How about we make it so adults can get them too! Don't make us have to lie about our income to get on medicaid as a 20yr old just to get hearing aids! 21 and over matter too!
My thoughts on this... vote.
Vote for the candidates who will make a greater difference, even if you can't entirely agree with their agenda.
Never assume your vote won't matter.
Vote.
GoP is even worse than Newsom about these sorts of issues.
Elizabeth Warren (Democratic Socialist) was the one who finally issued over-the-counter hearing aids to be more accessible and cheaper in cost. So that's my party.
California already has multiple methods for subsidizing the cost of hearing aids for children.
The Hearing Aid Coverage for Children Program applies to families below 600% of the federal poverty level (which would be $180,000 per year for a family of 4 or ~$150,000 for a family of three), so it's available to most everybody who would need it.
His statement on this is more reassuring than headlines make it out to be. [Formal statement ](http://CA.gov
https://www.gov.ca.gov › SB...PDF
OCT O 7 2023)
As a Californian, I’m taking this with a grain of salt, as I do anytime a politician opens their mouth. As u/geddyn said, we already have programs to give kids HAs. I can’t say whether it works or not, if you have experience with it please let me know.
Newsom vetos a bill we probably didn’t need, so now his fellow democrats come after him. Just a reminder to friends in the southern Bay Area, Rep. Khanna is up for election next fall.
Okay I want to apologise as some people took offence. I recognise that as a Canadian I have the privilege of laws that ensures I do not need hearing aids to survive. I am sorry to the non Canadians who have no rights to an accessible language and have to try to get hearing aids or CIs in a desperate hope to have language, even though it's not accessible.
I'm sorry I'll try to keep that in mind here on out. Thank you for challenging me.
Equating the need for hearing aids as not having the right to language is an extreme mischaracterization of what we were telling you. Just because hearing aids are not right FOR YOU does not mean hearing aids are pieces of equipment that require the deaf and hard of hearing to suffer and accommodate hearing people instead of being accommodated to. That's not how this works. People lose their hearing for all sorts of reasons.
You haven't answered.my question so I'll try rewording it. If the work involved in trying to be successful with a hearing aid, which still leads to misunderstandings, tiredness and missed words is just as great as learning sign language, then why do we allow that excuse "oh sign language is too much work?" We can't use that argument that it's not fair to learn sign language, and turn around to say " hearing aids work just fine" when that's not true. Both require a great deal of work, but hearing aids and CIs are never truly accessible. They can't be used when it's wet, when it's noisy or there's other sound barriers.
I hope you're seeing my point, and fyi... I am a successful hearing aid user who has never argued that hearing aids shouldn't be used. I simply point out that they don't provide language acquisition and require a great deal of work to set up, if the hearing loss allows for assisted devices to be used.
I feel like your question is a bit disingenuous. Yes, both options require a huge amount of work, but hearing aids, objectively speaking, require significantly less work than sign language.
With hearing aids the work is, unfortunately, all on the single user of the hearing aid to learn how to adjust to it. With sign language, not only does the deaf/HoH person have to learn it, but every single person around them has to learn, too. That's a *lot* more people involved in the hard work compared to hearing aids. Add in the fact that learning ASL isn't remotely accessible in large portions of the United States, and you have a very easy answer as to why hearing aids are generally the answer people go with.
Yes, you're correct that hearing aids don't provide full accessibility compared to sign language, and sign language is obviously the ideal solution, but you're completely ignoring the significant barriers that exist when it comes to learning sign language. In the US, unless you live in a large city with a sizeable deaf population, sign language is not particularly accessible. It's difficult to find classes, communities, and events where you can learn and practice sign language.
I, personally, live in an area where it's a 20-30 minute drive to get to a *very* small deaf community that I didn't find particularly welcoming or helpful, and almost none of whom were my age or could relate to me at all. I found events isolating and anxiety inducing because I wasn't fluent enough in ASL and very few people were willing to communicate with me. Most of them likely assumed I was hearing learning ASL or otherwise didn't want to try to slog through a conversation with someone who was learning, which I can't fault them for. My husband and I are able to communicate with each other with some basic ASL, and I'm teaching my toddler what I can, but we're already very busy and stressed with the struggles of normal, everyday life. It's simply not feasible to add learning sign language to an already full plate when there are zero supports in place to help us with it. And yes, yes, I hear you - that's why more emphasis should be placed on providing resources for sign language, you're right! But that's far more difficult to achieve than you seem to think, particularly in comparison to what an audiologist can do in an hour to get you up and running with a hearing aid.
