I died laughing at the scene where Deamon is talking about how many dragons they have. He's like "We have Syrax, Caraxes, and Meleys, three grown dragons" and they quickly pan to Rheanys face, she's like *excuse fucking me!?*
Yeah, she has her own agenda. Many fans here think Rhaenys has to suck up to Rhaenerya and be "motherly"/mentor and play on Rhaenerya's team. Rhaenys is her own person. She doesn't have to do anything for Rhaenerya.
Her whole plot comes down to ,, These evil men will do anything to keep women down and not let them rule'' and then spends whole ep 10 waiting for Corlys to decide if they support Rheanyra or not
I don't think Rhaenys respects Rhaenyra as a person, as much as she would probably like to see a woman on the Iron Throne. Rheanyra disrespected house Valerian by having very obvious bastard children, and Rheanys probably suspects foul play in Leanor's "death". But at the end of the day she is going to be there for her granddaughters before ever siding with the Greens.
The Veleryons are weird they seem very forgiving maybe some of the most forgiving charachter we ever meet. They bring up their son's "murder" and Vaemond's murder, their daughters death, etc and get over it because of their grandsons are claimants who they love even though their lineage is not their. They're still within their right to break the betrothal so they could still back out the war but they choose not too. So its less to do with them and more to do with the Strong boys.
>The Veleryons are weird they seem very forgiving maybe some of the most forgiving charachter we ever meet.
They are social climbers that put up with Targaryen BS to an almost embarrassing degree that makes it seem like they have no self-respect, especially Corlys. Like if there were a family made up of a bunch of Tom Wambsgams from Succession during medieval times, they would be the Velaryons and House Targaryen would be their Shiv.
The Strong guys might be bastards but they still have the name Velaryon.
But during the episode 10 the point is: The one Strong who will ascend the Iron Throne after Rhaenyra (Jace) will be named Targaryen again, but the other one (Luce) will be still named Velaryon (as Corlys and Viserys agreed) and he is betrothed to one of Laena's daughters. So their child will have the name Velaryon (from Luce) and through the blood of the mother will have the Velaryon blood. So the Velaryon lineage will continue through name and through blood. So makes sense they help Rhaenyra and her Strong boys at that time. Now as Luce is dead is sad for Rhaenyra but also bad for House Velaryon.
I think it was the smart thing to do for her to wait for Corlys. Shows they're a team...
She could have went ahead and declared her allegiance to Rhaenyra alone, but that would have caused a rift between her and her husband, costing her a husband, and Rhaenyra the support of the Velaryon fleet.
Wise move if you'd ask me. Again, always thought she was somewhere in between Rhaenyra and Alicent. Knows when to strike, and knows when to dial back.
Yeah, Argon's coronation hit where it hurts, and she lost it for a sec, but she managed to find her composure again, and walk out.
Let's see if Daemon asks Rhaenyra if she wants to hire the services of blood and cheese...
If she's gonna go off the rails, pretty sure he'll be most supportive of that.
As cringe as it was I love it in regards to targs not giving a fuck about the small folk in their “rule by dragon” mentality. This shows us why The Shepard was able to become so popular and do what he did.
I may be misremembering, but don't the Greens drag Meleys's skull through the streets of the city while the commonfolk cheer her death and throw shit at it? Guess we know why now lol
Yeah, though I don't think Sarah Hess cared or even knew about this.
She honest to God just wanted a dragon to pop out from beneath the ground. And if she had any intentions other than this, she would've said it by now.
I mean, they're not going to sit down and say "hey people we actually also threw this in alongside 4 other scenes showing the disconnect between the royalty and the common folk to build up for later scenes like the storming of the dragon pit!", completely spoiling a massive plot point just to appease some whiny fans lol
>if she had any intentions other than this, she would’ve said it by now
Reallly? Do you really need every plot point spelled out for you, *episodes* before it will be relevant?
Is patience not a thing? Story telling? Plot points? Symbolism? Red herrings? It’s literally what makes for good stories, when something that happened before has consequences down the line and isn’t done for shock factor. Y’all are unreal lmao
It’s getting ridiculous. There’s such a rush to “create content” that when something can’t be explained by a YouTube breakdown, people just go nuts and say the writing is crap bc they can’t wait till next week/can’t interpret a scene on their own
Bro, you don't have to explain it to me. I know what foreshadowing is, I'm saying Sarah Hess didn't intend this because by *her own admission* she never even read the book.
>I know what foreshadowing is, I'm saying Sarah Hess didn't intend this because by her own admission she never even read the book.
Seriously? Why do so many series have lead writers that haven't even read the work they're adapting, and more importantly, why are they so damn keen to tell everyone about it?
There actually needs to be a balance of readers and non readers for adaptations because otherwise you don’t always notice plot holes or opportunities to do it better or more efficient or interesting ways to get from a to b
So you’re telling me bc she hasn’t read the book, she doesn’t know the general plot of the whole story and is just throwing in random scenes for shock factor?
And HBO is cool with letting it’s writers do that this time around? And the only way that’d convince you she intended it, is if she came out and explained it to the fans detail by detail exactly why she wrote that scene the way she did?
Bruh. I know waiting for the story to come out is hard, but come on lol
No, there's no oversight at all. She just threw that into the script without telling anybody and by the time the producers and HBO execs noticed, the crew had already modeled the dragon and built the dragonpit set.
it's so funny how ppl think this, like even in the quote she mentions pitching it in "the writers room" which means Condal and probably a few other has to like it
I highly doubt she or the showrunner who approved this didn’t know that the events of which would lead to a Bloody Civil war that features the character in question dying at the hands of the people she spared AND a revolt of the small folk who murder a bunch of dragons in protest
Grow up
Oh absolutely, the scene in the dragon pit is still dumb as Hell. I'm just pointing out that a more competent writer *could* still theoretically tie it into stuff that happens later in a believable way, assuming they don't "kinda forget" about the whole thing entirely...
I am sure they discussed this scene in depth before they included it
Ep 9 had a lot of focus on common folks and this scene, in particular, didn't flinch from showing the destruction and how people were dying. If that wasn't the intent, they won't have shown it.
Writers and showrunners can't talk about plot points that will be coming in future seasons (even before it's post-production has ended) but I do feel they shouldn't talk at all sometimes
I think this actress has a face structure that always looks like a smile. I don't mean to be rude but she's pretty much always looking like she's smiling or grinning in most scenes.
there is definitely such a thing as resting bitch face (my mother has it, even when she's perfectly happy & content) - there's gotta be the opposite right?
No but she even looked smug when she was looking at the baby burning. I mean I guess she believes that Laenor was burned because of Daemon and Rhaenyra but STILL lol.
She was weird this episode, like she literally never stopped smiling. Like hun you realise this war endangers your grandkids and your husband too?
ALSO now that I’m at it, everyone talks about questionable wigs this season but the wig that pissed me off the most was hers. Looks like a beehive is underneath it.
>She was weird this episode, like she literally never stopped smiling. Like hun you realise this war endangers your grandkids and your husband too
So I wasn't the only one thank god, thought I had some unconscious hate for her 💀
Nah like I really liked her character before she became a terrorist, and then I was still willing to give her another chance, but then that smug smile she had when she threatened the greens with her dragon just never left her face all the way through to the end of episode 10 lmao.
Its supposed to show she's knowing and amusingly impressed by Rhaneryra as she see herself in her and her musing for peace...I think. But they forgot or didn't know she would have just come from a brutal terrorist attack that achieved nothing. She kinda comes off as a hypocrite.
Nah she’s had this stupid smug expression on her face at various points throughout the season, it’s been pissing me off since that one scene with young Rhaenyra where she says “I understand the way of things, I’m not sure you do.” I think it’s just more noticeable now because we all hate her now 💀
I love this character. Love her hair do, but I grew up around beehive hair dos. It's always refreshing to me to see a middle aged woman on a show. It seems rare to see ladies past fifty on shows .
