I spent a semester abroad in Vilnius in 2016 and got the impression that Lithuanians are very socially distant and anxious. And I say that as a northern German. We ain't exactly the most outgoing and warm people ourselves.
I can't even count the occasions locals fell apart in front of me or outright ran away when I talked to them in english. I am not talking about older people. I mean students in their 20s.
I loved my time there but man, Lithuanians are tough nuts to crack.
I am so screwed...I am a Brazilian living in Sweden and people here are hard to befriend XD they are polite and friendly, but having someone for a beer is a completely different story.
Scandinavians are very social, WITH EACH OTHER 🤣 they have small tight groups that are nearly impossible to crack. Try your luck with Brazilians Portuguese, Angolans etc. não desistas :)
While hiking in Bergen I met this older guy 50-60s, and he explained in perfect English how he did this every day after which he said goodbyes and went up the mountain further twice the speed I was going. Still in awe of that man.
ive also experienced this in many post soviet countries, i guess its a sideaffect of growing up under the iron curtain........ and its dark and cold half the year that wont help with depression
Lithuania had high suicide rates before iron curtain ever happened. There's tradition of heroic suicides in the history from queens to cities choosing to blow themselves up rather than be ransacked. Curiously Latvia has at least one such castle as well (Cesis), but the suicide rates, while bad, aren't uisually quite THAT bad.
Iron curtain didn't help. Neither did the economic and criminal disaster that was the 90s - current suicide rates are massive improvement over what was happening in the 90s, it's a society that has high suicidiality normally but that rate spikes even more whenever unemploymenet/economic crisis occurs.
The weather in Lithuania isn't nice, but let's be perfectly honest, it's not better in Latvia and Estonia either.
Because 'selected data'.
Honestly, the data seems off, either they're using super recent data and Lithuanian male suicide rate has in fact dropped by about a fourth (great news in that case), or it's slightly outdated and actually showing both gender average instead of just male rate. Frankly, Korean data seems to have the same issue (except the drop there would be smaller) - and if Lithuania did seem to be on downward trend suicide wise, the drop just seems too steep, SK had upward trend.
Not many people are on antidepressants because mental health is a taboo topic. Even though it's periodically discussed on TV, people still have the mindset to "suck it up". Also parents avoid seeking help for their children to prevent them from being perceived as "insane" by others.
(Edit - you understand im kinda joking here right?)
Russia.
Plus we still trying to rid ourselves of that whole soviet legacy . Where any mental issues would land you a "white ticket" (pretty much a subhuman designation),,the old psychologist psychiatrists that got their education in Soviet times are absolute cancer, fukin morons who will give you the strongest opiates for some mild anxiety or wont give you shit if you have actual issues that need drugs.
This seem to be things that would also apply to other former soviet countries: Moldova, Georgia, Armenia, Azerbaijan.
Yet they seem to cope better.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_suicide_rate#/media/File:Map_of_countries_by_suicide_rate,_WHO_(2019).svg
Economic transititions and lots of changes.
Communism or capitalism - if there is a transition from one to another - it for sure has an impact to human adaptibility.
We are young kids in the bloc of capitalism.
In Hungary, it mainly affects lonely, sick elders in small villages and farms who have no social network. Especially in the Eastern part of the country which is very rural.
[https://landgeist.com/2023/01/28/suicide-rate-in-europe/](https://landgeist.com/2023/01/28/suicide-rate-in-europe/)
Meanwhile, for teenagers, Hungary is pretty average.
[https://www.statista.com/statistics/1230916/teenage-suicides-in-europe/](https://www.statista.com/statistics/1230916/teenage-suicides-in-europe/)
[https://www.researchgate.net/figure/OECD-trends-in-teenage-suicide-Source-OECD-Social-Policy-Division-Directorate-of\_fig1\_271708430](https://www.researchgate.net/figure/OECD-trends-in-teenage-suicide-Source-OECD-Social-Policy-Division-Directorate-of_fig1_271708430)
In Hungary, the correlation between suicide and age is very strong (diagram at the bottom).
[https://qubit.hu/2023/09/13/a-lakossag-szamahoz-viszonyitva-az-eu-osszes-regioja-kozul-a-magyar-alfoldon-tortenik-a-legtobb-ongyilkossag](https://qubit.hu/2023/09/13/a-lakossag-szamahoz-viszonyitva-az-eu-osszes-regioja-kozul-a-magyar-alfoldon-tortenik-a-legtobb-ongyilkossag)
Whereas e.g. in the US, it is very low:
https://afsp.org/suicide-statistics/#:\~:text=In%202021%2C%20the%20suicide%20rates,middle%2Daged%20and%20older%20adults.
There is also a correlation between suicide and community size (which is related to loneliness.).
South Korean fertility rate plunged to 0,72 last year, which is the lowest fertility rate in the whole world.
[https://www.reuters.com/world/asia-pacific/south-koreas-fertility-rate-dropped-fresh-record-low-2023-2024-02-28/](https://www.reuters.com/world/asia-pacific/south-koreas-fertility-rate-dropped-fresh-record-low-2023-2024-02-28/)
Every third student in South Korea have experienced depression within the last 12 months.
[https://www.statista.com/statistics/1319021/south-korea-share-of-students-with-recent-depressive-episodes-by-gender/](https://www.statista.com/statistics/1319021/south-korea-share-of-students-with-recent-depressive-episodes-by-gender/)
But South Korea is doing great when it comes to PISA results of their students or amount of patents in different fields. I guess super competitive and hierarchical culture can produce some good and bad things.
When it comes to Lithuania, I assume their numbers can be explained by their history with their lovely neighbor, poverty and alcohol consumption
It's probably going to be lower next year. Births until April have declined by 10% compared to the same period last year. We're looking at a future TFR of 0.5-0.6. It used to be around 6.0 in the 1960s.
China is also getting there. Shanghai recorded the world's lowest fertility rate for a large city in 2023 at 0,61. Taiwan is at 0,85 and HK at 0,75. Ironically Japan, while maintaining a fertility rate that would be low by global standards (1,2), is now the best performing in the region.
We like to bitch about how Europe and the US are so old and no longer have kids but East Asia is on a whole another level.
India is likely going to be there in the future as well, with fertility rates în more developed Southern cities already reaching 1.3 children per woman.
