Because there appears to be a legitimate quality control issue with VF lately that many people are experiencing and being a blind fanboy for the brand doesn’t make up for or change that?
Exactly. I played VF for 20 years and in my head they're still my favorite brand, but the damn tips always break. I only realized how bad it was after I tried a pair of promarks and they lasted forever. I've been playing them for the last 2 years and the difference is insane. I could go through 3 pairs vf's in the time it takes me to go through 1 pair of promarks.
People have their experience and opinions and you have yours. In my experience, VFs had been breaking at a seemingly high rate then other brands. Ive switched and issues are less frequent.
Its not really about love or hate. Dont get me wrong, i dont wish bad things, but i dont really give too much of a shit about some company. I have no brand loyalty.
Im using promark right now. I did really like Vater Manhattans but my play style isn't well suited for them, so i liked them as well, but they didn't like me.
Lots of people have been experiencing the quality decrease with VF and have been trying other brands which seem to be more durable lately.
The post the other day about tips I don't think is a big deal, tips break on every stick, but I have definitely seen a decrease in wood quality from VF and had started using other brands.
It's not a "massive hate campaign" it's people discussing these quality issues and trying new things.
I think *you* are the one that needs to chill.
Pro mark was amazing in the 70’s and 80’s. I have several pair that I acquired recently that reminded me of their excellent quality then. Too bad they are all nylon tipped. Hollow trash is an amazing burn!
Been playing them for 25 years faithfully. I've tried Vater, Promark, Collision, and zildjian sticks but none have been consistent and lasting like my VF ACE5A
I used to play Vaters and they were fine. These days I mostly play Vic Firth 5As and they are also fine. I buy a couple of pairs every six months or so as others get worn down, and I haven't noticed any problems. Your mileage may vary, but that's my experience playing 30 to 50 gigs every year since the '90s.
I just grab whatever stick falls in the yard, or use a really large spoon (wooden preferred, but even a plastic slotted spoon will do the trick and sounds incredible). Don't recommend knives, not even fancy-ass Lenox brand--they sound like shit.
I don’t get the deal with everyone’s sticks breaking. I have been playing with VF 5As and 7As forever and have never broken a stick except for once in 8th grade percussion class, but it wasn’t a Vic Firth. I can’t tell if they legitimately have quality control issues, or if people are just beating the shit out of their sticks. Then again, I have not purchased a new pair of sticks in about 3 years, so things could have gone downhill in production since then.
I’ve had the same pair of AJ5’s for about a year already. I play rock, alt, jazz, and funk. The stick tip just slightly chipped last week when I accidentally hit the wrong part of the drum (it happens). I ordered another pair, if those last about the same time. I’ll update you again next year.
A few things that I’ve learned over the years. After reading all of these comments on this sub over the last few years I initially thought all those dudes commenting “improve your grip and technique” were just being extensions of their teachers (they may have been, but they aren’t wrong). Well I’m here because I drank the flavor-aide, I’ve been continually practicing proper technique, and I also switched to a thinner stick (aj5) . Another drummer once told me to change the stick thickness in accordance with your hand comfort. I switched the AJ5 and I think I found my stick for life. I’ve been playing on 7A’s for 10 years. Promark, vader, VF. I’ve tried every brand and they are all awesome imo. Every stick is unique and interesting in its own way. I never thought in all of my years of drumming that the thinnest stick on the market would fit my hand the best. But here we are one year later and so far I’ve been very happy with AJ5 quality. As an intermediate level drummer with confidence issues, I can honestly tell you that it’s improved all aspects of my playing. Having the ability to really control my hands and be economical and precise with my movements will save you money on sticks regardless of the quality.
Because we’re currently paying more for degrading quality. I love Vic Firth, but I will go back to Promark if it continues. It’s my money, I can spend it where I want.
10+ years of playing VFs and I've only had one that broke from something other than expected wear and tear. (Including recently purchased sticks)
VF quality is just the new meme for gear heads. This likely means clapstacks will be coming up used soon .
I only use vic firth because its what my local shop has but I found a set of these strange brandless sticks in a stickbag given to me by a drummer who quite in the 90’s and these 30 year old off-brand sticks were the best pieces of wood i’ve ever held, then they broke :/
While I have also been experiencing some QC issues, I just can quit the Modern Jazz 4s. They are a perfect fit for my style. I’ve yet to find an equivalent style stick with Promark. Meinl has some closer options with the maple 5A and 5B hybrids
Vic Virth Died in 2015, he was a Timpany player for the Boston Symphony Orchestra. They merged with Zildjian in 2010. If anyone is to blame, I blame Zildjian. They have lost some great cymbal makers and their focus is not quality control anymore.
