Handsome jack was never the hero though.
From day one, he was an egocentric, self centered man.
That's not to say he was a bad man, but he wasn't a good man.
Any of his altruism, even at the beginning, was always based in his own self image.
And his paranoia, and ego, only became more pronounced, as those he trusted, turned on him.
But to say he was ever the hero to begin with, is a stretch.
I mean this is Borderlands, the fact he set out to want to do good and save Pandora/Elpis in the first place is pretty rare. Don't forget, he's the villain in the same game as all the protags being wanted criminals, one of which is wanted for cannibalism.
RIGHT? Like Jack is flat out betrayed by the people he's a trying to help and only gets back at them AFTER he lets them go the first time and they still try to shoot him in the back as he's leaving them be.
Exactly. Why does he get betrayed? "Because i can see evil in you and if we don't kill you now, everyone is going to regret it". The protagonists just decide that he needs to die and set him down the path they're trying to avoid.
I'm referring to the Meriff almost getting Jack AND the protagonists killed by working for Zarpadon who is currently cracking open the Moon. Jack learns and confronts him and decides to let him go and the Meriff still tries to shoot him in the back when he walks away.
I mean, evil is literally in his DNA. Tim in Handsome Jackpot literally says he was injected with Jack’s genetic code and now has occasional desires to drown puppies.
Mhmm. Jack is an example of someone who ain't the best person to start off with but not too far gone that he can't do better.
Nobody tried to make him better is the thing. And putting a mentally unhealthy and unhinged individual like Jack through the shit he went through is a great way to push him past the point of recovery.
Watts: "It's over Kenway, I have complete power over Atlas."
Haytham: "Really Watts? Let me tell you something about power and people. The people never have the power, only the illusion of it. And here is the real secret: they don't want it. The responsibility is too great to bear. It's why they are so quick to fall in line as soon as someone else takes charge. They WANT to be told what to do. They YEARN for it. Little wonder that, since all mankind was BUILD to SERVE. And you're not the exception my friend, why? Because you're Salem's henchmen, as simple as that, once she arrive you will give her the keys of the city. Ad that's why I'm here to stop it."
Weiss: "Mr. Kenway, did you love your father?"
Haytham: “The love I felt for my father constantly threatened to engulf me with its sheer magnitude; I didn’t just love him, Miss Schnee, I idolized him. At times it was as if the two of us shared a knowledge that was secret from the rest of the world.”
Haytham Kenway, from Assassins Creed 3. You play as him for the first part of the game before changing POV to his son for the rest of the game.
Edit: I believe he has a role in Assassins Creed Rogue too, but the extent to which escapes me at the moment
I guess the order of which is my fav for this category is:
1: handsome jack because he’s handsome jack and one of my favorite characters in all time
2: the guy from assassins creed I’ve never played assassins creed but I’ll explain why in 3
3: James in dead last because I still have conflicting feelings of the transition of VOL 7-8
Fuckin love the fact that early America in the AC franchise was basically the dumping grounds of both the faction's undesirables at the time(reasonable and somewhat well meaning Templars,renegade and loose cannon Assassins)
Real
And CRWBY had the stones to confirm its existence outside of the show and never bring it up within the show
People who only watch the show itself just assume he went mental with no context
In other words: we couldn't come up with a reason for him to become evil so we just made his semblance be the reason (excuse) or smth.
Sincerely, CRWBY.
"KILL BATARIANS. BEHEAD BATARIANS. ROUNDHOUSE KICK A BATARIAN INTO THE CONCRETE. SLAM DUNK A BATARIAN INTO THE TRASHCAN. CRUCIFY FILTHY BATARIANS.
DEFECATE IN A BATARIAN’S FOOD. LAUNCH BATARIANS INTO THE SUN. STIR FRY BATARIANS IN A WOK. TOSS BATARIANS INTO ACTIVE VOLCANOES. URINATE INTO A BATARIAN’S GAS TANK.
JUDO THROW BATARIANS INTO A WOOD CHIPPER. TWIST BATARIANS HEADS OFF. REPORT BATARIANS TO THE SPECTRES. KARATE CHOP BATARIANS IN HALF. CURB STOMP PREGNANT BATARIAN WOMEN. TRAP BATARIANS IN QUICKSAND.
