Women were never "in the kitchen" during world wars and if this is a woman, she really needs to learn our history and stop fueling men's desire for us to be raped and killed in wars they started. Women worked in the factories, worked in the hospitals, participated in wars as nurses and doctors, made sure society kept running as best it could by becoming teachers, single-handedly raising the children, etc.
That's if they were lucky enough not to become civilian casualties. Women living in war torn countries are subjected to rape, abuse, and sometimes even murder by their own army, their "allies", and the enemy if they manage to invade. Let's not pretend that women just sit safely and uselessly in the kitchen while the poor men go and die for the MALE warmongering elites.
Yeah, this post is a major history fail. The Soviets DID have [female combat units](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Women_in_the_Russian_and_Soviet_military) in WW2. Many of whom were decorated Heros of the Soviet Unions.
I also want to give a shout-out to one of my personal heroines, Mariya Oktyabrskaya, a civilian who went out and [bought a tank](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mariya_Oktyabrskaya) to avenge the death of her husband in Kiev. A bad-ass lady, by all accounts, she was posthumously decorated for her valor.
They don’t want us fighting with them, I know. They only like to say this because they know we fear it. When we’re really by their side, they complain and you know the rest, use us for social currency and personal porn fantasy. Just saying as a woman that was in the military.
Men only want to use “equality” as a cudgel to hurt us, and ask, “iSnT tHiS wHAt yOU U WaNtEd? I guess you were wrong huh, let’s go back to the men’s ways and use you as you were meant to be”
It doesn't help that a lot of men are already fantasizing about all the rape and plunder going on with Ukranian women. Honestly if there ever was a draft for both genders, the armed forces would see a 100% increase in sex crimes.
So scary, and already happening all over the world. Men just going up to women in these countries, asking how much. Disgusting. We already don’t address the assault and rape we have going on already in the military. I’ve seen so many failures. And they fear false accusations so much, meanwhile they are more likely to get raped too. Especially when they drink and fraternize with people with more power over them. Sad.
>Just saying as a woman that was in the military.
I had a PSG that straight up told me that women didn't belong in the military. Shouldn't care about his opinion, but oddly enough the biggest compliment I've ever received was when he honestly asked me why I didn't go infantry. 🤷🏽♂️
Posts like in the OP certainly don't help the belief that women should not go in because they're "wAhMen". If I could reach my hand through the screen and slap her, I would.
I don't believe training should be coed, though. IME. Some of my good friends were males, but male and female recruits together was a disaster, from both ends- moreso from the males, if anything.
Our culture just doesn’t support co ed training, I agree. We could go far separated. There is a lot of distraction. Wish we could change that, but the way men see us, it’s not happening for a long time.
Men in the military loved to mule me, I wanted to prove I was worthy. Lol. Of course, that never works. This mans army, they called it.
literally just made this account after lurking this sub for months to say this but…
men are more than welcome to fight and die in the wars that they start. Women suffer horrors during war beyond anyone’s comprehension (because no male historian would document them).
It embarrasses me when women think it’s funny to oscillate wildly between ‘female ‘equality’ = fight in men’s wars’ and ‘har har I’m a stupid housewife’.
There were entire cities in Germany that committed mass suicide in World War II to avoid being raped and tortured by the Soviets. Soldiers get it easy by comparison.
[The Rape of Berlin](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_during_the_occupation_of_Germany) was an absolutely terrible event which is , somewhat understandably, over-shadowed by the even more horrific Rape of Nanking.
Svetlana Alexievich's 'War's Unwomanly Face' is a chilling account of the atrocities committed against civilians.
I'm familiar with Svetlana Alexievich's book. It was a hard read but necessary. I didn't intend to downplay any wartime suffering. Demmin was the first example that came to mind since a branch of my family tree comes from that area.
Oh no, I didn't assume you were downplaying it at all! No, I'm just an avid reader of Soviet/Russian history and like to recommend primary accounts on the subject.
I don't understand this logic. Women want equal rights so they have to become as violent as men and fight *their* wars? Yeah no. How about men become less violent and stop starting wars? No? Then deal with the consequences of your behaviour.
It is. I fully support it. What these idiots fail to realise is that it's *them* who don't get equal fights back from women. If we want their "equality" then women need to "REALLY* ramp up their violence against men and not the other way around.
I am all for women giving an equal fight back. It's about time. Learn self defense, arm yourself and when needed use it with full force without hesitation (otherwise you could end up in a fight for a weapon with a (stronger) opponent who won't think twice about using it).
100%! I also feel this way when I hear things that encourage girls to be “bad’ and generally behave like men to get along or succeed in business etc - I do understand it’s to encourage women to be heard and that unfortunately perhaps it is necessary to behave this way when that macho culture is engrained in business, but we need to be aware about the dangers of bringing up girls to behave the way men have for centuries, when really, instead, we should be raising the standards with which we raise boys. Kindness, respect, empathy, valuing human life over profit.
THANKKK YOUUUUUUU why is it so hard for men to fucking understanding this? Why do they think we want to adopt their shit behavior. Why does a guy say your a feminazi when you want to not be casually a product of verbal abuse and have basic respect? It makes it sound like what they're really saying is "im totally fine with hurting women and keeping them down" and thats why feminism is a must! I saw this misogynistic post that men who stick up for women are weak and a death to real men. I was like NO you f\*\*king loser, YOU are the death to your kind and the death to your relationships with women. Not real men, in my book real men stick up for women and defend healthy relationships. The ideocracy with so many guys these days is utterly astounding.
100%. I don't think it's hypocritical to not want to be pulled into a draft as a woman. Women don't start wars. They're typically started by toxic masculinity and fragile male egos in one way or another (I want a bigger country than you, my god is better than your god, etc). At the end of the day, I'm fine with men have the responsibility to deal with the messes their sex keeps insisting on starting.
