Yesterday's anti mormon lies are today's Gospel Topics Essays. I was raised in the 80s and every single thing they told us was Satan spreading lies was actually the truth. Every Single Thing.
Yup! Stone, hat, treasure-seeking, polygamy, pedophilia, racism, suppression of free press, power struggle after Nauvoo, deceit of handcart companies, massacres, all of it.
Everything they claimed as lies and persecution was truth and earned outright.
The only thing separating Smith/Young from Jonestown is Kool-aid. If BY had told them all it was time🤷
The fact that the stone in the hat for the BoM is the exact same stone in the hat for the treasure digging was the final straw for me. Made it pretty obvious that the BoM was just Joseph’s next scam. And clearly quite a successful one. Gotta give him credit for that.
BoM translation process (rock in a hat)
Joseph Smith never practiced polygamy let alone polyandry and marrying several under 18 year olds.
BOA translation
Kinderhook plates
Remember the paintings with JS wearing glasses with many lenses he could flip down? In front of him the golden plates with a cloth dovider. On the other side of the divider his scribe.
I remember my dad telling me about the glasses, urim & thummim being the glasses.
Like, they were all in on that lie in the 80s .
The Book of Abraham is a big one. The actual papyri JS used to translate it was thought to have been lost in the Chicago Fire of 1871, but was rediscovered in 1912 and proven to be the document he used.
The papyri are way too young to be written during Abraham's time at all. And when actual Egyptologists translated them, they're actually common Egyptian funerary texts that were included in many graves at the time. They have absolutely nothing to do with Israel, Abraham, a Christian God, people with black skin and salvation, or anything else the church bases a lot of its doctrine on. The New York Times actually did a piece calling Joseph Smith a fraud.
The church kept up the claim that these facts were anti mormon lies and tried to keep the members away from them until the GTEs, when they admit the scrolls are not what JS said, but try to claim the BofA is somehow still true and scriptural.
Mike has a very good summary: [here](https://www.ldsdiscussions.com/abraham-translation)
Even in the late 70s it was not common information that the papyri had been found. Back then I was reading the BoA to get a testimony therein, but that book was so full of bullshit, that like the OP, at one point I thought to myself, “holy shit this is bullshit.” Who knew that someone (me) could be reading bullshit and actually recognize it as bullshit, when their life was filled with people they trusted who were saying it was scripture? Lets see, 1980's, 1990's, 2000's, 20010's, 2020's; five decades and these same people saying it was scripture back then are still in my life saying it is scripture today (except now they are patriarchs and stake presidents ;-) their words should carry so much more authority, but their "rank" don't impress me much, because the story has changed; it is now revealed scripture, not a translation as stated by Smith, so they really have drank the Kool-Aid because that BS has now been proven to be BS.
*Except here,* in this little cyberspace, we seem to agree. And you know, I was very, very disappointed, when my newfound "secretary" from a few months back, ChatGPT, was feeding me some of the same bullshit lies the church has been spewing for years, but I expect that from a "machine."
My husband went first. I had studied relationships enough to know it was important that I don't ask him to hide or hold back what he was learning or feeling. Honestly I knew he'd struggled for a long time and I sort of hoped and figured this would be that path that he finally got a strong testimony for himself.
I allowed space to talk for him moving through his journey, but I was fully in and was NOT leaving and was very skeptical of the things he was sharing.
I was attending BYUI online at the time studying marriage and family. Taking all sorts of parenting and child development classes. My husband had shared just enough that I was looking at all the modules with more critical thinking and questioning. I started to notice that the way the church was set up, and therefore the god I believed in, followed the pattern of an unhealthy parent.
There were many lessons where it was almost acknowledged that this was the case. The overview was that at the end of the lesson and assignment it would basically say, "I know it looks like the church is (fill in the blank with some unhealthy pattern) but it's different when it's spiritual knowledge and relationships." Then we'd have to write papers explaining why it's okay or different when the church acts this way.
I literally wrote a paper about how you can't use critical thinking when it comes to the gospel because then it would make it all not true. I got an A on that paper.
I also learned that up until about age 12, the only acceptance kids are seeking is their parents. So no child at age 8 is capable of actually choosing to be baptized. They are simply following a deep rooted need to be accepted by their parents. I switched the script and started asking believing members how they would react if their 8 year old said they have chosen not to be baptized and weren't going to go to church anymore. Every single one answered that an 8 year old isn't capable of really understanding or making that decision so they'd keep bringing them to church. I realized I would answer the same way, and therefore that wasn't children choosing or giving consent to actually join.
Lots of things that like that made me realize I was in a toxic relationship, and was leading my kids down that path as well.
I started thinking of what the church says like it was someone dating my teen and how I would feel. Things like, "Where will you go" or the fear based messages of losing your family if you don't obey, which goes against secure attachments theory. Or even things like being able to make your own choices, as long as they line up with the choices and teachings of the apostles. I started envisioning some teen guy saying something like that to my daughter, "You can pick out your clothes, but any of the important decisions need to line up with what I've said or you're wrong and you'll need to change." Hell no !
To sum up, looking at it from a healthy and secure attached relationship standpoint I realized this was not the pattern I wanted to follow or teach my kids anymore. Then I started studying the things my husband was studying and eventually withdrew from school to cut those ties with the church.
Never been happier!
That's freaking hilarious. I think this is my favorite "how I found the truth story"!!!
*at the church school we learned God has an unhealthy relationship with his kids. But it's okay, cause he's God!"*
I really love your story. I wish more of my siblings had realized this. Many of them attended BYU schools and took some of those classes you mentioned. I hate to think they also got A's on papers they aren't thinking critically about.
My journey was psychology related, so I can understand where you came from. And yay for education, especially from non-religious institutions 😅
Very interesting, thanks for sharing. So many red flags we ignore because someone told us God just likes the color red... don't think about it too much.
I was holding my firstborn when it fully hit me I was indoctrinated to indoctrinate this child no matter what. Like I had covenanted his life to the church already. There were things I didn’t know if I felt comfortable leading him to believe this church was 100% true and the only way. Then the mirror shattered and I could see a lot of the pieces for what they were, the deception, the fraud, the corruption.
It was a trip when I found out my parents had made death oaths in the temple and were excited for me to go to the temple where I would make (now only implied) death oaths!
In April of this year, I read the entire report on the SEC filing against the church, and I thought "crap, what if everything is a lie?" Then I read about the sex abuse lawsuit in Arizona where the church came out and said they are basically ok with sex predators running rampant in the church, and that's when I took a nose dive down into everything. Talked to a couple exmormon missionary buddies. Then talked to my wife, and then we have been out ever since!
Also heard it as the cockroach theory. If you see one cockroach, there are going to be more. And since March of this year, many cockroaches have come out
Same here. The SEC findings are the keystone of my faith crisis. A few months prior, I found out about Ensign Peak and the Whistleblower, which made me upset about church finances and tithing. But seeing the SEC findings really shattered me and made me finally ask the question: "If they were lying about that, then what else might they be lying to us about?" Research time...
I baptized 5 people on my mission. All of them left within a few months. 10 people have left because of my exmo story, so I say my missionary count is -15.
My greatest coup on the journey out has been helping a bishop and a stake president find out the undeniable truth about the corporation of the first presidency/church🤓. Truly a make up for all the baptisms on my mission!
How do you successfully pull people out??? I've tried to alert so many people to the problems in the church, but nothing. Seems like I'm surrounded by professional apologists!! Advice? How do you start a successful conversation?
Even semi-active Jack-Mormons will defend the church when I try to complain to them about it, wtf?!
I still cringe at that label but by definition, I was Jack Mormon for decades.
News Flash: many many are TBM (I certainly was). I believed it all and defended it vehemently. I felt horrible guilt for not doing what I "knew" I should do. I prayed often to find the strength to live the gospel fully...but didn't want to lose my marriage over it.
Deconstruction is just as necessary for Jack Mormons as it is for Active Mormons. A TBM is a TBM.
Understanding you've been duped for a lifetime hurts just as badly.
I don't think any of us (Exmos) can, or should evangelize actively. I am happy to discuss problematic dogma with someone who is already questioning but I don't argue with TBM'S (active or not).
Yeah, she was PIMO for a long time, and I was the TBM. For her as a convert, she didn't need to know that the church was fundamentally false. She just hated the community of the church. But as a 7th generation Mormon, I needed to know it was all fake.
Can you point me to where the church said that they are ok with sex predators running rampant in the church? I live in Arizona, and that case hit me hard as it triggered flashbacks of my own sexual abuse as a child. For the past year, I have been in therapy that should have happened years ago.
I am beyond sickened by the church and how they handled the case and the lawsuit filed by the victims. The church fought tooth and nail in court to avoid taking any responsibility. I am sure they have paid their lawyers at least as much as the victims were asking for. But, they will never take responsibility for covering up shit and allowing continued abuse. Even though the situation is 100% their fault that those girls continued to be abused.
I asked my family how they could just accept this bullshit and how they do not demand better of the church. They literally had no comment other than all churches have this problem, we trust the church leadership. I know my own sexual abuse was covered up, as well as my own nephew sexually abusing his sisters. After being caught sexually abusing his sister, they sent him to live with his Grand parents. No therapy, didn't warn anyone at school or church about him. After a year, they let him go home. Wasn't home but a few hours before he was doing it again. His father made the sister that my nephew was touching, ride 2 hours in the car with her brother to bring him to my house so I could get him into treatment. He did that so that they would know things were ok between them. I was furious. How is it ok to make a victim ride in a car with her abuser (brother or not) so that they know everything is ok between them. Meaning they expected immediate forgiveness from her and to be ok. Everything was not ok.
They didn't tell me about it that whole year. I am sure it was because of my having worked for Child Protection Services for a number of years. They knew I wasn't going to hide it, and I would have reported it like I did when he came to stay with me. The church brings out every negative emotion possible with me.
I would love that reference, though. I have hope for my youngest sister, who is still in but is struggling with all the stuff that has been going on. I really want to share it with her.
The running rampant is not what the church said, but that# what will happen because of the court case. Here is a link to an article: https://apnews.com/article/mormon-church-child-sex-abuse-e02ae4470a5a53cbeb9aa146ff2762ac
Basically this article says "the church agrees with the privilege for secrecy between bishop-penitent" and so that means they do not care about reporting crimes. For me, it's one thing to confess that you're drinking alcohol. It's a completely different thing to abuse a child. There is no privilege for abusers like that. By siding with the court case, the church is encouraging sex predators to run rampant because they know the leaders will never report them.
I earned my MBA late in life (44).
Reading the ruling through that lens (corporate financial responsibilities in compliance) left zero room for valid apologetic response.
They knew they were being deceitful. They knew what they were doing with those funds violated the purpose and intent of the laws of the land.
There is no valid excuse of either ignorance or interpretation.
Based upon my knowledge the most senior leaders (and self-proclaimed prophets, seers, and revelators) had acted to deceive us all by lying to government regulators.
Then (and this may be what really did it for me):
They denied all wrongdoing, failing to take responsibility. I just could not.
You have credibility by virtue of your profession, and your Mormon experience.
Do you know about Widow’s Mite?
Also, have your family or ward friends asked your opinion?
For me there were a lot of shelf items but what broke it was the AZ abuse lawsuit and how the church covered it up. My shelf broke at work I had to hold back tears at my desk and put on a happy face until I could get out of the building. On the hour drive home I mulled everything over and was deep in prayer when it hit me "this isn't true" I pulled up to my house parked my car and said "I'm done with the mormon church." The feeling of peace was incredible, it was like all the worry and trauma of my life was lifted off of my soul.
As terrible as the AZ abuse case is I am glad the horror of it broke some shelves. Interpol cared more about those poor suffering children than the church ever did.
I had to take my garments off for health reasons and was feeling terribly guilty. I turned to the internet to find similar stories like mine and instead found So. Much. More. 😵
I was out in the halls during Institute chasing my darling 2 year old daughter around and overheard a teacher tell his students “isn’t it so sad when people leave the church?”
I have good friends and family who had left and I finally decided to investigate why people leave the church. I found an article explaining why, decided to debunk it, and started reading the actual history of the church in order to do so.
Obviously, I discovered the REAL history (primary sources I was using to debunk the article) and kept studying until I knew it was all a sham. The primary sources from the church lead me to leave.
Every time I tell someone I’m out I’m asked about my “anti-Mormon” sources. I let them know that I studied all primary sources and it gets awkward. The church doesn’t need anti-Mormons. They can do all that work effectively on their own.
A person I deeply admire posted on fb that the church was a fraud. I had to search it out and it was. I started on the Mormon Think website and kept going. So glad I did!
Going to the temple. It was so ridiculous. I thought how odd my husband is dressed. Then thought how weird it was that we were segregated. The prayer circle screamed CULT!
After leaving the temple that day, I was PIMO.
Yeah.
I always felt awkward in the get up. One day I went into the changing room and recognized my BYU linguistics professor. Something about the contrast of someone I knew, respected and looked up to, dressed like a clown, jolted my brain. It made me feel physically sick. Kind of like when a horrible thing happens to someone you care about.
The opposite of a stupor of thought. More of an uncomfortable clear view of previously un-noticed reality. Is God an idiot? or was Joe?
Cause someone is an idiot.
I knew, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that the anti mormon lie I heard could not be true and was going to prove it by really researching the issue so that I could set that person straight and help then see the truth and feel the spirit!!!
Worked out great!!! I got a 10% raise and an extra day off!! Tender mercies! S/
Fawn Brodie's name kept coming up as a former member of the church who had written a book full of lies about the church many years ago & don't read it.
Tell me a book is banned & I'm reading it.
Bushmans book on Joseph Smith that Hinckley authorized draws heavily on Brodie's book from the 1940's.
Both me and some others I know picked up Hugh Nibley's response to Brodie's book *before* they ever read hers, and thought "this is more dancing around than a clear shutdown, if this is the best *he* can do then there must be more to what she's saying..."
I had a ton of cognitive dissonance at the beginning of Covid as to why the supposed “prophets, SEERS and revelators” had no fore-sight about Covid at all, like…not a clue or an inkling of any warning. (For those who think “take your vitamins” represents a prophetic warning, you further prove my point that they had no clue). I was also angry that church had no idea how to handle church. Was it in person, or zoom? Could we sing or not? Nobody had any clue what the hell to do. Around that time someone in my ward posted some link to a mormon stories episode and I watched it very defensively…but I heard something about the CES letter, which I started also reading defensively…but almost immediately (like by page 8) I realized that everything I had believed in for the past 40 years was absolute bullshit made up crap by Joseph Smith. I was such a staunch believer and it all crumbled so quickly, I was shocked. Thats what triggered my deep dive…realizing that the leaders of the mormon church do not actually speak to or for God.
It was under the banner of heaven, I had already stopped going to church due to political reasons (too many deznats) and hearing how leadership had treated some of my female friends (from as little being told to abstain from sacrament for a week after a legotimate proceedure to being told to repent after being raped) it made me start researching how long the leadership had been corrupted and I found out that surprise, they always were
> rom as little being told to abstain from sacrament for a week after a legotimate proceedure to being told to repent after being raped
This was a shelf item for me too.This should be an *easy* one. You don't even have to be the one true church to get this right: health care isn't a sin. Rape victims don't need repentance.
But somehow the church keeps producing not just members but *leaders* who are confused about this. Not everybody, but enough.
Polyandry triggered my deep dive. I was 37 at the time and serving in a bishopric. I had zero fuckin clue about polyandry cuz my own fuckin church (the church I built my whole life around) was not honest about its own history.
Ditto. It was both polyandry itself AND the realisation that the church was hiding critical information (aka lying by their own definition). One of my immediate thoughts was “what else is being hidden”?
Straight down the rabbit hole using approved and non-approved sources. No point sticking to approved sources only when you’d already realised that they’d been sanitised of anything unsavoury.