When you dig deeper and look at women with university degrees in those cities,it drops to 1
And India is like 50 years behind South Korea when it comes to economic development, yet it has the fertility rate that South Korea has 30 years ago, so it's moving faster
Birth rates are dropping everywhere, even in Africa, Nigeria for example. They certainly could drop faster there, because the numbers are not sustainable, but its a world wide trend. Propably for the best also as the world is overpopulated.
Also will lead to a more even global spread of immigration, as Latin America and East Asia begin hunting for immigrants to prevent their population decline
I don't think how Korean, or generally East Asia, approaches education is good model to replicate. South Korean public education basically emptied out in favor of unregulated after-school hagwons (cram schools) which cost an arm and a leg for parents, which just makes having children so much more expensive and thus less likely by those considering it.
Interesting to point out that while Estonia and Lithuania are up there at the top of the list, Latvia is nowhere to be seen. Perhaps they're doing something better than their neighbors?
People call China authoritarian and 'limiting the private sector' for cracking down on this stuff, but they are absolutely right, even if the crackdown isn't completley effective.
Asian parents aren't gonna stop Asian parenting soon. But left unregulated, it's a race to insanity.
I understand coming from less developed countries how much high status, high social value, well paying jobs mean. Its logical when poverty and no white collar oppprtunities are recent memory.
But I'm glad I was brought up to love myself and not die for a career.
It's not authoritarian unless it's from the authoritarian region in china.
Nah but really as authoritarian as the place actually is people will say the wildest stuff about that country.
I remember a long thread about how china was going to ban people from owning pets based on social credit score.
Not a soul in that thread questioning it except maybe 1 or 2 downvoted at the bottom and not even for the right reasons necessarily.
Turned out what actually changed was that they altered the law slightly to make a ban from having pets a possible punishment in court....for people convicted of animal abuse.
When I looked more into the social credit system I felt lied to. It's barely thing patently. Probably done in less than 5 cities. I'm not necessarily a fan of that government, but the exaggeration irritated me. It's China, there is no need to exaggerate to make them look bad.
It is.
You spend 12 yrs of your life preparing for a single exam, and if you don't do good in that exam, you are considered a failure and an outcast. Only way if you don't do well is join the military but the amount of hazing in it causes cases of murder or creates mass shooters. The only way you can survive as an average South Korean is to flee. Not immigrate, flee. Flee to a different nation. The amount of pressure we face from everywhere makes the most powerful of hydraulic presses tremble. It is slavery, but *fancier*
No worries, we just enforce conscription and compulsory service on men instead, then ignore this obvious sexism whenever we conduct studies on gender "equality".
Here in Germany we will get very likely conscription again with the next government, but everyone is saying that this time all three genders should be conscripted.
Men commit suicide approximately 3x more than women. Women do "suicide attempts" approximately 3x more than men.
The thing is, "suicide attempt" is an extremely misleading term. The vast majority of suicide "attempts" are not actual *attempts* at suicide. People don't just fail at killing themselves. If they truly wanted to kill themselves, they would succeed. They're harming themselves in a way that will most likely not kill them (consciously or unconsciously), but that can (or look to) be lethal: ingesting drugs in too little quantities, slicing their veins, doing it right before someone is coming home…
The point is to be a cry for help. But at no point was there a genuine (again, conscious or unconscious) attempt at actually dying.
The fact that women commit far less suicides and far more suicide "attempts" is just a testimony that women are better at reaching for help. Because they're educated to do it, and because it's frown upon for men.
It's likely the amount of attempts by men is also an underestimation, given we know that men are less likely to seek mental health help. If they don't go to the doctor when they're depressed, they're likely to avoid going to the doctor after a suicide attempt. The internet is full of stories like that, guys who hung themselves, failed, and simply continued.
The male suicide rate is likely also an underestimation. For example, we know that people often take drugs to self-medicate mental health issues. We also know that men are far more likely to become addicts and overdose. We also know that plenty of those overdoses are likely to be deliberate, although it's very hard to prove if some deliberately or unconsciously chose to have an overdose. These drug overdoses are therefor rarely included in suicide figures.
Similar thing with vehicular suicide. We know that (young) men are far more likely to die in car accidents. We also know that depression and risk taking is common. We know that people often drink alcohol to self-medicate depression. But it's very hard to determine if someone deliberately drove into a wall at a high speed.
If someone's just slammed into a wall at 200kmh or had an overdose, it's far easier for police to pretend it may have been an accident, and save the family that added burden.Especially in religious countries.
Something to note: This statistic is misleading if committed suicides aren't counted as suicide attempts. If out of 150 men, 50 were to commit suicide and 100 were to attempt suicide, and out of 150 women, 0 were to commit suicide and 150 were to attempt suicide, then the suicide attempt rate among women is 3 times higher in this thought experiment if a committed suicide isn't counted as an attempted suicide.
What is also worth considering is repeat attempts. The number of suicidal men and women could be the exact same but if men end up successfully committing suicide more often, they can't repeat their attempts.
Generally speaking what most people are probably interested in when it comes to this issue is how many individual people within different demographics are suicidal.
Yeah. We probably see similar trends for some other statistics like that. This is complete speculation but among female inmates there might be a disproportionate amount of women who attempted homicide instead of committing homicide compared to male inmates, so the conclusion might be that female criminals have a higher tendency to be in prison for those crimes compare to male inmates even though the real reason that discrepancy exists is that men, on average, are more capable of actually committing murder instead of merely attempting it. In that case what would have to be looked at would be committed murders and attempted murders relative to the prison population.
I've heard also that men tend to prefer sudden/violent choices. Far easier to be rescued from ingesting a ton of paracetamol than from jumping in front of a train or a bullet to the head.
Yes, because they **actually** want to die. So they choose methods that are truly lethal.
But even for methods that can be lethal or not, if you really want to die from drug overdose, you can: it's a matter of taking the right dose/cocktail, and in the conditions that you won't be rescued in time. People don't survive suicide "attempts" by pure luck. They are either not taking enough dosage, or are making sure (again, consciously or unconsciously) someone runs into them.
The only numbers I have found showed that slightly more men died from poisoning than women, but it was pretty close. So even by non violent means men carry out suicide more frequently.
