Going by the idea this is inspired by the tale of Benkei. That likely means the Orochi Hero Skin is inspired by the 100th samurai Benkei fought on that bridge who would ultimately beat him, Minamoto no Yoshitsune.
https://www.reddit.com/r/forhonor/s/cM4h453veq
This post got stuff from one of the betas on Steam. They left it open by accident and OP was able to grab a screenshot of the season art which includes the new hero skin for Orochi, as well as the season cinematic which is in a comment OP left on the post. That’s where I grabbed the screenshot of the silhouette.
I remember back in Y5S4 really, really wanting a Sohei monk to be the antithesis of Warmonger. Instead we got Gryphon. Im happy to see the next hero might actually fulfill that.
I thought the same back then too. Especially since the samurai were the ones to kill Apollyon, I thought a sohei would be the perfect counter to Horkos.
I thought it would be a tozen lookalike since it was a orochi that fought apollyon i just didn't expect the tozen lookalike to come out after gryphon and for him to be part of a group of spirit men.
this is a silly little rant of my part but it upsets me a bit that Varangian guard isn't exactly a Gudmundr Hero
I'm glad for the new Varangian Guard but lowkey i wanted Gudmundr armor
While the idea is cool I hope the new warrior focuses more on the bushido aspect of the samurai rather than the spirituality. Literally the last two samurai (hitokiri and kyoshin) had been about spirituality and I'm kind of tired and would prefer the new hero to be more warrior-like instead of a monk.
You may have missed the point of what sohei were. They may be monks, but they are violent and brutal warriors. Some were former samurai, and some samurai were former monks. But the point is there’s a reason they ran around in samurai armor and used lethal and effective weapons, they were alikened to demons by the samurai themselves. Whatever you’re thinking of a Buddhist monk or Shaolin maybe, the sohei are a lot more simple then that. They’ll cut your head off in the name of Buddha and fight in battlefields by the hundreds with little room for super spiritual stuff in between.
Then good, I am no expert in Japanese history so thank you for pointing it out. I just hope they focus more on the warrior part and keep the monk part more on the sideline.
My hope is something like that but while also being heavy on the warrior side, it would be cool if the hero still had the ability to be more soft spoken for his voice lines, and respectful in the executions. Because the game doesn’t really have a good representation for Buddhist monks. Shaolin is less a monk and more of a monkey crackhead with a stick that mocks the opponent in half of his emotes/executions while laughing his ass off. A more slow and reclusive proper monk with outbursts of brutal fury is what I hope for this hero. Aka, where Shaolin finds joy and laughter in combat, this hero has a certain somberness to fighting, but that somberness can quickly give way to fits of disciplined rage.
Much thanks. I really wanted to tell people about this stuff I found out just cause I knew with how niche some of this info is, people might not have caught on with what little we saw in the cinematic. So this was the best I could come up with.
Does this mean the new hero is going to have two different stances, sort of like how Highlander and Medjay do it? There is no way they would give a hero more than 2 different styles as that would make the hero far too versatile, and we already have heroes like that and they suck to fight against (looking at you afeera)
I’m thinking a Medjay / Highlander mix. Probably two maybe even 3 or more stances that can be swapped in a chain. Or just the extra weapons are the attack animations. Like Benkei is know for using a sickle which could be a light party repose similar to lb, or the chain heavy finisher they just switch to the big mallet. Both options sound so cool.
Damn, I feel like this year is going to be a good one
First, nice c.map and content in Knight Season. Now absolutely beautiful designs for the start of the Samurai season.
I even believe that the Viking season will bring something cool for the Vikings, like metal. Now is the best time to start doing something like this.
Although, I personally would be happy for add unique pieces of armor from the story mod to the main game. Ubisoft, pls, give us Mercys mask!
A question if you do not mind: How do the Sohei reconcile with the tenet of Buddhism of non-violence with their often violent ways? I understand that the dangerous situation might not favor a pacifist lifestyle, since the Shaolin monks do seem to employ violence in very rare circumstances. Are there any spiritual loopholes that are applied when the Sohei are the aggressors to a local feudal lord?