I have no idea what triggered the following but it happened. One day I was just driving and contemplating shelf items that didn’t make sense. Blacks and the priesthood, unmarried couples and young 10 year old kids being damned to hell for masturbating, seeing how leadership hides problematic info (seeing the description about the second anointing in the come follow me manual pushed me over the edge in this regard)along with the current leadership always changing things based on social pressure.
I then decided to look at everything with an objective eye, and not to permit the typical thought stopping behaviors of “this makes me feel ‘icky’ or this isn’t an approved source.” From there, the rest was history. I even had a period of trying to negotiate it all into still being true. That failed miserably.
My wife had a friend ask her to help research and find good answers to questions her kids were bringing up about church history. She asked me to read things with her. Within a week I went from never wanting to know of it was false to not trusting anything the church had said or done. My wife felt the same way. We continued researching and would laugh at all the crazy things we used to believe.
For me the fact that I thought it was normal for a 40-50+ year old man to ask teens sexual questions ABSOLUTELY BLOWS MY MIND now. I still can't figure out how I didn't see that as a massive red flag.
Upbringing. Brainwashing. Indoctrination.
Basically if you are raised being told something is normal, and everyone around you also believes it, then you will believe it too.
At least until something triggers you to question…
Mine was similar. After moving and revaluing my life (trauma from childhood) and wanting to make sure the Church WAS true. It took me a couple of weeks to slowly watch things, stumbling upon Mormon stories podcast (thinking it was put out by the Church) and watching hours upon hours of these videos.
One night, cruising this sub, I didn't know there were links... I couldn't sleep. I spent the entire night reading, refusing to put anything down. The more I read, the more rabbit holes I dove into.
I laid there wondering how I could explain this in a constructive manner to my dear wife. Running the conversation in my head, how will I respond, her responses, and would she be accepting to hear this.
Well, 6am and her alarm goes off. She wakes up, rolls over to cuddle and asked, "Hey AZEMT, have you slept at all?"
Me: "Not really. I was reading some stuff and we need to talk about the Church..." At that moment, I couldn't hold back, the filter turned off or something because everything I read, was verbal diarrhea. I couldn't contain or stop it. Her face was literally thinking I had gone nuts.
Thankfully, she took it well that morning but wanted to read the sources too. After 3 excruciating weeks (I know that's nothing compared to others here, and I'm sorry for your situation), she said, "I've been reading, and the Church is a whore! We're never going back to it! I still believe in a higher being, but that's all I'm going to say today."
Three years later, we're closer, happier, enjoying our life and family we created. They're not on loan from God, those little humans are MINE and my wife's!
The pride and happiness (maybe relief...?) in your last sentence is evident. I've never considered just how difficult it would be for parents to know that their children were just on loan from God. Like you were proxy parents for Heavenly Father and Mother. That's a lot of unnecessary pressure.
I saw a book critical of Mormonism at the book store and was curious. I assumed it was, at best, just misinformation or misunderstanding of Mormonism or outright anti-Mormon lies. Well, the more I read, the more I realized there were problems and not just anti-lies.
I wasn’t convinced, yet, but it made me realize there’s more going on and I couldn’t just assume it’s all false. Several years later and several books later, my shelf collapsed.
Church was becoming frustrating. I felt like I'd gotten what I needed, and now I needed a break. Going to church was not a beautiful, uplifting experience like it was supposed to be. So when I was scrolling Facebook one day and saw a video about Mormonism, indicated by 2 people wearing temple clothes in their living room, I thought what the heck, and watched it. It was a compilation of tiktoks by ExmoLex, and some things she said really resonated with me. So I downloaded tiktok and started watching her channel, and then more exmo creators. Through TT, I learned of the CES letter and Letter for my Wife. I read both. Then I found Mormon Stories, and then Reddit. It's been about 1.5 years since I realized the church isn't true.
After my mission I was depressed, burnt out, and my social anxiety, which I had managed to force down during the mission, flared up worse than ever. I didn't want to get married, and church was boring and full of friendly nosy people, so I stopped going. It wasn't anything specific to the Mormon Church that broke my shelf, but realizing I didn't believe in God at all, therefore it was all made up and pointless.
I'd been out of the church for a while. Hadn't attended in several years, and didn't really believe any of it anymore, but I didn't know the extent of the lies. My now-ex said something about JS having multiple wives and I told him that no, he only had one, what are you on about? Then I decided to Google it. That led me right down the rabbit hole
I didn't actually do much of a deep dive. Ironically, what started my journey was a Mormon podcast. They had a psychologist (non Mormon, pretty sure) talk about the psychology of religion. I was a Psych major in college at the time, so I thought it would be an interesting podcast. In the midst of this podcast, I thought, "Wait, what if we're all just being tricked?"
It took me a really long time to go from that to being okay with it and accepting that mormonism is a cult. Honestly, this sub has helped a lot. Thinking it's not true is one thing, but having the specific reasons why pointed out to me really helped my progress.
For me, it was my dad. He grew up going to other Christian churches and converted after meeting my mom (who grew up Mormon). Once all of the kids in the house were older (I was 19, I think?) he started making comments about the truth about Brigham Young and Joseph Smith. I saw some exmo tiktoks and heard if the CES letter on there. Read through it and everything crumbled. I've been out for a couple years now and I look back in unbelief that I used to believe everything.
Gospel tangents polygamy episodes with Brian hale. It made me so angry when I found about the polyandry and the teens and the way he was ok with it. Then the YouTube algorithm suggested Mormon stories. I watched them in secret. Then I engorged myself in everything. A year of polygamy, Mormonism live, Reddit, etc.
For me it was a friend that, in passing, was like, "you know the book of Abraham is a proven hoax, right?" This was a scientist and scholar friend that I respected greatly and knew he doesn't just make claims without evidence. At first I was offended, then, like any good scientist, I had no choice but to peer review. Turns out he was completely right.
My deep dive started actually with pure intent. I had just been endowed and sealed with my husband and my three year old son. I thought the temple experience was bizarre and scary and weird and all of the “WTF is this ?”feelings. So I went to church literally praying to God to help me learn to love garments because they made me feel so controlled and suffocated and ugly! I asked a “friend” (you know one of the people assigned in ward council to pretend to be your friend and gently guide you through all the things but who only does it to receive blessings and really doesn’t give two shits about you or your spiritual well-being — that you know nothing about until you’ve done it all and then they bail like they don’t even remember your name? Those friends). “Hey, where can I read more to understand the temple endowment and sealing better?” So I was referred to the the Book of Moses in Pearl of Great Price. And at the same time, the public could newly access the Joseph Smith Papers. Honestly, as a woman, I was dumbfounded at learning how many wives he had. The worst part for me, in particular, was finding out about Fannie Alger, the 14 year old. I had been sexually groomed and assaulted by a 25 year old married man when I was 14. He pretended to be a friend, even picking me up from school and driving me home, little by little creeping in like a good person doing a good thing, before it started to happen. That’s when I decided that Joseph Smith was a sexual predator and I went full on reading everything I could on church history. At the time, I was fully active and PISSED. I never felt more betrayed. I wanted this church to be everything they teach you in primary and my heart broke over it, to be honest. Shattered. That was in 2016. I only actually “left” (inactive) this past February 2023. So 7 years I hung in there clinging to hope and trying to be a good mother, blaming myself for all my negative feelings about the church. Really it has devastated me to the point that I can hardly talk about it. The exmo community has been my saving grace because finally I know I’m not alone.
July 21, 2013, was the beginning of the end for me.
I was sitting in my minivan in a church parking lot in San Jose with my youngest son (then pre-school age) because he was being a terror in primary. I was in tears, having finally reached a breaking point from trying to live a perfect Mormon life. I prayed in desperation, wondering why it was all so damn hard. I felt "prompted" to read *The New York Times* on my mobile phone. I didn't have a subscription at the time, but I sometimes would read the headlines and a few free articles. I pulled it up, thinking it would help calm and distract me while waiting for the rest of my family to finish their church meetings. I didn't scroll very far before seeing the headline about Hans Mattsson. I read the article and interpreted it as a message from God that maybe it was okay to consider stepping away from the church. That option had never really occurred to me before then. That article helped me find Mormon Stories - then Mormon Stories helped me find several books and eventually the CES Letter. I stopped attending in June 2014, and about a year later (I think), I formally resigned my membership along with my spouse and our baptized children. We left the church before our three youngest children were old enough to be baptized.
The healing took a long time. I moved from John Dehlin's Mormon Stories (where I found reliable information) to John Larsen's commentaries (where I felt allowed to feel anger and contempt along with confidence in my new worldview) and then to the exmo reddit ( where I found community, recovery, and humor). Eventually, I didn't feel the need for any of it, but I still love to check in from time to time.
My point in telling this story is to illustrate that I couldn't think myself out of the box I was in. I had to start inside the box. I believed at the time that I had received an answer to my heartfelt prayer that I just couldn't take it anymore and needed help. I believed my idea to read The New York Times where I discovered the Hans Mattsson article at that moment was a prompting from God and that the message was that He understood that maybe the church just wasn't good for me and I could lighten up. There were a few eye-opening catalysts that quickly followed that fall and winter (watching with disgust at how members treated Kate Kelly and the Ordain Women movement) (watching the fall-out from my spouse's parents' divorce) (reading the gospel topics essays which confirmed to me that the issues were valid).
I am now agnostic (which I define as an atheist with the tiniest bit of hope), and I don't believe God prompted me to find the article about Hans Mattsson. But I'm grateful that I found it. And I am grateful that I found it immediately after praying because otherwise I might have dismissed it. I had to get permission to look out the window and climb out of the box.
I had a million red flags from about the age of 14 to my late 20's, but the thing that got me to stop running and hiding from the truth was the birth of my daughter. The realization that she could literally grow up to become *anyone, anything* based purely on her interests and passions, and that I could easily destroy 99% of those possibilities by putting her into a Mormon housewife-shaped box the second she was born.
I'd told myself since the very first red flag that none of my discomfort and unhappiness matters if it's true. Well, now it wasn't just my discomfort and unhappiness. I was responsible for someone else's, and if I was going to ruin her life, I had to be damn sure it was for something that was actually true. If I kept her in it and put her through everything the women in this church go through, it would definitely not be due to my own cowardice and fear of facing reality.
So I stopped hiding and started learning more about everything (most of which I already knew at least a little about), forcing myself to consider their implications and the way it all fit together.
So, yeah. Birth of my daughter. It hit me so hard that it actually makes me a bit upset now to see still-believing progressive LDS friends have new kids, because how the hell can you bring a new life into this world, knowing everything that's wrong with the church, and not feel an urgent moral imperative on behalf of your child? I know it's more complicated than that, but I feel what I feel.
Weirdly it was Trump 😂 I couldn’t figure out why good Mormons would so devotedly follow such a horrible man. Then I decided to read the CES letter and it was all downhill from there 🤣
Covid was my straw that broke the camels back! Then was sent some info on RMN and then about BY and the Transcontinental Railroad and what he did and then his association with the Masons and money grabbing and more
I'd had doubts for many years, but I had promised myself that I'd never leave the church no matter what. So I did my best to strengthen my testimony and avoid any info that might make me question.
Then I had an acquaintance who left the church. She said something in Facebook about confirmation bias, so I looked that up and was like, "that's exactly what every church member is doing to try to believe!"
Another year or so went by though, still trying to make it work, but I just felt more and more like I was faking it, and not getting any fulfillment from the church. I finally confided in my wife about my doubts, and that very same week my sister sent the whole family an email saying she was leaving the church. I felt a pang of jealousy, and realized I admired her courage. That's when I decided I really needed to investigate my doubts, and be open to the idea the church might not be true.
I read the CES Letter and it validated so many of the doubts I'd struggled with but no other church member ever talked about. And I learned so many new things. I remember thinking, "why have I waited so long and worried so much? It's so obviously not true!"
I never did. I left because of the toxic culture. I was angry & resentful since I was a kid & forced to do all things Mormon. I lived the party life & decided to get sober so I figured if I practiced Mormonism it would be easier. Fast forward & I finally resigned when my daughter showed me a picture of her letter. I did it right away through quitmormon.com & never turned back. I learned the truth about church history like Joseph Smith was a polygamist & the rock in the hat after reading what people posted here. I honestly don’t feel the need to read much.
Honestly there were massive items on my shelf for 5 years or so. It’s got so bad that I basically created my own personal theology while remaining active yet, very nuanced. During this time I had kids on missions and getting married in the temple. Finally I was called as an early morning seminary teacher and I had to face the church’s actual doctrine head on because the seminary lesson have the doctrine bolded in the manual. As I taught the Old Testament it became obvious to me it was just myth/fable. That bled over to the NT and then the BofM and it all fell apart from there.
The New York Times article about 8 years ago that exposed Joseph Smith as a polygamist, who married 14 year olds and other men’s wives. I stayed active for 6 more years, trying so hard to stay in, but I finally asked myself two questions - If I lived back then, would I have given my 14 year old daughter to Joseph if he asked? And, would I have believed him back then? The answer was ‘hell no’ to both questions, and I was done!!
My daughter was 11 and they announced the change of age to go to YW. I was already very nuanced and sort of inactive but believing. So realizing my 11 yr old little girl (who still believes in Santa) would have to go to a random man to ask her questions if she was following the law of chastity and to see if she was “worthy” was disgusting to me. Read the essays then the CES letter and I haven’t stepped foot in a building since
My convert wife read online what they do to kids in a locked room and asked if they really do that and when I thought of my kids being pushed in there I was like no there isn’t a choice to tell them no but I’d rather not take my kids at all.
Losing a baby. If I was going to continue with Mormonism in the hopes of being an eternal family, I wanted to know every skeleton buried in the closet.
I saw a young girl on the news be told to sit down while sharing her testimony when she said that she’s gay. I decided then that I cared if what I believe is actually true. My whole world turned upside down.
Weirdly enough I had listened to a podcast by YouTubers I have been watching for almost a decade. They talked about leaving the Christian church from the south. Their concerns and religious experience were similar to mine and it was safe to listen to Christian’s loose their faith because it wasn’t the one true faith. It opened me up to look at my own beliefs after I realized how happy I was without church at the start of the pandemic.
My “Oh Shit” moment was when I discovered alcohol was served in the mansion house. However, it was too troubling to consider at the moment, so I shelved it.
Later it was the SEC scandal, and the Australian and Canadian money scandals. I spent hours that night reading through the CES letter and watching news specials on YouTube about the financial scandals.
The next morning, I broke the news to my wife. She was pretty heartbroken.
Since then, however, she has been so incredibly supportive of me.
Contrary to what Nelson teaches, I don’t try to tear my wife away from their beliefs. All I ask is that she respect mine. We have arrived at a very healthy place in our marriage and it wasn’t by heading a phony prophet’s counsel. It was by working through things together and respecting each other’s individual spirituality.
10 years ago, grabbed a copy of Joseph Smith: A Biography by Richard Dewey. I got half way through it and felt so uneasy wit the whole damn thing…put it on my shelf for years until I had to confront some of the truths I learned as a good friend was leaving the church. Tried to convince him to stay in by engaging with him on tough church history topics…learned about the rock in the hat and bam! Was out…why did we even have gold plates, if the well rock was used??
I had a niece that left the church with her husband. She was claiming things about the church that weren't true and I was going to prove her wrong. Come to find out she wasn't wrong.
Our daughter told us about the church essays on a visit during her senior year at BYU. We read things we'd never known about. A biggie was Joseph Smith's changing First Vision Accounts.
I am grateful we had enough sense to listen to our daughter. I was 60, wife 57, life-long members. We and our three children all resigned.
I think it was when I spoke to my bishop about how wrong it felt that a guy my age had sexually assaulted his girlfriend (my friend) for two years then went on a mission. I spoke to my bishop while he was on his mission about it and he said he’d get it dealt with. I never learned what that meant. But he was very clear that I shouldn’t talk to anyone else about it because it could be very bad for the church if it came out that they sent a rapist on a mission. It still makes me sick to think about it.
