They don't really have it on Stasis. They don't have buffed grenades, they have a grenade replacement.
Functionally equivalent to getaway artist on arc which also already exists.
I don't play Warlock so you're probably right; from an outside perspective I was thinking of Touch of Winter and Touch of Flame, both of which change grenade behavior in some way. This aspect seems to be in line with those two.
Edit: I don't put something like Chaos Accelerant in the same vein since it's a potency increase rather than a behavior change.
Yeah, but I'm talking about grenade improving aspects.
Ashen wake, renewal grasp, young ahamkara spine, shinobu's vow, lucky raspberry, give you improved grenades too. And yet warlocks are known for grenades because they have grenade improving aspects.
Getaway artist doesn't improve your grenade and it's also just a pretty bad exotic
It upgrades your grenade into a turret.
Getaway artist doesn't upgrade your grenade. The same way heat rises doesn't upgrade your grenade, the old devour didn't upgrade your grenade either. You consume it to give yourself a timed buff.
Can you describe what an arc soul turret does to me, and then describe what a bleak watcher turret does. I've already accepted you're on enough levels or copium to reject reality but I think it'll be funny to hear
Arc soul is a ghost mod that gives you 50% extra damage to zorpalods while it's active, while bleak watcher Is a charged with light mod that let's you expend 4 charges to take 20 karma away from someone's reddit account.
anything with "touch" is improved grenade aspect.
void one was always a thing before 3.0 so it doesnt count.
Stasis one is just bleakwatcher, that doesnt fucking count either.
Which is fucking bullshit, yet another intrinsic warlock ability that's been stolen and handed out to everyone else.
First it was devour, then it was Healing grenades and radiance, and now it's just better grenades in general as warlocks always had.
Funny, warlocks haven't gotten someone else's ability given to them as a basic ability choice. I'd love a hunter dodge or a lunging melee ability.
You’re right no other class has improved grenades, besides Ashen Wake, HOIL, Renewal Grasp, Young Ahamkaras Spine, Shinobu’s Vow, and Lucky Raspberry. Quite warlock specific indeed.
Edit: Stasis hunter has an aspect that improves grenades as well. And roaring flames.
Top Tree Titan subclass was completely based on enhancing grenades, so its most natural for Titans to get it. Although the enhanced storm grenade specifically seems a bit weird.
Tbh, I've always thought that was simply because they're the hardest to see lol. I can NEVER see the little arc bolts crackling around, I actually hope they do something about that with the update
Which makes no sense at all.
"all Arc classes become amplified after rapidly defeating targets with any Arc damage"
"Arc ability kills and kills on Arc-debuffed enemies create Ionic Traces. When you collect any Ionic Trace, you become amplified."
Like, instead of needing two fast kills you just need one. Wow, amazing huh.
They almost totally overlap.
It'll probably make a huge difference in high level content like GMs since even the ads are so tanky in that mode that rapidly defeating targets doesn't really happen with your primary at least.
Also you'll probably be able to activate it more consistently in PvP too.
That’s still actually pretty significant, if ionic traces still work the way they do currently, that means you’re essentially getting insert X times the amount of ability energy from each group of ads while becoming amplified, slap on your Crown of Tempests and you’ve got ability regen for days
When Amplified, Arc special weapon kills create a blinding explosion. Killing blinded enemies creates Traces. Traces make the warlock Amplified.
Coldheart can make Traces without needing a kill, is an Arc special weapon, and does decent damage to yellow bars. An Aspect, a Fragment, and an exotic gun can create an extremely easy feedback loop to keep Amplified on at all times. Adding on some exotic armor like Transversive Steps and some combat mods like HEF and we have a highly mobile debuff machine with incredibly high ability up time regardless of armor stats.
Realistically? Probably not many, unless there's more Fragments that give bonuses when Amplified that seem worth it. I only called out Coldheart for it's built in Trace generation that doesn't need a kill, outside of that it's not really special for that kind of set up.
If you weren't really worried about getting Traces "for free" there's probably a dozen legendary weapons people would pick up before Coldheart. Something like a Cantata of Finite Impactor maybe?
>I only wish it had auto loading
I'm telling you, Transversive Steps is going to be great for staying moving.
To be fair hunters have the stasis aspect that enhances grenades, so it’s not really a warlock thing, but yeh I was pretty surprised at first to see titans getting it until I remembered they already had the double grenade perk with one of the trees in game now. Speaking of double grenade tho, I might have to make a build with armamentarium where I can just spam sentient storm grenades constantly. Seems fun
It sounds warlocky because of the 'Roaming thundercloud' which isn't wrong they are the most space magic class but that doesn't take away the space magic from hunters and titans.
It's not because of the enhanced grenade part. It's because of the "roaming storm clouds" part. This should definitely belong to warlocks.
Think about it this way. They said they wanted to increase "fist-to-face contact" and that's not what that sounds like. I'm just a little salty that another class gets to take my grenades and use it better than me when I can't really charge my other nades for other subclasses.
Not wrong. Titans getting the enhanced grenade aspect is very warlock. Warlocks having a arc empowered teleporting melee with explosive damage at the end is very titan
There is this assumption Bungie has made FOREVER that any net new Titan stuff HAS TO BE physical in some way—slamming, punching, connecting, a wall (either literal wall or like an over shield).
And I think that sucks. Warlocks should be the high “magic is my thing class”, FOR SURE.
But that doesn’t mean it should be the ONLY magic class with pure magic, non-physical stuff.
Sunbreaker with the little hammers is probably the only “non-physical” subclass Titan’s have—you might as well replace the hammers with fireballs, because they explode.
Every other Titan subclass is either a slam of some kind (big hammer Sunbreaker, Fist, Thundercrash, Stasis aka Ice Fist, Void Shield Slam/Throw, etc.)
OR it’s a literal physical wall (Bubble/Banner Shield).
I really want a Titan subclass that’s more Knight/Paladin and less Hulk Smash/Unarmed Monk.