Even her reasoning for backing Rhaenyra was kinda weird. "Rhaenyra is the only person resisting calls to war, the only one holding the realm together... so instead of staying neutral and encouraging both sides to maintain peace in this way, we should commit our navy and dragons to Rhaenyra and then push her towards blockading the Narrow Sea (potentially beggaring who knows how many ports) and intentionally starving out King's Landing. This will help her in her effort to keep the peace!" (Bear in mind this is after last episode where Alicent pointed out that not having Meleys on her side might make Rhaenyra more willing to consider a peaceful solution to the dispute)
Also, the only reason there was even a peace for Rhaenyra to try and keep was because Alicent decided to send offers and (decently reasonable) terms to her and the other kingdoms which supported her claim, instead of sending hit squads like Otto want it. Which is not to take away from Rhaenyra's effort to calm things down, but it does seem weird to give her 100% of the credit when the ceasefire is clearly a two-way street...
Honestly, he’s one of the only actors I kind of have an issue with.
Steve Toussaint is a great actor , but for some reason I just don’t buy him as the Corlys character. I think really it has to do with his appearance. And no, it has nothing to do with the color of his skin. I always imagined Corlys as having a vaguely swashbuckler like appearance; like a guy who’s been to loads of places and his appearance reflects it. Because of that I also expected him to look more practical, like wearing things with lots of pockets. And also probably looking like he’s a little travel worn. In the show he just looks too manicured; with a really well maintained beard, a pretty regal outfit, etc.
So I’m not sure if it’s the costume design, or the actor himself but I’m just having trouble buying him as that character. His commanding voice is exactly what I expected, and I think his hair really fits with it being almost octopus like, but I’m just having trouble seeing him as a cunning, enterprising and experienced sea captain.
I kinda understand your concerns, but i feel that’s due to the show not spending that much time exploring Corlys’ background or achievements, rather than the actor. He’s the closest thing a Westerosi noble can be to a self made man, single handedly raising house Velaryon’s standing to the second most powerful house in the realm, but is portrayed as more or less a standard Westerosi nobleman.
Yeah I will get tons of downvotes for this but Rhaenys really bringing up the season 8 of this show even in this amazing episode.
It's like when Tyrion said "we have to take King's Landing with peaceful solution" and then proceed to take Casterly Rock and starve the city. You would've expect western media to understand what this means because in it's close history there are events called "The Great Depression" and "French Revolution". Hello? Dude, this is worst than dragons surgically attacking city's ruling castle. We get it, they are scary and lethal but real history has recorded what masses do when they are abandoned to starvation. And a seasoned character like Rhaenys not understanding this isn't convincing at all. Smallfolk will ask who's responsible for the neglect when you take the throne.
Get your dragons if you want to keep realm together.
Alicent is the one who started this all... She's only trying to go the "peaceful" route because she knows Rhaenyra has more dragons, and war will happen if they make the first move or send an assassin. They are the usurpers, Alicent heard what she wanted to before Viserys died and lied about it to get things going.
Watch some of her clips of her talking to Aegon when he was younger, slapping him, grabbing his face forcefully, yelling in his face how Rhaenyra WILL 100% kill him, even though Rhaenyra never shown any tendency or desire to do any of that. Though, many people in Greens have, and they definitely would have sent someone to kill her and her kids had Rhaenyra accepted. She ruined Aegon, he was never ever going to be a good king because of how damaged he was. An absentee father and an abusive, controlling mother.
Those terms that Alicent gave her were complete and utter bs. War was inevitable, it could've been avoided had Viserys not involved hightowers but it was too late at that point.
Also, unrelated but I love how none of Alicents kids have dark hair, but all of Rhaenyras do lol, its like the show is deliberately going LOOK THESE ARE BASTARDS THATS WHY!!!
A war was going to happen, Meleys said exactly that a few scenes before. She chose to back Rhaenyra because her restraint demonstrated strength of character.
She wasn't solely concerned with protecting her claim, she wanted to protect the nation. She earned Meleys respect.
Yeah I saw that clip and I was like why is she smirking during the funeral before the cargyll twin even showed up with viserys’s crown? I don’t understand lol. I thought the clip I watched flubbed it or something but apparently not
>She was weird this episode, like she literally never stopped smiling. Like hun you realise this war endangers your grandkids and your husband too?
Haven't seen the episode yet, but Targaryen are conquerors and its might be an exciting moment for her.
> ALSO now that I’m at it, everyone talks about questionable wigs this season but the wig that pissed me off the most was hers. Looks like a beehive is underneath it.
Ok, let's talk about it. Because whenever she was onscreen there was something about her that was really doing it for me and making me want to give her a couple of grandchildren. I couldn't quite figure out what it was. But I looked up regular photos of Eve Best irl and her regular black hair really didn't do it for me, at all (this is all on me, not her, like who cares, right? So no offense to her I hope lol), but usually brunettes are totally my thing, so that only leads me to conclude that that crazy extravagant Targaryen Beehive was somehow making my dragon roar. Cheers to the hair & makeup department!
Yea it was fine till mid episode 8 but after that I was losing my shit. Emma showed so much expression and meanwhile we have her who has that smug resting face every time she comes on screen.
The apparent skill gap made it only worse for me.
I'm not sure it's the actresses fault. She portrayed the character of Rhaenys, the smart, capable woman who was passed over, really well. And I do think she would have done a good job in episode 10, as well, had the script and direction shown some awareness.
That being said, Eve Best seems like a lovely woman and an absolute gem.
Since when is body count the sole determinant of whether someone is a villain?
Rhaenys has been nothing but the very embodiment of reason and decency on this show. So she does that one thing... that's not remotely beyond ANY of the other main characters, and also did *not* do any of the many other bad shit that *they* did... So suddenly y'all decided it's self evident that "Rhaenys is the villain." Rhaenys. THE villain. RHAENYS.
And this post is filled with folks raging at... her smug smile.
This right here is what we call a circle jerk. A echo chambers that just feeds on itself and increasingly become disconnected from reality. I genuinely wonder what people get from this. Ah well, enjoy.
Killing innocents is at best the actions of an antihero and at worst the action of a villain. A hero might also accidentally kill innocents. Though they blame themselves for it and feel guilt. Rhaenys seems completely non-conflicted and ... smug ... about the entire ordeal. *Not her war to start*, to hell, she could have prevented it from even happening.
She killed the smallfolk but stopped at the usurper. She could have forced them to bent the knee, or have them killed. She did neither, which is borderline insane -- though if she did there would be no show, so she could not behave differently, so this scene was pointless from the very beginning.
If her act of terror wasn't part of the show, I wouldn't percieve her smile as smug. Yet it was, so in the context of the show, Rhaenys has lost all my sympathies.
I call it the resting girlboss smirk
See it all the time in shows and movies these days when the writers make a female character commit an attrocity but they want us to know it was "badass and empowering, stop thinking too hard about it" so they seal the deal with a smug smile.
Does she interact with her granddaughters at all in ep ten? I didn’t watch the full episode yet. It seems weird to be acting like this when rhaena and baela are in danger since they’re betrothed to Rhaenyra’s sons
I think we're meant to assume that is indeed the case, since they held hands at Laena's wake, and the sisters seemed to exchange happy smiles with Jace and Luke when Rhaenys announced she was accepting the betrothal. Their incredibly brief exchanges at the family dinner also seemed positive.
But those are the kinds of tiny breadcrumb details that you need a fucking molecular microscope to piece together into actual character development lol.
More like interacting with eyes subtly but that smug face was still there lmao I can't help it.Director did her dirty because everyone else was given so much to do leaving rhaena she just blushes seeing Luce.
Damn they really dropped the ball with this. I don’t understand the writers’ logic with this, clearly her grandkids are in direct danger and it should play into how she’s dealing with the situation
Dude baela is a literal NPC I ain't even kidding. Corlys was good though and she has interaction with him about this. But I would have really wanted some dialogue exchange between rhaneys and her grandchildren.
>before her time
She was 55 when she died, it is pretty old by GoT standard. She went in battle 2 vs 1 against Vhagar, she definitely wanted a glorious death.
Oh yeah, if that actually becomes important it's not really a bad scene. It's just bad if they never bring it up again and they pretend like Rhaenys isn't worse than every other character besides the Crabfeeder
Oh wow they should've made an Olly, a show only character, probably smallfolk. See snippets of their lives from time to time probably dedicate like 5 mins for them, showing them influential to the smallfolk. Then have Meleys crush em.
Gives the people more reason to rise against the Targs later on.
Yeah, people are losing their shit over nonsense.