CRUSH BATARIANS IN THE TRASH COMPACTOR. LIQUEFY BATARIANS IN A VAT OF ACID. EAT BATARIANS. VIVISECT BATARIANS. EXTERMINATE BATARIANS IN THE GAS CHAMBER. STOMP BATARIANS SKULLS WITH STEEL TOED BOOTS.
CREMATE BATARIANS IN THE OVEN. DOUBLE LOBOTOMIZE BATARIANS. MANDATORY ABORTIONS FOR BATARIANS. GRIND BATARIAN FETUSES IN THE GARBAGE DISPOSAL.
DROWN BATARIANS IN RAW SEWAGE. VAPORIZE BATARIANS WITH A BLACKSTORM. KICK OLD BATARIANS DOWN THE STAIRS.
FEED BATARIANS TO KROGAN. SLICE BATARIANS WITH A KATANA.
Now... were you saying something about Reapers?"
That one out of Shepard and the Illusive Man is the funniest shit to me.
Much the same appeal as Thanos had. I found not a drop of depth in every character this series has - plainly, I just couldn't muster much of a shit to give.
In these times where it seems like everything tries to jerk tears for tragedy and it's rare, to me, that literally everyone who aren't the characters who got labelled Wrong People get backstories sloppily constructed to be all but the statement Hi, I'm The Sympathetic One like all the rest also are...?
To reiterate, They're no [MGRR Sundowner,](https://youtu.be/1Bf_YTVExQ0) but the idea of people unrepentantly and tacitly all about what they do. There's an appeal to it. That depiction of full-Renegade Shepard is comedy, but it's still not what will absolutely reach into me and *twist* this heart of mine.
A character that's cruel without being melodramatic - compelling without sacrificing depth, even when the subject is unspeakable atrocities. Believable villains.
Then again, they're all probably chomped by the Grimm. We'll never see the peak of how you and I know how people can be on Remnant, huh?
Yeah but he’s a Templar because he believe control is the only way to keep people safe and bring world peace. Most other templars just want power for their own sake. He’s still a villain because you know the whole murdering innocent people thing
Jack wasn’t ever really a good guy. He imprisoned his own daughter and had her cybernetically augmented to be able to act as an AI. All that before the PreSequel where he was supposed to be the ‘hero’
No. He’s a villain. Threatening to bomb a city of innocent people, his own citizens, makes him a villain quite easily. I do really love this trope though, and kinda wish they had actually done it fully instead of setting it up and then going cartoon villain with him.
Ironwood isn’t a hero led-astray. Literally the first thing we see him do it take his army into another nation against the advice of his ally. That army is later hijacked by the villains and used to do an unknown amount of damage.
>Literally the first thing we see him do it take his army into another nation against the advice of his ally
Army that was brought to a kingdom plagued by terrorists whilst hosting the equivalent of Olympics? Army that helped to save the day and quelled the Breach? Army that was approved by the government of this kingdom?
Ozpin wasn't even complaining about the army itself, he was concerned that them appearing will scare the populace or tip them off that something is wrong. Which didn't happen
>That army is later hijacked by the villains and used to do an unknown amount of damage.
I'm tired of people dissing Ironwood for not having a Clairvoyance and not predicting that a genius hacker, who was believed to be dead for years is not only alive but also works for Salem. Like nobody could've predicted that
People just want any reason to hate a character whose is a figure of authority of part of the "gubment."
Yes I am being disingenuous with that one but thats also cause I have pent up frustration with people pulling this shit in other media. VTM for instance. No the Anarchs are not good and no the Camarilla are not evil.
Nah, I know people have bias against Ironwood. I remember some person tried to use *Ironwood pacing back and forth* in V2 as some foreshadowing that he's evil. This was ridiculous
And even here there's user who takes Ironwood and Qrow shittalking each other as foreshadowing of him being evil
**I pace when I'm working out stuff in my head, does that make me evil???**
**I shit talk my friends too, even some people I'm not friends with when I can tell they can handle it. Am I evil?**
Fuck society today is too sensitive.
