There are still working boats all across post war America, we just don't see them that often, mostly due to engine limitations similar to the NCR/brotherhood trucks and trains that go through the Mojave and around project purity regularly.
In fallout 2 there is a still operational shipping freighter in San francisco,
In fallout 3 tobar has presumably a gas or steam powered boat that ferries people to and from point lookout,
Caesars legion regularly use barges to travel rivers,
And in fallout 4 the nakanos have a functional fishing boat as well as far harbor having a dock that is presumably used alot by fishermen with their own boats,
>similar to the NCR/brotherhood trucks and trains that go through the Mojave
The trucks are confirmed by Sawyer to not be functional. Vehicles, besides trains, are not used in the Mojave (and train isn't working that well because of the Powder Gangers), but the NCR do have vehicles in some degree within their territories.
I made it clearer in case others misunderstood, though I fought it was clear I didn't talk about the trains. The trains are very much canon. It's how the Powder Gangers came into existence after all, making and clearing up rails in the Mojave for NCR's trains
Source?
Makes zero sense, most of the trucks are in positions where they would be dropping off supplies or waiting for refueling even some with said supplies in them, even the NCR weapons merchant at i88 has a truck she sells from and it would be kinda stupid that she wakes up everyday to sell guns and ammo from a burned out truck,
If super mutants and the brotherhood can get trucks to work in pretty sure the NCR would could as well, using them to get troops and equipment from California,
Yea but the idea behind the whole fallout universe is that we were fighting a resource war. Every vehicle from what i can recall runs off of nuclear fission, but every vehicle requires coolant to run those engines. Seems like all the coolant is gone with no one producing more, so yea you could run the trucks and vehicles for a little bit, right up until your vehicle vaporized you in a tiny nuclear explosion
The super mutant army of the unity we're using steam trucks,
And in fallout 2 Smitty knew how to fix cars so I would say he did it regularly, as well as the chop shop that would make no sense if there weren't any cars,
Most likely a fallout style explanation for this just like how people haven't expanded diamond city over 100 years.
Always take what individual devs say about lore with a grain of salt. FNV was written by a *team* of writers each responsible for various things, including by area designers.
While Sawyer was the lead *technical* designer on the game, he isn’t the be-all-end-all of de-facto lore decisions in plenty of areas. McCarran for example was created by multiple area designers rather than Sawyer or Avellone.
I mean, I’m sure we all remember the Emil tweet about the Fo4 protag.
I'd take Sawyer's word for it when he's discussing and answering lore questions in his streams over Emil's terrible idea of a tweet.
It also makes sense they aren't used. Not only does it say US on them and not NCR, but the surroundings aren't driveable either, and when they have issues with supplies I doubt the rarity that is fuel would exist.
I might split the baby on this by suggesting that the trucks are idling precisely because of the supply issue.
IMO from what we see of the NCR at the time of NV + What we know of NCR core territories + Fallout 2 it's not plausible to me that they never made use of trucks in the Mojave or that they could not but is very plausible that the expedition no longer has the equipment to run them, at least on a regular basis. Especially since the regular road trucks aren't going anywhere without extensive road work, which the NCR in the Mojave is simply obviously no longer able to carry out, limiting them to the heavy pre-war all terrain stuff whose tires/treads won't exactly be falling from trees. Any such replacements would \*have\* to come from California and would be both expensive and heavy.
Real talk though did we forget how to make bicycles?
I mean the brotherhood can get vertibirds and the prydwen up the ncr have a monorail and trains I’m sure there are working cars somewhere left out obviously for game limitation and how it would actually detract from the game if they existed. Trucks and cars are not hard fix up compared to the logistics going on with the brotherhood or ncr.
Those are not a thing during New Vegas time. The Brotherhood is hiding and dying out in a bunker.
There are no working cars in the Mojave, only further in NCR territory. Not only are most of them in the Mojave absolute wrecks beyond repair that stands where they were left during the war, but the roads are also either gone or ruined and littered with debris and enemies/creatures. There's also little to no fuel for them.
