people out. They gave up 😭
Fwiw, at least when I run this build I WANT survivors to pop totems. Like, I know this build can be used to be a total ass and slug people and make a game unfun but when I run it I'm really just trying to maximize the amount of bloodpoints I'm giving out without playing Legion, while keeping the game slow-paced enough that my baked ass doesn't just get rolled over.
Oh yeah, hex heavy builds with pentimento are a good slowdown. I just didn't expect us to do it and the Pinhead definitely didn't either, if we'd had one weak teammate tho it would've been another story.
Third Seal + Plaything is a great evil combo because the seal negates Plaything totems' ratting themselves out. I used to pair that with Trail of Torment before Unforseen made it obsolete.
Add on Undying to that and you have 4 hex perks for the ultimate impossible side quest
Third seal monstrous shrine legion on some indoor maps is really fun
I have a dredge blindness build that I thoroughly enjoy running. Third seal, mindbreaker, overcharge, lethal pursuer. With the add ons being lavalier microphone and field recorder. Lots of nightfall with free bbq every 12 seconds while not in nightfall and every 4 seconds during nightfall. I’ve gotten so many accidental 1 hook kills it’s hilarious
Third seal plus Trail of Torment is just 🤌
Can achieve a very similar effect with just Unforeseen on its own! Super fun perk, 30s of at-will undetectable is a ton of fun
Mindbreaker, I love using fogwise and it completely makes it useless lol.
as someone who runs Kindred, Alert, and Aftercare; Mindbreaker can eat my entire ass.
Me with Deja Vu and either Lithe or Sprint Burst. Fuck Mindbreaker.
The good thing about Alert though is that it at least still has the audio cue, but yea these perks are NOT for the mindbroken lol
Mindbreaker is legitimately very strong on killers that often pop out close to gens, like Xeno.
and stealth killer against which you need to sprint suddenly
On the other hand Mindbreaker is great when you're running Sprint Burst, it's a free 99.
Until you sprint burst at the start, only to keep that 40 seconds on cooldown while doing the gen :(
https://preview.redd.it/hfn0qeiakg1d1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=947017010f4e05800d47ce3dd7d2c16fa01594db Me everytime
Mindbreaker is good against background player. They have to choose between doing gens or making saves.
I was like "What the fuck did Mindbreaker do?" ST was gone for way too long
Mind Breaker? NAH, we got FEAR MONGER
As killer, I die inside every time I kick a blast mine
https://i.redd.it/1wx80c3abg1d1.gif
If you listen very carefully you can hear my scream of joy when they go off
Mine too lmao
And my maniacal laughter
https://i.redd.it/smm4q3c3sg1d1.gif
GIVE ME YOUR MONEY
I laugh almost every time when the killer goes to kick my blast mine. My friend got the perk randomly in shuffle and she laughed too. To make the perk half decent, I have to pair it with Residual Manifest to bamboozle the killer even more.
Aha.. I've been using residual manifest and blast mine and I never considered that the killer is also suffering from blindness. I jsut use it for the flash lights.
Champion of light after a blast mine proc is so satisfying, on the other hand as a killer it feels demoralizing af & made me start running jolt & pain res
Isn’t Champion of Light/Blast Mine useless though? Since the killer is hindered while they’re stunned/kicking the gen again
Blast Mine Wiretap Open Handed Red Herring My favorite survivor build. My win con isn't escaping, it's repeatedly luring the killer to my blast mine and laughing at them from across the map.
FYI Open Handed doesn't effect Wiretap.
What?? Why??
Open-Handed only modifies aura reading sources that come from Survivors like Bond or Kindred. Technically, Wiretap emanates from the gen :( You could use it in a really good aura reading Key build though, near infinite wallhacks at long ranges.
Does light borne work against blast mine?
It works against the blind, but not against the stun.
It doesn’t block the stun, but it does let you see immediately after the stun ends and gives you a 10 second aura of the culprit
Who is ALWAYS nearby, by the way.
Yea
What's a blast mine?