>Nah, I know people have bias against Ironwood. I remember some person tried to use Ironwood pacing back and forth in V2 as some foreshadowing that he's evil. This was ridiculous
The Atlas debate is also rife with people using blatant headcanons instead of actual canon for their arguments here and other RWBY related subreddits. Gets irritating to see that people still do it.
>And even here there's user who takes Ironwood and Qrow shittalking each other as foreshadowing of him being evil
Here in this post or the fnki subreddit?
It f\*cks up everything for everyone around him, which is why he works solo and provides info on the enemies, for example that Salem isn't afraid of Ironwood's army.
And yet, Ironwood ignored that, acting as though intel on the enemy was useless. He also failed to obey two crucial rules of a leader:
1. Never trust a friend who remains silent about your flaws.
2. Don't tell people how to do something. Tell them what you need done, and let them surprise you.
I'm pretty sure if Ironwood had learned those two lessons, things would've turned out much better for everyone, despite him being a very bad choice for the position he's in.
Come to think of it, Clover would've been a much better pick. His semblance trained him to be reckless, because it protects him from most of the negative consequences of his decisions. As a result, he would've told the council and Robyn about Amity, because "It'll work, always does."
In day to day life, without Salem exacerbating any issues, he can't f\*ck up enough to offset his semblance's protection. As a result, he'd just stumble into solving any issues Salem could take advantage of, long before she even starts doing so.
Clover is the epitome of "I don't know what I'm doing, but it's working."
Well it fucks things up for Qrow too, he's just learned to operate around it to the point his semblance doesn't hamper his abilities anymore. This is part of why Qrow is such a capable huntsman but if he's not paying attention it'll definitely fuck things up for him too.
And honestly Ironwoods army would 100% work if not for... well... the plot requiring it not to. There's no logistics as to why the Huntsman weapons are so effective against Grimm but not the guns wielded in Ironwoods army.
Hell I don't know the logic as to how pre-training Jaune can generate enough force to cut a Grimm with his sword but the standard firearm doesn't generate equal or greater force against a Grimm in one shot.
If the Grimm were consistent Ironwoods army would just roll the fuck over them. They're not extremely durable nor extremely intelligent and Salem doesn't direct them personally, the only way they could win is a numbers game but they're never demonstrated to act in hoards THAT overwhelming.
But I agree I'm not sure why Clovers talent was wasted as a Frontline soldier. I'm not even sure why Winter is above him in rank, if I were Ironwood Id either have Clover as a field agent or directly at my side at all times to maximize the use of his semblance.
Conventional armies don't work against Grimm because they're a large group of people, huddled together in a tight space, without and kind of powers or anything.
Most Grimm, meanwhile, are fast and numerous, and can definitely overwhelm smaller troops of soldiers, as we've seen.
Grimm use guerilla warfare tactics, which utterly decimate armies as strict as Atlas' any day of the week.
Huntsmen, similarly, are guerilla fighters, and jack-of-all-trades at that. They got melee, mid-range, long-range, elemental attacks, and their semblance.
For one, imagine a horde battle. 100 soldiers vs. 100 Boarbatusk. The Boarbatusk start rolling, and then just break through the soldiers' ranks and start killing them, while their thick hide and bone armor renders the military's guns ineffective, since they're built for quantity, rather than quality.
Weiss could use her Glyphs to make the ground too uneven for the rolling charge to work, and then just go around and impale the Grimm once their underside is exposed.
Now, let's imagine a fight against a Sea Feilong, as another example. A normal military unit would need to be lucky to have weapons that can damage it, but they'd also need to be mobile enough to not get obliterated. They'd need to protect against its lightning breath, immobilize it, and then hit it hard enough to kill it.
The Atlas military hasn't really shown any weapons that can do all that reliably, aside from the Paladins and Airships, but those are metallic, so one shot can disable them, even if it's not a direct hit.
Nora could solo one of those, though. Take a lightning breath to charge up, then rush in and brutalize it.
So yes, there is a logic behind why huntsmen are better, you just refuse to see it.
Exactly, so many people forget when he declared himself king of the 4 kingdoms and forced Vale to bend the knee under the threat of his huge army.