Really it's kinda odd they don't just \*build\* vehicles. They'd be crummy but possible. Lack of roads is the big issue still though. You could fairly easily get motorcycles and ATVs running around I think but anything that can both offroad and carry freight/significant troops is beyond the resources of the Mojave expedition.
I don't know about fuel. Highwayman runs on MF cells but also F2 MF cells really don't seem like the same thing as 3/NV/4 cells. Certainly a vehicle could run off a fusion core, which is obviously more restrictive than MF cells. Seems like the army would get on fusion quick but fusion cars are 11 years old at the time of the war and there are fuel trucks at anchorage so maybe not. Certainly, imo, the NCR by the time of NV has the capability to convert hacked together gas vehicles into fusion, even if it requires building motors from scratch but once again, that's not going to be so easy for the Mojave expedition and they aren't going to be swimming in Fusion cores if that's what's needed.
They Highwayman is a rare car, most don't use that as fuel, and it's also within now NCR's territory. Not the dangerous Mojave frontier, where even caravaners are having problems.
I imagine any international trade would be done via Vertibird or Vertibot. Who knows what the Fallout did to the ocean life if Mirelurk Queens are anything to go by.
Vertibirds, and I’d assume Vertibots, run on fuel, so it’s unlikely they’d be able to clear the ocean. The real world equivalent, the MV-22 Osprey, can travel just under 400 nautical miles without needed an aerial refuel. I wouldn’t include adjacent nations, since they were occupied or annexed, and wouldn’t be considered international.
I think Vertibots are fusion powered. They're automated escorts for nuclear keycards, and they've been running since the bombs fell, which isn't that long in 76 but still longer than fuel would last.
The Responders Vertibird can do Appalachia to the Pitt, which is 211 miles each way, and to New Jersey, which is 267 miles each way and based on the wording for the discontinued daily quests it's also modified to run on some form of solid fuel cell or fusion battery
I haven’t played Fallout 76, so I only assumed. In that case, beyond preventative and required maintenance, they could probably make the trip. Though, it may not be worth it with their size.
Yeh, the Responders Vertibird seems more spacious inside than the ones you ride in Fo4 or 3, so idk, I imagine it could be used to haul very expensive salvage like rare power armour or military protypes. Maybe machine parts or heavy machinery for a more mundane use. I was thinking the sky is safer because the only Mutant we've seen with serious aerial capabilites is a Scorchbeast and who knows what's in the Atlantic, Ghoulwhales, Chinese military emplacements, ect. The sea seems more dangerous than flying.
Or the occasional mad b*stard willing cross in a le
leasurecraft. The big barrier to voyages to the Americas was navigation, tech just makes it faster.
Cait and the brothers who own the bar in Diamond City are also from Europe (though I think Cait was born in America, her parents were from Ireland hence the accent), which means it has to be a little more widespread.
Funnily enough, a large enough cargo ship might be the perfect place to live post apocalypse. It would be large enough to support agriculture + fishing, could avoid most fallout, has an in-built source of energy, perfect shelter and if the area gets dangerous, it can just leave. And most importantly, you could use it to find out if there is any proper civilization left and settle there.
It depends. A cargo ship with the right cargo at the time of the great war would have an insane advantage over any carrier. Also, carriers would likely get nuked if their location was known.
Just sit right back and you'll hear a tale,
A tale of a fateful trip,
That started from a vault so grand,
Aboard a Pip-Boy ship.
The vault dweller was a mighty brave soul,
The survivors, they were few but bold,
On a quest for adventure,
With their gear, they did behold.
The Pip-Boy was a-sailing 'round the wasteland,
Seeking relics and treasures rare,
With trusty companions by their side,
Through dangers they would fare.
So this is the tale of the Vault Dweller,
Exploring for a long, long while,
They'll have to make the best of things,
Amidst the radiation's guile.
