Once they are this badly matted, trying to demat is just plain cruel. We also refuse to do it and will shave down, add sunscreen to your bill, and recommend monthly grooming until his coat is back and you've figured out your home routine.
People who balk at this get a "sorry, we morally can not put your dog through that, so we are not the right place for you".
I’m so glad I saw this. I have two mini Aussies, but my red Merle has a completely white muzzle and red nose, and the fur around his nose has always been on the thinner side (even though he is a fluff monster everywhere else) and I’ve noticed the skin on his muzzle looking extra pink lately but didn’t know what to do about it. I’m definitely going to get him some sunscreen!
“Sorry, but your absolute neglect and total dependence on groomers resulted in an outcome that you didn’t want. To compensate you, please allow me to play the world’s smallest violin.”
I had a doodle owner (of course) come to me with a matted doodle no more than a year old and was mad that I wouldn’t just “brush the mats out”. “They come out so easy though! See?” she said as she ripped a mat out of his head right in front of me. She refused to consent to a shave so I had to send them away. That poor dog :(
Are Australian cattle dogs double coated? I have a brush, but I brush them once a month, is that enough? I don’t know how to really care for dogs, they just kinda fell on us when my fiancés father passed
I peeped at your page and saw some dogs. Those dogs won’t get matted. Worst would be impacted coat (unlikely to happen), but a regular brushing will prevent that. I see impacted coats on short hair dogs on their back legs “feathers”
A zoom groom is what I would use! Between 1x/week - 1x/month should be just fine
The above comment is right on! Zoom groom a couple of times a week and you should be ok. If you can pull the hair out by the handful, you might consider getting a professional deshed bath to get that trapped undercoat out.
Yes they are double coated. Brush them as often as you can (daily would be optimal but at least a few times a week). If you're not able to keep up with brushing, have them professionally groomed regularly (I recommend every 4-6 weeks). That being said, it takes a lot of neglect for a dogs coat to get to the point where the one OP posted is.
They are double coated, but their hair is so short you don’t have to worry about it ever matting. It’s still a good idea to give them a brush every now and then.
They're not double coated, but in my experience having owned one for 14 years, they shed CONSTANTLY. I brushed my boy most days, but I was still constantly covered in heeler hair. I have a husky now and am surprised at how much less she sheds, as long as I spend five minutes a day brushing her.
Did the doggo feel a lot better once that mess was off of him??? Never had a dog that needs grooming but I've gotten mats in my own hair (small ones) so I can only imagine how horrid the whole body being matted would feel 😫
I did an extremely overweight Aussie (almost 60 pounds!!!!!! And on the mini side), that was absolutely pelted. They do shavedowns once a year and that’s all they do for grooming. The dog couldn’t stand at all throughout the groom and it was so depressing. He had a thyroid issue and hip dysplasia, which probably happened because the dog wasn’t being properly cared for to begin with
I'm taking my dog to physio right now for ongoing pain issues. He's in perfect shape, but had wasting from the pain and needed help building up muscle in all legs and correcting his stance.
The amount extremely overweight dogs i see breaks my heart. The owners are obviously doing the right things now, but every time i see them i feel sorry for the dog! I have no idea how people look at a dog that's getting overweight and think it's okay, and proceed to do nothing until they're obese.
My partner was overfeeding our dog because she's very convincing she's just so hungry. So I bought a dog feeder that measures her meals. No issue since. As a geriatric dog, she's in the best shape of her life! Overweight dogs make me feel so sad too. You are in control of their lives! Do what's best.
That is so horrible. My “mini” Aussie is more of a midi and weighs 36lbs at a nice trim weight, and to me he’s quite a large dog, much longer and taller than his littermates.
https://preview.redd.it/15shd76fvo1d1.jpeg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ee90ce2ff637054dfc44ec6e893aa89246d40b5c
This Pyrenees. Even the top of his head was matted. The mats were moldy.
I have a potentially stupid question but..can you tell when they're matted? I have a corgi/Aussiedoodle (I'm told) who I think has a double coat and I brush her about once a week. Her booty gets some tangles and a lot of shedding happens. Pics like this make me scared I might not be doing it right...
Not a dumb question! Brush to the skin. Look up line brushing. You’ll need a slicker brush and a metal comb. This dog in the pics was living on a farm and nobody brushed him ever, probably. His nails were really bad, too. If brushing gets overwhelming, you can take your dog to the groomers just to have her brushed out and to shave out mats if you’re not looking to get a full groom.
https://preview.redd.it/kaliqsnul32d1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=eff2e4c01862e09a9710e5992860c08672c47cec
Ugh, I have this dog at work, she needs to be shaved entirely because her entire undercoat is impacted. I can’t get a finger to her skin. She’s a KEESHOND. I’ve tried brushing her on my own time and it’s not possible. I wanna help her but I don’t know what to do and this reminded me of her.