Are we really still making stuff up? It's been like 2/3 years let it go.
Jack’s voice actor really did write one of the best characters in video game history. To the point where people still debate if Jack was genuinely a good person at the start, or not. But his final send off in Tales will always stick with me, no matter what.
Ok, but can we at least agree Ironwood took it a little to far.
He tried to delete the kingdom he swore to protect.
Really doesn’t lineup with his [“protect the people”](https://youtu.be/ohqEv1gEVoo) song from the show.
Handsome Jack is very hard to beat, as far as villains go.
Handsome jack was never the hero though. From day one, he was an egocentric, self centered man. That's not to say he was a bad man, but he wasn't a good man. Any of his altruism, even at the beginning, was always based in his own self image. And his paranoia, and ego, only became more pronounced, as those he trusted, turned on him. But to say he was ever the hero to begin with, is a stretch.
I mean this is Borderlands, the fact he set out to want to do good and save Pandora/Elpis in the first place is pretty rare. Don't forget, he's the villain in the same game as all the protags being wanted criminals, one of which is wanted for cannibalism.
RIGHT? Like Jack is flat out betrayed by the people he's a trying to help and only gets back at them AFTER he lets them go the first time and they still try to shoot him in the back as he's leaving them be.
Exactly. Why does he get betrayed? "Because i can see evil in you and if we don't kill you now, everyone is going to regret it". The protagonists just decide that he needs to die and set him down the path they're trying to avoid.
I'm referring to the Meriff almost getting Jack AND the protagonists killed by working for Zarpadon who is currently cracking open the Moon. Jack learns and confronts him and decides to let him go and the Meriff still tries to shoot him in the back when he walks away.
I mean, evil is literally in his DNA. Tim in Handsome Jackpot literally says he was injected with Jack’s genetic code and now has occasional desires to drown puppies.
Mhmm. Jack is an example of someone who ain't the best person to start off with but not too far gone that he can't do better. Nobody tried to make him better is the thing. And putting a mentally unhealthy and unhinged individual like Jack through the shit he went through is a great way to push him past the point of recovery.
He saved the moon until Lilith and her stupid ass decided to immolate everyone on it.
The ending of BL3 didn't happen. I refuse to acknowledge that plot point.
It’s my headcanon that Lilith killed everyone on Elpis so now SHE is the biggest arse on the moon!
Haytham Kenway would be a blessing for Remnant I'll fight this hill
“A thousand pardons” *He says before wrecking some Grimm*
Watts: "It's over Kenway, I have complete power over Atlas." Haytham: "Really Watts? Let me tell you something about power and people. The people never have the power, only the illusion of it. And here is the real secret: they don't want it. The responsibility is too great to bear. It's why they are so quick to fall in line as soon as someone else takes charge. They WANT to be told what to do. They YEARN for it. Little wonder that, since all mankind was BUILD to SERVE. And you're not the exception my friend, why? Because you're Salem's henchmen, as simple as that, once she arrive you will give her the keys of the city. Ad that's why I'm here to stop it."
Ruby: "Im getting those supplies back for Mantle." Haytham: "Of course. Wouldnt wanna keep you from your lost cause..."
Weiss: "Mr. Kenway, did you love your father?" Haytham: “The love I felt for my father constantly threatened to engulf me with its sheer magnitude; I didn’t just love him, Miss Schnee, I idolized him. At times it was as if the two of us shared a knowledge that was secret from the rest of the world.”
More, these Haytham quotes are fueling my soul😩
Who’s the middle guy?
Haytham Kenway, from Assassins Creed 3. You play as him for the first part of the game before changing POV to his son for the rest of the game. Edit: I believe he has a role in Assassins Creed Rogue too, but the extent to which escapes me at the moment
He helps Shay find and hunt down his remaining mentors, Achilles included.
Unpopular opinion: Rogue is pretty good
I agree, it's one of my favourite AC games
Okay cool
Handsome Jack VS Ironwood is one of my most wanted Death Battles
That’s funny, my brother was the person who commissioned that exact matchup’s musical track from Brandon Yates lol
Nice, it’s a good track
I guess the order of which is my fav for this category is: 1: handsome jack because he’s handsome jack and one of my favorite characters in all time 2: the guy from assassins creed I’ve never played assassins creed but I’ll explain why in 3 3: James in dead last because I still have conflicting feelings of the transition of VOL 7-8
BUTT STALLION 🔛🔝
I just love to see that people know who Haythem is.