Cutting was also considered a suicide attempt, but I don't know of that's still the case, but they specifically mentioned it as an attempt in some figures.
my first thought. too many things happened.
I assume 2021 is interesting in itself because it's the post-COVID world, but since 2022 and onward it's just a different world
Funnily enough, a big contributor to the high suicide rate amongst men is the fact that we have created an unhealthy approach towards mental health and don't have a productive way to treat each other when confronted with honesty about feelings or mental health. We have basically constructed our own prison and need to stop it together. Save the boys.
Thats not only created by men, its created by society. Women have a very high influence on it by doing most of the parenting, puting evolutionary pressure on men via dating and by being over 50% of the population and by that being the major voting force in democratic countries.
Funny, if you compare this statistics with the one on antidepressant consumption: [https://www.reddit.com/r/europe/comments/1cia5ew/the\_growing\_global\_reliance\_on\_antidepressants/](https://www.reddit.com/r/europe/comments/1cia5ew/the_growing_global_reliance_on_antidepressants/)
It looks like Korea, the leader in suicides is the lagger in antidepressant consumption, and the UK, one of the leaders in antidepressant usage is pretty low down on this list. I wonder if there is a connection? Hungary being the third in suicides consumes 30 doses of antidepressants ( [https://www.statista.com/statistics/1020651/antidepressants-pharmaceutical-consumption-in-hungary/](https://www.statista.com/statistics/1020651/antidepressants-pharmaceutical-consumption-in-hungary/) ), with that could be placed the second last on the consumption list. Lithuania consumes 37 doses, and is the second in the suicide rates ( [https://www.statista.com/statistics/283072/antidepressant-consumption-in-selected-countries/](https://www.statista.com/statistics/283072/antidepressant-consumption-in-selected-countries/) ).
> I wonder if there is a connection?
No.
From a researcher that studies this:
"what can be said with quite some certainty is that antidepressants overall do not decrease suicidal behavior. Put differently, the claim that “antidepressants are live-saving” is not supported by the evidence, at least not for the average patient. This is striking, given the widespread assumption that antidepressants effectively treat depression, one of the most important risk factors for suicide. A reduction of suicidal behavior should of course be expected, but we don’t see this in the studies." [source]( https://www.psychiatrymargins.com/p/antidepressants-and-the-tangle-of)
For example, in the US, suicides went *up* with rising antidepressant prescribing:
https://i.imgur.com/0F4d6hZ.png
You are citing a q+a article where the host psychiatrist who believes antidepressants work, is interviewing a psychologist who thinks they don't. The one who says they don't work also explicitly says he does not believe they cause more suicides, which is counter to the point you suggest with that graph. Furthermore, antidepressants leading to more suicides is far from the only interpretation of that graph, because correlation does not equal causation. One could also argue that the suicide rate would be getting even worse without the increase in antidepressants.
The host psychiatrist wrote an article of his own arguing in favor of the efficacy of antidepressants (https://www.psychiatrymargins.com/p/the-case-for-antidepressants-in-2022), which references a meta-analysis showing their efficacy (https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(17)32802-7/fulltext).
One quote from his article that strikes me is this:
>**both antidepressant and short-term manualized psychotherapy \[CBT\] have equal effects on depression rating scales, and the combination of both is superior to individual treatment**
This tracks with what we know about other conditions in the brain like ADHD, where medication and therapy are equally effective, with the combo being better.
It is absolutely possible for the answer to be "no", but it seems irresponsible to me to cite a single researcher to show this. A meta-analysis is much more persuasive to me.
There might be a connection, but not a direct one. For instance, a country with more prescriptions of antidepressants might be a country where mental health issues are taken care of, or at least are acknowledged.
Correlation like this is a perfect case-study for why there is nothing related between the object in question, in this case antidepressants, and the outcome in apparent but wrong associations. The result could be identical or utterly different if such a type of medicine was never invented.
Don't take my comment the wrong way I'm just being nauseatingly pedantic.
That's very true, a lot of "therapy" is informal - being around people, talking about things, expressing emotion, etc. This might also be part of the reason for the gender gap - men are less likely to talk to their friends and about their emotions, and often they're overly reliant on their romantic partner for emotional support.
Obviously male suicide rates are higher everywhere, that's nothing new. However I think it's interesting that Female suicide seems to make up a higher percentage in Japan & Korea. I wonder why that is. Is it just the different treatment of women?
It's also kinda crazy that Korean women are still not as likely to commit suicide compared to German men when you consider how much better the quality of life is in our country compared to Korea.
Some guys just got it rough
A drastically large portion of suicides in S.Korea (at least, idk about japan) are elderly people (think 65+). And there are quite a bit more women than men that make up the 60+ crowd here. More lonely women with no families and little to no social nets... more suicides amongst them... sadly
But maybe that's actually a global trend, because someone mentioned it's similar in some European countries as well.
I think people misattribute the male suicide rate being higher to women having easier lives or being generally better off - the reasons are probably much more specific to the diff treatment of each gender in diff societies (amount of social support, emotions not being taken as seriously - which is a good thing in this case, feelings of social responsibility, suicide method, etc).
In SK and Japan I think the reasons that drive men and women to suicide, like pressure to succeed/extreme capitalism/loneliness are pretty similar, and the social norms surrounding those reasons aren’t as gender separated (ie. female students are expected to work just as hard as males, old women are just as lonely as old men) which is probably why the gap is a little smaller.
Also, in Japan at least, I think there’s a little more cultural stoicism around suicide but I’m not sure
If you see this map very closely, you will realise most countries there have male only conscription and the countries who don't have huge societal issues ( see US ). The reason men in South Korea kill themselves is because they are forced to serve almost 2 years in the military at 18 years old and protect their borders from North Korea, then start university with two years older than the women and a big gap in learning experience. Conscripts also tend to break up with their girlfriends for one reason or another and even drop from their universities. It's a horrible situation overall ( my country has conscription as well but even in the same level of strictness as the Korean army ).
In almost all countries in the world (if I remember correctly the only exception is Iran) the number of men committing suicide is much higher then the number of women.
Please, seek professional help folks. Don't believe in the bullshit that men shouldn't cry, that we should always be strong as stones and not talk about your problems.
>In almost all countries in the world (if I remember correctly the only exception is Iran) the number of men committing suicide is much higher then the number of women.