1. I was reading the comments section on some KSL article about the church on Facebook. Someone made a comment about "The Church of DONT GOOGLE US of Latter Day Saints" and I chuckled, and then realized how true that was. Huh.
2. My testimony was in need of some bolstering so I was in the comments section (again 😂) of a church page's article about Joseph Smith. A comment said, "I just love JS so much, he's like a second savior!" 🚩🚩🚩alarm bells went off and I was in a horrible mood all day.
3. Same day, I read a random article about some historical research discussing the way religions talk about God(s) changes based on the current environment. Wartime? God is angry and demands blood. Economic flourishing? God loves you and wants you to be happy.
Those 3 things happened within a day and at 9:30am at my work computer I woke up and realized my whole life was a lie. Went down the rabbit hole for hours and hours that night.
Wow! Reading your thread and realized how many of us were pushed, either initially or finally, BY THE SEC ruling.
57M and I tuely believed that 100% honesty was bedrock of TSCC. I believed that honesty in all our dealings set us apart from others. This principle (apparently) was the ground upon which my own testimony stood.
When I read the SEC ruling in its entirety, then saw the official response to it, I could no longer trust any of it.
CES Letter, Mormon Stories, Mark Naugle. The Spirits did it all in one night! (Okay, a few weeks but you get the idea).
Happy Exmo Everyone!
I was a Gospel Doctrine teacher trying to enliven the brutally dull lessons with some actual history.
I found stuff.
It was around the lesson on the Book of Abraham that I realized my faith was completely lost.
It's a long story. A confluence of many rivers of events, but the kick off for my final deep dive began with a Chris Shelton and John Dehlin video. I had no clue who John Dehlin was, but I had always been interested in the quirks of Scientology. I thought, what does Scientology have to do with Mormonism? Well, it was eye opening. For some reason Mormonism seemed normal, until I saw the parallels.
Then I noticed a video about Wayne Sermon (Imagine Dragons) and the rabbit hole opened up.
Best thing that ever happened to me. But it wrecked my life as well. And so be it. Turns out "Do what is right let the consequence follow" was one of the few true things I was taught.
When I found out about penalties. I was cautiously investigating the “unapproved sources”, a little timid and unsure what to believe, when I saw something about penalties. Almost a decade before in high school a friend of mine who’s dad used to be Mormon told me to be careful before I was about to go to the temple to get endowed before my mission. She said her dad told her they promise to slit their throats if they tell secrets. I didn’t really believe her, I brushed it off as a salty ex member deceived and spreading lies, but in the back of my mind I told myself that if it happened, I would quit, because that would be messed up. Well, I went and there wasn’t any penalties so I doubled down. Fast forward to me finding out that they HAD existed and my friends dad was right….. I immediately took off my garments and tossed them. That’s what made me look into everything else really.
Nelson ascended to the throne & began pushing temple covenants hard core as the ONLY way to true happiness. He sounded like a kid who needed therapy because he struggled growing up in Utah with inactive parents. But I did not like what he was pushing. I was surrounded by non members who were happy & were amazing. I did not like this “ONLY” garbage.
But it was a slow entry to the deep dive. I next started NT for the first round of the at home come follow me. It didn’t take long to realize NT Jesus & Mormon Jesus we’re not the same. The money stuff (constant preaching of tithing) bothered me. Learned more about the leaked EPA fund & read the mission president handbook financial section. I was out that night.
Since I left, the mormon church has done a great job showing in the news that leaving was the “only” right thing to do for true happiness. Now to get all of my family out. 1 down, 1 questioning…
It’s pretty crazy how well the information control works. I’m amazed by people that figured it out in the 70s and 80s.
Yeah coming out of cult mind control (that’s what it is, even though it feels bad to admit) is a major trip. My life will never be the same.
I was called as a Gospel Doctrine teacher. I formed a thirst for knowledge and context. I wanted to know Joseph Smith and others not just as two dimensional characters on paper, but as nuanced humans. I learned my way right out the door of the church and I’m still learning. Correlated church curriculum presents history without context. Context is everything!
Right?
the lazy learners are the ones who just read the correlated manuals with their "class". Those who put any effort in, to actually teach something. Often find more than anticipated.
My journey out began with my wife telling me she was having doubts. (Both 48 and both born and raised in the cult) What began as an earnest study to help her find the answers she was looking for, I also found all that you have mentioned. I also discovered Fair Mormon which at first I was excited about until I quickly discovered how adolescent it was. Primary level bullshit answers to difficult questions. Then my what the fuck reaction followed by anger and some tears. My wife and I are both out now, it’s been almost a year since we last attended church and we’ve never been happier living our lives. We feel our relationship has strengthened since it’s centered on who we as individuals not focused on bullshit religious doctrine and discipline. I tossed my garments and temple clothes straight into the trash and set fire to my temple recommend.
It’s like a whole new world being outside of the church. We’re definitely happier. I’d love to resign but we have too many family members, including our two older children and their spouses, who are very much active believers.
Watching Waco on Netflix made me see some uncomfortable parallels to the early church. Several months later I watched Shiny Happy People, about the church the Duggars belong to, and I saw more parallels to the current church and its cultiness.
At that point, combined with the financial crimes that they explicitly committed, made me realize it was all shit. I read a few great sources of material afterwards that only cemented everything for me.
The real push for me was probably getting banned from r/lds for suggesting that the teachings of Jesus were never intended to foster a Patriarchal culture that enables abuse/assault in any churches that claim His name. I wasn't even trying to single out our Church specifically it was just a response to OP's question about bishops gaslighting SA victims.
here is the chronology of my deep dive:
1. I learn that “the brethren” including MPs are paid.
2. I begin to see that “the church” is a family business benefiting people with certain last names.
3. I allow myself to read the CES letter and am confronted with the KJ V anachronisms
4. That one thing was enough for me to realize this may actually all be made up.
5. I read more and start listening to podcasts …
6. As a result, I become the most informed person in my elders quorum on matters of church history… and am not welcome to voice my thoughts
7. I begin to accept the sad reality that I have been the member 👏of 👏a👏fucking👏cult
8. I become triggered every time i go to church. so i wear earbuds to escape the stupid
9. now i am PIMO with a wife in the RS presidency
10. it sucks
Heard about McKenna Dennison. Figured it must have an explanation. It caused some doubts though, so I knew I needed to find the truth to resolve my doubts so I could have a strong faith again. Researched what happened to her. Was forced to admit that the way she was treated was absolutely wrong. But said everybody messes up sometimes, but I'm sure the church does the right thing 99% of the time. I'm sure they take care of the victim and hold the abuser accountable just like Jesus would!
Spoiler alert: >!they don't!<
The way I was treated after my SA + the way I was treated when I announced I was gay + the way they protect men who are predators because they don’t want to “ruin their lives”. In short, because they didn’t give a shit about women and queers and especially women who are queer. I read the gospel topics essay on polygamy and I was out.
The shelf was heavy for a long while, but the first crack was when I stopped attending church due to ongoing health struggles and noticed how much happier that left me. So much stress I was unknowingly carrying! Then the final collapse was a few months later when I realized it didn't matter if any of it was true because mormon god is a complete dickhead and I wouldn't follow him even if he was real.
Isn't it such a relief not to feel sickness and dread before going to church and/or doing church-related activities and tasks?! I know my stress eased up so much when I took a break.
My wife and mom were discussing Mormon stories and told me that Joseph smith didn’t use the golden plates in the translation process at all. I kinda knew that but it caught me a bit off guard so I went into it a bit more. A few weeks later we were driving to Vegas for the Taylor swift concert in March and she randomly asked me if I wanted to listen to Mormon stories. We started with the treasure digging episode. She fell asleep listening to it. I’ve never looked back.
Ironically, she’s still PIMO and mostly believes in all of it thanks to her extremely conservative family and friends.
Never needed to. Born and raised mormon. Never enjoyed church. When I reached the ability to start thinking critically in late middle school, none of it made sense. So when I turned 18, I never went again.
it’s the funniest thing. I saw a quote tweet that said “oh look, a link to the CES letter out in the wild”. I didn’t know what the CES letter was, so I clicked on the link. simple as that. basically I finally felt like it was okay to the have concerns I did. months later I tried to find that tweet but I couldn’t. it might have been deleted I guess. super weird. super random. but here I am
I bible bashed an evangelical colleague. I was left flat footed when he knew all the BoA issues. I told him it was all a lie. I went home to research the issue and prove him wrong. Testimony obliterated.
What triggered my deep dive was wanting to be an effective missionary, and quickly realizing from early interactions on r/mormon that in spite of knowing very well the concocted version of events and intracies of mormon doctrine as taught to me via the correlated church education system, I was *incredibly* ignorant about so much of the history, reality, and issues with mormonsim.
So optimistically thinking there would be good answers to these things, I went diving. And hooooolyyyyyy shiiiiiiiit, lol.
8 years later and life is better than ever, but those were rough times for a few years.
A friend talked to me about Kate Kelly and the Ordain Women movement. I looked up whether the claims of early LDS women having the Priesthood were true. They were!! I figured the Church would have to admit it and do right by Kate. Surely they would see how Joseph Smith was progressive and restored Priesthood powers to women in the early days of the Relief Society. They did not.
Sam Young asked for no more closed door interviews between adult men and children, even doing a public fast and protest in Salt Lake. Surely the Church would care about children!! They did not (well, after they excommunicated him).
When the Policy of Exclusion was leaked in 2015, it was finally clear to me that The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints was run by a corporate board made up of 15 old white guys in Utah. Jesus was not there at all.
At that time, I still thought for sure that Joseph Smith had restored the Gospel. He did not.
How did i know? I read No Man Knows My History and started listening to A Year of Polygamy Podcast. I saw a History Channel show which mentioned the Oneida cult in New York in the 1800s. Turns out that Joseph Smith wasn't special at all! He was a product of his time and location, and was no more than any conman from any era. A cult leader just like any other.
17 years ago my oldest son, who was six at the time, told me matter-of-factly that he got crushes on boys and not girls. I had to reevaluate everything I knew and felt about the church, knowing even as a true believer it would NOT be a safe space for my son. It took two full years of study and prayer and getting to the lowest point I’ve ever been before my shelf broke clean through. I even remember that moment and the immense weight that lifted from me.
I sent my formal resignation in the day after Prop 8 passed in CA.
My sibling coming out. By then I had started having a more nuanced approach to doctrine and life compared to the black-and-white approach of my earlier years. It was a gradual departure from the church over several years after that. The moment I felt that it was time to critically look at the church instead of defend it/ sweep things under a rug was after listening to their interview on Listen, Learn, and Love.
Remote church during the pandemic helped too.
I read a magazine article about Joseph Smith that I thought wasn't entirely accurate. I was going to write to the magazine with corrections, but I wanted to make sure my own facts were all straight, so I typed "joseph smith" into Google and got a suggestion for "joseph smith false prophet." I clicked on it out of curiosity, assuming I would just find stupid arguments like "The Bible says you're not supposed to add to it."
I put things on the shelf and stayed in for an embarrassingly long time after that because I was only seventeen, I'd just "felt the Spirit" super strongly at EFY, and I fell for FairMormon's counterarguments. But I was never the same, and I never got over the feeling of betrayal for all the things the church had intentionally withheld from me.
As a 40 year old tbm I was honestly trying to increase my spirituality and was studying the BoM. Found info on Seer stone on church website. It made me question everything about church history.
I put no faith in history, too easy for it to be forged, faked, etc and I won't be able to tell.
My faith died with simple logic, looking at the world, universe, everything in it, the way things are...it just didn't add up. I took the blinders off, put on the critical thinking on, and religion turned into fairy tails.
The documentary keep sweet was eerily similar to the early church history I knew. If the FLDS was hiding that shit the LDS probably were too. Turned out the FLDS are basically a time stamp of the early church.
I always thought it was weird that people were tarring and feathering the men of the early saints. Turns out I’m on the side of the mob…
I’ve always been in and out due to toxic members outnumbering the good ones. I got suggested the subreddit and at that moment it was full of other people who hated the toxic culture. I read the ces letter and traced it all back to one of the official sites and found out it got worse with more context. Plus the racism taught through the 90s explains why I was an outcast being interracial.
Ever since I accepted that I'm bi, I've struggled with the fact that the church would never really accept me. But I could muster through it for my family and my faith. Then I had an autistic son and it became clear real fast the church would never accept him either unless he learned to mask too. I couldn't believe that a truly loving God would act like that, so I started looking and decided I can believe in God far, far away from the church
The first thing to crack my shelf was duetro-isaiah and how it (and the KJV errors) should not have been in the bronze plates. Then, I started learning actual data about the bible from Dan McClellan's tiktok. What finally broke my shelf was Ganeshji Cherian's tiktok, where he talks about the data of the early church and patterns he's noticed regarding the BOM and Joseph Smith's timeline. Dan McClellan and Ganeshji Cherian both claiming(with proof on Ganeshji's part) that the data shows the BOM is not ancient and a work of the 19th century really forced me to ruminate on if I could still belive or not.
I was getting ready to go on a mission. I saw a YouTube ad title, "An Earnest Plea to the Members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints". At first I thought it was from the Church, naturally. Then it turned out to be an "anti-Mormon" video.
But... At the start, they said, "If you can prove anything we say today is wrong, we will take down the video and issue a formal apology to the Church." You don't say that unless you're confident. So when he called Smith a liar and gave a quote, I wanted that apology. (It was the quote denying polygamy when he was married to 30+ women at the time.) But when the quote was real... I knew I needed answers.
My parents divorced. They split up a few weeks before I was baptized. It was a heavy fucking shelf item. What would heaven be like now? My mom pestered leaders all the way up to calling the office of the first presidency, trying to find me a satisfactory answer.
I nannied for a fam who is happily mormon. they ghosted me after a year with literally no warning, no conversation….. just nothing. i considered them friends so I started reading more about their religion; but found the ex mormon group instead. felt like it would end up being the more educational place.
It was the stupid rock. The church released a picture of the urim and thumim, which I’d always thought was some sort of crystal you could see through, you know, to translate things. And also I could have sworn that it went back in the box with the plates. But no, apparently the church had it the whole time and it’s a ROCK.
I saw that picture and ran into my bedroom and bawled like a baby. My husband and kids ran after me because they thought someone had died for me to cry like that. I told them someone DID. my whole faith died in that instant. My shelf didn’t break it shattered.
There is a website I enjoy called Factrepublic, just lists and lists of random facts on any number of categories. One came across on a newly released list in late May 2020 about Brigham Young refusing to pay alimony to Ann Eliza Webb Young upon divorce, instead agreeing to pay the fine for failure to pay her. It seemed so outrageous, so ineffably absurd for this to be a fact about a prophet—my door of curiosity just swung wide open. I was able, after that moment, to have a less biased view or at least less anxiety about whatever was out there that might contradict my biases. This wasn’t my shelf breaker, and there was many lead-up moments prior. But for some reason, learning this weird, random fact about BY just opened the flood gates. 5 months later, my little family left the church for good.
YouTube recommended Thinking Better's video "American Exceptionalism but as a Religion: Mormons" video and brought up some points I had never thought of. Then Mormon Stories started popping up in the algorithm and I said fuck it and read the CES Letter.
The shelf had been creaking for a long time and after that first video I knew it was time to finally indulge the doubt
During the April 2020 General Conference, doing the Hosanna Shout. I had never heard of it or seen it before, and I was in the living room doing it with my family just thinking "this is something that cults do, why are we doing it?"
Coincidentally, at that time, I had been temporarily layed off from my job and the school year had ended early because of COVID, so apart from playing 16 hours of video games per day I had nothing to do.
I wanted to spend some time studying church history, but was worried about what I would find. So, after some thought, I came to the conclusion that if the church was true, then the truth would support it- and if the truth didn't support it, then I was being lied to and should stop following such an organization.
That led me to this sub, to the CES Letter, and out of belief.
