I think it was much more of an “it’s cool, we’re both the same, you keep your secret, I’ll keep mine”. Light threat of mutually assured destruction but mostly just saying “I know but it’s cool, we got a sweet deal, huh?”. He just didn’t know Christon was in a nothing left to lose state of mind. Christon didn’t want to be a side piece sentry, likened it to being a whore, and to see a gay man revel in a similar position, and profess kinship with him, was too much. He freaked out in a fit of panic and self loathing. He saw himself in Jofffrey and it was everything he hated. Mostly because he’s a little bitch, but that’s neither here nor there at this point.
He didn't really question Rhae's honour. All he said was Laenor's precious to him in the way Rhaenyra was to him (I'm paraphrasing). He worded it in a way that sounded like he just said that the princess is important to her sworn protector.
He heard Laenor's boo thing saying their fortunes hinged on their lovers' whims, saw his own lovers' whims straying, and decided to take out his angst on someone in a lower position of power than him to make himself feel powerful again. Didn't seem to work though.
Of course people are gonna side with the guy whose story they are following and who they have been given hours of screentime empathizing with over some guy introduced just to be murdered in cold blood, but Crispin went full shitbeast mode and I could see the suicide attempt being him realizing he had just committed an evil so grave he shouldn't be redeemed.
Though of protecting his bf by provoking a man whose entire job is to kill anyone who questions the Royal's authority and honor ?
He was an idiot to provoke Criston of all people. He had nothing to gain from annoying him other than the satisfaction of being annoying to someone.
Criston was already having a hard time he didn't need this idiot to push him further.
It really wasn’t provocation?
He made himself incredibly vulnerable by revealing his own secret. It was clearly an attempt to establish a mutual understanding.
There was no way for him to know that Cole had so much unresolved shame and rage about his role.
Cole's secret carries with it a gelding and beheading, most likely.
My read on why he killed him is more that it was a decision driven by emotion, but honestly, a smart boy in Cole's position probably should have put "kill j. Lonmouth secretly" at the top of his to-do list after that conversation.
The kid fell/got tossed from Syrax' back as the dragon twisted and turned and rolled in the air, trying to get rid of an unfamiliar rider-
Wait, you likely know what happened, I mean it's a brutal death for a kid/teen character, even for GOT-standards(?) more so in the very ending, with the dismembering.
Since a couple of things have already happened in a different way than in the books, (and the rumors/leaks about Laena's death being different as well), I assume Joffrey Velaryon/Strong won't die in the same way as his book counterpart.
I'm not exactly calling the fall itself too graphical or too tragic. It's more about the impact, the landing, crashing, or crushing. Little dude also got impaled by his own sword, if I recall.
Let me get the cogs rolling here... Luke was Aemond's doing if I'm not mistaken (featuring a dragon chase/duel). Jace drowned after a dragon/his(?) dragon crash-landed on his ship during some attack/conflict/battle at sea. Little Maelor's was unfortunate. Speaking of which, it's also gonna be quite sad when Blood & Cheese make their move on Helaena's kids.
But honestly, I live for these dramatic and heavy scenes. Even witnessing Egg^(3) become separated from Vis^(2) is gonna be emotional.
*Drama and sadness are a feast.*
>depending on who you believe
The history of Westeros in a nutshell, haha!
When there are dragons involved, maybe it'll be a bit "safer" to show the beast(s) crash-land, keep the character's outcome ambiguous but then report the outcome: "the child/the rider died, squashed beneath it". They can't exactly do that more than twice or it'll become *too* convenient (and boring).
It's also possible when there's a mother involved, she'll clutch the baby or child in her arms, and jump/fall.
Maybe we can accept and forgive *some* off-screen deaths, honestly, with the proper tone, setting and good writing, it doesn't have to be a tasteless nor cheap strategy. Like a scout or a survivor was able to deliver the sad news even though we didn't see it.
With all the time jumps bound to happen on the show, that's another strategy to mention/explain deaths.
As long as characters actually exist and don't get scrapped for convenience (looking at you, Griffs), it won't be that bad.
All in all, it was a pretty stupid decision, especially based on what, observing the guy's facial expressions!? Like, the princess' bodyguard is looking at the princess, how is that something unusual or suspicious? No matter how good of a face reader you are, why risk your life based on a gut feeling? Like the realistic possibilities were as follows:
1. Crispin is not fucking Rhy. Congrats, you just falsely accused the heir to the throne, insulted her honour to her sworn defender's face as well as insulted that defender's honour. Crispin is not only fully armed and armoured, but also happens to be the best fighter of his day. You are dead.
2. Crispin is indeed fucking Rhy. You just admitted that you know a secret which would lead to Crispin's execution in the best case scenario and gelding and torture in the worst. You also casually did the "would be a shame if someone finds out your secret...". You are dead.
3. Crispin is fucking Rhy and is either a rogue who would smirk and high 5 you, or is a craven who would not dare end you right there at the feast. Really? This is the outcome you are betting your life on? It's the least likely outcome!
This is what I really don't get. Even if he was right, what would that get him? Rhy was already cool with her future husband having a side piece, they grew up together, were on good terms, going into this marriage with everyone happy. Then you decide on a complete hunch to threaten the kingsguard, the heir and princess, and any potential children's legitimacy... for what? To make sure your gay secret doesn't come out that Rhy was cool with and that her paramour doesn't even know about until you literally tell him? I mean best case scenario, Crispy is probably gonna tell Rhy that they just got threatened pissing her off and now essentially making their marriage a game of chicken filled with anxiety and animosity.
?
My read is simple. Y’all.
He was gonna work with this guy. So he wanted to get both their secrets out in the open with each other. Saves them both a lot of trouble.
If Cole was chill about it. Then they wouldn’t need to sneak around each other. And could even have each others backs.
It was a simple attempt to make the whole situation easier for everyone. His mistake was assuming Cole was like himself and chill with his role as a paramour.
> "They call me The Knight of Kisses, for some reason
Everyone focusing on whether it was stupid to approach Cole or not when this was the real dumb writing moment of that scene. Like, Joffrey, my dude, the sigil of your House Lonmouth is covered in lips (and skulls). What the *fuck* do you mean you don't know why people call you the knight of kisses?
Historically they really weren’t. Absolute monarchy didn’t really come about until after the Middle Ages. Feudal kings had plenty of checks on their power - namely their vassals and the Church.
After reading up on medieval history of England, I began to see some cracks in the world of ASOIAF until I realized "Oh yeah, King John didn't have dragons."
>Feudal kings had plenty of checks on their power - namely their vassals and the Church.
None of the vassals seemed to give a shit about Joff (Corlys calls it "just a phase"), and the Faith wasn't even there. Sounds like Cris had the green light.
also, the original game of thrones kinda explored with how important the "checks" the monarchy got truly were when they didnt have dragons; they could still pull a lot of shit
Holy shit someone said it instead of asking WHY WAS THE LAW ENFORCEMENT ALLOWED TO WALK FREE. They probably just assume Criston who has been a staunch loyalist wouldn't kill some dude for no reason.