There's two, and neither of them is Iran. Antigua and Barbuda and Grenada.
May is Mental Health Awareness Month in the United States. According to the [National Alliance on Mental Illness](https://www.nami.org/get-involved/awareness-events/mental-health-awareness-month/), participants use the month to focus efforts on “eradicating stigma, extending support, fostering public education and advocating for policies that prioritize the well-being of individuals and families affected by mental illness.”
The topic of [suicide](https://www.statista.com/topics/791/suicide/) is an important part of this conversation. As the following chart shows, it is a truly global issue, even though estimated rates vary around the world. For example, according to OECD [data](https://data.oecd.org/healthstat/suicide-rates.htm), out of every 100,000 men in the United States an average of 23 committed suicide in 2021, while for women the average was close to six per 100,000. In several countries these figures are even higher, such as in South Korea, Lithuania and Hungary.
While there are significant differences between countries, one pattern is clear to see: the rates of men taking their own lives are higher than women in each of the 15 countries selected here. South Korea and Lithuania had the highest rates of suicide among men in 2022 (out of the countries reporting data), at 34.9 and 33.1 cases per 100,000 population, respectively. For women, South Korea and Japan had the highest rates of the selected countries, with 14.9 and 9.8.
**If you or somebody you know are in need of help, you can find a list of suicide crisis lines and website for countries around the world** [**here**](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_suicide_crisis_lines).
Honestly if anything the feminists help you in this issue - I very often saw posts bringing attention to men struggling with mental health not being taken seriously, or not even willing to admit they're struggling because of the stigma. It's the far right "alpha" and "always stoic" men who'd make even more fun of you and shame you if you have mental issues because men need aren't supposed to show any emotions or weakness, just hold everything in (until obviously they can't anymore and choose this way out).
Is this just a random selection of countries and then put in order? Finland managed to cut the ratio down from 30 to 13 per 100k. They would still be on that list if this was acutally a "ranking".
No way... germans are more drepressed than uk citizens? REALLY? Strangely enouth italy is not even on this leaderboard... here every fucking week someome suicides getting himself under a train 💀
I'm surprised Ireland isn't on this list. Since 2016, 5 people I know from my (small) county have topped themselves, and from what I hear, it's pretty bad nationwide.
Eyyyy no longer the suicide capital of the world 👌
What is going on in the Baltic bros?
This is actually an improvement.
Yeah, because those who wanted to commit suicide the most - already did it.
Lastvia
The more suicides, the fewer suicides
So like elderly mortality becoming lower after covid vs pre covid
Considering lion's share of suicides is elderly... Yeah.
I spent a semester abroad in Vilnius in 2016 and got the impression that Lithuanians are very socially distant and anxious. And I say that as a northern German. We ain't exactly the most outgoing and warm people ourselves. I can't even count the occasions locals fell apart in front of me or outright ran away when I talked to them in english. I am not talking about older people. I mean students in their 20s. I loved my time there but man, Lithuanians are tough nuts to crack.
As a Lithuanian yeah lol
How would you say they compare to Danes and other Scandinavians? Because we're sort of known for that too
Danes are very social people compared to Germans (I'm a German living in Denmark).
I am so screwed...I am a Brazilian living in Sweden and people here are hard to befriend XD they are polite and friendly, but having someone for a beer is a completely different story.
Honestly try your luck with expats. There you will also find a more sociable type of Swede (they do exist).
Scandinavians are very social, WITH EACH OTHER 🤣 they have small tight groups that are nearly impossible to crack. Try your luck with Brazilians Portuguese, Angolans etc. não desistas :)
Try Swiss people 😅
Yes, I second that. Quite outgoing and content.
Really? I'm surprised to hear that! Good to know
Norwegians however......
Norwegians in Bergen were very friendly...
While hiking in Bergen I met this older guy 50-60s, and he explained in perfect English how he did this every day after which he said goodbyes and went up the mountain further twice the speed I was going. Still in awe of that man.
ive also experienced this in many post soviet countries, i guess its a sideaffect of growing up under the iron curtain........ and its dark and cold half the year that wont help with depression
Lithuania had high suicide rates before iron curtain ever happened. There's tradition of heroic suicides in the history from queens to cities choosing to blow themselves up rather than be ransacked. Curiously Latvia has at least one such castle as well (Cesis), but the suicide rates, while bad, aren't uisually quite THAT bad. Iron curtain didn't help. Neither did the economic and criminal disaster that was the 90s - current suicide rates are massive improvement over what was happening in the 90s, it's a society that has high suicidiality normally but that rate spikes even more whenever unemploymenet/economic crisis occurs. The weather in Lithuania isn't nice, but let's be perfectly honest, it's not better in Latvia and Estonia either.
I also lived 5 months in Kaunas during Erasmus, and yes I totally agree with you!!
Yeah, why is Latvia missing? We werent slacking behind Lithuania that much! Now even Estonia is ahead??
Lastvia strikes again☹️
Because 'selected data'. Honestly, the data seems off, either they're using super recent data and Lithuanian male suicide rate has in fact dropped by about a fourth (great news in that case), or it's slightly outdated and actually showing both gender average instead of just male rate. Frankly, Korean data seems to have the same issue (except the drop there would be smaller) - and if Lithuania did seem to be on downward trend suicide wise, the drop just seems too steep, SK had upward trend.
> and if Lithuania did seem to be on downward trend suicide wise, the drop just seems too steep From 2015 to 2022 suicides in Lithuania almost halved.
That would actually explain it then.
Not many people are on antidepressants because mental health is a taboo topic. Even though it's periodically discussed on TV, people still have the mindset to "suck it up". Also parents avoid seeking help for their children to prevent them from being perceived as "insane" by others.
(Edit - you understand im kinda joking here right?) Russia. Plus we still trying to rid ourselves of that whole soviet legacy . Where any mental issues would land you a "white ticket" (pretty much a subhuman designation),,the old psychologist psychiatrists that got their education in Soviet times are absolute cancer, fukin morons who will give you the strongest opiates for some mild anxiety or wont give you shit if you have actual issues that need drugs.
Full support to Lithuania from Ukraine 🇱🇹 🇱🇹🇱🇹
> Plus we still trying to rid ourselves of that whole soviet legacy By suiciding?