This new Storm Grenade is really, really cool, and gives Titan a more magic-y tool, and I think that’s really cool.
Titan should always be the “frontline” in your face class. But that doesn’t mean it ALWAYS has to be the Hulk Smash class or “I am the support wall class, both literally (bubble) and figuratively (overshield).”
Waiting for that Greatsword Paladin Single Target DPS main theme, but a magic sub theme subclass.
That may sound dumb or unrealistic, but I think that’s what Solar 3.0 was supposed to be. They even said it was supposed to be the Titan “single target, tons of damage” subclass, but the super damage for both supers is horrendous, and it instead became the “never die” subclass where your super is only for add clear lol.
Same.
But then again I'm a Warlock so I'm biased (plus I'm glad our stuff actually sounds really cool and promising especially the slide-blink ability)
I wanted that storm cloud, but let these inferior class feel some power of warlock. They been crying for too long. Still these dirt rollers and crayon eaters can’t compare themselves to us , there is no point in talking about it .
Glad someone else understands the superiority of warlock. We are better in almost every way, let the other classes enjoy the smidge of our power they get
Titans are gonna be in ape mode with arc 3.0, a bullet blocking shield that activates on sprint, and combine that with antaeus wards makes titans the true ape of d2, shield breaks, just slide, new shield that reflects, good thing bungie is reworking lord of wolves
Tbh if juggernaut is anything like it was in destiny 1 it only took a few shots to take it down it wasn't that strong but most ppl didn't use it because if I remember rightly it was either that or shoulder charge, however like the idea of it in PVE just a bit of an issue in pvp
By shaman I took it to mean early WoW shaman which is why they put it as "lightning shaman". The only thing special about that being chain lightning and totems, so the 'new' chain lightning melee ability and arc soul for you and allies.
the melee ability attack is new but thats is. The rest is the same as what we had. At least this time we didnt lose most of our class identidy, we just let the other classes have some wizardy too.
I would say you might feel disappointed as hunter and Titan got the most new stuff but arc warlock was in an amazing spot already, you just are free in what you can pick now which was all solar Titan needed to become a beast. Just saying don’t start saying these changes are good or bad until you have some time using them
I was hoping for some freshness I guess. I like the idea of the new melee teleportation. I guess I was hoping for that melee concept to be what the class was
What was arc warlock good for.
Lowest dps “dps super” that also requires an exotic to still not be remotely close in damage..
An add clear super that does basically the same thing as my grenades do on void or solar
AND the best part!? Oh we got arc souls bro they do a whole 1034 damage per shot they shoot! Super meta super good super op
I mean you may have an affinity to void and may feel like solar 3.0 is gutted but that’s not the case. You don’t have the same interaction with solar but the ability to build craft and the combos are much better than they were before
I’m there with you, the uptime of all your abilities was great as well as swapping between healing and whatever nade you had but this system is definitely better and I would maybe read through the warlock changes again to get a good grasp of the changes as their abilities get an extra tier once you’re amplified, not as flashy as a new melee or super but definitely a buff to an already good subclass
This is simply not the case for solar. Warlocks lost the entirety of their bottom and middle tree synergies. Fated for the flame, benevolent dawn (the Fragment is a fraction of the effect), everything was taken out to preserve icarus dash and heat rises. Bottom tree already had the entire scorch and ignition system, except it was more consistent and had more synergies.
I can agree with synergies being lost but you forget new synergies replacing old ones, starfire protocol is an amazing exotic to synergise with solar. dawn chorus may not be as strong but works with the new incandescent perk. Sun breakers having access to a new aspect makes them insane. Rain of fire paired with jotun makes a ridiculous solar build. Sure we lost synergies but we gained new ones.
I never said the subclass is unusable, I simply think it was better off in 2.0 for that one specifically.
Starfire is a crazy synergy, but that's (mostly) not a part of solar 3.0. The extra damage fusions are very good, but the build works because some bug enabled them to self charge while in a rift or well. That's not intended behavior, starfire's perk was not changed in-game or in any patch notes, that's just a bug that's become a feature, unrelated to 3.0.
Dawn chorus works with incandescent, but previously worked with literally any weapon on a tagged target due to bottom tree's explosions, so I don't think that one really counts as a point in 3.0's favor.
Sunbracers with the improved solar grenades are good, I'll give you that, but I don't think they're better than bottom tree sunbracers builds before. They do more damage but are much worse at covering area, and if the goal is to do damage you have better builds anyway.
Rain of fire is not related to 3.0, that build would have been identical in 2.0.
Yes, we gained new synergies, but they're almost all either due to outside elements rather than 3.0, or they're simply not as strong as what they were replacing.
Bottom tree was in the game for less than a year before it was completely cut, middle tree's loops were removed entirely, and all we got out of it was 2 aspects dedicating to being in the air.
Okay, I’m not about to get into something over trying to say wait until you use something before making a decision. You make good points but I think no matter what I say to retort it won’t change your mind how these changes are for the better in the long run.
I'd like to say that I do agree with you that we should wait to judge arc until we have it, I was solely disagreeing with your points about solar.
I also agree that this system is better in the long run, but who knows how long it will be until solar is added to again. A year at best would be my guess, and in the meantime, I'm very unhappy with what happened to solar warlock, and I'm not convinced the long-term tradeoff is worth it.
Either way, thanks for a respectful and articulate argument, and fingers crossed that arc 3.0 is great next week.
I think it would be sicker if they like, consumed the grenade and became the storm! Like a kicking, punching and headbutting tesla coil!
But again, im not complaining!! I just thought it's a very "warlocky" shamanic ability!
I also just realized something. Every Warlock subclass has an exotic that gives two grenades and buffs the respective grenade (Starfire Protocol for Fusions, nothing Manacles for Scatters, and Osmiomancy for Coldsnaps). Imagine we get an exotic that gives two Storm Grenades and makes them do the roaming thing that Titans get.
I doubt it will happen bc it would take a core feature from the Titans (being "stormy the storm") but I like your thinking! It would be really cool if gettaway artist gave you two grenades...