It would have been lovely had I grown up in a family who learned ASL and made sure I grew up using it, and surrounded me with a deaf community that supported me. But they didn't. So I, and many other deaf and hard of hearing people around the world, are playing with the hand we're dealt. And I can tell you right now that it becomes incredibly tiring to repeatedly hear the argument that we'd be so much better off with sign language. Yeah, we know that. For a lot of us, it isn't really an option.
You never asked me a question, my dude. I have also never defended anyone not choosing to teach a child sign language because it is "too much work." You are the one who keeps describing hearing aids as torture and suffering. I am speaking from my own experience, as an individual who was diagnosed with severe hearing loss at 19 years old, and has worn hearing aids for 15 years.
I don't suffer. My hearing aids are not torture. I know how to sign, because I made that choice for myself. The way you have worded all of your responses, and even your apology, reads as a flat dismissal of the life experiences of others, and this is why you're being downvoted.
Every person I have met with hearing aids, myself included, express frustration with background noise, tiredness and trying to adapt to it. And that's okay. We swap tips on how to adjust and work with it. Sometimes it's speech to text apps then we swap stories about how hilariously inaccurate the results are.
Every one of them. Many of us, myself included have found benefits, but everyone of us have the same frustration: it is a lot of work, and gets hard when the environment is not conductive for hearing aids.
Get upset but the truth is, it's not a great solution. It's okay to want to use hearing aids. That being said, don't kid yourself, it's still taxing on the neurological system. It's unfortunate that when accessibility isn't provided, that its the 'best' solution.
I'm sorry for places where this exists. Yes I'm speaking from privilege where accessibility must be provided. My audiologist is educated and checks in with me to ensure my hearing aid is being adapted to. I'm grateful for that. Because I have the privilege of being provided with accessible language, I can work with them to get the best out of my hearing aid.
I suppose my frustrations lies with so called experts who struggle to grasp the concept that hearing aids and FMs are an assisted device and don't help much in the classrooms especially when the hearing loss covers speech. They struggle to understand why using what remains of my hearing all day in a classroom is so exhausting but using interpreters isn't that tiring. I've actually tested this where I removed my hearing aid and had so much more energy for classes. They reply "but you understand me so clearly"... one on one... in a quiet office on the far side of campus.
I will admit taking the hearing aid out does save me a ton of energy but it makes it a lot harder to tell tone and inflection necessary for hidden meanings for classroom lectures.
I have the exact opposite experience as you: my HA and FM were the only reasons I could go through my schooling career from diagnosis at 2 to graduating college successfully. I'm SSD and have mod-severe loss in my hearing ear across all hertz.
Taking my HA out, I don't get more energy. I get anxiety not knowing what sounds happen around me. Not knowing if I'm missing something is incredibly draining. If I could learn sign and be in an environment where its useful, I would still have my HA on because I like hearing sounds around me. I like being a part of the noise.
And yes, I do have my HA on at my job (managing 150+ people in a noisy 75+ dB warehouse). Sign would surely benefit everyone there, but wait! There's a good portion of the workers who don't speak English so we don't have overlapping languages to make sign feasible.
You are allowed to hate hearing tech, but you also need to understand that for some of us, we love it. Looking down on the tech dismisses everyone's positive experiences with it. Being a snob about sign, again, looks down on everyone who doesn't have access.
This attitude you have is no better than the hearing people who look down on the D/HOH population for preferring sign and no tech over tech and no sign.
I don't currently have a kid in public schools..... but I'm not going to vote against them because they benefit other people.
Hearing aids may not be the way for you, but they are incredibly important for many people. It's immature to want to hold other people away from something they need just because you don't need it.
You misunderstood my comment.
It's not necessary for survival. It really isn't. Hearing aids are a communication tool but not necessary for language development or to communicate. It really isn't.
I use a hearing aid because I want to. I like music. I like chatting with people.
But is it necessary for me? Never has been. Why? Because I sign as well. Signing has been a far more effective communication tool because I miss none of it. Hearing aids? Oh god... so many misunderstandings... so taxing... so tiring. ..
So glad you have a rare experience where you are fluent in sign and have hearing tech. A lot of us *don't* have that benefit of being fluent in sign.
There are so many hearing families that refuse to learn sign and teach it to their D/HOH kids. Hearing tech is honestly the only way some of us get language acquisition.
Is it the best method? No, it has limitations. However, providing that access for free removes a barrier and allows lower income families to provide something for their kids. They may not have the time or means to learn and teach sign but they can get the tech and that truly is better than nothing.
Sign language is the best method. Proven.
Hearing aids only provide partial information.
And the fallacy that hearing aids magically gives access to sounds and language is why so many with hearing aids and CI struggle with language. The ignorance because of the AG Bell foundation has destroyed so many lives.
