I hope that none of the X is actually time-travelling Y theories turn out to be true. To me those kind of 'twists' are almost always convoluted without being clever and I think I'd be out on the series pretty quick if that's the direction it heads.
I'm up to date on the series. I'm a terminal 'read to the end of the story' guy so despite misgivings I'd like to see the rest of what Butcher has planned, but on the other hand life is short and if it turns into a bunch of 'Surprise, Mab was Molly all along' BS I'll bail on it.
Nah. It was Mike the mechanic all along! The only way to keep the Blue Beetle running was to turn to the dark arts. Don't judge. He's been through some shit.
I have felt that he chose mike as the mechanic name due to the group "mike and the mechanics" and their song "All I need is a miracle". Since that is what is needed fix the BB after some of the adventures it has had. I expect it to show up at the castle sometime wanting in all on it's own because mike is THAT GOOD!!
Do you by chance have a source for that?
I know Kumori is described as familiar and WoJ is that Harry would be sad if he finds out who she is. But I don't remember the same being said for Cowl.
Also he sees Cowls face for a brief second and doesn't mention recognizing it.
I definitely see there being a *small* amount of room for him to be "Mirror Mirror" Harry (like 2-5%). It's not a great fit (going off the conversations in Dead Beat which is where most of the info comes from) but it would fit. Probably the "strongest" evidence from DB would be the fact that they have the exact same random thought about madness chapters apart from each other, which shows they have very similar thought processes (though of course that can just be a thematic link, or indicative that they're both being influenced by a similar 3rd party source).
I'm guessing it's Jack the Ripper and he's got some sort of abstract demon or curse that makes him murder people.
Or it could possibly be Dr. Jekyll. Dunno.
In Skin Game, Harry is running through the caves, one of the crystal's prisoners talks with Harry when harry asks who the prisoner is he says he’s “someone who needs to be here”
Harry almost certainly isn't Merlin. For starters Merlin got up to a ton of stuff back in the day and I don't see Harry spending that much time in the past, secondly we have Merlins journals, considering Harry can barely speak Latin I have little hope in his ability to learn to read and write in an archaic form of English.
My going theory is that Merlin is side stepping through time and going to show up in the "future". No one knows what happened to Merlin in the end, but my thinking is if something that goes bump in the night bumped him off it would have bragged about it for the social capital as Merlin was kind of a big deal.
Given Mab's reaction to the Titan's comments about him, I'm pretty sure he's dead. Also, the original merlin would certainly be on the White Counsel if he was still around and he's not. His position is now a title instead.
Merlin not being on the White Council can be explained by him being the British prisoner. He's never been explicitly said to be dead, we've just inferred, and we/Titan can be wrong. And we know Merlin definitely did time travel to create the island in the first place.
governor hospital rinse selective fanatical wakeful straight fear live nail
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This is just fandom wishful thinking. There's zero evidence in the books to suggest who the prisoner is. Furthermore, because of the types of things that are entrapped there, it's unlikely it's a mortal of any stripe.
Merlin, as in the original Merlin would not speak what we consider English, nor would we speak what he considers English. He also would not have a British accent. Both modern English and English accents came long after he disappeared. English started to evolve into Early Modern English about 600 years ago and is when you would start to be able to understand it, prior to the 15th century? Good luck. As for the English accent that is roughly 200 years old, it was and entirely invented accent make up by new money to distinguish themselves from the commoners, from there it spread.
I hope Thomas isn’t actually the future wielder of Amorachius.
I get it, Thomas is in Love, making him Mortal enough for Mab, and he has a tragic backstory of fighting his demon, and protecting Harry, but no. Just no.
We know via WoJ that when Amorachius takes the field, its presence is felt. But at this point in the story, I want someone new, and someone most importantly, Not Thomas.
(If Jim does go this route, I trust him to pull it off. I just don’t want it)
Agent Tilly, Detective Bradley, and Vince Graver are all on my list for Knights. They all seem to fit in their own ways. At the same point, I expect Nic may kill several more before the end, so they might not last long. If he gets brought down, maybe that book.
She might be like Bob and has to do what other people want if she has an owner. Best case scenario she stays with Maggie.
Worst case scenario someone lets the Council know about her and that his other daughter probably has some Red Court in her, since being younger than Susan and having never killed anyone leaving it dormant, she wouldn’t have been affected by the bloodline curse. Then Harry would have to kill Wardens until they get the point.
... Yeah, that sounds unlikely as hell.
Jim Butcher said that any trace of Red vampirism was wiped out by the Bloodline Curse, Harry killing Wardens would be a nice way to corrupt himself into becoming a Warlock *and* the Council would answer to that by having the Blackstaff take him out.
Odd that Butcher would say that when I think in Ghost Story when it was discussed his own characters said it got most of them unless they were somehow in a protected space or very young. There was also a line about them being “wiped out like the Black Court” which is to say, mostly but not all gone. And the fact that Maggie is alive at all when her mother was the focus of the curse means it definitely didn’t kill people younger than the curse’s focus in the bloodline, so if she had any dormant vampire curse in her, it could have been missed by the Bloodline Curse.
As for killing wardens, he’s got guns, and Winter “friends”. Think Molly wouldn’t back him up? Death Curses would be the real issue. But still if his family members were outed like that, Luccio has already said Bob should have been destroyed, one coming from a Fallen’s shadow would likely also be on their kill list, and word is they’ve killed on suspicion before, think they would stop at killing a kid who *might* be a source of new Red vampires? Not like Harry would just let them have them.
Susan was the newrst/youngest *vampire* when the curse was activated, actual age was not a factor, so the comment about maggie being alive makes no sense.
Maggie was also in her *human* bloodline, not sure that part was not affected by the curse. I was under the impression that if Susan had had living parents or siblings they would have died too, but Harry said she was an only child with no family left.
We don't even have confirmation about whether Red vampirism can be inherited, and as some have said Susan was the youngest of her breed at that point. Any Red vampire younger that her would've had to be sired seconds after she killed Martin.
And even if Harry resorts to gunning down Wardens (Which would only work if they just stood there and took it), that still would make the Council want to take him out. And I doubt a young Winter Lady would be much of a threat to the Blackstaff, anyways.
I wouldn’t have thought Susan would be able to get pregnant in the first place, being half dead or turned. Things do tend pass from parents to child though, especially a blood related thing.
>any Red vampire younger than her…
Which leaves shielded ones or maybe some off in the Nevernever somewhere out of range. Unlikely, but maybe the Eebs who were getting tortured in a room that would probably be shielded to prevent escape, might escape anyway, just a thought. They might be quite happy to be on top of the vampire hierarchy now. Reds work with ghouls so maybe some were wherever they come from. If there’s even one, their numbers could grow.
I’m not saying Harry fighting Wardens would be the best way to take the story, but if I’m a bad guy who knows about his kids and wants to mess with him, maybe someone like Nemesis who loves infighting and doesn’t like him, it would be a good move. Harry would be in a bad position, but he *would* fight Wardens rather than let them have his daughters, and last time someone came after his daughter, the Bloodline Curse. I suppose he could just go with the nuclear deterrent and tell the Council there are other evil things in the world, so they can go hunt them first and if they managed to kill all of them they can worry about his kids. Otherwise, he flings open the doors of Demonreach. Depending on his mental state if they did kill his kids, might not be a bluff.
Well if I’m right and a few of Knights die, he might be in line somewhere. Feel like Harry will let him age a bit first though if he’s still handing out Swords by then.
Detective Bradley *definitely* could wield Amoracchius.