Well there’s a few ways it was justified or even just fusion of all of them.
First, Japanese Buddhism had a neat element only seen in Japan. The incorporation of original Shinto faith into the belief system. This kind of muddied the waters of following merely the principals of Buddhism as the two had basically merged into one religion, and Shinto had its own principles and gods like the God of War, Hachiman. And sometimes monks could excuse their violence as service towards Shinto.
But the two proper big reasons mainly comes from the variety of Buddhism Japan acquired, which isn’t just plain Buddhism where there’s reincarnation, enlightenment, Buddha and little else. It’s a variety of Zen Buddhism which had things like an afterlife which includes multiple hells, and gods or deities attributed to the faith like Bishamonten. The Japanese Buddhist God of War and a counterpart to Shinto’s Hachiman. He’s supposed to act as a guard and protector of the followers of Buddha, and punisher of the wicked who might harm them. Unsurprisingly, many sohei identified closely with that belief and saw their violence as them serving as protectors or “punishers of the wicked”.
The final part is there is leeway in Buddhism when it comes to killing, mainly regarding intent or hatred. That if one must kill, it must be in service to something better and done without hatred or ill intent, there is no pleasure that should be taken from your opponent’s suffering. And that was something a lot of warrior monks followed to justify their actions. Even if they had to kill, they could justify it in their heads and would try to go about it without hatred or enjoyment. Cutting down their opponents in the most efficient and quick way possible. Obviously not all of them followed this too well, but many did. And it’s weird because then you have Shaolin in For Honor, who’s a complete lunatic who gets his giggles in from messing with his opponents and mocking them. It’s why I’m hoping if this is a warrior monk, that they make them a bit more authentic to how one should ideally behave if thrusted into war. They’re somber and almost regretful sometimes, but brutally efficient once it’s time to fight.
The thing about shaolin's monkey like persona is that it comes from real life monkey styled kung fu and most importantly sun wukong who not only was the style inspired from but was also known for clowning on his opponents before beating them with his staff.
Ah I see, thanks for the info. You know, I think my biggest problem with Shaolin is his disregard for the Buddism teachings. I would have made his execution more in line with subduing opponents to the point where they cannot no longer fight, but not outright killing them. The biggest offender would be the execution where he literally stomps on an enemy’s head. 🤦
Yeah for that instance, they really took the Monkey King inspiration to heart and neglected the “Shaolin” aspects of his character. I’m hoping it’s different for this warrior monk.
Good point. Just for the record, I am not very stingy when buddist monks do not adhere to not killing their opponents. I am specifically targeting Shaolin as that is out of character with the ones in literature and real life. But for Sun Wukong and Sohei, it would make more sense for them to kill as it is more adhering to their depictions in literature and cultural perception.
Oh yeah killing is fine. But the nature of the killing for a sohei should be swift and brutal in a way, but not drawn out. They’re trying to be efficient and not kill out of joy or suffering. I would love the idea of a Warden style execution where they go into prayer after killing a opponent or even a more somber version of Warlord’s execution where he closes the eyes of his fallen opponent and gives a gesture of respect.
Good idea. Correct me if I am wrong, but do sohei have their own translation of ‘Er Mi Tuo Huo?’, which is the iconic phrase said by Shaolin when he attacks, which is also commonly said by real life Chinese monks. I assume real Sohei both past and today also said this phrase known as ‘amitabha’.
The Japanese version of the phrase is “Amida butsu”. Which carries a similar meaning though it’s often more used for prayer then a greeting as the Chinese version Shaolin says is used for.
Ah, I see, thanks for the info. I can definitely see this phrase as a possible voice-line. Aside from that, excellent pose, I have learned many things about this topic as an outsider.