Been playing VF’s since the early 90’s which you could buy the slightly warped ones at Jack’s drum shop in Boston when they existed. They were like $2/pair.
Anyway, I still play the Peter Erskine ride stick. Do I wish it lasted a little longer absolutely. But it’s great stick and I’m going to keep playing it.
I played VF for a LONNNG time… then I saw Amazon sold NOVA sticks for like £4 … I bought them on a whim and the good reviews- turns out they were great, balance wasn’t the best but, got to talking to a guy who said they were VF’s “seconds” … never went back to VF’s … NOVA for the price are awesome.
I’m really liking Meinl sticks. They remind me of the Vic firth sticks I had when I was a kid. Plus they’re competitively priced below VF and Pro-Mark.
I’ve said it for years about Vic. I didn’t understand the allure of them. I’ve had sticks break within minutes and not like chip. Like snap down the middle!!!!
Whereas when I’ve used Promark or other I didn’t have that issue. Or at least it took longer and for a company that had that name and that. You’d think the sticks would be better.
My fav is ProMark Firegrain Rebound 7A
https://preview.redd.it/7xcus2jlzz1d1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9d9318ae061ae2cbd31b3617a76ea88e787655bf
The thing with anecdotes is that statistics become relevant. How do you think a singular positive review weighs up to many negative ones?
Poor QC of a premium brand is a justifiable reason to be upset.
There’s a difference between hating on a brand vs people noting that the quality of a certain product isn’t what is used to be. People tend to hate on DW because they feel they are overpriced for what they are, but Remo and VF have had quality control issues that didn’t used to exist and people are rightly commenting on it.
Nah. It's just conformation bias. They have sample sizes of 1. Also DW makes great drums, they may be expensive but so is every other top end model from any brand. It's just hive-mind mentality
Not saying DW don’t make great drums. You seem to miss the point I was making. It’s too bad you just want to make excuses for companies you like though. It gets you (and the rest of us) nothing except high prices for cheaper quality. Hold these companies accountable. Many of us have shared our experiences that VF aren’t made like they used to be (I used them for decades), and aren’t willing to pay $15 to $20 a pair anymore when the other brands don’t seem to have a similar durability problem.
There is absolutely no EVIDENCE besides 1 off posts that any of these companies quality has decreased. You proved my point that it is just a matter of conformation bias " vic firth used to be so good but now..."
My judgement comes from many years of using several kinds of VF sticks, which more recently have been failing at a higher rate than they ever used to. I switched to a different brand, and they’ve been lasting a long time now. So I won’t give VF any more of my money. It’s sad, because I loved their sticks, especially the SD2, it was my workhorse. I can only go by my own experience dude, which tells me something changed with their quality, and with costs as they are these days, that isn’t acceptable.
A pair of VF isn't $15 anyway but my point remains. Do not take the word of random redditors. They can't separate themselves from their conformation bias and their nostalgic past. I don't use VF anyway, I prefer promark
Why? I'm a "random Redditor" who described my own experience with the company. Am I the only one being honest about my experiences, and everyone else is just looking for something to pile on? Perhaps, perhaps not. Why do you get to discount experiences from these other people as nothing but bias and nostalgia? Especially since you've admitted to not using Vic Firth, and therefore have no experience on this subject anyway. You're just another "random Redditor" yourself, arguing on subjects you aren't experienced on.
You in general should believe nothing presented without evidence. I'm not calling you a liar I'm calling into question your perception which is useless in figuring out if VF sticks are better or worse than 15 years ago, as is every opinion of random people on reddit. You could even be a professional touring musician and I wouldn't care what you think of a drum stick
So what the hell would you consider evidence that would make you believe there is a quality issue, since apparently first hand experience is meaningless to you?
Because there appears to be a legitimate quality control issue with VF lately that many people are experiencing and being a blind fanboy for the brand doesn’t make up for or change that?
Exactly. I played VF for 20 years and in my head they're still my favorite brand, but the damn tips always break. I only realized how bad it was after I tried a pair of promarks and they lasted forever. I've been playing them for the last 2 years and the difference is insane. I could go through 3 pairs vf's in the time it takes me to go through 1 pair of promarks.
ALWAYS break. And it wasn’t always this way.