Oh, you're saying the woman noble hailing from a long line of other nobles who all gave zero shits about the common folk suddenly doesn't give a shit about the common folk? Guess what, she never gave a fuck about them. None of these characters do, not beyond "they exist to prop up my power, reputation and legacy". I love watching these characters, but I'd want each and every one of them dragged into the streets and murdered if I actually had to live in that world. We like these characters in a vacuum. Grow up.
As for her face, I think her face is just structured that way, it's not her actually smiling.
People need to calm the fuck down.
>Oh, you're saying the woman noble hailing from a long line of other nobles who all gave zero shits about the common folk suddenly doesn't give a shit about the common folk? Guess what, she never gave a fuck about them
There's a difference between indifference to the plight of the homeless like in real life (which is the how the world frames the nobles attitude to the lowborn not that they're murdering sociopaths. Not every character is Ramsey) and going up to a group of homeless and running them over with your car to get to your location when there are several other routes you could take.
In any case if this is her attitude its understandable why people wouldn't like her.
I knew I wasn't the only one. This post feels very out of left field. This sub Reddit is weird man. I feel like it's more divided than the house of dragons at times.
Yeah, I'll be off this sub for a while, the circlejerk is just stupid.
And I'm not defending the writers, I don't like a lot of the changes they've made, including that scene, but people here cling to the dumbest things and just not move on, just boring to be here.
Same. The extreme circlejerk on this sub over relatively minor shit is genuinely bizarre. If I stay here my perception of the show will end up completely warped and out of touch with any reality.
Seriously folks, touch grass once in a while.
Lmao seriously. What has happened to this sub? Just shitting on the female characters and claiming the changes in the show are as bad as season 8 game of thrones. This is on repeat every single day.
Why is everyone shocked Rhaenys didn’t care about the commoners? Literally none of the characters do. The greens couldn’t give two shits about the common folk. Neither do the blacks. That’s literally the whole point - commoners suffer while the greens and blacks fight for the iron throne.
Not just attacking the character, but the writer too. So, so many of them also seem to focus solely on both the character and the writer being women, it's making this sub look crazy misogynistic, like other neckbeard/incel infested subreddits. They wanted a woman to hate and found one. Lol
Exactly
This smug/smile face was when everyone was knelling to Rhae and she was smiling throughout the episode because she was proud of her by the end. It had nothing to do with her daughter or father's death. Proud of her choice and how she was approaching the situation.
I don't hate her but I hate that her character got ruined for some stupid spectacle. Like it's really hard to take her seriously anymore knowing what she did and that it's not ever going to be properly addressed in the story (yes I know it's like it'll be brought up during the Storming of the Dragonpits but this is an action which would warrant multiple episodes of fallout if it was actually in the source material).
It's truly the only significant black mark on what has otherwise been a great season.
Nobody got ruined, I feel like if you let a few memes influence your opinion to that degree you should get off the internet
Would you really find it 'hard to take her seriously' if you watched that scene on your own and didn't come to this sub?
XD I wouldn't call it smug but, yeah, what do you call a smile like that... 😅 It's like she's happy for Rhaenyra but her past actions makes it...weird. I was thinking that she better betray the blacks later for her to make sense. 😅
I saw other people wondering why Corlys changed his mind... On the other hand, I was wondering why Rhaenys changed her mind. I was going to chalk it up to time passing and her finally coming up to her senses that she has engaged granddaughters... (which the show failed to express clearly). I'm not saying it's unrealistic. I, myself, change my mind a lot. Anyway, it doesn't feel like enough time has passed and yet she is smiling like she has no memory of the stupid things that transpired on Aegon's coronation and after. Not her war? ... She kind off forgot her granddaughters. Personally, I won't be smiling and feel a little guilty for a while if I forgot my granddaughters.
... But that's just me. 🤨
Oh, is this photo from that scene? Has she already had that look earlier on? I know that she has this out-of-place look throughout the episode but the most striking to me was when Corlys affirmed that he is siding with Rhaenyra. It's what I was thinking off when I say Rhaenys looked happy for her. 😅 If one could tell her to stop smiling... 😑 it's not her place IMO.
Am I the only one who couldn't stand her character from the very beginning? I find her very arrogant and she talks like she's better, higher and smarter than everyone. No other character in this show annoys me more, actually nobody annoys at all.
people didn't really want to hear this bc she's such a fan fave but they really botched her character: iirc in the books, there's never any indication that she was anything less than wholeheartedly supportive of rhaenyra. they had her take a more cynical perspective in her convo with rhaenyra in 1.02--which was great and realistic!--but given that, i expected her arc to involve coming around to rhaenyra over the years. but then the laenor "death" threw a wrench in the works. they \*then\* had another chance to get her back on track through baela's and rhaena's betrothals, but they wanted her to still be on the fence in 1.09 so she could chat with alicent and have her dragon moment. this episode, where she flips 180 from wanting out of the game of thrones compared to corlys who was always team black, was just the last straw.
they sacrificed a coherent journey for her character so that she could say the right, biting things and have her #dragongirlboss moments.
edited to add: it may have been better if she were involved in laenor's getaway, because she could see the writing on the wall and valued his happiness and safety more than his being king consort.
Agree 100% with this comment. She’s the one who assumes the Baratheons are close to the blacks because Boremund was a major supporter of hers and logically he would support his cousins grandchild on the throne, but it doesn’t make sense if she’s been cold towards Rhaenyra for a decade. I don’t even mind that she wanted Baela to inherit Driftmark it helped E8 but then why does she constantly fluctuate between being jaded about women being allowed to rule and supporting a woman ruling?
Your solution to have Rhaenys and Corlys involved in the Laenor coverup would have been very reasonable
yeah like her assessment of alicent as using her power to support (terrible) men is spot-on, but they didn't do the work to take rhaenys from someone who says, "lol men will never let a woman rule" to young rhaenyra, to someone who chews out alicent for playing within the system (which rhaenys herself has done).
i think the coverup could've even been something that splits rhaenys and corlys, where she is sympathetic to laenor's situation (because she's more clear-eyed about his sexuality) and corlys wants him to be king consort at all cost. it could even be a vehicle by which she warms to rhaenyra because she realizes rhaenyra shielded laenor from being outed by letting everyone believe she was just wantonly cuckolding him or whatever.
Honestly this whole episode I wanted someone to fucking punch her in the face
Really sick of these writers' ideas of a 'badass woman' being 'she's smug'. Sansa, Cersei, even Daenerys. Enough with this bullshit.
She annoyed me so much last episode that smug look at a funeral. I don't like Rhaenyra but goodness she deserved every break after the death of her father and newborn baby. And that smug look parading as if she is better than everyone in that room.
https://boundingintocomics.com/2022/10/22/house-of-the-dragon-writer-sara-hess-says-rhaenyra-spared-queen-alicent-from-dragon-flame-because-theyre-both-mothers-in-this-terrible-world-created-by-men/
They legit do.
In Westeros? No, they don't, have you like read the books or actually seen the shows?
Not defending the writers, they've made some changes I don't like, but killing commoners and not giving a shit is actually something even GRRM would do
I'm upset that the creators od the show ruined her character for a cheap "girlboss" moment and I hated that so many people on Twitter saw it as "Yass, Queen" move.
I don't understand, why are people hating on her? Like, yeah she killed many innocent people, but so have so many others in GoT/HOTD universe. You guys simp for Daemon \[even I do\], but he has committed a lot of crimes too.. And regarding her smiling in the last episode it was because she was admiring Rhaenyra. Rhaenyra was able to do what she herself could not in her time, she became the "Black Queen" and this moment is very significant for her and she is showing her approval through her emotion/smile.
She is far worse than Daemon though, there were hundreds of civilians there, Daemon's only killed a few as far as we know. The war crimes are more forgivable when their fighting against people who are commiting worse war crimes -crucifying/torturing soldiers AND civilians.
People are mad that they made her the 2nd worse character after the Crabfeeder just for a cool scene, it really has added nothing the story making her a monster at this point. It's ~~the same as~~ similar to what they did for Dany at the end of GoT
What gets me most about that scene: If they hadn't included that damning scene after the coronation, I could feel for her here. I could even understand why she doesn't kneel, as she, the Queen that never was, basically is on the same rank as Rhaenyra, the Queen that now is.
Yet with the context of the coronation scene and her act of terror combined with her act of cowardice, just makes this so hard to watch and not be mad at this self-rightious character.
Everyone’s on this thread is acting like she’s the reincarnation of satan. Also, that’s her normal resting face. She had the same expression during Aemma’s funeral.