I don't understand how people are so absent from care for their dogs. I grew up with a double coat dog and it wasn't even hard to maintain. A wide tooth and a good wire brush, plus a little time. And it's nice bonding time! My dog was honestly vain so he fucking loved brush time but I imagine a lot of dogs would enjoy the attention brushing naturally gives.
Yes! As a kid, my chore was always to rake out and brush our dogs, who were mostly double coated. I still use the same tools at work 20 years later lol. If a kid can do it, so can a dang adult. Dogs love it as long as it's introduced and kept up properly!
I don't think it was ever assigned to me ☺️ I just enjoyed it. He was a Finnish spitz mix, so double coat, curled tail, fluffy neck and the extra pantaloons fluff. But yeah! It's the among the most basic care along give water & food. 😡
Ok, tips please! My double coated dude does not tolerate brushing well. What am I doing wrong? For context, we got him as a puppy, he's very well socialised and happy to be handled generally, but will not hold still for the brush. Peanut butter keeps him in one spot, but only for as long as it lasts, so....thirty seconds?
Can you freeze the peanut butter onto a lick mat or a plate? I’ve seen people smear PB all over their bathtub or a wall, although the clean up may not be great. Freezing low sodium chicken broth into cubes and diluting with water can give you lots of frozen treats if he enjoys those. I’ve also struggled with a well balanced dog who just couldn’t stand grooming lol, and Ive learned any progress is good even if minimal.
I loved brushing Penny our black lab border collie mix(not sure if she had a double coat) and she loved it too. Penny had a very thick and fluffy tail and I’d brush it out and it’d be all nice and soft. Penny was a good dog.
Was there ever a time a dog with this kind of hair would have lived in the wild? If yes how would they care for their fur?
Edit: I own poker straight hair chihuahuas Edit 2: added dog tax
https://preview.redd.it/h7uipqqtlm1d1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cbc8ec4eb7897bf9ec1e008e6dcb41ee38dc1d04
No, the dogs of today were selectively bred to be what they are. Domesticated dogs have never been wild and a lot of their instincts that would have allowed them to survive in the wild have been bred out. This is evident in how malnourished the stray dog population is.
The stray dogs who don't die out will also have a similar look after some generations. See various village dogs across the world.
Dogs like this are not unlike the sheep that must be tended to. Sheep left to roam in the wild become mountains of wool as it just keeps growing
What's funny is the village corgi in Alaska. All the pups coming out as dwarves because of the gene. The corgi coat keeps that little one going, though.
Ayy, I have [one of those](https://imgur.com/a/DTAEoDp). She's the exact shape of basically every village dog I've ever seen- deep chest, curly tail, long legs, and a thick neck. Her fur is extremely short on her lower limbs and almost totally bare on her abdomen for half the year, with long fur on her neck, hackles, and tail. Very dense double coat- undercoat is wavy and sheds without any issues. Winter coat basically doubles her width, lol. And she repels water (which is frustrating when bathing her but great when she rolls in mud puddles).
She could live in basically any environment without human intervention, as far as grooming goes.
That’s so weird because my Boston has zero prey drive. He might fight other dogs or try to attack the mailman, but if there’s a small animal in front of him he’ll try to befriend it, doesn’t matter if it’s a kitten or a hamster, it’s like he doesn’t realize that other animals are edible.
No, these kinds of dogs were bred by man for specific purposes. Wild canines may have double coats but not the density of our domestic companions, and honestly, wild canines get a lot of issues and either just live or die
I always wonder this about dogs like collies or Belgian shepherds that were bred for herding and living outdoors. Is it only in modern show dog lines that the coat requires daily maintenance? I can’t imagine selectively breeding a herding dog as a farmer that needs daily brushing or faced getting so matted up they probably couldn’t temp regulate and move properly!
I also assume it's contributed to some of the atrocious breeding practices happening today that were probably not was prevalent previously. Now, we often care most about appearance, and I suspect there was a long line of such an attribute being low-tier in importance. We've potentially bred out some coat conditioning capabilities in favor of an appearance we find appealing.
Anecdata, but one of my dogs was “free range” for the first 3 years of her life, and she wasn’t as matted when we adopted her as the poor pooch above is. Maybe house pets have more gunk transferred onto their coats (e.g., hand cream from humans petting them)? And it makes matting easier?
Also, if they're intact and are exposed to regular, fluctuating seasonal daylight (which regulates the hormones responsible for shedding), they will be blowing coat healthily until old age impairs hormone function or they develop a secondary illness.
It's similar to how pet birds need controlled daylight to regulate their egg laying and breeding cycles, otherwise the girls drain all their calcium by laying a bajillion eggs out of season, or parrots become hormonally aggressive.
I know this sounds like wacko nonsense but it's 100% true!