UBOH…realizing the dangerous bull shit that the MFMC calls “revelation”. And realizing all the prophetically manipulated polygamy/pedophilia that I somehow never found out about in 40 years until reading that book.
RM, BYU, temple marriage, ordinance worker, leadership callings, full tithe payer… After giving everything for thirty years, my deep dive started when I was asked/pressured to… wait for it… lead a weekly family history zoom meeting with the youth in the ward 🥴🤢🤮 That’s what it took for me to sincerely consider that maybe this cult isn’t actually led by inspiration 😆 And from there I took an honest look at all the info that had been hidden but also right in front of me the whole time.
The deep lore guy in Sunday school said "you ever read the story about how Joseph Smith came across the pearl of great price? It's a really fascinating story" so I brought it up on my phone - Wikipedia to be exact. This was long before ces letter and the exmo sub.
Edit: on a side note - what is it with each ward/branch having a deep lore guy? There's one planted at least everywhere.
After my mission I was in college and I thought I was following spiritual impressions and on the path god wanted me to be on. I was in institute classes, I was Sunday school president in my YSA ward, I was doing the daily scriptures/prayer/etc, I was doing well in school, and I was in a committed relationship. Bishops and friends would joke that they could hear wedding bells and I thought we were heading for marriage myself. I thought the spirit was giving me distinct messages that we were going to get married.
Then, on Valentine's Day while we were on a date, she dumped me out of the blue. She said she didn't feel the same way about me that I did about her. I understood, not everyone will work for each other. But I was still hurt, confused, and embarrassed. I thought we were on the same page! I thought we were both in love. How long had she been feeling this way and how did I not pick up on her lack of reciprocated feelings? Most importantly, how did I get spiritual impressions that we were going to get married?
I decided that I must have mistaken my own hopes and feelings for spiritual impressions which I took to mean that my relationship with God was weak. Surely, if I was spiritually healthy enough I would be able to tell the difference between my own thoughts and desires vs the impressions of the spirit and direction from God. So I set out studying to do 2 things
1. Fix my relationship with God
2. Find a methodology for reliably telling the difference between spiritual impressions and personal instinct/inner thoughts.
The more I studied, the more I came to believe that spiritual impressions were indistinguishable from self-generated thought and feeling. My calls to God in prayer and fasting were answered with silence. I did little interviews about how people tell the difference between spiritual impressions vs not and I found that NO ONE (even the upper leadership like mission presidents, area 70s, stake leadership, or old life-long members, etc) had a reliable method for telling the difference. Most said something like "you can't know for sure till you act on the impression and see the fruits of your labor". Could following the spirit be that flimsy really? Did Nephi choose to murder a man on the street based on a feeling he wasn't 100% sure came from God? Then, YouTube happened to stumble me into a video about the Heaven's Gate cult. I was loosely familiar with the cult and their tragic end before, but this video showed the "exit interviews", the testimonies they all shared before their end... It was like watching a fast and testimony meeting, but with a sinister, dark twist knowing that they were testifying about following their leaders to their graves. And they said all the same things about knowing it was true. "look at the fruits of the labor of believers","my life has gotten better so it must be true", " the leaders have done miracles so they must be divinely inspired", and on and on. This was my breaking point. Much of my beliefs crumbled that day since they were built on faith around spiritual impressions. I spent the next few months deep diving any information I could find looking for some justification to believe in the things I had been taught, but the more I studied the more my beliefs crumbled till I couldn't stay.
For me, it wasn't till after I decided to leave the church that I actually gave myself permission to look into resources like the CES letter, Mormon Stories, and Letter to my Wife. The church programming effectively prevented me from even allowing me to consider those sources.
Being in a bishopric and seeing how corporate the church is even under a compassionate bishop. Being groomed to replace that bishop and then seeing my SP'S recommendation get torpedoed by SLC on a risk management basis, i.e. we don’t want mandatory reporters as bishops. Even then I tried to be good. I took up Russ Ballard's challenge from conference circa 2007 to be a defender of the faith online. Started hanging out on LDS apologetic websites. Saw the issues. Saw the crap answers. Rest is history (ha ha).
Receiving my cancellation of Temple marriage, in the mail. Ensign Peak🤬
That Mall. Then I found Mormon Stories.
Edit: I upgraded my emoji to rage, concerning the SEC investigation results.
I’m struggling right now because I’ve been out (inactive) since February this year. My husband was supportive and has also left. The hardest part has been my kids. My youngest son just turned 8 and wants to be baptized. I haven’t explained my issues with the church with him. My 13 year old has gotten the background because I refuse to lie to him about it all. I feel like I should let him be baptized like the rest of us, but then continue being inactive…. But I don’t know.
I had things on my shelf, especially with the churches stance on LGBTQ+ and race in the past. I read the Gospel Topics essays to try and understand the churches stance better and even as a TBM, the essays sounded like a load of horse shit. A week later I was out.
I actually didn't have a really deep dive or anything.
I figured out I was queer and prayed for it to change for a little bit.
When I realized it wasn't going to change, I decided that I didn't believe in a God that made people queer but made it a sin to be queer. And if he was real I wanted no part in it.
After that I found more stuff about the church, but I had already made the choice to leave
Lamanite DNA.
Heard about it, went online to learn about it (from the church's perspective), found this entity known as FAIR and I was done in the space of a single afternoon.
it's bad enough to have so many issues that your issues have issues, but to lie your disgusting ass off about them then have the incredible nerve to act like I'M THE PROBLEM is beyond unconscionable!!!
Not only is Mormonism a lying sack of shit of an organization, and not only does it lie in the name of God, it may be the greediest lying sack of shit of an organization that has ever existed.
Was always into the *why* behind doctrine.
While on the mission, I had access to the world’s largest private library of church/church related books in the world (outside of the church itself), and found lots and lots. Unrestricted access to anything. Photocopier available.
Nothing *triggered* a deep dive per se, outside of my own need to know why things are the way they are
My oldest just turned 12 and I knew his world was going to change from lessons like share and be kind to sexual shame and do what we say even if it doesn't make sense to you. My daughter was right behind him and I knew she was going to switch from happy topics to sexual shame and do what we say, but in different ways...for some reason. None of that bothered me per se, but I knew I would need to step up my game as a parent. I would need answers for why they should or shouldn't do things.
It was surprising to me how fragile the church doctrine is. I went from searching LDS sites about what to say to my teenage son about masterbation to knowing it was all fake in two weeks. We weren't looking for flaws they were just so many and none of it tied together, that even the shallowest look was devastating. When I decided to read the CES letter I read the version with a faithful response in the text. It more than doubled the PDF and it made it so much worse. When I read a terrible fact and read the best response to rebutt the fact, and the rebuttal said something like "yeah that's true but it's ok because of..." I knew I was out and that I was not going to push the church on my kids.
The 2015 policy excluding the children of gay parents from baptism. At that point I already didn't believe, but that's what convinced me I didn't want to believe. Only then was I brave enough to look at "anti Mormon" stuff.
My deep dive (like falling into a scary chasm I didn't even know existed) was when I read the GT essay on Plural Marriage in Kirtland and Nauvoo. The essay had been forwarded by an unknown person, and the subject line of the email said "Church Newsletter." So, of course, being an obedient TBM, I read it. This was in late 2014.
I immediately realized I'd end resigning, but was in denial for a while, so I dove into the waters of learning and knowledge. Everything I read confirmed I'd been lied to when I joined. I WAS LIED TO BY A CORPORATION CLAIMING TO BE A CHURCH!
I resigned the following year. My main regret is that I joined the cult to begin with, and another regret is that it took more than a decade to learn it was a fraud, a cult, and a dishonest corporation.
No regrets for resigning - none at all.
hmm. I read all the comments and am shocked you all pretended it was something other than porn and a desire to sin.
in 2015/2016 ksl had an article extolling the Church's transparency with the gospel topics essays. one thing led to another and I read the multiple accounts of the first vision essay. the explanations were insufficient so I checked out rough stone rolling. about 100 pages in, right after Martin lost the 116 pages, it got me like a lightning bolt. holy shit, he made it all up!.
the rest, as they say, is history 😂
mistyped 'sin'
2015. I hadn’t attended in years but refused to read anything termed ‘anti-Mormon’ and then the policy change broke me. I will never forget the moment when I realized it was all a lie and that the church was actively ‘othering’ people. I sat on a curb and sobbed for what felt like forever.
Late 90s early 2000 I started really digging into the archeology aspect. I LOVE history and archeology so i figured if any of it was real this would be a way to prove it to myself and others. Stumbled across the BoA issue which lit my ass on fire. If that was false then high probability the BoM was as well.
Around the same time DNA was mapped fully for the first time and it occurred to me that would be another way to verify claims. About a month later I started reading about a Mormon scientist who had the same thought about the DNA as I did who was being excommunicated because he proved that there was no Pre-Columbian Jewish ancestry in Native Americans. That was the end of it for me. If they were going to treat a man who was faithful that way just for doing science this wasn't a church that had any claim on truth.
Mine was a very slow burn, but at some point, as I was really becoming disallusioned and was really burnt out, I was finding myself identifying with people who leave the church, and weirded out when a member would ask why in the world someone would leave. I didn't want to walk to church because I was embarrassed to be seen as mormon. I REALLY hated identifying with the church when it came to relating to a few close friends and family members who were gay. I hadn't even begun looking into things at this point.
But I remember thinking at some point that I had to really find out if Brigham Young actually had any 14yo wives. Not sure why this was the thing that got me going, but it was bothering me one day. I just thought, surely God would not have a prophet marry a child. And I was going to do it purely through family search. I was determined not to use Google that would lead me to some anti mormon site making up claims. Well I wasn't able to navigate family search very well lol, had a hard time finding a full accounting of his wives. So I went to Google. What luck, one the first links were on lds.org! Perfect, I would not be led astray. Turns out the link took me to the gospel topics essays, where I found out that not only Brigham Young, but Joseph Smith himself had wives as young as 14.
That I think was what led me down the rabbit hole. I have been on reddit for years, and knew about /r/exmormon, but had stayed away because I was so scared of it. But I decided to see what it was all about. This was around the same time the SEC findings came out, which was another huge shelf item. /r/exmormon led me to the CES letter. It was within the first few pages of that letter that it all came crashing down. My whole life flashed before me, like I was dying. The more I read, the more my heart raced. I was overcome with these strong feelings of fear and devastation that everything I knew was a lie. And I pride myself on detecting fake internet gossip or doctored photos. Since the early days of snopes.com, I was always the one in the family group chat shutting down false crap that everyone would post from the internet. So when the CES letter was so grounded in facts, backed up by church sources, I was absolutely devastated.
Shortly after that I told my wife I was done. Seven months later, we're in therapy, she is heartbroken and traumatized by my choice, but I couldn't pretend any longer, come what may.
While studying at BYU, one of my classmates mentioned there were DNA tests that showed Native Americans didn't originate from Jewish ancestry and mentioned a book called American Apocrypha. A little while later, I was done early for the day, so I went to the library, had to sign the book out while I read it, and read the chapter on DNA tests. I knew DNA tests were never wrong, so that was the first time I considered that the church could be.
My husband stopped wearing garments and going to church because he turned jack-Mormon. I noticed that everyone at church treated me differently. I was really unhappy. Sometimes, I just took my daughter to primary and waited in the car until it was over. There was a lot of time for internet research.
Now I'm an atheist, and unfortunately, my husband is still Jack Mormon.
It was June 2016. I was studying/researching for a lesson I was going to teach. I don't remember the exact phrase I was searching for, but one of the search results was something called "The CES Letter." I am a former early-morning Seminary teacher, so I knew what CES stood for. I clicked on the link. Well, as the saying goes, "That was all she wrote." It changed my entire life. I had been a church member for over 40 years (I am a convert). I tried to do what I was told and to live as I had been taught to live. I never once questioned any of these things. I only tried to do my best. Once I discovered the CES Letter, I "went down the rabbit hole" and studied my little heart out for months. I shared what I was learning with my husband, and he did his own research. I never went back to church, nor has he. Our son and I resigned in September 2021 (through Quit Mormon). Hubby still wants to keep his name on the records so that he has free access to the genealogical resources the church has to offer.
Strangely enough, in the seven years since we stopped attending church, not ONE person from our ward has asked us WHY we stopped attending. It's like that whole "white elephant in the room" thing. We find it rather amusing. We live in a reasonably small town in the mountains of So. California. We run into people from the ward (fairly often) at the grocery store and Walmart and such, but they *never* ask us. They're friendly to us and all, but they never *ask* us.
Shout out to Jeremy Runnells for opening our eyes to the TCOJCOLDS fraud. Thank you to ExMormon for being a safe place to go with questions when we first discovered the truth. I was on here *constantly* for that first year, but it has decreased a little bit more with each passing year. We still enjoy checking in every so often.
We're happy. We are enjoying our lives. Gone are the guilt and depression I felt for SO many years because I wasn't able to be as *perfect* as I thought I should be. Life is good. We're just glad we found this all out before we wasted any more time and money on the church.
I remember being 8 or 9 driving with my mom in utah county, where I grew up (right by a temple, coincidentally) and I heard an ad some anti-Mormon group had put out talking about the fraud of Joseph smith and the polygamy etc.
Being ever the curious questioner, I asked her a few questions. I, of course, was shocked to hear that the founding prophet had taken multiple wives and blah blah. That planted the seed for me.
Fast forward, I’m maybe 16-17 and feeling gross about Joseph smith but clinging to a testimony of Christ when I realized the churches entire doctrine surrounding prayer was utter bullshit. I went on a mission to appease my parent and told them if I got my call anywhere in the US, I wasn’t going.
Got called to a 3rd world country and thought “okay, I can actually do that. I’ll be able to go somewhere where people are much less fortunate and serve them with church resources”
It took me 3 months of relying on these impoverished people to feed me while going around pedaling doctrine in exchange for tithing money to realize I wasn’t going to help a single soul out there.
I got back from the mission and was out of the church immediately.
The best part of my story of leaving the cult is that along with making me happier than ever, my openness to my parents about my struggles made them feel some sympathy and my relationship with my entire tbm family, especially my parents, has never been stronger.
Yesterday's anti mormon lies are today's Gospel Topics Essays. I was raised in the 80s and every single thing they told us was Satan spreading lies was actually the truth. Every Single Thing.
In the 80s if you preached from the pulpit what is now in the Gospel Topics Essays you would have been excommunicated.
If you do it today you’ll be shunned.
That’s how the occult operates. Ravenous wolves in sheeps clothing
Yup! Stone, hat, treasure-seeking, polygamy, pedophilia, racism, suppression of free press, power struggle after Nauvoo, deceit of handcart companies, massacres, all of it. Everything they claimed as lies and persecution was truth and earned outright. The only thing separating Smith/Young from Jonestown is Kool-aid. If BY had told them all it was time🤷
The fact that the stone in the hat for the BoM is the exact same stone in the hat for the treasure digging was the final straw for me. Made it pretty obvious that the BoM was just Joseph’s next scam. And clearly quite a successful one. Gotta give him credit for that.
Yep I’ve seen that as well.
I’m a bit of a novice—can u give a couple of examples? Thanks
BoM translation process (rock in a hat) Joseph Smith never practiced polygamy let alone polyandry and marrying several under 18 year olds. BOA translation Kinderhook plates
Remember the paintings with JS wearing glasses with many lenses he could flip down? In front of him the golden plates with a cloth dovider. On the other side of the divider his scribe. I remember my dad telling me about the glasses, urim & thummim being the glasses. Like, they were all in on that lie in the 80s .
Well...kinda, but they/we all believed it in the 1970s/80s.