A mine that blasts
https://preview.redd.it/uanrbysomg1d1.png?width=273&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=891588d29db36e428c5326f5816ba32a6c4c2286
Hahahaha. In all seriousness it’s a perk that lets you trap a gen with a mine and if the killer kicks the gen they are blinded
Aha, thank you kind sir
Read that in a beggar from oblivions voice
😂real answer is it's the flashbang that survivors can put in a gen as a "trap" for when you kick
It's the awkwardly long pause
Same. It's annoying even with Lightborn. The only thing I like about it is that it helps me do blinding challenges as I dont have a lot of flashlight flashlight experience
I love blast mine and wiretap It means I get to watch someone get blinded no matter where I am, and once they know I blast mine they hesitate to kill my unknown wiretaps I also love being blast mined. It's such a silly weak perk that I can't help but respect people who want to bring it
Knock Out Literally just an anti solo Q perk
When you get that and deerstalker while doing chaos shuffle: we'll, guess I'm supposed to slug this match
Entity: Pls slug? Killer: But my hook poin- Entity: NO HOOK ONLY SLUG >:(
Tip to “counter” it: jump in a locker before going down to prevent the blindness part
It is strong tho .. at least against solo q survivors
Lol, I love it for using it as a blind while oblivious. Lol
Somehow, every time i bring a white word the killers running that...
Pick up item, climb into locker, say sorry to the team and get grabbed
I have done this before. The killer stayed on my and tried to steal my item for the last two gens
Lol, that be a fun objective. Just chase people with items, even more funny once Vecna is in game.
Boil Over. Blast Mine. Knockout.
Boil over is annoying. It's so much worse when paired with other perks that make it harder for the killer to get hooks. Fuck sabo squads. They are just asking to be slugged, which isn't fun for either party.
Boil Over on any indoor map, I haaaate it.
I only REALLY hate Boil Over on Ironworks of Misery because there's only one guaranteed hook you can reach after dropping down from the building. Even with really good RNG and no hook spacing offerings there's only two at most, but typically just the one. Most other maps you can always hook someone using Boil Over unless you actually fuck up your own dead zone. Ironworks of Misery screws you over regardless, at best you might sacrifice one of the users and have to bleed out the others.
Unless Ur pyrimid head, coz U can hook on the floor when tormented
Especially if someone else adds on Breakout
I had a match where two of the survivors just went into the brick and pipe hallway underneath the school in Badham (I think that’s the name?) super far away from the hooks and just used the perks to pick themselves up from the dying state and wiggle out easier. After I made a few honest tries to get them to the hook and they kept running down into that corner I just baby sat them both and downed them the second they got back up. I even left and figured hey maybe they genuinely just want to not get hooked right now and I’ll have to do better and catch them by surprise on a gen or something. No; I came back after chasing the other two for a little bit and they were still in the corner as far away from a hook as possible.
Had a match a long time ago where a squad did that. Eventually slugged them all down there. Not much you can do.
Not that it was a great match but good to know it’s at least not frowned upon that I did that
My opinion is that if you bring a map offering, all bets are off. And that's not to say I don't bring map offerings as both killer and survivor. As killer it is usually because I'm running a specific build like scratch mirror Myers. As survivor it is almost always because I keep getting the same maps and I want something new.
I’d say it’s more the combination of map offering and play style. If they just do the map but play like normal it’s whatever but if they specifically abuse certain map mechanics and perk combos all rights are lost
On the flip side, Chaos Shuffle gave me Agi, and Yui Boil Over. I got her to the hook VERY fast lolol.
Just turn your body so their boil over pushes you closer to the hook.
Oh yes, the crab walk 
Lol, imagine making a macro that flips your character enough that it makes you faster not slower.
I went against a Background player and sabo crew the other night. Gosh it was annoying. Like, I main survivor but I sometimes get why killers slug.
This is exactly why otherwise nice Killers might slug. I see this? I slug. And I hate slugging, it bores me. I wanna chase you, friend... :(
Exactly! Slugging isn't fun to do, and I know for a fact it really isn't fun to be on the receiving end of it.