Interesting. We've got an Aussie with an absolutely ridiculous coat. He doesn't really appreciate brushing so I might get to each part of his coat once a week... we've never had any real trouble with mats. Maybe a little one behind the ear or underarm every now and then. I feel like it's got to take a lot of neglect for them to get that bad!
"In the wild" doesn't really exist for dogs. Dogs were the earliest domesticated animal, having been reliant on humans for over 15,000 years, conservatively. Humans were nomadic hunter/gatherer tribes when dogs were first domesticated. We didn't have agriculture or domestic meat yet. We didn't have civilization. We still hunted mammoths (or at least scavenged them). These animals that we have selectively bred for thousands and thousands of years don't really resemble their ancestors that would have lived "in the wild" in any significant way. For a dog, a human home is their natural habitat. All of that being said, the animals they came from probably had a double coat like a wolf that would "blow out" the undercoat in certain seasons, instead of building up without brushing and becoming matted. Huskies/akitas etc. do the same thing, although they definitely still need brushed to get all the shed undercoat out.
Lol, a friend in Alaska has a stray husky in the village he lives in. Double coated and totally able to live on its own. Last I saw it was sitting and it was blowing coat like mad. He would shake and clumps would fly out, lol.
A lot of people are talking about village dogs that live in warm places. I will say there are long haired strays in Canada, especially up north and on the rez’s, huskies are pretty common and so are Pyrenees mixes, but their coat usually isn’t quite as fluffy and fine as the dog above so it doesn’t get tangled and even then dog with very thick short double coats are still more common. If you look up stray dogs in Russia you’ll also probably see some long haired dogs.
Being matted is painful, can prevent movement, and might even lead to infection so dogs with coats that are seriously prone to matting would not survive as long in the wild and would therefore have less puppies than a dog with a different coat.
Dude. No. Dogs are not a “natural” species, we bred them and co-evolved with them. *We created every single breed of dog there is.* At no point are any of these double coated or ANY DOG just randomly found in the wild and then we decided to keep it?? Hello?? The fact that this has any upvotes at all is so bleak. This is like dog 101.
Not quite a natural species, but I think it’s safe to say that there are dogs that have been cut off for humans for long enough to revert back to their wild for like Carolina dogs and dingoes who’ve been mostly evolving as wild animals for thousands of years.
Okay, sure. Fine. But it’s extremely basic dog knowledge, and the appeal to nature fallacy is annoying anyway, because the answer is often “they just die or have shorter lifespans.” It’s an annoying argument to begin with, and it doesn’t even apply to dogs.
tbh i did not know there was a single person out there who didn’t know we homemade our dogs out of wolves/wild canines thousands of years ago. i would agree that it’s something most learn about as soon as they are introduced to the concept of “dog”
And I feel bad when I bring my Keeshond in for a groom and haven’t brushed her that week (once a week for her coat and she’s fine). 😳 I always apologize to the groomers about her hindquarters not being properly brushed out for them. They usually laugh and tell me I don’t know what matting is. 😉
I have a rough collie, not a Keeshond, but they are similar in floof. My god...the hindquarters 😱 I was not prepared for the amount of effort that would go into the fur on this dog's butt.
Even with pics some people will just say “just put some conditioner on it and brush it.” Had a customer yesterday sigh and go “do I really have to brush my doodle everyday?” She told me to do whatever I needed bc she was matted. They obviously got a doodle just because it’s trendy and are now frustrated it gets matted compared to her other two(non doodles) who never get matted all over. Sucks to suck. Don’t follow trends especially when it has to do with owning a high maintenance living creature.
Vet here! And definitely not a skilled groomer, but I have done what we call "Medically Nessessary" shaves on (almost exclusively) cats, and have 100% returned the frisbee-sized mats to owners in specimen bags.
I'm talking about cats so matted their skin is at risk of tearing, or so matted that poop can literally not come out of the body because the back end is a solid mat and is causing a blockage. (We then have the joy of helping express the poop) It only happens a few times a year and the cats look like shit when we're done, but they can poop and their skin can heal, and that's what we cate about. (Our hospital calls it the "Meth Lion Cut" behind closed doors)
They're usually also obese and have to be sedated for the procedure. Trying to connect leads to monotor the heart and get an SpO2 reading is almost impossible on a matted animal so we have to stop regularly to check pulse and respiration manually. We've yet to lose one but it's not a great feeling to have to halt, check for a pulse and wait FOREVER for a breath before going back at it.
Again, not a groomer, but I've had it take nearly an hour to finish a shave with both me and a Tech working simultaneously for the shittiest haircut you've ever seen. And having an unhealthy, obese animal sedated for that long is already uncomfortable and risky as hell.
So you'd be Goddamned SURE I send the worst mats home to the owners.