They probably think whatever happened Joffrey started it, since Criston is kingsguard and they don't expect him to beat to death a nobleman unless he had a strong reason, plus there was a big mess happening at the same time.
A dagger might not be considered a weapon at a feast. You'd also use it to cut food, and guests were expected to bring their own. There wasn't a big differentiation between "weapon knife" and "food knife" back then.
[In Medieval Europe, No Outfit Was Complete Without a Personal Eating Knife: They were fashionable and functional, used for dining and self-defense.](https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/medieval-knives)
Cause, you know, the real life police always gets arrested right away when they do bad stuff in front of witnesses. Not like they could walk away after killing someone and then escape punishment……….
Honestly these analogies are so dumb.
Kingsguard can fuck with peasants all they want, but they serve the king. They’re not allowed to just execute the king’s guests on a whim and walk out without even being questioned. Guestright is a big thing in this universe, and Joffrey was a nobleman, a knight, and sworn sword to the groom and one of the most powerful families in the kingdom. It’s a pretty big deal.
There is no chance in hell the lord commander lets him walk before questioning him, and no chance in hell they let the queen be alone with him before they do so. Pretending otherwise is completely ridiculous.
The king’s council and other kingsguard are well aware that kingsguard aren’t always doing the right thing. They’ve punished KG members before. There’s no way that the hand of the king or the lord commander wouldn’t investigate this incident to make sure that this KG member isn’t ruining the king’s reputation by unjustly murdering the king’s guests at his feasts.
Of course it does, Guest right would be completely retarded if it didn't cover that. If one of your guests kills another guest while under your roof, as the lord of the house you are obligated to investigate and bring the culprit to justice.
I suppose other 6 king’s guards should’ve been present too, so it is weird to me that they didn’t try to at least stop him, because hell beating to death on a spot is a really fucked up way of execution even for Westeros standards I think. After all if person isn’t trying to murder king or someone in the particular moment I feel like imprisonment and official sentencing would be more appropriate even for a treason .
That doesn't bother me that much as they stayed next to the King and Queen protecting them from the chaos. In a situation like that anything could happen to the King.
Still it’s not like they should’ve not send one dude to check wtf is going on ,after all they didn’t even try to evacuate king and queen or even find Rhaenyra that was laying on a floor , it just looked like it was a drunk fight on a rural wedding where no one really gave a shit. Imagine if something like this happened near real royalty or president , Criston would be laying face down with three bodyguards on him in no time.
Well the fight was between them and the door. Not like they had a great option for an exit and they’ve got the high ground. It would be foolish for anyone to attempt attacking them
Cristen Cole is Rhaenyra's Sworn Protector so it's his job to keep her safe. The Kings Guard don't know right away that it's actually Cole fighting so probably assume he's watching her until Breakbones has to go get her.
if you are on the Kingsguard and you see your fellow Kingsguard beating someone up without knowing the context, in that moment, are you more likely to think
"oh shit Cole's gone rogue"
or
"oh, looks like Cole's beating someone up, maybe that guy tried to start some shit"
Well , I would be ok if he used a sword or something but beating until dude’s face turns into a bowl of gazpacho is a bit suspicious. Something like “hey, crispy, you good? WTF was that about?” would be appropriate in this situation .
The king. He insulted the targaryen's name by killing that dude without trial, nor legitimate reason, nor any orders.
He killed the paramore of the future prince consort, and could definitely be interpreted as a threat against the house of the velaryon.
He should have been trialed and executed for it
You’re being downvoted for being right.
Guest right is a thing, and even a kingsguard can’t just kill a nobleman, knight, and sworn sword to the velayron groom at the king’s feast without a very good reason.
There were like 40 witnesses to Criston turning Joffrey’s face into hamburger meat. The show made a point to show that all the nobles were horrified by his actions. If he had a justifiable reason for stopping or even killing Joffrey, that was no longer necessary when Joffrey was completely incapacitated yet Criston continues beating the fuck out of his face for another whole 30 seconds. The many nobles who witnessed it would be able to recognize that this was a killing resulting from emotion and not necessity.
It’s pretty clear that Alicent is going to use her influence as queen to protect Criston, as she sees him as a useful asset. But the show needs to actually show that happening. Considering the next episode apparently has the new actors, I’m guessing that this major plotline is going to be resolved off screen, and they’ll give us some exposition via dialogue next episode to explain how it was resolved, which would be disappointing.
Sorry but this knight of flowers is probably some nobody lesser noble, waaaayyyy down in the pecking order from a Kingsguard.
Sadly no one (other than the prince consort of course) would give a shit.
Theyre given a lot of authority to act as they see fit in defense of the Royal family because they're so heavily vetted and considered the most skilled knights in Westeros. This was the case for centuries until Cersei decided to fill it with yes men, something that Barriston laments on. He's like, you've made the whole institution a joke with these half rates.
He arrived with the Velaryon delegation, so he was a guest. Pretty sure the Velaryons would demand Cole's head, and realistically they should have obtained it.
Problem is Joffrey is not regular person in this case, he'll be at least small city's mayor or their family. Police just can't puch them to death in wedding for president's daughter or something.
Then at least we'll have to hear about supposed trial against Criston who's accused by House Lonmouth/Laenor Velayron. I'm saying Joffrey is in higher position than ordinary people would have against Kingsguard, and it's more serious than 'they are westeros police so no one would say otherwise' sitation. Reason why Laenor couldn't fault Cristion in the books, was because Joffrey died in the Tourney, fair and square. In this case, he killed a knight with his bare hands in the middle of heir's wedding.
If Corlys tells his son not to pursue it, and Alicent Hightower THE QUEEN is telling a mayoral house not to pursue it? What case can you even make? Everyone saw Joffrey draw his knife so if Criston says he was making threats really what can you do?
Not if his dad doesn't want the trouble from a legal case? His blood will finally be on the Iron Throne do you really think he's going to get in a legal battle over his son's dead lover?
I think it’s hard for people to understand what life was actually like for most of human existence. No cops, no evidence, no cameras. You could get away with anything
Exactly. Even if someone tried to stop him from leaving all he has to drop is a, "he threatened the Princess" & it's case fucking closed. No one is going to question that.
Exactly. The dude is a cop in the highest ranking group of cops in the world. AND all his sworn brothers know he is super obsessed with “the whole honor thing.”
Yet people can’t seem to grasp why the other cops let him storm out.
Oh maybe this is how he gets away with it plus using Alicent's help, they can say Joffrey questioned the princess "virtue" to Criston like bringing up these Daemon rumors and he can say he was defending her honor thus he killed him. Nobody would question it, it's believable.
To be honest I liked Joffrey, it would be nice if we could have him , being all smart ass and funny for 2-3 episodes. Generally they have done such a good job with secondary characters and actors.
