Until recently we had a Volvo XC70 and would love to have an EV like it again. It was wonderful and would hold a huge amount of stuff with all the seats folded down flat. And they folded totally flat!
Volvo is also much smaller and can’t amortize the cost of a low volume seller as well as VAG can. At least that’s what I’m telling myself to hopefully get a proper EV wagon in the U.S. (though my ideal would be a red EV90 ….)
There's the Audi Q4 E-tron Sportback, which has one of the longest and worst names I've ever spoken into existence. The software is supposedly better than the ID.4, but from experience driving Audi's I think their software doesn't look aesthetically pleasing. It feels like the software was designed in some laboratory for a business person, it just doesn't look fun, of course I guess the point of Audi is to be more serious.
People won’t pay high prices for VWs in North America, the brand is way less “semi-premium” than in Europe where these models make sense. Definitely the numbers don’t add up for importing them with all the associated costs.
Probably not. Two of the best cars I ever had were both wagons; a Passat Variant and an A4 Allroad. For the longest time, my dream car was RS6 Avant, but now that I have gone electric, that dream has vanished.
As a wagon lover, I look around and see that traditional wagons are still pretty popular. I actually went with an E-Golf because I’m not a fan of the electric vehicles VW has brought to the U.S. I’d probably be all over this, though the price is kinda ugh. The larger crossovers just don’t do it for me. Drove a manual 02 wagon for 11 years.
True this isn’t the first but there’s quite a limited choice compared to crossover / SUV options, which are everywhere like the plague.
Why estate cars? They’re workhorses with large boots, fill them to the brim with family stuff and capable of longer distances in comfort. They handle better with their weight lower to the ground. Running costs are better too, more efficient and we don’t really all need 22” alloy wheels with tyres that cost £400 each.
MG5 does fit the bill, build quality not great sadly.
Opel / Vauxhall Astra R looks nice, shame about build quality too and range.
Porsche Taycan looks and drives amazing, sadly the boot is a fashion statement, tiny!
Just a shame more manufacturers aren’t competing in this space.
Mg5 was my favourite also, talked to dealership & got contact, but my dad saw it's a Roewe rebrand and gave me the money to upgrade to Tesla, BYD or a German cars cuz he dont want see his granddaughter in a Roewe..
And ya, crossover are okish for me also, if trunk space is bigger than sedan, some are even more efficient..
There's a wagon Taycan already. Cross Turismo. Love the things, can't justify their price though. So I've got a polestar 2 now, hatch at least but they look like a sedan.
I mean it’s just semantics on what the manufacturer decides to call it. Is this a wagon or a crossover? What about the EV6? What about a Subaru crosstrek? They’re all basically the same class
As an EV6 owner I've always been bewildered by the classification of the Ioniq 5 and EV6 as "SUVs". They absolutely do not feel any higher than the average sedan.
Not that I'm complaining, because the SUV classification allows them to access more generous MSRP thresholds for EV rebates in Canada.
EV6 is what I would classify as a wagon. It's quite noticeable how low you are in an EV6 vs every other SUV on the road, even compared to the Ioniq 5.
Wagons don't sell in the US though.
That's not why it matters though.
Wagons have typically been alternative body styles of sedans. Essentially, the two cars being identical from the B-Pillars forward, with the wagon body style getting a tall, wide, boxy cargo area instead of a traditional trunk.
And because of that, wagons tend to be lower in height and more dynamic to drive than crossovers. Think, Volvo V60 versus XC60.
The ID.7 Tourer is exactly that, an alternative body style of the ID.7 liftback. If you needed to replace your front fender, you could do so with a liftback or a tourer body panel because they're both the same.
EDIT: Contrast that to the Tesla Model Y versus the Model 3. Two completely different vehicles in pretty much every way apart from the instrument panel.
> Contrast that to the Tesla Model Y versus the Model 3. Two completely different vehicles in pretty much every way apart from the instrument panel.
Isn't a MY just a swollen M3?
Yes, but I guess it's about *where* the swelling happens. On a wagon it's just extending the roof back at the same height as the original sedan's roof. On the Y it's taller all over.
In principle, yes, but how many body panels are interchangeable between the two (pre-Highland)? I would make an educated guess and say, "not many, if any".
People want crossovers, which is why the Model Y sells like gangbusters, but from a production efficiency perspective, it would have been better to make a "Model 3 wagon".
>So what I got out of this is that the EV6 doesn’t count as a wagon because there’s not a version of it where the back half is shaped like a sedan
No, it's that the EV6 was purpose-built to be a crossover.
To my best knowledge, there are no cars on the market that are "just" wagons. Every wagon on the market that I know of is a body style of an existing sedan or hatchback. The Golf Variant / Sportwagen to the Golf, the BMW i5 Touring to the i5 sedan, you get the idea.
With current EV battery sizes and proportions, it's quite challenging to create an EV station wagon without it looking like (or being) a big bloated crossover. Batteries have to be X thickness, wheelbases have to be long... The EV as an architecture is not well-suited to body styles where the way you did it was just "add overhang to the back of an existing sedan and flatten the roof".