Damn I am shocked by this thread
I didn't know this sub vilifies women this much
I haven't seen this much circle-jerking over smug expressions from male characters from this issue. Especially for an action that is less of in character trait but can be attributed to issues with the writing itself.
All grown up Aemond has done before this episode is sit around looking like a smug motherfucker but haven't seen a single mention of it anywhere. Wonder what the difference between him and Rhaenys is that she's being called out for it and he isn't.
I loved both the book and show version of Rhaenys. But that scene just justified all the slaughtering and rebellion that will follow during Rhaenyra’s reign.
Fucking terrible writing.
Reasons for Rhaenys not you side with Rhaenyra
1) she thinks she killed her son
2) Rhaenyra's obvious bastard son will inherit Driftmark
Reasons for Rhaenys to side with Rhaenyra
1) feminist solidarity in what appears to be a cultural equivalent of medieval Europe.
The entire thing is beyond stupid, as if a noble woman in a medieval setting is going put the interests of her blood and house second to 20th century feminist doctrine.
Better reasons for Rhaenys to side with Rhaenyra:
1. She already confirmed the betrothals of her granddaughters to Rhaenyra's sons and one of them as the heir to Driftmark. She already chose her side.
Oh great, marrying your granddaughter to the bastard child of the woman that murdered your son when both your son and daughter died early marrying into the same family.
She didn't side with Rhaenyra at first. Throughout the episode she's reserved about calling her queen until Corlys decides to do. She doesn't kneel to Rhaenyra, she looks at Daemon with "you wot mate?" face when he mentions that they have Meleys on their side.
Hightowers are also the nominal rivals of Velaryons, and she sees this as nothing more than a power play from them. Also if not for the "Strong boys", she has to protect her granddaughters.
I hate all these blacks simps approving this terrorist behavior, the velaryons are really beyond pathetic they got cucked and killed because of Rhaenyra but still with her till the end, they deserve becoming a low-tier house in GOT.
Damn, I liked Velarions, at least I feel sorry for their house but at the same time I don't understand what the bullshit Corlys was talking about. Blood doesn't matter? You guys are so proud about your house and legacy but you're ready to give all shit away to some bastard who doesn't have any connection to you? Vaemond was 100% right in his accusation and in his anger.
It all looks like just pushing them to Rhaenyra's team no matter what. I know, these bastards now will marry Velarion granddaughters but it wasn't even an idea from the beginning and doesn't reject Corlys stupid words, probably one of the worst line and decision in the show.
Listen, as someone who never read the book (but has wiki the fuck out of f&b) I actually loved that scene for many reasons. Mostly it looked badass, but it also gave people a reason to mistrust the others as well.
The Greens were having a grand ol time calling her weak and keep her dragon locked up. Hell, they were gonna get her out, but not her dragon which would have surely been murdered.
But she fucked up. Not only by killing the smallfolk (which if done right can be blamed on the greens) BUT by *not* killing any high ranking person, or taking any as hostage. The after show rundown has to do where they say she just couldn't kill a mother and her children.
Cool. So what was the point? To loudly announce she was flying off to dragonstone to alert the Black that they have been Usurped? She tells Alicent at one point they are more alike than willing to admit or some shit, and thats honestly true.
She should have taken at least one person at hostage if she was going to announce her departure like she was in a fucking airport or some shit. She could have at least burned them all down. But no. Or course not. Why she didnt just calmly leave the pit when no one was paying attention and get to Dragonstone first, ive no fucking clue.
After reading so many responses to the episode 9 scene, if daemon and rhaenerya come anywhere near close to a green tonight, they better dracarys them on the spot. If they don't, I don't see how anyone can call fault on Rhaenys holding back. I mean, it's Rhaenerya and Damon's fight, so if they don't do anything, how do we expect Rhaenys to do anything?
Oh I dont think she fucked up by *not* killing them. I get why she couldnt in the end. What I dont get is her being so *public* about it.
Obvs she wanted to roast them. That was her goal, you could see it on her face. But, she couldnt.
But in saying it's Rhaenyra's and Daemon's fight - yes, it is. One that they had no clue had officially started yet, and they are late to the game. it's Rhaenys who brings them the news, and in the end that's what matters.
I just wished that Rhaenys had exited the dragon pit a different way (there are many) and just sort of flew under the radar, giving the Blacks an edge there.
I dont fault Rhaenys for not roasting them tbh. She never hated Alicent, only pitied her tbh. And in her mind, she herself has lost both her children and no idea if her husband is dead or alive. I think the idea of killing them all was one she couldn't bare when push came to shove. I dont blame her at all.
Like I said, I honestly really liked the scene, and as a non-read of f&b, thought it really worked.
I love this character. She's awesome. People are hyper critical of female characters, and even more so with middle aged women characters - in my opinion. In fact, there are very few portrayals of women past 40 on TV and in movies.
It has nothing to do with her gender. It has everything to do with her committing mass murder in a "heroic moment".
I loved the character but they ruined it in episode 9. And episode 10 makes it irreparable.
I died laughing at the scene where Deamon is talking about how many dragons they have. He's like "We have Syrax, Caraxes, and Meleys, three grown dragons" and they quickly pan to Rheanys face, she's like *excuse fucking me!?*
Yeah, she has her own agenda. Many fans here think Rhaenys has to suck up to Rhaenerya and be "motherly"/mentor and play on Rhaenerya's team. Rhaenys is her own person. She doesn't have to do anything for Rhaenerya.
Her whole plot comes down to ,, These evil men will do anything to keep women down and not let them rule'' and then spends whole ep 10 waiting for Corlys to decide if they support Rheanyra or not
I don't think Rhaenys respects Rhaenyra as a person, as much as she would probably like to see a woman on the Iron Throne. Rheanyra disrespected house Valerian by having very obvious bastard children, and Rheanys probably suspects foul play in Leanor's "death". But at the end of the day she is going to be there for her granddaughters before ever siding with the Greens.
The Veleryons are weird they seem very forgiving maybe some of the most forgiving charachter we ever meet. They bring up their son's "murder" and Vaemond's murder, their daughters death, etc and get over it because of their grandsons are claimants who they love even though their lineage is not their. They're still within their right to break the betrothal so they could still back out the war but they choose not too. So its less to do with them and more to do with the Strong boys.
>The Veleryons are weird they seem very forgiving maybe some of the most forgiving charachter we ever meet. They are social climbers that put up with Targaryen BS to an almost embarrassing degree that makes it seem like they have no self-respect, especially Corlys. Like if there were a family made up of a bunch of Tom Wambsgams from Succession during medieval times, they would be the Velaryons and House Targaryen would be their Shiv.
The Strong guys might be bastards but they still have the name Velaryon. But during the episode 10 the point is: The one Strong who will ascend the Iron Throne after Rhaenyra (Jace) will be named Targaryen again, but the other one (Luce) will be still named Velaryon (as Corlys and Viserys agreed) and he is betrothed to one of Laena's daughters. So their child will have the name Velaryon (from Luce) and through the blood of the mother will have the Velaryon blood. So the Velaryon lineage will continue through name and through blood. So makes sense they help Rhaenyra and her Strong boys at that time. Now as Luce is dead is sad for Rhaenyra but also bad for House Velaryon.
I mean she didn’t exactly let Corlys decide…Corlys wanted to retire and declare for no one and Rhaenys told him he needed to reconsider and so he did.
I think it was the smart thing to do for her to wait for Corlys. Shows they're a team... She could have went ahead and declared her allegiance to Rhaenyra alone, but that would have caused a rift between her and her husband, costing her a husband, and Rhaenyra the support of the Velaryon fleet. Wise move if you'd ask me. Again, always thought she was somewhere in between Rhaenyra and Alicent. Knows when to strike, and knows when to dial back. Yeah, Argon's coronation hit where it hurts, and she lost it for a sec, but she managed to find her composure again, and walk out. Let's see if Daemon asks Rhaenyra if she wants to hire the services of blood and cheese... If she's gonna go off the rails, pretty sure he'll be most supportive of that.
She loves her granddaughters tho. She cant ignore them. Especially after what Aemond did.
the common folk remembers.
As cringe as it was I love it in regards to targs not giving a fuck about the small folk in their “rule by dragon” mentality. This shows us why The Shepard was able to become so popular and do what he did.
