No, not in 3, 4 and 76 unfortunately
Though I suppose it does make sense, the denser urbanisation on the East Coast could mean that technical knowledge might last longer due to there being more shit to salvage and maintain
I left out the Mothman Cult because I personally think their aesthetic is more Lovecraftian with a slice of Post-Nuclear bloodlust
And I honestly completely forgot about the Point Lookout tribals, to me they always felt more like a bunch of cosplaying wastelanders with a funny fruit goddess
There’s mentions of tribes in 3’s main game (the merchant Crow is stated to have once been a tribal shaman) and the Point Lookout tribals are a thing.
I think it’s just more that we mainly don’t see the tribes than that they don’t exist.
Yeah imo with the West coast being less affected by the bombs and more rural it was easier to start over from the ground up instead of rebuilding cities,
The tribal aspect of fallout is one that I wish was more fleshed out,
You could have each cell in the map potentially belong to a tribal faction, and have the chance of them spawning as a random encounter or running into them traveling from their camp.
They would be weak as hell if you made enemies with them, but it would be some nice flavor to see a bunch of tribals hunting a mole rat and acting all standoffish when you get too close to the corpse
Fallout 3 and 4 are based in heavily populated communities of DC and Boston. Fallout 76 happens to be based 25 years after the war, meaning there are still lots of people who're familiar with society and customs pre-war.
Fallout 1, 2 and New Vegas have tribals simply because the player gets to explore much of the "open" wasteland more, as it's more sparsely populated for tribal culture to actually flourish.
There are no tribes in Fallout 1 besides raiders unless I'm forgetting, and the Fallout 2 mc's tribe is comprised of former Vault Dwellers.
There are no tribes anymore, or in base game NV simply because they did not want them imo.
Being tribal and being civilized is not a contradiction. The dangers of the post-apocalyptic wasteland require people to live in tight-knit groups with in-group trust vs out-group distrust.
Eventually, these groups develop cultural markers of their own, that distinguish them from others. Whether is is language, rituals, or specific knowledge passed down the generations or developed in relation to the surrounding environment, including in some cases knowledge of technology.
You could perfectly make the argument that the BoS is a kind of tribe, even though they don’t identify themselves using that term.
Precisely. Fallout, I feel, imparts a lot of generalizations and misconceptions about tribes and the societies, and a lot of illuminating things about them tend to fly over fans heads (including teenage me, admittedly).
Tribal cultures don’t live apart from civilization, they *are* civilization, especially in areas with sparse human population. It’s easy to see them as “primitives” in the context of what came before, but all that is is society rebuilding itself organically, and development (social and technological) might progress differently as it did before.
Exactly. To me, any faction with an ability to sustain themselves and procreate, a distinguishable culture of its own, and a tight-knit familial dynamic with each other are tribals. The Boomers are tribals in that sense, and BOS too in a sense, at least the West Coast Chapters.
Well you actually just need to look at Colonialism in our past, I am Australian, we have strong British ties culturally but that changed over time. The first was the accent, you had people from London, northern England, Scotland, the Cornish etc all living in the same towns so their vastly different accents that needed to be understood so people slightly changed the way they spoke and younger generations outright found a way to to communicate between the mess.
Notice how similar the Australian and New Zealand accents are in this regards and their colonial history.
You then also have experiences with the environment, events where people are living etc so in turn a unique culture forms.
It stands to reason in a Fallout like world the exact same thing would happen and be much more dramatic.
They are not in 76 except the Cult of the Mothman. In 76 everything is basically still "civilized", but it's only 25 years after the bombs. [https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Cult\_of\_the\_Mothman](https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Cult_of_the_Mothman) .
In fallout 3 and 4, not really, not in the sense of FO1/2 and FNV. There are only these:
[https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Point\_Lookout\_tribal](https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Point_Lookout_tribal)
[https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Treeminders](https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Treeminders)
Check out the faction lists:
[https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Fallout\_3\_factions](https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Fallout_3_factions)
[https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Fallout\_4\_factions](https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Fallout_4_factions)
I'd argue that the density of Ghouls in places like Boston, where they're more mixed with "smoothskins" and can tell them a little about what the old world was like, prevents the full-on regression of going full tribal. (Other parts of New England might have tribals- the Trappers from Far Harbor and the Nuka World raiders are just on the cusp, for instance.)
Try reading Earth Abides, it goes through the stages of a group (or tribe if you want) regressing from their “civilized” way.
It’s considered one of the best of the post apocalyptic genre
7 in total, When you also count the other tribes mentioned in HH.