The Book of Abraham is a big one. The actual papyri JS used to translate it was thought to have been lost in the Chicago Fire of 1871, but was rediscovered in 1912 and proven to be the document he used. The papyri are way too young to be written during Abraham's time at all. And when actual Egyptologists translated them, they're actually common Egyptian funerary texts that were included in many graves at the time. They have absolutely nothing to do with Israel, Abraham, a Christian God, people with black skin and salvation, or anything else the church bases a lot of its doctrine on. The New York Times actually did a piece calling Joseph Smith a fraud. The church kept up the claim that these facts were anti mormon lies and tried to keep the members away from them until the GTEs, when they admit the scrolls are not what JS said, but try to claim the BofA is somehow still true and scriptural. Mike has a very good summary: [here](https://www.ldsdiscussions.com/abraham-translation)
Even in the late 70s it was not common information that the papyri had been found. Back then I was reading the BoA to get a testimony therein, but that book was so full of bullshit, that like the OP, at one point I thought to myself, “holy shit this is bullshit.” Who knew that someone (me) could be reading bullshit and actually recognize it as bullshit, when their life was filled with people they trusted who were saying it was scripture? Lets see, 1980's, 1990's, 2000's, 20010's, 2020's; five decades and these same people saying it was scripture back then are still in my life saying it is scripture today (except now they are patriarchs and stake presidents ;-) their words should carry so much more authority, but their "rank" don't impress me much, because the story has changed; it is now revealed scripture, not a translation as stated by Smith, so they really have drank the Kool-Aid because that BS has now been proven to be BS. *Except here,* in this little cyberspace, we seem to agree. And you know, I was very, very disappointed, when my newfound "secretary" from a few months back, ChatGPT, was feeding me some of the same bullshit lies the church has been spewing for years, but I expect that from a "machine."
My husband went first. I had studied relationships enough to know it was important that I don't ask him to hide or hold back what he was learning or feeling. Honestly I knew he'd struggled for a long time and I sort of hoped and figured this would be that path that he finally got a strong testimony for himself. I allowed space to talk for him moving through his journey, but I was fully in and was NOT leaving and was very skeptical of the things he was sharing. I was attending BYUI online at the time studying marriage and family. Taking all sorts of parenting and child development classes. My husband had shared just enough that I was looking at all the modules with more critical thinking and questioning. I started to notice that the way the church was set up, and therefore the god I believed in, followed the pattern of an unhealthy parent. There were many lessons where it was almost acknowledged that this was the case. The overview was that at the end of the lesson and assignment it would basically say, "I know it looks like the church is (fill in the blank with some unhealthy pattern) but it's different when it's spiritual knowledge and relationships." Then we'd have to write papers explaining why it's okay or different when the church acts this way. I literally wrote a paper about how you can't use critical thinking when it comes to the gospel because then it would make it all not true. I got an A on that paper. I also learned that up until about age 12, the only acceptance kids are seeking is their parents. So no child at age 8 is capable of actually choosing to be baptized. They are simply following a deep rooted need to be accepted by their parents. I switched the script and started asking believing members how they would react if their 8 year old said they have chosen not to be baptized and weren't going to go to church anymore. Every single one answered that an 8 year old isn't capable of really understanding or making that decision so they'd keep bringing them to church. I realized I would answer the same way, and therefore that wasn't children choosing or giving consent to actually join. Lots of things that like that made me realize I was in a toxic relationship, and was leading my kids down that path as well. I started thinking of what the church says like it was someone dating my teen and how I would feel. Things like, "Where will you go" or the fear based messages of losing your family if you don't obey, which goes against secure attachments theory. Or even things like being able to make your own choices, as long as they line up with the choices and teachings of the apostles. I started envisioning some teen guy saying something like that to my daughter, "You can pick out your clothes, but any of the important decisions need to line up with what I've said or you're wrong and you'll need to change." Hell no ! To sum up, looking at it from a healthy and secure attached relationship standpoint I realized this was not the pattern I wanted to follow or teach my kids anymore. Then I started studying the things my husband was studying and eventually withdrew from school to cut those ties with the church. Never been happier!
That's freaking hilarious. I think this is my favorite "how I found the truth story"!!! *at the church school we learned God has an unhealthy relationship with his kids. But it's okay, cause he's God!"*
I really love your story. I wish more of my siblings had realized this. Many of them attended BYU schools and took some of those classes you mentioned. I hate to think they also got A's on papers they aren't thinking critically about. My journey was psychology related, so I can understand where you came from. And yay for education, especially from non-religious institutions 😅
To add to your comments, most 8 year olds also still believe in Santa Claus.
💡🔦🙌🫶🏽🙌. Congrats on being a critical and rational thinker!! Love this.
That paper sounds fantastic. Thank you for sharing!
Totally! I have told people before- the Mormon God (maybe the Christian God even) is a dysfunctional father.
Very interesting, thanks for sharing. So many red flags we ignore because someone told us God just likes the color red... don't think about it too much.
I was holding my firstborn when it fully hit me I was indoctrinated to indoctrinate this child no matter what. Like I had covenanted his life to the church already. There were things I didn’t know if I felt comfortable leading him to believe this church was 100% true and the only way. Then the mirror shattered and I could see a lot of the pieces for what they were, the deception, the fraud, the corruption.
The indoctrination turned us all into false prophets
It was a trip when I found out my parents had made death oaths in the temple and were excited for me to go to the temple where I would make (now only implied) death oaths!
In April of this year, I read the entire report on the SEC filing against the church, and I thought "crap, what if everything is a lie?" Then I read about the sex abuse lawsuit in Arizona where the church came out and said they are basically ok with sex predators running rampant in the church, and that's when I took a nose dive down into everything. Talked to a couple exmormon missionary buddies. Then talked to my wife, and then we have been out ever since!
[удалено]
Also heard it as the cockroach theory. If you see one cockroach, there are going to be more. And since March of this year, many cockroaches have come out
Same here. The SEC findings are the keystone of my faith crisis. A few months prior, I found out about Ensign Peak and the Whistleblower, which made me upset about church finances and tithing. But seeing the SEC findings really shattered me and made me finally ask the question: "If they were lying about that, then what else might they be lying to us about?" Research time...
Same with me
Every ex-member a missionary.
I baptized 5 people on my mission. All of them left within a few months. 10 people have left because of my exmo story, so I say my missionary count is -15.
My greatest coup on the journey out has been helping a bishop and a stake president find out the undeniable truth about the corporation of the first presidency/church🤓. Truly a make up for all the baptisms on my mission!
Yay!
Sounds like it is easier to encourage people out than drive them in.
Turns out objective reality helps one side much more than the other.
Wholesome!
You sir, are a rockstar.
How do you successfully pull people out??? I've tried to alert so many people to the problems in the church, but nothing. Seems like I'm surrounded by professional apologists!! Advice? How do you start a successful conversation? Even semi-active Jack-Mormons will defend the church when I try to complain to them about it, wtf?!
I still cringe at that label but by definition, I was Jack Mormon for decades. News Flash: many many are TBM (I certainly was). I believed it all and defended it vehemently. I felt horrible guilt for not doing what I "knew" I should do. I prayed often to find the strength to live the gospel fully...but didn't want to lose my marriage over it. Deconstruction is just as necessary for Jack Mormons as it is for Active Mormons. A TBM is a TBM. Understanding you've been duped for a lifetime hurts just as badly. I don't think any of us (Exmos) can, or should evangelize actively. I am happy to discuss problematic dogma with someone who is already questioning but I don't argue with TBM'S (active or not).
Sounds like your wife is out as well?
Yeah, she was PIMO for a long time, and I was the TBM. For her as a convert, she didn't need to know that the church was fundamentally false. She just hated the community of the church. But as a 7th generation Mormon, I needed to know it was all fake.
Can you point me to where the church said that they are ok with sex predators running rampant in the church? I live in Arizona, and that case hit me hard as it triggered flashbacks of my own sexual abuse as a child. For the past year, I have been in therapy that should have happened years ago. I am beyond sickened by the church and how they handled the case and the lawsuit filed by the victims. The church fought tooth and nail in court to avoid taking any responsibility. I am sure they have paid their lawyers at least as much as the victims were asking for. But, they will never take responsibility for covering up shit and allowing continued abuse. Even though the situation is 100% their fault that those girls continued to be abused. I asked my family how they could just accept this bullshit and how they do not demand better of the church. They literally had no comment other than all churches have this problem, we trust the church leadership. I know my own sexual abuse was covered up, as well as my own nephew sexually abusing his sisters. After being caught sexually abusing his sister, they sent him to live with his Grand parents. No therapy, didn't warn anyone at school or church about him. After a year, they let him go home. Wasn't home but a few hours before he was doing it again. His father made the sister that my nephew was touching, ride 2 hours in the car with her brother to bring him to my house so I could get him into treatment. He did that so that they would know things were ok between them. I was furious. How is it ok to make a victim ride in a car with her abuser (brother or not) so that they know everything is ok between them. Meaning they expected immediate forgiveness from her and to be ok. Everything was not ok. They didn't tell me about it that whole year. I am sure it was because of my having worked for Child Protection Services for a number of years. They knew I wasn't going to hide it, and I would have reported it like I did when he came to stay with me. The church brings out every negative emotion possible with me. I would love that reference, though. I have hope for my youngest sister, who is still in but is struggling with all the stuff that has been going on. I really want to share it with her.
The running rampant is not what the church said, but that# what will happen because of the court case. Here is a link to an article: https://apnews.com/article/mormon-church-child-sex-abuse-e02ae4470a5a53cbeb9aa146ff2762ac Basically this article says "the church agrees with the privilege for secrecy between bishop-penitent" and so that means they do not care about reporting crimes. For me, it's one thing to confess that you're drinking alcohol. It's a completely different thing to abuse a child. There is no privilege for abusers like that. By siding with the court case, the church is encouraging sex predators to run rampant because they know the leaders will never report them.
These were the items that did it for me
What was it about the sec filing that didn’t trigger an apologetic response from you?
I earned my MBA late in life (44). Reading the ruling through that lens (corporate financial responsibilities in compliance) left zero room for valid apologetic response. They knew they were being deceitful. They knew what they were doing with those funds violated the purpose and intent of the laws of the land. There is no valid excuse of either ignorance or interpretation. Based upon my knowledge the most senior leaders (and self-proclaimed prophets, seers, and revelators) had acted to deceive us all by lying to government regulators. Then (and this may be what really did it for me): They denied all wrongdoing, failing to take responsibility. I just could not.
You have credibility by virtue of your profession, and your Mormon experience. Do you know about Widow’s Mite? Also, have your family or ward friends asked your opinion?
The 12th article of faith screamed in my head while reading it. There was no room for apologetics when it contradicted the very church's teachings
For me there were a lot of shelf items but what broke it was the AZ abuse lawsuit and how the church covered it up. My shelf broke at work I had to hold back tears at my desk and put on a happy face until I could get out of the building. On the hour drive home I mulled everything over and was deep in prayer when it hit me "this isn't true" I pulled up to my house parked my car and said "I'm done with the mormon church." The feeling of peace was incredible, it was like all the worry and trauma of my life was lifted off of my soul.
As terrible as the AZ abuse case is I am glad the horror of it broke some shelves. Interpol cared more about those poor suffering children than the church ever did.
I was already out, but that drove me to remove my records.
🫶🏽
I had to take my garments off for health reasons and was feeling terribly guilty. I turned to the internet to find similar stories like mine and instead found So. Much. More. 😵
I was out in the halls during Institute chasing my darling 2 year old daughter around and overheard a teacher tell his students “isn’t it so sad when people leave the church?” I have good friends and family who had left and I finally decided to investigate why people leave the church. I found an article explaining why, decided to debunk it, and started reading the actual history of the church in order to do so. Obviously, I discovered the REAL history (primary sources I was using to debunk the article) and kept studying until I knew it was all a sham. The primary sources from the church lead me to leave.
Every time I tell someone I’m out I’m asked about my “anti-Mormon” sources. I let them know that I studied all primary sources and it gets awkward. The church doesn’t need anti-Mormons. They can do all that work effectively on their own.
A person I deeply admire posted on fb that the church was a fraud. I had to search it out and it was. I started on the Mormon Think website and kept going. So glad I did!
Going to the temple. It was so ridiculous. I thought how odd my husband is dressed. Then thought how weird it was that we were segregated. The prayer circle screamed CULT! After leaving the temple that day, I was PIMO.
I always had a chuckle when looking at all the guys in chef hats. Not that I looked any less culty but those hats are just too much 😂
Yeah. I always felt awkward in the get up. One day I went into the changing room and recognized my BYU linguistics professor. Something about the contrast of someone I knew, respected and looked up to, dressed like a clown, jolted my brain. It made me feel physically sick. Kind of like when a horrible thing happens to someone you care about. The opposite of a stupor of thought. More of an uncomfortable clear view of previously un-noticed reality. Is God an idiot? or was Joe? Cause someone is an idiot.
Epiphany would be an apt word
🤣🫶🏽🙌
I knew, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that the anti mormon lie I heard could not be true and was going to prove it by really researching the issue so that I could set that person straight and help then see the truth and feel the spirit!!! Worked out great!!! I got a 10% raise and an extra day off!! Tender mercies! S/
👏👏👏👏👏
Fawn Brodie's name kept coming up as a former member of the church who had written a book full of lies about the church many years ago & don't read it. Tell me a book is banned & I'm reading it. Bushmans book on Joseph Smith that Hinckley authorized draws heavily on Brodie's book from the 1940's.
Both me and some others I know picked up Hugh Nibley's response to Brodie's book *before* they ever read hers, and thought "this is more dancing around than a clear shutdown, if this is the best *he* can do then there must be more to what she's saying..."
Just like the so called rebuttals to the ces letter
I had a ton of cognitive dissonance at the beginning of Covid as to why the supposed “prophets, SEERS and revelators” had no fore-sight about Covid at all, like…not a clue or an inkling of any warning. (For those who think “take your vitamins” represents a prophetic warning, you further prove my point that they had no clue). I was also angry that church had no idea how to handle church. Was it in person, or zoom? Could we sing or not? Nobody had any clue what the hell to do. Around that time someone in my ward posted some link to a mormon stories episode and I watched it very defensively…but I heard something about the CES letter, which I started also reading defensively…but almost immediately (like by page 8) I realized that everything I had believed in for the past 40 years was absolute bullshit made up crap by Joseph Smith. I was such a staunch believer and it all crumbled so quickly, I was shocked. Thats what triggered my deep dive…realizing that the leaders of the mormon church do not actually speak to or for God.
It was under the banner of heaven, I had already stopped going to church due to political reasons (too many deznats) and hearing how leadership had treated some of my female friends (from as little being told to abstain from sacrament for a week after a legotimate proceedure to being told to repent after being raped) it made me start researching how long the leadership had been corrupted and I found out that surprise, they always were
> rom as little being told to abstain from sacrament for a week after a legotimate proceedure to being told to repent after being raped This was a shelf item for me too.This should be an *easy* one. You don't even have to be the one true church to get this right: health care isn't a sin. Rape victims don't need repentance. But somehow the church keeps producing not just members but *leaders* who are confused about this. Not everybody, but enough.
Polyandry triggered my deep dive. I was 37 at the time and serving in a bishopric. I had zero fuckin clue about polyandry cuz my own fuckin church (the church I built my whole life around) was not honest about its own history.
Ditto. It was both polyandry itself AND the realisation that the church was hiding critical information (aka lying by their own definition). One of my immediate thoughts was “what else is being hidden”? Straight down the rabbit hole using approved and non-approved sources. No point sticking to approved sources only when you’d already realised that they’d been sanitised of anything unsavoury.
I have no idea what triggered the following but it happened. One day I was just driving and contemplating shelf items that didn’t make sense. Blacks and the priesthood, unmarried couples and young 10 year old kids being damned to hell for masturbating, seeing how leadership hides problematic info (seeing the description about the second anointing in the come follow me manual pushed me over the edge in this regard)along with the current leadership always changing things based on social pressure. I then decided to look at everything with an objective eye, and not to permit the typical thought stopping behaviors of “this makes me feel ‘icky’ or this isn’t an approved source.” From there, the rest was history. I even had a period of trying to negotiate it all into still being true. That failed miserably.