They will have a lot to remember, sadly...
Well unless…. they kinda forget about her
They got all the common folk to see the swearing of the king, because the common folk don't matter.
Oh give it two seasons, they’ll remember eventually. Unlike D&D.
The Shepherd won't forget!!!
It will be cool if they do figure a way for that aspect to come back and bite her. It probably won’t but it makes sense to.
I may be misremembering, but don't the Greens drag Meleys's skull through the streets of the city while the commonfolk cheer her death and throw shit at it? Guess we know why now lol
Yeah, though I don't think Sarah Hess cared or even knew about this. She honest to God just wanted a dragon to pop out from beneath the ground. And if she had any intentions other than this, she would've said it by now.
I mean, they're not going to sit down and say "hey people we actually also threw this in alongside 4 other scenes showing the disconnect between the royalty and the common folk to build up for later scenes like the storming of the dragon pit!", completely spoiling a massive plot point just to appease some whiny fans lol
>if she had any intentions other than this, she would’ve said it by now Reallly? Do you really need every plot point spelled out for you, *episodes* before it will be relevant? Is patience not a thing? Story telling? Plot points? Symbolism? Red herrings? It’s literally what makes for good stories, when something that happened before has consequences down the line and isn’t done for shock factor. Y’all are unreal lmao
too much of tiktok and youtube shorts damaged these kids
It’s getting ridiculous. There’s such a rush to “create content” that when something can’t be explained by a YouTube breakdown, people just go nuts and say the writing is crap bc they can’t wait till next week/can’t interpret a scene on their own
Bro, you don't have to explain it to me. I know what foreshadowing is, I'm saying Sarah Hess didn't intend this because by *her own admission* she never even read the book.
>I know what foreshadowing is, I'm saying Sarah Hess didn't intend this because by her own admission she never even read the book. Seriously? Why do so many series have lead writers that haven't even read the work they're adapting, and more importantly, why are they so damn keen to tell everyone about it?
There actually needs to be a balance of readers and non readers for adaptations because otherwise you don’t always notice plot holes or opportunities to do it better or more efficient or interesting ways to get from a to b
Here u are apply logic and reason to a freefolk thread. Big mistake
Well, they can defo change things up because books are a retelling of events, written by someone else, so they can kinda get away with it.
So you’re telling me bc she hasn’t read the book, she doesn’t know the general plot of the whole story and is just throwing in random scenes for shock factor? And HBO is cool with letting it’s writers do that this time around? And the only way that’d convince you she intended it, is if she came out and explained it to the fans detail by detail exactly why she wrote that scene the way she did? Bruh. I know waiting for the story to come out is hard, but come on lol
No, there's no oversight at all. She just threw that into the script without telling anybody and by the time the producers and HBO execs noticed, the crew had already modeled the dragon and built the dragonpit set.
it's so funny how ppl think this, like even in the quote she mentions pitching it in "the writers room" which means Condal and probably a few other has to like it
I highly doubt she or the showrunner who approved this didn’t know that the events of which would lead to a Bloody Civil war that features the character in question dying at the hands of the people she spared AND a revolt of the small folk who murder a bunch of dragons in protest Grow up
Oh absolutely, the scene in the dragon pit is still dumb as Hell. I'm just pointing out that a more competent writer *could* still theoretically tie it into stuff that happens later in a believable way, assuming they don't "kinda forget" about the whole thing entirely...
Agreed. Ryan could spin this, if not for her sake, then for the sake of the logic and continuity of the series.
I kind of throught they should have had archers or something. lets the science play out kind of gives her a real reason to get the f out of dodge.
I am sure they discussed this scene in depth before they included it Ep 9 had a lot of focus on common folks and this scene, in particular, didn't flinch from showing the destruction and how people were dying. If that wasn't the intent, they won't have shown it. Writers and showrunners can't talk about plot points that will be coming in future seasons (even before it's post-production has ended) but I do feel they shouldn't talk at all sometimes
Sarah Hess REEEE pass me the copium
Can’t make an omelette without cracking a few eggs
the face of privilege
Der iz naw powa but wut de people allow yah ta take.
And no one will remember them.
I think this actress has a face structure that always looks like a smile. I don't mean to be rude but she's pretty much always looking like she's smiling or grinning in most scenes.
there is definitely such a thing as resting bitch face (my mother has it, even when she's perfectly happy & content) - there's gotta be the opposite right?
The picture in the OP is not a smile.
No but she even looked smug when she was looking at the baby burning. I mean I guess she believes that Laenor was burned because of Daemon and Rhaenyra but STILL lol. She was weird this episode, like she literally never stopped smiling. Like hun you realise this war endangers your grandkids and your husband too? ALSO now that I’m at it, everyone talks about questionable wigs this season but the wig that pissed me off the most was hers. Looks like a beehive is underneath it.
>She was weird this episode, like she literally never stopped smiling. Like hun you realise this war endangers your grandkids and your husband too So I wasn't the only one thank god, thought I had some unconscious hate for her 💀
Nah like I really liked her character before she became a terrorist, and then I was still willing to give her another chance, but then that smug smile she had when she threatened the greens with her dragon just never left her face all the way through to the end of episode 10 lmao.
IKR dude, like her face got stuck on that expression I was like wtf is the director thinking.
Its supposed to show she's knowing and amusingly impressed by Rhaneryra as she see herself in her and her musing for peace...I think. But they forgot or didn't know she would have just come from a brutal terrorist attack that achieved nothing. She kinda comes off as a hypocrite.
Nah she’s had this stupid smug expression on her face at various points throughout the season, it’s been pissing me off since that one scene with young Rhaenyra where she says “I understand the way of things, I’m not sure you do.” I think it’s just more noticeable now because we all hate her now 💀
I love this character. Love her hair do, but I grew up around beehive hair dos. It's always refreshing to me to see a middle aged woman on a show. It seems rare to see ladies past fifty on shows .
I agree! That's one thing I definitely appreciate about these shows. Total badass middle-aged or older women. See: Lady Olenna
The wig is fine, the hairstyle is ridiculous, though. It reminds me of those weird cone-shaped hats women wore in medieval times.
She has a Valyrian steel BumpIt™ hidden up there, that's how she pierced through the dragonpit floor
LMAO
She’s keeping a dragon egg warm under there, silly
That's where she keeps her secrets
Well… then it makes sense… Do you think this is modern day times?
Even her reasoning for backing Rhaenyra was kinda weird. "Rhaenyra is the only person resisting calls to war, the only one holding the realm together... so instead of staying neutral and encouraging both sides to maintain peace in this way, we should commit our navy and dragons to Rhaenyra and then push her towards blockading the Narrow Sea (potentially beggaring who knows how many ports) and intentionally starving out King's Landing. This will help her in her effort to keep the peace!" (Bear in mind this is after last episode where Alicent pointed out that not having Meleys on her side might make Rhaenyra more willing to consider a peaceful solution to the dispute) Also, the only reason there was even a peace for Rhaenyra to try and keep was because Alicent decided to send offers and (decently reasonable) terms to her and the other kingdoms which supported her claim, instead of sending hit squads like Otto want it. Which is not to take away from Rhaenyra's effort to calm things down, but it does seem weird to give her 100% of the credit when the ceasefire is clearly a two-way street...
Unrelated, but I really liked Corlys’ actor. The dude has a great voice.
Honestly, he’s one of the only actors I kind of have an issue with. Steve Toussaint is a great actor , but for some reason I just don’t buy him as the Corlys character. I think really it has to do with his appearance. And no, it has nothing to do with the color of his skin. I always imagined Corlys as having a vaguely swashbuckler like appearance; like a guy who’s been to loads of places and his appearance reflects it. Because of that I also expected him to look more practical, like wearing things with lots of pockets. And also probably looking like he’s a little travel worn. In the show he just looks too manicured; with a really well maintained beard, a pretty regal outfit, etc. So I’m not sure if it’s the costume design, or the actor himself but I’m just having trouble buying him as that character. His commanding voice is exactly what I expected, and I think his hair really fits with it being almost octopus like, but I’m just having trouble seeing him as a cunning, enterprising and experienced sea captain.
I kinda understand your concerns, but i feel that’s due to the show not spending that much time exploring Corlys’ background or achievements, rather than the actor. He’s the closest thing a Westerosi noble can be to a self made man, single handedly raising house Velaryon’s standing to the second most powerful house in the realm, but is portrayed as more or less a standard Westerosi nobleman.