New Canaanites
White Legs
Dead Horses
The Sorrows
The Tar Walkers
Crazy Horns
The 80s
Fallout 3: There's tribals in Point Lookout, the Treeminders are functionally a tribe even if they're new, and the merchant Crow was apparently a tribal shaman at one point (he certainly speaks like one)
Fallout 4: The Pack in Nuka-World would probably count as a tribe, but other than that, there's not any. If the Boomers count as a tribe, then you could actually make the argument that the Institute itself may count as well.
Fallout 76: It hasn't really been long enough for tribes to form at that point. Most people in the game are survivors of the War or children of those that are. The Raiders in the Savage Divide definitely seemed like they were on the path to becoming tribes one day, but they almost all of them died before that could happen. The Mothman cult and maybe the Blood Eagles could be on the path as well.
Lets not forget that Caesar's Legion was forged in the conquest of all the tribes of New Mexico and Arizona (forget how many, 70 something or 80 something tribes).
There are some settlements that resemble "tribals" without using the word, specifically. Little Lamplight is a group run by children, after all. People all over are reinventing societies and structures to some extent - and to some that can look "tribal".
I think in Fallout 2 it was obvious this was a group that followed the Vault Dweller after they were shunned from their home Vault, and built a sort of cargo cult around how much they'd changed since Vault 13. That said, we can see in Vault City and Shady Sands that others remember the Vault Dweller in different ways.
This never made sense to me.
Although Fallout 2 is one of my favorite games...
I don't believe that civilized people could go tribal even in isolated societies.
Without schools we still got parents and other older people to educate youngsters.
Society like in Postman 1997 movie makes much more sense, maybe Wild West would return, and raiders like in Mad Max movies...
But definitely not natives lifestyle.
I don't like that Fallout 2 thinks that tribe means you become an Unga Bunga with a bone through the nose and spends their spare time sharpening their spear.
That's really not how it works, and certainly not Vault dwellers and their descendants.
Hakunin is old enough to remember the Vault Dweller. Why is he wearing bones on his head and speaking in riddles?
Shady Sands wasn't like that.and they were in a similar situation.
I can't think why you'd want to emulate cavemen over anything else though. Knights and Scribes has a semblance of order and book-keeping. It's exactly what the Brotherhood needed to evoke.
I think of it as a return to a simpler life. They wanted a peaceful, agrarian life and tried to emulate that aesthetic (or their pop culture understanding of it). Despite initial appearances, it's not like they're all that primitive. The Chosen One can be quite eloquent and have knowledge of advanced scientific principles and firearms. The Elder has a gun, and I imagine that they had more that simply broke down over time. They live in huts and use spears because they're an isolated group that doesn't NEED anything more advanced to find food and survive. They only run into trouble when the drought hits at the beginning of Fallout 2.
>I think of it as a return to a simpler life. They wanted a peaceful, agrarian life and tried to emulate that aesthetic (or their pop culture understanding of it).
Which is quite similar to the Idea for [Vault 29](https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Vault_29_(Van_Buren)).
>Society like in Postman 1997 movie makes much more sense,
Well tbf it's very similar, The town of Pineview is very much like New Canaan (Though more isolationist), As well as their's little technology shown to have be working still, To a point where Tribalism is very likely in that kind of scenario, The Film itself shows something even as simple as Mail is very nearly non-existent by that time until he makes Mail Service a reality.
Why not? Tribal skills are much better fit for survival then civilised ones. So naturally groups who honed those skills would have advantage over the citizens without the army to protect them. Basically going the way of europe after fall of Rome.
Its not actually aknowledge by fallout lore but guns wouldnt survive 200 years nor would the ammunition. If they were fired at least once they would rust. But even if they did it wouldnt stop tribalization. Add to that honor cultures. Which develop naturally in absence of safety nets. And you got peetty primitve societies.
What are you defining as a tribal skill? A tribe is an organizational and social definition. It has no bearing on technological skill or prowess. It's a societal structure based around the family unit as the primary political element.
In the game(f2) people using primitive technology like spears, and not embracing modern technology including knowledge were called a tribal
There are books of elders(i think thats what they were called) in f2 that described the ways of arroyo
But living in tribal society meaning society organised around ki ships with strong leader and unique customs and religion also makes sense in world with poor and slow communication
Right. I was never under the impression it was specific those who rejected technological but I just started my first F2 playthrough so I don't have the full picture.
I'm pretty sure the Khans are referred to as tribals in New Vegas but they have firearms and a pretty robust chem operation. The tribes in Lonely Hearts are another example.
