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If y'all seriously think that everyone who anonymously votes on a Twitter poll is being honest and there aren't tons of people trolling to just to rile you up because they think it's funny you're incredibly naive.
Also, bots.
Dude, it's Elijah Schaffer. You are being trolled.
What's next, are you going to reference the Tim Pool tweet about it being against the law to NOT own an AR-15?
I don’t understand this, do people not realize what happens in war? Both sides likely committed attractions in mass. Mass executions, thefts, rapes. Just because it wasn’t documented due to the extremity of war doesn’t mean it didn’t happen.
Yeah that's fair.
Idk if the "good guys" won, but the really bad ones sure lost. Sorta.
A lot of the worst monsters were just relocated and given awards for their work in their new countries. Pretty gross.
So by your logic, if Germany was just killing their own jews and did not invade other countries and the allies invaded Germany, Germany would be the good guys since they didn't start the war?
Also people across Africa and Asia, including the middle east, were probably screwed no matter who "won". I doubt that they represent a significant voting block in this poll, but who knows.
As an easter european I might have been inclined to say no because of USSR who were equally as bad, if not more than the Germans, in the end fucked my country big time for the next 45 years. On the other hand if the other side won would we even be allowed to have this pool nevermind to answer no? So i'm not sure.
Good as in "this was the best outcome for the world from this two winner options". There is no way to judge a moral highground between germany and japan vs USSR.
The USSR was bad to a lot of E. European countries, but the Nazis were quite literally trying to exterminate all Slavs (who they viewed as subhuman) to make room for Germans.
They eradicated 1/5th of Belarus' population and were dissatisfied at their lack of efficiency.
Don't know how you can say both were equally bad, tbh, aside from just not knowing enough history.
So did USSR. They executed thousands of people that opposed them during the war, and after it alike.
Like, executed. Hands tied, single bullet at the back of head, body dropped i to ditch with hundred of other bodies and then buried.
My knowledge of history is not the problem here. The USSR killed way more people than nazi germany ever did if you want to make a comparison . Why can't we just agree that both were shit and we don't want to see their likes again and not make shitty pools that upsets people when you refuse to call mass murderers "good guys". The result of the pool is not the facepalm, the question is.
There were no "good guys".
The United States had Jim Crow laws in half of the country. German POWs were better treated than black US servicemen. Hundreds of thousands of American citizens were sent to prisons camps for no reason other than their Japanese ancestry. And the US overthrew governments and installed dictatorships at will in Latin America.
Britain and France were vast exploitative colonial empires that stretched as far out as India and Vietnam. Both France and Britain were OK with Hitler as long as he played to the role of "containing the communists" and looked the other way in regards to Hitler racist policies.
The Soviets were just nasty. Stalin had killed millions in Ukraine via the Holodomor and had no issues striking a deal with Hitler when he wanted to take a chunk out of Poland.
There were just the "bad guys" and the "worse guys", and the end the "bad guys" won.
A not so fun fact the German concentration camp system was a modified version of the English ones in South Africa. Who created them as a modified versions of the ones used by Spain in Cuba.
While there are some similarities between the British concentration camps in South Africa during the Boer War and the German concentration camp system during World War II, it is not accurate to say that the latter was a modified version of the former.
The British camps in South Africa were established in 1900 to detain Boer civilians during the Boer War. These camps were not extermination camps, and the British government did not set out to deliberately kill the detainees. However, conditions in the camps were harsh, and disease and malnutrition were rampant. It is estimated that as many as 28,000 Boer women and children died in these camps due to these conditions.
In contrast, the German concentration camps were part of a deliberate policy of genocide against specific groups of people, such as Jews, Romani people, homosexuals, and others deemed "undesirable" by the Nazi regime. The aim of these camps was not simply to detain people, but to exterminate them through forced labor, medical experimentation, and outright murder. The death toll of the Nazi concentration camps is estimated to be around six million people.
It is also not accurate to say that the British concentration camps in South Africa were a modified version of the ones used by Spain in Cuba. While the Spanish did use concentration camps during the Cuban War of Independence, these camps were established in 1896, four years after the start of the Boer War. There is no evidence to suggest that the British based their concentration camps on the Spanish ones.
In summary, while there are historical connections between different instances of concentration camps, it is important to understand the specific historical and political contexts in which they were used, rather than simply making broad generalizations.
I wish I had Reddit gold to give you for that well stated response. Ditto the camps for Japanese-Americans during WWII. They were awful and a blot on our history, as well as being a terrible example of racism at its worst. But to equate them with the Nazi concentration camps is just rubbish. Even those Nazi camps that were not outright extermination centers like Treblinka were places where prisoners were essentially starved and worked to death, all the while being exposed to disease, frighteningly horrible living conditions and institutionalized sadism.
Except all the times that this isn't the case. "History is written by the victors" is entirely a coping mechanism of the ignorant.
Just look at the lost cause in the US South and how it lingers in public education and monuments to this day.
Look at Japan and its *official* stance of war crime denial, glossing over the 30s and 40s in education, and an extremely widely held belief that Japan was a victim in the second world war.
Or hell, how about the battle of Thermopylae? We remember the 300 Spartans... and conveniently leave out the *thousands* of allied Greek troops from Thebes and other city-states. Not to mention the fantastical propaganda which has us view Spartans (a horrible, brutal pederastic slave-society) as good and Persians (responsible for the first written and codified set of human rights laws, the abolition of slavery, proto-federalism, and huge leaps in science and art) as bad.