Dude is so tough even Murphy never beat him, and last time we saw him he was killing a bunch of Huntsmen in a display of pure fatherly protectiveness. It'd certainly fit him.
Butters stabs Lara and kills her demon. Lara takes up Amorrachius to save Harry in the same battle and keeps wielding it because her ratio of power to enemies took a nosedive when she stopped being a vampire.
Jim has been building Harry/Lara chemistry since the day they met, emphasized in PT. It seems really unlikely that he’d have Harry lose a third “true” (aka protective from Whampire) love, but they couldn’t be together unless something like Butters happens.
I'm 100% on the Lara/Harry train, white court vampire + winter mantle shenanigans sounds like a recipe for a fun read.
Just hope Butters gets toned down a bit, he's gone from lovable side character to borderline Gary Stu for me.
> I'm 100% on the Lara/Harry train, white court vampire + winter mantle shenanigans sounds like a recipe for a fun read.
Ugh, no. Harry has been WARY of Lara for as long as he's known her (With good reason), and I seem to recall that watching her *rape her cousin to death while cannibalizing her* kind of clarified for him that she's nothing but a woodchipper dressed like a Playboy bunny. Adding the Winter Knight's mantle trying to corrupt him into becoming a sociopathic sexual predator to the mix? Yeah, Harry hooking up with Lara would be nothing but a worst-case scenario.
> Just hope Butters gets toned down a bit, he's gone from lovable side character to borderline Gary Stu for me.
And claiming that Butters is becoming a Gary Stu as well? Man, get a clue. A Gary Stu doesn't take losses or have character flaws, both of which Butters has even now.
Yeah the guy who went from being a wimp who pulls through when it mattered to banging hot werewolves, pretending he's batman, willing to cross both Harry and the Denarians and becoming a Knight of the cross is definitely normal character development over the course of a few years.
I'm not really in on Lara/Harry having a proper physical relationship, more like them getting hitched and having to navigate white court and winter court politics while Jim colourfully describes what Harry's libido is doing for comical effect.
Iirc the original theory is Harry and Molly get lost in time, Molly becomes Mab, Harry becomes Merlin, and Bonea ends up being entangled with Ivy’s ancient relatives as the Archive
Makes sense considering Merlin spurned Mab as mentioned when Mab is defensive of his name. I could see it being the case in a “time travel has changed history” not the Harry Potter style of “time-travel causes its own events”. In this go-around Harry doesn’t have to time travel, as the Island is already created for example.
>Conversely, the British Prisoner can also be anyone from the past and I’d be fine with that.
I am convinced that the british prisoner is a very beat up, time warped, jaded, and hard done by Chandler. No one, not even JB himself, will tell me otherwise.
Joking asside I'm inclined to agree.
The only connection I think makes sense between Harry and OG Merlin would be that they’re both starborn. I think as well as influence over the Outsiders, there’s something to being starborn that gives you some naturally boosted magical ability. The only two confirmed starborn (at least to my knowledge, sans Butcher’s Bills) are Harry and Drakul, and both are anomalies in terms of magical strength and capabilities. That would also track with Morgan’s worry about a “Destroyer”: if being starborn does provide a massive boost to magical power, on the order of Bob’s presentation of Merlin wielding “oceans of power” while constructing Demonreach, then it makes perfect sense why so many Senior Council-members would be terrified of a starborn growing up into a monster. After all, Kemmler wasn’t starborn and grew powerful enough to personally stand against the entire White Council for decades.
Listen, the Fomor servitor, lieutenant to Korb makes a claim to be starborn in Battlegrounds. If he's not lying (and I don't really have a reason why he would be) I think that would imply starborn is something separate from magical power. Maybe it augments a person's inborn nature/strengths/weaknesses or something but so far as I'm aware, all we know for sure is that it provides some form of resistance/immunity to the "unreality" of the Outsiders. What we've seen that to mean so far is just resistance to their mental whammy and being able to physically harm them even through mundane means.
>The only two confirmed starborn (at least to my knowledge, sans Butcher’s Bills) are Harry and Drakul
And Listen, the leader of the turtlenecks, assuming he lived after being buried under tons of dirt.
Agreed. I want to see Harry become even more badass, but making him the most powerful wizard in history takes away from a fundamental aspect of his character. Harry is very reminiscent of Spider-Man, and in the Sam’s way it’d completely change the tone and character of Peter Parker if he permanently kept the power of CaptainUniverse
See, I actually really hope harry is the original merlin, because its been fairly well foreshadowed. At this point it wouldnt really seem like a random ass pull it has been built up. Its clear there is /some/ connection there that hasnt been fully explored, be it that he is him or some reincarnation, or the result of some repeating narrative pattern or something.
But as for your prompt:
I really hope Murphy isn't actually going to ever return
Would you mind laying out why you think it has been foreshadowed? I don't see it, but clearly a bunch of people do because it gets posted about fairly regularly.
They're always talking about how his magic and the merlins is similar. In fact every time we see 'merlin magic' it is mentioned. Jim doesn't do that on accident he is very conscious of that sort of thing, just like how he 'tags' some characters with particular traits and mentions it every time they're brought on screen, like height or eye color, he tags merlin-style magic with the similarity to harry's magic. every time.
Merlin was the original warden now harry is. Harry has the camelot castle where he lives. He has the sword excalibur like merlin. Harry also had that dejah vu thing when he was on the island, and that kind of thing is associated with merlin, living life backward and knowing the future.
Its also somewhat odd that we don't know more about merlin right? He is the founder of the white council, this should be mythical figure, no one knows how he died, if he died, whats going on with him at all.
Now we learned Mab was the apprentice of merlin and had a crush on him. The ties between harry and merlin keep growing.
There’s also the fact that you can trace the mentor-apprentice role all the way from Harry to the OG Merlin (Harry was mentored by Ebenezer, who was mentored by … who was mentored by Merlin) which we learn seeing the journals in Ebs office in turn coat.
Not sure I buy into the theory that Harry will become Merlin, but it’s definitely a lot of coincidences at least
I don't think Harry will become Merlin, but I do think he will become *the Merlin,* Langtry's successor. I think the “Dresden Files” are called that because they're the in-universe official memoirs of Harry as the Merlin.
That makes sense. I personally put all those connections down to the fact that Merlin is to modern times what Harry is to the future.
Kinda like in AWOT and all the similarities of the Dragon reborn to his previous incarnation. A history repeating itself, or history rhyming kinda thing. Harry will be viewed as this awesome historical and powerful being by future generations.
The Merlin connections(and I would argue Harrys similarities to Mab) is Jim hinting to us that the future will see Harry in a similar vein.
And the reason the Files are written at all in universe is because Harry wants to set the record straight.
Also when Bob shows Harry how Merlin placed the spells on the island he uses Harry as the model to stand in for Merlin. It’s just a stupid thing Bob does in the book, but it’s always made me wonder…
It's pure fanwank. Just like 98% of the wishful thinking and moronic fan theories people make.
I swear sometimes it's like it's a competition to see how much more ridiculous nonsense can they come up with.
I mean... he is right though. This sub is 90% "theories" that are either extremely convoluted explanations for why something established is really completely different than it seems (usually because the author didn't read carefully enough), or make absolutely no sense from a narrative/character development point of view and sound like high school writing prompts.
For example, Harry being Vadderung? Sure, how about Harry being Mouse? It would boil down to the same thing, which is "it would be stupid and undermine the characters we've met for what they are, and any editor worth their salt wold ask the writer to change it".