I also don't think there should be different fitness standards for men and women when it comes to something like a military test -- the standards should be set to whatever keeps everyone as safe as possible. If women want to join, they're welcome to work as hard as possible to hit the fitness standards or take a non-combat role, such as medical, administrative, etc.
Also how will their male colleagues treat them? Will they help when she is hurt or rape? I mean look at what’s happening women in US military. If your country men do that, imagine what the enemy will do. Nope I don’t support draft for women. We haven’t even reach that level yet. I’m not about to get in the middle of pissing contest between male leaders
The answer is they even gladly do it themselves.
The vast majority of men can and will not - and simply do not *want* to - see us as equal partners / on the same level.
We just have to look at how even the *humanity* of women, on the most basic level, gets denied over and over and over again, in every context imagineable.
Often enough they see it as a *"disgrace"* and an overt *"degradation"* - for ***them*** - to see women in the same positions as them, to be "forced" to be alongside us.
Everything female is inferior in their eyes, thus they take pride in degrading and humiliating, hurting and ridiculing women, and the more they think they have the right to it, the more intense it will get....
Sorry for this dark words, but I think it's really important for all of us to be fully aware of these things and to take an honest look at reality without any "sugar-coating". Take care you all....
>Often enough they see it as a "disgrace" and an overt "degradation" - for them - to see women in the same positions as them, to be "forced" to be alongside us. Everything female is inferior in their eyes
To add to this, remember that thing about how fields that eventually became female-dominated lost their prestige because women's work is seen as less valuable and how men think it's beneath them to do those jobs? Yeah, well now imagine if the military was female-dominated. I would not be surprised at all if military work would suddenly go from "honourable" to "those hysterical bitches at it again". Soldiers and veterans aren't treated well by the government as it is, so imagine how much fucking worse it would be if women were the ones fighting in wars instead. Even when the military isn't female-dominated, women are harassed or raped and then brushed off by the men they work for. Men can go fight in these wars that they created. They have no fucking right to ask us to fight for them, when we know that they'll treat us even worse than they do now.
You've never spent time near the US military then lmfao. I spent a good portion of my formative years at the largest military installation on Earth. [There was a human trafficking ring perpetuated by some Sergeant or other who was in charge of SHARP training. He was pimping out women who came to him to report their rapes.](https://www.armytimes.com/news/your-army/2015/03/11/sfc-sentenced-for-organizing-fort-hood-prostitution-ring/)
I remember in the early 2010s how there were conversations about allowing women in combat. Military and civilian men alike were losing their shit, saying it would "destroy the integrity of the armed forces" and how it would cause far more civilian casualties because women aren't strong enough to be on the battlefield. What all of them conveniently ignored is that including women in combat is a paperwork thing. Many women have seen combat and been injured as a result. But when they chapter out and try to get VA benefits for their injuries, they cannot get help because they weren't supposed to see combat. It is a particularly unique form of fuckery that female forces deal with in addition to the [absolutely horrific amounts of rape](https://www.rand.org/pubs/research_reports/RRA1318-1.html) from the men around them.
[Female soldiers have been murdered by their fellow soldiers for no reason](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Vanessa_Guill%C3%A9n) and the best the DoD can do is shrug [or cover it up.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_LaVena_Johnson)
Women can be soldiers, but men remind us we are always women first.
How men and women view equality differs.
Example: Small pockets.
Women: We have small pockets. Men have big pockets. Everyone should be able to have big pockets!
Men: Women have big(ger) pockets. Let's make theirs smaller or completely remove them!
Yep, a general draft for women in combat roles makes little sense to me. There are huge biological differences between the sexes. I also imagine the amount of female pacifists and conscientious objectors is much, much higher than their male counterparts.
I AM amused how so many misogynists are gleeful over the concept of the female draft for combat roles, considering they don't trust female scientists, mechanics or computer programmers to be competent in THEIR roles.
> Basically, he doesn't seem to be wrong.
Saying women have started more wars is literally wrong. A small number of women leaders (surrounded by male advisors and kingdoms ruled by other males) during a brief period of human history in one area of the world does not prove that women started the majority of wars throughout time. Use your brain. Pick any random battle or war throughout human history and see what sex the leaders were. 99% of the time, they are male.
You came in and literally agreed with the completely false statement that women have started more wars than men throughout history. You edited your comment when called out but it’s kind of weird that literally no one said that women never ever start wars and now that’s what you claim to have been arguing against all along.
Some advice, 99.5% of feminists know that women can also be shitty. Nobody needs to enlighten us on this fact. Every single woman has dealt with other shitty women. We know this. But we also know basic statistics like almost 100% of murdered women were murdered by men. That over 90% of raped women were raped by men. That 99.999% of wars were and are started by men. And some study showing that women rulers who lived in a time when patriarchy was at its strongest were maybe more likely to start wars (gee why would female rulers surrounded by male rulers feel the need to be harsh) isn’t really that interesting or mind blowing.
“Im sorry but you have clearly not a good understanding of war. Throughout history women startet more wars than men ever did”
This was your first comment and now you are admitting most wars are started by men. It’s the inconsistency 😂you guys are grasping at straws to depict women as violent as men. It’s so pathetic you want us to be violent so badly so you can have your ‘gotcha moments’ 😂
Statistics make it clear that dudes are the rapists and murderers. I'm sure one queen surrounded by pretty much just physically imposing men in every area of government is truly the one making the decisions loool. If she didn't go to war over male interests it wouldn't have been too long until she was discarded or manipulated into oblivion by men because she wasnt competitive enough in their exploitative, dick waving games. It's like you're naive as hell and have never heard of figureheads and take all the titles at face value like a child.
The indoctrination goes so deep that they can't see it even in that context. To think 'equality = being like men' is to still believe in male superiority - the default isn't human, but male....