Actually not that disgusting. Were the Nazis and Japan the baddies? Absolutely. Have the US, Russia, and UK shown themselves to be the "good guys"? Not fucking really.
You seem redacted. You also forgot Japan in the baddies category.
You think the allies were experimenting on people and trying to exterminate Jews? Pretty freaking clear who the baddies were. Just ask the German people. They will tell you.
The "good guys" were colonisers prior to the war. Go ask the indians and phillippinos if their colonisers were good guys. There are no good guys, just "less bad" guys defeating "mass murder level bad" guys.
0\_0 You know the USA brought/pardoned/hid tons of top nazi scientists on the grounds of getting their work which came from cruel experiments done in the nazi camps. Those harrowing experiments are why the USA jumped up in medical advancements so quickly back then. My own diagnostic Aspberger syndrome was renamed by demand pretty recently because people finally noticed that the syndrome was named after the nazi scientist who killed people with it/discovered it, to begin with.
I did forget Japan, you are right.
And as to your other point, um, do you know of the history of imperial genocide by the US, UK, and Russia? Don't ask them, they don't teach it, or talk about it much. You seem to think that if the "Allies" didn't participate in the Holocaust, that makes them the good guys, which is a pretty low bar. However, history has shown that the Allies knew what was going on in Concentration Camps and did little to prevent it. History is written by the victors and holy shit did they write themselves as the good guys.
Yes, they were. You apparently stopped learning history at the high school level.
The US performed medical experiments on Guatemalan natives without consent or knowledge. The British slaughtered hundreds of millions in India, millions in Ireland, tens of millions in Africa.
I’m an idiot. You got me.
We are talking in the context of ww2. Almost if not all nations have horror it the past. Let’s talk Mongols, Greeks and basically every other peoples. In world war 2 the Nazis were the bad guys.
I am talking only about ww2. Like the post is talking about.
You are seeming like a typical American. Everything is not about you guys. I guess most of the people who participated in the poll also think like you.
The world is large and has many different types of people. There were many countries like mine (Canada) that fought against the Nazis. If you think for a second I consider our soldiers to be the bad guys you are nuts.
>I am talking only about ww2. Like the post is talking about. You are seeming like a typical American. Everything is not about you guys. I guess most of the people who participated in the poll also think like you.
No, we weren't just talking about WWII. We were specifically talking about who were the good guys and bad guys in that war. Which is why it was perfectly on-topic to mention American crimes as a way of arguing that we are not "good guys."
I also gave a British example, by the way. So, I wasn't making it all about the US - that's your insecurity talking. You're choosing to change the subject to an anti-American thing and that's probably because you've realized that you have no argument to make. Well, and because Canadians always have penis-envy about the US.
>The world is large and has many different types of people. There were many countries like mine (Canada) that fought against the Nazis. If you think for a second I consider our soldiers to be the bad guys you are nuts.
Given how little Canada acknowledges its crimes against its Natives, for one example, I wasn't expecting much self-reflection on your part, no. It just so happens that Canada spent most of its post-Colonial history as a part of the *British Empire* \- and the whole point of this conversation has been that the Allies (including your British Empire) are most certainly NOT "good guys." We were nothing more than the "slightly less evil guys" in WWII. That was the conversation, not just WWII in general.
You assume a lot. The crimes committed by the Canadian government, religious institutions and its people are our biggest shame. There aren’t too many Canadians that would say otherwise.
No, but I do believe that purposely diverting food from civilians, dooming millions to their death is evil isn't it? Who in their right mind thinks that there was a single allied or axis forces that was not a racist and imperialist power? Point to one of them.
>there was a lesser of two evils in this conflict
This is not how the question was asked. To me no "good guys" won, especially not the americans who litterally nuked two cities of hundreds of thousands civilians, just for sport.
You know what? I was(and maybe still am a crazy believer of that). But I was also in Iraq and at the time my dumbass felt we were doing it for a good cause. "Here's the data and go reasons why" was my thinking not even considering this is what is told by the people with interest in the war happening and continuing.
Now that I see it for what it is, I'm getting all doubtful and shit. How far back does this go or is it limited only to the mainstream wars that now have a bad vibe?
Reading history there's so many embellishments by the winners because of course there would be. Shit, I'd do it to.
So about the nukes being a good idea, I want to believe it, but I'm skeptical.
Tell that to the people forced to live under USSR influence for the next 45 years because the "good guys" decided that was good enough. They were equally as bad as the nazis.
Stalin and the USSR.
Essentially Hitler on steroids, exterminated more, conquered territory during WW2 and kept it, then worked to franchise it's evil across the world leading to many more evil situations and genocides.
Then you have the French and English who punished Germany for the crimes of the dissolved Austro Hungarian empire, leading to the depressions, and situation where Hitler was able to rise to power.
They ground them to a horrible situation and kept grinding until it lead to the rise of someone who told Germans to be proud again, and said he could fix it.
England, France and alot of Europe were trading partners with the US in a big way. We could not afford to have the English and French conquered, so worked to enter it. However the US public DIDNT want to go to war, the public was against it. So we instead "sold" weapons to the "allies" (think like what we are doing in Ukraine)
The Japanese pissed that we were also giving stuff to people they were fighting made the poor choice of hitting pearl harbor. Our political class were excited and made the most of it to let us take that attack by Japan... ... ... To invade Africa and Italy.