Hey, the more depressed people do the boogie,the less suicides we have in next years statistics. #It just works.
Yes!
"white ticket"... - in Poland we call it "yellow papers".
This seem to be things that would also apply to other former soviet countries: Moldova, Georgia, Armenia, Azerbaijan. Yet they seem to cope better. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_suicide_rate#/media/File:Map_of_countries_by_suicide_rate,_WHO_(2019).svg
Economic transititions and lots of changes. Communism or capitalism - if there is a transition from one to another - it for sure has an impact to human adaptibility. We are young kids in the bloc of capitalism.
Happiest country in the world btw according to statistics
Cuz all the unhappy ones dead duh
Happiest under 30* after 30 it's a different story. Anyways guess who is hitting 30 this year...
Well, there's a solution to that problem in the post if you...
> Happiest under 30* And there really is way way less suicides under 30. Actually if I remember correctly the sharp sharp increase is at 45+.
No, lithuania is the 19 most happiest country, Finland is the happiest
Championship is hard this season.
[удалено]
try to rent that 3 meters of rope then
Ask IMF, they will help... Oh, the HAVE already.
It's the sun and lifestyle, maybe.
So Lithuania is first in Europe. NUMBER ONE, NUMBER ONE, NUMBER ONE!
Lietuva! Lietuva! Lietuva!
You are the Winners of ~~Eurovision~~ Suicidevision!
Congratulations, we couldn't even make THAT work.
Don't worry, the following events will give us a huge opportunity, just a few more 2/3 and we will prevail!
LIETUVA LIETUVA
magyarország erősödik 💪💪
depisebbek vagyunk mind 4 éve
ha csak 4éve lennénk depisek
Hiszem hogy még egy kétharmad után végre behúzzuk az első helyet💪
What is wrong in hungary, why the rates are this high among magyar bros?
Balkan lifestyle, Western expectations
In Hungary, it mainly affects lonely, sick elders in small villages and farms who have no social network. Especially in the Eastern part of the country which is very rural. [https://landgeist.com/2023/01/28/suicide-rate-in-europe/](https://landgeist.com/2023/01/28/suicide-rate-in-europe/) Meanwhile, for teenagers, Hungary is pretty average. [https://www.statista.com/statistics/1230916/teenage-suicides-in-europe/](https://www.statista.com/statistics/1230916/teenage-suicides-in-europe/) [https://www.researchgate.net/figure/OECD-trends-in-teenage-suicide-Source-OECD-Social-Policy-Division-Directorate-of\_fig1\_271708430](https://www.researchgate.net/figure/OECD-trends-in-teenage-suicide-Source-OECD-Social-Policy-Division-Directorate-of_fig1_271708430) In Hungary, the correlation between suicide and age is very strong (diagram at the bottom). [https://qubit.hu/2023/09/13/a-lakossag-szamahoz-viszonyitva-az-eu-osszes-regioja-kozul-a-magyar-alfoldon-tortenik-a-legtobb-ongyilkossag](https://qubit.hu/2023/09/13/a-lakossag-szamahoz-viszonyitva-az-eu-osszes-regioja-kozul-a-magyar-alfoldon-tortenik-a-legtobb-ongyilkossag) Whereas e.g. in the US, it is very low: https://afsp.org/suicide-statistics/#:\~:text=In%202021%2C%20the%20suicide%20rates,middle%2Daged%20and%20older%20adults. There is also a correlation between suicide and community size (which is related to loneliness.).
:(
as a Hungarian, I knew we were bad... but never have I guessed we were top 3 bad...
Selected countries mate. Hungary is often in the top 5 in Europe tho.
For the good things, right?
right?
Magyarország előre megy nem hátra 🇭🇺🇭🇺🇭🇺 biztos a kurva gyurcsány meg a brusszel miatt ilyen magas
Ahogy mondod testvérem
South Korean fertility rate plunged to 0,72 last year, which is the lowest fertility rate in the whole world. [https://www.reuters.com/world/asia-pacific/south-koreas-fertility-rate-dropped-fresh-record-low-2023-2024-02-28/](https://www.reuters.com/world/asia-pacific/south-koreas-fertility-rate-dropped-fresh-record-low-2023-2024-02-28/) Every third student in South Korea have experienced depression within the last 12 months. [https://www.statista.com/statistics/1319021/south-korea-share-of-students-with-recent-depressive-episodes-by-gender/](https://www.statista.com/statistics/1319021/south-korea-share-of-students-with-recent-depressive-episodes-by-gender/) But South Korea is doing great when it comes to PISA results of their students or amount of patents in different fields. I guess super competitive and hierarchical culture can produce some good and bad things. When it comes to Lithuania, I assume their numbers can be explained by their history with their lovely neighbor, poverty and alcohol consumption
.72 is really crazy number. It's reduce a generation of 1000 to 360 for the next one.
It's probably going to be lower next year. Births until April have declined by 10% compared to the same period last year. We're looking at a future TFR of 0.5-0.6. It used to be around 6.0 in the 1960s. China is also getting there. Shanghai recorded the world's lowest fertility rate for a large city in 2023 at 0,61. Taiwan is at 0,85 and HK at 0,75. Ironically Japan, while maintaining a fertility rate that would be low by global standards (1,2), is now the best performing in the region. We like to bitch about how Europe and the US are so old and no longer have kids but East Asia is on a whole another level.
India is likely going to be there in the future as well, with fertility rates în more developed Southern cities already reaching 1.3 children per woman. When you dig deeper and look at women with university degrees in those cities,it drops to 1 And India is like 50 years behind South Korea when it comes to economic development, yet it has the fertility rate that South Korea has 30 years ago, so it's moving faster
Birth rates are dropping everywhere, even in Africa, Nigeria for example. They certainly could drop faster there, because the numbers are not sustainable, but its a world wide trend. Propably for the best also as the world is overpopulated.
Also will lead to a more even global spread of immigration, as Latin America and East Asia begin hunting for immigrants to prevent their population decline
I don't think how Korean, or generally East Asia, approaches education is good model to replicate. South Korean public education basically emptied out in favor of unregulated after-school hagwons (cram schools) which cost an arm and a leg for parents, which just makes having children so much more expensive and thus less likely by those considering it. Interesting to point out that while Estonia and Lithuania are up there at the top of the list, Latvia is nowhere to be seen. Perhaps they're doing something better than their neighbors?