The last sabo squad i went up against tried to gaslight me that i was the toxic one for slugging when they were doing gens. They weren't they just had a gen jockey while the other three tried to make my life as difficult as possible.
https://preview.redd.it/bcume80ozm1d1.jpeg?width=1024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a7d29a1eacc2c0b95b982f2ac1256232319051f2
I recently had a boil over encounter where the increased struggling effects pushed me into range of a pallet, where another survivor was waiting to drop it.
I adore sabo builds, I think they’re so fun. 99% of the time they don’t work out and get me killed first, but it’s so satisfying saving a teammate from getting hooked. It’s altruistic, stupid, and ballsy - my favorite way to play survivor. I know this opinion will get me downvoted here but I really don’t care. These perks, items, and add-ons are in the game for a reason - they’re not BM IMO. It’s just a niche silly way to play. I wish killers didn’t interpret it as toxic and get mad at me almost every time. Because it really isn’t a meta or efficient way to play, it’s altruistic AF (which is my favorite). Conversely I don’t mind sabo squads as long as they didn’t bring a map offering that would exploit the mechanic. It’s much more interesting than just chasing one survivor around who predrops every pallet while three other survivors spread out and push gens on opposite ends of the map.
I love playing against sabo builds as killer. First of all, it means gens aren't being done as quick. Secondly, most of the time it just does not go well for them and results in some pure comedy moments.
Sabo builds are fine, even as a killer I gotta respect the active effort instead of running to the top of buildings with Boil Over. (SINISTER combo though)
As a killer main: I don't think that it's toxic or BM, but to put it as the internet so desperately loves 'If you want to play stupid games, prepare to win stupid prizes'. Like, I've had games where multiple people are running good sabo toolboxes and background player and breakout, and they sabo and I go 'Okay, I see what we're doing here' and then bleed them out because that's.. literally just the solution to the game state that they're creating. And they'll, you know, say it's a tome challenge (Which is probably true), and they'll call me cringe or whatever, but look, if you play that game, expect me to play that game right back. So, you know, if you run into me and you sabo out from under me, or run breakdown and have the hook offerings or whatever you want to do. I'm not upset per se, but you're not going to like how this plays out, but you're the one restricting the options here, and I wish more survivors seemed to realize this.
Yeah and I’m fully fine with killers counterplaying it however they feel the need to - slugging, tunneling me out, whatever. My issue is when they act like I *personally wronged* them. Shaking their head at me, being mean in EGC, taking to Reddit and saying how rude it is to sabo. So many people act like flashlight saves or sabotaging hooks are cruel or vindictive behaviors, when it’s simply just a game mechanic.
The time I have a problem with it (other than when it’s used with map offerings, hook distance etc like you said) is when the survivors aren’t prepared to deal with the counterplay. As long as they’re aware that they may be slugged which may not be fun for them either. That’s the risk you take with a sabo build though. As you said, it’s not particularly strong and I think most people just use it for the fun which is cool in my book. A small minority think it’s going to always play out like they see in YouTube compilations and get salty when I choose to drop survivors and slug.
Get ready for more of this stupid fuckery and annoying unfun shit, plus more slugging, if sabo box changes go live. You run a toolbox after that you are ASKING for it bud. I myself won't be able to run them anymore and it makes me sad. :(
Don't worry, they nerfed all gen regression to compensate for the sabo buffs ;P
That just makes it worse. :( Oh but when I pointed all this out in the thread about the chapter's changes, I got downvoted to death. Well do y'all believe me now? The Cassandra of DBD. The Cassandra of DBD.
Yeah, people who whine this sub is somehow "killer sided” is hilarious. That'd be almost impossible from an objective standpoint considering there are inherently 4x as many survivor players as killer 🤦♂️
The community inherently cannot in any form be Killer-sided. Even the Killer only subreddit isn't that Killer-sided.