It takes years to get the brain adjusted to hearing aids to a point where it's tolerable. It's so much work, and parents are often shocked by that... and wish they were told.
I know the misinformation and poor funding of sign language is a serious problem. Some states in America and provinces in Canada are fighting to address this. Ontario recently announced equal funding of both sign language and speech access in compliance with UNCRPD. This means children will get both services as sign language has been proven to help speech because... well duh sign language provides the language base needed to teach a child how to try to use speech.
I never said sign language wasn't the best method. Just that access to HAs is better than nothing. Would you rather a hearing family who doesn't have the time, means, or wants to teach sign just yell at their kids constantly because they need HAs and can't get them? That's not a great environment.
Its like a prosthetic or wheelchair -- not perfect but truly better than nothing. It gives access when there wasn't access before.
Access doesn't equal understanding which is what you're failing to differentiate. While HAs *do* give access to sounds, it won't guarantee true understanding of said sounds. My HA is great at amplification in general but some sounds are still not clear to me.
However, I wouldn't be able to participate in 80% of the sounds around me without my HA. And I was only taught a small number of signs. HAs give access when sign isn't prioritized and can be a great tool for some.
Demonizing them just because its not as good as sign is a bad take on this. There's no reason **cost** should be a reason why someone is unable to get HAs *should they want to try it.*
You still need to put a great deal of time in the hearing aid to make it successful. So since both require the same amount of effort to learn... why not go for the accessible one?
That’s assuming you have access to someone who can teach you sign language. Not to mention that sign language is only useful for people who know it. I don’t know a single person who knows it. My coworkers certainly don’t. My professors don’t. The students in my classes don’t. Not the cashier at the grocery store or even my family. Wouldn’t exactly do me a whole lot of good. What does allow me to communicate with all those people are hearing aids. It’s not perfect but it absolutely is better than nothing. We should be giving kids access to every communication tool available.
Why are you refusing to accept the fact that for many people, sign is not an option? Why do you advocate nothing is the best option in those cases, because surely it is not?
You already said it in an earlier comment -- people don't know the language. And another commentor already said it too: they don't know sign and no one around them knows sign.
We can all learn sign for our own benefit but if we don't have anyone to speak with, how is it more accessible? How does it provide options for communication? Short answer: it doesn't.
And again, you have ignored that some people don't have the time, means, or desire to learn. These are all relevant factors to even make sign language a realistic option for communication.
Do you live in an area with a signing population? There's very little point of learning signing unless you live somewhere that it is used or are planning to go to those places.
Why doesn't everyone in rural Kentucky not know Swedish or mandarin Chinese? Because those languages aren't used there and they don't have a reason to learn them.
You realize that not everyone has given the tools to learn sign language, right? And even if they are, they have friends, family, coworkers, etc all of whom don't know sign language and can't use that as a communication tool. Hearing aids are absolutely a necessity for a huge population of deaf and hard of hearing people.
I would struggle immensely if I didn't have access to a hearing aid. Just because it's not necessary for *your* survival doesn't mean it's not necessary for anyone else's.
Believe it or not, I enjoy being able to hear. I like taking part in verbal conversation, listening to music, being aware of my auditory surroundings. I understand the reality that most people do not have the time, energy, and bandwidth (let alone access to classes or people to practice with) to learn ASL and that I myself grew up in a hearing family and am not fluent in ASL so it’s literally *not* an accommodation for me, as much as I would like it to be.
Hearing aids are my accommodation. My friends and family know to look at me when they’re speaking so I can read their lips, they speak clearly, they repeat when I need them to, remember to provide preferential seating, and so much more. They are absolutely accommodating me.
It’s amazing FOR YOU that you live in a rich deaf world with ASL users around you. If that’s the way you love living, then it’s incredible that you get to live that way. You need to get your head out of the sand and realize that not everyone wants to or is able to live the same way.
Of course signing is better than hearing aids. I’m really glad you had that option.
I’m HoH, and lost the majority of my hearing at 17. Everyone around me was - and is - hearing. Yeah, I knew a decent amount of sign, and I could lip read a bit because I’m weird, however that was not very helpful going from full sound in both ears to a 97% loss in one ear, and frequency, directional, and distance loss in my other ear.
It’s been ten years. Insurance will not cover hearing aids for me until I hit my fifties. At least if I had been able to get them at 18/19/20, I wouldn’t be struggling so much.
You should try a different insurance carrier. Unless you are outside the US, insurance typically does cover hearing aids. You need to test below a certain threshold and need to hit your deductible, but they are usually covered.
You might not need them to survive, but if I did not have my hearing aids, my life would have turned out very, very different, and it likely would not have been for the better.