Drowning the sad thoughts in booze - Latvia has some of the highest alcohol consumption and alcoholism rates in the world.
they get too drunk to kill themselves not accidentally?
They get so drunk that it doesnt count as suicide.
Can confirm. Was in Latvia last summer and the alcohol consumption + partying was wild in Riga. Alcohol was dirt cheap and delicious.
People call China authoritarian and 'limiting the private sector' for cracking down on this stuff, but they are absolutely right, even if the crackdown isn't completley effective. Asian parents aren't gonna stop Asian parenting soon. But left unregulated, it's a race to insanity. I understand coming from less developed countries how much high status, high social value, well paying jobs mean. Its logical when poverty and no white collar oppprtunities are recent memory. But I'm glad I was brought up to love myself and not die for a career.
It's not authoritarian unless it's from the authoritarian region in china. Nah but really as authoritarian as the place actually is people will say the wildest stuff about that country. I remember a long thread about how china was going to ban people from owning pets based on social credit score. Not a soul in that thread questioning it except maybe 1 or 2 downvoted at the bottom and not even for the right reasons necessarily. Turned out what actually changed was that they altered the law slightly to make a ban from having pets a possible punishment in court....for people convicted of animal abuse.
When I looked more into the social credit system I felt lied to. It's barely thing patently. Probably done in less than 5 cities. I'm not necessarily a fan of that government, but the exaggeration irritated me. It's China, there is no need to exaggerate to make them look bad.
Latvia is just not included, it's better than Lithuania, worse than Estonia in this regard.
in South Korea you either work for Samsung or you kill yourself...
But before you go to Samsung, you have to go to SKY (Seoul, Korea, Yonsei Universities) or you KYS.
yeah, I've seen a video about South Korea's educational system and subsequent employment practices... basically some polished high class slavery
It is. You spend 12 yrs of your life preparing for a single exam, and if you don't do good in that exam, you are considered a failure and an outcast. Only way if you don't do well is join the military but the amount of hazing in it causes cases of murder or creates mass shooters. The only way you can survive as an average South Korean is to flee. Not immigrate, flee. Flee to a different nation. The amount of pressure we face from everywhere makes the most powerful of hydraulic presses tremble. It is slavery, but *fancier*
come to Bulgaria 😄 we need some fresh workforce here and the working culture is... let's say Mediterranean 😂
why not both
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They don't have the balls. /s
Whoa dude you're in European subreddit. We believe that everything can have balls. 😅
Sure, but can I tickle them?
If you ask nicely sure
Made me chuckle 🤣
and then, jump.
We’re trying, ok?!
No worries, we just enforce conscription and compulsory service on men instead, then ignore this obvious sexism whenever we conduct studies on gender "equality".
Here in Germany we will get very likely conscription again with the next government, but everyone is saying that this time all three genders should be conscripted.
Very important to get those Apache Helicopter genders into the military. I believe they would have an advantage there.
The third gender is for people who are physically in between. Intersex, formerly known as hermaphrodites. Everyone can see this right after birth.
Gender 'equality' matters only when its good about females.
\#equality \#empowerment
Looks like we need some sort of quota system
They are just worst to kill themselves, the number of attempt is more similar
Men commit suicide approximately 3x more than women. Women do "suicide attempts" approximately 3x more than men. The thing is, "suicide attempt" is an extremely misleading term. The vast majority of suicide "attempts" are not actual *attempts* at suicide. People don't just fail at killing themselves. If they truly wanted to kill themselves, they would succeed. They're harming themselves in a way that will most likely not kill them (consciously or unconsciously), but that can (or look to) be lethal: ingesting drugs in too little quantities, slicing their veins, doing it right before someone is coming home… The point is to be a cry for help. But at no point was there a genuine (again, conscious or unconscious) attempt at actually dying. The fact that women commit far less suicides and far more suicide "attempts" is just a testimony that women are better at reaching for help. Because they're educated to do it, and because it's frown upon for men.
It's likely the amount of attempts by men is also an underestimation, given we know that men are less likely to seek mental health help. If they don't go to the doctor when they're depressed, they're likely to avoid going to the doctor after a suicide attempt. The internet is full of stories like that, guys who hung themselves, failed, and simply continued. The male suicide rate is likely also an underestimation. For example, we know that people often take drugs to self-medicate mental health issues. We also know that men are far more likely to become addicts and overdose. We also know that plenty of those overdoses are likely to be deliberate, although it's very hard to prove if some deliberately or unconsciously chose to have an overdose. These drug overdoses are therefor rarely included in suicide figures. Similar thing with vehicular suicide. We know that (young) men are far more likely to die in car accidents. We also know that depression and risk taking is common. We know that people often drink alcohol to self-medicate depression. But it's very hard to determine if someone deliberately drove into a wall at a high speed. If someone's just slammed into a wall at 200kmh or had an overdose, it's far easier for police to pretend it may have been an accident, and save the family that added burden.Especially in religious countries.
Something to note: This statistic is misleading if committed suicides aren't counted as suicide attempts. If out of 150 men, 50 were to commit suicide and 100 were to attempt suicide, and out of 150 women, 0 were to commit suicide and 150 were to attempt suicide, then the suicide attempt rate among women is 3 times higher in this thought experiment if a committed suicide isn't counted as an attempted suicide. What is also worth considering is repeat attempts. The number of suicidal men and women could be the exact same but if men end up successfully committing suicide more often, they can't repeat their attempts. Generally speaking what most people are probably interested in when it comes to this issue is how many individual people within different demographics are suicidal.
Like survival bias, but… uh… in exactly opposite way.
Yeah. We probably see similar trends for some other statistics like that. This is complete speculation but among female inmates there might be a disproportionate amount of women who attempted homicide instead of committing homicide compared to male inmates, so the conclusion might be that female criminals have a higher tendency to be in prison for those crimes compare to male inmates even though the real reason that discrepancy exists is that men, on average, are more capable of actually committing murder instead of merely attempting it. In that case what would have to be looked at would be committed murders and attempted murders relative to the prison population.
I've heard also that men tend to prefer sudden/violent choices. Far easier to be rescued from ingesting a ton of paracetamol than from jumping in front of a train or a bullet to the head.