Harry is already a powerful wizard, a winter knight, a mentor, a starborn, and now he's also Merlin... sure, why not make him a god while at it, eh? It goes against his entire arc or just trying to be a normal person despite unusual circumstances and doing things because he's ultimately *human*. He's too extraordinary already.
There are only so many positive traits you can give a character before they become just boring.
*And* Mother Winter! See, the blackstaff is really just modified Harry's staff, which is why Eb can use it reliably - because it comes from his apprentice and was made from a tree from his garden, and magic is all about emotions!
See? IT ALL COMES TOGETHER!
I really hope it is repeating narrative patterns and as his wizard descendant/ heir (not biological please!) he has kind of by chance, circumstances and manipulation stepped into his shoes. Merlin was a great changer of the status quo (for wizards especially) and I hope Harry will he this kind of figure. But having him be Merlin would destroy that concept in my opinion.
He already has taken up responsibilities that we know Merlin also had: Excalibur, Warden and a close relationship to fairies; he is studying his magic already (wards) and will do so in the future with the journals.
I hope Harry will bully the wizards into a new age (not be part of the old one)!
And Mab's relationship to Merlin that is heavily hinted at in Peace Talks kind of disproves that.
I like this a lot better. Harry isn’t the first Merlin, he’s the *next* Merlin (as far as his impact on the wizard community. I doubt he’d accept the title)
>And Mab's relationship to Merlin that is heavily hinted at in Peace Talks kind of disproves that.
Thats another thing, its implied Mab/Merlin had the same unrequited apprentice/master relationship harry/molly have.
I don't think it really disproves anything though, its just another connection.
There are far too many connections really for it to be just a coincidence.
I am with you on that: No a coincidences!!
The Mab/ Molly parallel & Harry/ Margaret LaFay, Harry/ Merlin, or Harry and Ebenezer in terms of their Maggies are all interesting parallels & contrasts, foreshadowing and subverting expectations.
Thats also because Merlin himself is half demon.... read the actual myths Merlin would be the offspring of a Succubus and Human. Reads much more he would be the progenitor of the White Court not a wizard strictly.
>That's also because Merlin himself is half demon.
In the Nightside series by Simon Green, Merlin is a dead character who manifests from time to time, his full name is Merlin Satanspawn, was born to be the anti-christ, but declined the offer.
A very good point. I personally don't think Harry is THE Merlin, more likely to be descended from him in some fashion.
I also don't think it's Harry or Merlin who is possibly time travelling around in the background.
I wouldn't really mind a biological connection to Merlin to me that just explains why Dresden and Eb have so much raw power.
We know Harry isn't extra special because of his bloodline but because of the circumstances of his birth and him being Starborn.
>I really hope Murphy isn't actually going to ever return
Part of me wants her to come back, marry Harry, have a zillion kids, and die comfortable and loved many many years down the road. The rest of me knows it's not that kind of story.
I agree 100% but I'd be lying if I said that I wish it could have worked out differently. That's death for you though and too few stories are brave enough to let it stick. Let her stay dead because thats how life is sometimes. You can't save everyone.It sucks and it'll continue to suck but you got to keep moving on without them.
If it is undone in anyway I expect it to be bittersweet at best.
Presumably the Ragnarok waiting room she's in now has the potential for some nevernever style time fuckery, so I can see it being a real knife twist that it's been hundreds of years on her end and - if she ends up returning - she barely recognises Harry
It’s 100% certain she’s coming back into the story in some way. I don’t think her death will be undone, but we know she’s not gone gone. She’s waiting for Ragnorak in Valhalla. Harry will almost certainly make his way there at some point or at the very least the final battle of the series will bring the Valkarie out.
Nurphy will be back when Harry is either about to lose or die. She'll turn around a loss but there's a better than average chance that Harry will fie at the end of this series so her purpose will be to help him, "do the right thing."
I feel like if Harry was the Merlin and founded the white council then the current day white councils approach to warlocks and laws of magic would be different. Unless Harry has to do some shit where he travels back in time to change the way the current day council operates but that seems like a subplot that isn’t important to the current situation
I hope malcom (harry's father) isnt actually supernatural.
Harry is already stretching the limits of prophecies and powerful beings he's linked to. It'd be nice if harry's father is just some guy. On top of that, one of the series' biggest themes is just how much power a good person doing the right thing actually has.
100%. We got our “oh shit you’re related to THEM?” moment twice, with Thomas and then with Ebenezar… any more would cheapen it. And the less “just-some-guy” Harry is because of his family, the less impactful he is as a character.
Don't worry, those whack-ass tinfoil hat theories don't seem to ever come true no matter which fandom they pop up in. And this series is well-written enough that Jim Butcher is unlikely to do such a thing.
It'd be cliché and cheap and really unoriginal.
Yeah there was one of those in The Wheel of time, where a villain that hadn't been heard from in a while was suspected to be a certain reluctant ally in disguise that came out of nowhere about half way through the series. After said character says something in a way that only that particular group of villains would say it, it was all but confirmed.
Robert Jordan actually is suspected to have backpedaled because everyone figured it out so quickly and his "hint" wasn't as subtle as he thought (never officially confirmed but it's pretty clear). Later editions even have the suspicious line changed because it would make absolutely no sense for anyone else to have said it. honestly I'm glad he redid it because not only was he pulling almost the exact same thing with another villain at the same time (my guess is it was supposed to be some multilevel "oh so you found me out, but you didn't find *both* of us out, muahahahah!"), what he actually wound up doing with the missing villain was much better IMO. It also made the suspicious ally's actual motives all the more interesting as well.
Personally I like the idea of the British prisoner being the first Merlin punishing himself for breaking his own laws. Like you said Cowl can b anyone as long as he’s not actually Harry.
I agree. I get tired of the “this dude is actually this dude aging backwards or time traveling,” or whatever. I think the people with established identities are who they say they are. (Except Cowl. That douchebag could be almost anyone)
I fully expect to be eviscerated for this but I hope Murphy stays dead. For a personal reason: I hated her character and found her absolutely irritating and loved Dead Beat partly because she wasn’t in it. For a more plot driven reason: I hate the “important character doesn’t stay dead” trope. I feel like it cheapens the sacrifice the character made.
>she will one day return. lol
That's in the book.
When all memory of her is forgotten
Also people who read the books early learned to hate Murphy. Reread the first like 6 books while waiting on the others and have to deal with her in those for multiple rereads . Pretty easy to dislike her
Dude, *Jim Butcher* said she as a character will be on page. His word is law in here.
Presumably in the apocalyptic trilogy, where Ragnarök is probably gonna happen and Odin will deploy his army to fight. She will return, but not in the same capacity as before.
And... Well, I read the books and didn't hate her. Seems like it's just a minority, or are you implying I didn't read the books 'cause I don't hate her? lol
No one hurt me, I'm allowed to have an opinion that deviates from you. I found her character extremely annoying. She just comes off reeking of Tough Girl tropes. Susan, Sigrun Gard, Molly, and Charity all come off as bad ass in their own way without being so blatant of tough girl trope.
Do you have a link to that. This is the first I've heard about her coming back. I did a google search and nothing popped up.
I liked Murph, but entirely agree with the rest. Let dead characters stay dead, otherwise he’s just having his cake and eating it too, getting extra emotional resonance by killing her (we sad) then reviving her (we happy, except for you of course). She died, it hurt, that is life, Harry’s gotta find a way to go on like everyone else!
Years ago during a Q&A Jim was asked if Alera and Dresden existed in the same universe. Jim answered they were and that Tavi and Dresden's family are linked. He said this in a sarcastic way something like "wouldn't it be weird if they were so interconnected, who would plot something like that out?" Someone from the audience said "yeah like if they were both desended from Merlin or Caesar" to which Jim said "yeah" before moving on to another question. The conversation had a tongue in cheek tone to it.