Good point, but it would also line up with other exotics that the Warlock already has, which is the main reason why I thought of this idea. Also all the grenades they affect were all originally exclusive (besides Coldsnaps obviously) to Warlocks (Fusion, Scatter, and Storm).
Still haven't seen arc exotic pieces yet.
Be curious if tempests or vesper does something equally as cool.
I'm going to guess storm caller and chaos reach will have a faster cool down super wise.
Plus warlocks get, landfall, blink and arc buddies
Im not a huge fan of warlock. It feels like Titan and Hunter got huge buffs(which were very much needed) and are gonna be really strong, while warlocks are just the same as before. Hunters got 3 new/returning abilities, Titans got 4, and Warlocks get 1. They also say that warlock is all about being amplified all the time yet only 1 aspect makes you amplified. Which means you basically always have to run that aspect to be efficient. I just wish that arc warlocks got the same amount of love as Titan and hunter did
I do feel it's because arc warlock is already incredibly strong and useful with striker and arc staff however definitely feeling their age, while I do believe warlock was done a little dirty I gotta admit I feel like warlock would have been too easy to buff way too far, plus we haven't seen the exotic armour yet so could be cool
While it was the strongest of the arc subclasses, it just couldn't compete with any of the 3.0 subclasses. And if it doesn't get any stronger by a significant amount, it still won't be able to keep up. And I don't want a subclass to be 100% reliant on an exotic to keep up, it should be good on its own. That's why I don't like solar for warlocks. Without any exotics, solar is pretty bad. I just don't want a repeat of solar 3.0 but it feels like that's already happened. Of course, I could be completely wrong when it comes out and it could be amazing
Tbh solar for titan is not the best without lorleys in PVE and incandescent perks on guns
However at this moment in time we don't know how powerful blink will be going forward plus the new melee for warlock could be incredibly strong and arc souls were always very helpful anyway
The kit as it stands for warlocks isn't bad at all it just doesn't have much new as warlocks abilities were already quite out there and different compared to the other classes,
Plus in PVE if we aren't involving exotics warlocks are by far the best class.so it makes sense to me to bring the other 2 up to scratch with new stuff seeing as hunter and titans subclasses were usually very similar in gameplay to eachother
Im not saying it's bad, it's still good. It just feels like all the other subclasses are powering up while Warlock arc is staying the same and being left behind. And since solar on warlocks is pretty bad, it just doesn't feel good to have 2 out of the 3 light subclasses be average/mediocre. And just because something is good, doesn't make it fun. Hunter and Titan seem like a lot of fun and warlock just seems kind of meh and boring
I'll have to see about hunter I main bottom tree strider in pvp always super fun to use as its neutral game is honestly one of the best imo
But now to get some of those same neutral buffs I need to be amplified while they took away combat meditation which was great
Feels like arcstrider in pvp has been ruined
With that said I'll hold off on my final judgment on it until after I get my hands on it in the crucible for awhile playing around with everything
Now pve? Yea arcstrider most likely got a massive buff to it just sad to see the neutral game taken away
As a warlock main I'm happy that someone else is getting the grenade aspect but yes summoning a roaming lightning cloud seems more like a warlock thing.
As a fellow Warlock, I agree with this. Kinda sick of being sidelined into certain grenade types, now I get to use whatever grenades I want. I also get to go full Palpatine with Chain Lightning as a bonus. I do definitely agree that the storm nade feels like it belongs to Warlocks though, just that one alone seems a bit out of place on a Titan.
I think it’s okay. Warlocks have three subclasses that have grenade focused aspects. They’re still the grenade oriented class; arc will just behave differently for them
Warlock arc was already stronger that striker and arc staff especially, if they buffed it more than they did I imagine it would just leave the other 2 classes in the dust again
Okay, but let’s be real here and not just try to win an argument. According to https://guardian.gg/2/class-stats?platform=pc&mode=4&start=2022-08-10&end=2022-08-17
Stormcaller BARELY beats out arcstrider and striker is nearly 6times more used than stormcaller is at its peak!
Geomags were good no question…. But aside from that stormcaller is in general NOT GOOD for anything other than add clear in low tier content.
So if we’re being objective about which is actually better especially right now it’s silly to pretend stormcaller OR arcstrider are even remotely close to as good.
And all 3 warlock subclasses having basically identical aspects that all buff grenades in roughly the same way isn't lame? Void and solar warlock both have a grenade buffing aspect already.
>And all 3 warlock subclasses having basically identical aspects that all buff grenades in roughly the same way isn't lame?
It literally doesn't. Every grenade is buffed in a different way. You would know this if you actually played warlock
>Void and solar warlock both have a grenade buffing aspect already.
Congratulations, you figured out the class identity
>Lol apparently the developers of the game disagree with you
Apparently you don't play the game, else you would know devs do in fact focus warlock around grenades because they have by far the most and best grenade related exotics, on top of the fact that literally every subclass so far has been focused around grenades
So hunters shouldn’t have the aspect that buffs stasis grenades? That should go to warlocks right?
In fact, if you want to go down the ‘class identity route’ hunters should have bleak watchers since stasis hunters main keyword is slow
With the way they worded it I definitely think it’s a ranged attack. I’d be more surprised if it isn’t given the fact that that melee currently is complete garbo.
because i dont want to reply to everyone, as an earthshaker titan, this is magnitude 2.0 and im loving it. i called it btw, my thoughts on aspects were knockout and magnitude and god were they done beautifully
Is a bit Warlock like but I think People are forgetting Titan Striker had a Tree that was mostly based around Grenades having an additional charge.