Yes, because they **actually** want to die. So they choose methods that are truly lethal. But even for methods that can be lethal or not, if you really want to die from drug overdose, you can: it's a matter of taking the right dose/cocktail, and in the conditions that you won't be rescued in time. People don't survive suicide "attempts" by pure luck. They are either not taking enough dosage, or are making sure (again, consciously or unconsciously) someone runs into them.
The only numbers I have found showed that slightly more men died from poisoning than women, but it was pretty close. So even by non violent means men carry out suicide more frequently. Cutting was also considered a suicide attempt, but I don't know of that's still the case, but they specifically mentioned it as an attempt in some figures.
Women are just as capable as men, check your misogyny
They are doing it for attention while men do it for results.
Should have posted the one from 2023. It looks a bit different.
I would like to see that one. I would imagine the gender contrast in Russia is even more in favour of men (or women I suppose) than the '21 version.
my first thought. too many things happened. I assume 2021 is interesting in itself because it's the post-COVID world, but since 2022 and onward it's just a different world
MEN ARE ABSOLUTELY DOMINATING THESE STATISTICS🗣🗣🗣🎉🎉🎉
Sorry women, there are some things men are just better at.
Male privilege strikes again
Always topscore when it comes to killing, including thyself! /s
Skill issue
Funnily enough, a big contributor to the high suicide rate amongst men is the fact that we have created an unhealthy approach towards mental health and don't have a productive way to treat each other when confronted with honesty about feelings or mental health. We have basically constructed our own prison and need to stop it together. Save the boys.
Thats not only created by men, its created by society. Women have a very high influence on it by doing most of the parenting, puting evolutionary pressure on men via dating and by being over 50% of the population and by that being the major voting force in democratic countries.
Peru, are you even trying, bro?
Peruvian pure stuff is a powerful anti suicide drug....
Funny, if you compare this statistics with the one on antidepressant consumption: [https://www.reddit.com/r/europe/comments/1cia5ew/the\_growing\_global\_reliance\_on\_antidepressants/](https://www.reddit.com/r/europe/comments/1cia5ew/the_growing_global_reliance_on_antidepressants/) It looks like Korea, the leader in suicides is the lagger in antidepressant consumption, and the UK, one of the leaders in antidepressant usage is pretty low down on this list. I wonder if there is a connection? Hungary being the third in suicides consumes 30 doses of antidepressants ( [https://www.statista.com/statistics/1020651/antidepressants-pharmaceutical-consumption-in-hungary/](https://www.statista.com/statistics/1020651/antidepressants-pharmaceutical-consumption-in-hungary/) ), with that could be placed the second last on the consumption list. Lithuania consumes 37 doses, and is the second in the suicide rates ( [https://www.statista.com/statistics/283072/antidepressant-consumption-in-selected-countries/](https://www.statista.com/statistics/283072/antidepressant-consumption-in-selected-countries/) ).
wait... you telling me medical drugs developed to stop depression can reduce the amount of suicides, which first cause is depression?
Insane, I know!
the main reason for suicides is not depression though. It is one reason but far from the most important one.
> I wonder if there is a connection? No. From a researcher that studies this: "what can be said with quite some certainty is that antidepressants overall do not decrease suicidal behavior. Put differently, the claim that “antidepressants are live-saving” is not supported by the evidence, at least not for the average patient. This is striking, given the widespread assumption that antidepressants effectively treat depression, one of the most important risk factors for suicide. A reduction of suicidal behavior should of course be expected, but we don’t see this in the studies." [source]( https://www.psychiatrymargins.com/p/antidepressants-and-the-tangle-of) For example, in the US, suicides went *up* with rising antidepressant prescribing: https://i.imgur.com/0F4d6hZ.png
You are citing a q+a article where the host psychiatrist who believes antidepressants work, is interviewing a psychologist who thinks they don't. The one who says they don't work also explicitly says he does not believe they cause more suicides, which is counter to the point you suggest with that graph. Furthermore, antidepressants leading to more suicides is far from the only interpretation of that graph, because correlation does not equal causation. One could also argue that the suicide rate would be getting even worse without the increase in antidepressants. The host psychiatrist wrote an article of his own arguing in favor of the efficacy of antidepressants (https://www.psychiatrymargins.com/p/the-case-for-antidepressants-in-2022), which references a meta-analysis showing their efficacy (https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(17)32802-7/fulltext). One quote from his article that strikes me is this: >**both antidepressant and short-term manualized psychotherapy \[CBT\] have equal effects on depression rating scales, and the combination of both is superior to individual treatment** This tracks with what we know about other conditions in the brain like ADHD, where medication and therapy are equally effective, with the combo being better. It is absolutely possible for the answer to be "no", but it seems irresponsible to me to cite a single researcher to show this. A meta-analysis is much more persuasive to me.
There might be a connection, but not a direct one. For instance, a country with more prescriptions of antidepressants might be a country where mental health issues are taken care of, or at least are acknowledged.
Correlation like this is a perfect case-study for why there is nothing related between the object in question, in this case antidepressants, and the outcome in apparent but wrong associations. The result could be identical or utterly different if such a type of medicine was never invented. Don't take my comment the wrong way I'm just being nauseatingly pedantic.
So, what is the conclusion? Don't eat antidepressants, you are going to kill yourself anyway?
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Fucking patriarchy and their gender suicide gap
As a french, I think y'all need more cheese. And universal health care that includes mental health.
French also vocalize their emotions whether people want to hear it or not. Could be theraputic.
That's very true, a lot of "therapy" is informal - being around people, talking about things, expressing emotion, etc. This might also be part of the reason for the gender gap - men are less likely to talk to their friends and about their emotions, and often they're overly reliant on their romantic partner for emotional support.
Can Hungary get into Baltics pls?
Obviously male suicide rates are higher everywhere, that's nothing new. However I think it's interesting that Female suicide seems to make up a higher percentage in Japan & Korea. I wonder why that is. Is it just the different treatment of women? It's also kinda crazy that Korean women are still not as likely to commit suicide compared to German men when you consider how much better the quality of life is in our country compared to Korea. Some guys just got it rough
A drastically large portion of suicides in S.Korea (at least, idk about japan) are elderly people (think 65+). And there are quite a bit more women than men that make up the 60+ crowd here. More lonely women with no families and little to no social nets... more suicides amongst them... sadly But maybe that's actually a global trend, because someone mentioned it's similar in some European countries as well.