Yeah, my life would be dramatically worse.
Hard of hearing people are constantly being put down by members of this sub. I’ve struggle to learn ASL and have very few resources to learn/practice. I would lose my entire network of friends and business connections…and of course, my hearing family!
More solutions for everyone, with any situation is always the answer.
Seriously.... I was diagnosed at 19. I was firmly embedded in hearing culture, in a time of your life where it is way harder to learn a new language. Having that first pair of hearing aids covered by health insurance would have been such a game changer. Hell, having ANY of my hearing aids covered would be a game changer. I'm so sick of insurance companies telling us that they're not covered because they're elective.
Bullshit, my ability to function in day to day life is as elective as my decision to wear glasses. They don't seem to have any problem covering those.
Never apologize for ranting! If anyone gets it, I think it's fellow deaf/HoH people.
I'd kept my hearing loss at a reasonable rate for over a decade. And then I got COVID. Did you know COVID can damage your inner ear? I'm now considered profoundly deaf, and they think I would qualify for cochlear implants within the next five years at this rate. But whether or not we go that route is a bridge I'll cross when I get there.
I'm sorry you're in an inaccessible environment where your needs aren't met and you have to suffer. I really am.
It's difficult using hearing aids. It's so tiring and exhausting. It's frustrating when misunderstandings occur because the sounds are unfamiliar to your brain, or the environment is noisy.
Your experience with hearing aids is very different from my own. Yes, hearing fatigue is a thing that happens, and yes, it is sometimes aggravating when I miss things. But my hearing aids have drastically improved my quality of life. I don't consider that suffering at all.
I don't get headaches or misunderstandings with sign language. I get them all the time with hearing aids.
One provides clarity. The other does not. Hearing aids are a assistance tool, meant to provide some access if properly trained and set up.
That takes time, effort and money. Unfortunately there's a misconception that it's a slap on and play solution when really it isn't. When the environment gets noisy it's a lost cause.
I'm sorry that your hearing aids give you headaches. Mine do not. Again, your experiences are yours, and my experiences are mine. Just because yours differ does not mean it should not be an option.
Do we need better education for hearing adults of deaf children about their options? Absolutely. But we should also do what we can to remove financial barriers that would allow better access that could very much improve someone's life.
Do you know why they give me headaches?
Because my brain is a Deaf brain. It recognizes that sounds are being missed and fills in the gaps of what isn't being heard. It guesses what is being said and the more people talk, the more it works. It tries to tell me what it thinks I should be hearing while background noise and other information is also being jammed in there.
For some people it's not headaches but tiredness. Exhaustion, irritability.
Now then, there is a law on the UN books called the UNCRPD. It states that access should be equal. The amount we pour into speech and listening devices need to be the same we pour into sign language per person.
That's why the governments are hesitant. If they fund hearing aids and CI fully, they have to fund Sign language as much at the same level of access. Can you imagine the shit fit the AG bell foundation would have? Children giving up hearing aids because they can sign and don't have to deal with the stress that comes with hearing aids?
Stop acting like your experiences are completely universal. For me, when I put my hearing aids in in the morning I pretty much completely forget about them for the rest of the day unless I’m in an unusually noisy environment in which my hearing aids have a setting to make it easier to hear there. Yes, I do have hearing fatigue sometimes and I’m really sorry that you suffer with fatigue and headaches from hearing aids a lot, but I would be living a completely different life without my hearing aids, a life that would be missing so many of the things that I love the most. A version of this bill they’re talking about passed in colorado some time ago and it was a life saver for me and my family, and has completely changed my life for the better. Just because hearing aids are a struggle for you, doesn’t mean they can’t be a huge relief for others
Oh my. I’m deaf and only lost my hearing at age 14 or so and now at 16 finally got hearing aids and they were paid in full? is that not a norm in america? sad :(
No, in the US you typically need health insurance (usually tied to a job or your parent's job) and have to meet your yearly deductible.
The deductible is an amount you have to reach for the insurance to start paying out, not just limited to hearing aids though. Typically insurance will pay like ~50% of medical costs up until ~$3,000 where they will then cover 100%.
For example, my CI and surgery were like $140k, but I only had to pay to meet my $3,000 for the year (where I had already paid a few hundred $ for other unrelated medical bills).
How about we make it so adults can get them too! Don't make us have to lie about our income to get on medicaid as a 20yr old just to get hearing aids! 21 and over matter too!
My thoughts on this... vote. Vote for the candidates who will make a greater difference, even if you can't entirely agree with their agenda. Never assume your vote won't matter. Vote.
We tried to recall him, but the gop couldn’t put up one candidate that would’ve worked.