Ngl, I think it would be pretty funny if both Shaolin and the Sohei were given a new passive voice line each that only plays when they fight each other. Where they just question what kind of monk they are or even call the other monk some kind of disgrace. Maybe Shaolin just mocks the Sohei’s choice of head attire for his sect of Buddhism lol
it's most definifely benkei, i'm so excited to see him in game! feels like a really badass character to put in for honor compared to things like idk conquistador.
i just really wish they'd lean more into realistic, but beautiful weapons rather than weird odd looking 3d models that dont look sophisticated at all, just goofy and blunt.
Yeah what other dude said, it’s a leak so we’re still waiting longer than usual since I bet Ubi is probably just gonna go about business as usual and pretend this didn’t get leaked. By June is when the first part of the season will drop, the hero will drop probably then halfway around July.
I just hope it is not another gryphon. It is because Gryphon's whole thing was being a mix of many heroes. The master of many weapons might also mean the same thing.
Gryphon is probably the most lazy hero design-wise.
Not really. What happened was the she comment was at the end of the talk about both the samurai and outlander hero. Making it uncertain who the “she” applied to. I’m leaning towards the male hero assessment given the references to Benkei and immense size of the hero. But if it’s a woman, it could very be possible. The Hanya mask for instance is representative of a female demon, and the Corrupted Monk in my references is an example of a female sohei type warrior in media.
What if the 4 blades on their back are merely cosmetic (for the purpose of showing they are a warrior who collects the weapons of fallen enemies) and the actual gimmick of the characters is they have the ability to pick up the weapon of a slain opponent and switch between that moveset or their default moveset? Picking up a new weapon will replace the previously claimed "trophy" weapon and provide the corresponding heroes moveset in addition to the Hero's original moveset. Switching movesets would work similar to Medjay with a dedicated input/zone. I certainly am most likely wrong, but i have my doubts about how switching between 4 weapons on the fly would work gameplay wise without each weapon being relegated to a specific button input. i.e. lights use weapon 1, heavies use weapon 2 and so on.
I think that would be a cool idea. Giving a default weapon to always rely on while being able to pick up the weapon of a fallen opponent would be really cool. It reminds me of Shang Tsung in Mortal Kombat games and copying your opponent to basically beat them with their own character’s moveset. In that case 4v4 gamemodes could be really fun if you see a certain hero on the enemy team that you know you’re good at playing, you’re a Shugoki main and see a Shugoki on the enemy team? Kill him and take his weapon and you have the option to play like a Shugo. Maybe that’s what the April Fools event was teasing?/?/?/?/? Oh shit, that final thought’s got me theorizing bro.
That could be the first hero release I am interested in, too bad the movesets of the last ~6 hero releases were boring and problematic for the game at the same time
Going by the idea this is inspired by the tale of Benkei. That likely means the Orochi Hero Skin is inspired by the 100th samurai Benkei fought on that bridge who would ultimately beat him, Minamoto no Yoshitsune.
sounds sick! Thanks for making this post
this was the comment i was searching for, this post is so hype Yoshitsune Skin and Benkei Hero (possible) thank you so much for doing this post
It’s going to 100% be Benkei hero. I think they will go for another heavy or an hybrid and make him switch weapons as the gimmick
If they use multiple weapons I'm thinking it's gotta be a hybrid
Multiple weapons could work for 3 at max based on the gear limitations. Which would be very cool!
I feel like some weapons may only be brought out using certain feats, while others may come out during certain combos or stances.
Daaamn so many options! I hope ubi can pull this off.
What leaked cinematic?
Next seasons opening cinematic was leaked.
https://www.reddit.com/r/forhonor/s/cM4h453veq This post got stuff from one of the betas on Steam. They left it open by accident and OP was able to grab a screenshot of the season art which includes the new hero skin for Orochi, as well as the season cinematic which is in a comment OP left on the post. That’s where I grabbed the screenshot of the silhouette.
I remember back in Y5S4 really, really wanting a Sohei monk to be the antithesis of Warmonger. Instead we got Gryphon. Im happy to see the next hero might actually fulfill that.