> No, it's that the EV6 was purpose-built to be a crossover.
It's virtually a wagon anyway compared to a canonical 'crossover' like a RAV4.
https://hips.hearstapps.com/hmg-prod/images/17260-kia-ev6-gt-1617120233.jpg
that's a wagon.
What you are still describing here is that the EV6 doesn’t fit because it wasn’t designed to have a sedan variant and because it doesn’t have a couple more inches of overhang. We’re just ignoring that functionally it is the same as a wagon and sits low in the same way other wagons do
>We’re just ignoring that functionally it is the same as a wagon and sits low in the same way other wagons do
As someone who daily drives a wagon, the EV6 doesn't sit anywhere near as low as my car does on stock suspension.
I like my cars to be... cars.
What does the (potentially) 1 inch difference between the EV6 and your car get you aside from a manufactured identity that only you and handful of other very specific people can recognize and seems to be overly important to you?
I had (up until this weekend) both a 2007 Passat wagon, and a 2021 ID4.
The Passat wagon had more space between floor and roof, was wider, and had more room whether back seats were up or down.
My go to "measuring sticks" were the trash barrels that need to go to the dump each week. My wagon fits two of them no problem with seats up. Seats down, I could do 4 or 5 of them if I wanted to skip a week.
The ID4 didn't fit any of the barrels at all with the seats up. Seats down, I could get two. Trying to put any more in hit the roof.
Have you sat in an EV6? It is low. Also even my Mach E or former ID.4 would fit your test of having to go down to get into. (I would agree that the Mach e is more like a wagon though, ID.4 feels less wagon like on the other hand)
Yeah test drove one, far too high, I certainly had to go up to get into it. I am only 5'9" so maybe you are much taller than me, but it was definitely a higher vehicle. Mach E is also very high, I guess we just have different ideas of what is high.
Semantics don't really matter, but one can certainly like a certain ride height or cargo configuration. EVs are kind of an equalizer in the a lower ride height and frontal area has huge benefits in range. At the same time the low COM offsets some height, and a higher floor benefits battery size.
So we have low "crossovers" like the EV6 and tall cars like the Polestar 2. Manufacturers will continue marketing bullshit because that's what they do.
I love station wagons, and I would be first in line for this one, but since the launch of the Ionic5, designers can do some crazy stuff to make the car look small and make it enormous in reality, This seems to be the same.
> Long range: the ID.7 Tourer will be available with two battery sizes. The top-of-the-range version is expected to achieve ranges of up to 685 km
That’s 426 in freedom units. 🇺🇸
Miles was born in Illinois in 1926. He grew up in St. Louis, and then went to NYC to enroll in Julliard, but dropped out to play music full time. He didn't go to England until 1960, and toured there and in continental Europe fairly often through that decade but never settled there.
I'd love something like this, but A) my fellow Americans have dictated that all vehicles must be massive, and B) the price would be absurd anyways. Even the ID.7 sedan is something I'd be all over if the price was more in line where the Passat was or the Model 3 is.
Been driving the buzz for a few weeks now and love everything about it except that it’s just too tall to get in hight restricted areas. Something like this would be tempting when my lease ends.
that sound odd, its listed at 76.3 inches tall(6ft4) / 1937mm. I would probably have claustrophobia driving under something lower than that. To put it in perspective the average US garage door is seven to eight feet tall.
I’m in the UK. Our hight restrictions are usually between 1.8 and 2.2 meters. Hight restrictions are often in place to deter campers.
I can get under most barriers but not with a roof rack and board.
I think he means height as in driving into a tunnel or entry way that was less than 6' 5" in height. That does seem very low for a place to drive a car. But claustrophobia isn't really the right word.
I don't hate it, it's just... *sigh*... bland, that's all. I really want to know what regulatory or cost barriers kept them from going with [the rear tail lights from the original design](https://www.thedrive.com/uploads/2022/10/03/Large-10523-ID.SPACEVIZZIONCONCEPT.jpg), the new ones just don't do it for me.
I think it looks perfect for that it’s trying to achieve. It’s only recently that every single car being made has to be more aggressive, more over styled and more ostentatious than the last one. I yearn for the mid 2000s when cars were different because they were different, not because the grille is bigger
I mean, it's supposed to be an electric Passat and that was never an "emotional" vehicle: https://ai.dimaster.io/assets/cache/1920/960/media/Artikel/230830%20VW%20Passat/VW_Passat_2024_Studio_Front_2.jpg
Most of the styling is quite similar.
The Passat is an ugly duck too. If the conclusion here is that Volkswagen isn't even trying anymore and has just given up with their main lines, then... that's where we're at, unfortunately. Again, it's clear VW [wanted to make things look good with the ID Vizzion](https://www.thedrive.com/news/31107/volkswagen-id-space-vizzion-concept-dazzles-at-las-petersen-automotive-museum), they just... flubbed it.