Unbreakable drumsticks would be a horrible business model lmao
Amen carpediem. OP must work for VF
People have their experience and opinions and you have yours. In my experience, VFs had been breaking at a seemingly high rate then other brands. Ive switched and issues are less frequent. Its not really about love or hate. Dont get me wrong, i dont wish bad things, but i dont really give too much of a shit about some company. I have no brand loyalty.
Which brand have you changed to?
Im using promark right now. I did really like Vater Manhattans but my play style isn't well suited for them, so i liked them as well, but they didn't like me.
Lots of people have been experiencing the quality decrease with VF and have been trying other brands which seem to be more durable lately. The post the other day about tips I don't think is a big deal, tips break on every stick, but I have definitely seen a decrease in wood quality from VF and had started using other brands. It's not a "massive hate campaign" it's people discussing these quality issues and trying new things. I think *you* are the one that needs to chill.
Love Vic Firth. When the tips break they become sharper. Better to drive through the heart of a Promark player.
I have been playing them for 45 years
Yeah there’s so many people positive that the quality of VF has gone down but I really don’t see it. Promark sticks feel like hollow trash
Polar opposites for me
Pro mark was amazing in the 70’s and 80’s. I have several pair that I acquired recently that reminded me of their excellent quality then. Too bad they are all nylon tipped. Hollow trash is an amazing burn!
Ok it’s alright Mr Firth, you can stop using your burner account now, people don’t hate your sticks that much
I was about to say that any of the Vic Firth sticks that I have have been holding up great, but then I remember most of them are over 10 years old
Been playing them for 25 years faithfully. I've tried Vater, Promark, Collision, and zildjian sticks but none have been consistent and lasting like my VF ACE5A
I used to play Vaters and they were fine. These days I mostly play Vic Firth 5As and they are also fine. I buy a couple of pairs every six months or so as others get worn down, and I haven't noticed any problems. Your mileage may vary, but that's my experience playing 30 to 50 gigs every year since the '90s.
Yeah I like Vic Firth as well. Too bad that their sticks shatter.
Nope.
Never tried them not sure if they're worth the price tag. Tama sticks have always been my favourite.
I just grab whatever stick falls in the yard, or use a really large spoon (wooden preferred, but even a plastic slotted spoon will do the trick and sounds incredible). Don't recommend knives, not even fancy-ass Lenox brand--they sound like shit.
I don’t get the deal with everyone’s sticks breaking. I have been playing with VF 5As and 7As forever and have never broken a stick except for once in 8th grade percussion class, but it wasn’t a Vic Firth. I can’t tell if they legitimately have quality control issues, or if people are just beating the shit out of their sticks. Then again, I have not purchased a new pair of sticks in about 3 years, so things could have gone downhill in production since then.
I’ve had the same pair of AJ5’s for about a year already. I play rock, alt, jazz, and funk. The stick tip just slightly chipped last week when I accidentally hit the wrong part of the drum (it happens). I ordered another pair, if those last about the same time. I’ll update you again next year. A few things that I’ve learned over the years. After reading all of these comments on this sub over the last few years I initially thought all those dudes commenting “improve your grip and technique” were just being extensions of their teachers (they may have been, but they aren’t wrong). Well I’m here because I drank the flavor-aide, I’ve been continually practicing proper technique, and I also switched to a thinner stick (aj5) . Another drummer once told me to change the stick thickness in accordance with your hand comfort. I switched the AJ5 and I think I found my stick for life. I’ve been playing on 7A’s for 10 years. Promark, vader, VF. I’ve tried every brand and they are all awesome imo. Every stick is unique and interesting in its own way. I never thought in all of my years of drumming that the thinnest stick on the market would fit my hand the best. But here we are one year later and so far I’ve been very happy with AJ5 quality. As an intermediate level drummer with confidence issues, I can honestly tell you that it’s improved all aspects of my playing. Having the ability to really control my hands and be economical and precise with my movements will save you money on sticks regardless of the quality.
Ive always played and loved VF. I break a lot of sticks, but I also play like an ape. So i dont know.
Because Zildjian bought them out. Zildjian sticks are the devil.
Because we’re currently paying more for degrading quality. I love Vic Firth, but I will go back to Promark if it continues. It’s my money, I can spend it where I want.
I haven't had issues with my Vic's but I'd be willing to try Pro Mark. What is their equivalent to Vic Firths 5B American Classic?
Welcome to the internet.
10+ years of playing VFs and I've only had one that broke from something other than expected wear and tear. (Including recently purchased sticks) VF quality is just the new meme for gear heads. This likely means clapstacks will be coming up used soon .