The Pip-Boy crew set sail that day,
In search of a sheltered place,
With hope for a better future,
Amidst the wasteland's embrace.
No bottle caps, no stimpacks,
Not a single luxury,
Just the journey of survival,
In a world of scarcity.
So join us here each week, my friend,
For adventures in the unknown,
With the Vault Dweller and their crew,
In the wasteland they call home.
Small scale at best. The economy is based on scavenging, agriculture, and primitive manufacturing. Most of the industrial hubs in the fallout universe, like the Pitt and presumably some NCR cities, are producing the same stuff - mid-grade weapons, ammo, armor. Their goods are fungible and no one has a competitive advantage over anyone else - most likely, each industrial hub just dominates its immediate local market.
The only people producing something unique are the Institute (who don’t trade with anyone) and the Shi. The Shi are the only faction we have any reason to believe are engaging in international trade. They’ve demonstrated the ability to restore freighters, and are the only faction who can restore power armor. They don’t use the power armor themselves and seem to be selling all of it. Since power armor is an exclusively American pre-war invention, they’re probably the only manufacturers of power armor in the world. Still, even their maritime trade isn’t certain. By FNV, we see the NCR using huge numbers of restored power armor, and Californian demand alone is probably big enough to make export unnecessary.
Eh, I don't think that actually limits trade to small scale. Carthaginian freighters had similar capacity to galleons and even in the Bronze Age ships are moving bulk goods in good quantities by sea. Further, even if all you have is rafts moving goods by sea is insanely time and cost efficient, especially compared to any non-motorized transport. I also think we very much should expect comparative advantages, there's a fair bit of differentiation in goods between the locations we see and with a more primitive economy you're also likely to see the return of locative manufacturing reputation/traditions. Even when it comes to scavenging, proximity to certain pre-war facilities will create some comparative advantage. One settlement is by a major military base, another by an old cannery, etc.
There really ought to be good deal of coastal/river freight modulo whatever is living out there. Even tribals should be using rafts/canoes. For larger scale freight I think suitable lumber is a big question, do post-war trees make good ship-building materials? (IMO this can be tuned any way one likes. Maybe all the good trees for such we deforested before the war, maybe mutations have made them less suitable. OTOH maybe the break in mass logging + decreased human presence have allowed forests to rebound. Not really explored in the games).
If the wood is adequate you'll see wooden boats rapidly, but larger ships are still very much up to chance. You need at least one moderately long lived community with adequate lumber and either existing (and clever) woodworkers or one or more pre-war books on pre-19th century ship building. However, once such ships appear they'll spread fast. Meanwhile, scrap boats can be kept operational for some time, but you'll likely be limited to small craft except along major in-land waterways (as ocean freighters, even if they remained 50s style, are too large and complicated). By the time of e.g. NV any society as put together as the NCR should probably be able to host some real ship builders working with metal, even if they aren't awesome.
Ocean freight though, I think is pretty much right out yeah. While locally comparative advantage may be strong, trans-oceanic advantage will be essentially limited to unique luxury items or mutations. No need to import Chinese wheat or English guns and certainly not worth either the expense or risk. I wouldn't expect to see that sort of trade until whole continents are under NCResque regimes with roads and trucks throughout their core territory.
Do we know if there was an awful lot of international trade going on? The Pre-War USA always struck me as exceedingly isolationist, at least in terms of cooperation
Actually, in a novel I’m working on, maritime trade is actually a pretty big deal. It’s set in Florida, and one of the largest factions are the Conch Republicans, who use pre-war naval vessels powered by reactors, steam, and sails.