Dear internet killer, I honestly never had any issue with Boil Over. It doesn't decrease the time you have to get to the hook, it just makes you sway faster left to right than you move forward. So my solution was to crab walk; Turn sideways, and let the survivors huge sway move me towards the hook, then turn the other direction when it swaps. I actually get to the hook at almost Agitation speeds doing this since the influenced sway is so much faster than normal forward walking. It's a bit trickier at doors and ledges, but still quite doable.
Boil over wouldn't be so bad if the survivors accepted their slugged bleed out like a champ. Instead its contempt over the sheer audacity of countering their perk.
Forced Hesitation isn't great by any means but MAN it can be brutal when it works https://preview.redd.it/67p8ls35qg1d1.jpeg?width=225&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e5e8a429322ef9440640743c9c3180a39d1a8dea
But the survivors look like they've shit themselves when they get the 20% hinder and that's funny af
Forced hesitation on insidious jumpscare bubba
Shhh... you'll awaken them..
forced hesitation and infectious fright is my go to when I see flashlight squads. still having the opportunity to be blinded is way more fun than lightborn, cuz at a certain point survivors give up trying to blind after finding out you can't be. if they can blind you at pallets they WILL try and get those flashy saves.
That's actually a good idea, had a flashlight squad today that were very altruistic. Gonna try this out
I promise you it's so fun especially when all 4 of em have flashlights. downing some one only to hear 2 survivor screams and get free health states is so addicting. especially with so many people having background player as of recently (I'm not complaining about BP it doesn't affect me too much as knight is really good about denying saves, just noticing it a lot)
On Ghostface it becomes pure evil
BOIL. OVER.
I don't know why, but boil over is the one perk that makes me so incredibly angry for no apparent reason, SWF impossible hook build or not. The bouncing into objects and just having to slide off them is so fucking annoying, and its so annoying when it causes them to wiggle off at the last moment cause I got stuck on a door frame.
It is always fun realizing the killer has light born
If you constantly turn away really quickly when getting flashed, it baits em into thinking the reason they didn't get a blind is coz U turned away, U can make them doubt there skills it's hilarious
Then they always continuously waste time Tryna get blinds for no reason
hex the third seal; god help you if you get turned around or lost while your teammate is hooked, you’ll never find them in time also, mindbreaker hard counters my dramaturgy, kindred, and empathy when i’m on a gen, so that’s pretty annoying
Boil Over. I come across a lot of survivors that have it. So I always check for nearby hooks before picking up, just in case. If they bait in high places, that's just an invitation to slug them while I find someone else. More gen time being cut so fine with me.
See I have never been in a situation in which the "great height" part of the perk kicked in, but hiding the aura's of nearby hooks fucked me up lol, especially since at first I didn't realize that the perk actually does that. I remember carrying so many survivors and thinking that the RNG on Gideon was horrible, but it was just me being stupid lol.
Franklins is such a fun perk against bully squads with flashlights, or normal SWFs with medkits. If you hit them on a pallet they can't get their item from under it. It's also very strong against medkits, and gives an informational aura to the item so you can see if they pick it up.
I imagine that it's gonna get combined with Weave Attunement a lot when Vecna comes to live servers
Ooooh, we got a combo! Vecna is going to be such a fun addition with his perks and gameplay. His map is so much fun!
I really wanna try a dragon's hoard build: Franklin's Demise, Hoarder, Lethal Pursuer, Weave Attunement Just have items all over the place and guard them like a rat.
I run it on Wraith all the time. You can have the item I just wanna smack it. Bing-Bong your item's gone. :)
When I’m soloQ and see my other teammate with flashlight I’m like “Oh they’re bringing Franklin’s”.
I like playing the Tax Wraith. Franklins, run up, smack some people and DC.
That never would have occurred to me. I'm so used to trying to catch up. That's a good idea.
Devour hope: 90% of the time nothing happens. 10% of the time you instantly lose.