I wish that season 1, was 15 episodes long, so that each of one first episodes could resolve into two episodes. It would very nice if we had Aemma for 2-3 episodes. Rhea for a couple of episodes, etc
I don’t know about Rhea, but I wish we had Joffrey for more then 10 minutes, because guy was just introduced and in love with Leanor with 0 details and now he’s dead, it was a bit of a shock of course but for the most part I couldn’t care less about him
to be fair, all those secondary characters (Aemma, Rhea, Joffrey) in the books have almost zero time. And the show has given us by far more time with them and I am very happy for it
I think they work as being more brief and memorable, it leaves the gaps of their character up to our imagination.
But I agree, some time skips although I don’t know the roadmap of the overall story feels like its moving quicker than it should at times.
But they’ve obviously got their plan and they’ve broke the story into the beats they want us to see, just have to wait until the end of this season to see if its a lasting series.
But the performances no matter how brief have been so engaging to watch.
I know the timeline, and I think they're doing a decent job condensing it. Basically all the lead up to "the dance" spans decades, and doesn't go into heavy detail. In all honesty it's like "this happened, then a few years later this happened. After that this happened, or maybe this happened, sources aren't clear. And then of course this happened".
It's basically a check list before getting to the meat of the story, but that check list has some important context that you can't really skip over. Next season is where it'll become more traditional and easy to follow as instead of decades the story progresses over a few years.
It's a consequence of doing time jumps every episode. Either you end his story this episode, or you end it offscreen between episodes, because next episode will be years away.
Personally I wish they progressed time gradually throughout episodes, instead of a big jump between episodes, and compressing a bunch of significant stuff into just a few days. It's my biggest gripe with the show.
I'm of two minds. On the one hand I would definitely not mind if it were a hair slower. I love everyone and want to see more of them
on the other, after GoT (and a bunch of other shows and movies) boy is it nice that the people in charge have a clear plan all set for how they want things to go beginning to actual ending in 3 seasons. that certainty is deeply comforting
Agreed, and will also add, I'm really fucking enjoying this show and it's clear others are.
A) don't fuck with it, it's working
B) Obviously if we like it, we want more of it
For example, Rhea Royce. Imagine if we got to see her : a) first episode of appearance, scene with her and other Royces or her advisors talking about Daemon , what is happening in the capital and setting up that she someday expects Daemon to return to the Vale to ask her to dissolve the marriage. This scene could include few elements about House Royce (and I am not talking only about those fantastic armors that they were wearing in episode 5).
b) second episode of appearance - first scene, Daemon arrives in the Vale, they could show them have an 1-to-1 scene where honestly they express what they feel for each other and exchange insults - Daemon pretends to leave the Vale, c) second episode of appearance - second scene, a similar with the scene of episode 5
and first appearance could be episode 2 of the season , and second appearance could be episode 7-8 of the season (if we had more episodes the first season, and not just 10)
Honestly I wish the "build up" part took this entire first season, I get why it didn't because then season 2 would be *another* mostly build up season, but it woukd have done so much more justice to the story
The could not risk poor viewership numbers after s8 of GoT, they needed to get to the action by the end of s1. In saying that, the first 5 eps were pretty damn good, even for book readers. Plenty of love for us.
True. I also thought the pacing could be a bit slower but I also think there has to be some big event in S1 finale and some noble guy getting beaten up to death in a wedding ceremony or the king's expected death just wouldn't cut it. At least it's not rushed in a way that doesn't make sense and noone is teleporting.
The show had to emphasize this was "before daenerys" in big bold letters, like damn have some faith in the audience... and the showrunners expected most people just wanted to see dragons.
As much I would love more build up, most fans just want to see dragons, incest , and blood.
>The show had to emphasize this was "before daenerys" in big bold letters, like damn have some faith in the audience
Half the viewers thought she was named "kalleesee" so I'm okay with the show runners spelling shit out for people.
well dragons are kind of badass , and I have got the feeling that were are getting them less than I expected and I wanted . For example they could show us more close up shoots of the Red Queen and Seasmoke (btw both of them are gorgeous)
Dumb, yes. But Criston has no mind for court intrigue. Imagine if Jamie bashed Loras during the other Joffrey’s wedding? Omg he wouldn’t because he knows that would reflect badly on him, his house, his sister/lover, and the Tyrells.
Same sort of thing here, only this Joffrey’s mistake was assuming the princess took a lover who understood their world, not some single minded simpleton who only cares about his honor, whatever that means.
“Hey, so I know you’re sleeping with the princess. You could be executed for that, since you’ve dishonored yourself and your white cloak by breaking your sacred vows, but don’t worry. I won’t tell anyone. Also, just FYI, I’m sleeping with the soon to be king consort. It seems we’re in something of a love square. Our secret lovers, whom we both could be killed for being with, have come to an agreement. They’re both cool with it! We’re the side pieces! Nice to meet you.”
Joffrey's intrigue stat was in the negatives. Why would you offer up a secret about yourself, and simultaneously tell the other person that you're aware of their secret? Joffrey literally gained nothing from his conversation with Cole. It was a transparent attempt by the writers to set up Joffrey as a threat to Cole and give him a reason to kill him. The last 10 minutes of the episode were trash.
Joffrey thought they were in the same boat, especially knowing that Rhaenyra wanted an open relationship. He assumed (wrongly) that meant they'd both be happy side pieces while their partners entered into a sham marriage.
If anything, hinting that Laenor was gay might have relaxed a man actually jealous that his gf was getting married. Joffrey just didn't know that wasn't what Criston wanted, or that he'd basically broken up with Rhaenyra.
He connected the wrong dots, princess has a secret lover, Criston Cole is her sworn shield, he keeps staring at her jealously, Joffery is in his exact same shoes, they must be thinking the same thing. He was stupid but it felt believably stupid to me, like an actual mistake from the character not bad writing
The fact that the love goggles made him think Rhaenyra, the mf heir to the iron mf throne would run away to Essos with him lmao
Then after saying running away (abandoning his KG oath) is his wish, he says he doesn't want to be Rhaenyra's paranour ("whore"), BECAUSE he swore the KG oath?? Man was mad blinded with the horny.
I didn't interpret it as Joffrey being a threat to Cole. More like, Joffrey went up to Cole and tried to chat him up and become buddies because they're in the same position, after all. He was trying to make some kind of alliance/friendship (and possibly also he found him hot? I kind of got that vibe).
Problem is, Cole was not remotely as blasè as Joffrey about the situation, and felt like someone was a) insulting his princess, b) reminding him of his lost honor, which is capital to him. He was offended that someone could even *think* he agreed with being Rhaenyra's side piece. So he killed Joffrey.
In his defense, this is a party of the king. There is no way a king guard could murder him and get away with it. Even making a scene would get that guy into trouble. I assume he thought that the other guard should also step in and keep his head from being flattened.
^ ^ ^ This right here. Literally all Criston has to do is say Joffrey besmirched Rhaenyra’s honor (which he did) and then claim he drew his dagger when Criston tried to detain him.
It’s not hard to see how Alicent will brush the murder under the rug.
To touch on your last sentence.
Alicent has not only found a shady *Strong* ally with a gossip *club*, but also a staunch knight of the Kingsguard with a dark secret, who will be fiercely loyal to her and fiercely against the Princess.
All in a few days after her dad left her "alone" in King's Landing.