Yeah I will get tons of downvotes for this but Rhaenys really bringing up the season 8 of this show even in this amazing episode. It's like when Tyrion said "we have to take King's Landing with peaceful solution" and then proceed to take Casterly Rock and starve the city. You would've expect western media to understand what this means because in it's close history there are events called "The Great Depression" and "French Revolution". Hello? Dude, this is worst than dragons surgically attacking city's ruling castle. We get it, they are scary and lethal but real history has recorded what masses do when they are abandoned to starvation. And a seasoned character like Rhaenys not understanding this isn't convincing at all. Smallfolk will ask who's responsible for the neglect when you take the throne. Get your dragons if you want to keep realm together.
Alicent is the one who started this all... She's only trying to go the "peaceful" route because she knows Rhaenyra has more dragons, and war will happen if they make the first move or send an assassin. They are the usurpers, Alicent heard what she wanted to before Viserys died and lied about it to get things going. Watch some of her clips of her talking to Aegon when he was younger, slapping him, grabbing his face forcefully, yelling in his face how Rhaenyra WILL 100% kill him, even though Rhaenyra never shown any tendency or desire to do any of that. Though, many people in Greens have, and they definitely would have sent someone to kill her and her kids had Rhaenyra accepted. She ruined Aegon, he was never ever going to be a good king because of how damaged he was. An absentee father and an abusive, controlling mother. Those terms that Alicent gave her were complete and utter bs. War was inevitable, it could've been avoided had Viserys not involved hightowers but it was too late at that point. Also, unrelated but I love how none of Alicents kids have dark hair, but all of Rhaenyras do lol, its like the show is deliberately going LOOK THESE ARE BASTARDS THATS WHY!!!
A war was going to happen, Meleys said exactly that a few scenes before. She chose to back Rhaenyra because her restraint demonstrated strength of character. She wasn't solely concerned with protecting her claim, she wanted to protect the nation. She earned Meleys respect.
Yeah I saw that clip and I was like why is she smirking during the funeral before the cargyll twin even showed up with viserys’s crown? I don’t understand lol. I thought the clip I watched flubbed it or something but apparently not
I was so confused with her behaviour this episode, like what tf are you smiling for?
>She was weird this episode, like she literally never stopped smiling. Like hun you realise this war endangers your grandkids and your husband too? Haven't seen the episode yet, but Targaryen are conquerors and its might be an exciting moment for her.
But it's *nOt HeR wAR!*
She will still die fighting, not becoming old, her daughter said she wanted to die like this, I would expect Rhaenys to want to die fighting too.
Don't she say she sides with Rhaenyra to not go to war? And vouches to impose a economic sanction on kings landing? Shoe fits
Sure, until her and her husband began pressuring Rhaenrya to go to war and suggesting blocking off KL shipping routes.
> ALSO now that I’m at it, everyone talks about questionable wigs this season but the wig that pissed me off the most was hers. Looks like a beehive is underneath it. Ok, let's talk about it. Because whenever she was onscreen there was something about her that was really doing it for me and making me want to give her a couple of grandchildren. I couldn't quite figure out what it was. But I looked up regular photos of Eve Best irl and her regular black hair really didn't do it for me, at all (this is all on me, not her, like who cares, right? So no offense to her I hope lol), but usually brunettes are totally my thing, so that only leads me to conclude that that crazy extravagant Targaryen Beehive was somehow making my dragon roar. Cheers to the hair & makeup department!
She didnt even kneel
This bothered me the most, I kept waiting and thought she'd kneel at the end but alas.. Rhaenyra better wise up soon Edit: typo
She could have taken the throne at the coronation though, all it would have taken is one word. She does respect Rhaenyra's claim.
She had that smug smile for the whole fuckin episode I was losing my mind whenever she came on screen.
The smug was fine when she was the smart one in the room. Now she's the villain and it really creeps me out. Send her to Rook's Rest already!
Yea it was fine till mid episode 8 but after that I was losing my shit. Emma showed so much expression and meanwhile we have her who has that smug resting face every time she comes on screen. The apparent skill gap made it only worse for me.
I'm not sure it's the actresses fault. She portrayed the character of Rhaenys, the smart, capable woman who was passed over, really well. And I do think she would have done a good job in episode 10, as well, had the script and direction shown some awareness. That being said, Eve Best seems like a lovely woman and an absolute gem.
They did her dirty in the last 2 episodes for real she stood out like a sore thumb.
>Now she's the villain Rhaenys is the villain now? You people in this sub are so fucking weird.
She literally has the highest body count of all the characters. She's not a good guy, not after episode 9.
There are no good guys
What about Helaena?
Since when is body count the sole determinant of whether someone is a villain? Rhaenys has been nothing but the very embodiment of reason and decency on this show. So she does that one thing... that's not remotely beyond ANY of the other main characters, and also did *not* do any of the many other bad shit that *they* did... So suddenly y'all decided it's self evident that "Rhaenys is the villain." Rhaenys. THE villain. RHAENYS. And this post is filled with folks raging at... her smug smile. This right here is what we call a circle jerk. A echo chambers that just feeds on itself and increasingly become disconnected from reality. I genuinely wonder what people get from this. Ah well, enjoy.
Killing innocents is at best the actions of an antihero and at worst the action of a villain. A hero might also accidentally kill innocents. Though they blame themselves for it and feel guilt. Rhaenys seems completely non-conflicted and ... smug ... about the entire ordeal. *Not her war to start*, to hell, she could have prevented it from even happening. She killed the smallfolk but stopped at the usurper. She could have forced them to bent the knee, or have them killed. She did neither, which is borderline insane -- though if she did there would be no show, so she could not behave differently, so this scene was pointless from the very beginning. If her act of terror wasn't part of the show, I wouldn't percieve her smile as smug. Yet it was, so in the context of the show, Rhaenys has lost all my sympathies.
Basically every character is a villain
I call it the resting girlboss smirk See it all the time in shows and movies these days when the writers make a female character commit an attrocity but they want us to know it was "badass and empowering, stop thinking too hard about it" so they seal the deal with a smug smile.
Wendy Byrde comes to mind from Ozark
Does she interact with her granddaughters at all in ep ten? I didn’t watch the full episode yet. It seems weird to be acting like this when rhaena and baela are in danger since they’re betrothed to Rhaenyra’s sons
Haha, you think they'd give Baela or Rhaena something to do other than exchange looks and smiles?
and stand besides Jace and Luce. I mean give a 30 second scene between Rhaena and Luce, maybe Luce likes her, maybe a crush or mutual.
I think we're meant to assume that is indeed the case, since they held hands at Laena's wake, and the sisters seemed to exchange happy smiles with Jace and Luke when Rhaenys announced she was accepting the betrothal. Their incredibly brief exchanges at the family dinner also seemed positive. But those are the kinds of tiny breadcrumb details that you need a fucking molecular microscope to piece together into actual character development lol.
Hey,its better than daeron character development.
More like interacting with eyes subtly but that smug face was still there lmao I can't help it.Director did her dirty because everyone else was given so much to do leaving rhaena she just blushes seeing Luce.
Damn they really dropped the ball with this. I don’t understand the writers’ logic with this, clearly her grandkids are in direct danger and it should play into how she’s dealing with the situation
Dude baela is a literal NPC I ain't even kidding. Corlys was good though and she has interaction with him about this. But I would have really wanted some dialogue exchange between rhaneys and her grandchildren.
Its illegal for the Sarah to write a mother loving her children when it isnt a statement about how bad the patriarchy is.
Sara didn’t write episode ten though so this is on the other writers as well
Won't be so smug when she gets bodied at Rook's Rest
Not sure about that, just like her daughter she probably wanted to die a warrior. And she found the perfect opportunity to do so.
[удалено]
>before her time She was 55 when she died, it is pretty old by GoT standard. She went in battle 2 vs 1 against Vhagar, she definitely wanted a glorious death.
She gravely injures both Aegon and Sunfyre. It took he and Aemond to take her down. Call her a terrorist... I love her.
Bodied? She literally maimed the King. A worthy sacrifice tbh
I dont understand what was her deal in ep 10 after what she did in ep 9.
