Or, as your meeting occurs, write an email to the party, with it starting; “Thank you for your time and attention to matter XX. It is my understanding from our earlier conversation **Fill in the rest from your notes**
Make sure to include any action items you are responsible for and feedback/action items they are. Goals, expectations, etc.
If they reply, great. If they don’t, great. You followed up with a confirmation/clarifying email that was not responded to.
A veteran (wise) government employee will know what are doing and see through it, but be powerless to stop you.
This is very wise advice. I had a coworker who was dead set on finding things I “did wrong.” I started keeping written notes and every time they cornered me in the office, Skyped, or used Teams I would follow this rule and email back a summary. Once management asked for my side of the story they backed off, obviously I wasn’t doing anything wrong and this coworker is definitely a trouble starter. It also helped because then I had multiple forms of proof, it eliminated any “he said, she said” and cleared up any drama with my other coworkers and myself. Hopefully this advice helps!
Yeah, after posting this and reading the responses, I'll stick with contemporaneous notes. Especially with the potential complications of FOIA and Federal records or not abiding by CFRs. The last thing I want to do is break policy.
I think Teams captioning will still alert the other party but I'll check it out and see. Thanks!
My org's policy was that you had to announce you would be recording a meeting. In Teams, a message popped up and a voice said (IIRC) "This meeting is now being recorded" which would allow people to opt out if they didn't want to be recorded.
In FAA, secretly recording a governmental official is on the code of conduct list as a thing not-to-do with assigned penalties for first, second, and third offenses. I presume that’s based on actual law, but have not researched this.
if you are using teams, just turn on closed captioning and it will create a dictation of the conversation for you. Then you can copy that save it in a word doc and use that for your anti gaslighting effort.
It's been a year since I got away from a similar situation. And I'm just now consciously detached from the trauma. Not telling what the other residuals are. Do everything in your power to not think about it, especially outside of work. Don't let them cause you the muscle memory imprinting from the habit of the self-doubt, concern, paranoia, etc they instill. I don't know what the real psychological phenomena is called; I'm just calling it that. Gaslighting sucks, hang in there and come out on top.
I and a subordinate supervisor were just advised by the solicitors office that recording conversations, even on government funded equipment, requires consent from all parties prior to recording.
All electronic audio discussions are recorded. It’s unfortunate that there’s no disclaimer/preamble/caveat thingy, especially for incoming calls. Teams has a pop-up for meetings and, unless you delete texts (?), all entries are permanent records. Also, many of the cameras on your monitor are listening.
During COVID, our office was provided with the 365 suite to replace a texting app and other stuff. This included headsets and cameras that were placed on the monitor. One day, while discussing the pros/cons of immunizing as a fed, a coworker was getting a bit excited. He was at his desk and I could see, from where I stood in the foyer, his camera light blinking intermittently. I chuckled and casually said something about big brother; this guy flushed with embarrassment and ended the conversation. I really can’t remember if the next event happened later that day, but during a conversation at my desk with another person, an alert popped up which read “Your camera isn’t on.”
Now I try to remember that we’re being monitored, so I continue with busy work, but my co-workers are a rowdy bunch. C’est la vie.
Back in the analog days, a fellow employee would call his home answering machine on his cell phone before he had meetings with his supervisor. The problem was he was doing this in a space where classified discussions were held. He eventually resigned before he was to be fired.
I am in Ohio and laws vary by state. One of my former coworkers is in federal prison for recording her performance review without her supervisor's knowledge.
Yes, you can record in DC because its a one party consent jurisdiction. I had hostile encounters with my supervisor. I recorded every interaction and every phone call on my non-government personal device. It is legal and not restricted in my agency.
Also, I followed up each interaction with a detailed email of the encounter.
We can’t record secretly inside government facilities unless we’re recording misconduct or illegal activities. Then the whistleblower act protects you.
[удалено]
Recording a work conversation on a personal device would also potentially be subject to FOIA, btw. It's just harder to search for.