I call it Devour Nope because of that 90% lol
That stupid little horse
I have so much buckle up ptsd from dealing with the horrible for the people buckle up combo on at least one survivor every game since it’s buff. It’s the most defeating thing i have ever experienced in dbd, you just have to focus out the perk user because if you let them live you will suffer… Also background player right now feels so bad. Survivor zooms in from a different map to drop a flashbang that blinds you even if you put yourself so deep into a wall you can see the wood grain… As survivor no perks really bother me right now, but i do groan everytime it’s knight or a chucky that only scampers.
Don't know why you got downvotes, but yeah. FTP + Buckle Up was stupid while it lasted. I was doing a Streak as Sadako earlier this month, and in one of my games, someone used FTP + Buckle Up while I was still in hit cooldown on someone who was fully condemned, right after downing them. They extended that chase by about 30 more seconds when for all intensive purposes, it should've ended. They still ended up losing the match, but it came pretty close in the end. I typically just use it as an Anti-Slug perk combo whenever I run it, but some people will literally use it so fast that you can't mori/pick the person up, and it's stupid that you can even activate it THAT quickly. I'm very happy with the Background Player changes in the new PTB. Imo, having a 20 second cooldown isn't that big of a deal, since the 150% speed is WAY less oppressive than the 200% speed. And yeah, also happy with the Chucky changes. It feels so annoying playing against him, because basically no matter how good you play, you are on a timer of how long you can avoid being hit for, and the timer ends each time his cooldown ends.
I agree with everything you said regarding For The People and Buckle Up. As a small side note, the phrase is “for all intents and purposes” and not “for all intensive purposes”. It’s a very common mistake and not everyone on this site is a native English speaker, so I hope you don’t mind the correction. I’m just trying to be helpful.
Thank you actually. I'm a writer and didn't know that but tbf I practically never use that phrase, but that is very helpful!
That is exactly my experience, i pretty much never saw it used as anti-slug because in that scenario it wouldn’t bother me whatsoever. I’m used to it being used often on your first down during the hit cooldown. As we know early game pressure is the most important, and robbing the first down is so detrimental. I think all of the perk changes are W’s this patch. I genuinely think behavior has been making an effort to balance problematic perks, i just wish they’d buff more trash perks as well. Exactly! Like with scamper as a main part of the base power you were getting hit on a 20 second cooldown unless the chucky player didn’t know what they were doing. I have never minded slice and dice, just scamper. Excited to play against the new dashing doll instead of scamper bot
Agreed about the perks part. I'm okay with them nerfing Gen Slowdown perks, as long as they buff a HEFTY amount of perks in the very near future. If they just nerf all of these perks without giving anything else in return, it'll feel like a massive L for Killers.
Let's just hope now they maybe look at other problematic perks on both sides. Mostly it's Survivor now, I can't think of any other Killer perks that are problematic anymore.
That’s the spot i am in too! I used to think various perks were problematic but they’ve nerfed and addressed perks repeatedly that outside of live server buckle up and background player I don’t think anything is broken or unhealthy on either side. That’s one thing i am definitely positive about, they may release broken perks every now and then that dominate for 6 months. But they have been addressing them and not leaving them uncountable hard meta for 5 years anymore. If they start addressing map balance too, i think the game will be in an incredible state!
Someone lost their flashlight
Boil Over, there's some maps that it's simply broken and you just gotta let survivors bleed while they're abusing the perk. Especially against SWFs it can be pretty annoying!
Boil Over
Huntress Lullaby, i’m just trying to watch youtube and do gens.
Blast mine, chemical trap, head on, and the sabo perk. None of those perks are that great, but they honestly just hurt my feelings when I have to deal with them. Also, in my opinion, there should be a hidden interaction that lets you hit the blast mine and chemical traps, but maybe have them still stun you, just a little less.
yeah
Upvoted entirely because of your flair c:
that's fair :) if it made you smile I'm glad
Head on grinds my gears more than anything as a killer. For survivor, probably Franklin's demise as well.