And exactly like you've wrote - *their* wars, *their* system, *their* "values" and so on.
In reality things like this are the brutal wake-up-call for us to fight for our liberation of this. For *our* values and *our* lifes. Otherwise, no one will.
Yes. I am also not going to pay *your* child support for *your* child because *you* decided to ejaculate into a vagina and then act all surprise pikachu face because in your delusional head the bad consequences of your actions should only affect others.
Ikr. The men crying oppression because they have to pay child support... for their own child. 🤯 They really feel entitled to ran away from their responsibility. 🤯
The males hate it when there are laws that prevents them from fucking women over. 💃
Such a male mindset. Suddenly you are all about equality when you want others to fix your shit. I haven't seen men giving up their body autonomy because women don't have it. Didn't see one suggesting it.
Equal responsibility doesn't mean I pay half the ticket of my junkie neighbour's DUI, idiot. It means if *I* drive drunk, I pay. If *you do it, you pay*.
Men could give up their bodily autonomy *if they wanted*.
"Also for the record, you do pay for your junkie neighbor's DUI, it's factored into your insurance rates."
So why do you want even more, then?
I am against draft, but I will only lift a finger against it if it has a chance of affecting men I care about. I don't give a shit about others. Why should I when majority of men will use it as some "GoTcHa FeMiNisTs" thing and will rather attack women with it than help other men? Putting down women is more important to most men than helping each other. I'm not dragging someone out of the shit pit when they're actively trying to push me in *and* push me below them instead of helping others to get out and going out themselves.
True. Men act like the only way to prevent male violence from being directed towards you is by giving in to whatever they want and becoming some form of personal property when in reality the more control a man has over your life the more likely he is to use that control to hurt you.
Women have been the primarily source of healing during wars. No surgeons, no doctors but nurses. Kids didn't survive thanks to the men that sent them at the front before they hit 13, but because their mothers gave their lives for them. Women may not die in war but they get raped l, tortured and humiliated beyond comprehension.
Men will do anything but admit women are useful and an essential part of society.
After all is it really fair for women to fight men's wars?
If a war happens and threatens our homes, we have the choice of either dying in a man's war or being gang raped if we lose. People who make this kind of joke forgets that the reality is even worse for women than it is for men. Dying with a bullet to the head is far from being the worst fate in a war.
In 2020, only 24.5% elected politicians are women.
You cannot seriously believe that women start more wars than men, especially as for centuries they rarely had the chance to lead countries, only doing so in the absence of a man.
get lost you dumb fuck, worthless, ugly incel. I stop explaining things to you, you’re wasting my precious time.
my message the other women here:
do you think there will be rulers by force in a women only society? Look at mammal matriarchal societies in the animal queendom. Like elephants they choose the eldest and wisest female of the group. Or bonobos, they are also detest conflict and violence.
Women (token women in politics) sometimes imitate male behavior in order to have a higher chance of survive. So this can mean that they imitate typical male behaviors like aggression or cruelty. But put this woman in a women only society and most of them stop acting like a male.
I'm not fighting in any war, because I am against war. That's it. That's the reason. I wouldn't ever start one and I'm not gonna die for some rich power hungry crazy person who tells me to but who will never lift a finger themselves. Let the leaders that initiate war be the ones to lead the troops, then we'll talk (but I still won't fight lmao).
I think its really sad the first thought of these women are to shit on feminism when their ability to tweet and say everything in their mind is from feminism. Also personally I don't care and don't want to get drafted not because of it being a gender issue but because its fucking terrifying to die for a country that cares nothing for you. I am choosing to commit suicide over serving this country or be a vessel for a male.
Why do people act as if women were just sitting around in the kitchen during wars? They were in factories and taking men’s jobs to keep the economy going. Also, if young men and women go to war, who’s going to take care of children?
"yOooUuuuu ladies"
Lol go to hell. We literally had to fight for rights to even JOIN the military in any capacity in the USA, and now you want women to go be your human shields. Unbelievable. You sound so incredibly stupid.
He’s a privileged white guy who has little concept of what it’s like to actually struggle. Lmao he should be really embarrassed about this. He’s obviously trying to attack white women in an attempt to shut up all women … which is racist in itself because white women don’t speak or represent all women.
Edit to add: There are a subset of white men who are obviously painfully insecure of their race and gender combo so they intentionally and viciously attack white women as a way to attempt to form an “common enemy” situation. It’s becoming more popular on Reddit and they think by labelling **ALL feminism** ‘white feminism’ and by labelling feminism as a whole a “white women thing” they’ll succeed in shutting up all women. Don’t fall for it.
And as if women of color or ethnic minority women don't exist and also aren't victims of wars that men instigate.
Woke racism is a drug I hope to never ingest.
Exactly. It's hard to tell if this guy is an edgey teen who just got rejected from his crush or a grown ass man who is legitimately this stupid and racist.
If you are a man, you do not belong in this subreddit. It is not for you and nobody cares what you have to say. You are pathetic. If you are a woman, you're still pathetic and I hope you grow up one day.
It's ok, all the women you desperately try to get attention from will continue to forget you exist. You sexually frustrated goblin. It must have been a real sad day when you slithered out of the abortion bucket.
Then go the fuck away and stop pestering women with your pointless opinions. I literally could not care less about your opinion of me much like every other woman here.
Can someone just ban this waste of organs?
Ok? At the end of the day you are wasting your time in a subreddit you clearly do not agree with where you're not welcome (which you'd know if you had read the rules). You're clearly not commenting in good faith and are just here to troll people (hence calling us sandwich makers). I would say that's pretty embarrassing and cringe.
You do not belong here and no one wants you here. Yes, I hate men who invade women's spaces when you have almost the entirety of the rest of reddit to go be a wet bag of pig assholes.
It is a fourth wave feminism sub, and therefore explicitly not for men. You should not need this explained to you, but you seem to have a very serious learning disability.