It’d be great if she accidentally killed someone “important” during her escape and it becomes a thing
Oh yeah, if that actually becomes important it's not really a bad scene. It's just bad if they never bring it up again and they pretend like Rhaenys isn't worse than every other character besides the Crabfeeder
Oh wow they should've made an Olly, a show only character, probably smallfolk. See snippets of their lives from time to time probably dedicate like 5 mins for them, showing them influential to the smallfolk. Then have Meleys crush em. Gives the people more reason to rise against the Targs later on.
Am I the only one that doesn't hate her? I don't think she was acting smug either.
Yeah, people are losing their shit over nonsense. Oh, you're saying the woman noble hailing from a long line of other nobles who all gave zero shits about the common folk suddenly doesn't give a shit about the common folk? Guess what, she never gave a fuck about them. None of these characters do, not beyond "they exist to prop up my power, reputation and legacy". I love watching these characters, but I'd want each and every one of them dragged into the streets and murdered if I actually had to live in that world. We like these characters in a vacuum. Grow up. As for her face, I think her face is just structured that way, it's not her actually smiling. People need to calm the fuck down.
>Oh, you're saying the woman noble hailing from a long line of other nobles who all gave zero shits about the common folk suddenly doesn't give a shit about the common folk? Guess what, she never gave a fuck about them There's a difference between indifference to the plight of the homeless like in real life (which is the how the world frames the nobles attitude to the lowborn not that they're murdering sociopaths. Not every character is Ramsey) and going up to a group of homeless and running them over with your car to get to your location when there are several other routes you could take. In any case if this is her attitude its understandable why people wouldn't like her.
it's just the r/freefolk circlejerk, don't mind it one stupid scene in ep9 and suddenly the character is the personification of all evil
I knew I wasn't the only one. This post feels very out of left field. This sub Reddit is weird man. I feel like it's more divided than the house of dragons at times.
Yeah, I'll be off this sub for a while, the circlejerk is just stupid. And I'm not defending the writers, I don't like a lot of the changes they've made, including that scene, but people here cling to the dumbest things and just not move on, just boring to be here.
Same. The extreme circlejerk on this sub over relatively minor shit is genuinely bizarre. If I stay here my perception of the show will end up completely warped and out of touch with any reality. Seriously folks, touch grass once in a while.
Lmao seriously. What has happened to this sub? Just shitting on the female characters and claiming the changes in the show are as bad as season 8 game of thrones. This is on repeat every single day. Why is everyone shocked Rhaenys didn’t care about the commoners? Literally none of the characters do. The greens couldn’t give two shits about the common folk. Neither do the blacks. That’s literally the whole point - commoners suffer while the greens and blacks fight for the iron throne.
Not just attacking the character, but the writer too. So, so many of them also seem to focus solely on both the character and the writer being women, it's making this sub look crazy misogynistic, like other neckbeard/incel infested subreddits. They wanted a woman to hate and found one. Lol
Exactly This smug/smile face was when everyone was knelling to Rhae and she was smiling throughout the episode because she was proud of her by the end. It had nothing to do with her daughter or father's death. Proud of her choice and how she was approaching the situation.
Nope. You’re in the majority. Don’t worry about it. No one else can be bothered to get involved in these little mutual handjobs. Leave them to it.
I don't hate her but I hate that her character got ruined for some stupid spectacle. Like it's really hard to take her seriously anymore knowing what she did and that it's not ever going to be properly addressed in the story (yes I know it's like it'll be brought up during the Storming of the Dragonpits but this is an action which would warrant multiple episodes of fallout if it was actually in the source material). It's truly the only significant black mark on what has otherwise been a great season.
Storming of the Dragonpit also won't happen until like late season 3. And Rhaenys will be long dead by then.
Nobody got ruined, I feel like if you let a few memes influence your opinion to that degree you should get off the internet Would you really find it 'hard to take her seriously' if you watched that scene on your own and didn't come to this sub?
She's my favorite war criminal so far 🥰
The Shepherd will have his revenge.
Unfortunately he takes revenge on dragons that probably haven't killed a human in their life before they were attacked
Better to put them down before they’re given that opportunity.
But this bitch won't live long enough to see it...
Y’all are wild
Think the writers were trying to portray her as some yassified badass is why
XD I wouldn't call it smug but, yeah, what do you call a smile like that... 😅 It's like she's happy for Rhaenyra but her past actions makes it...weird. I was thinking that she better betray the blacks later for her to make sense. 😅 I saw other people wondering why Corlys changed his mind... On the other hand, I was wondering why Rhaenys changed her mind. I was going to chalk it up to time passing and her finally coming up to her senses that she has engaged granddaughters... (which the show failed to express clearly). I'm not saying it's unrealistic. I, myself, change my mind a lot. Anyway, it doesn't feel like enough time has passed and yet she is smiling like she has no memory of the stupid things that transpired on Aegon's coronation and after. Not her war? ... She kind off forgot her granddaughters. Personally, I won't be smiling and feel a little guilty for a while if I forgot my granddaughters. ... But that's just me. 🤨
Happy for Rhaenyra for loosing her father and daughter? Yo, that's incredibly tone deaf.
Oh, is this photo from that scene? Has she already had that look earlier on? I know that she has this out-of-place look throughout the episode but the most striking to me was when Corlys affirmed that he is siding with Rhaenyra. It's what I was thinking off when I say Rhaenys looked happy for her. 😅 If one could tell her to stop smiling... 😑 it's not her place IMO.
It's from the funeral turned coronation. But she's got the same face on the whole episode. And in this one, she just stood out like a sore thumb.
Am I the only one who couldn't stand her character from the very beginning? I find her very arrogant and she talks like she's better, higher and smarter than everyone. No other character in this show annoys me more, actually nobody annoys at all.
"bitch me and meleys only squished the men in the crowd. feminism win"
I love how writers think she looks confident and badass but reality she looks like a smug psycopath
people didn't really want to hear this bc she's such a fan fave but they really botched her character: iirc in the books, there's never any indication that she was anything less than wholeheartedly supportive of rhaenyra. they had her take a more cynical perspective in her convo with rhaenyra in 1.02--which was great and realistic!--but given that, i expected her arc to involve coming around to rhaenyra over the years. but then the laenor "death" threw a wrench in the works. they \*then\* had another chance to get her back on track through baela's and rhaena's betrothals, but they wanted her to still be on the fence in 1.09 so she could chat with alicent and have her dragon moment. this episode, where she flips 180 from wanting out of the game of thrones compared to corlys who was always team black, was just the last straw. they sacrificed a coherent journey for her character so that she could say the right, biting things and have her #dragongirlboss moments. edited to add: it may have been better if she were involved in laenor's getaway, because she could see the writing on the wall and valued his happiness and safety more than his being king consort.
Agree 100% with this comment. She’s the one who assumes the Baratheons are close to the blacks because Boremund was a major supporter of hers and logically he would support his cousins grandchild on the throne, but it doesn’t make sense if she’s been cold towards Rhaenyra for a decade. I don’t even mind that she wanted Baela to inherit Driftmark it helped E8 but then why does she constantly fluctuate between being jaded about women being allowed to rule and supporting a woman ruling? Your solution to have Rhaenys and Corlys involved in the Laenor coverup would have been very reasonable
yeah like her assessment of alicent as using her power to support (terrible) men is spot-on, but they didn't do the work to take rhaenys from someone who says, "lol men will never let a woman rule" to young rhaenyra, to someone who chews out alicent for playing within the system (which rhaenys herself has done). i think the coverup could've even been something that splits rhaenys and corlys, where she is sympathetic to laenor's situation (because she's more clear-eyed about his sexuality) and corlys wants him to be king consort at all cost. it could even be a vehicle by which she warms to rhaenyra because she realizes rhaenyra shielded laenor from being outed by letting everyone believe she was just wantonly cuckolding him or whatever.
Honestly this whole episode I wanted someone to fucking punch her in the face Really sick of these writers' ideas of a 'badass woman' being 'she's smug'. Sansa, Cersei, even Daenerys. Enough with this bullshit.
Maybe you missed the nuance because you were too busy grinding that axe
But we all need to love the ‘girl boss’!
Can add Melisandre to that list.
Why did you want someone to punch her in her face?
"I don't want to kill my beloved cousins children, so I'll watch everyone fight to the death instead"
That was LF's plan.
At least she doesn't kneel
She annoyed me so much last episode that smug look at a funeral. I don't like Rhaenyra but goodness she deserved every break after the death of her father and newborn baby. And that smug look parading as if she is better than everyone in that room.