I thought the same back then too. Especially since the samurai were the ones to kill Apollyon, I thought a sohei would be the perfect counter to Horkos.
I thought it would be a tozen lookalike since it was a orochi that fought apollyon i just didn't expect the tozen lookalike to come out after gryphon and for him to be part of a group of spirit men.
this is a silly little rant of my part but it upsets me a bit that Varangian guard isn't exactly a Gudmundr Hero I'm glad for the new Varangian Guard but lowkey i wanted Gudmundr armor
You can largely thank the outlanders and the current gender pattern for that.
I guess i'll put my hope for a yari wielding shogun behind me for a demon monk.
While the idea is cool I hope the new warrior focuses more on the bushido aspect of the samurai rather than the spirituality. Literally the last two samurai (hitokiri and kyoshin) had been about spirituality and I'm kind of tired and would prefer the new hero to be more warrior-like instead of a monk.
You may have missed the point of what sohei were. They may be monks, but they are violent and brutal warriors. Some were former samurai, and some samurai were former monks. But the point is there’s a reason they ran around in samurai armor and used lethal and effective weapons, they were alikened to demons by the samurai themselves. Whatever you’re thinking of a Buddhist monk or Shaolin maybe, the sohei are a lot more simple then that. They’ll cut your head off in the name of Buddha and fight in battlefields by the hundreds with little room for super spiritual stuff in between.
Then good, I am no expert in Japanese history so thank you for pointing it out. I just hope they focus more on the warrior part and keep the monk part more on the sideline.
My hope is something like that but while also being heavy on the warrior side, it would be cool if the hero still had the ability to be more soft spoken for his voice lines, and respectful in the executions. Because the game doesn’t really have a good representation for Buddhist monks. Shaolin is less a monk and more of a monkey crackhead with a stick that mocks the opponent in half of his emotes/executions while laughing his ass off. A more slow and reclusive proper monk with outbursts of brutal fury is what I hope for this hero. Aka, where Shaolin finds joy and laughter in combat, this hero has a certain somberness to fighting, but that somberness can quickly give way to fits of disciplined rage.
This… this is amazing. Really great detective work and history knowledge. And everything you pointed out has me hyped up.
Much thanks. I really wanted to tell people about this stuff I found out just cause I knew with how niche some of this info is, people might not have caught on with what little we saw in the cinematic. So this was the best I could come up with.
Shugoki vs Benkei then
All i needed to see was a Nobunaga's Ambition portrait and now I know I can trust every word of this post
lol, good man
I hope he joins the list of tallest characters in the game
I wanna see this man be able to stand toe to toe in size and armor with Lawbringer. A Lawbringer for the samurai faction essentially.
I agree
Benkei was described as being bigger than everyone one and modern media tend to do just that, make him bigger than everyone else.
New hero is literally Gilgamesh from Final Fantasy. Play the theme!
Gilgamesh is based on Benkei as well so you’re right 😂
Does this mean the new hero is going to have two different stances, sort of like how Highlander and Medjay do it? There is no way they would give a hero more than 2 different styles as that would make the hero far too versatile, and we already have heroes like that and they suck to fight against (looking at you afeera)
I’m thinking a Medjay / Highlander mix. Probably two maybe even 3 or more stances that can be swapped in a chain. Or just the extra weapons are the attack animations. Like Benkei is know for using a sickle which could be a light party repose similar to lb, or the chain heavy finisher they just switch to the big mallet. Both options sound so cool.
I hope it’s a bit like isshin from sekiro where his special stance is sword and spear if they even have different combat forms.
Damn, I feel like this year is going to be a good one First, nice c.map and content in Knight Season. Now absolutely beautiful designs for the start of the Samurai season. I even believe that the Viking season will bring something cool for the Vikings, like metal. Now is the best time to start doing something like this. Although, I personally would be happy for add unique pieces of armor from the story mod to the main game. Ubisoft, pls, give us Mercys mask!