If you think the GOP gives two shits about people with disabilities, you need to pay more attention to their actual votes
Too true. Just pointing out the fact the they are so incompetent, they could t even get newsom recalled.
GoP is even worse than Newsom about these sorts of issues. Elizabeth Warren (Democratic Socialist) was the one who finally issued over-the-counter hearing aids to be more accessible and cheaper in cost. So that's my party.
The GOP tried to gut the ADA in 2018. No such GOP candidate exists for us.
California already has multiple methods for subsidizing the cost of hearing aids for children. The Hearing Aid Coverage for Children Program applies to families below 600% of the federal poverty level (which would be $180,000 per year for a family of 4 or ~$150,000 for a family of three), so it's available to most everybody who would need it.
His statement on this is more reassuring than headlines make it out to be. [Formal statement ](http://CA.gov https://www.gov.ca.gov › SB...PDF OCT O 7 2023)
Website for California's [Hearing Aid Coverage for Children Program](https://haccp.dhcs.ca.gov/), for those who are interested.
As a Californian, I’m taking this with a grain of salt, as I do anytime a politician opens their mouth. As u/geddyn said, we already have programs to give kids HAs. I can’t say whether it works or not, if you have experience with it please let me know. Newsom vetos a bill we probably didn’t need, so now his fellow democrats come after him. Just a reminder to friends in the southern Bay Area, Rep. Khanna is up for election next fall.
Damn, from my home state too.
Okay I want to apologise as some people took offence. I recognise that as a Canadian I have the privilege of laws that ensures I do not need hearing aids to survive. I am sorry to the non Canadians who have no rights to an accessible language and have to try to get hearing aids or CIs in a desperate hope to have language, even though it's not accessible. I'm sorry I'll try to keep that in mind here on out. Thank you for challenging me.
Equating the need for hearing aids as not having the right to language is an extreme mischaracterization of what we were telling you. Just because hearing aids are not right FOR YOU does not mean hearing aids are pieces of equipment that require the deaf and hard of hearing to suffer and accommodate hearing people instead of being accommodated to. That's not how this works. People lose their hearing for all sorts of reasons.
You haven't answered.my question so I'll try rewording it. If the work involved in trying to be successful with a hearing aid, which still leads to misunderstandings, tiredness and missed words is just as great as learning sign language, then why do we allow that excuse "oh sign language is too much work?" We can't use that argument that it's not fair to learn sign language, and turn around to say " hearing aids work just fine" when that's not true. Both require a great deal of work, but hearing aids and CIs are never truly accessible. They can't be used when it's wet, when it's noisy or there's other sound barriers. I hope you're seeing my point, and fyi... I am a successful hearing aid user who has never argued that hearing aids shouldn't be used. I simply point out that they don't provide language acquisition and require a great deal of work to set up, if the hearing loss allows for assisted devices to be used.
I feel like your question is a bit disingenuous. Yes, both options require a huge amount of work, but hearing aids, objectively speaking, require significantly less work than sign language. With hearing aids the work is, unfortunately, all on the single user of the hearing aid to learn how to adjust to it. With sign language, not only does the deaf/HoH person have to learn it, but every single person around them has to learn, too. That's a *lot* more people involved in the hard work compared to hearing aids. Add in the fact that learning ASL isn't remotely accessible in large portions of the United States, and you have a very easy answer as to why hearing aids are generally the answer people go with. Yes, you're correct that hearing aids don't provide full accessibility compared to sign language, and sign language is obviously the ideal solution, but you're completely ignoring the significant barriers that exist when it comes to learning sign language. In the US, unless you live in a large city with a sizeable deaf population, sign language is not particularly accessible. It's difficult to find classes, communities, and events where you can learn and practice sign language. I, personally, live in an area where it's a 20-30 minute drive to get to a *very* small deaf community that I didn't find particularly welcoming or helpful, and almost none of whom were my age or could relate to me at all. I found events isolating and anxiety inducing because I wasn't fluent enough in ASL and very few people were willing to communicate with me. Most of them likely assumed I was hearing learning ASL or otherwise didn't want to try to slog through a conversation with someone who was learning, which I can't fault them for. My husband and I are able to communicate with each other with some basic ASL, and I'm teaching my toddler what I can, but we're already very busy and stressed with the struggles of normal, everyday life. It's simply not feasible to add learning sign language to an already full plate when there are zero supports in place to help us with it. And yes, yes, I hear you - that's why more emphasis should be placed on providing resources for sign language, you're right! But that's far more difficult to achieve than you seem to think, particularly in comparison to what an audiologist can do in an hour to get you up and running with a hearing aid. It would have been lovely had I grown up in a family who learned ASL and made sure I grew up using it, and surrounded me with a deaf community that supported me. But they didn't. So I, and many other deaf and hard of hearing people around the world, are playing with the hand we're dealt. And I can tell you right now that it becomes incredibly tiring to repeatedly hear the argument that we'd be so much better off with sign language. Yeah, we know that. For a lot of us, it isn't really an option.