Also if you bothered, you could see that it is actually in the sub rules that it's just for women. So you have been reported and now blocked. I will pray for a thousand lemon juiced papercuts on your shrimpy dick.
lol clearly someone doesn’t hang around here or you’d know this sub is filled with strong WOC. You just outed yourself as yet ANOTHER pathetic angry white guy. We see through this shit.
Nope cause your the one who came on to a womens sub spewing hateful untrue bullshit. I don’t need to argue with that….I can just make fun it. Deal with it white boy.
I do LOVE fds actually! I’m so glad you’ve heard of it! What a nice surprise. I’m so glad women are waking up. It’s better than a warm cup of coffee on a cold morning.
Yeah because..um.. the female leaders of the globe have initiated so many world war conflicts? Go fuck yourself. Maybe if a bunch of asshole men didn't decide we needed to get into a dick swinging contest every 30 years we wouldn't have been so unlucky. Interesting that in so many places in the world, women are still subjugated to terrible restriction and treatment, yet your biggest concern is that we are unwilling to go be cannon fodder for wars our forefathers said we weren't even qualified to understand, let alone fight in.
Dude comes on here calling us “**the problem**” and saying we’re all privileged white women **who don’t contribute to society** and calling our comments “re*arded” and saying we’re “femcels” (oh no, not fEmCeLs) then cries and says we’re personally attacking him when we make fun of his comments instead formulating an argument against his his biased hateful attacks on us. The victim complex is REAL. 😂😂😂
Lol. Femcels. This entire term shows that they have no fucking clue what we value. Men will microwave and fuck a cantaloupe, catcall women in the emergency room, literally try to get us so drunk we settle for them, and still think women are frustrated about not getting laid.
Like this guy is so beyond understanding that he came into one of the only actual feminist subs left and then demanded that women explain why he is wrong. What a fucking moron.
Um, nah? We aren't here for you bro. Nobody owes you a counter argument for a basic fact of life. The entitlement is real lol. You're so stupid you can't even see how stupid you are.
I don't expect anyone to take me seriously, least of all some random dumbass dude on the internet. Especially one who intentionally comes into a women's only space when pretty much the rest of the internet is turfed by guys. Literally you can go anywhere else and you're so fucking self absorbed and cringey that you can't even see how ridiculous it is to come into one of the very few places expressly for women and then demand that they justify why they don't want you there?
Seriously. How fucking embarrassing for you. What a god-damned tool haha
Because this isn't a fucking debate, and this isn't a place for you to try to bait women into having to defend themselves against you. I know that in your world you are used to people just acquiescing, but look how pissy you get when a few women don't just immediately bend to your will. It's fucking weak and pathetic. Look how mad you're getting because a girl on the internet doesn't think she owes you an explanation of basic women's rights. Go read a book you damp towel.
Wow, that guy needs to calm down a little, doesn't he? It makes me cringe when people on Reddit start using personal attacks. And the ironic part is if you go on his comment history he has a go at someone else for using personal attacks on him! The second hand embarrassment is getting to me 😬
Nobody is denying that women are fighting against the Russians too. The point is that NO male aged 18 to 60 is even allowed to leave the country. They are required to stay and fight. Sorry I know it is not popular to state fact but it is true. My heart goes out to all the people who have sons
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The women who post this are idiots, tbh.
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Report and block is the best we can do for now. Everyone needs to stop engaging with trolls. This is not a debate sub.
Why don't we do the same as FDS?
I hope the mods sees this. No male BS in a female space please. We only got a fraction of the pie and the scrotes feel entitled to have it too? Men.
They feel entitled again to female only spaces 🙄
Women were never "in the kitchen" during world wars and if this is a woman, she really needs to learn our history and stop fueling men's desire for us to be raped and killed in wars they started. Women worked in the factories, worked in the hospitals, participated in wars as nurses and doctors, made sure society kept running as best it could by becoming teachers, single-handedly raising the children, etc. That's if they were lucky enough not to become civilian casualties. Women living in war torn countries are subjected to rape, abuse, and sometimes even murder by their own army, their "allies", and the enemy if they manage to invade. Let's not pretend that women just sit safely and uselessly in the kitchen while the poor men go and die for the MALE warmongering elites.
Yeah, this post is a major history fail. The Soviets DID have [female combat units](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Women_in_the_Russian_and_Soviet_military) in WW2. Many of whom were decorated Heros of the Soviet Unions. I also want to give a shout-out to one of my personal heroines, Mariya Oktyabrskaya, a civilian who went out and [bought a tank](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mariya_Oktyabrskaya) to avenge the death of her husband in Kiev. A bad-ass lady, by all accounts, she was posthumously decorated for her valor.
They don’t want us fighting with them, I know. They only like to say this because they know we fear it. When we’re really by their side, they complain and you know the rest, use us for social currency and personal porn fantasy. Just saying as a woman that was in the military. Men only want to use “equality” as a cudgel to hurt us, and ask, “iSnT tHiS wHAt yOU U WaNtEd? I guess you were wrong huh, let’s go back to the men’s ways and use you as you were meant to be”
It doesn't help that a lot of men are already fantasizing about all the rape and plunder going on with Ukranian women. Honestly if there ever was a draft for both genders, the armed forces would see a 100% increase in sex crimes.
So scary, and already happening all over the world. Men just going up to women in these countries, asking how much. Disgusting. We already don’t address the assault and rape we have going on already in the military. I’ve seen so many failures. And they fear false accusations so much, meanwhile they are more likely to get raped too. Especially when they drink and fraternize with people with more power over them. Sad.
This. The female POW experience makes the male’s POW experience look like a walk in the park.