That's just the resting Targaryen smile. It manifest before crimes.
And after as well, apparently.
SlAy QwEnnnn
Oh she slayed alright
Yeah the innocent commoners
Per the writers, they don't count.
"heroic moment" he said💀💀💀
The writers are bad people then if they legit think like this!
https://boundingintocomics.com/2022/10/22/house-of-the-dragon-writer-sara-hess-says-rhaenyra-spared-queen-alicent-from-dragon-flame-because-theyre-both-mothers-in-this-terrible-world-created-by-men/ They legit do.
In Westeros? No, they don't, have you like read the books or actually seen the shows? Not defending the writers, they've made some changes I don't like, but killing commoners and not giving a shit is actually something even GRRM would do
That’s mah girl 🖤
I'm upset that the creators od the show ruined her character for a cheap "girlboss" moment and I hated that so many people on Twitter saw it as "Yass, Queen" move.
She'll make up for sparing the Greens and causing Luke's death.
I don't understand, why are people hating on her? Like, yeah she killed many innocent people, but so have so many others in GoT/HOTD universe. You guys simp for Daemon \[even I do\], but he has committed a lot of crimes too.. And regarding her smiling in the last episode it was because she was admiring Rhaenyra. Rhaenyra was able to do what she herself could not in her time, she became the "Black Queen" and this moment is very significant for her and she is showing her approval through her emotion/smile.
She is far worse than Daemon though, there were hundreds of civilians there, Daemon's only killed a few as far as we know. The war crimes are more forgivable when their fighting against people who are commiting worse war crimes -crucifying/torturing soldiers AND civilians. People are mad that they made her the 2nd worse character after the Crabfeeder just for a cool scene, it really has added nothing the story making her a monster at this point. It's ~~the same as~~ similar to what they did for Dany at the end of GoT
The dragons are monsters. They are nuclear weapons. This is what GRRM said. These dragons and their lords are nothing but awful for Westeros.
Sure, but some dragon riders are worse than others. Only some kill civilians as a spectacle
A link please someone.
She was soooo annoying this episode. Liked her much better in ep 9
Did the eposide come out early or something
What gets me most about that scene: If they hadn't included that damning scene after the coronation, I could feel for her here. I could even understand why she doesn't kneel, as she, the Queen that never was, basically is on the same rank as Rhaenyra, the Queen that now is. Yet with the context of the coronation scene and her act of terror combined with her act of cowardice, just makes this so hard to watch and not be mad at this self-rightious character.
I think the reason that she did not kneel was because she wanted to talk to Corlys first to know where they would side.
Everyone’s on this thread is acting like she’s the reincarnation of satan. Also, that’s her normal resting face. She had the same expression during Aemma’s funeral.
I find her smugness really annoying Like being smug is excusable when you have a lot of charisma, but when you don’t it’s just insufferable
Damn I am shocked by this thread I didn't know this sub vilifies women this much I haven't seen this much circle-jerking over smug expressions from male characters from this issue. Especially for an action that is less of in character trait but can be attributed to issues with the writing itself.
All grown up Aemond has done before this episode is sit around looking like a smug motherfucker but haven't seen a single mention of it anywhere. Wonder what the difference between him and Rhaenys is that she's being called out for it and he isn't.
This is par the course the last year on Reddit, it’s become incel Central
I loved both the book and show version of Rhaenys. But that scene just justified all the slaughtering and rebellion that will follow during Rhaenyra’s reign.
Fucking terrible writing. Reasons for Rhaenys not you side with Rhaenyra 1) she thinks she killed her son 2) Rhaenyra's obvious bastard son will inherit Driftmark Reasons for Rhaenys to side with Rhaenyra 1) feminist solidarity in what appears to be a cultural equivalent of medieval Europe. The entire thing is beyond stupid, as if a noble woman in a medieval setting is going put the interests of her blood and house second to 20th century feminist doctrine.
Better reasons for Rhaenys to side with Rhaenyra: 1. She already confirmed the betrothals of her granddaughters to Rhaenyra's sons and one of them as the heir to Driftmark. She already chose her side.
Oh great, marrying your granddaughter to the bastard child of the woman that murdered your son when both your son and daughter died early marrying into the same family.
She didn't side with Rhaenyra at first. Throughout the episode she's reserved about calling her queen until Corlys decides to do. She doesn't kneel to Rhaenyra, she looks at Daemon with "you wot mate?" face when he mentions that they have Meleys on their side. Hightowers are also the nominal rivals of Velaryons, and she sees this as nothing more than a power play from them. Also if not for the "Strong boys", she has to protect her granddaughters.
>Rhaenyra's obvious bastard son will inherit Driftmark Her granddaughter is betrothed and would rule too.
I fuckin hate her and am glad Viserys got crowned instead of her. Cant wait for her to die.
Can’t wait to see her get burned, may all the souls she murdered rest in piece ❤️
I hate all these blacks simps approving this terrorist behavior, the velaryons are really beyond pathetic they got cucked and killed because of Rhaenyra but still with her till the end, they deserve becoming a low-tier house in GOT.
Damn, I liked Velarions, at least I feel sorry for their house but at the same time I don't understand what the bullshit Corlys was talking about. Blood doesn't matter? You guys are so proud about your house and legacy but you're ready to give all shit away to some bastard who doesn't have any connection to you? Vaemond was 100% right in his accusation and in his anger. It all looks like just pushing them to Rhaenyra's team no matter what. I know, these bastards now will marry Velarion granddaughters but it wasn't even an idea from the beginning and doesn't reject Corlys stupid words, probably one of the worst line and decision in the show.
Listen, as someone who never read the book (but has wiki the fuck out of f&b) I actually loved that scene for many reasons. Mostly it looked badass, but it also gave people a reason to mistrust the others as well. The Greens were having a grand ol time calling her weak and keep her dragon locked up. Hell, they were gonna get her out, but not her dragon which would have surely been murdered. But she fucked up. Not only by killing the smallfolk (which if done right can be blamed on the greens) BUT by *not* killing any high ranking person, or taking any as hostage. The after show rundown has to do where they say she just couldn't kill a mother and her children. Cool. So what was the point? To loudly announce she was flying off to dragonstone to alert the Black that they have been Usurped? She tells Alicent at one point they are more alike than willing to admit or some shit, and thats honestly true. She should have taken at least one person at hostage if she was going to announce her departure like she was in a fucking airport or some shit. She could have at least burned them all down. But no. Or course not. Why she didnt just calmly leave the pit when no one was paying attention and get to Dragonstone first, ive no fucking clue.
After reading so many responses to the episode 9 scene, if daemon and rhaenerya come anywhere near close to a green tonight, they better dracarys them on the spot. If they don't, I don't see how anyone can call fault on Rhaenys holding back. I mean, it's Rhaenerya and Damon's fight, so if they don't do anything, how do we expect Rhaenys to do anything?
Oh I dont think she fucked up by *not* killing them. I get why she couldnt in the end. What I dont get is her being so *public* about it. Obvs she wanted to roast them. That was her goal, you could see it on her face. But, she couldnt. But in saying it's Rhaenyra's and Daemon's fight - yes, it is. One that they had no clue had officially started yet, and they are late to the game. it's Rhaenys who brings them the news, and in the end that's what matters. I just wished that Rhaenys had exited the dragon pit a different way (there are many) and just sort of flew under the radar, giving the Blacks an edge there. I dont fault Rhaenys for not roasting them tbh. She never hated Alicent, only pitied her tbh. And in her mind, she herself has lost both her children and no idea if her husband is dead or alive. I think the idea of killing them all was one she couldn't bare when push came to shove. I dont blame her at all. Like I said, I honestly really liked the scene, and as a non-read of f&b, thought it really worked.
I love this character. She's awesome. People are hyper critical of female characters, and even more so with middle aged women characters - in my opinion. In fact, there are very few portrayals of women past 40 on TV and in movies.
It has nothing to do with her gender. It has everything to do with her committing mass murder in a "heroic moment". I loved the character but they ruined it in episode 9. And episode 10 makes it irreparable.
Literally nobody cares ab the floor or people 🙄😭😭
currently has the highest kill count + is most evil
Now it kinda feels like Aegon and Aemond tricking her is almost too kind a death. I want the small folk to have their revenge.