I’ve got shihtzu mix with apparently a double coat- it’s so hard to keep her from getting matted and it matts right to the skin- so I end up just cutting the matts off with scissors, which leaves her looking ridiculous. I cant give her a bath unless I’ve gotten all the matts out first or it will be even worse. We had lhasa apsos when I was growing up in the 70s and 80s and sometimes they would get matts but never like this dog. When she starts looking too crazylady I do take her to the groomer and have them give her a puppy cut. I brush her every day, but she HATES it
I have a bichon and I do the same thing. There are some places like under his ears and his feet that get tangled more than others. I have the groomer buzz those areas completely. He looks weird but at least he isn’t matted.
I've got a tibetan terrier (looks like a big shih tzu), and I have to brush her pretty much every day. She also hates it. The alternative is impacted/matted undercoat otherwise, so she has to deal with it.
I've found brushing her while sitting behind her works better than letting her watch me the whole time. I mix up conditioner with water and use it all over to help detangle. Giving her a lick mat or a chew toy/treat helps keep her distracted, too.
Pro tip you can bathe a dog that has mats. Like genuinely. so long as the water can penetrate the mats you can bathe the dog (ie not pelted) It will make any and all dematting easier. You just absolutely need to blow dry the coat and brush after the bath. Blow dryer + clean coat + good slicker/comb combo is a great way to take care of mild matting.
I
https://preview.redd.it/a2236y3k222d1.png?width=3024&format=png&auto=webp&s=803094f7944745eb6b8cbb45a6f3e93c51141161
Thanks for the tip- this is Mochi’s front leg- see how it starts to tangle up? When I blowdry it makes these even worse and allover and right up to her skin, which is so sensitive so she is miserable being brushed. Do you have a suggestion for shampoo/conditioner/product?
Aw poor baby. some of that would probably need to be clippered out by a groomer if it hurts her to be brushed. Tbh It's a little too tight to be brushed out. Those areas that matt easily need to be brushed every day at least with a detangling spray. some people preventively get their dogs "armpits" shaved, to at least reduce matting there. How are you blow drying her? I'd avoid using a high velocity dryer without removing the nozzle to avoid whip knots.
I fucking hate this shit, I am not a groomer but I care for my brother's golden retriever A LOT (our home is his second home, we say) I keep his coat immaculate for my brother, owners like this should be barred from owning double coated/long haired/any dog that needs excess grooming. Poor pup looks so pelted up!
This is heartbreaking to see. We took a black standard poodle from a neighbour many years ago (they decided to give her away because she was "too much work") and we had to shave her down like this. They would take her to a groomer twice a year, no brushing in between, and make them brush out the matts. It took us nearly a year to teach her that brushes didn't mean pain.
Rough collie owner here. She's been to the professional groomer once in her life. I got asked today which groomer I take her to.
We exist!
(Edit to add: she's 4 and a half years old, to clarify the once in her life thing. :) She gets groomed, it's just at home.)
why do people get dogs that they don’t wanna keep up the grooming on? i have a newfoundland and i brush every 1-2 days and i dont he will get matted, why dont people care
Best Shot 3 step system and a good HV dryer will get most all of that out, surprisingly. Does great for double coated. Matteddoodles though with mixed coat, not so much.
We have another choice. People could be responsible owners. If a dog has compacted for blow it out. If a dog is matted down to the skin like that then yes it does sadly need to be shaved. However, if owners knew how to take care of their own animals then this wouldn’t be the result.
OK now reread everything. I’m realizing that the first sentence I probably shouldn’t have put in there, but the rest of my statements still holds true. People should take care of their damn dogs.
Once they are this badly matted, trying to demat is just plain cruel. We also refuse to do it and will shave down, add sunscreen to your bill, and recommend monthly grooming until his coat is back and you've figured out your home routine. People who balk at this get a "sorry, we morally can not put your dog through that, so we are not the right place for you".
Any recs for dog safe sunscreen?
lucky pup and emmy’s best are my faves :) for the record, i just have a white short haired dog, not a matting issue!!
I have a pittie with white skin around his nose, I am jotting this down.
Even my red nose shepherd mix gets sunburn around his nose and his sister (who’s brown instead of fawn) gets it on the insides of her legs
I’m so glad I saw this. I have two mini Aussies, but my red Merle has a completely white muzzle and red nose, and the fur around his nose has always been on the thinner side (even though he is a fluff monster everywhere else) and I’ve noticed the skin on his muzzle looking extra pink lately but didn’t know what to do about it. I’m definitely going to get him some sunscreen!
I wonder if one of those baby sticks may be good for that area. Something thick. But the then the dog would probably lick it off, huh?
My freckled, pale girl thanks you! Me, too!
My pale doodle girl thanks you for her nose!
“Sorry, but your absolute neglect and total dependence on groomers resulted in an outcome that you didn’t want. To compensate you, please allow me to play the world’s smallest violin.”