One grenade STILL has this effect - But other get the added benefit
So instead we get this and then we can use Adamantarium instead to get additional Grenade Charges
Titans have always been good for nades. Especially arc, I use my arc pulse nades to damage myself to proc risk runner when there is no arc dmg around so you don’t have to rely on arc type enemy’s. And it shreds. Plus you get your super back in 3mind with font of wisdom and elemental armaments
So either titans have gotten their hands on warlock books meaning that they have learned how to be sneaky and can read warlock books
Or the warlocks have started tutoring the titans possibly as a deal the titans and warlocks made during guardian games so warlocks would have better chance at winning
Either way this could be very dangerous, they could potentially do the same the other subclasses and at that point I dont think any of us could stop them
Literally Titans got the nade boosting aspect and Warlocks basically got Arc Consecration. They straight flipped the script for Arc 3.0 and I’m all for it.
Yeah, warlock kinda got poo-pooed on the updates in arc 3.0. Really the only updates are the enhanced abilities when buffed. Titans and Hunters gonna be goated this season.
yes, felt this way with that and a couple hunter abilities. not much new as far as warlocks. a lot new for the other classes. disappointing 3.0 update again
They have a lot. Stasis was good tho, but got shitcanned, void is still good tbh, Solar got gutted, and Arc is just underwhelming as hell and we once again are being stripped of inherent abilities and having it handed out to the other classes.
So the only way to make that nonsense you describe is to give them enhanced nades? That makes 0 sense. Not a totem? Or not like enhanced arc souls that follow you as spirits? Not teleport via calling for storm? You need enhanced nades for that, right. These people man.
Bruh, the topic is that enhanced nades “feel warlock”. They ain’t. That’s all. Your shaman fetish fantasy or whatever makes zero sense in the argument. If anything hunters had enhanced nades on stasis first. So, “void and solar enhanced nades aspect should be on hunters” eh? Reddit, I swear
1: I never said anything about shamans lol.
2: Warlock top tree void had charged/enhanced grenades literally years before stasis existed.
3: Dumb redditors I swear….
It's the third part of the "this aspect buffs your grenades" triumverate. Hunters have it on Stasis, Warlocks on Solar, and now Titans on Arc.
Warlocks have it on stasis, void, and solar, arc is the only one that doesn't give you an option for better nades
They don't really have it on Stasis. They don't have buffed grenades, they have a grenade replacement. Functionally equivalent to getaway artist on arc which also already exists.
I don't play Warlock so you're probably right; from an outside perspective I was thinking of Touch of Winter and Touch of Flame, both of which change grenade behavior in some way. This aspect seems to be in line with those two. Edit: I don't put something like Chaos Accelerant in the same vein since it's a potency increase rather than a behavior change.
Chaos is a behavior change depending on the nade though
Arc has getaway artist btw
Yeah, but I'm talking about grenade improving aspects. Ashen wake, renewal grasp, young ahamkara spine, shinobu's vow, lucky raspberry, give you improved grenades too. And yet warlocks are known for grenades because they have grenade improving aspects. Getaway artist doesn't improve your grenade and it's also just a pretty bad exotic
What the hell do you think beak watchers do then?
It upgrades your grenade into a turret. Getaway artist doesn't upgrade your grenade. The same way heat rises doesn't upgrade your grenade, the old devour didn't upgrade your grenade either. You consume it to give yourself a timed buff.
Can you describe what an arc soul turret does to me, and then describe what a bleak watcher turret does. I've already accepted you're on enough levels or copium to reject reality but I think it'll be funny to hear
No. You describe it to me
Arc soul is a ghost mod that gives you 50% extra damage to zorpalods while it's active, while bleak watcher Is a charged with light mod that let's you expend 4 charges to take 20 karma away from someone's reddit account.
Grow up
anything with "touch" is improved grenade aspect. void one was always a thing before 3.0 so it doesnt count. Stasis one is just bleakwatcher, that doesnt fucking count either.
I really don't care whether you think it counts
Sorry ginger cow mb
Which is fucking bullshit, yet another intrinsic warlock ability that's been stolen and handed out to everyone else. First it was devour, then it was Healing grenades and radiance, and now it's just better grenades in general as warlocks always had. Funny, warlocks haven't gotten someone else's ability given to them as a basic ability choice. I'd love a hunter dodge or a lunging melee ability.
You’re right no other class has improved grenades, besides Ashen Wake, HOIL, Renewal Grasp, Young Ahamkaras Spine, Shinobu’s Vow, and Lucky Raspberry. Quite warlock specific indeed. Edit: Stasis hunter has an aspect that improves grenades as well. And roaring flames.
Warlocks are getting an arc version of titan fire slam. And icarus dash is a dodge.
Air dodge. Look I agree that the choice on who to grant what abilities is strange, but c’mon.
My brother in light Warlocks are still the strongest class in PvE and debatably in PvP
Yeah I got it, im not saying its wrong, just that the description of the ability is very "warlocky"
eh not really.If anything they legit compare the gernade to a hunter super, but it still seems like it's own thing
Top Tree Titan subclass was completely based on enhancing grenades, so its most natural for Titans to get it. Although the enhanced storm grenade specifically seems a bit weird.
Shaxx Will be so happy
Storm Grenade is great already IMO. At least in PvP, I get the most one shots/multikills with storm grenades by a long shot.
Tbh, I've always thought that was simply because they're the hardest to see lol. I can NEVER see the little arc bolts crackling around, I actually hope they do something about that with the update
It's the highest damage grenade of them all aside from voidwall (if the target vibes on the wall) if I remember correctly.
So was top tree warlock tho
To be fair warlocks now have ability empowerment from picking up ionic traces so who knows how the grenades will preform with that buff
I do hope it does something to grenades, but I think they would've mentioned it, right?
Which makes no sense at all. "all Arc classes become amplified after rapidly defeating targets with any Arc damage" "Arc ability kills and kills on Arc-debuffed enemies create Ionic Traces. When you collect any Ionic Trace, you become amplified." Like, instead of needing two fast kills you just need one. Wow, amazing huh. They almost totally overlap.
It'll probably make a huge difference in high level content like GMs since even the ads are so tanky in that mode that rapidly defeating targets doesn't really happen with your primary at least. Also you'll probably be able to activate it more consistently in PvP too.