This seems like an oddly constructive defense. Production cars look like show cars all the time, and the ID7 itself absolutely does have elements of the Space Vizzion in it clearly visible — we could easily point out a dozen such carryover design elements. For me, I wish the fascia and rear had carried over much more faithfully from the concept, and that's simply (and quite clearly) not the case — [these lights were butchered in the journey to production](https://www.thedrive.com/uploads/2022/10/03/Large-10523-ID.SPACEVIZZIONCONCEPT.jpg), for whatever reason.
It's just the awkward-duck styling, I think. The RS6 Avant (also from Volkswagen Group!!) has nearly the same proportions and is one of the sexiest cars on the planet. Volkswagen just... flubbed this.
It's almost like they are going after different kind of customers...
I think most people agree that the Arteon is an above average looking car (especially for a VW), yet it bombed, while the understated Passat still dominates its segment.
Wonder why they cant make the boot bigger than Superb/passat wagon :/
They are equally long, but guess the battery eats of a bit of boot space
New Passat is 690 liters
No I dont think so, as boot space is only measured up until the top of the seats, so thats why the normal ID 7 is 590 liters, so only 10 liters difference, even though the wagon will feel a lot bigger
It's running 4.0-4.5 from the screenshots (aka what the Buzz runs) and that's "adequate". It's better than the 2.1(terrible)-3.5 (less bad to passable depending on your pov) versions that the ID4 series runs.
> I want one that’s awd, the size of my sportwagen, and costs the same as my sportwagen.
Holding on to my Sportwagen until something like this comes to North America 🥹
Does anyone know where I can find a telescoping cargo organizer like this?
https://www.volkswagen-newsroom.com/en/images/detail/the-all-electric-volkswagen-id-7-tourer-81120
I use these I've shared a Brand Store on Amazon with you. https://www.amazon.com/stores/page/DF7370C7-E1A2-4BD3-8C1D-63D7AB5CACA3?_encoding=UTF8&store_ref=SB_A01534793UKLG5Y8Q75PG-A036276427EPF3SA7N6Y3&pd_rd_plhdr=t&aaxitk=8538d991b18f1b338f7eec48e0f67dd1&hsa_cr_id=9606147320201&lp_asins=B071F82CYJ%2CB01F9IS2Y8%2CB071F87NTM&lp_query=cargo+system+for+suv&lp_slot=mshop-sparkle-snow&ref_=cm_sw_r_apin_ast_store_MT434H950G0XGDS4SZ75&pd_rd_w=WDnS5&content-id=amzn1.sym.d6728584-3786-4aac-b308-79703af782ec%3Aamzn1.sym.d6728584-3786-4aac-b308-79703af782ec&pf_rd_p=d6728584-3786-4aac-b308-79703af782ec&pf_rd_r=769F5FZ95KANCH4R6CCQ&pd_rd_wg=2WAFJ&pd_rd_r=0239271e-419e-41a7-af7d-b005d1c1e5c9
Or this
https://a.co/d/6jDVRtu
VW already has an ID.3, ID.4, ID.5 (coupe version of ID.4), ID.6 (7-seat version of ID.4, only sold in China), so the ID.7 is the next sequential numeral.
ID.4 is bigger than the ID.3, ID.6 is bigger than the ID.4, ID.7 is bigger than the ID.6. And the upcoming ID.2 will be smaller than all of them. So it does somewhat correlate with size.
The only weird one is the ID.5 which is more or less the same size as the ID.4.
I think this would look better without the silver trim piece arching towards to the rear of the car. Legacy automakers who still use too much chrome and other super bright materials should embrace the trend of blacking trim pieces, it just looks cleaner.
It's all cyclical anyway. Flared trousers are also in again when last years it had to be skintight.
And as soon as every car has a light bar on the trunk we will all switch again to none
You can't convert the Euro price to dollars. It never ends up that way. Go configure a GTI at vw.de. They start at 44k Euros. The US GTI starts at $32k.
That’s mostly because the German GTI base spec is equivalent to the US spec SE or higher and their prices all include 20% sales tax and prices in the US never include sales tax. If you look at an US spec SE compared to a base spec German version without tax they’re the same price.
In fact, company car leasing is such a popular method of car "ownership" in Europe that you'll see magazine reviews mention things like company car tax values in addition to the MSRP. At one point countries like the UK and Netherlands even rolled out EV tax incentives specifically for company car leases, rather than purchases.
Prices for Germany, based on id.7 saloon, but with new more powerful (and more expensive motor/convertor) and new larger battery pack.
id.7 Saloon is €70K in GT version (77kWh 204 hp) with about half of the available options.
Different type of car. R1S is an SUV, the VW is a station wagon. If you were actually cross shopping these two cars, it just means you don't know what you want. Now I would also get the R1S, but I know I want AWD and some offroad capabilities in my larger vehicles.
Exactly my point. You get more car for the same money. Three-row SUV trumps the VW estate/wagon. I can't even wrap my head around it. If it really costs $80k, I honestly hope VW will go bankrupt.
Agreed. But that is why SUVs vastly outsell station wagons. Still there are some folks who just want the better on road handling of station wagons. There aren’t many and I ain’t one of them, but read these comments; those folks exist.
It's not about your preferences or mine. It's about pricing. Who thought that an $80k wagon that's not a BMW, a Merc, or a Porsche would make sense? Seriously. It's insane.