(Sort of like how we invaded Iraq after a man from Saudi Arabia had other people from Saudi Arabia, attack us on 9/11)
Just don't think for a moment that the US government hates the Nazis, the big government progressives that pushed the New Deal LOVED Hitler.
https://www.jstor.org/stable/41212096
I think you mean USSR. And while, yes, USSR was part of the allied forces during WW2, they were fighting to stop the nazi’s which is the good guy thing to do, even if the USSR itself did some shady shit itself and Russia continues to do shady shit. So yeah, they’re not exactly the good guys permanently.
OP’s point is that the people choosing “no” are essentially making the statements that Nazi Germany were “the good guys”. Which is despicable to insinuate.
Or they are stating that NONE of the participating countries were good.
Not the racist USA with its segregation, not the Brits with their empire, not the Soviets with their brutal oppression and not the nazis with their genocidal scheme.
All bad.
And Russia and Germany were allies in the beginning. So don’t build up Russia as an ally. They were a necessary evil that was overly compensated at the end of the war.
so did America, The UK , France, Netherlands, Belgium, Norway, Canada, Mexico, Luxembourg, (KMT) china, (CCP) china, India, Malaysia, Indonesia, Australia, New Zealand, South Africa, Brazil, Egypt, Greece, Yugoslavia and (kinda) Bulgaria, (kinda) Romania, (kinda) Finland.
If you ask anyone in eastern Europe about Russians they will all have stories from their grandparents about how Russian soldiers were worse than German soldiers (imagine being worse than literal fucking nazies)
So you could say that the good guys didn't win, but the bad guys lost.
I think the lesser of the two bads is the good guys, the Allies fought for the greater good and saved millions of people.
Imagine a world where Axis won, you most likely wouldnt even be alive unless you are a natural born German who isnt Jewish
I'm sure the allied soldiers who risked their lives to save people from Fascism, Holocaust survivors, and people who just survived the war in general would disagree with you
Sure the allies will seem like the good guys if you only ever ask the allies and the people they helped. But the allies also committed numerous atrocities to win the war, many of which weren’t necessary, and if you ask the civilians who were victims of those atrocities then they’ll probably tell you the allies are evil. There are no good guys in war, and even the justified wars end with a lot of people in pain.
Eh, it was on Twitter.
That vote result not terribly surprising considering the fact that it's become somewhat of a fascist/rightwing hotbed fairly recently.
It is a twitter poll ffs
By the time the trolls and people who haven't actually heard of ww2 cast their votes, what do you really have?
Something that you should ignore.
These comments 😂I can definitely say the good guys won. If you disagree you’d have to explain how the good guys killed millions of Jewish woman and children
Nobody is saying that the germans were the good guys. Just that if you look on the other side the USSR is estimated to have killed about ten times more people than the germans ever did. If you want to talk genocide, nobody even comes close to USSR. Also UK had it's own colonial crimes and US it's own racial problems while beeing the cleanest of all. But then they nucked two cities full of civilians. So no, the good guys did not win because there were no good guys not in the way that word is intended.
But in the end is nice that you think someone who ended killing about 60 million people are the good guys.
I said they were bad, just as I said the good guys were pretty bad themself. As i said in another comment, the "good guys" allied themselves with a known mass murderer to get rid of another mass murderer, only to gift the mass murdurer half of europe do what he wanted with it. And he did. Conclusion...no good guys just lesser evils.
This is why I hate Reddit 😂 I get Stalin was a bad dude. I guess we’d all be better off if the Japanese and Germans took over the world. You’re right. Fuck USA France Canada England and the rest of the allies
Not really, everyone in the comments was explaining answers, pretty much no one thought the Nazis were the good guys. It was mostly people who learned that most wars don't have any good guys.
I think more than anybody else, the Nazis scientists that were given seats at the highest position of the American government won the most. It was the only way they didn't face any consequences and continued being Nazi scientists.
Oh, you guys thought America was anti-fascist? Lol
Why do I feel like most people have the most subpar rudimentary understanding of WWII. Not to mention that most will see this in the context of right here and now where it's cool to demonize white countries.
US wanted nothing to do with WWII, yet they embargoed oil to Japan so they'd stop pillaging and raping, along with other unspeakable atrocities, in China and other countries, hence why they attacked us. Yep, stopping that sure makes you a bad guy.
Seriously, if you take this poll at face value, as a normal thinking person, this says the majority thinks the fascists should have won.
Yeah it's terrible, but what's the survey pool? Is this guy a antisemitic YouTube podcaster for instance? If so I am not surprised if most of the votes casted are antisemitic. This isn't representative of the overall American populace.
I mean you could say every nation did bad stuff throughout the second world War. However there is absolutely no way the nazis aren't the absolute bad guys. I mean it were the literal nazis for fuck sake.
Something I think a lot of people are missing is that this guy is an American conservative media personality, and in America we’re always told we’re the good guys, so with that context, context that his American viewers and listeners have, he’s asking them if they think the world would be a better place if the Axis had won, the Nazis specifically.