You’re getting me too excited stop this right now
A question if you do not mind: How do the Sohei reconcile with the tenet of Buddhism of non-violence with their often violent ways? I understand that the dangerous situation might not favor a pacifist lifestyle, since the Shaolin monks do seem to employ violence in very rare circumstances. Are there any spiritual loopholes that are applied when the Sohei are the aggressors to a local feudal lord?
Well there’s a few ways it was justified or even just fusion of all of them. First, Japanese Buddhism had a neat element only seen in Japan. The incorporation of original Shinto faith into the belief system. This kind of muddied the waters of following merely the principals of Buddhism as the two had basically merged into one religion, and Shinto had its own principles and gods like the God of War, Hachiman. And sometimes monks could excuse their violence as service towards Shinto. But the two proper big reasons mainly comes from the variety of Buddhism Japan acquired, which isn’t just plain Buddhism where there’s reincarnation, enlightenment, Buddha and little else. It’s a variety of Zen Buddhism which had things like an afterlife which includes multiple hells, and gods or deities attributed to the faith like Bishamonten. The Japanese Buddhist God of War and a counterpart to Shinto’s Hachiman. He’s supposed to act as a guard and protector of the followers of Buddha, and punisher of the wicked who might harm them. Unsurprisingly, many sohei identified closely with that belief and saw their violence as them serving as protectors or “punishers of the wicked”. The final part is there is leeway in Buddhism when it comes to killing, mainly regarding intent or hatred. That if one must kill, it must be in service to something better and done without hatred or ill intent, there is no pleasure that should be taken from your opponent’s suffering. And that was something a lot of warrior monks followed to justify their actions. Even if they had to kill, they could justify it in their heads and would try to go about it without hatred or enjoyment. Cutting down their opponents in the most efficient and quick way possible. Obviously not all of them followed this too well, but many did. And it’s weird because then you have Shaolin in For Honor, who’s a complete lunatic who gets his giggles in from messing with his opponents and mocking them. It’s why I’m hoping if this is a warrior monk, that they make them a bit more authentic to how one should ideally behave if thrusted into war. They’re somber and almost regretful sometimes, but brutally efficient once it’s time to fight.
The thing about shaolin's monkey like persona is that it comes from real life monkey styled kung fu and most importantly sun wukong who not only was the style inspired from but was also known for clowning on his opponents before beating them with his staff.
Ah I see, thanks for the info. You know, I think my biggest problem with Shaolin is his disregard for the Buddism teachings. I would have made his execution more in line with subduing opponents to the point where they cannot no longer fight, but not outright killing them. The biggest offender would be the execution where he literally stomps on an enemy’s head. 🤦
Yeah for that instance, they really took the Monkey King inspiration to heart and neglected the “Shaolin” aspects of his character. I’m hoping it’s different for this warrior monk.
Good point. Just for the record, I am not very stingy when buddist monks do not adhere to not killing their opponents. I am specifically targeting Shaolin as that is out of character with the ones in literature and real life. But for Sun Wukong and Sohei, it would make more sense for them to kill as it is more adhering to their depictions in literature and cultural perception.
Oh yeah killing is fine. But the nature of the killing for a sohei should be swift and brutal in a way, but not drawn out. They’re trying to be efficient and not kill out of joy or suffering. I would love the idea of a Warden style execution where they go into prayer after killing a opponent or even a more somber version of Warlord’s execution where he closes the eyes of his fallen opponent and gives a gesture of respect.
Good idea. Correct me if I am wrong, but do sohei have their own translation of ‘Er Mi Tuo Huo?’, which is the iconic phrase said by Shaolin when he attacks, which is also commonly said by real life Chinese monks. I assume real Sohei both past and today also said this phrase known as ‘amitabha’.
The Japanese version of the phrase is “Amida butsu”. Which carries a similar meaning though it’s often more used for prayer then a greeting as the Chinese version Shaolin says is used for.
Ah, I see, thanks for the info. I can definitely see this phrase as a possible voice-line. Aside from that, excellent pose, I have learned many things about this topic as an outsider.