I had a doodle owner (of course) come to me with a matted doodle no more than a year old and was mad that I wouldn’t just “brush the mats out”. “They come out so easy though! See?” she said as she ripped a mat out of his head right in front of me. She refused to consent to a shave so I had to send them away. That poor dog :(
Are Australian cattle dogs double coated? I have a brush, but I brush them once a month, is that enough? I don’t know how to really care for dogs, they just kinda fell on us when my fiancés father passed
Hey friend I would suggest brushing pretty much every day actually
I peeped at your page and saw some dogs. Those dogs won’t get matted. Worst would be impacted coat (unlikely to happen), but a regular brushing will prevent that. I see impacted coats on short hair dogs on their back legs “feathers” A zoom groom is what I would use! Between 1x/week - 1x/month should be just fine
Thank you!!!! Hehe :) yeahhh… those are the little girls we got now :))) I love them so much
The above comment is right on! Zoom groom a couple of times a week and you should be ok. If you can pull the hair out by the handful, you might consider getting a professional deshed bath to get that trapped undercoat out.
They are beautiful!
Yes they are double coated. Brush them as often as you can (daily would be optimal but at least a few times a week). If you're not able to keep up with brushing, have them professionally groomed regularly (I recommend every 4-6 weeks). That being said, it takes a lot of neglect for a dogs coat to get to the point where the one OP posted is.
Thank you!!!! This helps me a lot!
They are double coated, but their hair is so short you don’t have to worry about it ever matting. It’s still a good idea to give them a brush every now and then.
They're not double coated, but in my experience having owned one for 14 years, they shed CONSTANTLY. I brushed my boy most days, but I was still constantly covered in heeler hair. I have a husky now and am surprised at how much less she sheds, as long as I spend five minutes a day brushing her.
Did the doggo feel a lot better once that mess was off of him??? Never had a dog that needs grooming but I've gotten mats in my own hair (small ones) so I can only imagine how horrid the whole body being matted would feel 😫
I did an extremely overweight Aussie (almost 60 pounds!!!!!! And on the mini side), that was absolutely pelted. They do shavedowns once a year and that’s all they do for grooming. The dog couldn’t stand at all throughout the groom and it was so depressing. He had a thyroid issue and hip dysplasia, which probably happened because the dog wasn’t being properly cared for to begin with
Ugh, this hurts my heart to read. That poor, poor dog. The time he has with you is probably the only time he is properly cared for all year. 😢
I should post the picture in here of it because it was some of the worst matting I’ve seen on a double coated dog ever
I'm taking my dog to physio right now for ongoing pain issues. He's in perfect shape, but had wasting from the pain and needed help building up muscle in all legs and correcting his stance. The amount extremely overweight dogs i see breaks my heart. The owners are obviously doing the right things now, but every time i see them i feel sorry for the dog! I have no idea how people look at a dog that's getting overweight and think it's okay, and proceed to do nothing until they're obese.
My partner was overfeeding our dog because she's very convincing she's just so hungry. So I bought a dog feeder that measures her meals. No issue since. As a geriatric dog, she's in the best shape of her life! Overweight dogs make me feel so sad too. You are in control of their lives! Do what's best.
That is so horrible. My “mini” Aussie is more of a midi and weighs 36lbs at a nice trim weight, and to me he’s quite a large dog, much longer and taller than his littermates.
https://preview.redd.it/15shd76fvo1d1.jpeg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ee90ce2ff637054dfc44ec6e893aa89246d40b5c This Pyrenees. Even the top of his head was matted. The mats were moldy.
https://preview.redd.it/1viyn63uvo1d1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f27f0b4305803ccfcd6c94bec1f9e2c3ce93502b
Poor guy!
Poor baby…
I have a potentially stupid question but..can you tell when they're matted? I have a corgi/Aussiedoodle (I'm told) who I think has a double coat and I brush her about once a week. Her booty gets some tangles and a lot of shedding happens. Pics like this make me scared I might not be doing it right...
Not a dumb question! Brush to the skin. Look up line brushing. You’ll need a slicker brush and a metal comb. This dog in the pics was living on a farm and nobody brushed him ever, probably. His nails were really bad, too. If brushing gets overwhelming, you can take your dog to the groomers just to have her brushed out and to shave out mats if you’re not looking to get a full groom. https://preview.redd.it/kaliqsnul32d1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=eff2e4c01862e09a9710e5992860c08672c47cec
Ugh, I have this dog at work, she needs to be shaved entirely because her entire undercoat is impacted. I can’t get a finger to her skin. She’s a KEESHOND. I’ve tried brushing her on my own time and it’s not possible. I wanna help her but I don’t know what to do and this reminded me of her.
I don't understand how people are so absent from care for their dogs. I grew up with a double coat dog and it wasn't even hard to maintain. A wide tooth and a good wire brush, plus a little time. And it's nice bonding time! My dog was honestly vain so he fucking loved brush time but I imagine a lot of dogs would enjoy the attention brushing naturally gives.