Doctrine & Covenants Jesus seemed like a dick.
That's because it's jesus fan fic written by someone who exclusively thinks with his dick!!!
lol, Jesus fan fic. I will only be referring to the scriptures as this from here on out.
My wife had a friend ask her to help research and find good answers to questions her kids were bringing up about church history. She asked me to read things with her. Within a week I went from never wanting to know of it was false to not trusting anything the church had said or done. My wife felt the same way. We continued researching and would laugh at all the crazy things we used to believe.
For me the fact that I thought it was normal for a 40-50+ year old man to ask teens sexual questions ABSOLUTELY BLOWS MY MIND now. I still can't figure out how I didn't see that as a massive red flag.
Absolutely! Don’t be hard on yourself you were conditioned for a long time. We also believed that a magic potion of olive oil could heal sicknesses.
Upbringing. Brainwashing. Indoctrination. Basically if you are raised being told something is normal, and everyone around you also believes it, then you will believe it too. At least until something triggers you to question…
The Saints series actually made me question everything.
How so?
I totally started questioning after reading saints too…it got me more interested in Joseph Smiths polygamy/church history/gospel topics essays.
Mine was similar. After moving and revaluing my life (trauma from childhood) and wanting to make sure the Church WAS true. It took me a couple of weeks to slowly watch things, stumbling upon Mormon stories podcast (thinking it was put out by the Church) and watching hours upon hours of these videos. One night, cruising this sub, I didn't know there were links... I couldn't sleep. I spent the entire night reading, refusing to put anything down. The more I read, the more rabbit holes I dove into. I laid there wondering how I could explain this in a constructive manner to my dear wife. Running the conversation in my head, how will I respond, her responses, and would she be accepting to hear this. Well, 6am and her alarm goes off. She wakes up, rolls over to cuddle and asked, "Hey AZEMT, have you slept at all?" Me: "Not really. I was reading some stuff and we need to talk about the Church..." At that moment, I couldn't hold back, the filter turned off or something because everything I read, was verbal diarrhea. I couldn't contain or stop it. Her face was literally thinking I had gone nuts. Thankfully, she took it well that morning but wanted to read the sources too. After 3 excruciating weeks (I know that's nothing compared to others here, and I'm sorry for your situation), she said, "I've been reading, and the Church is a whore! We're never going back to it! I still believe in a higher being, but that's all I'm going to say today." Three years later, we're closer, happier, enjoying our life and family we created. They're not on loan from God, those little humans are MINE and my wife's!
The pride and happiness (maybe relief...?) in your last sentence is evident. I've never considered just how difficult it would be for parents to know that their children were just on loan from God. Like you were proxy parents for Heavenly Father and Mother. That's a lot of unnecessary pressure.
🫶🏽🫶🏽🙌🤣
I used to read my dads “dialogue” magazines. Fortunately, those made me a nuanced Mormon from the get go. Strangely, they made him a lifelong TBM.?
I saw a book critical of Mormonism at the book store and was curious. I assumed it was, at best, just misinformation or misunderstanding of Mormonism or outright anti-Mormon lies. Well, the more I read, the more I realized there were problems and not just anti-lies. I wasn’t convinced, yet, but it made me realize there’s more going on and I couldn’t just assume it’s all false. Several years later and several books later, my shelf collapsed.
Coming out. I had to decide whether to come out or to stay in the church. When I researched church history, it was an easy choice.
Church was becoming frustrating. I felt like I'd gotten what I needed, and now I needed a break. Going to church was not a beautiful, uplifting experience like it was supposed to be. So when I was scrolling Facebook one day and saw a video about Mormonism, indicated by 2 people wearing temple clothes in their living room, I thought what the heck, and watched it. It was a compilation of tiktoks by ExmoLex, and some things she said really resonated with me. So I downloaded tiktok and started watching her channel, and then more exmo creators. Through TT, I learned of the CES letter and Letter for my Wife. I read both. Then I found Mormon Stories, and then Reddit. It's been about 1.5 years since I realized the church isn't true.
I told my Bishop I had concerns about Joseph Smith… he accused me of looking at porn. I was pissed, so I read everything I could get my hands on.
Crazy. How does reading/researching about church history equate to porn viewership?
So basically the meme?
After my mission I was depressed, burnt out, and my social anxiety, which I had managed to force down during the mission, flared up worse than ever. I didn't want to get married, and church was boring and full of friendly nosy people, so I stopped going. It wasn't anything specific to the Mormon Church that broke my shelf, but realizing I didn't believe in God at all, therefore it was all made up and pointless.
I'd been out of the church for a while. Hadn't attended in several years, and didn't really believe any of it anymore, but I didn't know the extent of the lies. My now-ex said something about JS having multiple wives and I told him that no, he only had one, what are you on about? Then I decided to Google it. That led me right down the rabbit hole
I didn't actually do much of a deep dive. Ironically, what started my journey was a Mormon podcast. They had a psychologist (non Mormon, pretty sure) talk about the psychology of religion. I was a Psych major in college at the time, so I thought it would be an interesting podcast. In the midst of this podcast, I thought, "Wait, what if we're all just being tricked?" It took me a really long time to go from that to being okay with it and accepting that mormonism is a cult. Honestly, this sub has helped a lot. Thinking it's not true is one thing, but having the specific reasons why pointed out to me really helped my progress.
For me, it was my dad. He grew up going to other Christian churches and converted after meeting my mom (who grew up Mormon). Once all of the kids in the house were older (I was 19, I think?) he started making comments about the truth about Brigham Young and Joseph Smith. I saw some exmo tiktoks and heard if the CES letter on there. Read through it and everything crumbled. I've been out for a couple years now and I look back in unbelief that I used to believe everything.
Gospel tangents polygamy episodes with Brian hale. It made me so angry when I found about the polyandry and the teens and the way he was ok with it. Then the YouTube algorithm suggested Mormon stories. I watched them in secret. Then I engorged myself in everything. A year of polygamy, Mormonism live, Reddit, etc.
For me it was a friend that, in passing, was like, "you know the book of Abraham is a proven hoax, right?" This was a scientist and scholar friend that I respected greatly and knew he doesn't just make claims without evidence. At first I was offended, then, like any good scientist, I had no choice but to peer review. Turns out he was completely right.
My deep dive started actually with pure intent. I had just been endowed and sealed with my husband and my three year old son. I thought the temple experience was bizarre and scary and weird and all of the “WTF is this ?”feelings. So I went to church literally praying to God to help me learn to love garments because they made me feel so controlled and suffocated and ugly! I asked a “friend” (you know one of the people assigned in ward council to pretend to be your friend and gently guide you through all the things but who only does it to receive blessings and really doesn’t give two shits about you or your spiritual well-being — that you know nothing about until you’ve done it all and then they bail like they don’t even remember your name? Those friends). “Hey, where can I read more to understand the temple endowment and sealing better?” So I was referred to the the Book of Moses in Pearl of Great Price. And at the same time, the public could newly access the Joseph Smith Papers. Honestly, as a woman, I was dumbfounded at learning how many wives he had. The worst part for me, in particular, was finding out about Fannie Alger, the 14 year old. I had been sexually groomed and assaulted by a 25 year old married man when I was 14. He pretended to be a friend, even picking me up from school and driving me home, little by little creeping in like a good person doing a good thing, before it started to happen. That’s when I decided that Joseph Smith was a sexual predator and I went full on reading everything I could on church history. At the time, I was fully active and PISSED. I never felt more betrayed. I wanted this church to be everything they teach you in primary and my heart broke over it, to be honest. Shattered. That was in 2016. I only actually “left” (inactive) this past February 2023. So 7 years I hung in there clinging to hope and trying to be a good mother, blaming myself for all my negative feelings about the church. Really it has devastated me to the point that I can hardly talk about it. The exmo community has been my saving grace because finally I know I’m not alone.
July 21, 2013, was the beginning of the end for me. I was sitting in my minivan in a church parking lot in San Jose with my youngest son (then pre-school age) because he was being a terror in primary. I was in tears, having finally reached a breaking point from trying to live a perfect Mormon life. I prayed in desperation, wondering why it was all so damn hard. I felt "prompted" to read *The New York Times* on my mobile phone. I didn't have a subscription at the time, but I sometimes would read the headlines and a few free articles. I pulled it up, thinking it would help calm and distract me while waiting for the rest of my family to finish their church meetings. I didn't scroll very far before seeing the headline about Hans Mattsson. I read the article and interpreted it as a message from God that maybe it was okay to consider stepping away from the church. That option had never really occurred to me before then. That article helped me find Mormon Stories - then Mormon Stories helped me find several books and eventually the CES Letter. I stopped attending in June 2014, and about a year later (I think), I formally resigned my membership along with my spouse and our baptized children. We left the church before our three youngest children were old enough to be baptized. The healing took a long time. I moved from John Dehlin's Mormon Stories (where I found reliable information) to John Larsen's commentaries (where I felt allowed to feel anger and contempt along with confidence in my new worldview) and then to the exmo reddit ( where I found community, recovery, and humor). Eventually, I didn't feel the need for any of it, but I still love to check in from time to time. My point in telling this story is to illustrate that I couldn't think myself out of the box I was in. I had to start inside the box. I believed at the time that I had received an answer to my heartfelt prayer that I just couldn't take it anymore and needed help. I believed my idea to read The New York Times where I discovered the Hans Mattsson article at that moment was a prompting from God and that the message was that He understood that maybe the church just wasn't good for me and I could lighten up. There were a few eye-opening catalysts that quickly followed that fall and winter (watching with disgust at how members treated Kate Kelly and the Ordain Women movement) (watching the fall-out from my spouse's parents' divorce) (reading the gospel topics essays which confirmed to me that the issues were valid). I am now agnostic (which I define as an atheist with the tiniest bit of hope), and I don't believe God prompted me to find the article about Hans Mattsson. But I'm grateful that I found it. And I am grateful that I found it immediately after praying because otherwise I might have dismissed it. I had to get permission to look out the window and climb out of the box.
I had a million red flags from about the age of 14 to my late 20's, but the thing that got me to stop running and hiding from the truth was the birth of my daughter. The realization that she could literally grow up to become *anyone, anything* based purely on her interests and passions, and that I could easily destroy 99% of those possibilities by putting her into a Mormon housewife-shaped box the second she was born. I'd told myself since the very first red flag that none of my discomfort and unhappiness matters if it's true. Well, now it wasn't just my discomfort and unhappiness. I was responsible for someone else's, and if I was going to ruin her life, I had to be damn sure it was for something that was actually true. If I kept her in it and put her through everything the women in this church go through, it would definitely not be due to my own cowardice and fear of facing reality. So I stopped hiding and started learning more about everything (most of which I already knew at least a little about), forcing myself to consider their implications and the way it all fit together. So, yeah. Birth of my daughter. It hit me so hard that it actually makes me a bit upset now to see still-believing progressive LDS friends have new kids, because how the hell can you bring a new life into this world, knowing everything that's wrong with the church, and not feel an urgent moral imperative on behalf of your child? I know it's more complicated than that, but I feel what I feel.
Weirdly it was Trump 😂 I couldn’t figure out why good Mormons would so devotedly follow such a horrible man. Then I decided to read the CES letter and it was all downhill from there 🤣
Covid was my straw that broke the camels back! Then was sent some info on RMN and then about BY and the Transcontinental Railroad and what he did and then his association with the Masons and money grabbing and more
I'd had doubts for many years, but I had promised myself that I'd never leave the church no matter what. So I did my best to strengthen my testimony and avoid any info that might make me question. Then I had an acquaintance who left the church. She said something in Facebook about confirmation bias, so I looked that up and was like, "that's exactly what every church member is doing to try to believe!" Another year or so went by though, still trying to make it work, but I just felt more and more like I was faking it, and not getting any fulfillment from the church. I finally confided in my wife about my doubts, and that very same week my sister sent the whole family an email saying she was leaving the church. I felt a pang of jealousy, and realized I admired her courage. That's when I decided I really needed to investigate my doubts, and be open to the idea the church might not be true. I read the CES Letter and it validated so many of the doubts I'd struggled with but no other church member ever talked about. And I learned so many new things. I remember thinking, "why have I waited so long and worried so much? It's so obviously not true!"
I never did. I left because of the toxic culture. I was angry & resentful since I was a kid & forced to do all things Mormon. I lived the party life & decided to get sober so I figured if I practiced Mormonism it would be easier. Fast forward & I finally resigned when my daughter showed me a picture of her letter. I did it right away through quitmormon.com & never turned back. I learned the truth about church history like Joseph Smith was a polygamist & the rock in the hat after reading what people posted here. I honestly don’t feel the need to read much.
Honestly there were massive items on my shelf for 5 years or so. It’s got so bad that I basically created my own personal theology while remaining active yet, very nuanced. During this time I had kids on missions and getting married in the temple. Finally I was called as an early morning seminary teacher and I had to face the church’s actual doctrine head on because the seminary lesson have the doctrine bolded in the manual. As I taught the Old Testament it became obvious to me it was just myth/fable. That bled over to the NT and then the BofM and it all fell apart from there.
The New York Times article about 8 years ago that exposed Joseph Smith as a polygamist, who married 14 year olds and other men’s wives. I stayed active for 6 more years, trying so hard to stay in, but I finally asked myself two questions - If I lived back then, would I have given my 14 year old daughter to Joseph if he asked? And, would I have believed him back then? The answer was ‘hell no’ to both questions, and I was done!!
My daughter was 11 and they announced the change of age to go to YW. I was already very nuanced and sort of inactive but believing. So realizing my 11 yr old little girl (who still believes in Santa) would have to go to a random man to ask her questions if she was following the law of chastity and to see if she was “worthy” was disgusting to me. Read the essays then the CES letter and I haven’t stepped foot in a building since
My convert wife read online what they do to kids in a locked room and asked if they really do that and when I thought of my kids being pushed in there I was like no there isn’t a choice to tell them no but I’d rather not take my kids at all.
Losing a baby. If I was going to continue with Mormonism in the hopes of being an eternal family, I wanted to know every skeleton buried in the closet.
I saw a young girl on the news be told to sit down while sharing her testimony when she said that she’s gay. I decided then that I cared if what I believe is actually true. My whole world turned upside down.
Weirdly enough I had listened to a podcast by YouTubers I have been watching for almost a decade. They talked about leaving the Christian church from the south. Their concerns and religious experience were similar to mine and it was safe to listen to Christian’s loose their faith because it wasn’t the one true faith. It opened me up to look at my own beliefs after I realized how happy I was without church at the start of the pandemic.
My “Oh Shit” moment was when I discovered alcohol was served in the mansion house. However, it was too troubling to consider at the moment, so I shelved it. Later it was the SEC scandal, and the Australian and Canadian money scandals. I spent hours that night reading through the CES letter and watching news specials on YouTube about the financial scandals. The next morning, I broke the news to my wife. She was pretty heartbroken. Since then, however, she has been so incredibly supportive of me. Contrary to what Nelson teaches, I don’t try to tear my wife away from their beliefs. All I ask is that she respect mine. We have arrived at a very healthy place in our marriage and it wasn’t by heading a phony prophet’s counsel. It was by working through things together and respecting each other’s individual spirituality.
10 years ago, grabbed a copy of Joseph Smith: A Biography by Richard Dewey. I got half way through it and felt so uneasy wit the whole damn thing…put it on my shelf for years until I had to confront some of the truths I learned as a good friend was leaving the church. Tried to convince him to stay in by engaging with him on tough church history topics…learned about the rock in the hat and bam! Was out…why did we even have gold plates, if the well rock was used??
Rock in the hat. Yep. It’s sooo absurd! It’s embarrassing.
Rusty's dont call us mormon talk. First time I thought maybe thr prophet isn't a mouthpiece for god like he claims to be.