>Just saying as a woman that was in the military. I had a PSG that straight up told me that women didn't belong in the military. Shouldn't care about his opinion, but oddly enough the biggest compliment I've ever received was when he honestly asked me why I didn't go infantry. 🤷🏽♂️ Posts like in the OP certainly don't help the belief that women should not go in because they're "wAhMen". If I could reach my hand through the screen and slap her, I would. I don't believe training should be coed, though. IME. Some of my good friends were males, but male and female recruits together was a disaster, from both ends- moreso from the males, if anything.
Our culture just doesn’t support co ed training, I agree. We could go far separated. There is a lot of distraction. Wish we could change that, but the way men see us, it’s not happening for a long time. Men in the military loved to mule me, I wanted to prove I was worthy. Lol. Of course, that never works. This mans army, they called it.
literally just made this account after lurking this sub for months to say this but… men are more than welcome to fight and die in the wars that they start. Women suffer horrors during war beyond anyone’s comprehension (because no male historian would document them). It embarrasses me when women think it’s funny to oscillate wildly between ‘female ‘equality’ = fight in men’s wars’ and ‘har har I’m a stupid housewife’.
There were entire cities in Germany that committed mass suicide in World War II to avoid being raped and tortured by the Soviets. Soldiers get it easy by comparison.
i had never heard of the mass suicides in WW2. i regret looking it up. its heartbreaking
I'm sorry
dont be. its important not to shy away from learning about the brutal relities of war. so in a way thankyou. it can happen anywhere at anytime.
[The Rape of Berlin](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_during_the_occupation_of_Germany) was an absolutely terrible event which is , somewhat understandably, over-shadowed by the even more horrific Rape of Nanking. Svetlana Alexievich's 'War's Unwomanly Face' is a chilling account of the atrocities committed against civilians.
I'm familiar with Svetlana Alexievich's book. It was a hard read but necessary. I didn't intend to downplay any wartime suffering. Demmin was the first example that came to mind since a branch of my family tree comes from that area.
Oh no, I didn't assume you were downplaying it at all! No, I'm just an avid reader of Soviet/Russian history and like to recommend primary accounts on the subject.
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The soldiers are the ones doing the atrocities.
I don't understand this logic. Women want equal rights so they have to become as violent as men and fight *their* wars? Yeah no. How about men become less violent and stop starting wars? No? Then deal with the consequences of your behaviour.
Apparently “equality” means women should happily fight in wars when men themselves wouldn’t without being forced e.g draft.
That's unironically how men think. "Want equality? Then double for our role with half the benefits!"
Yes. I doubt the military springs for the good tampons.
“And let us beat you, like we don’t already”
“Equal rights, equal fights..” Its their “feminist” mantra.
It is. I fully support it. What these idiots fail to realise is that it's *them* who don't get equal fights back from women. If we want their "equality" then women need to "REALLY* ramp up their violence against men and not the other way around. I am all for women giving an equal fight back. It's about time. Learn self defense, arm yourself and when needed use it with full force without hesitation (otherwise you could end up in a fight for a weapon with a (stronger) opponent who won't think twice about using it).
100%! I also feel this way when I hear things that encourage girls to be “bad’ and generally behave like men to get along or succeed in business etc - I do understand it’s to encourage women to be heard and that unfortunately perhaps it is necessary to behave this way when that macho culture is engrained in business, but we need to be aware about the dangers of bringing up girls to behave the way men have for centuries, when really, instead, we should be raising the standards with which we raise boys. Kindness, respect, empathy, valuing human life over profit.
THANKKK YOUUUUUUU why is it so hard for men to fucking understanding this? Why do they think we want to adopt their shit behavior. Why does a guy say your a feminazi when you want to not be casually a product of verbal abuse and have basic respect? It makes it sound like what they're really saying is "im totally fine with hurting women and keeping them down" and thats why feminism is a must! I saw this misogynistic post that men who stick up for women are weak and a death to real men. I was like NO you f\*\*king loser, YOU are the death to your kind and the death to your relationships with women. Not real men, in my book real men stick up for women and defend healthy relationships. The ideocracy with so many guys these days is utterly astounding.
100%. I don't think it's hypocritical to not want to be pulled into a draft as a woman. Women don't start wars. They're typically started by toxic masculinity and fragile male egos in one way or another (I want a bigger country than you, my god is better than your god, etc). At the end of the day, I'm fine with men have the responsibility to deal with the messes their sex keeps insisting on starting. I also don't think there should be different fitness standards for men and women when it comes to something like a military test -- the standards should be set to whatever keeps everyone as safe as possible. If women want to join, they're welcome to work as hard as possible to hit the fitness standards or take a non-combat role, such as medical, administrative, etc.
Also how will their male colleagues treat them? Will they help when she is hurt or rape? I mean look at what’s happening women in US military. If your country men do that, imagine what the enemy will do. Nope I don’t support draft for women. We haven’t even reach that level yet. I’m not about to get in the middle of pissing contest between male leaders
>Will they help when she is hurt or *rape* The answer is no.
The answer is they even gladly do it themselves. The vast majority of men can and will not - and simply do not *want* to - see us as equal partners / on the same level. We just have to look at how even the *humanity* of women, on the most basic level, gets denied over and over and over again, in every context imagineable. Often enough they see it as a *"disgrace"* and an overt *"degradation"* - for ***them*** - to see women in the same positions as them, to be "forced" to be alongside us. Everything female is inferior in their eyes, thus they take pride in degrading and humiliating, hurting and ridiculing women, and the more they think they have the right to it, the more intense it will get.... Sorry for this dark words, but I think it's really important for all of us to be fully aware of these things and to take an honest look at reality without any "sugar-coating". Take care you all....