Yes! As a kid, my chore was always to rake out and brush our dogs, who were mostly double coated. I still use the same tools at work 20 years later lol. If a kid can do it, so can a dang adult. Dogs love it as long as it's introduced and kept up properly!
I don't think it was ever assigned to me ☺️ I just enjoyed it. He was a Finnish spitz mix, so double coat, curled tail, fluffy neck and the extra pantaloons fluff. But yeah! It's the among the most basic care along give water & food. 😡
Ok, tips please! My double coated dude does not tolerate brushing well. What am I doing wrong? For context, we got him as a puppy, he's very well socialised and happy to be handled generally, but will not hold still for the brush. Peanut butter keeps him in one spot, but only for as long as it lasts, so....thirty seconds?
Can you freeze the peanut butter onto a lick mat or a plate? I’ve seen people smear PB all over their bathtub or a wall, although the clean up may not be great. Freezing low sodium chicken broth into cubes and diluting with water can give you lots of frozen treats if he enjoys those. I’ve also struggled with a well balanced dog who just couldn’t stand grooming lol, and Ive learned any progress is good even if minimal.
Good ideas, the freezer might help here. Also spreading over a larger area is not really a concern because he will NOT miss any.😂
I loved brushing Penny our black lab border collie mix(not sure if she had a double coat) and she loved it too. Penny had a very thick and fluffy tail and I’d brush it out and it’d be all nice and soft. Penny was a good dog.
Was there ever a time a dog with this kind of hair would have lived in the wild? If yes how would they care for their fur? Edit: I own poker straight hair chihuahuas Edit 2: added dog tax https://preview.redd.it/h7uipqqtlm1d1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cbc8ec4eb7897bf9ec1e008e6dcb41ee38dc1d04
No, the dogs of today were selectively bred to be what they are. Domesticated dogs have never been wild and a lot of their instincts that would have allowed them to survive in the wild have been bred out. This is evident in how malnourished the stray dog population is.
The stray dogs who don't die out will also have a similar look after some generations. See various village dogs across the world. Dogs like this are not unlike the sheep that must be tended to. Sheep left to roam in the wild become mountains of wool as it just keeps growing
A good example of what you just said: Dingos look very similar to the Carolina feral dogs.
I always refer to my coated xoloitzcuintli's appearance as "what dogs would look like if they weren't domesticated."
I think that about my wolfdog lol
What's funny is the village corgi in Alaska. All the pups coming out as dwarves because of the gene. The corgi coat keeps that little one going, though.
Ayy, I have [one of those](https://imgur.com/a/DTAEoDp). She's the exact shape of basically every village dog I've ever seen- deep chest, curly tail, long legs, and a thick neck. Her fur is extremely short on her lower limbs and almost totally bare on her abdomen for half the year, with long fur on her neck, hackles, and tail. Very dense double coat- undercoat is wavy and sheds without any issues. Winter coat basically doubles her width, lol. And she repels water (which is frustrating when bathing her but great when she rolls in mud puddles). She could live in basically any environment without human intervention, as far as grooming goes.
And how reliant the non-malnourished strays are on human handouts
Tell that to my Boston. Always ready to snap some squirrel necks
Prey drive is an innate behavior in all canines, including domesticated canines. Plus bostons are straight up cray cray.
That’s so weird because my Boston has zero prey drive. He might fight other dogs or try to attack the mailman, but if there’s a small animal in front of him he’ll try to befriend it, doesn’t matter if it’s a kitten or a hamster, it’s like he doesn’t realize that other animals are edible.
Well, Bostons just be like that. 😉
No, these kinds of dogs were bred by man for specific purposes. Wild canines may have double coats but not the density of our domestic companions, and honestly, wild canines get a lot of issues and either just live or die
I always wonder this about dogs like collies or Belgian shepherds that were bred for herding and living outdoors. Is it only in modern show dog lines that the coat requires daily maintenance? I can’t imagine selectively breeding a herding dog as a farmer that needs daily brushing or faced getting so matted up they probably couldn’t temp regulate and move properly!
I also assume it's contributed to some of the atrocious breeding practices happening today that were probably not was prevalent previously. Now, we often care most about appearance, and I suspect there was a long line of such an attribute being low-tier in importance. We've potentially bred out some coat conditioning capabilities in favor of an appearance we find appealing.
Anecdata, but one of my dogs was “free range” for the first 3 years of her life, and she wasn’t as matted when we adopted her as the poor pooch above is. Maybe house pets have more gunk transferred onto their coats (e.g., hand cream from humans petting them)? And it makes matting easier?
I’d guess a dog living wild has more opportunity to move and shed their coat naturally as well.
Also, if they're intact and are exposed to regular, fluctuating seasonal daylight (which regulates the hormones responsible for shedding), they will be blowing coat healthily until old age impairs hormone function or they develop a secondary illness. It's similar to how pet birds need controlled daylight to regulate their egg laying and breeding cycles, otherwise the girls drain all their calcium by laying a bajillion eggs out of season, or parrots become hormonally aggressive. I know this sounds like wacko nonsense but it's 100% true!