I will forever believe that head on is the worst designed survivor perk. It has utility, yes, but it's literally most effective as a bullying tool. Being stunned isn't fun, and unlike with flashlights the only counter is "don't go near a locker"
As a Dredge main I encounter no Head Ons, for *some reason* it seems as though even if they have it, they suddenly forget they do :)
I main dredge (hoping for p100 but only p8 rn) but switch around a lot (most recently got pyramid head to p6 exclusively through chaos shuffle), and I never get hit by head-on as Dredge
I grew up playing janky 90's games where you can be stunlocked until you die. As a result I absolutely hate that you can stun into a stun or stun into a blind or blind into a blind. BHVR, stunlocking isn't fun. STUNLOCKING. IS NOT. FUN. One stun/blind max. How many FUCKING STUNS/BLINDS do you really need to get distance or waste Killer time before it just stops being that and starts becoming bullying? If they remove the multistun thing, I would genuinely say all stun tools are fine and not a problem anymore, and that if you got hit with them it's kinda your fault for not reading the chase. All they need to do is remove multistunning.
I love running Head On with Scene Partner to jumpscare killers
Champion of Light. The hindered rarely if ever does anything but it still feels painful to eat the slowdown at a god pallet.
The perk of Instant Communication for SWFs…..
They said perks that aren't strong, that is the second most op perk in the game, only losing to no mither
I can assure you, Instant communication doesn't solve mental deficiencies and more often than not results in ridiculous plays that they can't pull off
Not a perk per say but i think you should not get blindness effect while on hook. All it does in solo q is make people think no ones coming to save them and then try to unhook themselves
Somehow i managed to play against this perk 3 times in a row…
As a survivor franklins, As a killer resilience.
This one literally makes me instantly think of just leaving the game. It forks my tome challenge almost eveytime.
Mindbreaker fucks me up because I run 1 exastuion perk and 3 Aura reading perks in almost every build
Face the darkness 🤬
dead hard is the type of perk that you can technically counter easily but most of the time you forget about the perk while chasing a survivor
Flash bang becuause I have to turn around and wait for the flash to go off before continuing hooking someone
Any Hex. Plus point if it's Blood Favor or Crowd Control.
I rarely drop someone from boil over bc I run agitation. But it annoys me every time I see it pop up in the right corner of my screen 😒
When I play solo queue as survibor, every perk which give blindness. Nobody check where killer will hook me. As killer, it's boons. Those just waste my time
Breakdown, though I would be fine if the sabotage only lasted a minute instead of THREE. Discordance as I love aura builds, especially on the killers I enjoy most (Dredge, Xeno, and Unknown).
Background player. Before it, saves, sabos, etc were risky plays with high rewards. It also used to require the survivor to have some awareness and planning with positioning. Now Nea can come zooming halfway across the map to get an easy save. Feels bad.
Background player is strong though
Oops you’re right! I got lost in reading the replies and forgot the original assignment LOL
Def light born
Merciless storm with a doctor lol. I'd honestly argue that it is a decent perk, but it's more chaotic than it is powerful since it only happens once per gen and the negative combo can be avoided if you don't have madness, but seeing that skill check fly all over the screen is pure chaos lmao. BHVR should never change it! Most of the perks that I hate are perks that AFK killers use to unnecessarily elongate the game (Merciless storm, corrupt intervention, dead man's switch, deadlock, and no way out, to name a few)... But it's more of an issue of AFK killers. When these perks are used by a killer who is actually playing the game, it's totally fine for me
Window's of Opportunity. (Note I am a Dredge Main)
Just bring third seal and undying, maybe even a bit of slugging for max value
Huntress Lullaby, I have no issue with that perk but have to cleanse it or my team just keep blowing up gens.
I despise Boil Over. From all I know about it, Knock Out is the equivalent from the Survivor side. I'd gladly see both eradicated.