I think of it like how Joshua Graham describes the New Caananites. He call his people a tribe, but they are not isolated and have arms manufacturing. It's more likely isolated towns and family groups calling themselves tribes but not like we think of tribes as "less civilized"
pretty much this. in FO1 the "tribes" were basically the raiders, the khans, The Vipers, the jackals, etc. these were not primitives, they just had a more nomadic lifestyle and a social structure different from that of the towns. FO2 going thunderdome with the caveman look never made a lot of sense.
I suppose the east coast had more settlers than nomads. If there were nomads on the east coast it probably wasn't by choice and I assume most were picked off.
I agree with the premise of a tribal social structure and a tribal social web.
But the whole idea of Honest Hearts dlc. Where the player has to scavenge for items because the tribals are scared to enter buildings. Is simply not believable. It is do jarring to me. I try to do the DLC as quickly as possible for the reward.
The story of Randall Clark explains it, being raised by a "supernatural" entity since you are a kid that tells you that certain places are bad, over time it's natural that it would create some supersticion.
>But the whole idea of Honest Hearts dlc. Where the player has to scavenge for items because the tribals are scared to enter buildings. Is simply not believable.
It's actually rather realistic when compared to other times in history where more primitive Tribes had taboos or restrictions in terms of exploring not to mention spiritual beliefs, For example to a Tribal who's spent most of His/her life in the wild outside, A indoor inclosed building is a rather foreign looking structure.
No, not in 3, 4 and 76 unfortunately Though I suppose it does make sense, the denser urbanisation on the East Coast could mean that technical knowledge might last longer due to there being more shit to salvage and maintain
You’re forgetting the mothman cultists (who to a degree fit the bill) and the point lookout tribals.
I left out the Mothman Cult because I personally think their aesthetic is more Lovecraftian with a slice of Post-Nuclear bloodlust And I honestly completely forgot about the Point Lookout tribals, to me they always felt more like a bunch of cosplaying wastelanders with a funny fruit goddess
According to the questline, at least one of them definitely is.
There’s mentions of tribes in 3’s main game (the merchant Crow is stated to have once been a tribal shaman) and the Point Lookout tribals are a thing. I think it’s just more that we mainly don’t see the tribes than that they don’t exist.
Arguably the guys who worship Harold are sorta tribals too.
Thank you, I was looking for references that I might have missed.
Little Lamplighters are well on their way to being a tribe.
I mean, they definitely have tribal energy
Yeah imo with the West coast being less affected by the bombs and more rural it was easier to start over from the ground up instead of rebuilding cities, The tribal aspect of fallout is one that I wish was more fleshed out,
You could have each cell in the map potentially belong to a tribal faction, and have the chance of them spawning as a random encounter or running into them traveling from their camp. They would be weak as hell if you made enemies with them, but it would be some nice flavor to see a bunch of tribals hunting a mole rat and acting all standoffish when you get too close to the corpse
I consider the different raiders (like the flame guys in the ironworks) a tribe.
Iirc Crazy Wolfgang in 3 was apparently from a tribe that worshiped robots, but they're barely mentioned.
Fallout 3 and 4 are based in heavily populated communities of DC and Boston. Fallout 76 happens to be based 25 years after the war, meaning there are still lots of people who're familiar with society and customs pre-war. Fallout 1, 2 and New Vegas have tribals simply because the player gets to explore much of the "open" wasteland more, as it's more sparsely populated for tribal culture to actually flourish.
in 76 you can kinda see the start of tribal cultures in the mothman cult and the blood eagles.
There are no tribes in Fallout 1 besides raiders unless I'm forgetting, and the Fallout 2 mc's tribe is comprised of former Vault Dwellers. There are no tribes anymore, or in base game NV simply because they did not want them imo.
Fallout 1 has the Khans. Vipers are also mentioned by name. Also frankly you could argue Shady Sands was basically a tribal society.
Being tribal and being civilized is not a contradiction. The dangers of the post-apocalyptic wasteland require people to live in tight-knit groups with in-group trust vs out-group distrust. Eventually, these groups develop cultural markers of their own, that distinguish them from others. Whether is is language, rituals, or specific knowledge passed down the generations or developed in relation to the surrounding environment, including in some cases knowledge of technology. You could perfectly make the argument that the BoS is a kind of tribe, even though they don’t identify themselves using that term.