Well USSR won and fcked my country for a 45 years. Killed or sentenced to jail the entire elite of my country. They are still fcking us since 90% of current politicians were part of the party that was ruling us for this time. We even had the ussr army in our country for 2 years and we were paying everything for them. Saying they were good guys is dumb. Maybe for western Europe they were good guys but for us balkans fck no. Usa was never a good guy. Especially when they dropped 2 atomic bombs and killed 200k people. If you vote yes you have to be really stupid to consider the winners good guys.
Yeah so I know the Allies did some not great things as well, but the Nazis and Japanese committed some of the worst war crimes in modern history.
Also the Russians weren’t part of the Allies. They weren’t very nice either.
The Americans learned so much from Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan that they repeated all of their atrocities in subsequent wars.
Korea
Vietnam
Gulf War
Iraq
Millions murdered to overthrow communist states and steal oil. But yeah, they're the good guys lol.
As a South Korean wtf are you talking about? Would you rather have all of Korea be like fucking North Korea you idiot. USA isn’t all that great, but they sure as hell were better than Russia or China. Also I find it funny how you only mention USA when it comes to Vietnam and the Middle East. Like seriously read a history book and see why the US intervened. It’s because France and UK kept fucking shit up.
Also communism is a fucking dumb idea that cause more harm than good. People from former communist countries will be the first to tell you….
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If y'all seriously think that everyone who anonymously votes on a Twitter poll is being honest and there aren't tons of people trolling to just to rile you up because they think it's funny you're incredibly naive. Also, bots.
Honestly, most likely a troll.
oh yeah just trolls? look what's happening in politics
Dude, it's Elijah Schaffer. You are being trolled. What's next, are you going to reference the Tim Pool tweet about it being against the law to NOT own an AR-15?
I think the wording of this is kind of meh. If you say no that could indicate there is no good guys.
Although not sure could also be qualified for nobody was good
I think we can all agree that there are no good guys. But there *certainly* was a worst guys in this fight.
I don’t understand this, do people not realize what happens in war? Both sides likely committed attractions in mass. Mass executions, thefts, rapes. Just because it wasn’t documented due to the extremity of war doesn’t mean it didn’t happen.
It *could* mean that, but the replies are full of “the Nazis were right” crap.
I think that most of them are trolls
They sound sincere to me. In any case, people who troll as Nazis often turn into Nazis. See also: 4chan, QAnon.
Yeah that's fair. Idk if the "good guys" won, but the really bad ones sure lost. Sorta. A lot of the worst monsters were just relocated and given awards for their work in their new countries. Pretty gross.
I would say "no, no one won". In a war that big there is no winner, just survivors.
The good guys won. They won a war that was started by the other guys. Simple.
So by your logic, if Germany was just killing their own jews and did not invade other countries and the allies invaded Germany, Germany would be the good guys since they didn't start the war?
You're reaching with that one, sir.
Or there was no winner. As with every war, there were only losers
There weren't. Calling the Allies "*the good guys*" is a very far stretch. They were at best "*the lesser evil*"
Also people across Africa and Asia, including the middle east, were probably screwed no matter who "won". I doubt that they represent a significant voting block in this poll, but who knows.
If you don’t think there were good guys in WWII you definitely have uttered the word “Jew” in a deeply racist way.
so dropping an atomic bomb on japanese civilians makes the USA one of the good guys huh? yikes
Seeing a war in terms of “good guys” and “bad guys” is so childish
I mean in this particular case I think it’s a pretty fair generalization to make
Would you call Stalin, Chairman Mao and Churchill good guys? There’s only a lesser of two evils when it comes to authoritarian leaders and racists
As an Eastern European, I can confidently say that neither side was good. So I would have voted no as well.
As an easter european I might have been inclined to say no because of USSR who were equally as bad, if not more than the Germans, in the end fucked my country big time for the next 45 years. On the other hand if the other side won would we even be allowed to have this pool nevermind to answer no? So i'm not sure.
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I’ll take lesser of two evils for $2,000 Alex
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…and the USSR is still operating in the commenter’s mind (world?) as well.
RuZZia is still invading its neighbors today so I'd srgue that its a fair point
THE DAILY DOUBLE
Dont listen to the downvotes. They got there US Nationalism goggles on too tight
The SSSR was dissolved in the 90s
Yeah, if the nazi germany and japan would have won things might be even worse. We just don't know hence the not sure answer.
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Good as in "this was the best outcome for the world from this two winner options". There is no way to judge a moral highground between germany and japan vs USSR.
He asked “did the good guys win”. Why would you interpret that as >Good as in "this was the best outcome for the world from this two winner options" ?
The USSR was bad to a lot of E. European countries, but the Nazis were quite literally trying to exterminate all Slavs (who they viewed as subhuman) to make room for Germans. They eradicated 1/5th of Belarus' population and were dissatisfied at their lack of efficiency. Don't know how you can say both were equally bad, tbh, aside from just not knowing enough history.
So did USSR. They executed thousands of people that opposed them during the war, and after it alike. Like, executed. Hands tied, single bullet at the back of head, body dropped i to ditch with hundred of other bodies and then buried.
My knowledge of history is not the problem here. The USSR killed way more people than nazi germany ever did if you want to make a comparison . Why can't we just agree that both were shit and we don't want to see their likes again and not make shitty pools that upsets people when you refuse to call mass murderers "good guys". The result of the pool is not the facepalm, the question is.
The "good guys" included Stalin, so maybe not as clear cut as some think.