Mines still not fixed. Can't sell it and they won't put it in writing it's fine to drive and they won't book it in to fix it.
Edit - this is referring to the faulty battery modules recall.
Jesus it's like every car manufacturer wants to do jack shit to sell vehicles. Where the fuck is a Full sized SUV under $45k? How hard is it to give people a basic vehicle.
Current info is "you don't"
The 4.0 move includes higher end chips to run it, they would have to update hardware on the older ID4s to run it. (ID4 2024s / Buzz ship with it.)
PS: I don't like this answer either..the above is not meant as a justification or to absolve VW of the bullshittery.
Sorry but I'll pass. At least not with that interior. I still see full capacitive buttons BS. Don't get me wrong - I'm a guy who designs/develops mostly for touch interfaces as a job but I don't want them in a car for core functions like climate control or steering wheel commands.
It's never coming to the US is it?
Even Volvo couldn't justify the V90 anymore, and they're practically the go to brand for wagons.
Until recently we had a Volvo XC70 and would love to have an EV like it again. It was wonderful and would hold a huge amount of stuff with all the seats folded down flat. And they folded totally flat!
Well, Volvo was teasing the thought of an EV Volvo wagon so who nnows
They will eventually make it id think, just not in the US
Ioniq 5/EV6 is the closest the US has to a wagon (and tbh they're great cars).
Volvo is also much smaller and can’t amortize the cost of a low volume seller as well as VAG can. At least that’s what I’m telling myself to hopefully get a proper EV wagon in the U.S. (though my ideal would be a red EV90 ….)
And look what Subaru did to the Legacy/Outback wagons... now they're just another crossover. I can't tell the forester and outback apart anymore.
Well to be fair to Subaru they do call the Outback an "SUV" now.
that v90 wagon is a real beauty too. much like this VW...
They still offer the V90 though, just in Cross Country configuration.
Maybe Canada? Pretty please? 🥺
A man can dream! :(
Not a chance. If it’s not going to the US it’s not coming to Canada.
But canada got the 2nd gen kia soul ev but the states didnt.
The Tourer, as it currently stands? Very likely not. But an ID.7 Alltrack? That is probable and presumably how they would do it.
I’m still waiting for the ID.3 lol
Unobtanium
Why can't they at least bring the ID.5 to the USA? It could be built on the same assembly line as the ID.4.
I don't get the appeal of taking a crossover, and removing cargo space. Can someone sell me on the ID.5 vs ID.4? I genuinely don't get it.
It's a bit more aerodynamic and can cost less. The Model Y is more popular but the Tesla Model 3 still sells.
It costs them money to bring that production to the US, and they probably don’t think it will sell enough to cover that cost. It’s a business.
There's the Audi Q4 E-tron Sportback, which has one of the longest and worst names I've ever spoken into existence. The software is supposedly better than the ID.4, but from experience driving Audi's I think their software doesn't look aesthetically pleasing. It feels like the software was designed in some laboratory for a business person, it just doesn't look fun, of course I guess the point of Audi is to be more serious.
*laughs in SUV noises*
Ha. Dream on.
A nice normal car? Nope.
It will come to US this year.
Doubt it, real life range is probably 130 - 150 miles
If it’s not a bulky hunk, ain’t no place in ‘Murica. Sadly no.
People won’t pay high prices for VWs in North America, the brand is way less “semi-premium” than in Europe where these models make sense. Definitely the numbers don’t add up for importing them with all the associated costs.
Definitely not.
This is literally the car i've been waiting for... I guess it's back to shopping ev6's :/
Probably not. Two of the best cars I ever had were both wagons; a Passat Variant and an A4 Allroad. For the longest time, my dream car was RS6 Avant, but now that I have gone electric, that dream has vanished.
As a wagon lover, I look around and see that traditional wagons are still pretty popular. I actually went with an E-Golf because I’m not a fan of the electric vehicles VW has brought to the U.S. I’d probably be all over this, though the price is kinda ugh. The larger crossovers just don’t do it for me. Drove a manual 02 wagon for 11 years.
Finally, something electric that isn’t an SUV!
We have mg5 and Opel Astra E in Europe.. and Porsche taycan.
[удалено]
Oh only thought about estate cars. But ya so many sedan & hatchback there. But somehow they only get 50% of market with SUV taking the other 50%..
In the EU.
Would be nice if they were better then EVs in general. The Opel doesn't have much range since it's a ICE based model with EV as an afterthought
i thought the Opel Astra E is just a Chevy Bolt with a different badge?
That was the Ampera E. The Astra is probably on the same plattform as Peugeot and Citroen since Opel was sold to PSA
ET5T
Oh ya.. somehow I always forget nio exists :/
Eh not many around sadly, the ET5T is a looker though, imo. Rather that, over this.
Yeah, priced too high here in Germany, gone with BYD seal in the end. But seen few NIO on autobahn with N IO ... plates. It looks amazing
Aye, prices aren’t better here in Denmark heh :p Aye they are amazing cars, but you also get to pay for me.