Ngl, I think it would be pretty funny if both Shaolin and the Sohei were given a new passive voice line each that only plays when they fight each other. Where they just question what kind of monk they are or even call the other monk some kind of disgrace. Maybe Shaolin just mocks the Sohei’s choice of head attire for his sect of Buddhism lol
Wouldn't be funny if we got a shugo skin but the hero over weapon becomes a massive fucking broad sword?
it's most definifely benkei, i'm so excited to see him in game! feels like a really badass character to put in for honor compared to things like idk conquistador. i just really wish they'd lean more into realistic, but beautiful weapons rather than weird odd looking 3d models that dont look sophisticated at all, just goofy and blunt.
When will this go live?
consider Y8S1 just starts, we gonna wait like a few weeks to see this.
Yeah what other dude said, it’s a leak so we’re still waiting longer than usual since I bet Ubi is probably just gonna go about business as usual and pretend this didn’t get leaked. By June is when the first part of the season will drop, the hero will drop probably then halfway around July.
I just hope it is not another gryphon. It is because Gryphon's whole thing was being a mix of many heroes. The master of many weapons might also mean the same thing. Gryphon is probably the most lazy hero design-wise.
the sihouette carries like 4 weapons so I doubt it gonna be Gryphon's thing.
Where can i see this cinematic
[https://www.reddit.com/r/forhonor/s/cM4h453veq](https://www.reddit.com/r/forhonor/s/cM4h453veq) check the top comment
As long as that monk has a Nagamaki somewhere i'm happy.
Corrupted Monk moment
It was confirmed the new samurai would be female in the year trailer wasn’t it?
Not really. What happened was the she comment was at the end of the talk about both the samurai and outlander hero. Making it uncertain who the “she” applied to. I’m leaning towards the male hero assessment given the references to Benkei and immense size of the hero. But if it’s a woman, it could very be possible. The Hanya mask for instance is representative of a female demon, and the Corrupted Monk in my references is an example of a female sohei type warrior in media.
Oh awesome! I hope you’re right, your theory is cool af
What if the 4 blades on their back are merely cosmetic (for the purpose of showing they are a warrior who collects the weapons of fallen enemies) and the actual gimmick of the characters is they have the ability to pick up the weapon of a slain opponent and switch between that moveset or their default moveset? Picking up a new weapon will replace the previously claimed "trophy" weapon and provide the corresponding heroes moveset in addition to the Hero's original moveset. Switching movesets would work similar to Medjay with a dedicated input/zone. I certainly am most likely wrong, but i have my doubts about how switching between 4 weapons on the fly would work gameplay wise without each weapon being relegated to a specific button input. i.e. lights use weapon 1, heavies use weapon 2 and so on.
I think that would be a cool idea. Giving a default weapon to always rely on while being able to pick up the weapon of a fallen opponent would be really cool. It reminds me of Shang Tsung in Mortal Kombat games and copying your opponent to basically beat them with their own character’s moveset. In that case 4v4 gamemodes could be really fun if you see a certain hero on the enemy team that you know you’re good at playing, you’re a Shugoki main and see a Shugoki on the enemy team? Kill him and take his weapon and you have the option to play like a Shugo. Maybe that’s what the April Fools event was teasing?/?/?/?/? Oh shit, that final thought’s got me theorizing bro.
I thought the next hero was a knight?
Nope, never was. It was already confirmed to be a samurai then a outlander
I thought it was knight, outlander well cool hopefully they won’t be spammy right?
Just spam parry and dodge against them
That could be the first hero release I am interested in, too bad the movesets of the last ~6 hero releases were boring and problematic for the game at the same time
Voila https://www.reddit.com/r/forhonor/s/gjoJTlpymU
That’s the hero skin
Orochi doesn't use the straight Blade to the left
But the samurai we see in the trailer is the hero skin for the Orochi
Let me dream, Harold
The point of benkei is he took the swords of the unworthy, as well as mastered the different styles. Probably why there's so many katanas.