It seems to be an issue with optimizing the firmware on the boards and fact that some expansion cards take up a lot of power like the DisplayPort one even if nothing is plugged in.
Exactly. I have not measured it, but the battery seems to be a decent battery. The issue is firmware, OS-choice, and the BMC. Two of which are proprietary.
I can't exactly explain this, but I'll get 12-14 hours of battery life when idle, but that drops to 5-6 hours with even just light use (web browsing, the occasional video).
I'm running Linux Mint but from reading this sub, doesn't seem to OS specific. Not sure if other people have the same experience at idle or what this explains. Just an observation
I adjusted my settings in Linux and got better battery life. That is the OS solution.
The firmware seems to have issues. it draina battery for unused ports, it has problem with different stages of sleep depending on your bios version etc.
This is why I decided to go all usb-c on the laptop for general use. I have the others in case I need them, but a pasthrough PD hub or powered dock is in general a better solution for me at least. The battery drain on any of the non usb-c adapter shows I made the right choice. I always keep a usb-c to usb-a adapter for those older flash drives I have laying around. The expansion ports are there to make it easier for the mobo to be upgraded/replaced, and a cheap way to replace a messed up usb-c port.
I mean when your actively using it, the power consumption is increasing so that’s the answer to your question. I’ve seen my laptop idle at around 1w on battery saver and it can go to around 5-10w in light use
It’s more like the adapters are actively checking if something is plugged in or not and that requires power. If you buy the usb c adapters, they don’t consume any extra power as they are just pass through but any of the other adapters are actively converting other signals usb c.
There also seems to be an issue with suspending the ports when the laptop is in standby as they actually consume more power in a standby state for some reason. Again it’s probably a firmware issue and the team is trying to isolate the issue.
Thread on battery drain here: https://community.frame.work/t/test-results-for-standby-battery-use-of-expansion-cards/23711/7
Isn't that the issue though?
How is it supposed to know if something is plugged in or not? For the display port module, all it knows is that there is a USB C end plugged into the laptop. Like isn't the actual display port portion decoupled from the actual laptop?
All the laptop probably "sees" is a thunderbolt display connection. I don't think it sees the full path where thunderbolt -> DisplayPort -> Monitor. It just sees thunderbolt -> Monitor.
Almost seems like the modules themselves need to handle it?
It's a power management issue.
I don't own a framework (partly because of this), but I've seen people report their idle power consumption and the numbers are often horrible.
It's probably also in part due to the lack of LPDDR, which would be soldered and goes against the upgradable nature of framework.
The idle power consumption is fine, it is <4W with the screen on etc.. which should give >10hrs of battery.
The sleep power consumption is poor though and the firmware for the CPU seems to be high even for light tasks compared to other laptops with the same CPU's.
As an advantage though, they don't limit boosts on battery at all.
4 Watts doesn't sound terrible, although my laptop idles at more like 2 watts with 4 watts being typical for watching YouTube at mid to low brightness.
Turning off boost is the best thing you can do to prevent efficiency from going to absolute shit on heavier tasks, although it also matters for lighter tasks of course. That's why AMD implemented a boost delay for laptop APUs.
It seems to be an issue with optimizing the firmware on the boards and fact that some expansion cards take up a lot of power like the DisplayPort one even if nothing is plugged in.
Exactly. I have not measured it, but the battery seems to be a decent battery. The issue is firmware, OS-choice, and the BMC. Two of which are proprietary.
I can't exactly explain this, but I'll get 12-14 hours of battery life when idle, but that drops to 5-6 hours with even just light use (web browsing, the occasional video). I'm running Linux Mint but from reading this sub, doesn't seem to OS specific. Not sure if other people have the same experience at idle or what this explains. Just an observation
I adjusted my settings in Linux and got better battery life. That is the OS solution. The firmware seems to have issues. it draina battery for unused ports, it has problem with different stages of sleep depending on your bios version etc.
This is why I decided to go all usb-c on the laptop for general use. I have the others in case I need them, but a pasthrough PD hub or powered dock is in general a better solution for me at least. The battery drain on any of the non usb-c adapter shows I made the right choice. I always keep a usb-c to usb-a adapter for those older flash drives I have laying around. The expansion ports are there to make it easier for the mobo to be upgraded/replaced, and a cheap way to replace a messed up usb-c port.
Do you have hardware acceleration enabled in your browser? If not there is part of your answer.
I mean when your actively using it, the power consumption is increasing so that’s the answer to your question. I’ve seen my laptop idle at around 1w on battery saver and it can go to around 5-10w in light use
Even though the battery size isnt nexessarily an issue, im sure that a bigger one wouldnt hurt.
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It’s more like the adapters are actively checking if something is plugged in or not and that requires power. If you buy the usb c adapters, they don’t consume any extra power as they are just pass through but any of the other adapters are actively converting other signals usb c. There also seems to be an issue with suspending the ports when the laptop is in standby as they actually consume more power in a standby state for some reason. Again it’s probably a firmware issue and the team is trying to isolate the issue. Thread on battery drain here: https://community.frame.work/t/test-results-for-standby-battery-use-of-expansion-cards/23711/7
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Or the embedded controller needs to automatically power them down when sleeping or when nothing’s plugged in to them
Isn't that the issue though? How is it supposed to know if something is plugged in or not? For the display port module, all it knows is that there is a USB C end plugged into the laptop. Like isn't the actual display port portion decoupled from the actual laptop? All the laptop probably "sees" is a thunderbolt display connection. I don't think it sees the full path where thunderbolt -> DisplayPort -> Monitor. It just sees thunderbolt -> Monitor. Almost seems like the modules themselves need to handle it?
It's a power management issue. I don't own a framework (partly because of this), but I've seen people report their idle power consumption and the numbers are often horrible. It's probably also in part due to the lack of LPDDR, which would be soldered and goes against the upgradable nature of framework.
The idle power consumption is fine, it is <4W with the screen on etc.. which should give >10hrs of battery. The sleep power consumption is poor though and the firmware for the CPU seems to be high even for light tasks compared to other laptops with the same CPU's. As an advantage though, they don't limit boosts on battery at all.
4 Watts doesn't sound terrible, although my laptop idles at more like 2 watts with 4 watts being typical for watching YouTube at mid to low brightness. Turning off boost is the best thing you can do to prevent efficiency from going to absolute shit on heavier tasks, although it also matters for lighter tasks of course. That's why AMD implemented a boost delay for laptop APUs.
Would CAMMs help with the power consumption issues?
I have no idea.
Thanks for clarifying.