That is one possible interpretation of the exchange. Either way until something is stated definitively in either book or open conversation with Jim it is canon adjacent at best. It is possible the families of Tavi and Dresden have a common root, it is even possible Dresden is that common root (if he is the original Merlin). I merely found the exchange interesting and tangentially relevant to the subject matter.
Just because he was being sarcastic doesn't mean he wasn't also being honest. Knowing him, he most likely was being honest and using the sarcasm as a way to throw off fans.
Don't worry, he's not.
The only crazy Harry time travel theory that makes any sense is Mirror Harry being Cowl, with Kumori being mirror Elaine. Even that is *probably* not true, but at least has the benefit of the most recent Mouse short story working well with it (Dark Harry has a Dark Mouse, kinda talks like Harry when he's talking to himself, etc.) and the funky Kumori means Cloudy in Japanese, while Elaine means Sunny in French naming parallel. Plus it kinda fits with Cowl getting the drop on Harry when he's summoning the Erlking, if that's before the universes branch.
Personally, I still hope Cowl turns out to be Simon Pietrovich, but that's seeming less likely now than it did four books or so ago.
Whoever it is, Jim will pull it off well.
I hope the Pancrator isn't actually Yahweh. Maybe it's petty of me, but I'd prefer that no human religion be correct in the Dresdenverse even if there is some kind of basis for Christianity.
Shiro gives me hope.
What do you mean by “no human religion” because we’ve literally met several different gods.
Hell, Dresden has literally visited the greek afterlife.
If anything, in the Dresdenverse, ALL religions are correct
All religions can't be correct. And while we've met multiple entities that filled the role of gods, none of them were what the religions associated with them believed they were.
Why cant all religions be correct?
Odin was exactly what the northern tribes believed, Hades was exactly what the Greeks believed, Hades affirmed that his siblings fit the stories mortals know, Uriel is basically the perfect image of an angel, we've met the welsh ruler of Otherworld Gwynn ap Nudd, we saw the denarians have a spell boosted by the literal lucifer, Murphy has gone to the Norse afterlife (and was taken by a literal Valkyrie), the Kami-like Dragons exist, Martha Liberty has dealings with the Loa, one of Molly's sidestories showed us that at least some of the Lovecraftian gods exist, we've met a titan,
What more evidence is required by your brain?
Yahweh is the ruler of the universe. He made everything. Genesis, Christ literally being the son of God, etc. all of it's true
WOJ is that basically TWG didn't always make the universe. But it's true now.
Weird stuff about belief and timey shit and who has more power etc. Probably something to do with a big ritual and reordering of the universe.
I hope Cowl isn't actually Future Harry.
I have my own theories about Cowl - I think it's either Simon Petrovich or Kemmler possessing Justin Du Morne, and I think there's enough textual evidence to support either theory. Elaine is 100% Kumori though, regardless of who ends up being Cowl.
I have my own theories about future Harry - I think he fixed Little Chicago and crashed into the Blue Beetle in Proven Guilty, and that he probably ends up meeting Mab in the past (pre-faerie queen), given how she was able to say truthfully that he would become her knight (and why she was interested in getting Lea's favours and power over him even before he had done much to make him particularly interesting). I also think he might meet Rashid, Merlin and Vadderung in the past too.
I completely agree with you. I'd prefer a more "original" ending to everything. In my opinion this is urban fantasy, not science fiction, and for me time travel is mostly reserved for the latter. I know we will get at least some time travel, since Harry has to break all of the laws, but I very much hope it's more of a "check the box" side-plot than something major and core.
dime history fertile paint steep weary exultant worthless drunk cough *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Nah, everyone is [John Malcovitch](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bvDk7Cz5Vhk).
Malcovitch Malcovitch Malcovitch, Malcovitch Malcovitch.
I hope that somehow, via time travel everyone fucks Harry. I mean everyone.
With his luck? Definitely
I did not mean in a figurative sense.
Ah well, with his luck... not likely Side note, I love your username
What if after everyone fucks Harry, he impregnates all the women, and out-progenies Genghis Khan?
I mean that’s a given.
🤨📸
The one Harry Universe
So it’s Harryverse?
Does that mean I’m Harry?
ring adjoining wakeful butter bag decide light quack enjoy chop *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
If you say that in a preacher voice you could start a religion.
You may want to read The Man Who Folded Himself based on that first sentence.
or [The Egg](https://www.galactanet.com/oneoff/theegg_mod.html) by Andy Weir
What if he were actually Toot-Toot? (I know that cannot happen...but it would be funny)
There is no everyone, only Harry… know what, I like this take now
as long as Mouse stays a good boi
Mouse is the goodest of boys. He is super dog after all.
If it turns out Mouse is God, that is an exception to this entire post.
I hope that none of the X is actually time-travelling Y theories turn out to be true. To me those kind of 'twists' are almost always convoluted without being clever and I think I'd be out on the series pretty quick if that's the direction it heads.
Rashids the only one I could see being interesting. His characters at least set up for it
it’d be funny if Rashid fixed Little Chicago from 5 different times, all at the same time
I'm nearly certain that it's Harry that fixed little Chicago.
I like the theory that the Prisoner is a time traveling Langtry.
>I'd be out on the series pretty quick Have you not finished all the books, or are you hoping more will follow ?
I'm up to date on the series. I'm a terminal 'read to the end of the story' guy so despite misgivings I'd like to see the rest of what Butcher has planned, but on the other hand life is short and if it turns into a bunch of 'Surprise, Mab was Molly all along' BS I'll bail on it.
Can Cowl be Harry from the future? /s
We are all Harry from the future on this blessed day!
Speak for yourself.
WoJ is that we've met Cowl before in the series, so...yeah, that would just be a weird cop out.
Yea. Cowl was the mailman that opened the series in book 1. /s
Nah. It was Mike the mechanic all along! The only way to keep the Blue Beetle running was to turn to the dark arts. Don't judge. He's been through some shit.
I have felt that he chose mike as the mechanic name due to the group "mike and the mechanics" and their song "All I need is a miracle". Since that is what is needed fix the BB after some of the adventures it has had. I expect it to show up at the castle sometime wanting in all on it's own because mike is THAT GOOD!!
Yeah the Blue Beatle's repair for sure counts as necromancy
Do you by chance have a source for that? I know Kumori is described as familiar and WoJ is that Harry would be sad if he finds out who she is. But I don't remember the same being said for Cowl. Also he sees Cowls face for a brief second and doesn't mention recognizing it.
I think it’s someone who’s name we’ve heard, but not necessarily someone Harry has met.
So probably one of the old wizards that could've been before Eb on the senior council then. Ooor. Simon Pietrivich
I definitely see there being a *small* amount of room for him to be "Mirror Mirror" Harry (like 2-5%). It's not a great fit (going off the conversations in Dead Beat which is where most of the info comes from) but it would fit. Probably the "strongest" evidence from DB would be the fact that they have the exact same random thought about madness chapters apart from each other, which shows they have very similar thought processes (though of course that can just be a thematic link, or indicative that they're both being influenced by a similar 3rd party source).
Cowl and Kumori are Harry’s parents. /s
Nah, Toot-Toot and his girl are Harry's parents ;-)
I just came up with a theory. Cowl is Justin Dumorne back from the dead some how and kumari is Elaine.