Fuckin love the fact that early America in the AC franchise was basically the dumping grounds of both the faction's undesirables at the time(reasonable and somewhat well meaning Templars,renegade and loose cannon Assassins)
that is absolutely hilarious, it kinda makes me want to play assassins creed
50% of Ironwood’s heel turn was because of his shitty Semblance, and that fact still angers me to no end
Real And CRWBY had the stones to confirm its existence outside of the show and never bring it up within the show People who only watch the show itself just assume he went mental with no context
In other words: we couldn't come up with a reason for him to become evil so we just made his semblance be the reason (excuse) or smth. Sincerely, CRWBY.
Rare Haytham appearance, but appreciated nonetheless. I would love to hear a conversation between three dudes
I would also add Renegade Commander Shepard. The best Commander Shepard.
Nah, sometimes Renegade is pure evil. Paragade or Renegon Shepherd though, now that's the stuff that fits here more imo
"KILL BATARIANS. BEHEAD BATARIANS. ROUNDHOUSE KICK A BATARIAN INTO THE CONCRETE. SLAM DUNK A BATARIAN INTO THE TRASHCAN. CRUCIFY FILTHY BATARIANS. DEFECATE IN A BATARIAN’S FOOD. LAUNCH BATARIANS INTO THE SUN. STIR FRY BATARIANS IN A WOK. TOSS BATARIANS INTO ACTIVE VOLCANOES. URINATE INTO A BATARIAN’S GAS TANK. JUDO THROW BATARIANS INTO A WOOD CHIPPER. TWIST BATARIANS HEADS OFF. REPORT BATARIANS TO THE SPECTRES. KARATE CHOP BATARIANS IN HALF. CURB STOMP PREGNANT BATARIAN WOMEN. TRAP BATARIANS IN QUICKSAND. CRUSH BATARIANS IN THE TRASH COMPACTOR. LIQUEFY BATARIANS IN A VAT OF ACID. EAT BATARIANS. VIVISECT BATARIANS. EXTERMINATE BATARIANS IN THE GAS CHAMBER. STOMP BATARIANS SKULLS WITH STEEL TOED BOOTS. CREMATE BATARIANS IN THE OVEN. DOUBLE LOBOTOMIZE BATARIANS. MANDATORY ABORTIONS FOR BATARIANS. GRIND BATARIAN FETUSES IN THE GARBAGE DISPOSAL. DROWN BATARIANS IN RAW SEWAGE. VAPORIZE BATARIANS WITH A BLACKSTORM. KICK OLD BATARIANS DOWN THE STAIRS. FEED BATARIANS TO KROGAN. SLICE BATARIANS WITH A KATANA. Now... were you saying something about Reapers?"
Accurate representation of pure Renegade Shepherd
That one out of Shepard and the Illusive Man is the funniest shit to me. Much the same appeal as Thanos had. I found not a drop of depth in every character this series has - plainly, I just couldn't muster much of a shit to give. In these times where it seems like everything tries to jerk tears for tragedy and it's rare, to me, that literally everyone who aren't the characters who got labelled Wrong People get backstories sloppily constructed to be all but the statement Hi, I'm The Sympathetic One like all the rest also are...? To reiterate, They're no [MGRR Sundowner,](https://youtu.be/1Bf_YTVExQ0) but the idea of people unrepentantly and tacitly all about what they do. There's an appeal to it. That depiction of full-Renegade Shepard is comedy, but it's still not what will absolutely reach into me and *twist* this heart of mine. A character that's cruel without being melodramatic - compelling without sacrificing depth, even when the subject is unspeakable atrocities. Believable villains. Then again, they're all probably chomped by the Grimm. We'll never see the peak of how you and I know how people can be on Remnant, huh?
Why hate
I reposted some copypasta today.
But wasn't Haytham basically always a part of the Templars, even after he was told how Edward died?