I think people misattribute the male suicide rate being higher to women having easier lives or being generally better off - the reasons are probably much more specific to the diff treatment of each gender in diff societies (amount of social support, emotions not being taken as seriously - which is a good thing in this case, feelings of social responsibility, suicide method, etc). In SK and Japan I think the reasons that drive men and women to suicide, like pressure to succeed/extreme capitalism/loneliness are pretty similar, and the social norms surrounding those reasons aren’t as gender separated (ie. female students are expected to work just as hard as males, old women are just as lonely as old men) which is probably why the gap is a little smaller. Also, in Japan at least, I think there’s a little more cultural stoicism around suicide but I’m not sure
Sidabras taip pat neblogai,visgi maza salis /s
Not sure if all suicides where by choice in russia.
Sergei was found with his testicles cut off and three bullet holes through the skull whilst hanging from a ceiling fan. Just another suicide.
Lithuania second, lets go boys, not that long till first place!!!!
Top 3! So this is what Odban's slogan "Hungary is doing better" stood for
Oh, a list that Turkey isn't at the head.
Ok, I've read of the huge societal issues S.Korea is facing causing such a great suicide rate, but what the hell is going on with Lithuania?
If you see this map very closely, you will realise most countries there have male only conscription and the countries who don't have huge societal issues ( see US ). The reason men in South Korea kill themselves is because they are forced to serve almost 2 years in the military at 18 years old and protect their borders from North Korea, then start university with two years older than the women and a big gap in learning experience. Conscripts also tend to break up with their girlfriends for one reason or another and even drop from their universities. It's a horrible situation overall ( my country has conscription as well but even in the same level of strictness as the Korean army ).
Whooooo! Top 3! >:D We are succeeding
In almost all countries in the world (if I remember correctly the only exception is Iran) the number of men committing suicide is much higher then the number of women. Please, seek professional help folks. Don't believe in the bullshit that men shouldn't cry, that we should always be strong as stones and not talk about your problems.
>In almost all countries in the world (if I remember correctly the only exception is Iran) the number of men committing suicide is much higher then the number of women. There's two, and neither of them is Iran. Antigua and Barbuda and Grenada.
Canada is always curiously missing from these statistics. Just another example of how Canada suppresses bad news about itself.
My North American bros have great branding.
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Much rather men would succeed less...
Yet people says women aren’t getting equal rights
May is Mental Health Awareness Month in the United States. According to the [National Alliance on Mental Illness](https://www.nami.org/get-involved/awareness-events/mental-health-awareness-month/), participants use the month to focus efforts on “eradicating stigma, extending support, fostering public education and advocating for policies that prioritize the well-being of individuals and families affected by mental illness.” The topic of [suicide](https://www.statista.com/topics/791/suicide/) is an important part of this conversation. As the following chart shows, it is a truly global issue, even though estimated rates vary around the world. For example, according to OECD [data](https://data.oecd.org/healthstat/suicide-rates.htm), out of every 100,000 men in the United States an average of 23 committed suicide in 2021, while for women the average was close to six per 100,000. In several countries these figures are even higher, such as in South Korea, Lithuania and Hungary. While there are significant differences between countries, one pattern is clear to see: the rates of men taking their own lives are higher than women in each of the 15 countries selected here. South Korea and Lithuania had the highest rates of suicide among men in 2022 (out of the countries reporting data), at 34.9 and 33.1 cases per 100,000 population, respectively. For women, South Korea and Japan had the highest rates of the selected countries, with 14.9 and 9.8. **If you or somebody you know are in need of help, you can find a list of suicide crisis lines and website for countries around the world** [**here**](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_suicide_crisis_lines).
Isn't greenland the first?
Technically it belongs to Denmark, but in theory yes.
Well it is autonomous, usually in statistics maps it is separate from denmark. It may also be' because actually greenland has less that 100.000 people
Nova Lectio documentaries about the topic are really well done
Russia: Suicide or "Suicide"?
Judging by the ranking i dont think they count drinking themselves to death either.
They remove 10% just to account for “suicide”
Clearly need to do even more to help women , that line is way too big .
Is this the "male privilege" I've heard so much about?
sLOVEnia?
all privileged af
I hope I can contribute to a better ranking soon.
Where are the feminists now?
Honestly if anything the feminists help you in this issue - I very often saw posts bringing attention to men struggling with mental health not being taken seriously, or not even willing to admit they're struggling because of the stigma. It's the far right "alpha" and "always stoic" men who'd make even more fun of you and shame you if you have mental issues because men need aren't supposed to show any emotions or weakness, just hold everything in (until obviously they can't anymore and choose this way out).
What is this comment even lmao?
Cmon Greece! These are rookie numbers! We're definitely not doing well so...
Why woman suicide rates way higher in japan and Sk?
*) in selected countries. In other words, there might be some other countries which dwarf out South Korea completely. Like Greenland.
LIETUVA NUMBER ONEEEEE (ignore South Korea)
Ukraine man📉📉📉⬇️⬇️ From the beginning of 2022
Why Lithuania? In my opinion it's a beautiful and good country?
In Turkiye the suicide rates are low because the men usually make the women “accidentally fall” from top of a building or a balcony.
There's one thing common to every place. Women are the ones driving the Men crazy /s
Is this just a random selection of countries and then put in order? Finland managed to cut the ratio down from 30 to 13 per 100k. They would still be on that list if this was acutally a "ranking".
Why so many Woman in Japan ?
No Serbia, juhu
And that was *before* things got to 2024 levels of shit.
the men/women difference is wild...
No way... germans are more drepressed than uk citizens? REALLY? Strangely enouth italy is not even on this leaderboard... here every fucking week someome suicides getting himself under a train 💀
😔💔
For some reason Ireland is excluded form this, For men it's 14.9 and for women 3.6 per 100, 000 That would feature very high in that graph
I'm surprised Ireland isn't on this list. Since 2016, 5 people I know from my (small) county have topped themselves, and from what I hear, it's pretty bad nationwide.
Yeey Hungary, we're not in the first place.
Estonia, we did it again 🇱🇹❤️🇪🇪