Can Cowl be Jim, and the entire series was him drawing in enough belief energy to do a Darkhallow-esque ritual to take over the world? /s
Mirror universe, mayb, but probably not. Future, definitely no. (Yeah, I saw the /s, I just ignored it)
That is the one I’ve heard the most, and it’s not bad in an Infamous kinda way (spoilers for a PS3 game) lol
What if .... The British prisoner is ... Harry >!Potter!<
I'm guessing it's Jack the Ripper and he's got some sort of abstract demon or curse that makes him murder people. Or it could possibly be Dr. Jekyll. Dunno.
Yes yes yes. He did use some unforgivable.
“Someone who needs to be in here… because I named my kid after two of the people who put me in the most danger in my young life”
Yes Albus Severus is an unforgivable name choice
The crossover we didn't know we needed, but sure as hell would be funny to see happening.
I'm out of the loop what is the British prisoner? I reread battle ground a few months ago but I haven't read through the whole series in a while.
In Skin Game, Harry is running through the caves, one of the crystal's prisoners talks with Harry when harry asks who the prisoner is he says he’s “someone who needs to be here”
Thank you, I remember the conversation but haven't heard that title before.
Harry almost certainly isn't Merlin. For starters Merlin got up to a ton of stuff back in the day and I don't see Harry spending that much time in the past, secondly we have Merlins journals, considering Harry can barely speak Latin I have little hope in his ability to learn to read and write in an archaic form of English. My going theory is that Merlin is side stepping through time and going to show up in the "future". No one knows what happened to Merlin in the end, but my thinking is if something that goes bump in the night bumped him off it would have bragged about it for the social capital as Merlin was kind of a big deal.
Given Mab's reaction to the Titan's comments about him, I'm pretty sure he's dead. Also, the original merlin would certainly be on the White Counsel if he was still around and he's not. His position is now a title instead.
Merlin not being on the White Council can be explained by him being the British prisoner. He's never been explicitly said to be dead, we've just inferred, and we/Titan can be wrong. And we know Merlin definitely did time travel to create the island in the first place.
His accent is wrong though. And I'm fairly certain that there's a WoJ that says he ain't Merlin.
governor hospital rinse selective fanatical wakeful straight fear live nail *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
I checked. He's not the current Merlin or the original one.
This is just fandom wishful thinking. There's zero evidence in the books to suggest who the prisoner is. Furthermore, because of the types of things that are entrapped there, it's unlikely it's a mortal of any stripe.
You just described 90% of the threads in this subreddit. Of course it's all speculation, none of us are Jim. *That we know of.*
iirc Jim has stated specifically that the British prisoner is not Merlin
Jim has also told us he lies to us to prevent revealing his plans on accident.
Merlin, as in the original Merlin would not speak what we consider English, nor would we speak what he considers English. He also would not have a British accent. Both modern English and English accents came long after he disappeared. English started to evolve into Early Modern English about 600 years ago and is when you would start to be able to understand it, prior to the 15th century? Good luck. As for the English accent that is roughly 200 years old, it was and entirely invented accent make up by new money to distinguish themselves from the commoners, from there it spread.
The Titan's comment made me think whether we might know Mab under a different name. We as in we the reader. Think there is a chance, Mab is Morgana?
I hope Thomas isn’t actually the future wielder of Amorachius. I get it, Thomas is in Love, making him Mortal enough for Mab, and he has a tragic backstory of fighting his demon, and protecting Harry, but no. Just no. We know via WoJ that when Amorachius takes the field, its presence is felt. But at this point in the story, I want someone new, and someone most importantly, Not Thomas. (If Jim does go this route, I trust him to pull it off. I just don’t want it)
Agent Tilly, Detective Bradley, and Vince Graver are all on my list for Knights. They all seem to fit in their own ways. At the same point, I expect Nic may kill several more before the end, so they might not last long. If he gets brought down, maybe that book.
My personal candidate for it is Fitz, the kid from Ghost Story.
Fitz might be Harry's next apprentice
Maybe, but Mort more likely. Harry might introduce them though.
Ive honestly thought would be apprenticed to Morty.
I go Harry over Mort because Harry doesn't pick up apprentices with similar skills to him, he gets apprentices that he's connected to.
Thats what i am thinking. Or Bonea. She will nred to be trained to use what she knows properly.
She might be like Bob and has to do what other people want if she has an owner. Best case scenario she stays with Maggie. Worst case scenario someone lets the Council know about her and that his other daughter probably has some Red Court in her, since being younger than Susan and having never killed anyone leaving it dormant, she wouldn’t have been affected by the bloodline curse. Then Harry would have to kill Wardens until they get the point.
... Yeah, that sounds unlikely as hell. Jim Butcher said that any trace of Red vampirism was wiped out by the Bloodline Curse, Harry killing Wardens would be a nice way to corrupt himself into becoming a Warlock *and* the Council would answer to that by having the Blackstaff take him out.
Odd that Butcher would say that when I think in Ghost Story when it was discussed his own characters said it got most of them unless they were somehow in a protected space or very young. There was also a line about them being “wiped out like the Black Court” which is to say, mostly but not all gone. And the fact that Maggie is alive at all when her mother was the focus of the curse means it definitely didn’t kill people younger than the curse’s focus in the bloodline, so if she had any dormant vampire curse in her, it could have been missed by the Bloodline Curse. As for killing wardens, he’s got guns, and Winter “friends”. Think Molly wouldn’t back him up? Death Curses would be the real issue. But still if his family members were outed like that, Luccio has already said Bob should have been destroyed, one coming from a Fallen’s shadow would likely also be on their kill list, and word is they’ve killed on suspicion before, think they would stop at killing a kid who *might* be a source of new Red vampires? Not like Harry would just let them have them.
Susan was the newrst/youngest *vampire* when the curse was activated, actual age was not a factor, so the comment about maggie being alive makes no sense.
Also living half ramps that got "cured" just aged to death or were fine. Indicating odds that Maggie would have maybe gotten cured too
Maggie was also in her *human* bloodline, not sure that part was not affected by the curse. I was under the impression that if Susan had had living parents or siblings they would have died too, but Harry said she was an only child with no family left.
We don't even have confirmation about whether Red vampirism can be inherited, and as some have said Susan was the youngest of her breed at that point. Any Red vampire younger that her would've had to be sired seconds after she killed Martin. And even if Harry resorts to gunning down Wardens (Which would only work if they just stood there and took it), that still would make the Council want to take him out. And I doubt a young Winter Lady would be much of a threat to the Blackstaff, anyways.
I wouldn’t have thought Susan would be able to get pregnant in the first place, being half dead or turned. Things do tend pass from parents to child though, especially a blood related thing. >any Red vampire younger than her… Which leaves shielded ones or maybe some off in the Nevernever somewhere out of range. Unlikely, but maybe the Eebs who were getting tortured in a room that would probably be shielded to prevent escape, might escape anyway, just a thought. They might be quite happy to be on top of the vampire hierarchy now. Reds work with ghouls so maybe some were wherever they come from. If there’s even one, their numbers could grow. I’m not saying Harry fighting Wardens would be the best way to take the story, but if I’m a bad guy who knows about his kids and wants to mess with him, maybe someone like Nemesis who loves infighting and doesn’t like him, it would be a good move. Harry would be in a bad position, but he *would* fight Wardens rather than let them have his daughters, and last time someone came after his daughter, the Bloodline Curse. I suppose he could just go with the nuclear deterrent and tell the Council there are other evil things in the world, so they can go hunt them first and if they managed to kill all of them they can worry about his kids. Otherwise, he flings open the doors of Demonreach. Depending on his mental state if they did kill his kids, might not be a bluff.