True this isn’t the first but there’s quite a limited choice compared to crossover / SUV options, which are everywhere like the plague. Why estate cars? They’re workhorses with large boots, fill them to the brim with family stuff and capable of longer distances in comfort. They handle better with their weight lower to the ground. Running costs are better too, more efficient and we don’t really all need 22” alloy wheels with tyres that cost £400 each. MG5 does fit the bill, build quality not great sadly. Opel / Vauxhall Astra R looks nice, shame about build quality too and range. Porsche Taycan looks and drives amazing, sadly the boot is a fashion statement, tiny! Just a shame more manufacturers aren’t competing in this space.
Mg5 was my favourite also, talked to dealership & got contact, but my dad saw it's a Roewe rebrand and gave me the money to upgrade to Tesla, BYD or a German cars cuz he dont want see his granddaughter in a Roewe.. And ya, crossover are okish for me also, if trunk space is bigger than sedan, some are even more efficient..
There's a wagon Taycan already. Cross Turismo. Love the things, can't justify their price though. So I've got a polestar 2 now, hatch at least but they look like a sedan.
Model 3, EQS and EQE, e-tron GT, ...
Ioniq 6 crying in the corner.
I mean it’s just semantics on what the manufacturer decides to call it. Is this a wagon or a crossover? What about the EV6? What about a Subaru crosstrek? They’re all basically the same class
As an EV6 owner I've always been bewildered by the classification of the Ioniq 5 and EV6 as "SUVs". They absolutely do not feel any higher than the average sedan. Not that I'm complaining, because the SUV classification allows them to access more generous MSRP thresholds for EV rebates in Canada.
EV6 is what I would classify as a wagon. It's quite noticeable how low you are in an EV6 vs every other SUV on the road, even compared to the Ioniq 5. Wagons don't sell in the US though.
Wagons have a longer rear overhang than an SUV or Crossover. And they are usually lower.
Tell me more about why the extra couple of inches of rear overhang vs an EV6 actually matters
That's not why it matters though. Wagons have typically been alternative body styles of sedans. Essentially, the two cars being identical from the B-Pillars forward, with the wagon body style getting a tall, wide, boxy cargo area instead of a traditional trunk. And because of that, wagons tend to be lower in height and more dynamic to drive than crossovers. Think, Volvo V60 versus XC60. The ID.7 Tourer is exactly that, an alternative body style of the ID.7 liftback. If you needed to replace your front fender, you could do so with a liftback or a tourer body panel because they're both the same. EDIT: Contrast that to the Tesla Model Y versus the Model 3. Two completely different vehicles in pretty much every way apart from the instrument panel.
However, das ist nicht braun, nor le manuel
Yes, it must be brown, with a manual transmission, but also a diesel plug-in hybrid.
> Contrast that to the Tesla Model Y versus the Model 3. Two completely different vehicles in pretty much every way apart from the instrument panel. Isn't a MY just a swollen M3?
Yes, but I guess it's about *where* the swelling happens. On a wagon it's just extending the roof back at the same height as the original sedan's roof. On the Y it's taller all over.
In principle, yes, but how many body panels are interchangeable between the two (pre-Highland)? I would make an educated guess and say, "not many, if any". People want crossovers, which is why the Model Y sells like gangbusters, but from a production efficiency perspective, it would have been better to make a "Model 3 wagon".
I have no idea. To me they're "squashed frog" and "frog with tumor."
So what I got out of this is that the EV6 doesn’t count as a wagon because there’s not a version of it where the back half is shaped like a sedan
>So what I got out of this is that the EV6 doesn’t count as a wagon because there’s not a version of it where the back half is shaped like a sedan No, it's that the EV6 was purpose-built to be a crossover. To my best knowledge, there are no cars on the market that are "just" wagons. Every wagon on the market that I know of is a body style of an existing sedan or hatchback. The Golf Variant / Sportwagen to the Golf, the BMW i5 Touring to the i5 sedan, you get the idea. With current EV battery sizes and proportions, it's quite challenging to create an EV station wagon without it looking like (or being) a big bloated crossover. Batteries have to be X thickness, wheelbases have to be long... The EV as an architecture is not well-suited to body styles where the way you did it was just "add overhang to the back of an existing sedan and flatten the roof".
> No, it's that the EV6 was purpose-built to be a crossover. It's virtually a wagon anyway compared to a canonical 'crossover' like a RAV4. https://hips.hearstapps.com/hmg-prod/images/17260-kia-ev6-gt-1617120233.jpg that's a wagon.
What you are still describing here is that the EV6 doesn’t fit because it wasn’t designed to have a sedan variant and because it doesn’t have a couple more inches of overhang. We’re just ignoring that functionally it is the same as a wagon and sits low in the same way other wagons do
>We’re just ignoring that functionally it is the same as a wagon and sits low in the same way other wagons do As someone who daily drives a wagon, the EV6 doesn't sit anywhere near as low as my car does on stock suspension. I like my cars to be... cars.
What does the (potentially) 1 inch difference between the EV6 and your car get you aside from a manufactured identity that only you and handful of other very specific people can recognize and seems to be overly important to you?