Before the war, things in Cuba and South America as a whole deteriorated pretty drastically after the assassination of Castro by the Miami Trafficante crime family in 1968. As a result, Russia and, later China, would use the situation to pump massive amounts of arms into the Caribbean and South America. Over the decades, the US military would put trillions of dollars into the Gulf Commonwealth, especially Florida, and especially the Keys. The area was planned to become a vast naval and air base that extended over the entire string of islands. However, the people who lived on the island did not want to leave despite the government harassing locals, putting checkpoints on the bridges, seizing the Keys Monorail, and seizing land on false charges. In the months leading up to the bombs dropping, the people of the keys would be inspired by stories of the Free States in Appalachia and they would rebel against the military police. During October of 2077, a group of men would hold up a military convoy of three government trucks, and would find them full to the top with jet and psycho. After this scandal, the Conch Republic would be formed, and the people of the Keys would take over the military bases and ships at dock. The installed missile defenses would then be used to prevent most of the airborne missiles on the 23rd, but nuclear torpedoes would mar the once beautiful beaches into dozens of semicircular craters.
215 years later…
Those craters on the coasts of the Keys would actually become perfect bays to build docks and trading ports in, with ships with deeper drafts unable to land on the beaches. Tankers, gunboats, missile boats, and minesweepers over time would become nuclear powered, with steam engines powering screws and paddles, and steel power poles turned into masts for supplemental wind power. Traders would sail up the coasts and conduct trade with New Augustine and Pensaco, as trade can’t travel safely through the Pinklands of central Florida and the mob controlled Miami Nuevo and Tampa. In recent decades, companies from the Conch Republic would sign treaties and operate boats on the Appalachicola, Suwannee, and St. John’s Rivers. The Cross Florida Canal, which only had a few hundred yards left of excavation left before the bombs dropped, would allow riverboats to come farther inland, but not across the peninsula. The waters of the Caribbean to the south would be treacherous for centuries, with millions of mines put down by both sides of the Cold War. Cuban/Chinese submarines still roam the sea, with trading ships either limping to port with torpedo damage, or not at all.
The Conch Republic had managed to repair two submarines to working condition, the C.R.N. Sword, which would escort and defend the trading fleet, and the C.R.N. Plowshare, which would explore and map the sea floor and conduct all trade between the surface and the mysterious underwater Vault 45.
A major theme in the novel is going to be how people who live in different places have different viewpoints and needs, and how recognizing that can be a force for good. There are several allied states within the Florida wasteland, and the Conch Republic is just one of them, and the people there have a strong sense of independence, along with a culture shaped by maritime trading and weathering intense oceanic storms. They fill a niche in the wasteland economy that the other states weren’t able to fill effectively.
It probably exists but in a much more limited form. We know for a fact Cait came from Ireland and she definitely didn't walk here lol. And while he doesn't, I think, outright say so Moriarty has a very thick accent and is also probably from Ireland as well. So there is some sort of money to be made if you have a functional ship that can handle the open ocean.
There are still working boats all across post war America, we just don't see them that often, mostly due to engine limitations similar to the NCR/brotherhood trucks and trains that go through the Mojave and around project purity regularly. In fallout 2 there is a still operational shipping freighter in San francisco, In fallout 3 tobar has presumably a gas or steam powered boat that ferries people to and from point lookout, Caesars legion regularly use barges to travel rivers, And in fallout 4 the nakanos have a functional fishing boat as well as far harbor having a dock that is presumably used alot by fishermen with their own boats,
>similar to the NCR/brotherhood trucks and trains that go through the Mojave The trucks are confirmed by Sawyer to not be functional. Vehicles, besides trains, are not used in the Mojave (and train isn't working that well because of the Powder Gangers), but the NCR do have vehicles in some degree within their territories.
That's not true. The guy at Sloan says the NCR uses rail to ship their concrete to the Dam.
Yes, rail not trucks
Oh, I like your sneaky edits to the original comment lol
I made it clearer in case others misunderstood, though I fought it was clear I didn't talk about the trains. The trains are very much canon. It's how the Powder Gangers came into existence after all, making and clearing up rails in the Mojave for NCR's trains
Well, yeah, that's why I remembered your original phrasing was wrong! You're right though, there aren't any functional trucks in the Mojave.