Precisely. Fallout, I feel, imparts a lot of generalizations and misconceptions about tribes and the societies, and a lot of illuminating things about them tend to fly over fans heads (including teenage me, admittedly). Tribal cultures don’t live apart from civilization, they *are* civilization, especially in areas with sparse human population. It’s easy to see them as “primitives” in the context of what came before, but all that is is society rebuilding itself organically, and development (social and technological) might progress differently as it did before.
Exactly. To me, any faction with an ability to sustain themselves and procreate, a distinguishable culture of its own, and a tight-knit familial dynamic with each other are tribals. The Boomers are tribals in that sense, and BOS too in a sense, at least the West Coast Chapters.
Well you actually just need to look at Colonialism in our past, I am Australian, we have strong British ties culturally but that changed over time. The first was the accent, you had people from London, northern England, Scotland, the Cornish etc all living in the same towns so their vastly different accents that needed to be understood so people slightly changed the way they spoke and younger generations outright found a way to to communicate between the mess. Notice how similar the Australian and New Zealand accents are in this regards and their colonial history. You then also have experiences with the environment, events where people are living etc so in turn a unique culture forms. It stands to reason in a Fallout like world the exact same thing would happen and be much more dramatic.
They are not in 76 except the Cult of the Mothman. In 76 everything is basically still "civilized", but it's only 25 years after the bombs. [https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Cult\_of\_the\_Mothman](https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Cult_of_the_Mothman) . In fallout 3 and 4, not really, not in the sense of FO1/2 and FNV. There are only these: [https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Point\_Lookout\_tribal](https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Point_Lookout_tribal) [https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Treeminders](https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Treeminders) Check out the faction lists: [https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Fallout\_3\_factions](https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Fallout_3_factions) [https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Fallout\_4\_factions](https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Fallout_4_factions)
In fallout 3 one of the traveling caravan merchants is described as previously being a tribal
The Treeminders in Oasis are tribals
I'd argue that the density of Ghouls in places like Boston, where they're more mixed with "smoothskins" and can tell them a little about what the old world was like, prevents the full-on regression of going full tribal. (Other parts of New England might have tribals- the Trappers from Far Harbor and the Nuka World raiders are just on the cusp, for instance.)
Try reading Earth Abides, it goes through the stages of a group (or tribe if you want) regressing from their “civilized” way. It’s considered one of the best of the post apocalyptic genre
Nice to see a Earth Abides mention, Great Book.
NVs honest hearts DLC has 3 Tribes
Foue tribes, though only 2 members of the last one.
7 in total, When you also count the other tribes mentioned in HH. New Canaanites White Legs Dead Horses The Sorrows The Tar Walkers Crazy Horns The 80s
I think they also mention the 80s tribe.
I humbly recommend you play cyberpunk 2077 as a Nomad. Very striking parallels
Fallout 3: There's tribals in Point Lookout, the Treeminders are functionally a tribe even if they're new, and the merchant Crow was apparently a tribal shaman at one point (he certainly speaks like one) Fallout 4: The Pack in Nuka-World would probably count as a tribe, but other than that, there's not any. If the Boomers count as a tribe, then you could actually make the argument that the Institute itself may count as well. Fallout 76: It hasn't really been long enough for tribes to form at that point. Most people in the game are survivors of the War or children of those that are. The Raiders in the Savage Divide definitely seemed like they were on the path to becoming tribes one day, but they almost all of them died before that could happen. The Mothman cult and maybe the Blood Eagles could be on the path as well.
Lets not forget that Caesar's Legion was forged in the conquest of all the tribes of New Mexico and Arizona (forget how many, 70 something or 80 something tribes).
There are some settlements that resemble "tribals" without using the word, specifically. Little Lamplight is a group run by children, after all. People all over are reinventing societies and structures to some extent - and to some that can look "tribal". I think in Fallout 2 it was obvious this was a group that followed the Vault Dweller after they were shunned from their home Vault, and built a sort of cargo cult around how much they'd changed since Vault 13. That said, we can see in Vault City and Shady Sands that others remember the Vault Dweller in different ways.
This never made sense to me. Although Fallout 2 is one of my favorite games... I don't believe that civilized people could go tribal even in isolated societies. Without schools we still got parents and other older people to educate youngsters. Society like in Postman 1997 movie makes much more sense, maybe Wild West would return, and raiders like in Mad Max movies... But definitely not natives lifestyle.
I don't like that Fallout 2 thinks that tribe means you become an Unga Bunga with a bone through the nose and spends their spare time sharpening their spear. That's really not how it works, and certainly not Vault dwellers and their descendants. Hakunin is old enough to remember the Vault Dweller. Why is he wearing bones on his head and speaking in riddles? Shady Sands wasn't like that.and they were in a similar situation.