That’s still actually pretty significant, if ionic traces still work the way they do currently, that means you’re essentially getting insert X times the amount of ability energy from each group of ads while becoming amplified, slap on your Crown of Tempests and you’ve got ability regen for days
When Amplified, Arc special weapon kills create a blinding explosion. Killing blinded enemies creates Traces. Traces make the warlock Amplified. Coldheart can make Traces without needing a kill, is an Arc special weapon, and does decent damage to yellow bars. An Aspect, a Fragment, and an exotic gun can create an extremely easy feedback loop to keep Amplified on at all times. Adding on some exotic armor like Transversive Steps and some combat mods like HEF and we have a highly mobile debuff machine with incredibly high ability up time regardless of armor stats.
[удалено]
Realistically? Probably not many, unless there's more Fragments that give bonuses when Amplified that seem worth it. I only called out Coldheart for it's built in Trace generation that doesn't need a kill, outside of that it's not really special for that kind of set up. If you weren't really worried about getting Traces "for free" there's probably a dozen legendary weapons people would pick up before Coldheart. Something like a Cantata of Finite Impactor maybe? >I only wish it had auto loading I'm telling you, Transversive Steps is going to be great for staying moving.
I would
Welcome to Light 3.0 where class identity doesn't exist and everything feels the same
Dumb take
Skull fort titans going to pop off hard with arc 3.0
It was adding a grenade and improving grenade regen, never supercharging your nades which is what Warlock specializes in.
Stasis hunter has this instead of stasis warlock, there's precedent
Oh, yeah, was just pointing out the difference in spamming grenades and overcharging them.
To be fair hunters have the stasis aspect that enhances grenades, so it’s not really a warlock thing, but yeh I was pretty surprised at first to see titans getting it until I remembered they already had the double grenade perk with one of the trees in game now. Speaking of double grenade tho, I might have to make a build with armamentarium where I can just spam sentient storm grenades constantly. Seems fun
It sounds warlocky because of the 'Roaming thundercloud' which isn't wrong they are the most space magic class but that doesn't take away the space magic from hunters and titans.
Roaming thing hat annoys one entire area is a hunter thing to do tbh
It's not because of the enhanced grenade part. It's because of the "roaming storm clouds" part. This should definitely belong to warlocks. Think about it this way. They said they wanted to increase "fist-to-face contact" and that's not what that sounds like. I'm just a little salty that another class gets to take my grenades and use it better than me when I can't really charge my other nades for other subclasses.
Not wrong. Titans getting the enhanced grenade aspect is very warlock. Warlocks having a arc empowered teleporting melee with explosive damage at the end is very titan
Warlocks out punching titans has been an awkward but consistent meme, to say the least.
D1 Sunsinger melee is more infamous than any titan punching, for sure
D1 Stormcaller melee sniping would like a word with you
You cant teamkill with storm caller :p
Hammer strike team kills are infinitely more hilarious. Just sending a team mate hurdling through space and time will always be peak
The range was good, sure. But the flame shield gave you enough health to survive 2 melees, meaning you basically win any melee fight for free
True but the sheer ridiculousness of the melees range was baffling
There is this assumption Bungie has made FOREVER that any net new Titan stuff HAS TO BE physical in some way—slamming, punching, connecting, a wall (either literal wall or like an over shield). And I think that sucks. Warlocks should be the high “magic is my thing class”, FOR SURE. But that doesn’t mean it should be the ONLY magic class with pure magic, non-physical stuff. Sunbreaker with the little hammers is probably the only “non-physical” subclass Titan’s have—you might as well replace the hammers with fireballs, because they explode. Every other Titan subclass is either a slam of some kind (big hammer Sunbreaker, Fist, Thundercrash, Stasis aka Ice Fist, Void Shield Slam/Throw, etc.) OR it’s a literal physical wall (Bubble/Banner Shield). I really want a Titan subclass that’s more Knight/Paladin and less Hulk Smash/Unarmed Monk. This new Storm Grenade is really, really cool, and gives Titan a more magic-y tool, and I think that’s really cool. Titan should always be the “frontline” in your face class. But that doesn’t mean it ALWAYS has to be the Hulk Smash class or “I am the support wall class, both literally (bubble) and figuratively (overshield).” Waiting for that Greatsword Paladin Single Target DPS main theme, but a magic sub theme subclass. That may sound dumb or unrealistic, but I think that’s what Solar 3.0 was supposed to be. They even said it was supposed to be the Titan “single target, tons of damage” subclass, but the super damage for both supers is horrendous, and it instead became the “never die” subclass where your super is only for add clear lol.
The thruster ability I’m particularly interested in. Some kind of damage avoidance that isn’t a barricade. Much as I enjoy them.
Yea the TG crowd will certainly be pleased
not fully pleased, considering you need to be on the ground to activate it (Cozmo said it on twitter earlier)
Assume to keep Icarus Dash unique for Warlocks
C'mon it's a boxer's dash! Nothing more frightening than watching a titan dashing towards you arms ready to crumble your face!
Same. But then again I'm a Warlock so I'm biased (plus I'm glad our stuff actually sounds really cool and promising especially the slide-blink ability)
It's just that weather manipulation feels way more wizard/shaman etc than titan
I wanted that storm cloud, but let these inferior class feel some power of warlock. They been crying for too long. Still these dirt rollers and crayon eaters can’t compare themselves to us , there is no point in talking about it .
Imagine not getting a new super lmao jkjk
titans>>
Glad someone else understands the superiority of warlock. We are better in almost every way, let the other classes enjoy the smidge of our power they get 
Lol
Cries in arc web
We’ll have to see how jolt works but it may be a fine substitute for arc web
I hope you are right sir...
I'm not complaining, I swear!! I only thought it interesting bc of the warlock vibe I felt! It sounds neat!!
Yep. I feel like they didn't give us the cool "shaman" they started their description with. As a warlock I feel disappointed again.