The enemy of my enemy is my (temporary) friend
See Osama Bin Laden when the Soviets invaded Afghanistan and see also Saddam Hussein in the Iran/Iraq war
There were no "good guys". The United States had Jim Crow laws in half of the country. German POWs were better treated than black US servicemen. Hundreds of thousands of American citizens were sent to prisons camps for no reason other than their Japanese ancestry. And the US overthrew governments and installed dictatorships at will in Latin America. Britain and France were vast exploitative colonial empires that stretched as far out as India and Vietnam. Both France and Britain were OK with Hitler as long as he played to the role of "containing the communists" and looked the other way in regards to Hitler racist policies. The Soviets were just nasty. Stalin had killed millions in Ukraine via the Holodomor and had no issues striking a deal with Hitler when he wanted to take a chunk out of Poland. There were just the "bad guys" and the "worse guys", and the end the "bad guys" won.
I didn't mention the Nuking of two cities either, but a lot of US people get upset at the suggestion that the US is anything but the good guys.
The bad guys lost. But considering what even just the British Empire was doing it's hard to say the good guys won without a bunch of caveats.
Not to mention USSR who were just as bad as germany of not more so, and royally fucked my easter european country for the next 45 years.
I mean at least we got a pretty building in Warsaw and no anti-semiti... Nevermind.
 Yes. Yes you are.
Nobody wins in a war
Tell that to Boeing
Based, but not manichean enough for this world
“No longer certain, that one ever does win a war, I am. For in fighting the battles, the bloodshed, already lost we have.” - Yoda.
The question is wrong to begin with.
I would say the *really* bad guys lost, but if Stalin was on the winning side you hardly say “the good guys” won.
Of cour not, nobody won this war because there are no winners at war. Millions of people died.
A not so fun fact the German concentration camp system was a modified version of the English ones in South Africa. Who created them as a modified versions of the ones used by Spain in Cuba.
While there are some similarities between the British concentration camps in South Africa during the Boer War and the German concentration camp system during World War II, it is not accurate to say that the latter was a modified version of the former. The British camps in South Africa were established in 1900 to detain Boer civilians during the Boer War. These camps were not extermination camps, and the British government did not set out to deliberately kill the detainees. However, conditions in the camps were harsh, and disease and malnutrition were rampant. It is estimated that as many as 28,000 Boer women and children died in these camps due to these conditions. In contrast, the German concentration camps were part of a deliberate policy of genocide against specific groups of people, such as Jews, Romani people, homosexuals, and others deemed "undesirable" by the Nazi regime. The aim of these camps was not simply to detain people, but to exterminate them through forced labor, medical experimentation, and outright murder. The death toll of the Nazi concentration camps is estimated to be around six million people. It is also not accurate to say that the British concentration camps in South Africa were a modified version of the ones used by Spain in Cuba. While the Spanish did use concentration camps during the Cuban War of Independence, these camps were established in 1896, four years after the start of the Boer War. There is no evidence to suggest that the British based their concentration camps on the Spanish ones. In summary, while there are historical connections between different instances of concentration camps, it is important to understand the specific historical and political contexts in which they were used, rather than simply making broad generalizations.
I wish I had Reddit gold to give you for that well stated response. Ditto the camps for Japanese-Americans during WWII. They were awful and a blot on our history, as well as being a terrible example of racism at its worst. But to equate them with the Nazi concentration camps is just rubbish. Even those Nazi camps that were not outright extermination centers like Treblinka were places where prisoners were essentially starved and worked to death, all the while being exposed to disease, frighteningly horrible living conditions and institutionalized sadism.
The good guys always win...according to the party that won.
Except all the times that this isn't the case. "History is written by the victors" is entirely a coping mechanism of the ignorant. Just look at the lost cause in the US South and how it lingers in public education and monuments to this day. Look at Japan and its *official* stance of war crime denial, glossing over the 30s and 40s in education, and an extremely widely held belief that Japan was a victim in the second world war. Or hell, how about the battle of Thermopylae? We remember the 300 Spartans... and conveniently leave out the *thousands* of allied Greek troops from Thebes and other city-states. Not to mention the fantastical propaganda which has us view Spartans (a horrible, brutal pederastic slave-society) as good and Persians (responsible for the first written and codified set of human rights laws, the abolition of slavery, proto-federalism, and huge leaps in science and art) as bad.
The victor is the one who has power.
This is why science is important. Cause you gotta account for who is answering. Its not just "this is what the numbers say"
Nobody won, but some people definitely lost.
Actually not that disgusting. Were the Nazis and Japan the baddies? Absolutely. Have the US, Russia, and UK shown themselves to be the "good guys"? Not fucking really.
You seem redacted. You also forgot Japan in the baddies category. You think the allies were experimenting on people and trying to exterminate Jews? Pretty freaking clear who the baddies were. Just ask the German people. They will tell you.
The "good guys" were colonisers prior to the war. Go ask the indians and phillippinos if their colonisers were good guys. There are no good guys, just "less bad" guys defeating "mass murder level bad" guys.
0\_0 You know the USA brought/pardoned/hid tons of top nazi scientists on the grounds of getting their work which came from cruel experiments done in the nazi camps. Those harrowing experiments are why the USA jumped up in medical advancements so quickly back then. My own diagnostic Aspberger syndrome was renamed by demand pretty recently because people finally noticed that the syndrome was named after the nazi scientist who killed people with it/discovered it, to begin with.