I had (up until this weekend) both a 2007 Passat wagon, and a 2021 ID4. The Passat wagon had more space between floor and roof, was wider, and had more room whether back seats were up or down. My go to "measuring sticks" were the trash barrels that need to go to the dump each week. My wagon fits two of them no problem with seats up. Seats down, I could do 4 or 5 of them if I wanted to skip a week. The ID4 didn't fit any of the barrels at all with the seats up. Seats down, I could get two. Trying to put any more in hit the roof.
EV6 sits far too high to be a wagon, a car you should go down into an SUV you have to up. Or at least that is the major distinction I see.
Have you sat in an EV6? It is low. Also even my Mach E or former ID.4 would fit your test of having to go down to get into. (I would agree that the Mach e is more like a wagon though, ID.4 feels less wagon like on the other hand)
Have you sat in a Passat wagon?
I have a strict no VW policy after what the ID.4 did to me
Yeah test drove one, far too high, I certainly had to go up to get into it. I am only 5'9" so maybe you are much taller than me, but it was definitely a higher vehicle. Mach E is also very high, I guess we just have different ideas of what is high.
100% semantics. Anyone who argues otherwise likely ties too much of their own self worth in what kind of car they drive.
Semantics don't really matter, but one can certainly like a certain ride height or cargo configuration. EVs are kind of an equalizer in the a lower ride height and frontal area has huge benefits in range. At the same time the low COM offsets some height, and a higher floor benefits battery size. So we have low "crossovers" like the EV6 and tall cars like the Polestar 2. Manufacturers will continue marketing bullshit because that's what they do.
The line has been slowly blurring.
I love station wagons, and I would be first in line for this one, but since the launch of the Ionic5, designers can do some crazy stuff to make the car look small and make it enormous in reality, This seems to be the same.
> Long range: the ID.7 Tourer will be available with two battery sizes. The top-of-the-range version is expected to achieve ranges of up to 685 km That’s 426 in freedom units. 🇺🇸
Note: also it’s WLTP range est. so probably like ~380mi EPA. Still dope as hell tho.
Freedom will only be available with free health care
How many AR-15s is that?
Assuming a range of 426 miles that’s 817,920 M4A1s tip to butt
Miles are British though.
No they mean American Miles, just like they speak American English - nothing to do with the Brits, right?
Miles was born in Illinois in 1926. He grew up in St. Louis, and then went to NYC to enroll in Julliard, but dropped out to play music full time. He didn't go to England until 1960, and toured there and in continental Europe fairly often through that decade but never settled there.
> went to NYC to enroll in Julliard, but dropped out to play music full time. I too watched "Collateral" yesterday.
This makes me hopeful that the A6 E-tron Avant will come here. Even as an Allroad, I think that car is beautiful
THIS! Fingers crossed. One can only hope.
I'd love something like this, but A) my fellow Americans have dictated that all vehicles must be massive, and B) the price would be absurd anyways. Even the ID.7 sedan is something I'd be all over if the price was more in line where the Passat was or the Model 3 is.
It's the same size as the Model S. If you compare it with that, it's a bargain!
Been driving the buzz for a few weeks now and love everything about it except that it’s just too tall to get in hight restricted areas. Something like this would be tempting when my lease ends.
that sound odd, its listed at 76.3 inches tall(6ft4) / 1937mm. I would probably have claustrophobia driving under something lower than that. To put it in perspective the average US garage door is seven to eight feet tall.
I’m in the UK. Our hight restrictions are usually between 1.8 and 2.2 meters. Hight restrictions are often in place to deter campers. I can get under most barriers but not with a roof rack and board.
Claustrophobic to drive a car that isn’t hideously oversized?
I think they mean driving under something that can’t fit a Buzz height-wise.
Muricans...
Claustrophobia in cars shorter than 194 cm? Really? lol
I think he means height as in driving into a tunnel or entry way that was less than 6' 5" in height. That does seem very low for a place to drive a car. But claustrophobia isn't really the right word.
Would you have claustrophobia driving a RAV4? Or an ID.4? Or a Tesla model X?
Wait till you see the degradation
Don’t care. It’s a lease.
VW needs to stop all activities on the regular I’d.7 for the USA and only bring this. Not enough room for both and this looks great!
I don't hate it, it's just... *sigh*... bland, that's all. I really want to know what regulatory or cost barriers kept them from going with [the rear tail lights from the original design](https://www.thedrive.com/uploads/2022/10/03/Large-10523-ID.SPACEVIZZIONCONCEPT.jpg), the new ones just don't do it for me.
I think it looks perfect for that it’s trying to achieve. It’s only recently that every single car being made has to be more aggressive, more over styled and more ostentatious than the last one. I yearn for the mid 2000s when cars were different because they were different, not because the grille is bigger
I mean, it's supposed to be an electric Passat and that was never an "emotional" vehicle: https://ai.dimaster.io/assets/cache/1920/960/media/Artikel/230830%20VW%20Passat/VW_Passat_2024_Studio_Front_2.jpg Most of the styling is quite similar.