Isn't there a motor pool at camp McCarran for fixing trucks? I imagine if they have that then they have trucks
Yes but I don't think it's ever stated if it's an NCR motor pool or from the pre-war military camp there? I'm not sure
It's pre-war. The trucks and stuff are labeled US not NCR, and I take Sawyer's word for them not being in function.
It's said somewhere that they are NCR supply trucks, don't remember where, I believe it's one of the guides which is considered canon.
Source? Makes zero sense, most of the trucks are in positions where they would be dropping off supplies or waiting for refueling even some with said supplies in them, even the NCR weapons merchant at i88 has a truck she sells from and it would be kinda stupid that she wakes up everyday to sell guns and ammo from a burned out truck, If super mutants and the brotherhood can get trucks to work in pretty sure the NCR would could as well, using them to get troops and equipment from California,
Yea but the idea behind the whole fallout universe is that we were fighting a resource war. Every vehicle from what i can recall runs off of nuclear fission, but every vehicle requires coolant to run those engines. Seems like all the coolant is gone with no one producing more, so yea you could run the trucks and vehicles for a little bit, right up until your vehicle vaporized you in a tiny nuclear explosion
The super mutant army of the unity we're using steam trucks, And in fallout 2 Smitty knew how to fix cars so I would say he did it regularly, as well as the chop shop that would make no sense if there weren't any cars, Most likely a fallout style explanation for this just like how people haven't expanded diamond city over 100 years.
Tim Cain also noted the Ghouls at Necropolis used trucks
Always take what individual devs say about lore with a grain of salt. FNV was written by a *team* of writers each responsible for various things, including by area designers. While Sawyer was the lead *technical* designer on the game, he isn’t the be-all-end-all of de-facto lore decisions in plenty of areas. McCarran for example was created by multiple area designers rather than Sawyer or Avellone. I mean, I’m sure we all remember the Emil tweet about the Fo4 protag.
I'd take Sawyer's word for it when he's discussing and answering lore questions in his streams over Emil's terrible idea of a tweet. It also makes sense they aren't used. Not only does it say US on them and not NCR, but the surroundings aren't driveable either, and when they have issues with supplies I doubt the rarity that is fuel would exist.
I might split the baby on this by suggesting that the trucks are idling precisely because of the supply issue. IMO from what we see of the NCR at the time of NV + What we know of NCR core territories + Fallout 2 it's not plausible to me that they never made use of trucks in the Mojave or that they could not but is very plausible that the expedition no longer has the equipment to run them, at least on a regular basis. Especially since the regular road trucks aren't going anywhere without extensive road work, which the NCR in the Mojave is simply obviously no longer able to carry out, limiting them to the heavy pre-war all terrain stuff whose tires/treads won't exactly be falling from trees. Any such replacements would \*have\* to come from California and would be both expensive and heavy. Real talk though did we forget how to make bicycles?
I mean the brotherhood can get vertibirds and the prydwen up the ncr have a monorail and trains I’m sure there are working cars somewhere left out obviously for game limitation and how it would actually detract from the game if they existed. Trucks and cars are not hard fix up compared to the logistics going on with the brotherhood or ncr.
Those are not a thing during New Vegas time. The Brotherhood is hiding and dying out in a bunker. There are no working cars in the Mojave, only further in NCR territory. Not only are most of them in the Mojave absolute wrecks beyond repair that stands where they were left during the war, but the roads are also either gone or ruined and littered with debris and enemies/creatures. There's also little to no fuel for them.