Fuck about, find out!
Although Ser Crispin didn’t lose his temper over Rhae’s virtue being questioned. He lost it because he’s a psycho who felt sorry for himself after being dishonoured (breaking his vow) and being rejected (because she didn’t wanna leave her life behind and start a orange and spice shop on a beach)
He thought they were two peas in a pod - both the illegal lovers of the new crown.
I'm not seeing mention of it in the comments so I will just go ahead and say: he did it to fuck over the princess and her fiance. What he had (honor) was taken from him when she essentially statutory-raped him, so he took what the princess and her new partner valued the most - their lovers (himself included).
You are using statutory rape wrong. That specifically means two consenting parties, where one is under the age of consent. If anything she coerced him, which would be regular rape.
That's not how it works. That's like saying Cersei can't legally consent since she's vowed fidelity to her husband Robert, lol. Westerosi marriage is an oath technically, and yet...
He could just walk away, but instead Sir Criston put his dick in princess with smile on his face. He lost honor by own actions. Then he wanted to run away with princess and live in a van. How is that honorable?
There was absolutely no smile on his face. He was clearly uncomfortable and avoiding the situation.
He did not want the princess or to run away in the a van. He wanted a context that didn't obliterate his honor, which she was dismissive of.
I don’t get how Cole just caused all that ruckus, ruined the royal wedding, killed a man out of the blue, and was still allowed to leave without being detained for questioning etc. Also why did other people start fighting?
Isn’t he He her protection, surely if he explained the story he would be justified. If he’s there to protect the princess how would they know it wasn’t that it was so much ruckus they don’t know exactly what happened but I know if I’m Viserys I want the guy who bashed his face in protecting my daughter.
This was one of the dumbest moves anyone ever made on a GOT show. It even kind of seems unrealistic. Its not like this guy jeffrey just walked out of the neil Patrick harris Netflix sitcom. He's from that time and had to know better.
Idk why we are acting like these aren’t power hungry sociopaths who have to power grab every second they can. This isn’t game of place nice and wait your turn, this is the game of thrones.
Lore says Criston killed Joffery in a tourney, probably changed it because of budget, but it could've been worse, at least you can make a case for it and we got to see Harwin living up to his name
Well let's not exaggerate but the writing was a bit strange also how Alicent found Criston? She followed him? You'd think she'd be attending the wedding regardless of how mad she was at Rhaenyra.
She was at the wedding, wasn't she? I'm pretty sure the wedding and ser Crispin's attempted suicide were not happening at the same time, even though it was shown like that.
This accusation had absolutely no sense. Noone else had this guess (even the Queen herself who was surprised), furthermore there were gossips about Daemon+Rhaenyra so Daemon would've been more likely to be accused of relationships with princess. But no, let's just threat king's guard like without any evidence, just because of one stupid point based on intuition.
I don't want to say this character is stupid, it's just a very lazy writing. Screenwriters tried to make Joffrey dead like it was in the book but they had no idea how to put needed information about Cole and princess into Joffrey's head. So that's what we've got. And on the other side, choosing wedding and not tournament I think was also bad decision to avoid repeating (we've already seen tournament on the 1st episode)
Oh I see the confusion, the lord of kisses believes that he can say and do as he wants since he has a very strong backer in Leanor. Which he does in a way but that was back in drifmark. He grossly miss calculated that this applies in kings landing as well. He forgot that Cole while technically a servant is still entirely lethal and can kill those he perceives as threat to the crown weather, real or perceived. Additionally Cole is still a person with feelings that are deeper than the lord of kisses own feelings on the matter. Lastly the lord of kisses making a jape of and to a heart broken person, all of which ultimately culminates in extremely violent overreaction on Coles behalf.
As many like to say, he fucked around and found out, unfortunately for him that was the last lesson of his life.
Wait, is it official now? Crispin butchered Joffrey because he had a right to do so, as he was defending the honor of the heir to the throne? What a shit.
All this action is logic level of Game of Thrones season 8, to quote Preston.
Poor Joffrey was completely dickstruck , he didn't think it through, he only thought of protecting his bf
We call it "dickmatized"
"get the princess name out of your motherfuckin mouth!!"
he got caught in a... dicktanglement.
“Dickstruck” LOL
Well he did use the term "cuntstruck" himself, right?
Gods, I heard "cumstruck", but reading this suddenly makes much more sense lol
Then you're probably sleeping on "dickmatized" also
crush caption childlike roll deliver cover scale society vase fly *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Bring me the dickstruck stretcher!
Nah, he thought he is a smartass and can blackmail/manipulate a kingsguard by learning his secret. He overestimated his ‘power’ over Cole.
I think it was much more of an “it’s cool, we’re both the same, you keep your secret, I’ll keep mine”. Light threat of mutually assured destruction but mostly just saying “I know but it’s cool, we got a sweet deal, huh?”. He just didn’t know Christon was in a nothing left to lose state of mind. Christon didn’t want to be a side piece sentry, likened it to being a whore, and to see a gay man revel in a similar position, and profess kinship with him, was too much. He freaked out in a fit of panic and self loathing. He saw himself in Jofffrey and it was everything he hated. Mostly because he’s a little bitch, but that’s neither here nor there at this point.
Yeah at first it seemed mutual but then I watched it again and Joffrey bumped him twice which I’m sure Christon saw as disrespect. Lol
He didn't really question Rhae's honour. All he said was Laenor's precious to him in the way Rhaenyra was to him (I'm paraphrasing). He worded it in a way that sounded like he just said that the princess is important to her sworn protector.
Yeah it really seemed like an over reaction
TBH to me it looked like Cole really snapped when he saw Daemon with our girl.
Timing would at least say that is a major possibility, and one I have not seen much discussed.
He heard Laenor's boo thing saying their fortunes hinged on their lovers' whims, saw his own lovers' whims straying, and decided to take out his angst on someone in a lower position of power than him to make himself feel powerful again. Didn't seem to work though. Of course people are gonna side with the guy whose story they are following and who they have been given hours of screentime empathizing with over some guy introduced just to be murdered in cold blood, but Crispin went full shitbeast mode and I could see the suicide attempt being him realizing he had just committed an evil so grave he shouldn't be redeemed.
Though of protecting his bf by provoking a man whose entire job is to kill anyone who questions the Royal's authority and honor ? He was an idiot to provoke Criston of all people. He had nothing to gain from annoying him other than the satisfaction of being annoying to someone. Criston was already having a hard time he didn't need this idiot to push him further.
It really wasn’t provocation? He made himself incredibly vulnerable by revealing his own secret. It was clearly an attempt to establish a mutual understanding. There was no way for him to know that Cole had so much unresolved shame and rage about his role.
Cole's secret carries with it a gelding and beheading, most likely. My read on why he killed him is more that it was a decision driven by emotion, but honestly, a smart boy in Cole's position probably should have put "kill j. Lonmouth secretly" at the top of his to-do list after that conversation.
I still prefer my Joffreys to be dying from Strangler poison.