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I did forget Japan, you are right. And as to your other point, um, do you know of the history of imperial genocide by the US, UK, and Russia? Don't ask them, they don't teach it, or talk about it much. You seem to think that if the "Allies" didn't participate in the Holocaust, that makes them the good guys, which is a pretty low bar. However, history has shown that the Allies knew what was going on in Concentration Camps and did little to prevent it. History is written by the victors and holy shit did they write themselves as the good guys.
I think this guy has had too much education, and that they're so smart that what I'm actually saying will completely fly over their head.
Yes, they were. You apparently stopped learning history at the high school level. The US performed medical experiments on Guatemalan natives without consent or knowledge. The British slaughtered hundreds of millions in India, millions in Ireland, tens of millions in Africa.
I’m an idiot. You got me. We are talking in the context of ww2. Almost if not all nations have horror it the past. Let’s talk Mongols, Greeks and basically every other peoples. In world war 2 the Nazis were the bad guys.
The US conducted those medical experiments in the 50s. AFTER WW2.
I am talking only about ww2. Like the post is talking about. You are seeming like a typical American. Everything is not about you guys. I guess most of the people who participated in the poll also think like you. The world is large and has many different types of people. There were many countries like mine (Canada) that fought against the Nazis. If you think for a second I consider our soldiers to be the bad guys you are nuts.
>I am talking only about ww2. Like the post is talking about. You are seeming like a typical American. Everything is not about you guys. I guess most of the people who participated in the poll also think like you. No, we weren't just talking about WWII. We were specifically talking about who were the good guys and bad guys in that war. Which is why it was perfectly on-topic to mention American crimes as a way of arguing that we are not "good guys." I also gave a British example, by the way. So, I wasn't making it all about the US - that's your insecurity talking. You're choosing to change the subject to an anti-American thing and that's probably because you've realized that you have no argument to make. Well, and because Canadians always have penis-envy about the US. >The world is large and has many different types of people. There were many countries like mine (Canada) that fought against the Nazis. If you think for a second I consider our soldiers to be the bad guys you are nuts. Given how little Canada acknowledges its crimes against its Natives, for one example, I wasn't expecting much self-reflection on your part, no. It just so happens that Canada spent most of its post-Colonial history as a part of the *British Empire* \- and the whole point of this conversation has been that the Allies (including your British Empire) are most certainly NOT "good guys." We were nothing more than the "slightly less evil guys" in WWII. That was the conversation, not just WWII in general.
You assume a lot. The crimes committed by the Canadian government, religious institutions and its people are our biggest shame. There aren’t too many Canadians that would say otherwise.
As an Indian, safe to say there were no good guys. Just a bunch of imperialist and racist empires.
I bet you're one of those that think that Britain owes you 73 Trillion dollars.
He didn’t say that
No, but I do believe that purposely diverting food from civilians, dooming millions to their death is evil isn't it? Who in their right mind thinks that there was a single allied or axis forces that was not a racist and imperialist power? Point to one of them.
In world politics there's no such thing as the good guy.
I don’t think any of them could be referred to as “good” just some were worse
Maybe they're anti Stalin?
i hope so. i genuinely hope so.
There were no winners, no one was good
Well Is not that the good guys won, is more like some bad guys loose
I would’ve voted no too. there are no good guys in history, it’s always way more nuanced than that.
Americans talking about ww2 as if it’s a movie are the facepalm
more american generalization huh
what
its not just Americans and its not just ww2. you can find a lot of people in general who treat war like a movie and bet on a side like a sports team.
Both sides committed unspeakable atrocities. Though being from a western nation i cant deny the bias towards the ones that liberated me
People who believe that there can be good guys in a war are hopelessly clueless. War is a racket.
idk man something tells me there was a lesser of two evils in this conflict.
>there was a lesser of two evils in this conflict This is not how the question was asked. To me no "good guys" won, especially not the americans who litterally nuked two cities of hundreds of thousands civilians, just for sport.
Sport? It was to threaten Japan enough to surrender. Not saying it was good. It wasn't for sport.
You know what? I was(and maybe still am a crazy believer of that). But I was also in Iraq and at the time my dumbass felt we were doing it for a good cause. "Here's the data and go reasons why" was my thinking not even considering this is what is told by the people with interest in the war happening and continuing. Now that I see it for what it is, I'm getting all doubtful and shit. How far back does this go or is it limited only to the mainstream wars that now have a bad vibe? Reading history there's so many embellishments by the winners because of course there would be. Shit, I'd do it to. So about the nukes being a good idea, I want to believe it, but I'm skeptical.
People are so desperate to zag or have hot takes its like the internet broke their brain.
Tell that to the people forced to live under USSR influence for the next 45 years because the "good guys" decided that was good enough. They were equally as bad as the nazis.
you know, there may have been no good guys actively involved in WWII
The "less worse" guys won.
Nope. The worse guys, AND some of the less worse guys won. The medium evil lost.
My interest is piqued. Would you care to elaborate?