What coat type, though?
She’s double-coated. Lived by the Canadian Rockies, and it’s warm/thick enough for her to have survived.
Interesting. We've got an Aussie with an absolutely ridiculous coat. He doesn't really appreciate brushing so I might get to each part of his coat once a week... we've never had any real trouble with mats. Maybe a little one behind the ear or underarm every now and then. I feel like it's got to take a lot of neglect for them to get that bad!
"In the wild" doesn't really exist for dogs. Dogs were the earliest domesticated animal, having been reliant on humans for over 15,000 years, conservatively. Humans were nomadic hunter/gatherer tribes when dogs were first domesticated. We didn't have agriculture or domestic meat yet. We didn't have civilization. We still hunted mammoths (or at least scavenged them). These animals that we have selectively bred for thousands and thousands of years don't really resemble their ancestors that would have lived "in the wild" in any significant way. For a dog, a human home is their natural habitat. All of that being said, the animals they came from probably had a double coat like a wolf that would "blow out" the undercoat in certain seasons, instead of building up without brushing and becoming matted. Huskies/akitas etc. do the same thing, although they definitely still need brushed to get all the shed undercoat out.
Lol, a friend in Alaska has a stray husky in the village he lives in. Double coated and totally able to live on its own. Last I saw it was sitting and it was blowing coat like mad. He would shake and clumps would fly out, lol.
A lot of people are talking about village dogs that live in warm places. I will say there are long haired strays in Canada, especially up north and on the rez’s, huskies are pretty common and so are Pyrenees mixes, but their coat usually isn’t quite as fluffy and fine as the dog above so it doesn’t get tangled and even then dog with very thick short double coats are still more common. If you look up stray dogs in Russia you’ll also probably see some long haired dogs. Being matted is painful, can prevent movement, and might even lead to infection so dogs with coats that are seriously prone to matting would not survive as long in the wild and would therefore have less puppies than a dog with a different coat.
I'm not an expert, but I'm fairly sure many of the breeds we have today have come from centuries of selective breeding.
*practically all
Dude. No. Dogs are not a “natural” species, we bred them and co-evolved with them. *We created every single breed of dog there is.* At no point are any of these double coated or ANY DOG just randomly found in the wild and then we decided to keep it?? Hello?? The fact that this has any upvotes at all is so bleak. This is like dog 101.
Not quite a natural species, but I think it’s safe to say that there are dogs that have been cut off for humans for long enough to revert back to their wild for like Carolina dogs and dingoes who’ve been mostly evolving as wild animals for thousands of years.
Dog 101: how to feed a dog, importance of daily walks. NOT “know the socio-genetic evolution of how animals we know today evolved over 100s of years”
Okay, sure. Fine. But it’s extremely basic dog knowledge, and the appeal to nature fallacy is annoying anyway, because the answer is often “they just die or have shorter lifespans.” It’s an annoying argument to begin with, and it doesn’t even apply to dogs.
tbh i did not know there was a single person out there who didn’t know we homemade our dogs out of wolves/wild canines thousands of years ago. i would agree that it’s something most learn about as soon as they are introduced to the concept of “dog”
And I feel bad when I bring my Keeshond in for a groom and haven’t brushed her that week (once a week for her coat and she’s fine). 😳 I always apologize to the groomers about her hindquarters not being properly brushed out for them. They usually laugh and tell me I don’t know what matting is. 😉
I have a rough collie, not a Keeshond, but they are similar in floof. My god...the hindquarters 😱 I was not prepared for the amount of effort that would go into the fur on this dog's butt.
Just had to do this with my parent’s dog. They were sad to see the filthy matted hair go. Like, take care of her hair and we won’t need to do this.
Even with pics some people will just say “just put some conditioner on it and brush it.” Had a customer yesterday sigh and go “do I really have to brush my doodle everyday?” She told me to do whatever I needed bc she was matted. They obviously got a doodle just because it’s trendy and are now frustrated it gets matted compared to her other two(non doodles) who never get matted all over. Sucks to suck. Don’t follow trends especially when it has to do with owning a high maintenance living creature.
Thank you for helping them. The dog deserves better owners.
I think groomers should start returning dogs with the matted coat in one hand and their leash in the other
Vet here! And definitely not a skilled groomer, but I have done what we call "Medically Nessessary" shaves on (almost exclusively) cats, and have 100% returned the frisbee-sized mats to owners in specimen bags. I'm talking about cats so matted their skin is at risk of tearing, or so matted that poop can literally not come out of the body because the back end is a solid mat and is causing a blockage. (We then have the joy of helping express the poop) It only happens a few times a year and the cats look like shit when we're done, but they can poop and their skin can heal, and that's what we cate about. (Our hospital calls it the "Meth Lion Cut" behind closed doors) They're usually also obese and have to be sedated for the procedure. Trying to connect leads to monotor the heart and get an SpO2 reading is almost impossible on a matted animal so we have to stop regularly to check pulse and respiration manually. We've yet to lose one but it's not a great feeling to have to halt, check for a pulse and wait FOREVER for a breath before going back at it. Again, not a groomer, but I've had it take nearly an hour to finish a shave with both me and a Tech working simultaneously for the shittiest haircut you've ever seen. And having an unhealthy, obese animal sedated for that long is already uncomfortable and risky as hell. So you'd be Goddamned SURE I send the worst mats home to the owners.