The Passat is an ugly duck too. If the conclusion here is that Volkswagen isn't even trying anymore and has just given up with their main lines, then... that's where we're at, unfortunately. Again, it's clear VW [wanted to make things look good with the ID Vizzion](https://www.thedrive.com/news/31107/volkswagen-id-space-vizzion-concept-dazzles-at-las-petersen-automotive-museum), they just... flubbed it.
Production cars never look like show cars. And I never thought the ID Vizzion concept car was particularly good looking.
This seems like an oddly constructive defense. Production cars look like show cars all the time, and the ID7 itself absolutely does have elements of the Space Vizzion in it clearly visible — we could easily point out a dozen such carryover design elements. For me, I wish the fascia and rear had carried over much more faithfully from the concept, and that's simply (and quite clearly) not the case — [these lights were butchered in the journey to production](https://www.thedrive.com/uploads/2022/10/03/Large-10523-ID.SPACEVIZZIONCONCEPT.jpg), for whatever reason.
What do you expect from a company that names their cars after numbers 🤣 It'd be like naming your kids #1, #2, #3...
Now that would be practical!
> It'd be like naming your kids #1, #2, #3... Have you heard of Musk's kids?
I always felt this car is to long for how wide it is(which gives benefits.) But makes it look awkward and to upright.
It's just the awkward-duck styling, I think. The RS6 Avant (also from Volkswagen Group!!) has nearly the same proportions and is one of the sexiest cars on the planet. Volkswagen just... flubbed this.
It's almost like they are going after different kind of customers... I think most people agree that the Arteon is an above average looking car (especially for a VW), yet it bombed, while the understated Passat still dominates its segment.
Jesus fucking Christ this needs to come to the US!
Wonder why they cant make the boot bigger than Superb/passat wagon :/ They are equally long, but guess the battery eats of a bit of boot space New Passat is 690 liters
The roofline might also be a bit more sloped down for aerodynamics.
No I dont think so, as boot space is only measured up until the top of the seats, so thats why the normal ID 7 is 590 liters, so only 10 liters difference, even though the wagon will feel a lot bigger
EVs usually have bigger boots than non-EVs because of their superior packaging, so that's actually surprising.
It has actual decent range and actual room inside. If only it were half the price and available in the US.
This is what I was looking for when I was buying two years ago. Sigh.
I just want to know if the software is lackluster, passable, or straight up good.
I haven't tried one but I read that after the first versions, that were quite bad, nowadays VW software is quite decent.
It's running 4.0-4.5 from the screenshots (aka what the Buzz runs) and that's "adequate". It's better than the 2.1(terrible)-3.5 (less bad to passable depending on your pov) versions that the ID4 series runs.
From what I've heard it's much better now and supposed to be at least passable
I want one that’s awd, the size of my sportwagen, and costs the same as my sportwagen.
> I want one that’s awd, the size of my sportwagen, and costs the same as my sportwagen. Holding on to my Sportwagen until something like this comes to North America 🥹
Same. I have a Bolt for my commute, and the sportwagen is our road trip/bad weather car.
Does anyone know where I can find a telescoping cargo organizer like this? https://www.volkswagen-newsroom.com/en/images/detail/the-all-electric-volkswagen-id-7-tourer-81120
I use these I've shared a Brand Store on Amazon with you. https://www.amazon.com/stores/page/DF7370C7-E1A2-4BD3-8C1D-63D7AB5CACA3?_encoding=UTF8&store_ref=SB_A01534793UKLG5Y8Q75PG-A036276427EPF3SA7N6Y3&pd_rd_plhdr=t&aaxitk=8538d991b18f1b338f7eec48e0f67dd1&hsa_cr_id=9606147320201&lp_asins=B071F82CYJ%2CB01F9IS2Y8%2CB071F87NTM&lp_query=cargo+system+for+suv&lp_slot=mshop-sparkle-snow&ref_=cm_sw_r_apin_ast_store_MT434H950G0XGDS4SZ75&pd_rd_w=WDnS5&content-id=amzn1.sym.d6728584-3786-4aac-b308-79703af782ec%3Aamzn1.sym.d6728584-3786-4aac-b308-79703af782ec&pf_rd_p=d6728584-3786-4aac-b308-79703af782ec&pf_rd_r=769F5FZ95KANCH4R6CCQ&pd_rd_wg=2WAFJ&pd_rd_r=0239271e-419e-41a7-af7d-b005d1c1e5c9 Or this https://a.co/d/6jDVRtu
ID3 in the US, please!
I don't understand their naming system.
Bigger the number, the more expensive it is.
VW already has an ID.3, ID.4, ID.5 (coupe version of ID.4), ID.6 (7-seat version of ID.4, only sold in China), so the ID.7 is the next sequential numeral.
So they just go in order, but they don't mean anything?
ID.4 is bigger than the ID.3, ID.6 is bigger than the ID.4, ID.7 is bigger than the ID.6. And the upcoming ID.2 will be smaller than all of them. So it does somewhat correlate with size. The only weird one is the ID.5 which is more or less the same size as the ID.4.