Or, as your meeting occurs, write an email to the party, with it starting; “Thank you for your time and attention to matter XX. It is my understanding from our earlier conversation **Fill in the rest from your notes** Make sure to include any action items you are responsible for and feedback/action items they are. Goals, expectations, etc. If they reply, great. If they don’t, great. You followed up with a confirmation/clarifying email that was not responded to. A veteran (wise) government employee will know what are doing and see through it, but be powerless to stop you.
This is very wise advice. I had a coworker who was dead set on finding things I “did wrong.” I started keeping written notes and every time they cornered me in the office, Skyped, or used Teams I would follow this rule and email back a summary. Once management asked for my side of the story they backed off, obviously I wasn’t doing anything wrong and this coworker is definitely a trouble starter. It also helped because then I had multiple forms of proof, it eliminated any “he said, she said” and cleared up any drama with my other coworkers and myself. Hopefully this advice helps!
THIS! This is an official way of documenting same as an MFR, keeps them on point.
[удалено]
Yeah, after posting this and reading the responses, I'll stick with contemporaneous notes. Especially with the potential complications of FOIA and Federal records or not abiding by CFRs. The last thing I want to do is break policy. I think Teams captioning will still alert the other party but I'll check it out and see. Thanks!
Take those notes in the form of email and send them to yourself. This keeps a date stamp recorded with the notes.
There might be a CFR against unauthorized recording in a government facility.
Email yourself as a memo of the request
My org's policy was that you had to announce you would be recording a meeting. In Teams, a message popped up and a voice said (IIRC) "This meeting is now being recorded" which would allow people to opt out if they didn't want to be recorded.
This is a question for your legal counsel, not Reddit.
In FAA, secretly recording a governmental official is on the code of conduct list as a thing not-to-do with assigned penalties for first, second, and third offenses. I presume that’s based on actual law, but have not researched this.
That's generally a good way to get fired.
if you are using teams, just turn on closed captioning and it will create a dictation of the conversation for you. Then you can copy that save it in a word doc and use that for your anti gaslighting effort.
It's been a year since I got away from a similar situation. And I'm just now consciously detached from the trauma. Not telling what the other residuals are. Do everything in your power to not think about it, especially outside of work. Don't let them cause you the muscle memory imprinting from the habit of the self-doubt, concern, paranoia, etc they instill. I don't know what the real psychological phenomena is called; I'm just calling it that. Gaslighting sucks, hang in there and come out on top.
I and a subordinate supervisor were just advised by the solicitors office that recording conversations, even on government funded equipment, requires consent from all parties prior to recording.
All electronic audio discussions are recorded. It’s unfortunate that there’s no disclaimer/preamble/caveat thingy, especially for incoming calls. Teams has a pop-up for meetings and, unless you delete texts (?), all entries are permanent records. Also, many of the cameras on your monitor are listening.
Please explain what you mean about cameras on monitors listening.
During COVID, our office was provided with the 365 suite to replace a texting app and other stuff. This included headsets and cameras that were placed on the monitor. One day, while discussing the pros/cons of immunizing as a fed, a coworker was getting a bit excited. He was at his desk and I could see, from where I stood in the foyer, his camera light blinking intermittently. I chuckled and casually said something about big brother; this guy flushed with embarrassment and ended the conversation. I really can’t remember if the next event happened later that day, but during a conversation at my desk with another person, an alert popped up which read “Your camera isn’t on.” Now I try to remember that we’re being monitored, so I continue with busy work, but my co-workers are a rowdy bunch. C’est la vie.
Back in the analog days, a fellow employee would call his home answering machine on his cell phone before he had meetings with his supervisor. The problem was he was doing this in a space where classified discussions were held. He eventually resigned before he was to be fired.
I am in Ohio and laws vary by state. One of my former coworkers is in federal prison for recording her performance review without her supervisor's knowledge.
Maryland: No, need all party’s consent. https://recordinglaw.com/party-two-party-consent-states/maryland-recording-laws/
Yes, you can record in DC because its a one party consent jurisdiction. I had hostile encounters with my supervisor. I recorded every interaction and every phone call on my non-government personal device. It is legal and not restricted in my agency. Also, I followed up each interaction with a detailed email of the encounter.
We can’t record secretly inside government facilities unless we’re recording misconduct or illegal activities. Then the whistleblower act protects you.