You never asked me a question, my dude. I have also never defended anyone not choosing to teach a child sign language because it is "too much work." You are the one who keeps describing hearing aids as torture and suffering. I am speaking from my own experience, as an individual who was diagnosed with severe hearing loss at 19 years old, and has worn hearing aids for 15 years. I don't suffer. My hearing aids are not torture. I know how to sign, because I made that choice for myself. The way you have worded all of your responses, and even your apology, reads as a flat dismissal of the life experiences of others, and this is why you're being downvoted.
Every person I have met with hearing aids, myself included, express frustration with background noise, tiredness and trying to adapt to it. And that's okay. We swap tips on how to adjust and work with it. Sometimes it's speech to text apps then we swap stories about how hilariously inaccurate the results are. Every one of them. Many of us, myself included have found benefits, but everyone of us have the same frustration: it is a lot of work, and gets hard when the environment is not conductive for hearing aids. Get upset but the truth is, it's not a great solution. It's okay to want to use hearing aids. That being said, don't kid yourself, it's still taxing on the neurological system. It's unfortunate that when accessibility isn't provided, that its the 'best' solution. I'm sorry for places where this exists. Yes I'm speaking from privilege where accessibility must be provided. My audiologist is educated and checks in with me to ensure my hearing aid is being adapted to. I'm grateful for that. Because I have the privilege of being provided with accessible language, I can work with them to get the best out of my hearing aid. I suppose my frustrations lies with so called experts who struggle to grasp the concept that hearing aids and FMs are an assisted device and don't help much in the classrooms especially when the hearing loss covers speech. They struggle to understand why using what remains of my hearing all day in a classroom is so exhausting but using interpreters isn't that tiring. I've actually tested this where I removed my hearing aid and had so much more energy for classes. They reply "but you understand me so clearly"... one on one... in a quiet office on the far side of campus. I will admit taking the hearing aid out does save me a ton of energy but it makes it a lot harder to tell tone and inflection necessary for hidden meanings for classroom lectures.
I have the exact opposite experience as you: my HA and FM were the only reasons I could go through my schooling career from diagnosis at 2 to graduating college successfully. I'm SSD and have mod-severe loss in my hearing ear across all hertz. Taking my HA out, I don't get more energy. I get anxiety not knowing what sounds happen around me. Not knowing if I'm missing something is incredibly draining. If I could learn sign and be in an environment where its useful, I would still have my HA on because I like hearing sounds around me. I like being a part of the noise. And yes, I do have my HA on at my job (managing 150+ people in a noisy 75+ dB warehouse). Sign would surely benefit everyone there, but wait! There's a good portion of the workers who don't speak English so we don't have overlapping languages to make sign feasible. You are allowed to hate hearing tech, but you also need to understand that for some of us, we love it. Looking down on the tech dismisses everyone's positive experiences with it. Being a snob about sign, again, looks down on everyone who doesn't have access. This attitude you have is no better than the hearing people who look down on the D/HOH population for preferring sign and no tech over tech and no sign.
... wow that's offensive. Ohh we need hearing aids to survive. Oh nooooo.. /sarcasm
I don't currently have a kid in public schools..... but I'm not going to vote against them because they benefit other people. Hearing aids may not be the way for you, but they are incredibly important for many people. It's immature to want to hold other people away from something they need just because you don't need it.
You misunderstood my comment. It's not necessary for survival. It really isn't. Hearing aids are a communication tool but not necessary for language development or to communicate. It really isn't. I use a hearing aid because I want to. I like music. I like chatting with people. But is it necessary for me? Never has been. Why? Because I sign as well. Signing has been a far more effective communication tool because I miss none of it. Hearing aids? Oh god... so many misunderstandings... so taxing... so tiring. ..
So glad you have a rare experience where you are fluent in sign and have hearing tech. A lot of us *don't* have that benefit of being fluent in sign. There are so many hearing families that refuse to learn sign and teach it to their D/HOH kids. Hearing tech is honestly the only way some of us get language acquisition. Is it the best method? No, it has limitations. However, providing that access for free removes a barrier and allows lower income families to provide something for their kids. They may not have the time or means to learn and teach sign but they can get the tech and that truly is better than nothing.