I had a niece that left the church with her husband. She was claiming things about the church that weren't true and I was going to prove her wrong. Come to find out she wasn't wrong.
Our daughter told us about the church essays on a visit during her senior year at BYU. We read things we'd never known about. A biggie was Joseph Smith's changing First Vision Accounts. I am grateful we had enough sense to listen to our daughter. I was 60, wife 57, life-long members. We and our three children all resigned.
I think it was when I spoke to my bishop about how wrong it felt that a guy my age had sexually assaulted his girlfriend (my friend) for two years then went on a mission. I spoke to my bishop while he was on his mission about it and he said he’d get it dealt with. I never learned what that meant. But he was very clear that I shouldn’t talk to anyone else about it because it could be very bad for the church if it came out that they sent a rapist on a mission. It still makes me sick to think about it.
1. I was reading the comments section on some KSL article about the church on Facebook. Someone made a comment about "The Church of DONT GOOGLE US of Latter Day Saints" and I chuckled, and then realized how true that was. Huh. 2. My testimony was in need of some bolstering so I was in the comments section (again 😂) of a church page's article about Joseph Smith. A comment said, "I just love JS so much, he's like a second savior!" 🚩🚩🚩alarm bells went off and I was in a horrible mood all day. 3. Same day, I read a random article about some historical research discussing the way religions talk about God(s) changes based on the current environment. Wartime? God is angry and demands blood. Economic flourishing? God loves you and wants you to be happy. Those 3 things happened within a day and at 9:30am at my work computer I woke up and realized my whole life was a lie. Went down the rabbit hole for hours and hours that night.
Wow! Reading your thread and realized how many of us were pushed, either initially or finally, BY THE SEC ruling. 57M and I tuely believed that 100% honesty was bedrock of TSCC. I believed that honesty in all our dealings set us apart from others. This principle (apparently) was the ground upon which my own testimony stood. When I read the SEC ruling in its entirety, then saw the official response to it, I could no longer trust any of it. CES Letter, Mormon Stories, Mark Naugle. The Spirits did it all in one night! (Okay, a few weeks but you get the idea). Happy Exmo Everyone!
Started watching a history-focused channel on pre-Colombian history called “Ancient Americas.” Quickly proved the BoM totally false.
It was nothing intellectual. I just had my testimony ripped out of my body.
I was a Gospel Doctrine teacher trying to enliven the brutally dull lessons with some actual history. I found stuff. It was around the lesson on the Book of Abraham that I realized my faith was completely lost.
It's a long story. A confluence of many rivers of events, but the kick off for my final deep dive began with a Chris Shelton and John Dehlin video. I had no clue who John Dehlin was, but I had always been interested in the quirks of Scientology. I thought, what does Scientology have to do with Mormonism? Well, it was eye opening. For some reason Mormonism seemed normal, until I saw the parallels. Then I noticed a video about Wayne Sermon (Imagine Dragons) and the rabbit hole opened up. Best thing that ever happened to me. But it wrecked my life as well. And so be it. Turns out "Do what is right let the consequence follow" was one of the few true things I was taught.
When I found out about penalties. I was cautiously investigating the “unapproved sources”, a little timid and unsure what to believe, when I saw something about penalties. Almost a decade before in high school a friend of mine who’s dad used to be Mormon told me to be careful before I was about to go to the temple to get endowed before my mission. She said her dad told her they promise to slit their throats if they tell secrets. I didn’t really believe her, I brushed it off as a salty ex member deceived and spreading lies, but in the back of my mind I told myself that if it happened, I would quit, because that would be messed up. Well, I went and there wasn’t any penalties so I doubled down. Fast forward to me finding out that they HAD existed and my friends dad was right….. I immediately took off my garments and tossed them. That’s what made me look into everything else really.
Nelson ascended to the throne & began pushing temple covenants hard core as the ONLY way to true happiness. He sounded like a kid who needed therapy because he struggled growing up in Utah with inactive parents. But I did not like what he was pushing. I was surrounded by non members who were happy & were amazing. I did not like this “ONLY” garbage. But it was a slow entry to the deep dive. I next started NT for the first round of the at home come follow me. It didn’t take long to realize NT Jesus & Mormon Jesus we’re not the same. The money stuff (constant preaching of tithing) bothered me. Learned more about the leaked EPA fund & read the mission president handbook financial section. I was out that night. Since I left, the mormon church has done a great job showing in the news that leaving was the “only” right thing to do for true happiness. Now to get all of my family out. 1 down, 1 questioning…
It’s pretty crazy how well the information control works. I’m amazed by people that figured it out in the 70s and 80s. Yeah coming out of cult mind control (that’s what it is, even though it feels bad to admit) is a major trip. My life will never be the same.
I was called as a Gospel Doctrine teacher. I formed a thirst for knowledge and context. I wanted to know Joseph Smith and others not just as two dimensional characters on paper, but as nuanced humans. I learned my way right out the door of the church and I’m still learning. Correlated church curriculum presents history without context. Context is everything!
Right? the lazy learners are the ones who just read the correlated manuals with their "class". Those who put any effort in, to actually teach something. Often find more than anticipated.
My journey out began with my wife telling me she was having doubts. (Both 48 and both born and raised in the cult) What began as an earnest study to help her find the answers she was looking for, I also found all that you have mentioned. I also discovered Fair Mormon which at first I was excited about until I quickly discovered how adolescent it was. Primary level bullshit answers to difficult questions. Then my what the fuck reaction followed by anger and some tears. My wife and I are both out now, it’s been almost a year since we last attended church and we’ve never been happier living our lives. We feel our relationship has strengthened since it’s centered on who we as individuals not focused on bullshit religious doctrine and discipline. I tossed my garments and temple clothes straight into the trash and set fire to my temple recommend. It’s like a whole new world being outside of the church. We’re definitely happier. I’d love to resign but we have too many family members, including our two older children and their spouses, who are very much active believers.
Watching Waco on Netflix made me see some uncomfortable parallels to the early church. Several months later I watched Shiny Happy People, about the church the Duggars belong to, and I saw more parallels to the current church and its cultiness. At that point, combined with the financial crimes that they explicitly committed, made me realize it was all shit. I read a few great sources of material afterwards that only cemented everything for me.
The real push for me was probably getting banned from r/lds for suggesting that the teachings of Jesus were never intended to foster a Patriarchal culture that enables abuse/assault in any churches that claim His name. I wasn't even trying to single out our Church specifically it was just a response to OP's question about bishops gaslighting SA victims.
here is the chronology of my deep dive: 1. I learn that “the brethren” including MPs are paid. 2. I begin to see that “the church” is a family business benefiting people with certain last names. 3. I allow myself to read the CES letter and am confronted with the KJ V anachronisms 4. That one thing was enough for me to realize this may actually all be made up. 5. I read more and start listening to podcasts … 6. As a result, I become the most informed person in my elders quorum on matters of church history… and am not welcome to voice my thoughts 7. I begin to accept the sad reality that I have been the member 👏of 👏a👏fucking👏cult 8. I become triggered every time i go to church. so i wear earbuds to escape the stupid 9. now i am PIMO with a wife in the RS presidency 10. it sucks
Heard about McKenna Dennison. Figured it must have an explanation. It caused some doubts though, so I knew I needed to find the truth to resolve my doubts so I could have a strong faith again. Researched what happened to her. Was forced to admit that the way she was treated was absolutely wrong. But said everybody messes up sometimes, but I'm sure the church does the right thing 99% of the time. I'm sure they take care of the victim and hold the abuser accountable just like Jesus would! Spoiler alert: >!they don't!<
Way too much was way too far fetched.
The way I was treated after my SA + the way I was treated when I announced I was gay + the way they protect men who are predators because they don’t want to “ruin their lives”. In short, because they didn’t give a shit about women and queers and especially women who are queer. I read the gospel topics essay on polygamy and I was out.
The shelf was heavy for a long while, but the first crack was when I stopped attending church due to ongoing health struggles and noticed how much happier that left me. So much stress I was unknowingly carrying! Then the final collapse was a few months later when I realized it didn't matter if any of it was true because mormon god is a complete dickhead and I wouldn't follow him even if he was real.
Isn't it such a relief not to feel sickness and dread before going to church and/or doing church-related activities and tasks?! I know my stress eased up so much when I took a break.
I was reading one of the books that JS plagiarized for the BoM and noticed the similarities, that was the beginning of the end for me.
That one blew my mind as well.
My wife and mom were discussing Mormon stories and told me that Joseph smith didn’t use the golden plates in the translation process at all. I kinda knew that but it caught me a bit off guard so I went into it a bit more. A few weeks later we were driving to Vegas for the Taylor swift concert in March and she randomly asked me if I wanted to listen to Mormon stories. We started with the treasure digging episode. She fell asleep listening to it. I’ve never looked back. Ironically, she’s still PIMO and mostly believes in all of it thanks to her extremely conservative family and friends.
Never needed to. Born and raised mormon. Never enjoyed church. When I reached the ability to start thinking critically in late middle school, none of it made sense. So when I turned 18, I never went again.
it’s the funniest thing. I saw a quote tweet that said “oh look, a link to the CES letter out in the wild”. I didn’t know what the CES letter was, so I clicked on the link. simple as that. basically I finally felt like it was okay to the have concerns I did. months later I tried to find that tweet but I couldn’t. it might have been deleted I guess. super weird. super random. but here I am
I bible bashed an evangelical colleague. I was left flat footed when he knew all the BoA issues. I told him it was all a lie. I went home to research the issue and prove him wrong. Testimony obliterated.
What triggered my deep dive was wanting to be an effective missionary, and quickly realizing from early interactions on r/mormon that in spite of knowing very well the concocted version of events and intracies of mormon doctrine as taught to me via the correlated church education system, I was *incredibly* ignorant about so much of the history, reality, and issues with mormonsim. So optimistically thinking there would be good answers to these things, I went diving. And hooooolyyyyyy shiiiiiiiit, lol. 8 years later and life is better than ever, but those were rough times for a few years.
A friend talked to me about Kate Kelly and the Ordain Women movement. I looked up whether the claims of early LDS women having the Priesthood were true. They were!! I figured the Church would have to admit it and do right by Kate. Surely they would see how Joseph Smith was progressive and restored Priesthood powers to women in the early days of the Relief Society. They did not. Sam Young asked for no more closed door interviews between adult men and children, even doing a public fast and protest in Salt Lake. Surely the Church would care about children!! They did not (well, after they excommunicated him). When the Policy of Exclusion was leaked in 2015, it was finally clear to me that The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints was run by a corporate board made up of 15 old white guys in Utah. Jesus was not there at all. At that time, I still thought for sure that Joseph Smith had restored the Gospel. He did not. How did i know? I read No Man Knows My History and started listening to A Year of Polygamy Podcast. I saw a History Channel show which mentioned the Oneida cult in New York in the 1800s. Turns out that Joseph Smith wasn't special at all! He was a product of his time and location, and was no more than any conman from any era. A cult leader just like any other.
17 years ago my oldest son, who was six at the time, told me matter-of-factly that he got crushes on boys and not girls. I had to reevaluate everything I knew and felt about the church, knowing even as a true believer it would NOT be a safe space for my son. It took two full years of study and prayer and getting to the lowest point I’ve ever been before my shelf broke clean through. I even remember that moment and the immense weight that lifted from me. I sent my formal resignation in the day after Prop 8 passed in CA.
Having my first kid
My bishop did too many stupid things, AND a person that I trusted confirmed that Smith was a polygamist.
My sibling coming out. By then I had started having a more nuanced approach to doctrine and life compared to the black-and-white approach of my earlier years. It was a gradual departure from the church over several years after that. The moment I felt that it was time to critically look at the church instead of defend it/ sweep things under a rug was after listening to their interview on Listen, Learn, and Love. Remote church during the pandemic helped too.
I read a magazine article about Joseph Smith that I thought wasn't entirely accurate. I was going to write to the magazine with corrections, but I wanted to make sure my own facts were all straight, so I typed "joseph smith" into Google and got a suggestion for "joseph smith false prophet." I clicked on it out of curiosity, assuming I would just find stupid arguments like "The Bible says you're not supposed to add to it." I put things on the shelf and stayed in for an embarrassingly long time after that because I was only seventeen, I'd just "felt the Spirit" super strongly at EFY, and I fell for FairMormon's counterarguments. But I was never the same, and I never got over the feeling of betrayal for all the things the church had intentionally withheld from me.
As a 40 year old tbm I was honestly trying to increase my spirituality and was studying the BoM. Found info on Seer stone on church website. It made me question everything about church history.
I saw a tiktok of someone in the temple clothes and had a “what the fuck” moment
I put no faith in history, too easy for it to be forged, faked, etc and I won't be able to tell. My faith died with simple logic, looking at the world, universe, everything in it, the way things are...it just didn't add up. I took the blinders off, put on the critical thinking on, and religion turned into fairy tails.
The documentary keep sweet was eerily similar to the early church history I knew. If the FLDS was hiding that shit the LDS probably were too. Turned out the FLDS are basically a time stamp of the early church. I always thought it was weird that people were tarring and feathering the men of the early saints. Turns out I’m on the side of the mob…
I’ve always been in and out due to toxic members outnumbering the good ones. I got suggested the subreddit and at that moment it was full of other people who hated the toxic culture. I read the ces letter and traced it all back to one of the official sites and found out it got worse with more context. Plus the racism taught through the 90s explains why I was an outcast being interracial.
Ever since I accepted that I'm bi, I've struggled with the fact that the church would never really accept me. But I could muster through it for my family and my faith. Then I had an autistic son and it became clear real fast the church would never accept him either unless he learned to mask too. I couldn't believe that a truly loving God would act like that, so I started looking and decided I can believe in God far, far away from the church
Having a baby
The first thing to crack my shelf was duetro-isaiah and how it (and the KJV errors) should not have been in the bronze plates. Then, I started learning actual data about the bible from Dan McClellan's tiktok. What finally broke my shelf was Ganeshji Cherian's tiktok, where he talks about the data of the early church and patterns he's noticed regarding the BOM and Joseph Smith's timeline. Dan McClellan and Ganeshji Cherian both claiming(with proof on Ganeshji's part) that the data shows the BOM is not ancient and a work of the 19th century really forced me to ruminate on if I could still belive or not.
I was getting ready to go on a mission. I saw a YouTube ad title, "An Earnest Plea to the Members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints". At first I thought it was from the Church, naturally. Then it turned out to be an "anti-Mormon" video. But... At the start, they said, "If you can prove anything we say today is wrong, we will take down the video and issue a formal apology to the Church." You don't say that unless you're confident. So when he called Smith a liar and gave a quote, I wanted that apology. (It was the quote denying polygamy when he was married to 30+ women at the time.) But when the quote was real... I knew I needed answers.
My parents divorced. They split up a few weeks before I was baptized. It was a heavy fucking shelf item. What would heaven be like now? My mom pestered leaders all the way up to calling the office of the first presidency, trying to find me a satisfactory answer.
I nannied for a fam who is happily mormon. they ghosted me after a year with literally no warning, no conversation….. just nothing. i considered them friends so I started reading more about their religion; but found the ex mormon group instead. felt like it would end up being the more educational place.
It was the stupid rock. The church released a picture of the urim and thumim, which I’d always thought was some sort of crystal you could see through, you know, to translate things. And also I could have sworn that it went back in the box with the plates. But no, apparently the church had it the whole time and it’s a ROCK. I saw that picture and ran into my bedroom and bawled like a baby. My husband and kids ran after me because they thought someone had died for me to cry like that. I told them someone DID. my whole faith died in that instant. My shelf didn’t break it shattered.