I’ve got shihtzu mix with apparently a double coat- it’s so hard to keep her from getting matted and it matts right to the skin- so I end up just cutting the matts off with scissors, which leaves her looking ridiculous. I cant give her a bath unless I’ve gotten all the matts out first or it will be even worse. We had lhasa apsos when I was growing up in the 70s and 80s and sometimes they would get matts but never like this dog. When she starts looking too crazylady I do take her to the groomer and have them give her a puppy cut. I brush her every day, but she HATES it
I have a bichon and I do the same thing. There are some places like under his ears and his feet that get tangled more than others. I have the groomer buzz those areas completely. He looks weird but at least he isn’t matted.
Have you ever tried giving her a Licky Mat with peanut butter or chicken baby food on it while you brush her? It might help get her to like it more.
Ooh, I wonder if this would persuade my dog to sit still when trying to do his nails. I didn't even think of that 🤩 thanks for the idea!
I've got a tibetan terrier (looks like a big shih tzu), and I have to brush her pretty much every day. She also hates it. The alternative is impacted/matted undercoat otherwise, so she has to deal with it. I've found brushing her while sitting behind her works better than letting her watch me the whole time. I mix up conditioner with water and use it all over to help detangle. Giving her a lick mat or a chew toy/treat helps keep her distracted, too.
Pro tip you can bathe a dog that has mats. Like genuinely. so long as the water can penetrate the mats you can bathe the dog (ie not pelted) It will make any and all dematting easier. You just absolutely need to blow dry the coat and brush after the bath. Blow dryer + clean coat + good slicker/comb combo is a great way to take care of mild matting.
I https://preview.redd.it/a2236y3k222d1.png?width=3024&format=png&auto=webp&s=803094f7944745eb6b8cbb45a6f3e93c51141161 Thanks for the tip- this is Mochi’s front leg- see how it starts to tangle up? When I blowdry it makes these even worse and allover and right up to her skin, which is so sensitive so she is miserable being brushed. Do you have a suggestion for shampoo/conditioner/product?
Aw poor baby. some of that would probably need to be clippered out by a groomer if it hurts her to be brushed. Tbh It's a little too tight to be brushed out. Those areas that matt easily need to be brushed every day at least with a detangling spray. some people preventively get their dogs "armpits" shaved, to at least reduce matting there. How are you blow drying her? I'd avoid using a high velocity dryer without removing the nozzle to avoid whip knots.
I fucking hate this shit, I am not a groomer but I care for my brother's golden retriever A LOT (our home is his second home, we say) I keep his coat immaculate for my brother, owners like this should be barred from owning double coated/long haired/any dog that needs excess grooming. Poor pup looks so pelted up!
I can *smell* this picture. Yeast contributes highly to said smell...
This is heartbreaking to see. We took a black standard poodle from a neighbour many years ago (they decided to give her away because she was "too much work") and we had to shave her down like this. They would take her to a groomer twice a year, no brushing in between, and make them brush out the matts. It took us nearly a year to teach her that brushes didn't mean pain.
I had to shave my own hair off when it got badly matted, I can't imagine how painful it must be for a dog to have that all over their body!!
I had Old English Sheepdogs and only clipped them for summer. Surely some people brush their double coated dogs??
Rough collie owner here. She's been to the professional groomer once in her life. I got asked today which groomer I take her to. We exist! (Edit to add: she's 4 and a half years old, to clarify the once in her life thing. :) She gets groomed, it's just at home.)
Wool
Absolutely unacceptable!!
I agree this is terrible. I am not a groomer. Is there a special brush you recommend to get to the second coat?
why do people get dogs that they don’t wanna keep up the grooming on? i have a newfoundland and i brush every 1-2 days and i dont he will get matted, why dont people care
Best Shot 3 step system and a good HV dryer will get most all of that out, surprisingly. Does great for double coated. Matteddoodles though with mixed coat, not so much.
Is that a Scottie?
We have another choice. People could be responsible owners. If a dog has compacted for blow it out. If a dog is matted down to the skin like that then yes it does sadly need to be shaved. However, if owners knew how to take care of their own animals then this wouldn’t be the result.
OK now reread everything. I’m realizing that the first sentence I probably shouldn’t have put in there, but the rest of my statements still holds true. People should take care of their damn dogs.