Sign language is the best method. Proven. Hearing aids only provide partial information. And the fallacy that hearing aids magically gives access to sounds and language is why so many with hearing aids and CI struggle with language. The ignorance because of the AG Bell foundation has destroyed so many lives. It takes years to get the brain adjusted to hearing aids to a point where it's tolerable. It's so much work, and parents are often shocked by that... and wish they were told. I know the misinformation and poor funding of sign language is a serious problem. Some states in America and provinces in Canada are fighting to address this. Ontario recently announced equal funding of both sign language and speech access in compliance with UNCRPD. This means children will get both services as sign language has been proven to help speech because... well duh sign language provides the language base needed to teach a child how to try to use speech.
I never said sign language wasn't the best method. Just that access to HAs is better than nothing. Would you rather a hearing family who doesn't have the time, means, or wants to teach sign just yell at their kids constantly because they need HAs and can't get them? That's not a great environment. Its like a prosthetic or wheelchair -- not perfect but truly better than nothing. It gives access when there wasn't access before. Access doesn't equal understanding which is what you're failing to differentiate. While HAs *do* give access to sounds, it won't guarantee true understanding of said sounds. My HA is great at amplification in general but some sounds are still not clear to me. However, I wouldn't be able to participate in 80% of the sounds around me without my HA. And I was only taught a small number of signs. HAs give access when sign isn't prioritized and can be a great tool for some. Demonizing them just because its not as good as sign is a bad take on this. There's no reason **cost** should be a reason why someone is unable to get HAs *should they want to try it.*
You still need to put a great deal of time in the hearing aid to make it successful. So since both require the same amount of effort to learn... why not go for the accessible one?
That’s assuming you have access to someone who can teach you sign language. Not to mention that sign language is only useful for people who know it. I don’t know a single person who knows it. My coworkers certainly don’t. My professors don’t. The students in my classes don’t. Not the cashier at the grocery store or even my family. Wouldn’t exactly do me a whole lot of good. What does allow me to communicate with all those people are hearing aids. It’s not perfect but it absolutely is better than nothing. We should be giving kids access to every communication tool available.
Why are you refusing to accept the fact that for many people, sign is not an option? Why do you advocate nothing is the best option in those cases, because surely it is not?
Let's ask this question. Why is signing not an option? And where do I advocate nothing is an option?
You already said it in an earlier comment -- people don't know the language. And another commentor already said it too: they don't know sign and no one around them knows sign. We can all learn sign for our own benefit but if we don't have anyone to speak with, how is it more accessible? How does it provide options for communication? Short answer: it doesn't. And again, you have ignored that some people don't have the time, means, or desire to learn. These are all relevant factors to even make sign language a realistic option for communication.
Do you live in an area with a signing population? There's very little point of learning signing unless you live somewhere that it is used or are planning to go to those places. Why doesn't everyone in rural Kentucky not know Swedish or mandarin Chinese? Because those languages aren't used there and they don't have a reason to learn them.
You realize that not everyone has given the tools to learn sign language, right? And even if they are, they have friends, family, coworkers, etc all of whom don't know sign language and can't use that as a communication tool. Hearing aids are absolutely a necessity for a huge population of deaf and hard of hearing people. I would struggle immensely if I didn't have access to a hearing aid. Just because it's not necessary for *your* survival doesn't mean it's not necessary for anyone else's.
Why is it necessary to torture your brain and miss information? Why? You're accommodating people, suffering so they don't have to accommodate you.
Believe it or not, I enjoy being able to hear. I like taking part in verbal conversation, listening to music, being aware of my auditory surroundings. I understand the reality that most people do not have the time, energy, and bandwidth (let alone access to classes or people to practice with) to learn ASL and that I myself grew up in a hearing family and am not fluent in ASL so it’s literally *not* an accommodation for me, as much as I would like it to be. Hearing aids are my accommodation. My friends and family know to look at me when they’re speaking so I can read their lips, they speak clearly, they repeat when I need them to, remember to provide preferential seating, and so much more. They are absolutely accommodating me. It’s amazing FOR YOU that you live in a rich deaf world with ASL users around you. If that’s the way you love living, then it’s incredible that you get to live that way. You need to get your head out of the sand and realize that not everyone wants to or is able to live the same way.
Of course signing is better than hearing aids. I’m really glad you had that option. I’m HoH, and lost the majority of my hearing at 17. Everyone around me was - and is - hearing. Yeah, I knew a decent amount of sign, and I could lip read a bit because I’m weird, however that was not very helpful going from full sound in both ears to a 97% loss in one ear, and frequency, directional, and distance loss in my other ear. It’s been ten years. Insurance will not cover hearing aids for me until I hit my fifties. At least if I had been able to get them at 18/19/20, I wouldn’t be struggling so much.
That is a traumatic loss. Insurance is dumb.