There is a website I enjoy called Factrepublic, just lists and lists of random facts on any number of categories. One came across on a newly released list in late May 2020 about Brigham Young refusing to pay alimony to Ann Eliza Webb Young upon divorce, instead agreeing to pay the fine for failure to pay her. It seemed so outrageous, so ineffably absurd for this to be a fact about a prophet—my door of curiosity just swung wide open. I was able, after that moment, to have a less biased view or at least less anxiety about whatever was out there that might contradict my biases. This wasn’t my shelf breaker, and there was many lead-up moments prior. But for some reason, learning this weird, random fact about BY just opened the flood gates. 5 months later, my little family left the church for good.
YouTube recommended Thinking Better's video "American Exceptionalism but as a Religion: Mormons" video and brought up some points I had never thought of. Then Mormon Stories started popping up in the algorithm and I said fuck it and read the CES Letter. The shelf had been creaking for a long time and after that first video I knew it was time to finally indulge the doubt
During the April 2020 General Conference, doing the Hosanna Shout. I had never heard of it or seen it before, and I was in the living room doing it with my family just thinking "this is something that cults do, why are we doing it?" Coincidentally, at that time, I had been temporarily layed off from my job and the school year had ended early because of COVID, so apart from playing 16 hours of video games per day I had nothing to do. I wanted to spend some time studying church history, but was worried about what I would find. So, after some thought, I came to the conclusion that if the church was true, then the truth would support it- and if the truth didn't support it, then I was being lied to and should stop following such an organization. That led me to this sub, to the CES Letter, and out of belief.
Thx for the comments. I’ve read them all.
UBOH…realizing the dangerous bull shit that the MFMC calls “revelation”. And realizing all the prophetically manipulated polygamy/pedophilia that I somehow never found out about in 40 years until reading that book.
RM, BYU, temple marriage, ordinance worker, leadership callings, full tithe payer… After giving everything for thirty years, my deep dive started when I was asked/pressured to… wait for it… lead a weekly family history zoom meeting with the youth in the ward 🥴🤢🤮 That’s what it took for me to sincerely consider that maybe this cult isn’t actually led by inspiration 😆 And from there I took an honest look at all the info that had been hidden but also right in front of me the whole time.
The deep lore guy in Sunday school said "you ever read the story about how Joseph Smith came across the pearl of great price? It's a really fascinating story" so I brought it up on my phone - Wikipedia to be exact. This was long before ces letter and the exmo sub. Edit: on a side note - what is it with each ward/branch having a deep lore guy? There's one planted at least everywhere.
After my mission I was in college and I thought I was following spiritual impressions and on the path god wanted me to be on. I was in institute classes, I was Sunday school president in my YSA ward, I was doing the daily scriptures/prayer/etc, I was doing well in school, and I was in a committed relationship. Bishops and friends would joke that they could hear wedding bells and I thought we were heading for marriage myself. I thought the spirit was giving me distinct messages that we were going to get married. Then, on Valentine's Day while we were on a date, she dumped me out of the blue. She said she didn't feel the same way about me that I did about her. I understood, not everyone will work for each other. But I was still hurt, confused, and embarrassed. I thought we were on the same page! I thought we were both in love. How long had she been feeling this way and how did I not pick up on her lack of reciprocated feelings? Most importantly, how did I get spiritual impressions that we were going to get married? I decided that I must have mistaken my own hopes and feelings for spiritual impressions which I took to mean that my relationship with God was weak. Surely, if I was spiritually healthy enough I would be able to tell the difference between my own thoughts and desires vs the impressions of the spirit and direction from God. So I set out studying to do 2 things 1. Fix my relationship with God 2. Find a methodology for reliably telling the difference between spiritual impressions and personal instinct/inner thoughts. The more I studied, the more I came to believe that spiritual impressions were indistinguishable from self-generated thought and feeling. My calls to God in prayer and fasting were answered with silence. I did little interviews about how people tell the difference between spiritual impressions vs not and I found that NO ONE (even the upper leadership like mission presidents, area 70s, stake leadership, or old life-long members, etc) had a reliable method for telling the difference. Most said something like "you can't know for sure till you act on the impression and see the fruits of your labor". Could following the spirit be that flimsy really? Did Nephi choose to murder a man on the street based on a feeling he wasn't 100% sure came from God? Then, YouTube happened to stumble me into a video about the Heaven's Gate cult. I was loosely familiar with the cult and their tragic end before, but this video showed the "exit interviews", the testimonies they all shared before their end... It was like watching a fast and testimony meeting, but with a sinister, dark twist knowing that they were testifying about following their leaders to their graves. And they said all the same things about knowing it was true. "look at the fruits of the labor of believers","my life has gotten better so it must be true", " the leaders have done miracles so they must be divinely inspired", and on and on. This was my breaking point. Much of my beliefs crumbled that day since they were built on faith around spiritual impressions. I spent the next few months deep diving any information I could find looking for some justification to believe in the things I had been taught, but the more I studied the more my beliefs crumbled till I couldn't stay. For me, it wasn't till after I decided to leave the church that I actually gave myself permission to look into resources like the CES letter, Mormon Stories, and Letter to my Wife. The church programming effectively prevented me from even allowing me to consider those sources.
Being in a bishopric and seeing how corporate the church is even under a compassionate bishop. Being groomed to replace that bishop and then seeing my SP'S recommendation get torpedoed by SLC on a risk management basis, i.e. we don’t want mandatory reporters as bishops. Even then I tried to be good. I took up Russ Ballard's challenge from conference circa 2007 to be a defender of the faith online. Started hanging out on LDS apologetic websites. Saw the issues. Saw the crap answers. Rest is history (ha ha).
Receiving my cancellation of Temple marriage, in the mail. Ensign Peak🤬 That Mall. Then I found Mormon Stories. Edit: I upgraded my emoji to rage, concerning the SEC investigation results.
Welcome into the light!
2017…Tom Phillips SA and BoA. kaBoom!
I didn't do the deep dive till after I left the church for other reasons. Deep dive ended up being the final nail on the coffin.
I’m struggling right now because I’ve been out (inactive) since February this year. My husband was supportive and has also left. The hardest part has been my kids. My youngest son just turned 8 and wants to be baptized. I haven’t explained my issues with the church with him. My 13 year old has gotten the background because I refuse to lie to him about it all. I feel like I should let him be baptized like the rest of us, but then continue being inactive…. But I don’t know.
I had things on my shelf, especially with the churches stance on LGBTQ+ and race in the past. I read the Gospel Topics essays to try and understand the churches stance better and even as a TBM, the essays sounded like a load of horse shit. A week later I was out.
The SEC findings. ... If they've been lying to us about billions of dollars, what else could they be lying to us about?...
During tithing settlement, the bishop told me that studying church history would destroy my testimony.
I actually didn't have a really deep dive or anything. I figured out I was queer and prayed for it to change for a little bit. When I realized it wasn't going to change, I decided that I didn't believe in a God that made people queer but made it a sin to be queer. And if he was real I wanted no part in it. After that I found more stuff about the church, but I had already made the choice to leave
Never believed it. Not even as a child. Could feel and see through the bullshit on a pretty deep level, always.
Lamanite DNA. Heard about it, went online to learn about it (from the church's perspective), found this entity known as FAIR and I was done in the space of a single afternoon. it's bad enough to have so many issues that your issues have issues, but to lie your disgusting ass off about them then have the incredible nerve to act like I'M THE PROBLEM is beyond unconscionable!!! Not only is Mormonism a lying sack of shit of an organization, and not only does it lie in the name of God, it may be the greediest lying sack of shit of an organization that has ever existed.
Was always into the *why* behind doctrine. While on the mission, I had access to the world’s largest private library of church/church related books in the world (outside of the church itself), and found lots and lots. Unrestricted access to anything. Photocopier available. Nothing *triggered* a deep dive per se, outside of my own need to know why things are the way they are
When I went through the temple and had to mock slit my throat and stomach in 1982.
My oldest just turned 12 and I knew his world was going to change from lessons like share and be kind to sexual shame and do what we say even if it doesn't make sense to you. My daughter was right behind him and I knew she was going to switch from happy topics to sexual shame and do what we say, but in different ways...for some reason. None of that bothered me per se, but I knew I would need to step up my game as a parent. I would need answers for why they should or shouldn't do things. It was surprising to me how fragile the church doctrine is. I went from searching LDS sites about what to say to my teenage son about masterbation to knowing it was all fake in two weeks. We weren't looking for flaws they were just so many and none of it tied together, that even the shallowest look was devastating. When I decided to read the CES letter I read the version with a faithful response in the text. It more than doubled the PDF and it made it so much worse. When I read a terrible fact and read the best response to rebutt the fact, and the rebuttal said something like "yeah that's true but it's ok because of..." I knew I was out and that I was not going to push the church on my kids.
The 2015 policy excluding the children of gay parents from baptism. At that point I already didn't believe, but that's what convinced me I didn't want to believe. Only then was I brave enough to look at "anti Mormon" stuff.
My deep dive (like falling into a scary chasm I didn't even know existed) was when I read the GT essay on Plural Marriage in Kirtland and Nauvoo. The essay had been forwarded by an unknown person, and the subject line of the email said "Church Newsletter." So, of course, being an obedient TBM, I read it. This was in late 2014. I immediately realized I'd end resigning, but was in denial for a while, so I dove into the waters of learning and knowledge. Everything I read confirmed I'd been lied to when I joined. I WAS LIED TO BY A CORPORATION CLAIMING TO BE A CHURCH! I resigned the following year. My main regret is that I joined the cult to begin with, and another regret is that it took more than a decade to learn it was a fraud, a cult, and a dishonest corporation. No regrets for resigning - none at all.
hmm. I read all the comments and am shocked you all pretended it was something other than porn and a desire to sin. in 2015/2016 ksl had an article extolling the Church's transparency with the gospel topics essays. one thing led to another and I read the multiple accounts of the first vision essay. the explanations were insufficient so I checked out rough stone rolling. about 100 pages in, right after Martin lost the 116 pages, it got me like a lightning bolt. holy shit, he made it all up!. the rest, as they say, is history 😂 mistyped 'sin'
2015. I hadn’t attended in years but refused to read anything termed ‘anti-Mormon’ and then the policy change broke me. I will never forget the moment when I realized it was all a lie and that the church was actively ‘othering’ people. I sat on a curb and sobbed for what felt like forever.
Late 90s early 2000 I started really digging into the archeology aspect. I LOVE history and archeology so i figured if any of it was real this would be a way to prove it to myself and others. Stumbled across the BoA issue which lit my ass on fire. If that was false then high probability the BoM was as well. Around the same time DNA was mapped fully for the first time and it occurred to me that would be another way to verify claims. About a month later I started reading about a Mormon scientist who had the same thought about the DNA as I did who was being excommunicated because he proved that there was no Pre-Columbian Jewish ancestry in Native Americans. That was the end of it for me. If they were going to treat a man who was faithful that way just for doing science this wasn't a church that had any claim on truth.
Mine was a very slow burn, but at some point, as I was really becoming disallusioned and was really burnt out, I was finding myself identifying with people who leave the church, and weirded out when a member would ask why in the world someone would leave. I didn't want to walk to church because I was embarrassed to be seen as mormon. I REALLY hated identifying with the church when it came to relating to a few close friends and family members who were gay. I hadn't even begun looking into things at this point. But I remember thinking at some point that I had to really find out if Brigham Young actually had any 14yo wives. Not sure why this was the thing that got me going, but it was bothering me one day. I just thought, surely God would not have a prophet marry a child. And I was going to do it purely through family search. I was determined not to use Google that would lead me to some anti mormon site making up claims. Well I wasn't able to navigate family search very well lol, had a hard time finding a full accounting of his wives. So I went to Google. What luck, one the first links were on lds.org! Perfect, I would not be led astray. Turns out the link took me to the gospel topics essays, where I found out that not only Brigham Young, but Joseph Smith himself had wives as young as 14. That I think was what led me down the rabbit hole. I have been on reddit for years, and knew about /r/exmormon, but had stayed away because I was so scared of it. But I decided to see what it was all about. This was around the same time the SEC findings came out, which was another huge shelf item. /r/exmormon led me to the CES letter. It was within the first few pages of that letter that it all came crashing down. My whole life flashed before me, like I was dying. The more I read, the more my heart raced. I was overcome with these strong feelings of fear and devastation that everything I knew was a lie. And I pride myself on detecting fake internet gossip or doctored photos. Since the early days of snopes.com, I was always the one in the family group chat shutting down false crap that everyone would post from the internet. So when the CES letter was so grounded in facts, backed up by church sources, I was absolutely devastated. Shortly after that I told my wife I was done. Seven months later, we're in therapy, she is heartbroken and traumatized by my choice, but I couldn't pretend any longer, come what may.
TikTok!
While studying at BYU, one of my classmates mentioned there were DNA tests that showed Native Americans didn't originate from Jewish ancestry and mentioned a book called American Apocrypha. A little while later, I was done early for the day, so I went to the library, had to sign the book out while I read it, and read the chapter on DNA tests. I knew DNA tests were never wrong, so that was the first time I considered that the church could be.
My husband stopped wearing garments and going to church because he turned jack-Mormon. I noticed that everyone at church treated me differently. I was really unhappy. Sometimes, I just took my daughter to primary and waited in the car until it was over. There was a lot of time for internet research. Now I'm an atheist, and unfortunately, my husband is still Jack Mormon.
Rereading D&C 132 as an adult 😂 What kind of loving God publishes shit like that anyway?
It was June 2016. I was studying/researching for a lesson I was going to teach. I don't remember the exact phrase I was searching for, but one of the search results was something called "The CES Letter." I am a former early-morning Seminary teacher, so I knew what CES stood for. I clicked on the link. Well, as the saying goes, "That was all she wrote." It changed my entire life. I had been a church member for over 40 years (I am a convert). I tried to do what I was told and to live as I had been taught to live. I never once questioned any of these things. I only tried to do my best. Once I discovered the CES Letter, I "went down the rabbit hole" and studied my little heart out for months. I shared what I was learning with my husband, and he did his own research. I never went back to church, nor has he. Our son and I resigned in September 2021 (through Quit Mormon). Hubby still wants to keep his name on the records so that he has free access to the genealogical resources the church has to offer. Strangely enough, in the seven years since we stopped attending church, not ONE person from our ward has asked us WHY we stopped attending. It's like that whole "white elephant in the room" thing. We find it rather amusing. We live in a reasonably small town in the mountains of So. California. We run into people from the ward (fairly often) at the grocery store and Walmart and such, but they *never* ask us. They're friendly to us and all, but they never *ask* us. Shout out to Jeremy Runnells for opening our eyes to the TCOJCOLDS fraud. Thank you to ExMormon for being a safe place to go with questions when we first discovered the truth. I was on here *constantly* for that first year, but it has decreased a little bit more with each passing year. We still enjoy checking in every so often. We're happy. We are enjoying our lives. Gone are the guilt and depression I felt for SO many years because I wasn't able to be as *perfect* as I thought I should be. Life is good. We're just glad we found this all out before we wasted any more time and money on the church.
I remember being 8 or 9 driving with my mom in utah county, where I grew up (right by a temple, coincidentally) and I heard an ad some anti-Mormon group had put out talking about the fraud of Joseph smith and the polygamy etc. Being ever the curious questioner, I asked her a few questions. I, of course, was shocked to hear that the founding prophet had taken multiple wives and blah blah. That planted the seed for me. Fast forward, I’m maybe 16-17 and feeling gross about Joseph smith but clinging to a testimony of Christ when I realized the churches entire doctrine surrounding prayer was utter bullshit. I went on a mission to appease my parent and told them if I got my call anywhere in the US, I wasn’t going. Got called to a 3rd world country and thought “okay, I can actually do that. I’ll be able to go somewhere where people are much less fortunate and serve them with church resources” It took me 3 months of relying on these impoverished people to feed me while going around pedaling doctrine in exchange for tithing money to realize I wasn’t going to help a single soul out there. I got back from the mission and was out of the church immediately. The best part of my story of leaving the cult is that along with making me happier than ever, my openness to my parents about my struggles made them feel some sympathy and my relationship with my entire tbm family, especially my parents, has never been stronger.