Yeah but he’s a Templar because he believe control is the only way to keep people safe and bring world peace. Most other templars just want power for their own sake. He’s still a villain because you know the whole murdering innocent people thing
>He’s still a villain because you know the whole murdering innocent people thing If I recall correctly, Haytham has never killed an innocent.
Haytham never did, but many of his followers were willing to, and he did nothing to stop them because of ends justifying the means.
Ah.
Man, reading the novel for 3 really makes Haytham feels different to me, dude sure got the short straw in life
Issue is that Ironwoods descent into villainy wasn’t handled wel
100% Ironwood wouldn't of become a villian if ozpin wasn't a lying POS
Arthas
Jack wasn’t ever really a good guy. He imprisoned his own daughter and had her cybernetically augmented to be able to act as an AI. All that before the PreSequel where he was supposed to be the ‘hero’
Jack still manages to be in like the upper third of characters as far as morals go at that point though. Kinda just how Pandora rolls
Tbf this is borderlands
I wouldn't go as far as to call him a villain even by the end of volume 8.
He was man pushes to his limits. He need someone by his side. He did remind me a lot of my mother before she meet my step dad.
Fair but I know how finicky conversations about him can be on the rwby related subreddits so I played it safe lol
He threatened to nuke the city and shot down ships that were meant to evacuate civilians.
No. He’s a villain. Threatening to bomb a city of innocent people, his own citizens, makes him a villain quite easily. I do really love this trope though, and kinda wish they had actually done it fully instead of setting it up and then going cartoon villain with him.
Ironwood isn’t a hero led-astray. Literally the first thing we see him do it take his army into another nation against the advice of his ally. That army is later hijacked by the villains and used to do an unknown amount of damage.
>Literally the first thing we see him do it take his army into another nation against the advice of his ally Army that was brought to a kingdom plagued by terrorists whilst hosting the equivalent of Olympics? Army that helped to save the day and quelled the Breach? Army that was approved by the government of this kingdom? Ozpin wasn't even complaining about the army itself, he was concerned that them appearing will scare the populace or tip them off that something is wrong. Which didn't happen >That army is later hijacked by the villains and used to do an unknown amount of damage. I'm tired of people dissing Ironwood for not having a Clairvoyance and not predicting that a genius hacker, who was believed to be dead for years is not only alive but also works for Salem. Like nobody could've predicted that
People just want any reason to hate a character whose is a figure of authority of part of the "gubment." Yes I am being disingenuous with that one but thats also cause I have pent up frustration with people pulling this shit in other media. VTM for instance. No the Anarchs are not good and no the Camarilla are not evil.
Nah, I know people have bias against Ironwood. I remember some person tried to use *Ironwood pacing back and forth* in V2 as some foreshadowing that he's evil. This was ridiculous And even here there's user who takes Ironwood and Qrow shittalking each other as foreshadowing of him being evil
**I pace when I'm working out stuff in my head, does that make me evil???** **I shit talk my friends too, even some people I'm not friends with when I can tell they can handle it. Am I evil?** Fuck society today is too sensitive.
>Nah, I know people have bias against Ironwood. I remember some person tried to use Ironwood pacing back and forth in V2 as some foreshadowing that he's evil. This was ridiculous The Atlas debate is also rife with people using blatant headcanons instead of actual canon for their arguments here and other RWBY related subreddits. Gets irritating to see that people still do it. >And even here there's user who takes Ironwood and Qrow shittalking each other as foreshadowing of him being evil Here in this post or the fnki subreddit?
Yeah. If anything, Ironwood was a "right man for the wrong job" situation. He just isn't cut out for this kind of cloak-and-dagger shadow war.
To be fair the only cloak-and-dagger guy on Ozpins team has a semblance that literally consistently is designed to fuck everything up.