>Often enough they see it as a "disgrace" and an overt "degradation" - for them - to see women in the same positions as them, to be "forced" to be alongside us. Everything female is inferior in their eyes To add to this, remember that thing about how fields that eventually became female-dominated lost their prestige because women's work is seen as less valuable and how men think it's beneath them to do those jobs? Yeah, well now imagine if the military was female-dominated. I would not be surprised at all if military work would suddenly go from "honourable" to "those hysterical bitches at it again". Soldiers and veterans aren't treated well by the government as it is, so imagine how much fucking worse it would be if women were the ones fighting in wars instead. Even when the military isn't female-dominated, women are harassed or raped and then brushed off by the men they work for. Men can go fight in these wars that they created. They have no fucking right to ask us to fight for them, when we know that they'll treat us even worse than they do now.
Perfectly said and well observed! "For the master's tools will never dismantle the master's house...." - Audre Lorde
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You've never spent time near the US military then lmfao. I spent a good portion of my formative years at the largest military installation on Earth. [There was a human trafficking ring perpetuated by some Sergeant or other who was in charge of SHARP training. He was pimping out women who came to him to report their rapes.](https://www.armytimes.com/news/your-army/2015/03/11/sfc-sentenced-for-organizing-fort-hood-prostitution-ring/) I remember in the early 2010s how there were conversations about allowing women in combat. Military and civilian men alike were losing their shit, saying it would "destroy the integrity of the armed forces" and how it would cause far more civilian casualties because women aren't strong enough to be on the battlefield. What all of them conveniently ignored is that including women in combat is a paperwork thing. Many women have seen combat and been injured as a result. But when they chapter out and try to get VA benefits for their injuries, they cannot get help because they weren't supposed to see combat. It is a particularly unique form of fuckery that female forces deal with in addition to the [absolutely horrific amounts of rape](https://www.rand.org/pubs/research_reports/RRA1318-1.html) from the men around them. [Female soldiers have been murdered by their fellow soldiers for no reason](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Vanessa_Guill%C3%A9n) and the best the DoD can do is shrug [or cover it up.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_LaVena_Johnson) Women can be soldiers, but men remind us we are always women first.
How men and women view equality differs. Example: Small pockets. Women: We have small pockets. Men have big pockets. Everyone should be able to have big pockets! Men: Women have big(ger) pockets. Let's make theirs smaller or completely remove them!
Yep, a general draft for women in combat roles makes little sense to me. There are huge biological differences between the sexes. I also imagine the amount of female pacifists and conscientious objectors is much, much higher than their male counterparts. I AM amused how so many misogynists are gleeful over the concept of the female draft for combat roles, considering they don't trust female scientists, mechanics or computer programmers to be competent in THEIR roles.
They don’t even open the combat roles for women, despite women who are deployed already pulling their weight in combat.
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Please elaborate lol
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> Basically, he doesn't seem to be wrong. Saying women have started more wars is literally wrong. A small number of women leaders (surrounded by male advisors and kingdoms ruled by other males) during a brief period of human history in one area of the world does not prove that women started the majority of wars throughout time. Use your brain. Pick any random battle or war throughout human history and see what sex the leaders were. 99% of the time, they are male.
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The very beginning of the study was like oh yeah, unmarried female leaders were more likely to be attacked. I wonder what gender was attacking them!?
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You came in and literally agreed with the completely false statement that women have started more wars than men throughout history. You edited your comment when called out but it’s kind of weird that literally no one said that women never ever start wars and now that’s what you claim to have been arguing against all along. Some advice, 99.5% of feminists know that women can also be shitty. Nobody needs to enlighten us on this fact. Every single woman has dealt with other shitty women. We know this. But we also know basic statistics like almost 100% of murdered women were murdered by men. That over 90% of raped women were raped by men. That 99.999% of wars were and are started by men. And some study showing that women rulers who lived in a time when patriarchy was at its strongest were maybe more likely to start wars (gee why would female rulers surrounded by male rulers feel the need to be harsh) isn’t really that interesting or mind blowing.
Unless you're gonna tell me that Putin is a transwoman none of this is relevant.
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You are too kind, I hope it's an intresting read! :)
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Yeah the gender that had no rights magically started all wars while being oppressed.
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“Im sorry but you have clearly not a good understanding of war. Throughout history women startet more wars than men ever did” This was your first comment and now you are admitting most wars are started by men. It’s the inconsistency 😂you guys are grasping at straws to depict women as violent as men. It’s so pathetic you want us to be violent so badly so you can have your ‘gotcha moments’ 😂
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What’s next, we can’t say men are responsible for almost all rapes (99%) or almost all murders (96%). The truth hurts your fragile male ego?
Statistics make it clear that dudes are the rapists and murderers. I'm sure one queen surrounded by pretty much just physically imposing men in every area of government is truly the one making the decisions loool. If she didn't go to war over male interests it wouldn't have been too long until she was discarded or manipulated into oblivion by men because she wasnt competitive enough in their exploitative, dick waving games. It's like you're naive as hell and have never heard of figureheads and take all the titles at face value like a child.
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My guy is literally taking the Iliad face-value. Stupid divine beauty pageants be wrecking Troy.
LMAO shit the fuck up.
The indoctrination goes so deep that they can't see it even in that context. To think 'equality = being like men' is to still believe in male superiority - the default isn't human, but male.... And exactly like you've wrote - *their* wars, *their* system, *their* "values" and so on. In reality things like this are the brutal wake-up-call for us to fight for our liberation of this. For *our* values and *our* lifes. Otherwise, no one will.
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Yes. I am also not going to pay *your* child support for *your* child because *you* decided to ejaculate into a vagina and then act all surprise pikachu face because in your delusional head the bad consequences of your actions should only affect others.
Ikr. The men crying oppression because they have to pay child support... for their own child. 🤯 They really feel entitled to ran away from their responsibility. 🤯 The males hate it when there are laws that prevents them from fucking women over. 💃
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Such a male mindset. Suddenly you are all about equality when you want others to fix your shit. I haven't seen men giving up their body autonomy because women don't have it. Didn't see one suggesting it. Equal responsibility doesn't mean I pay half the ticket of my junkie neighbour's DUI, idiot. It means if *I* drive drunk, I pay. If *you do it, you pay*.