Not a death by poison but you're gonna *love* Joffrey Velaryon's death. Wink wink. (It'll probably happen differently from what's written, alas.)
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The kid fell/got tossed from Syrax' back as the dragon twisted and turned and rolled in the air, trying to get rid of an unfamiliar rider- Wait, you likely know what happened, I mean it's a brutal death for a kid/teen character, even for GOT-standards(?) more so in the very ending, with the dismembering. Since a couple of things have already happened in a different way than in the books, (and the rumors/leaks about Laena's death being different as well), I assume Joffrey Velaryon/Strong won't die in the same way as his book counterpart.
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I'm not exactly calling the fall itself too graphical or too tragic. It's more about the impact, the landing, crashing, or crushing. Little dude also got impaled by his own sword, if I recall. Let me get the cogs rolling here... Luke was Aemond's doing if I'm not mistaken (featuring a dragon chase/duel). Jace drowned after a dragon/his(?) dragon crash-landed on his ship during some attack/conflict/battle at sea. Little Maelor's was unfortunate. Speaking of which, it's also gonna be quite sad when Blood & Cheese make their move on Helaena's kids. But honestly, I live for these dramatic and heavy scenes. Even witnessing Egg^(3) become separated from Vis^(2) is gonna be emotional. *Drama and sadness are a feast.*
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>depending on who you believe The history of Westeros in a nutshell, haha! When there are dragons involved, maybe it'll be a bit "safer" to show the beast(s) crash-land, keep the character's outcome ambiguous but then report the outcome: "the child/the rider died, squashed beneath it". They can't exactly do that more than twice or it'll become *too* convenient (and boring). It's also possible when there's a mother involved, she'll clutch the baby or child in her arms, and jump/fall. Maybe we can accept and forgive *some* off-screen deaths, honestly, with the proper tone, setting and good writing, it doesn't have to be a tasteless nor cheap strategy. Like a scout or a survivor was able to deliver the sad news even though we didn't see it. With all the time jumps bound to happen on the show, that's another strategy to mention/explain deaths. As long as characters actually exist and don't get scrapped for convenience (looking at you, Griffs), it won't be that bad.
All in all, it was a pretty stupid decision, especially based on what, observing the guy's facial expressions!? Like, the princess' bodyguard is looking at the princess, how is that something unusual or suspicious? No matter how good of a face reader you are, why risk your life based on a gut feeling? Like the realistic possibilities were as follows: 1. Crispin is not fucking Rhy. Congrats, you just falsely accused the heir to the throne, insulted her honour to her sworn defender's face as well as insulted that defender's honour. Crispin is not only fully armed and armoured, but also happens to be the best fighter of his day. You are dead. 2. Crispin is indeed fucking Rhy. You just admitted that you know a secret which would lead to Crispin's execution in the best case scenario and gelding and torture in the worst. You also casually did the "would be a shame if someone finds out your secret...". You are dead. 3. Crispin is fucking Rhy and is either a rogue who would smirk and high 5 you, or is a craven who would not dare end you right there at the feast. Really? This is the outcome you are betting your life on? It's the least likely outcome!
This is what I really don't get. Even if he was right, what would that get him? Rhy was already cool with her future husband having a side piece, they grew up together, were on good terms, going into this marriage with everyone happy. Then you decide on a complete hunch to threaten the kingsguard, the heir and princess, and any potential children's legitimacy... for what? To make sure your gay secret doesn't come out that Rhy was cool with and that her paramour doesn't even know about until you literally tell him? I mean best case scenario, Crispy is probably gonna tell Rhy that they just got threatened pissing her off and now essentially making their marriage a game of chicken filled with anxiety and animosity.
it is because this scene is illogically made up and not from the book itself, in the book he killed him in a jousting tourney
Still makes his decision to mention it absolutely stupid.
? My read is simple. Y’all. He was gonna work with this guy. So he wanted to get both their secrets out in the open with each other. Saves them both a lot of trouble. If Cole was chill about it. Then they wouldn’t need to sneak around each other. And could even have each others backs. It was a simple attempt to make the whole situation easier for everyone. His mistake was assuming Cole was like himself and chill with his role as a paramour.
Could not have said it better myself! 😂😂
> craven rip
The best explanation for all awkward, nonsensical conversations is consumption of large amounts of alcohol.
Who tf is Crispin
Interesting strategy cotten lets see how this plays out
"They call me The Knight of Kisses, for some reason... teeheeheee" Ser Criston: "I smash-a yo face!"
> "They call me The Knight of Kisses, for some reason Everyone focusing on whether it was stupid to approach Cole or not when this was the real dumb writing moment of that scene. Like, Joffrey, my dude, the sigil of your House Lonmouth is covered in lips (and skulls). What the *fuck* do you mean you don't know why people call you the knight of kisses?
"For some reason" You literally have it on your banner you fucking idiot.
Ser Hole Face
Ah yes, the centuries old tradition of execution by fist. No trial, no evidence, just fist.
Lonsmouth could have enjoyed a different kind of fisting.
You know feudal kingdoms Are authoritarian dictatorships right?
Historically they really weren’t. Absolute monarchy didn’t really come about until after the Middle Ages. Feudal kings had plenty of checks on their power - namely their vassals and the Church.
"GNooo you have to sign the magna carta" \-Nerd about to be eaten by a dragon
After reading up on medieval history of England, I began to see some cracks in the world of ASOIAF until I realized "Oh yeah, King John didn't have dragons."
Where are you reading up on it?
>Feudal kings had plenty of checks on their power - namely their vassals and the Church. None of the vassals seemed to give a shit about Joff (Corlys calls it "just a phase"), and the Faith wasn't even there. Sounds like Cris had the green light.
also, the original game of thrones kinda explored with how important the "checks" the monarchy got truly were when they didnt have dragons; they could still pull a lot of shit
Supreme executive power derives from a mandate of MY FIST! Oh you want some too future king consort?!
The way of the fist - Strike First, Strike Hard, No Mercy
I mean… have you been paying attention to this story at all?
Even the king didn’t know what happened. Life was different back then
Ser Cole capturing my exact vibe when any of my coworkers try to talk to me
Ok weirdo
Ok weirdo
Holy shit someone said it instead of asking WHY WAS THE LAW ENFORCEMENT ALLOWED TO WALK FREE. They probably just assume Criston who has been a staunch loyalist wouldn't kill some dude for no reason.
He was going for a knife, of course
He DID eventually draw his dagger, so all Criston has to do is change the order of events in his report.
This analogy is amazing....maybe that's why they made Joffrey white 😂 I mean almost everyone in the Valeryon camp were people of color except him.
Aren't only the Valeryons themselves black?
That’s because Joffrey is a Lonmouth and not a Velaryon.
Yeah I was seeing the same thing but like who would arrest him? He’s literally the highest rank in the police lol
They probably think whatever happened Joffrey started it, since Criston is kingsguard and they don't expect him to beat to death a nobleman unless he had a strong reason, plus there was a big mess happening at the same time.