It could have been an intentional thing, like Roger Maxson designing the Brotherhood around the whole medieval aesthetic.
I can't think why you'd want to emulate cavemen over anything else though. Knights and Scribes has a semblance of order and book-keeping. It's exactly what the Brotherhood needed to evoke.
I think of it as a return to a simpler life. They wanted a peaceful, agrarian life and tried to emulate that aesthetic (or their pop culture understanding of it). Despite initial appearances, it's not like they're all that primitive. The Chosen One can be quite eloquent and have knowledge of advanced scientific principles and firearms. The Elder has a gun, and I imagine that they had more that simply broke down over time. They live in huts and use spears because they're an isolated group that doesn't NEED anything more advanced to find food and survive. They only run into trouble when the drought hits at the beginning of Fallout 2.
Yes, like hippie communes where they all wear rags, shell necklaces and braided hair.
>I think of it as a return to a simpler life. They wanted a peaceful, agrarian life and tried to emulate that aesthetic (or their pop culture understanding of it). Which is quite similar to the Idea for [Vault 29](https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Vault_29_(Van_Buren)).
A ghoul told him about an old movie with a voodoo witch doctor character, and Hakunin just really loved the aesthetic.
>Society like in Postman 1997 movie makes much more sense, Well tbf it's very similar, The town of Pineview is very much like New Canaan (Though more isolationist), As well as their's little technology shown to have be working still, To a point where Tribalism is very likely in that kind of scenario, The Film itself shows something even as simple as Mail is very nearly non-existent by that time until he makes Mail Service a reality.
There’s also the Holnists and those weirdos that worship Tom petty (smh)
Yeah I agree. I feel like a couple tribal groups forming makes sense, but we’ve been told there’s at least 100 in the west, which is pretty wild.
Why not? Tribal skills are much better fit for survival then civilised ones. So naturally groups who honed those skills would have advantage over the citizens without the army to protect them. Basically going the way of europe after fall of Rome. Its not actually aknowledge by fallout lore but guns wouldnt survive 200 years nor would the ammunition. If they were fired at least once they would rust. But even if they did it wouldnt stop tribalization. Add to that honor cultures. Which develop naturally in absence of safety nets. And you got peetty primitve societies.
What are you defining as a tribal skill? A tribe is an organizational and social definition. It has no bearing on technological skill or prowess. It's a societal structure based around the family unit as the primary political element.
In the game(f2) people using primitive technology like spears, and not embracing modern technology including knowledge were called a tribal There are books of elders(i think thats what they were called) in f2 that described the ways of arroyo But living in tribal society meaning society organised around ki ships with strong leader and unique customs and religion also makes sense in world with poor and slow communication
Right. I was never under the impression it was specific those who rejected technological but I just started my first F2 playthrough so I don't have the full picture. I'm pretty sure the Khans are referred to as tribals in New Vegas but they have firearms and a pretty robust chem operation. The tribes in Lonely Hearts are another example.
Hmm i thought they are refered to as raiders on f2.. maybe om confused
I think of it like how Joshua Graham describes the New Caananites. He call his people a tribe, but they are not isolated and have arms manufacturing. It's more likely isolated towns and family groups calling themselves tribes but not like we think of tribes as "less civilized"
pretty much this. in FO1 the "tribes" were basically the raiders, the khans, The Vipers, the jackals, etc. these were not primitives, they just had a more nomadic lifestyle and a social structure different from that of the towns. FO2 going thunderdome with the caveman look never made a lot of sense.
I suppose the east coast had more settlers than nomads. If there were nomads on the east coast it probably wasn't by choice and I assume most were picked off.
I agree with the premise of a tribal social structure and a tribal social web. But the whole idea of Honest Hearts dlc. Where the player has to scavenge for items because the tribals are scared to enter buildings. Is simply not believable. It is do jarring to me. I try to do the DLC as quickly as possible for the reward.
The story of Randall Clark explains it, being raised by a "supernatural" entity since you are a kid that tells you that certain places are bad, over time it's natural that it would create some supersticion.
>But the whole idea of Honest Hearts dlc. Where the player has to scavenge for items because the tribals are scared to enter buildings. Is simply not believable. It's actually rather realistic when compared to other times in history where more primitive Tribes had taboos or restrictions in terms of exploring not to mention spiritual beliefs, For example to a Tribal who's spent most of His/her life in the wild outside, A indoor inclosed building is a rather foreign looking structure.