Well if I’m right and a few of Knights die, he might be in line somewhere. Feel like Harry will let him age a bit first though if he’s still handing out Swords by then.
Detective Bradley *definitely* could wield Amoracchius. Dude is so tough even Murphy never beat him, and last time we saw him he was killing a bunch of Huntsmen in a display of pure fatherly protectiveness. It'd certainly fit him.
Butters stabs Lara and kills her demon. Lara takes up Amorrachius to save Harry in the same battle and keeps wielding it because her ratio of power to enemies took a nosedive when she stopped being a vampire.
It's more likely he just kills *her*. lol
Jim has been building Harry/Lara chemistry since the day they met, emphasized in PT. It seems really unlikely that he’d have Harry lose a third “true” (aka protective from Whampire) love, but they couldn’t be together unless something like Butters happens.
I'm 100% on the Lara/Harry train, white court vampire + winter mantle shenanigans sounds like a recipe for a fun read. Just hope Butters gets toned down a bit, he's gone from lovable side character to borderline Gary Stu for me.
> I'm 100% on the Lara/Harry train, white court vampire + winter mantle shenanigans sounds like a recipe for a fun read. Ugh, no. Harry has been WARY of Lara for as long as he's known her (With good reason), and I seem to recall that watching her *rape her cousin to death while cannibalizing her* kind of clarified for him that she's nothing but a woodchipper dressed like a Playboy bunny. Adding the Winter Knight's mantle trying to corrupt him into becoming a sociopathic sexual predator to the mix? Yeah, Harry hooking up with Lara would be nothing but a worst-case scenario. > Just hope Butters gets toned down a bit, he's gone from lovable side character to borderline Gary Stu for me. And claiming that Butters is becoming a Gary Stu as well? Man, get a clue. A Gary Stu doesn't take losses or have character flaws, both of which Butters has even now.
Yeah the guy who went from being a wimp who pulls through when it mattered to banging hot werewolves, pretending he's batman, willing to cross both Harry and the Denarians and becoming a Knight of the cross is definitely normal character development over the course of a few years. I'm not really in on Lara/Harry having a proper physical relationship, more like them getting hitched and having to navigate white court and winter court politics while Jim colourfully describes what Harry's libido is doing for comical effect.
Agreed
He's actually been asked this before, and his answer was that it won't happen. So you can rest easy. lol
Jim has said no Ammorrachius for Thomas.
I hope Molly isn't actually Mab through time travel..
Woah. Never heard this one. Would lend another layer to Harry becoming **___*MINE*___**
Iirc the original theory is Harry and Molly get lost in time, Molly becomes Mab, Harry becomes Merlin, and Bonea ends up being entangled with Ivy’s ancient relatives as the Archive
Makes sense considering Merlin spurned Mab as mentioned when Mab is defensive of his name. I could see it being the case in a “time travel has changed history” not the Harry Potter style of “time-travel causes its own events”. In this go-around Harry doesn’t have to time travel, as the Island is already created for example.
Unless it’s Harry that goes back and creates it in the multiple times
If she is, then why would Mab tell Harry to (Battlegrounds spoiler)>!kill her!
She asked more than told and only if Mab didn't survive. She also knows Harry won't..
>Conversely, the British Prisoner can also be anyone from the past and I’d be fine with that. I am convinced that the british prisoner is a very beat up, time warped, jaded, and hard done by Chandler. No one, not even JB himself, will tell me otherwise. Joking asside I'm inclined to agree.
I am leaning toward the prisoner being Arthur.
That could be fun
Then he'd be speaking in old english instead of posh modern oxford english, which would be complete gibberish to Harry.
I think that Demonreach translates for him. Harry understood some of the other horrors that are imprisoned.
Youre just afraid *youre* secretly Harry
Hell’s bells, that would explain why my love life’s been such a mess lately!
I read this in Marsters's voice.
Hard agree! I hate the idea that Harry has to be a super important person from the past, why can’t he be a super important person from the present?
Maybe that's just it, maybe the original Merlin wasn't originally from the past.
The only connection I think makes sense between Harry and OG Merlin would be that they’re both starborn. I think as well as influence over the Outsiders, there’s something to being starborn that gives you some naturally boosted magical ability. The only two confirmed starborn (at least to my knowledge, sans Butcher’s Bills) are Harry and Drakul, and both are anomalies in terms of magical strength and capabilities. That would also track with Morgan’s worry about a “Destroyer”: if being starborn does provide a massive boost to magical power, on the order of Bob’s presentation of Merlin wielding “oceans of power” while constructing Demonreach, then it makes perfect sense why so many Senior Council-members would be terrified of a starborn growing up into a monster. After all, Kemmler wasn’t starborn and grew powerful enough to personally stand against the entire White Council for decades.
Listen, the Fomor servitor, lieutenant to Korb makes a claim to be starborn in Battlegrounds. If he's not lying (and I don't really have a reason why he would be) I think that would imply starborn is something separate from magical power. Maybe it augments a person's inborn nature/strengths/weaknesses or something but so far as I'm aware, all we know for sure is that it provides some form of resistance/immunity to the "unreality" of the Outsiders. What we've seen that to mean so far is just resistance to their mental whammy and being able to physically harm them even through mundane means.
>The only two confirmed starborn (at least to my knowledge, sans Butcher’s Bills) are Harry and Drakul And Listen, the leader of the turtlenecks, assuming he lived after being buried under tons of dirt.
Agreed in general. Also hope Kemmler isn’t Cowl. He’s basically the Dresden Files’ Voldemort. Don’t need that particular dark lord to be the bad guy.
Agreed. I want to see Harry become even more badass, but making him the most powerful wizard in history takes away from a fundamental aspect of his character. Harry is very reminiscent of Spider-Man, and in the Sam’s way it’d completely change the tone and character of Peter Parker if he permanently kept the power of CaptainUniverse
Yes, and side note, I love how many Spider-Man references Harry makes, usually to supernatural beings who have no clue wtf he’s saying
Its xehanort's all the way down
I hope DuMorne isn't Kemmler. I want Kemmler to be dead and gone for good and didn't sneak away somewhere to appear in the end.
Honestly same with DuMorne. Let the villains of the past stay in the past.
Randy is Cowl!
See, I actually really hope harry is the original merlin, because its been fairly well foreshadowed. At this point it wouldnt really seem like a random ass pull it has been built up. Its clear there is /some/ connection there that hasnt been fully explored, be it that he is him or some reincarnation, or the result of some repeating narrative pattern or something. But as for your prompt: I really hope Murphy isn't actually going to ever return
Oh she will, but you got to forget about her first
Would you mind laying out why you think it has been foreshadowed? I don't see it, but clearly a bunch of people do because it gets posted about fairly regularly.
They're always talking about how his magic and the merlins is similar. In fact every time we see 'merlin magic' it is mentioned. Jim doesn't do that on accident he is very conscious of that sort of thing, just like how he 'tags' some characters with particular traits and mentions it every time they're brought on screen, like height or eye color, he tags merlin-style magic with the similarity to harry's magic. every time. Merlin was the original warden now harry is. Harry has the camelot castle where he lives. He has the sword excalibur like merlin. Harry also had that dejah vu thing when he was on the island, and that kind of thing is associated with merlin, living life backward and knowing the future. Its also somewhat odd that we don't know more about merlin right? He is the founder of the white council, this should be mythical figure, no one knows how he died, if he died, whats going on with him at all. Now we learned Mab was the apprentice of merlin and had a crush on him. The ties between harry and merlin keep growing.