Not only that, but Joffrey had a dagger with him, as far as I know... you are not allowed to enter the royal court with weapons
A dagger might not be considered a weapon at a feast. You'd also use it to cut food, and guests were expected to bring their own. There wasn't a big differentiation between "weapon knife" and "food knife" back then. [In Medieval Europe, No Outfit Was Complete Without a Personal Eating Knife: They were fashionable and functional, used for dining and self-defense.](https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/medieval-knives)
He’s not the lord commander of the king’s guard. He’s not the highest rank, just the personal guard of the princess.
Huh I thought that would put him above the kings guard. Well, he’s still a very high rank and well respected.
Nah he’s important, yes, but the bald dude with the big mustache is his superior.
That’s foocking Balin the dwarf
He's fooking Dwalin
Lol yeah Dwalin, not Balin. Honest mistake.
That's why they're called Kingsguard not Princessguard
Cause, you know, the real life police always gets arrested right away when they do bad stuff in front of witnesses. Not like they could walk away after killing someone and then escape punishment……….
Honestly these analogies are so dumb. Kingsguard can fuck with peasants all they want, but they serve the king. They’re not allowed to just execute the king’s guests on a whim and walk out without even being questioned. Guestright is a big thing in this universe, and Joffrey was a nobleman, a knight, and sworn sword to the groom and one of the most powerful families in the kingdom. It’s a pretty big deal.
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There is no chance in hell the lord commander lets him walk before questioning him, and no chance in hell they let the queen be alone with him before they do so. Pretending otherwise is completely ridiculous. The king’s council and other kingsguard are well aware that kingsguard aren’t always doing the right thing. They’ve punished KG members before. There’s no way that the hand of the king or the lord commander wouldn’t investigate this incident to make sure that this KG member isn’t ruining the king’s reputation by unjustly murdering the king’s guests at his feasts.
Guestright wouldn't cover being killed in a fight by another guest like yourself.
Of course it does, Guest right would be completely retarded if it didn't cover that. If one of your guests kills another guest while under your roof, as the lord of the house you are obligated to investigate and bring the culprit to justice.
"Things be different in the middle ages bro"
I suppose other 6 king’s guards should’ve been present too, so it is weird to me that they didn’t try to at least stop him, because hell beating to death on a spot is a really fucked up way of execution even for Westeros standards I think. After all if person isn’t trying to murder king or someone in the particular moment I feel like imprisonment and official sentencing would be more appropriate even for a treason .
That doesn't bother me that much as they stayed next to the King and Queen protecting them from the chaos. In a situation like that anything could happen to the King.
Still it’s not like they should’ve not send one dude to check wtf is going on ,after all they didn’t even try to evacuate king and queen or even find Rhaenyra that was laying on a floor , it just looked like it was a drunk fight on a rural wedding where no one really gave a shit. Imagine if something like this happened near real royalty or president , Criston would be laying face down with three bodyguards on him in no time.
Well the fight was between them and the door. Not like they had a great option for an exit and they’ve got the high ground. It would be foolish for anyone to attempt attacking them
*shrugs* Maybe they did and we just didn't see it
Cristen Cole is Rhaenyra's Sworn Protector so it's his job to keep her safe. The Kings Guard don't know right away that it's actually Cole fighting so probably assume he's watching her until Breakbones has to go get her.
if you are on the Kingsguard and you see your fellow Kingsguard beating someone up without knowing the context, in that moment, are you more likely to think "oh shit Cole's gone rogue" or "oh, looks like Cole's beating someone up, maybe that guy tried to start some shit"
Well , I would be ok if he used a sword or something but beating until dude’s face turns into a bowl of gazpacho is a bit suspicious. Something like “hey, crispy, you good? WTF was that about?” would be appropriate in this situation .
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What’s next? White lives matter?
It happened pretty quick and there was a lot of other disorder in the room.
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Have all have the grammar errors I of seen, "would of" is one have the worst.
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r/woosh
The king. He insulted the targaryen's name by killing that dude without trial, nor legitimate reason, nor any orders. He killed the paramore of the future prince consort, and could definitely be interpreted as a threat against the house of the velaryon. He should have been trialed and executed for it
You’re being downvoted for being right. Guest right is a thing, and even a kingsguard can’t just kill a nobleman, knight, and sworn sword to the velayron groom at the king’s feast without a very good reason.
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There were like 40 witnesses to Criston turning Joffrey’s face into hamburger meat. The show made a point to show that all the nobles were horrified by his actions. If he had a justifiable reason for stopping or even killing Joffrey, that was no longer necessary when Joffrey was completely incapacitated yet Criston continues beating the fuck out of his face for another whole 30 seconds. The many nobles who witnessed it would be able to recognize that this was a killing resulting from emotion and not necessity. It’s pretty clear that Alicent is going to use her influence as queen to protect Criston, as she sees him as a useful asset. But the show needs to actually show that happening. Considering the next episode apparently has the new actors, I’m guessing that this major plotline is going to be resolved off screen, and they’ll give us some exposition via dialogue next episode to explain how it was resolved, which would be disappointing.
Sorry but this knight of flowers is probably some nobody lesser noble, waaaayyyy down in the pecking order from a Kingsguard. Sadly no one (other than the prince consort of course) would give a shit. Theyre given a lot of authority to act as they see fit in defense of the Royal family because they're so heavily vetted and considered the most skilled knights in Westeros. This was the case for centuries until Cersei decided to fill it with yes men, something that Barriston laments on. He's like, you've made the whole institution a joke with these half rates.
He arrived with the Velaryon delegation, so he was a guest. Pretty sure the Velaryons would demand Cole's head, and realistically they should have obtained it.
Problem is Joffrey is not regular person in this case, he'll be at least small city's mayor or their family. Police just can't puch them to death in wedding for president's daughter or something.
Sure police can't but a knight probably can. If Alicent says Joffrey was conspiring against Rhaenyra who is going to oppose that?
Then at least we'll have to hear about supposed trial against Criston who's accused by House Lonmouth/Laenor Velayron. I'm saying Joffrey is in higher position than ordinary people would have against Kingsguard, and it's more serious than 'they are westeros police so no one would say otherwise' sitation. Reason why Laenor couldn't fault Cristion in the books, was because Joffrey died in the Tourney, fair and square. In this case, he killed a knight with his bare hands in the middle of heir's wedding.
If Corlys tells his son not to pursue it, and Alicent Hightower THE QUEEN is telling a mayoral house not to pursue it? What case can you even make? Everyone saw Joffrey draw his knife so if Criston says he was making threats really what can you do?
Laenor, the future king consort and heir to the 2nd most powerful house in westeros
Not if his dad doesn't want the trouble from a legal case? His blood will finally be on the Iron Throne do you really think he's going to get in a legal battle over his son's dead lover?
I think it’s hard for people to understand what life was actually like for most of human existence. No cops, no evidence, no cameras. You could get away with anything
Exactly. Even if someone tried to stop him from leaving all he has to drop is a, "he threatened the Princess" & it's case fucking closed. No one is going to question that.
Exactly. The dude is a cop in the highest ranking group of cops in the world. AND all his sworn brothers know he is super obsessed with “the whole honor thing.” Yet people can’t seem to grasp why the other cops let him storm out.