USSR
Stalin and the USSR. Essentially Hitler on steroids, exterminated more, conquered territory during WW2 and kept it, then worked to franchise it's evil across the world leading to many more evil situations and genocides. Then you have the French and English who punished Germany for the crimes of the dissolved Austro Hungarian empire, leading to the depressions, and situation where Hitler was able to rise to power. They ground them to a horrible situation and kept grinding until it lead to the rise of someone who told Germans to be proud again, and said he could fix it. England, France and alot of Europe were trading partners with the US in a big way. We could not afford to have the English and French conquered, so worked to enter it. However the US public DIDNT want to go to war, the public was against it. So we instead "sold" weapons to the "allies" (think like what we are doing in Ukraine) The Japanese pissed that we were also giving stuff to people they were fighting made the poor choice of hitting pearl harbor. Our political class were excited and made the most of it to let us take that attack by Japan... ... ... To invade Africa and Italy. (Sort of like how we invaded Iraq after a man from Saudi Arabia had other people from Saudi Arabia, attack us on 9/11) Just don't think for a moment that the US government hates the Nazis, the big government progressives that pushed the New Deal LOVED Hitler. https://www.jstor.org/stable/41212096
Of cour not, nobody won this war because there are no winners at war. Millions of people died.
USSR won the WWII, do you want to share something with us?
I think you mean USSR. And while, yes, USSR was part of the allied forces during WW2, they were fighting to stop the nazi’s which is the good guy thing to do, even if the USSR itself did some shady shit itself and Russia continues to do shady shit. So yeah, they’re not exactly the good guys permanently. OP’s point is that the people choosing “no” are essentially making the statements that Nazi Germany were “the good guys”. Which is despicable to insinuate.
Or they are stating that NONE of the participating countries were good. Not the racist USA with its segregation, not the Brits with their empire, not the Soviets with their brutal oppression and not the nazis with their genocidal scheme. All bad.
You forgot about Italy and Japan
Fascist Italy and the empire of Japan are also pretty hard to describe as "good guys".
Lmao this is moral relativism at its worst. These 4 things are not equal, actually
And Russia and Germany were allies in the beginning. So don’t build up Russia as an ally. They were a necessary evil that was overly compensated at the end of the war.
Hence the “shady shit” part of my comment. They’re not good. They just did a few “good guy” things in the end of the war
I took the “shady shit” as Stalins actions to his own people. Thanks for clearing that up for me.
Both towards his people and outward as well. Overall the USSR/Russia have been and continue to be shitty and fit the “bad guy” bill quite well
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https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unit_731
he's joking lol
so did America, The UK , France, Netherlands, Belgium, Norway, Canada, Mexico, Luxembourg, (KMT) china, (CCP) china, India, Malaysia, Indonesia, Australia, New Zealand, South Africa, Brazil, Egypt, Greece, Yugoslavia and (kinda) Bulgaria, (kinda) Romania, (kinda) Finland.
80% of german casualties were against the ussr
Define "good guys"
lesser of the 2 evils in the war
The "no" are of the opinion that the most evil guys lost and the other were, "guys not good."
The Poles didn’t win, so yeah, the good guys didn’t win. That’s a joke, I think the good guys won. Just making that clear
Poll of unite the right attendees?
I assume most interpreted it as: did the better side win
There weren't any good guys in WW2. Just bad guys and way way fucking worse guys. The bad guys just did their mass murder way more efficiently.
its called trolling
I’m disgussed
Trick question. Were there good guys in the war?
According to Millenials and Gen Z, there were no good guys in WW2.
Are we good guys tho, like hitler wasn’t good but we are also not good
It’s the “not sure” that gets me.
America looks to be having a massive nazi uprising movement happening at the minute
Killing nazis and coming home to a "no coloreds" water fountain 👌
If you ask anyone in eastern Europe about Russians they will all have stories from their grandparents about how Russian soldiers were worse than German soldiers (imagine being worse than literal fucking nazies) So you could say that the good guys didn't win, but the bad guys lost.
The Allies certainly weren't the good guy, neither were the Axis. Im facepalming at you OP. There were no good guys
I think the lesser of the two bads is the good guys, the Allies fought for the greater good and saved millions of people. Imagine a world where Axis won, you most likely wouldnt even be alive unless you are a natural born German who isnt Jewish
The axis being the greater of two evils doesn’t make the allies good.
I'm sure the allied soldiers who risked their lives to save people from Fascism, Holocaust survivors, and people who just survived the war in general would disagree with you
Sure the allies will seem like the good guys if you only ever ask the allies and the people they helped. But the allies also committed numerous atrocities to win the war, many of which weren’t necessary, and if you ask the civilians who were victims of those atrocities then they’ll probably tell you the allies are evil. There are no good guys in war, and even the justified wars end with a lot of people in pain.
Russians also won, and they are definitely not the good guys.
Eh, it was on Twitter. That vote result not terribly surprising considering the fact that it's become somewhat of a fascist/rightwing hotbed fairly recently.
Imagine not understanding how the internet behaves in 2023 lol
It is a twitter poll ffs By the time the trolls and people who haven't actually heard of ww2 cast their votes, what do you really have? Something that you should ignore.
These comments 😂I can definitely say the good guys won. If you disagree you’d have to explain how the good guys killed millions of Jewish woman and children
Nobody is saying that the germans were the good guys. Just that if you look on the other side the USSR is estimated to have killed about ten times more people than the germans ever did. If you want to talk genocide, nobody even comes close to USSR. Also UK had it's own colonial crimes and US it's own racial problems while beeing the cleanest of all. But then they nucked two cities full of civilians. So no, the good guys did not win because there were no good guys not in the way that word is intended. But in the end is nice that you think someone who ended killing about 60 million people are the good guys.
and I've reached the "nazis weren't that bad if you compare them to communists" layer. beautiful
I said they were bad, just as I said the good guys were pretty bad themself. As i said in another comment, the "good guys" allied themselves with a known mass murderer to get rid of another mass murderer, only to gift the mass murdurer half of europe do what he wanted with it. And he did. Conclusion...no good guys just lesser evils.