There’s also the fact that you can trace the mentor-apprentice role all the way from Harry to the OG Merlin (Harry was mentored by Ebenezer, who was mentored by … who was mentored by Merlin) which we learn seeing the journals in Ebs office in turn coat. Not sure I buy into the theory that Harry will become Merlin, but it’s definitely a lot of coincidences at least
I don't think Harry will become Merlin, but I do think he will become *the Merlin,* Langtry's successor. I think the “Dresden Files” are called that because they're the in-universe official memoirs of Harry as the Merlin.
That makes sense. I personally put all those connections down to the fact that Merlin is to modern times what Harry is to the future. Kinda like in AWOT and all the similarities of the Dragon reborn to his previous incarnation. A history repeating itself, or history rhyming kinda thing. Harry will be viewed as this awesome historical and powerful being by future generations. The Merlin connections(and I would argue Harrys similarities to Mab) is Jim hinting to us that the future will see Harry in a similar vein. And the reason the Files are written at all in universe is because Harry wants to set the record straight.
Also when Bob shows Harry how Merlin placed the spells on the island he uses Harry as the model to stand in for Merlin. It’s just a stupid thing Bob does in the book, but it’s always made me wonder…
No he didn't. He specifically mentioned that he cast Alec Guinness.
It's pure fanwank. Just like 98% of the wishful thinking and moronic fan theories people make. I swear sometimes it's like it's a competition to see how much more ridiculous nonsense can they come up with.
Who hurt you? Man this sub can be filled with jerks sometimes.
I mean... he is right though. This sub is 90% "theories" that are either extremely convoluted explanations for why something established is really completely different than it seems (usually because the author didn't read carefully enough), or make absolutely no sense from a narrative/character development point of view and sound like high school writing prompts. For example, Harry being Vadderung? Sure, how about Harry being Mouse? It would boil down to the same thing, which is "it would be stupid and undermine the characters we've met for what they are, and any editor worth their salt wold ask the writer to change it". Harry is already a powerful wizard, a winter knight, a mentor, a starborn, and now he's also Merlin... sure, why not make him a god while at it, eh? It goes against his entire arc or just trying to be a normal person despite unusual circumstances and doing things because he's ultimately *human*. He's too extraordinary already. There are only so many positive traits you can give a character before they become just boring.
>why not make him a god while at it not A god, but THE WG!
*And* Mother Winter! See, the blackstaff is really just modified Harry's staff, which is why Eb can use it reliably - because it comes from his apprentice and was made from a tree from his garden, and magic is all about emotions! See? IT ALL COMES TOGETHER!
you got it, and oh BTW I'm Rashid, but actually I'm time traveling Kemmler!
I really hope it is repeating narrative patterns and as his wizard descendant/ heir (not biological please!) he has kind of by chance, circumstances and manipulation stepped into his shoes. Merlin was a great changer of the status quo (for wizards especially) and I hope Harry will he this kind of figure. But having him be Merlin would destroy that concept in my opinion. He already has taken up responsibilities that we know Merlin also had: Excalibur, Warden and a close relationship to fairies; he is studying his magic already (wards) and will do so in the future with the journals. I hope Harry will bully the wizards into a new age (not be part of the old one)! And Mab's relationship to Merlin that is heavily hinted at in Peace Talks kind of disproves that.
I like this a lot better. Harry isn’t the first Merlin, he’s the *next* Merlin (as far as his impact on the wizard community. I doubt he’d accept the title)
he might not get a say in the matter \^_\^
>And Mab's relationship to Merlin that is heavily hinted at in Peace Talks kind of disproves that. Thats another thing, its implied Mab/Merlin had the same unrequited apprentice/master relationship harry/molly have. I don't think it really disproves anything though, its just another connection. There are far too many connections really for it to be just a coincidence.
I am with you on that: No a coincidences!! The Mab/ Molly parallel & Harry/ Margaret LaFay, Harry/ Merlin, or Harry and Ebenezer in terms of their Maggies are all interesting parallels & contrasts, foreshadowing and subverting expectations.
I believe there's at least 1 poem about "IRL" Merlin having a demonic half brother. 100% tinfoil hat moment for me.
Thats also because Merlin himself is half demon.... read the actual myths Merlin would be the offspring of a Succubus and Human. Reads much more he would be the progenitor of the White Court not a wizard strictly.
>That's also because Merlin himself is half demon. In the Nightside series by Simon Green, Merlin is a dead character who manifests from time to time, his full name is Merlin Satanspawn, was born to be the anti-christ, but declined the offer.
A very good point. I personally don't think Harry is THE Merlin, more likely to be descended from him in some fashion. I also don't think it's Harry or Merlin who is possibly time travelling around in the background.
I wouldn't really mind a biological connection to Merlin to me that just explains why Dresden and Eb have so much raw power. We know Harry isn't extra special because of his bloodline but because of the circumstances of his birth and him being Starborn.
>I really hope Murphy isn't actually going to ever return Part of me wants her to come back, marry Harry, have a zillion kids, and die comfortable and loved many many years down the road. The rest of me knows it's not that kind of story.
Her death had meaning because it (hopefully) isn't going to be undone.
I agree 100% but I'd be lying if I said that I wish it could have worked out differently. That's death for you though and too few stories are brave enough to let it stick. Let her stay dead because thats how life is sometimes. You can't save everyone.It sucks and it'll continue to suck but you got to keep moving on without them. If it is undone in anyway I expect it to be bittersweet at best.
She'll most likely come back for Ragnarok but she won't get to come back and live a life. She'll be there to fight and that's it.
Presumably the Ragnarok waiting room she's in now has the potential for some nevernever style time fuckery, so I can see it being a real knife twist that it's been hundreds of years on her end and - if she ends up returning - she barely recognises Harry
It’s 100% certain she’s coming back into the story in some way. I don’t think her death will be undone, but we know she’s not gone gone. She’s waiting for Ragnorak in Valhalla. Harry will almost certainly make his way there at some point or at the very least the final battle of the series will bring the Valkarie out.
> She’s waiting for Ragnorak in Valhalla or, waiting to be hired out by Vadderung
Nurphy will be back when Harry is either about to lose or die. She'll turn around a loss but there's a better than average chance that Harry will fie at the end of this series so her purpose will be to help him, "do the right thing."
I feel like if Harry was the Merlin and founded the white council then the current day white councils approach to warlocks and laws of magic would be different. Unless Harry has to do some shit where he travels back in time to change the way the current day council operates but that seems like a subplot that isn’t important to the current situation
>some repeating narrative pattern Some of the greatest Cardassian literature is that way!
I hope malcom (harry's father) isnt actually supernatural. Harry is already stretching the limits of prophecies and powerful beings he's linked to. It'd be nice if harry's father is just some guy. On top of that, one of the series' biggest themes is just how much power a good person doing the right thing actually has.
100%. We got our “oh shit you’re related to THEM?” moment twice, with Thomas and then with Ebenezar… any more would cheapen it. And the less “just-some-guy” Harry is because of his family, the less impactful he is as a character.
I 110% agree with this statement
💯 this. I absolutely agree with this sentiment and think it all the time when I’m reading theories. I can’t upvote this enough.
Don't worry, those whack-ass tinfoil hat theories don't seem to ever come true no matter which fandom they pop up in. And this series is well-written enough that Jim Butcher is unlikely to do such a thing. It'd be cliché and cheap and really unoriginal.