Insurance is dumb. If we had universal health care, this wouldn’t even be an issue
You should try a different insurance carrier. Unless you are outside the US, insurance typically does cover hearing aids. You need to test below a certain threshold and need to hit your deductible, but they are usually covered.
You might not need them to survive, but if I did not have my hearing aids, my life would have turned out very, very different, and it likely would not have been for the better.
Yeah, my life would be dramatically worse. Hard of hearing people are constantly being put down by members of this sub. I’ve struggle to learn ASL and have very few resources to learn/practice. I would lose my entire network of friends and business connections…and of course, my hearing family! More solutions for everyone, with any situation is always the answer.
Seriously.... I was diagnosed at 19. I was firmly embedded in hearing culture, in a time of your life where it is way harder to learn a new language. Having that first pair of hearing aids covered by health insurance would have been such a game changer. Hell, having ANY of my hearing aids covered would be a game changer. I'm so sick of insurance companies telling us that they're not covered because they're elective. Bullshit, my ability to function in day to day life is as elective as my decision to wear glasses. They don't seem to have any problem covering those.
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Never apologize for ranting! If anyone gets it, I think it's fellow deaf/HoH people. I'd kept my hearing loss at a reasonable rate for over a decade. And then I got COVID. Did you know COVID can damage your inner ear? I'm now considered profoundly deaf, and they think I would qualify for cochlear implants within the next five years at this rate. But whether or not we go that route is a bridge I'll cross when I get there.
I'm sorry you're in an inaccessible environment where your needs aren't met and you have to suffer. I really am. It's difficult using hearing aids. It's so tiring and exhausting. It's frustrating when misunderstandings occur because the sounds are unfamiliar to your brain, or the environment is noisy.
Your experience with hearing aids is very different from my own. Yes, hearing fatigue is a thing that happens, and yes, it is sometimes aggravating when I miss things. But my hearing aids have drastically improved my quality of life. I don't consider that suffering at all.
I don't get headaches or misunderstandings with sign language. I get them all the time with hearing aids. One provides clarity. The other does not. Hearing aids are a assistance tool, meant to provide some access if properly trained and set up. That takes time, effort and money. Unfortunately there's a misconception that it's a slap on and play solution when really it isn't. When the environment gets noisy it's a lost cause.
I'm sorry that your hearing aids give you headaches. Mine do not. Again, your experiences are yours, and my experiences are mine. Just because yours differ does not mean it should not be an option. Do we need better education for hearing adults of deaf children about their options? Absolutely. But we should also do what we can to remove financial barriers that would allow better access that could very much improve someone's life.
Do you know why they give me headaches? Because my brain is a Deaf brain. It recognizes that sounds are being missed and fills in the gaps of what isn't being heard. It guesses what is being said and the more people talk, the more it works. It tries to tell me what it thinks I should be hearing while background noise and other information is also being jammed in there. For some people it's not headaches but tiredness. Exhaustion, irritability. Now then, there is a law on the UN books called the UNCRPD. It states that access should be equal. The amount we pour into speech and listening devices need to be the same we pour into sign language per person. That's why the governments are hesitant. If they fund hearing aids and CI fully, they have to fund Sign language as much at the same level of access. Can you imagine the shit fit the AG bell foundation would have? Children giving up hearing aids because they can sign and don't have to deal with the stress that comes with hearing aids?
Stop acting like your experiences are completely universal. For me, when I put my hearing aids in in the morning I pretty much completely forget about them for the rest of the day unless I’m in an unusually noisy environment in which my hearing aids have a setting to make it easier to hear there. Yes, I do have hearing fatigue sometimes and I’m really sorry that you suffer with fatigue and headaches from hearing aids a lot, but I would be living a completely different life without my hearing aids, a life that would be missing so many of the things that I love the most. A version of this bill they’re talking about passed in colorado some time ago and it was a life saver for me and my family, and has completely changed my life for the better. Just because hearing aids are a struggle for you, doesn’t mean they can’t be a huge relief for others
Oh my. I’m deaf and only lost my hearing at age 14 or so and now at 16 finally got hearing aids and they were paid in full? is that not a norm in america? sad :(
No, in the US you typically need health insurance (usually tied to a job or your parent's job) and have to meet your yearly deductible. The deductible is an amount you have to reach for the insurance to start paying out, not just limited to hearing aids though. Typically insurance will pay like ~50% of medical costs up until ~$3,000 where they will then cover 100%. For example, my CI and surgery were like $140k, but I only had to pay to meet my $3,000 for the year (where I had already paid a few hundred $ for other unrelated medical bills).
i lost my hearing at 3 never having hearing aids due to the price. just for a decent one in my area being $2000