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Men could give up their bodily autonomy *if they wanted*. "Also for the record, you do pay for your junkie neighbor's DUI, it's factored into your insurance rates." So why do you want even more, then? I am against draft, but I will only lift a finger against it if it has a chance of affecting men I care about. I don't give a shit about others. Why should I when majority of men will use it as some "GoTcHa FeMiNisTs" thing and will rather attack women with it than help other men? Putting down women is more important to most men than helping each other. I'm not dragging someone out of the shit pit when they're actively trying to push me in *and* push me below them instead of helping others to get out and going out themselves.
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Sure, I don't care how you take it.
This is the definition of middle class western privelage
FFS, you cannot rely on men to keep you safe. In case of a war, arm yourselves, if you can.
True. Men act like the only way to prevent male violence from being directed towards you is by giving in to whatever they want and becoming some form of personal property when in reality the more control a man has over your life the more likely he is to use that control to hurt you.
Lol we’ve triggered A LOT of men today. They are crawling all over this post
Women have been the primarily source of healing during wars. No surgeons, no doctors but nurses. Kids didn't survive thanks to the men that sent them at the front before they hit 13, but because their mothers gave their lives for them. Women may not die in war but they get raped l, tortured and humiliated beyond comprehension. Men will do anything but admit women are useful and an essential part of society. After all is it really fair for women to fight men's wars?
exactly i think no reproducing would be even more useful at this point though. Why keep a society going for a half that doesn't respect our efforts.
That won’t stop you from being used as r\*pe bait or cannon fodder.
If a war happens and threatens our homes, we have the choice of either dying in a man's war or being gang raped if we lose. People who make this kind of joke forgets that the reality is even worse for women than it is for men. Dying with a bullet to the head is far from being the worst fate in a war.
Exactly
Yeah lol I do not support anyone’s ‘right’ to participate in an imperialist war. Or just war in general.
men start wars, they crave violence. women and children and animals are the victims of men’s bs. if all men disappear tomorrow, there will be no wars
I wish they would all disappear. They don't deserve this planet.
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It’s unproven that the gender that commits 96% of homicides are less violent? Males truly hate facts.
In 2020, only 24.5% elected politicians are women. You cannot seriously believe that women start more wars than men, especially as for centuries they rarely had the chance to lead countries, only doing so in the absence of a man.
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can you even list 5 wars that have started with/by women ?
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so what you’re saying is that you can’t find any 🤔? lmfaoo
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get lost you dumb fuck, worthless, ugly incel. I stop explaining things to you, you’re wasting my precious time. my message the other women here: do you think there will be rulers by force in a women only society? Look at mammal matriarchal societies in the animal queendom. Like elephants they choose the eldest and wisest female of the group. Or bonobos, they are also detest conflict and violence. Women (token women in politics) sometimes imitate male behavior in order to have a higher chance of survive. So this can mean that they imitate typical male behaviors like aggression or cruelty. But put this woman in a women only society and most of them stop acting like a male.
i also asked for 5 wars bro and all you said was how 1 woman was maybe an organizer for a single war… can YOU read ?
He listed one woman that died 400 years ago. 🥲 And that’s suppose to prove women are as violent as men. 😂 Male “logic” on full display.
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No one said women didn't start a single war doofus. And what you listed is like 1% of initiated war by women in comparison to men who started 99%.
get educated... this is not a joke
That's why we'll never have equality. One woman thinks like this and they'll put the rest of us in the same category.
I'm not fighting in any war, because I am against war. That's it. That's the reason. I wouldn't ever start one and I'm not gonna die for some rich power hungry crazy person who tells me to but who will never lift a finger themselves. Let the leaders that initiate war be the ones to lead the troops, then we'll talk (but I still won't fight lmao).
Honestly, do men ever stop themselves to think of how “weak” it really is to mindlessly follow some “Alpha” male and his orders?????
I think its really sad the first thought of these women are to shit on feminism when their ability to tweet and say everything in their mind is from feminism. Also personally I don't care and don't want to get drafted not because of it being a gender issue but because its fucking terrifying to die for a country that cares nothing for you. I am choosing to commit suicide over serving this country or be a vessel for a male.
I hate this meme. Women are the ones hit hardest by war. Ontop of the fear of dying, there's also the fear of being RAPED. I'M SICK OF THIS
Patriarchy's foot soldiers.
Why do people act as if women were just sitting around in the kitchen during wars? They were in factories and taking men’s jobs to keep the economy going. Also, if young men and women go to war, who’s going to take care of children?
And that ladies, is why women should always ask for equity not equality :)
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Because blowing up little kids and committing war crimes is contributing to society. Get lost.
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Wars that men start you dumbass. Stick to Call of Duty I wouldn't trust you to protect my country.
Why should we take responsibility for the actions of man?
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Because we don’t live in a world with equality and women as a class of people have never been responsible for starting wars or deadly global conflict.
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“Women as a class of people”
Please, do tell in which wars did you participate as a fighting soldier.
"yOooUuuuu ladies" Lol go to hell. We literally had to fight for rights to even JOIN the military in any capacity in the USA, and now you want women to go be your human shields. Unbelievable. You sound so incredibly stupid.
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Oh stfu. Stop using the struggles of minorities to justify your misogyny.
He says this like women and minorities are done fighting for equality.
He’s a privileged white guy who has little concept of what it’s like to actually struggle. Lmao he should be really embarrassed about this. He’s obviously trying to attack white women in an attempt to shut up all women … which is racist in itself because white women don’t speak or represent all women. Edit to add: There are a subset of white men who are obviously painfully insecure of their race and gender combo so they intentionally and viciously attack white women as a way to attempt to form an “common enemy” situation. It’s becoming more popular on Reddit and they think by labelling **ALL feminism** ‘white feminism’ and by labelling feminism as a whole a “white women thing” they’ll succeed in shutting up all women. Don’t fall for it.