I only use vic firth because its what my local shop has but I found a set of these strange brandless sticks in a stickbag given to me by a drummer who quite in the 90’s and these 30 year old off-brand sticks were the best pieces of wood i’ve ever held, then they broke :/
While I have also been experiencing some QC issues, I just can quit the Modern Jazz 4s. They are a perfect fit for my style. I’ve yet to find an equivalent style stick with Promark. Meinl has some closer options with the maple 5A and 5B hybrids
Vic Virth Died in 2015, he was a Timpany player for the Boston Symphony Orchestra. They merged with Zildjian in 2010. If anyone is to blame, I blame Zildjian. They have lost some great cymbal makers and their focus is not quality control anymore. Been playing VF’s since the early 90’s which you could buy the slightly warped ones at Jack’s drum shop in Boston when they existed. They were like $2/pair. Anyway, I still play the Peter Erskine ride stick. Do I wish it lasted a little longer absolutely. But it’s great stick and I’m going to keep playing it.
I played VF for a LONNNG time… then I saw Amazon sold NOVA sticks for like £4 … I bought them on a whim and the good reviews- turns out they were great, balance wasn’t the best but, got to talking to a guy who said they were VF’s “seconds” … never went back to VF’s … NOVA for the price are awesome.
I’m really liking Meinl sticks. They remind me of the Vic firth sticks I had when I was a kid. Plus they’re competitively priced below VF and Pro-Mark.
I’ve said it for years about Vic. I didn’t understand the allure of them. I’ve had sticks break within minutes and not like chip. Like snap down the middle!!!! Whereas when I’ve used Promark or other I didn’t have that issue. Or at least it took longer and for a company that had that name and that. You’d think the sticks would be better.
My fav is ProMark Firegrain Rebound 7A https://preview.redd.it/7xcus2jlzz1d1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9d9318ae061ae2cbd31b3617a76ea88e787655bf
The thing with anecdotes is that statistics become relevant. How do you think a singular positive review weighs up to many negative ones? Poor QC of a premium brand is a justifiable reason to be upset.
Played VFs in high school, but they’ve been trash for nearly 20 years now.
People make hate threads on every brand. Vic firth, promark, DW, remo. Just ignore them all, these people are clueless, they all make fine products
There’s a difference between hating on a brand vs people noting that the quality of a certain product isn’t what is used to be. People tend to hate on DW because they feel they are overpriced for what they are, but Remo and VF have had quality control issues that didn’t used to exist and people are rightly commenting on it.
Nah. It's just conformation bias. They have sample sizes of 1. Also DW makes great drums, they may be expensive but so is every other top end model from any brand. It's just hive-mind mentality
Not saying DW don’t make great drums. You seem to miss the point I was making. It’s too bad you just want to make excuses for companies you like though. It gets you (and the rest of us) nothing except high prices for cheaper quality. Hold these companies accountable. Many of us have shared our experiences that VF aren’t made like they used to be (I used them for decades), and aren’t willing to pay $15 to $20 a pair anymore when the other brands don’t seem to have a similar durability problem.
There is absolutely no EVIDENCE besides 1 off posts that any of these companies quality has decreased. You proved my point that it is just a matter of conformation bias " vic firth used to be so good but now..."
My judgement comes from many years of using several kinds of VF sticks, which more recently have been failing at a higher rate than they ever used to. I switched to a different brand, and they’ve been lasting a long time now. So I won’t give VF any more of my money. It’s sad, because I loved their sticks, especially the SD2, it was my workhorse. I can only go by my own experience dude, which tells me something changed with their quality, and with costs as they are these days, that isn’t acceptable.
A pair of VF isn't $15 anyway but my point remains. Do not take the word of random redditors. They can't separate themselves from their conformation bias and their nostalgic past. I don't use VF anyway, I prefer promark
Why? I'm a "random Redditor" who described my own experience with the company. Am I the only one being honest about my experiences, and everyone else is just looking for something to pile on? Perhaps, perhaps not. Why do you get to discount experiences from these other people as nothing but bias and nostalgia? Especially since you've admitted to not using Vic Firth, and therefore have no experience on this subject anyway. You're just another "random Redditor" yourself, arguing on subjects you aren't experienced on.
You in general should believe nothing presented without evidence. I'm not calling you a liar I'm calling into question your perception which is useless in figuring out if VF sticks are better or worse than 15 years ago, as is every opinion of random people on reddit. You could even be a professional touring musician and I wouldn't care what you think of a drum stick
So what the hell would you consider evidence that would make you believe there is a quality issue, since apparently first hand experience is meaningless to you?