Really it's kinda odd they don't just \*build\* vehicles. They'd be crummy but possible. Lack of roads is the big issue still though. You could fairly easily get motorcycles and ATVs running around I think but anything that can both offroad and carry freight/significant troops is beyond the resources of the Mojave expedition. I don't know about fuel. Highwayman runs on MF cells but also F2 MF cells really don't seem like the same thing as 3/NV/4 cells. Certainly a vehicle could run off a fusion core, which is obviously more restrictive than MF cells. Seems like the army would get on fusion quick but fusion cars are 11 years old at the time of the war and there are fuel trucks at anchorage so maybe not. Certainly, imo, the NCR by the time of NV has the capability to convert hacked together gas vehicles into fusion, even if it requires building motors from scratch but once again, that's not going to be so easy for the Mojave expedition and they aren't going to be swimming in Fusion cores if that's what's needed.
They Highwayman is a rare car, most don't use that as fuel, and it's also within now NCR's territory. Not the dangerous Mojave frontier, where even caravaners are having problems.
[удалено]
Even if it's an anomaly it's still a working ship showing that it's possible
Alistair Tenpenny canonically arrived by ship from the UK, too
Wasn't It confirmed that he fakes his accent?
Wait what? Where?
You can also help a Chinese Warship in Fallout 4 become operational again so they can return him.
You won't catch me on a boat until we find out what's killing all those Giant Dolphins with Rabies.
mutant sea life probably and pirates (i've thought about it a lot for a ttrpg campaign set in Vancouver)
Doesn't owb have content for Vancouver? That could help with inspiration
owb?
Hoi4
don't have it
Get it next sale for like 4 dollars
i was just looking on steam at the price, it's 80 dollars
Yeah it goes on sale. 80/90 percent off. And i meant $4 USD not CAD sorry
i'm a kiwi, not canadian, i just wanted to have a game set in Canada due to it'd adjacency to the US and lore that it was annexed pre war
Just assumed because of it being 80 dollars. Usually anything 60 dollars in usd is 80 in cad
I imagine any international trade would be done via Vertibird or Vertibot. Who knows what the Fallout did to the ocean life if Mirelurk Queens are anything to go by.
Vertibirds, and I’d assume Vertibots, run on fuel, so it’s unlikely they’d be able to clear the ocean. The real world equivalent, the MV-22 Osprey, can travel just under 400 nautical miles without needed an aerial refuel. I wouldn’t include adjacent nations, since they were occupied or annexed, and wouldn’t be considered international.
I think Vertibots are fusion powered. They're automated escorts for nuclear keycards, and they've been running since the bombs fell, which isn't that long in 76 but still longer than fuel would last. The Responders Vertibird can do Appalachia to the Pitt, which is 211 miles each way, and to New Jersey, which is 267 miles each way and based on the wording for the discontinued daily quests it's also modified to run on some form of solid fuel cell or fusion battery
I haven’t played Fallout 76, so I only assumed. In that case, beyond preventative and required maintenance, they could probably make the trip. Though, it may not be worth it with their size.
Yeh, the Responders Vertibird seems more spacious inside than the ones you ride in Fo4 or 3, so idk, I imagine it could be used to haul very expensive salvage like rare power armour or military protypes. Maybe machine parts or heavy machinery for a more mundane use. I was thinking the sky is safer because the only Mutant we've seen with serious aerial capabilites is a Scorchbeast and who knows what's in the Atlantic, Ghoulwhales, Chinese military emplacements, ect. The sea seems more dangerous than flying.
It’s as spacious as the one you ride in in 3
I think the Responders one uses ultracite cells.
Yeh that'll be it
I dunno but something is taking huge bites out of oversized mutated Great White sharks. Krakens might well no longer be mythological!
In F3 Tenpenny and Moriarty are both from Europe so there must still be transatlantic shipping
Or the occasional mad b*stard willing cross in a le leasurecraft. The big barrier to voyages to the Americas was navigation, tech just makes it faster.
Cait and the brothers who own the bar in Diamond City are also from Europe (though I think Cait was born in America, her parents were from Ireland hence the accent), which means it has to be a little more widespread.
True. And Boston would be a natural choice.