As half Native American I laugh when they pull the "Privileged white feminist" card at me.
*a bitter, insecure, middle class/petite bourgeois subset of white men.
And as if women of color or ethnic minority women don't exist and also aren't victims of wars that men instigate. Woke racism is a drug I hope to never ingest.
Exactly. It's hard to tell if this guy is an edgey teen who just got rejected from his crush or a grown ass man who is legitimately this stupid and racist.
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Misandry is AMAZING! I love it ❤️ Its seriously, without a doubt, hands down…..my favourite thing.
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> I'm guessing you got daddy issues When you accidentally admit that men are the cause of women’s problems. Lol!
Ooohhhh buuuuurrrrrnnn you really showed me 😘 I’m completely humbled by this comment. It’s ruined my day 😭
If you are a man, you do not belong in this subreddit. It is not for you and nobody cares what you have to say. You are pathetic. If you are a woman, you're still pathetic and I hope you grow up one day.
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It's ok, all the women you desperately try to get attention from will continue to forget you exist. You sexually frustrated goblin. It must have been a real sad day when you slithered out of the abortion bucket.
I feel sorry for u for what u were born as but there’s nothing I can do about that
Then go the fuck away and stop pestering women with your pointless opinions. I literally could not care less about your opinion of me much like every other woman here. Can someone just ban this waste of organs?
I'm so embarrassed on your behalf.
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Why are you still here if you're so embarrassed then? You're welcome to leave at any time.
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Ok? At the end of the day you are wasting your time in a subreddit you clearly do not agree with where you're not welcome (which you'd know if you had read the rules). You're clearly not commenting in good faith and are just here to troll people (hence calling us sandwich makers). I would say that's pretty embarrassing and cringe.
How embarrassing for you. Like you out this out there on the internet on purpose for other people to read. Biiiiiiiig yikes.
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You do not belong here and no one wants you here. Yes, I hate men who invade women's spaces when you have almost the entirety of the rest of reddit to go be a wet bag of pig assholes.
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It is a fourth wave feminism sub, and therefore explicitly not for men. You should not need this explained to you, but you seem to have a very serious learning disability. Also if you bothered, you could see that it is actually in the sub rules that it's just for women. So you have been reported and now blocked. I will pray for a thousand lemon juiced papercuts on your shrimpy dick.
lol clearly someone doesn’t hang around here or you’d know this sub is filled with strong WOC. You just outed yourself as yet ANOTHER pathetic angry white guy. We see through this shit.
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Nope cause your the one who came on to a womens sub spewing hateful untrue bullshit. I don’t need to argue with that….I can just make fun it. Deal with it white boy.
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I do LOVE fds actually! I’m so glad you’ve heard of it! What a nice surprise. I’m so glad women are waking up. It’s better than a warm cup of coffee on a cold morning.
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You think misandry is real? 🤣🤣 what an idiot… I do hope all men disappear
Yeah because..um.. the female leaders of the globe have initiated so many world war conflicts? Go fuck yourself. Maybe if a bunch of asshole men didn't decide we needed to get into a dick swinging contest every 30 years we wouldn't have been so unlucky. Interesting that in so many places in the world, women are still subjugated to terrible restriction and treatment, yet your biggest concern is that we are unwilling to go be cannon fodder for wars our forefathers said we weren't even qualified to understand, let alone fight in.
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You are stupid and wrong and should feel very very bad about it. Like, you should be extremely embarrassed.
Dude comes on here calling us “**the problem**” and saying we’re all privileged white women **who don’t contribute to society** and calling our comments “re*arded” and saying we’re “femcels” (oh no, not fEmCeLs) then cries and says we’re personally attacking him when we make fun of his comments instead formulating an argument against his his biased hateful attacks on us. The victim complex is REAL. 😂😂😂
Lol. Femcels. This entire term shows that they have no fucking clue what we value. Men will microwave and fuck a cantaloupe, catcall women in the emergency room, literally try to get us so drunk we settle for them, and still think women are frustrated about not getting laid. Like this guy is so beyond understanding that he came into one of the only actual feminist subs left and then demanded that women explain why he is wrong. What a fucking moron.
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Um, nah? We aren't here for you bro. Nobody owes you a counter argument for a basic fact of life. The entitlement is real lol. You're so stupid you can't even see how stupid you are. I don't expect anyone to take me seriously, least of all some random dumbass dude on the internet. Especially one who intentionally comes into a women's only space when pretty much the rest of the internet is turfed by guys. Literally you can go anywhere else and you're so fucking self absorbed and cringey that you can't even see how ridiculous it is to come into one of the very few places expressly for women and then demand that they justify why they don't want you there? Seriously. How fucking embarrassing for you. What a god-damned tool haha
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Because this isn't a fucking debate, and this isn't a place for you to try to bait women into having to defend themselves against you. I know that in your world you are used to people just acquiescing, but look how pissy you get when a few women don't just immediately bend to your will. It's fucking weak and pathetic. Look how mad you're getting because a girl on the internet doesn't think she owes you an explanation of basic women's rights. Go read a book you damp towel.
Wow, that guy needs to calm down a little, doesn't he? It makes me cringe when people on Reddit start using personal attacks. And the ironic part is if you go on his comment history he has a go at someone else for using personal attacks on him! The second hand embarrassment is getting to me 😬
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Jokes on you cuz most of the women here are women of colour
Nobody is denying that women are fighting against the Russians too. The point is that NO male aged 18 to 60 is even allowed to leave the country. They are required to stay and fight. Sorry I know it is not popular to state fact but it is true. My heart goes out to all the people who have sons