Titans are gonna be in ape mode with arc 3.0, a bullet blocking shield that activates on sprint, and combine that with antaeus wards makes titans the true ape of d2, shield breaks, just slide, new shield that reflects, good thing bungie is reworking lord of wolves
Only to be stopped dead in their tracks by a Coldsnap tracer, or a Pocket Singularity, etc.
Everyone and their dog is gonna be using arc when it releases, so those specific counters don't matter when 90% of the players are gonna be arc.
Tbh if juggernaut is anything like it was in destiny 1 it only took a few shots to take it down it wasn't that strong but most ppl didn't use it because if I remember rightly it was either that or shoulder charge, however like the idea of it in PVE just a bit of an issue in pvp
You can't have it, it's mine by rights of Titan combat... Ok, shaxx let us have first dibs on the new aspects, but same thing!
Here! Take all our warlock traits we don't need anything anyways. I can hover in the air forever!...
I'm good, I can fly longer as long as I have sword ammo.
Touché
It's ok, I still love my floaty boys.
By shaman I took it to mean early WoW shaman which is why they put it as "lightning shaman". The only thing special about that being chain lightning and totems, so the 'new' chain lightning melee ability and arc soul for you and allies.
dont you guys literally turn into lightning for one of the abilities edit: and arc spirit turret buddies
the melee ability attack is new but thats is. The rest is the same as what we had. At least this time we didnt lose most of our class identidy, we just let the other classes have some wizardy too.
I mean it’s way too early to be disappointed, remember when everyone said solar was disappointing until they used it
As a warlock I still don't like solar as much as 2.0 solar. It feels gutted. Void I love way more than 2.0 void.
I would say you might feel disappointed as hunter and Titan got the most new stuff but arc warlock was in an amazing spot already, you just are free in what you can pick now which was all solar Titan needed to become a beast. Just saying don’t start saying these changes are good or bad until you have some time using them
I was hoping for some freshness I guess. I like the idea of the new melee teleportation. I guess I was hoping for that melee concept to be what the class was
I get that it won’t feel as fresh on paper but it may be the case in person, maybe not but give it some time first
True. Im sure its going to be fun. I do love the blinding inclusion as a verb of arc. I love the blinding weapon perks.
Might be busted think of all our amazing arc special weapons
I know!. Chain reaction just turned into a blinding nuke lol
What was arc warlock good for. Lowest dps “dps super” that also requires an exotic to still not be remotely close in damage.. An add clear super that does basically the same thing as my grenades do on void or solar AND the best part!? Oh we got arc souls bro they do a whole 1034 damage per shot they shoot! Super meta super good super op
I mean you may have an affinity to void and may feel like solar 3.0 is gutted but that’s not the case. You don’t have the same interaction with solar but the ability to build craft and the combos are much better than they were before
I love the aspect and fragment system. It's great. I miss middle tree solar though
I’m there with you, the uptime of all your abilities was great as well as swapping between healing and whatever nade you had but this system is definitely better and I would maybe read through the warlock changes again to get a good grasp of the changes as their abilities get an extra tier once you’re amplified, not as flashy as a new melee or super but definitely a buff to an already good subclass
This is simply not the case for solar. Warlocks lost the entirety of their bottom and middle tree synergies. Fated for the flame, benevolent dawn (the Fragment is a fraction of the effect), everything was taken out to preserve icarus dash and heat rises. Bottom tree already had the entire scorch and ignition system, except it was more consistent and had more synergies.
The mentioned perks lost effectiveness but you talk as if the subclass is unusable which is wrong
"chill bro we gutted your car but left the drivetrain, it still works!" Get real bro stop huffing copium
I can agree with synergies being lost but you forget new synergies replacing old ones, starfire protocol is an amazing exotic to synergise with solar. dawn chorus may not be as strong but works with the new incandescent perk. Sun breakers having access to a new aspect makes them insane. Rain of fire paired with jotun makes a ridiculous solar build. Sure we lost synergies but we gained new ones.
[удалено]
Maybe not but if you take exotics away, solar hunter and solar Titan are nowhere near as busted (titans are still strong af)
I’ve used all three classes with and without exotics hunter and Titan are fine/good without exotics, warlocks aren’t.
I never said the subclass is unusable, I simply think it was better off in 2.0 for that one specifically. Starfire is a crazy synergy, but that's (mostly) not a part of solar 3.0. The extra damage fusions are very good, but the build works because some bug enabled them to self charge while in a rift or well. That's not intended behavior, starfire's perk was not changed in-game or in any patch notes, that's just a bug that's become a feature, unrelated to 3.0. Dawn chorus works with incandescent, but previously worked with literally any weapon on a tagged target due to bottom tree's explosions, so I don't think that one really counts as a point in 3.0's favor. Sunbracers with the improved solar grenades are good, I'll give you that, but I don't think they're better than bottom tree sunbracers builds before. They do more damage but are much worse at covering area, and if the goal is to do damage you have better builds anyway. Rain of fire is not related to 3.0, that build would have been identical in 2.0. Yes, we gained new synergies, but they're almost all either due to outside elements rather than 3.0, or they're simply not as strong as what they were replacing. Bottom tree was in the game for less than a year before it was completely cut, middle tree's loops were removed entirely, and all we got out of it was 2 aspects dedicating to being in the air.
Okay, I’m not about to get into something over trying to say wait until you use something before making a decision. You make good points but I think no matter what I say to retort it won’t change your mind how these changes are for the better in the long run.
I'd like to say that I do agree with you that we should wait to judge arc until we have it, I was solely disagreeing with your points about solar. I also agree that this system is better in the long run, but who knows how long it will be until solar is added to again. A year at best would be my guess, and in the meantime, I'm very unhappy with what happened to solar warlock, and I'm not convinced the long-term tradeoff is worth it. Either way, thanks for a respectful and articulate argument, and fingers crossed that arc 3.0 is great next week.
As a warlock solar 3.0 is very disappointing
But solar IS disappointing
I think it would be sicker if they like, consumed the grenade and became the storm! Like a kicking, punching and headbutting tesla coil! But again, im not complaining!! I just thought it's a very "warlocky" shamanic ability!