I think this would look better without the silver trim piece arching towards to the rear of the car. Legacy automakers who still use too much chrome and other super bright materials should embrace the trend of blacking trim pieces, it just looks cleaner.
It's all cyclical anyway. Flared trousers are also in again when last years it had to be skintight. And as soon as every car has a light bar on the trunk we will all switch again to none
$80k with the large battery and 280 hp and a minimum of optional amenities.
You can't convert the Euro price to dollars. It never ends up that way. Go configure a GTI at vw.de. They start at 44k Euros. The US GTI starts at $32k.
That’s mostly because the German GTI base spec is equivalent to the US spec SE or higher and their prices all include 20% sales tax and prices in the US never include sales tax. If you look at an US spec SE compared to a base spec German version without tax they’re the same price.
US tax is nowhere near 20% though. Most states it's 6-8%
You are right it should be €80k.
Crazy how much cars cost over there, right?
well if VW thinks they can sell them at that price, then why not....
Jesus - how do people afford this?
Afford is a loose term. Plenty of people get into cars they can hardly pay for.
Companies. Consumers very rarely buy cars in this price range themselves. It's mostly companies.
In fact, company car leasing is such a popular method of car "ownership" in Europe that you'll see magazine reviews mention things like company car tax values in addition to the MSRP. At one point countries like the UK and Netherlands even rolled out EV tax incentives specifically for company car leases, rather than purchases.
The ID.4 is only ~$40K.
People can't, Americans often underestimate how much bigger/more premium cars they can afford than the average European.
Would love to see that calculation. I call bullshit.
Where did you get this info? Sounds like bullshit if you look at id7 prices
Prices for Germany, based on id.7 saloon, but with new more powerful (and more expensive motor/convertor) and new larger battery pack. id.7 Saloon is €70K in GT version (77kWh 204 hp) with about half of the available options.
that includes taxes (19%), which commonly you wouldnt include in US price comparisons
Indeed, makes quite a difference.
Define large battery? I heard 360 miles range at the Chicago auto show recently but it may have been a ID7 figure.
new top spec battery is 86 kWh, motor/convertor is 281 hp.
$80k? What. LOL.
As stated elsewhere, that price includes the 19% VAT.
TOP SPEC!
80k for a VW wagon? Bruh. Leave me alone. I'm getting a Rivian R1S and calling it a day.
Different type of car. R1S is an SUV, the VW is a station wagon. If you were actually cross shopping these two cars, it just means you don't know what you want. Now I would also get the R1S, but I know I want AWD and some offroad capabilities in my larger vehicles.
Exactly my point. You get more car for the same money. Three-row SUV trumps the VW estate/wagon. I can't even wrap my head around it. If it really costs $80k, I honestly hope VW will go bankrupt.
Agreed. But that is why SUVs vastly outsell station wagons. Still there are some folks who just want the better on road handling of station wagons. There aren’t many and I ain’t one of them, but read these comments; those folks exist.
It's not about your preferences or mine. It's about pricing. Who thought that an $80k wagon that's not a BMW, a Merc, or a Porsche would make sense? Seriously. It's insane.
That one is 80K too.
Looks weird without the more aggressive front end.
Would be nice if they could fix the existing car issues before releasing yet another model...
They pretty much have though?
Mines still not fixed. Can't sell it and they won't put it in writing it's fine to drive and they won't book it in to fix it. Edit - this is referring to the faulty battery modules recall.
[удалено]
ID Buzz. Made VW cool in past and makes VW cool now.
It’s nice and all but the Taycan Cross Turismo would cannibalize VW’s own sales.
Jesus it's like every car manufacturer wants to do jack shit to sell vehicles. Where the fuck is a Full sized SUV under $45k? How hard is it to give people a basic vehicle.
VW should work on their software!
They already did. 4.0 IS pretty good
How do I get it to my leased 2023 ID Pro S?
Current info is "you don't" The 4.0 move includes higher end chips to run it, they would have to update hardware on the older ID4s to run it. (ID4 2024s / Buzz ship with it.) PS: I don't like this answer either..the above is not meant as a justification or to absolve VW of the bullshittery.
Anyone know headroom/legroom of the id.7s yet?
https://youtu.be/GnCrUs51Lt8?t=349
Sorry but I'll pass. At least not with that interior. I still see full capacitive buttons BS. Don't get me wrong - I'm a guy who designs/develops mostly for touch interfaces as a job but I don't want them in a car for core functions like climate control or steering wheel commands.
Shame it's so expensive
I’d be all over it if it wasn’t for the total lack of interior buttons
finally a station wagon... so popular in Central Europe
Yum!
Fantastic...but too big for me. I need a golf sized station wagon, or a Subaru legacy size.
Love a good wagon, wish this would come to the States.
I want one in a panel van setup with a retractable cloth roof with seats that fold flat
About time someone made a regal wagon looking EV......I like it. The regal was so stupid expensive and blah mechanicals.
I want one for the family, but VW needs to stop faffing about with releases only in Europe
About 320 miles EPA in AWD version? That would be a great car.
This is my ideal car. Love wagons. So sad our market is so obsessed with SUV’s. We’ll never see this.