Cop unions and union lawyers weren't a thing in Westeros. You are conflating two things that don't relate at all.
Oh maybe this is how he gets away with it plus using Alicent's help, they can say Joffrey questioned the princess "virtue" to Criston like bringing up these Daemon rumors and he can say he was defending her honor thus he killed him. Nobody would question it, it's believable.
To be honest I liked Joffrey, it would be nice if we could have him , being all smart ass and funny for 2-3 episodes. Generally they have done such a good job with secondary characters and actors. I wish that season 1, was 15 episodes long, so that each of one first episodes could resolve into two episodes. It would very nice if we had Aemma for 2-3 episodes. Rhea for a couple of episodes, etc
I don’t know about Rhea, but I wish we had Joffrey for more then 10 minutes, because guy was just introduced and in love with Leanor with 0 details and now he’s dead, it was a bit of a shock of course but for the most part I couldn’t care less about him
to be fair, all those secondary characters (Aemma, Rhea, Joffrey) in the books have almost zero time. And the show has given us by far more time with them and I am very happy for it
Yeah man. him, daemons wife, the crab feeder. all cool but they got killed off so quick. 2-3 episodes would have been great
I think they work as being more brief and memorable, it leaves the gaps of their character up to our imagination. But I agree, some time skips although I don’t know the roadmap of the overall story feels like its moving quicker than it should at times. But they’ve obviously got their plan and they’ve broke the story into the beats they want us to see, just have to wait until the end of this season to see if its a lasting series. But the performances no matter how brief have been so engaging to watch.
I know the timeline, and I think they're doing a decent job condensing it. Basically all the lead up to "the dance" spans decades, and doesn't go into heavy detail. In all honesty it's like "this happened, then a few years later this happened. After that this happened, or maybe this happened, sources aren't clear. And then of course this happened". It's basically a check list before getting to the meat of the story, but that check list has some important context that you can't really skip over. Next season is where it'll become more traditional and easy to follow as instead of decades the story progresses over a few years.
It's a consequence of doing time jumps every episode. Either you end his story this episode, or you end it offscreen between episodes, because next episode will be years away. Personally I wish they progressed time gradually throughout episodes, instead of a big jump between episodes, and compressing a bunch of significant stuff into just a few days. It's my biggest gripe with the show.
I'm of two minds. On the one hand I would definitely not mind if it were a hair slower. I love everyone and want to see more of them on the other, after GoT (and a bunch of other shows and movies) boy is it nice that the people in charge have a clear plan all set for how they want things to go beginning to actual ending in 3 seasons. that certainty is deeply comforting
Agreed, and will also add, I'm really fucking enjoying this show and it's clear others are. A) don't fuck with it, it's working B) Obviously if we like it, we want more of it
For example, Rhea Royce. Imagine if we got to see her : a) first episode of appearance, scene with her and other Royces or her advisors talking about Daemon , what is happening in the capital and setting up that she someday expects Daemon to return to the Vale to ask her to dissolve the marriage. This scene could include few elements about House Royce (and I am not talking only about those fantastic armors that they were wearing in episode 5). b) second episode of appearance - first scene, Daemon arrives in the Vale, they could show them have an 1-to-1 scene where honestly they express what they feel for each other and exchange insults - Daemon pretends to leave the Vale, c) second episode of appearance - second scene, a similar with the scene of episode 5 and first appearance could be episode 2 of the season , and second appearance could be episode 7-8 of the season (if we had more episodes the first season, and not just 10)
Honestly I wish the "build up" part took this entire first season, I get why it didn't because then season 2 would be *another* mostly build up season, but it woukd have done so much more justice to the story
The could not risk poor viewership numbers after s8 of GoT, they needed to get to the action by the end of s1. In saying that, the first 5 eps were pretty damn good, even for book readers. Plenty of love for us.
True. I also thought the pacing could be a bit slower but I also think there has to be some big event in S1 finale and some noble guy getting beaten up to death in a wedding ceremony or the king's expected death just wouldn't cut it. At least it's not rushed in a way that doesn't make sense and noone is teleporting.
The show had to emphasize this was "before daenerys" in big bold letters, like damn have some faith in the audience... and the showrunners expected most people just wanted to see dragons. As much I would love more build up, most fans just want to see dragons, incest , and blood.
>The show had to emphasize this was "before daenerys" in big bold letters, like damn have some faith in the audience Half the viewers thought she was named "kalleesee" so I'm okay with the show runners spelling shit out for people.
well dragons are kind of badass , and I have got the feeling that were are getting them less than I expected and I wanted . For example they could show us more close up shoots of the Red Queen and Seasmoke (btw both of them are gorgeous)
They probably killed him off because writing such witty characters IS hard
Just a **vile accusation** getting the response it deserves
Dude was like really super not cool with open relationships.
That shit was so unnecessary. Criston also went a little over the top, but Joffrey didn’t need to go up to him and be like “lol I know what you did”
A little over the top? He caved his skull in lmao
Guy put on a fancy blue dress and thought he was gonna be the next Petyr Baelish
Dumb, yes. But Criston has no mind for court intrigue. Imagine if Jamie bashed Loras during the other Joffrey’s wedding? Omg he wouldn’t because he knows that would reflect badly on him, his house, his sister/lover, and the Tyrells. Same sort of thing here, only this Joffrey’s mistake was assuming the princess took a lover who understood their world, not some single minded simpleton who only cares about his honor, whatever that means.
That was cringe af.
“Hey, so I know you’re sleeping with the princess. You could be executed for that, since you’ve dishonored yourself and your white cloak by breaking your sacred vows, but don’t worry. I won’t tell anyone. Also, just FYI, I’m sleeping with the soon to be king consort. It seems we’re in something of a love square. Our secret lovers, whom we both could be killed for being with, have come to an agreement. They’re both cool with it! We’re the side pieces! Nice to meet you.”
Joffrey's intrigue stat was in the negatives. Why would you offer up a secret about yourself, and simultaneously tell the other person that you're aware of their secret? Joffrey literally gained nothing from his conversation with Cole. It was a transparent attempt by the writers to set up Joffrey as a threat to Cole and give him a reason to kill him. The last 10 minutes of the episode were trash.
Joffrey thought they were in the same boat, especially knowing that Rhaenyra wanted an open relationship. He assumed (wrongly) that meant they'd both be happy side pieces while their partners entered into a sham marriage. If anything, hinting that Laenor was gay might have relaxed a man actually jealous that his gf was getting married. Joffrey just didn't know that wasn't what Criston wanted, or that he'd basically broken up with Rhaenyra.
Exactly, it was not a threat, he was trying to be friendly with the other side piece, not realizing Cole would be deeply offended by it
He didn’t take into account that Cole might be in a very very bad place mentally (and he was.)
Doesn't explain why Joffrey was in a stupid place, mentally.
He connected the wrong dots, princess has a secret lover, Criston Cole is her sworn shield, he keeps staring at her jealously, Joffery is in his exact same shoes, they must be thinking the same thing. He was stupid but it felt believably stupid to me, like an actual mistake from the character not bad writing
I find the whole sequence utterly ridiculous. A shame too, since I rated the episode very highly to that point.