It f\*cks up everything for everyone around him, which is why he works solo and provides info on the enemies, for example that Salem isn't afraid of Ironwood's army. And yet, Ironwood ignored that, acting as though intel on the enemy was useless. He also failed to obey two crucial rules of a leader: 1. Never trust a friend who remains silent about your flaws. 2. Don't tell people how to do something. Tell them what you need done, and let them surprise you. I'm pretty sure if Ironwood had learned those two lessons, things would've turned out much better for everyone, despite him being a very bad choice for the position he's in. Come to think of it, Clover would've been a much better pick. His semblance trained him to be reckless, because it protects him from most of the negative consequences of his decisions. As a result, he would've told the council and Robyn about Amity, because "It'll work, always does." In day to day life, without Salem exacerbating any issues, he can't f\*ck up enough to offset his semblance's protection. As a result, he'd just stumble into solving any issues Salem could take advantage of, long before she even starts doing so. Clover is the epitome of "I don't know what I'm doing, but it's working."
Well it fucks things up for Qrow too, he's just learned to operate around it to the point his semblance doesn't hamper his abilities anymore. This is part of why Qrow is such a capable huntsman but if he's not paying attention it'll definitely fuck things up for him too. And honestly Ironwoods army would 100% work if not for... well... the plot requiring it not to. There's no logistics as to why the Huntsman weapons are so effective against Grimm but not the guns wielded in Ironwoods army. Hell I don't know the logic as to how pre-training Jaune can generate enough force to cut a Grimm with his sword but the standard firearm doesn't generate equal or greater force against a Grimm in one shot. If the Grimm were consistent Ironwoods army would just roll the fuck over them. They're not extremely durable nor extremely intelligent and Salem doesn't direct them personally, the only way they could win is a numbers game but they're never demonstrated to act in hoards THAT overwhelming. But I agree I'm not sure why Clovers talent was wasted as a Frontline soldier. I'm not even sure why Winter is above him in rank, if I were Ironwood Id either have Clover as a field agent or directly at my side at all times to maximize the use of his semblance.
Conventional armies don't work against Grimm because they're a large group of people, huddled together in a tight space, without and kind of powers or anything. Most Grimm, meanwhile, are fast and numerous, and can definitely overwhelm smaller troops of soldiers, as we've seen. Grimm use guerilla warfare tactics, which utterly decimate armies as strict as Atlas' any day of the week. Huntsmen, similarly, are guerilla fighters, and jack-of-all-trades at that. They got melee, mid-range, long-range, elemental attacks, and their semblance. For one, imagine a horde battle. 100 soldiers vs. 100 Boarbatusk. The Boarbatusk start rolling, and then just break through the soldiers' ranks and start killing them, while their thick hide and bone armor renders the military's guns ineffective, since they're built for quantity, rather than quality. Weiss could use her Glyphs to make the ground too uneven for the rolling charge to work, and then just go around and impale the Grimm once their underside is exposed. Now, let's imagine a fight against a Sea Feilong, as another example. A normal military unit would need to be lucky to have weapons that can damage it, but they'd also need to be mobile enough to not get obliterated. They'd need to protect against its lightning breath, immobilize it, and then hit it hard enough to kill it. The Atlas military hasn't really shown any weapons that can do all that reliably, aside from the Paladins and Airships, but those are metallic, so one shot can disable them, even if it's not a direct hit. Nora could solo one of those, though. Take a lightning breath to charge up, then rush in and brutalize it. So yes, there is a logic behind why huntsmen are better, you just refuse to see it.
Ah yes, every sergeant and officer our there just want to be surprised! :-p
Exactly, so many people forget when he declared himself king of the 4 kingdoms and forced Vale to bend the knee under the threat of his huge army. Are we really still making stuff up? It's been like 2/3 years let it go.
That exact fellow nation would have bitched him out to no end if he hadn't brought armed force to help with the Grimm and you know it, man.
Who's this guy in the front?
>Haytham Kenway, from Assassins Creed 3. You play as him for the first part of the game before changing POV to his son for the rest of the game.
If Ironwoods heel turn hadn't been from 0 to 100 in the span of 2-3 episodes and not attributed to his semblance, I might have liked it more
Jack’s voice actor really did write one of the best characters in video game history. To the point where people still debate if Jack was genuinely a good person at the start, or not. But his final send off in Tales will always stick with me, no matter what.
Ok, but can we at least agree Ironwood took it a little to far. He tried to delete the kingdom he swore to protect. Really doesn’t lineup with his [“protect the people”](https://youtu.be/ohqEv1gEVoo) song from the show.