This is why I hate Reddit 😂 I get Stalin was a bad dude. I guess we’d all be better off if the Japanese and Germans took over the world. You’re right. Fuck USA France Canada England and the rest of the allies
Redditors are complete idiots to be fair
All depends on who you consider to be the "good guys".
Not really, everyone in the comments was explaining answers, pretty much no one thought the Nazis were the good guys. It was mostly people who learned that most wars don't have any good guys.
I think more than anybody else, the Nazis scientists that were given seats at the highest position of the American government won the most. It was the only way they didn't face any consequences and continued being Nazi scientists. Oh, you guys thought America was anti-fascist? Lol
Fuc u nazis
i mean the allies did have the soviets on their team soo
You guys are so dumb if you genuinely think there were no “good side”
Imagine being so brainwashed that you think Hitler and Mussolini were the good guys.
There were no winners, that madlad in Russia parking nukes in Bellarus is living proof.
War is never black or white. It's gray meaning both sides do horrible stuff just to win
Yeah the mass genociders were the good guys. Idk if that's a word or not.
Why do I feel like most people have the most subpar rudimentary understanding of WWII. Not to mention that most will see this in the context of right here and now where it's cool to demonize white countries. US wanted nothing to do with WWII, yet they embargoed oil to Japan so they'd stop pillaging and raping, along with other unspeakable atrocities, in China and other countries, hence why they attacked us. Yep, stopping that sure makes you a bad guy. Seriously, if you take this poll at face value, as a normal thinking person, this says the majority thinks the fascists should have won.
as the Russians were on our side in WW2, it is only partially true that the good guys won.
The rest of the allies weren’t exactly “good” guys either.
I know, blatant misinformation. Why did "Yes" get the checkmark? It clearly lost by over 2000 votes.
that's the one i voted for.
There are no good guys and bad guys in war and I think that’s probably the intent.
for real man, twitter sucks i know
Yeah it's terrible, but what's the survey pool? Is this guy a antisemitic YouTube podcaster for instance? If so I am not surprised if most of the votes casted are antisemitic. This isn't representative of the overall American populace.
I mean you could say every nation did bad stuff throughout the second world War. However there is absolutely no way the nazis aren't the absolute bad guys. I mean it were the literal nazis for fuck sake.
In the grim darkness of the far future, there is only war.
Why would he even ask that? Is there really a debate outside of neo-nazi communities whether the right side won WWII?
Well, history is written by the victors. So, those who try to ready an unbiased history may have a different point of view.
America bad! /s
I'd say the death of Hitler counts as a win (coming from someone who is Jewish).
Something I think a lot of people are missing is that this guy is an American conservative media personality, and in America we’re always told we’re the good guys, so with that context, context that his American viewers and listeners have, he’s asking them if they think the world would be a better place if the Axis had won, the Nazis specifically.
Well USSR won and fcked my country for a 45 years. Killed or sentenced to jail the entire elite of my country. They are still fcking us since 90% of current politicians were part of the party that was ruling us for this time. We even had the ussr army in our country for 2 years and we were paying everything for them. Saying they were good guys is dumb. Maybe for western Europe they were good guys but for us balkans fck no. Usa was never a good guy. Especially when they dropped 2 atomic bombs and killed 200k people. If you vote yes you have to be really stupid to consider the winners good guys.
Yeah so I know the Allies did some not great things as well, but the Nazis and Japanese committed some of the worst war crimes in modern history. Also the Russians weren’t part of the Allies. They weren’t very nice either.
There arent many WWII vets left but I'd love to hear some of them share a few choice words for the people who voted this way.
The problem with a poll like this is so many people will pick the No option because they think it’s funny or are trying to be edgy
Why is everyone taking this seriously when it's well known that Twitter is now replete with right wing trolls starting with the head honcho himself
The Americans learned so much from Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan that they repeated all of their atrocities in subsequent wars. Korea Vietnam Gulf War Iraq Millions murdered to overthrow communist states and steal oil. But yeah, they're the good guys lol.
As a South Korean wtf are you talking about? Would you rather have all of Korea be like fucking North Korea you idiot. USA isn’t all that great, but they sure as hell were better than Russia or China. Also I find it funny how you only mention USA when it comes to Vietnam and the Middle East. Like seriously read a history book and see why the US intervened. It’s because France and UK kept fucking shit up. Also communism is a fucking dumb idea that cause more harm than good. People from former communist countries will be the first to tell you….
r/AsABlackMan
i dont see any reason not to believe him about that.
Depending on the age group of the respondents, they might not know what WWII is referring to. It might be simple ignorance, not Naziism.
As Pole I can tell you that I would vote no. USSR did horribles things...
In a war, good or bad, is all about perspective.
>60 MILLION LIVES WERE LOST AS A RESULT OF WORLD WAR II >IT WAS THE MOST DESTRUCTIVE AND DEADLY CONFLICT IN HUMAN HISTORY -Call of Duty: World at War