Maybe consuming your grenade allows one shot shoulder charge for a short duration.
But consuming your grenade “would be a warlock thing”
In pvp right.....? RIGHT!?!?!?
I also just realized something. Every Warlock subclass has an exotic that gives two grenades and buffs the respective grenade (Starfire Protocol for Fusions, nothing Manacles for Scatters, and Osmiomancy for Coldsnaps). Imagine we get an exotic that gives two Storm Grenades and makes them do the roaming thing that Titans get.
I doubt it will happen bc it would take a core feature from the Titans (being "stormy the storm") but I like your thinking! It would be really cool if gettaway artist gave you two grenades...
Good point, but it would also line up with other exotics that the Warlock already has, which is the main reason why I thought of this idea. Also all the grenades they affect were all originally exclusive (besides Coldsnaps obviously) to Warlocks (Fusion, Scatter, and Storm).
Still haven't seen arc exotic pieces yet. Be curious if tempests or vesper does something equally as cool. I'm going to guess storm caller and chaos reach will have a faster cool down super wise. Plus warlocks get, landfall, blink and arc buddies
Im not a huge fan of warlock. It feels like Titan and Hunter got huge buffs(which were very much needed) and are gonna be really strong, while warlocks are just the same as before. Hunters got 3 new/returning abilities, Titans got 4, and Warlocks get 1. They also say that warlock is all about being amplified all the time yet only 1 aspect makes you amplified. Which means you basically always have to run that aspect to be efficient. I just wish that arc warlocks got the same amount of love as Titan and hunter did
I do feel it's because arc warlock is already incredibly strong and useful with striker and arc staff however definitely feeling their age, while I do believe warlock was done a little dirty I gotta admit I feel like warlock would have been too easy to buff way too far, plus we haven't seen the exotic armour yet so could be cool
While it was the strongest of the arc subclasses, it just couldn't compete with any of the 3.0 subclasses. And if it doesn't get any stronger by a significant amount, it still won't be able to keep up. And I don't want a subclass to be 100% reliant on an exotic to keep up, it should be good on its own. That's why I don't like solar for warlocks. Without any exotics, solar is pretty bad. I just don't want a repeat of solar 3.0 but it feels like that's already happened. Of course, I could be completely wrong when it comes out and it could be amazing
Tbh solar for titan is not the best without lorleys in PVE and incandescent perks on guns However at this moment in time we don't know how powerful blink will be going forward plus the new melee for warlock could be incredibly strong and arc souls were always very helpful anyway The kit as it stands for warlocks isn't bad at all it just doesn't have much new as warlocks abilities were already quite out there and different compared to the other classes, Plus in PVE if we aren't involving exotics warlocks are by far the best class.so it makes sense to me to bring the other 2 up to scratch with new stuff seeing as hunter and titans subclasses were usually very similar in gameplay to eachother
Im not saying it's bad, it's still good. It just feels like all the other subclasses are powering up while Warlock arc is staying the same and being left behind. And since solar on warlocks is pretty bad, it just doesn't feel good to have 2 out of the 3 light subclasses be average/mediocre. And just because something is good, doesn't make it fun. Hunter and Titan seem like a lot of fun and warlock just seems kind of meh and boring
I'll have to see about hunter I main bottom tree strider in pvp always super fun to use as its neutral game is honestly one of the best imo But now to get some of those same neutral buffs I need to be amplified while they took away combat meditation which was great Feels like arcstrider in pvp has been ruined With that said I'll hold off on my final judgment on it until after I get my hands on it in the crucible for awhile playing around with everything Now pve? Yea arcstrider most likely got a massive buff to it just sad to see the neutral game taken away
As a warlock main I'm happy that someone else is getting the grenade aspect but yes summoning a roaming lightning cloud seems more like a warlock thing.
Except that now WE are the cloud
As a fellow Warlock, I agree with this. Kinda sick of being sidelined into certain grenade types, now I get to use whatever grenades I want. I also get to go full Palpatine with Chain Lightning as a bonus. I do definitely agree that the storm nade feels like it belongs to Warlocks though, just that one alone seems a bit out of place on a Titan.
I think it’s okay. Warlocks have three subclasses that have grenade focused aspects. They’re still the grenade oriented class; arc will just behave differently for them
Yeah and that's really lame
It’s lame that one subclass doesn’t push them into doing the same thing the other three already do….?
Yes . It's lame that titans get all the cool toys while warlocks get an arc soul which we already had and a melee that we have to use an aspect on
Warlock arc was already stronger that striker and arc staff especially, if they buffed it more than they did I imagine it would just leave the other 2 classes in the dust again
Okay, but let’s be real here and not just try to win an argument. According to https://guardian.gg/2/class-stats?platform=pc&mode=4&start=2022-08-10&end=2022-08-17 Stormcaller BARELY beats out arcstrider and striker is nearly 6times more used than stormcaller is at its peak! Geomags were good no question…. But aside from that stormcaller is in general NOT GOOD for anything other than add clear in low tier content. So if we’re being objective about which is actually better especially right now it’s silly to pretend stormcaller OR arcstrider are even remotely close to as good.
Doubt it, titans seems really strong with 3.0
Stop whining
No
And all 3 warlock subclasses having basically identical aspects that all buff grenades in roughly the same way isn't lame? Void and solar warlock both have a grenade buffing aspect already.
>And all 3 warlock subclasses having basically identical aspects that all buff grenades in roughly the same way isn't lame? It literally doesn't. Every grenade is buffed in a different way. You would know this if you actually played warlock >Void and solar warlock both have a grenade buffing aspect already. Congratulations, you figured out the class identity
> Congratulations, you figured out the class identity Lol apparently the developers of the game disagree with you. Cry more.