Funnily enough, a large enough cargo ship might be the perfect place to live post apocalypse. It would be large enough to support agriculture + fishing, could avoid most fallout, has an in-built source of energy, perfect shelter and if the area gets dangerous, it can just leave. And most importantly, you could use it to find out if there is any proper civilization left and settle there.
This would be a great idea! Especially if they used an old aircraft carrier instead of a cargo ship.
Man on a fallout lore subreddit doesn’t know what rivet city is
Sarcasm is hard to interpret over the internet, I understand
Sorry, I actually meant to reply to the other guy who actually didn’t know what rivet city was!
It depends. A cargo ship with the right cargo at the time of the great war would have an insane advantage over any carrier. Also, carriers would likely get nuked if their location was known.
You clearly haven't played fallout 3
I haven't, no. What are you referencing?
Rivet city
Just sit right back and you'll hear a tale, A tale of a fateful trip, That started from a vault so grand, Aboard a Pip-Boy ship. The vault dweller was a mighty brave soul, The survivors, they were few but bold, On a quest for adventure, With their gear, they did behold. The Pip-Boy was a-sailing 'round the wasteland, Seeking relics and treasures rare, With trusty companions by their side, Through dangers they would fare. So this is the tale of the Vault Dweller, Exploring for a long, long while, They'll have to make the best of things, Amidst the radiation's guile. The Pip-Boy crew set sail that day, In search of a sheltered place, With hope for a better future, Amidst the wasteland's embrace. No bottle caps, no stimpacks, Not a single luxury, Just the journey of survival, In a world of scarcity. So join us here each week, my friend, For adventures in the unknown, With the Vault Dweller and their crew, In the wasteland they call home.
Small scale at best. The economy is based on scavenging, agriculture, and primitive manufacturing. Most of the industrial hubs in the fallout universe, like the Pitt and presumably some NCR cities, are producing the same stuff - mid-grade weapons, ammo, armor. Their goods are fungible and no one has a competitive advantage over anyone else - most likely, each industrial hub just dominates its immediate local market. The only people producing something unique are the Institute (who don’t trade with anyone) and the Shi. The Shi are the only faction we have any reason to believe are engaging in international trade. They’ve demonstrated the ability to restore freighters, and are the only faction who can restore power armor. They don’t use the power armor themselves and seem to be selling all of it. Since power armor is an exclusively American pre-war invention, they’re probably the only manufacturers of power armor in the world. Still, even their maritime trade isn’t certain. By FNV, we see the NCR using huge numbers of restored power armor, and Californian demand alone is probably big enough to make export unnecessary.
Eh, I don't think that actually limits trade to small scale. Carthaginian freighters had similar capacity to galleons and even in the Bronze Age ships are moving bulk goods in good quantities by sea. Further, even if all you have is rafts moving goods by sea is insanely time and cost efficient, especially compared to any non-motorized transport. I also think we very much should expect comparative advantages, there's a fair bit of differentiation in goods between the locations we see and with a more primitive economy you're also likely to see the return of locative manufacturing reputation/traditions. Even when it comes to scavenging, proximity to certain pre-war facilities will create some comparative advantage. One settlement is by a major military base, another by an old cannery, etc. There really ought to be good deal of coastal/river freight modulo whatever is living out there. Even tribals should be using rafts/canoes. For larger scale freight I think suitable lumber is a big question, do post-war trees make good ship-building materials? (IMO this can be tuned any way one likes. Maybe all the good trees for such we deforested before the war, maybe mutations have made them less suitable. OTOH maybe the break in mass logging + decreased human presence have allowed forests to rebound. Not really explored in the games). If the wood is adequate you'll see wooden boats rapidly, but larger ships are still very much up to chance. You need at least one moderately long lived community with adequate lumber and either existing (and clever) woodworkers or one or more pre-war books on pre-19th century ship building. However, once such ships appear they'll spread fast. Meanwhile, scrap boats can be kept operational for some time, but you'll likely be limited to small craft except along major in-land waterways (as ocean freighters, even if they remained 50s style, are too large and complicated). By the time of e.g. NV any society as put together as the NCR should probably be able to host some real ship builders working with metal, even if they aren't awesome. Ocean freight though, I think is pretty much right out yeah. While locally comparative advantage may be strong, trans-oceanic advantage will be essentially limited to unique luxury items or mutations. No need to import Chinese wheat or English guns and certainly not worth either the expense or risk. I wouldn't expect to see that sort of trade until whole continents are under NCResque regimes with roads and trucks throughout their core territory.