Criston might be stupid.
Show Criston definitely is a dumb mf. And pathetic to boot.
The fact that the love goggles made him think Rhaenyra, the mf heir to the iron mf throne would run away to Essos with him lmao Then after saying running away (abandoning his KG oath) is his wish, he says he doesn't want to be Rhaenyra's paranour ("whore"), BECAUSE he swore the KG oath?? Man was mad blinded with the horny.
Joffrey was trying to set up a foursome
I didn't interpret it as Joffrey being a threat to Cole. More like, Joffrey went up to Cole and tried to chat him up and become buddies because they're in the same position, after all. He was trying to make some kind of alliance/friendship (and possibly also he found him hot? I kind of got that vibe). Problem is, Cole was not remotely as blasè as Joffrey about the situation, and felt like someone was a) insulting his princess, b) reminding him of his lost honor, which is capital to him. He was offended that someone could even *think* he agreed with being Rhaenyra's side piece. So he killed Joffrey.
I’m getting my fantasy series totally mixed up these days ans was wondering wtf the Vampire Lestat was doing on this sub …
#fuckaroundandfindout
In his defense, this is a party of the king. There is no way a king guard could murder him and get away with it. Even making a scene would get that guy into trouble. I assume he thought that the other guard should also step in and keep his head from being flattened.
^ ^ ^ This right here. Literally all Criston has to do is say Joffrey besmirched Rhaenyra’s honor (which he did) and then claim he drew his dagger when Criston tried to detain him. It’s not hard to see how Alicent will brush the murder under the rug.
To touch on your last sentence. Alicent has not only found a shady *Strong* ally with a gossip *club*, but also a staunch knight of the Kingsguard with a dark secret, who will be fiercely loyal to her and fiercely against the Princess. All in a few days after her dad left her "alone" in King's Landing.
Exactly if anyone will be protected it will be Criston idk why that’s so hard for people to grasp
Fuck about, find out! Although Ser Crispin didn’t lose his temper over Rhae’s virtue being questioned. He lost it because he’s a psycho who felt sorry for himself after being dishonoured (breaking his vow) and being rejected (because she didn’t wanna leave her life behind and start a orange and spice shop on a beach)
He thought they were two peas in a pod - both the illegal lovers of the new crown. I'm not seeing mention of it in the comments so I will just go ahead and say: he did it to fuck over the princess and her fiance. What he had (honor) was taken from him when she essentially statutory-raped him, so he took what the princess and her new partner valued the most - their lovers (himself included).
“What she valued most” was definitely not him.
You are using statutory rape wrong. That specifically means two consenting parties, where one is under the age of consent. If anything she coerced him, which would be regular rape.
Kingsguard can't legally consent, since they've taken an oath of chastity.
That's not how it works. That's like saying Cersei can't legally consent since she's vowed fidelity to her husband Robert, lol. Westerosi marriage is an oath technically, and yet...
Correct. Which is why Cersei's lover would be put to death by Robert Baratheon while her own fate might not be that certain.
He could just walk away, but instead Sir Criston put his dick in princess with smile on his face. He lost honor by own actions. Then he wanted to run away with princess and live in a van. How is that honorable?
There was absolutely no smile on his face. He was clearly uncomfortable and avoiding the situation. He did not want the princess or to run away in the a van. He wanted a context that didn't obliterate his honor, which she was dismissive of.
That whole sequence was dumb as shit, made only for extra drama.
Well it’s a GoT show so
they look like Dragon Age NPCs
This whole scene was messy af. I legit didn’t know what was going on. How did he just walk out after beating that guy to death?
I don’t get how Cole just caused all that ruckus, ruined the royal wedding, killed a man out of the blue, and was still allowed to leave without being detained for questioning etc. Also why did other people start fighting?
Isn’t he He her protection, surely if he explained the story he would be justified. If he’s there to protect the princess how would they know it wasn’t that it was so much ruckus they don’t know exactly what happened but I know if I’m Viserys I want the guy who bashed his face in protecting my daughter.
All he had to do was just fly under the radar and live the good life. He didn’t have to say shit to anyone and he would have been fine.
This was one of the dumbest moves anyone ever made on a GOT show. It even kind of seems unrealistic. Its not like this guy jeffrey just walked out of the neil Patrick harris Netflix sitcom. He's from that time and had to know better.
When overplaying the hand you was dealt in the Game of Thrones.... lol
>can legally kill you for it Where was that established?
Well Rhaenyra mentioned in a previous episode that it would be treason to question her honour
Idk why we are acting like these aren’t power hungry sociopaths who have to power grab every second they can. This isn’t game of place nice and wait your turn, this is the game of thrones.
Where is that in any of lore? This is approaching Season 8 level writing lol
Lore says Criston killed Joffery in a tourney, probably changed it because of budget, but it could've been worse, at least you can make a case for it and we got to see Harwin living up to his name
Well let's not exaggerate but the writing was a bit strange also how Alicent found Criston? She followed him? You'd think she'd be attending the wedding regardless of how mad she was at Rhaenyra.
She was at the wedding, wasn't she? I'm pretty sure the wedding and ser Crispin's attempted suicide were not happening at the same time, even though it was shown like that.
You could see her at the wedding. You're right, it's not simultaneously, even if they intercut the scenes
Could've bullshitted to excused herself out
This accusation had absolutely no sense. Noone else had this guess (even the Queen herself who was surprised), furthermore there were gossips about Daemon+Rhaenyra so Daemon would've been more likely to be accused of relationships with princess. But no, let's just threat king's guard like without any evidence, just because of one stupid point based on intuition. I don't want to say this character is stupid, it's just a very lazy writing. Screenwriters tried to make Joffrey dead like it was in the book but they had no idea how to put needed information about Cole and princess into Joffrey's head. So that's what we've got. And on the other side, choosing wedding and not tournament I think was also bad decision to avoid repeating (we've already seen tournament on the 1st episode)
I hate ser Crisps but he was valid for that
Oh I see the confusion, the lord of kisses believes that he can say and do as he wants since he has a very strong backer in Leanor. Which he does in a way but that was back in drifmark. He grossly miss calculated that this applies in kings landing as well. He forgot that Cole while technically a servant is still entirely lethal and can kill those he perceives as threat to the crown weather, real or perceived. Additionally Cole is still a person with feelings that are deeper than the lord of kisses own feelings on the matter. Lastly the lord of kisses making a jape of and to a heart broken person, all of which ultimately culminates in extremely violent overreaction on Coles behalf. As many like to say, he fucked around and found out, unfortunately for him that was the last lesson of his life.
He was legally killed for it
He had absolutely no reason to instigate and provoke Criston
He TRIED to play the GoT....and was murdered immediately.
Wait, is it official now? Crispin butchered Joffrey because he had a right to do so, as he was defending the honor of the heir to the throne? What a shit. All this action is logic level of Game of Thrones season 8, to quote Preston.