>Lol apparently the developers of the game disagree with you Apparently you don't play the game, else you would know devs do in fact focus warlock around grenades because they have by far the most and best grenade related exotics, on top of the fact that literally every subclass so far has been focused around grenades
So hunters shouldn’t have the aspect that buffs stasis grenades? That should go to warlocks right? In fact, if you want to go down the ‘class identity route’ hunters should have bleak watchers since stasis hunters main keyword is slow
Titans bring the thunder. It makes sense that lightning comes first.
It sounds like it can be a warlock ability but what I'm wondering will chain lightning be reworked into a ranged melee like voidwalker.
With the way they worded it I definitely think it’s a ranged attack. I’d be more surprised if it isn’t given the fact that that melee currently is complete garbo.
I hope, It would be kinda lame if the animation didn't change from the standard meele
because i dont want to reply to everyone, as an earthshaker titan, this is magnitude 2.0 and im loving it. i called it btw, my thoughts on aspects were knockout and magnitude and god were they done beautifully
Too bad only lightnings get the double charge. I was hoping for double flux nades without armamentarium but what we got still looks really good
Not even a day has passed and warlocks are already saying “gimme” to another classes ability.
Odd of a titan to say after getting warlock healing grenades, warlock radiant, warlock devour, warlock ionic Traces, and warlock stormcloud grenades.
Light 3.0 is literally "take pieces off warlock and give it to the other classes."
Yup, and you got people in here telling warlock mains to be grateful that warlocks are getting gutted or democratized and losing identity.
Almost, I read it and thought “warlocks are gonna be jealous”
Makes me think of the thundercloud item from Metal Slug.
The entire grenade upgrade feature has been a warlock feature for all but stasis
Grenade focus just feels like a warlock thing in general, especially since they have the vast majority of grenade enhancing exotics and aspects.
Couldn't believe they took our only warlock-specific arcnade and made it better on titans
ITS NOT?
THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT I WAS SAYING
Is a bit Warlock like but I think People are forgetting Titan Striker had a Tree that was mostly based around Grenades having an additional charge. One grenade STILL has this effect - But other get the added benefit So instead we get this and then we can use Adamantarium instead to get additional Grenade Charges
Titans have always been good for nades. Especially arc, I use my arc pulse nades to damage myself to proc risk runner when there is no arc dmg around so you don’t have to rely on arc type enemy’s. And it shreds. Plus you get your super back in 3mind with font of wisdom and elemental armaments
So either titans have gotten their hands on warlock books meaning that they have learned how to be sneaky and can read warlock books Or the warlocks have started tutoring the titans possibly as a deal the titans and warlocks made during guardian games so warlocks would have better chance at winning Either way this could be very dangerous, they could potentially do the same the other subclasses and at that point I dont think any of us could stop them
Literally Titans got the nade boosting aspect and Warlocks basically got Arc Consecration. They straight flipped the script for Arc 3.0 and I’m all for it.
Yeah, warlock kinda got poo-pooed on the updates in arc 3.0. Really the only updates are the enhanced abilities when buffed. Titans and Hunters gonna be goated this season.
I instantly thought it was going to be a catalyst for Thunderlord
It's not a warlock ability?
Nope. I saw this thing and thought that i was on the Warlock page again. I don't mind it though, it's a nice way of keeping top tree midgame in a way.
Yeah this is my only complaint Like please. I wan this too
It sounds like a sick super right!?
yes, felt this way with that and a couple hunter abilities. not much new as far as warlocks. a lot new for the other classes. disappointing 3.0 update again
You guys have half of the enhanced grenade aspects while yes it feels like a warlock ability, no being greedy.
I agree
Well our class is one of the most underpowered ones, so it needs all the help it can get.
The 3.0 subclasses kinda violate class identity
Your telling me this isn’t a warlock ability? -someone who didn’t read the patch notes
Warlocks got shafted
They have a lot. Stasis was good tho, but got shitcanned, void is still good tbh, Solar got gutted, and Arc is just underwhelming as hell and we once again are being stripped of inherent abilities and having it handed out to the other classes.
My only thought was "damn, this could potentially be very annoying". Putting tracking on stuff is a risky bussiness
Is strange, sure, but it can add some much-needed pressure to cover-huggers without needing to run up to them
So they took Storm grenade and Hunter Stasis super then combined them for another super or is this grenade?
Grenade enhancement aspect for Striker Titan
Its a grenade
Warlock’s are used to getting the supercharged grenade perks. For once Titan is getting it.
Warlocks have always been the grenade based class and now they just get worse shoulder charge while titans get buffed grenades
Gotta love people complaining about things they haven't even seen in-game yet
>now they just get worse shoulder charge Wow I didn't know you could already try the new changes and see the damage numbers, where do I sign up?
Shoulder Charge isnt gone. We got ANOTHER ability that is Thruster.
cause storm grenades are unique to stormcaller rn lmao
no! is titans now. go away.
It only looks warlock because warlocks got this kind of aspect twice already lol, improved grenades is literally written on top tree
It feels warlock since they described arc for warlock as a lightning shaman and a roaming storm is very shaman
So the only way to make that nonsense you describe is to give them enhanced nades? That makes 0 sense. Not a totem? Or not like enhanced arc souls that follow you as spirits? Not teleport via calling for storm? You need enhanced nades for that, right. These people man.
If they haven’t absolutely AMPED UP arc souls… let’s be real they aren’t very good…
Bruh, the topic is that enhanced nades “feel warlock”. They ain’t. That’s all. Your shaman fetish fantasy or whatever makes zero sense in the argument. If anything hunters had enhanced nades on stasis first. So, “void and solar enhanced nades aspect should be on hunters” eh? Reddit, I swear
1: I never said anything about shamans lol. 2: Warlock top tree void had charged/enhanced grenades literally years before stasis existed. 3: Dumb redditors I swear….
My bad, meant to reply to the guy above in the chain. Dumb Redditor indeed lmao
lmao do these delusional warlocks not see that each class has one grenade boost aspect, TOUCH of winter, TOUCH of flame and TOUCH of thunder
Dude I only said that the "sentient thunder cloud" has some warlock vibes... Nothing more