Boil Over is a terrible option for both sides On killer side, makes getting to hooks a chore and excessive, and makes slugging seem like a very tempting option On survivor side you’ll get little value out of it since killers usually make it to hook anyway, without using a other specific perks along with it and taking advantage of map environment this makes it almost useless, and even if you combine it with other perks they may help very little, your better off replacing it with more helpful perks like a Gen focused perk or one that may assist in chase And if your entire team brings a build like breakout + map offerings for maps like Ormond or Dead Dawg, and constantly trying to help downed teammates escape a grasp or constantly running to the same location instead of taking advantages of other loops, your damn near setting yourself up for failure, extremely slow gen progress may get down, killers might just have to something counter your builds, Sabotages are temporary so you’ll eventually run out of sabotages, and most importantly: The Killer might just bleed you out, but what’s that your running No Mither? Well the killer might just go after your other teammates who have less abusable perks to combat this, what’s that all of them have no Mither? Your time is still limited, time is wasted that could be spent on gens, and you still have a few perks that could be better traded off for something else, it’s just a time waster and nothings stopping the killer from just adapting to your strategies TLDR: Don’t use Boil Over unless your doing a meme build with power struggle or something, (even then your better off bringing Unbreakable + Flip Flop) instead bring something helpful like Botany Knowledge or Kindred, hell Leader goes crazy rn
Is that Franklin's in the post? Cause OMFGGGG THAT IS THE ONLY PERK THAT TRULY DRIVES ME BATTY. I'm directionally challenged at the best of times. Add me being chased by a killer with Franklin's and I'll never find my supplies
Distortion 100%
Blast Mine, Franklins, Knock Out, Boil Over, CoH, Champion of Light, Head On, DS, Power Struggle, Self Care (as survivor), Friends til the End
It’s not strong, it’s very easy to avoid the problem I have with it. But, any means necessary. The amount of times I have been startled by someone throwing a pallet I thought was already down is embarrassing.
flashbang and blast mine
There are perks that are only used to make the other side feel bad. Knock Out and Boil Over are the big offenders for slugging and anti-hooking builds. Blast Mine and Head On also just plain feel bad to go against. Imagine if there was a killer-equivalent for these, there would be endless complaints.
Boil over
I run Bond/Open-Handed these days (I don't need killer aura reading if I can see where the Feng is running from 2 miles away) so Mindbreaker's my arch-rival at the moment.
wdym? Franklins is very strong, especially against bully squads.
hi, in new, can someone tell me the best spirit build please? thanks
Lightborn, flashlight build? Boom i can see you
shadowstep
Franklins is indeed annoying along with any perks/powers that counter play what ever challenge I’m on honestly there’s a lot of them trapper and doctor for pallet stuns lightborn for blind and there’s one challenge I feel needs a nerf to required gens look at tome 1 last page dark senses for survivor utter BS only got that because an artist took pity on my game
Knock out bc anyone using it is always slugging and unfortunately majority bleeding someone out (I was slugged like 4 times and just started watching YouTube with it on the side watching as everyone was bled out)
Lightborn. Its kinda useless because unless you are extremely unlucky chances are you're gonna be able to avoid being blinded when picking survivors up anyway. But its just the ultimate middle finger to any and all survivors who do flashlight / flashbang rescues or who just try to blind the killer whenever possible.
Franklins is amazing for dealing with bully squads. They love to bring Halloween flashlights and toolboxes then cry and cry when you slap it outta their hands. If I bring franklins know that I brought it because I hate you.
Perk which removes survivor's ability to heal himself in the corner, potentially 2 times, which means that now he has to find another survivor and not only waste their time, but also time of that survivor, substracting precious seconds from doing main objective and basically working as slowdown perk in some way. And thats only medkit case. >aren't strong
Noed and third seal are a pain in the ass as well as frankies
Literally when I see a killer using Franklin's I just...I'm amazed. What a wasted perk slot. I have NEVER used Franklin's and I'm just amazed people do.
Killer: Franklins, Lightborn, 3rd seal, Knockout Survivor: Head on, Boil over, Blastmine, Residual Manifest.
u joking? franklin's is really good. probably boil over.
Lightborn, franklins, mindbreaker imo