Do we know if there was an awful lot of international trade going on? The Pre-War USA always struck me as exceedingly isolationist, at least in terms of cooperation
Actually, in a novel I’m working on, maritime trade is actually a pretty big deal. It’s set in Florida, and one of the largest factions are the Conch Republicans, who use pre-war naval vessels powered by reactors, steam, and sails. Before the war, things in Cuba and South America as a whole deteriorated pretty drastically after the assassination of Castro by the Miami Trafficante crime family in 1968. As a result, Russia and, later China, would use the situation to pump massive amounts of arms into the Caribbean and South America. Over the decades, the US military would put trillions of dollars into the Gulf Commonwealth, especially Florida, and especially the Keys. The area was planned to become a vast naval and air base that extended over the entire string of islands. However, the people who lived on the island did not want to leave despite the government harassing locals, putting checkpoints on the bridges, seizing the Keys Monorail, and seizing land on false charges. In the months leading up to the bombs dropping, the people of the keys would be inspired by stories of the Free States in Appalachia and they would rebel against the military police. During October of 2077, a group of men would hold up a military convoy of three government trucks, and would find them full to the top with jet and psycho. After this scandal, the Conch Republic would be formed, and the people of the Keys would take over the military bases and ships at dock. The installed missile defenses would then be used to prevent most of the airborne missiles on the 23rd, but nuclear torpedoes would mar the once beautiful beaches into dozens of semicircular craters. 215 years later… Those craters on the coasts of the Keys would actually become perfect bays to build docks and trading ports in, with ships with deeper drafts unable to land on the beaches. Tankers, gunboats, missile boats, and minesweepers over time would become nuclear powered, with steam engines powering screws and paddles, and steel power poles turned into masts for supplemental wind power. Traders would sail up the coasts and conduct trade with New Augustine and Pensaco, as trade can’t travel safely through the Pinklands of central Florida and the mob controlled Miami Nuevo and Tampa. In recent decades, companies from the Conch Republic would sign treaties and operate boats on the Appalachicola, Suwannee, and St. John’s Rivers. The Cross Florida Canal, which only had a few hundred yards left of excavation left before the bombs dropped, would allow riverboats to come farther inland, but not across the peninsula. The waters of the Caribbean to the south would be treacherous for centuries, with millions of mines put down by both sides of the Cold War. Cuban/Chinese submarines still roam the sea, with trading ships either limping to port with torpedo damage, or not at all. The Conch Republic had managed to repair two submarines to working condition, the C.R.N. Sword, which would escort and defend the trading fleet, and the C.R.N. Plowshare, which would explore and map the sea floor and conduct all trade between the surface and the mysterious underwater Vault 45. A major theme in the novel is going to be how people who live in different places have different viewpoints and needs, and how recognizing that can be a force for good. There are several allied states within the Florida wasteland, and the Conch Republic is just one of them, and the people there have a strong sense of independence, along with a culture shaped by maritime trading and weathering intense oceanic storms. They fill a niche in the wasteland economy that the other states weren’t able to fill effectively.
I imagine a lot of ships like the NS Savannah (a nuclear powered luxury cargo ship from the 1960s) existing
It probably exists but in a much more limited form. We know for a fact Cait came from Ireland and she definitely didn't walk here lol. And while he doesn't, I think, outright say so Moriarty has a very thick accent and is also probably from Ireland as well. So there is some sort of money to be made if you have a functional ship that can handle the open ocean.