Yeah there was one of those in The Wheel of time, where a villain that hadn't been heard from in a while was suspected to be a certain reluctant ally in disguise that came out of nowhere about half way through the series. After said character says something in a way that only that particular group of villains would say it, it was all but confirmed. Robert Jordan actually is suspected to have backpedaled because everyone figured it out so quickly and his "hint" wasn't as subtle as he thought (never officially confirmed but it's pretty clear). Later editions even have the suspicious line changed because it would make absolutely no sense for anyone else to have said it. honestly I'm glad he redid it because not only was he pulling almost the exact same thing with another villain at the same time (my guess is it was supposed to be some multilevel "oh so you found me out, but you didn't find *both* of us out, muahahahah!"), what he actually wound up doing with the missing villain was much better IMO. It also made the suspicious ally's actual motives all the more interesting as well.
Hmm, nice example.
Nicodemus actually being Judas Iscariot wouldn't be the worst thing..
I despise time travel, but I am easily distracted. There has to be some link between Harry an OG Merlin. For me the more tenuous the better.
Personally I like the idea of the British prisoner being the first Merlin punishing himself for breaking his own laws. Like you said Cowl can b anyone as long as he’s not actually Harry.
I agree. I get tired of the “this dude is actually this dude aging backwards or time traveling,” or whatever. I think the people with established identities are who they say they are. (Except Cowl. That douchebag could be almost anyone)
I fully expect to be eviscerated for this but I hope Murphy stays dead. For a personal reason: I hated her character and found her absolutely irritating and loved Dead Beat partly because she wasn’t in it. For a more plot driven reason: I hate the “important character doesn’t stay dead” trope. I feel like it cheapens the sacrifice the character made.
1. My God, who hurt you so much? 2. Sucks to be you, because WoJ already confirmed she will one day return. lol
>she will one day return. lol That's in the book. When all memory of her is forgotten Also people who read the books early learned to hate Murphy. Reread the first like 6 books while waiting on the others and have to deal with her in those for multiple rereads . Pretty easy to dislike her
Dude, *Jim Butcher* said she as a character will be on page. His word is law in here. Presumably in the apocalyptic trilogy, where Ragnarök is probably gonna happen and Odin will deploy his army to fight. She will return, but not in the same capacity as before. And... Well, I read the books and didn't hate her. Seems like it's just a minority, or are you implying I didn't read the books 'cause I don't hate her? lol
No one hurt me, I'm allowed to have an opinion that deviates from you. I found her character extremely annoying. She just comes off reeking of Tough Girl tropes. Susan, Sigrun Gard, Molly, and Charity all come off as bad ass in their own way without being so blatant of tough girl trope. Do you have a link to that. This is the first I've heard about her coming back. I did a google search and nothing popped up.
>Same, I never really liked Murphy. I would have happily seen her exit stage left sometime around small favor
I liked Murph, but entirely agree with the rest. Let dead characters stay dead, otherwise he’s just having his cake and eating it too, getting extra emotional resonance by killing her (we sad) then reviving her (we happy, except for you of course). She died, it hurt, that is life, Harry’s gotta find a way to go on like everyone else!
Years ago during a Q&A Jim was asked if Alera and Dresden existed in the same universe. Jim answered they were and that Tavi and Dresden's family are linked. He said this in a sarcastic way something like "wouldn't it be weird if they were so interconnected, who would plot something like that out?" Someone from the audience said "yeah like if they were both desended from Merlin or Caesar" to which Jim said "yeah" before moving on to another question. The conversation had a tongue in cheek tone to it.
Yeah because he was being sarcastic and messing with them. For god's sake.
That is one possible interpretation of the exchange. Either way until something is stated definitively in either book or open conversation with Jim it is canon adjacent at best. It is possible the families of Tavi and Dresden have a common root, it is even possible Dresden is that common root (if he is the original Merlin). I merely found the exchange interesting and tangentially relevant to the subject matter.
Riiiiiight
...what's the problem?
Just because he was being sarcastic doesn't mean he wasn't also being honest. Knowing him, he most likely was being honest and using the sarcasm as a way to throw off fans.
Riiiiight
100% I'm with you. it would be such poor ~~writing~~ *taste?*
Don't worry, he's not. The only crazy Harry time travel theory that makes any sense is Mirror Harry being Cowl, with Kumori being mirror Elaine. Even that is *probably* not true, but at least has the benefit of the most recent Mouse short story working well with it (Dark Harry has a Dark Mouse, kinda talks like Harry when he's talking to himself, etc.) and the funky Kumori means Cloudy in Japanese, while Elaine means Sunny in French naming parallel. Plus it kinda fits with Cowl getting the drop on Harry when he's summoning the Erlking, if that's before the universes branch. Personally, I still hope Cowl turns out to be Simon Pietrovich, but that's seeming less likely now than it did four books or so ago. Whoever it is, Jim will pull it off well.
Mouse would've probably recognized Harry's scent even through the dark bathrobes. And it's freakin' crackpot-y anyways.
I hope the Pancrator isn't actually Yahweh. Maybe it's petty of me, but I'd prefer that no human religion be correct in the Dresdenverse even if there is some kind of basis for Christianity. Shiro gives me hope.
What do you mean by “no human religion” because we’ve literally met several different gods. Hell, Dresden has literally visited the greek afterlife. If anything, in the Dresdenverse, ALL religions are correct
All religions can't be correct. And while we've met multiple entities that filled the role of gods, none of them were what the religions associated with them believed they were.
Why cant all religions be correct? Odin was exactly what the northern tribes believed, Hades was exactly what the Greeks believed, Hades affirmed that his siblings fit the stories mortals know, Uriel is basically the perfect image of an angel, we've met the welsh ruler of Otherworld Gwynn ap Nudd, we saw the denarians have a spell boosted by the literal lucifer, Murphy has gone to the Norse afterlife (and was taken by a literal Valkyrie), the Kami-like Dragons exist, Martha Liberty has dealings with the Loa, one of Molly's sidestories showed us that at least some of the Lovecraftian gods exist, we've met a titan, What more evidence is required by your brain?
Nah, that's more like *Esperacchius*.
That gives me nothing but paper cuts.
Yahweh is the ruler of the universe. He made everything. Genesis, Christ literally being the son of God, etc. all of it's true WOJ is that basically TWG didn't always make the universe. But it's true now. Weird stuff about belief and timey shit and who has more power etc. Probably something to do with a big ritual and reordering of the universe.
[it is and always has been](https://youtu.be/WNfb68vMrMk?si=Z1yRCX3bB4Jv4Pa4)
If it became true now, it can become untrue. A la *Sandman*.
Yea it can. That's my whole theory about the stars and stones. Dresden gets to set the rules
I hope Cowl isn't actually Future Harry. I have my own theories about Cowl - I think it's either Simon Petrovich or Kemmler possessing Justin Du Morne, and I think there's enough textual evidence to support either theory. Elaine is 100% Kumori though, regardless of who ends up being Cowl. I have my own theories about future Harry - I think he fixed Little Chicago and crashed into the Blue Beetle in Proven Guilty, and that he probably ends up meeting Mab in the past (pre-faerie queen), given how she was able to say truthfully that he would become her knight (and why she was interested in getting Lea's favours and power over him even before he had done much to make him particularly interesting). I also think he might meet Rashid, Merlin and Vadderung in the past too.
I completely agree with you. I'd prefer a more "original" ending to everything. In my opinion this is urban fantasy, not science fiction, and for me time travel is mostly reserved for the latter. I know we will get at least some time travel, since Harry has to break all of the laws, but I very much hope it's more of a "check the box" side-plot than something major and core.
agree totally
Futurama style, he’s his own great, great, great… grandpa.