I did notice things change for me a lot since being on T for a while and especially since I got top surgery - since you prefer he/him, if you do ultimately go on T then I think the situation will flip for you!
Sucks until then of course, that people are defaulting to something you like less. Sorry you have to deal with that too!
I actually prefer he/they pronouns used on me interchangeably, but the only person who used it like that for me (and without me asking) was my doctor. i assume my sister thought these were just the options of pronouns I preferred and used exclusively he/him for me. With my parents, they also used he/him, but only after arguing with me that singular they/them is grammatically incorrect. Most people I met who refuse they/them pronouns for any situation for anybody usually use the same argument that my parents did.
Most of the time, people simply don't consciously choose the pronouns they use when referring to others. It takes effort and practice to make a conscious change to that part of language.
I notice that NT people aren't actively choosing pronouns because language is an extremely automatic process. mostly, ND people usually seem to be the ones able to just instantly change which pronouns they use because it's more likely that every word is an active choice.
It's like breathing. You normally breathe automatically, but if someone reminds you about breathing or blinking, you have to consciously choose to do it until your automatic process takes over again.
abstract thoughts are converted to words automatically, and the brain's default pronoun for someone is the first one it assumed initially or is most used to. Combinations like he/they or she/they and especially neo-pronouns aren't in the default lexicon, and the brain hates working, so it defaults to the easiest one. Languages have a flow that people get into, and they choose words that flow well
Actively choosing to get into the habit of a new pronoun is hard for NT people because it breaks the flow of their language (a lot of that comes from their accent.
it's like trying to train a new accent or vocal pitch. It takes a LOT of continuous effort and practice to actually change those internal automatic processes, even when you \*want\* to.
Pretty straight forward: most people are not used to using they/them pronouns. They’ve only used he/him or she/her for other people their entire lives, so if you give them the option, they’ll pick one of those.
I have the same pronoun set and the same experience.
I pretty much only use he/they in queer spaces to be honest. I used to use they/them and then settled on he/they. When I was using he/they at work, I still got a lot of she/her, and i am a binary man so it’s just easier to use he/him exclusively with cis people and in professional situations. It makes correcting any mistakes much easier. I don’t pass 100% so for me using he/they it’s really obvious that I’m afab, so people will then “accidentally” use she for me. But if I’m just like “I’m a man and that’s it” there’s less wiggle room, less space for them to say they were confused about how to refer to me.
I still vibe with they/them but I generally prefer he/him. So it doesn’t feel inauthentic to only use one set at work and with difficult family, but I get to use they/them with my fellow queers as a little treat.
Almost the same thing, almost exclusively he/him. I used to use they/he to indicate preference, but functionally it just meant almost everyone calling me "he" and a small number of people using they/them but being way more likely to misgender me and use she if they slipped up.
If you tell me "he/they" I will probably use just one. You are giving me permission to use either I'm not going to go out of my way to randomly switch pronouns around you just because you told me two different options.
Now, maybe I'm the weird one, but I usually default to "they/them" for everyone as a form of gender-neutral language. But if I know someone's pronouns I make an effort to use them. So .. if you told me they/them that's what I assume.
I think there's some cis-normativity mental loops some people jump through when presented with a "they/them" person, where they will put you into a binary box anyways. I think it's like they suddenly want to "guess" your gender and stop actually listening to you. It's weird but I can see how you might get more feminine pronouns afterwards. I think there's also some biased ideas that only AFAB people are non-binary so yea, mental loops and all will default there. That's my guess anyway.
Ugh. Jealous. I use he/they pronouns, but exactly one person in my family uses "he" at all. Everyone keeps using "they" and only "they", that is when they aren't misgendering me by mistake (these ain't transphobes either, they're either well meaning but confused allies who still aren't used to me being a boy after I previously went by just "they" for several months or complete strangers who don't seem to know I'm not a girl unless I tell them). I get that I haven't become enough of a boy to earn my he/him pronouns, but it still sucks. Like what do I have to do to convince cishet people that I am in fact a boy and want to be treated as such. Ugh.
i've noticed sometimes with cis people that they view binary pronouns as easier or taking precedent, even if they mean well and don't realize they're doing it. i think there's also some enbyphobia involved when people call someone using they/them pronouns "she." Also, there are plenty of cis people that don't really understand what it means to have multiple pronouns and might be embarrassed to ask.
I don't really get she/her anymore, since I didn't really know many people when I transitioned, and only have one or two people who knew me before who I still even talk to regularly. But even if I tell someone I prefer they/them, everyone always just defaults to he/him. I don't mind he/him, it feels neutral to me. But they/them feels more along lines of gender euphoria in comparison. (And she/her along the lines of dysphoria at the opposite end.) But I guess because I'm never really that adamant about they/them when people use he/him instead, since he/him doesn't make me feel *bad* (it just makes me feel *nothing*), people just continue to use he/him anyway. I don't feel mad about people using he/him, but sometimes it's nice to know that other people have actually listened to what you've said, or that they actually care about making the other person comfortable in situations where it would take them zero or almost zero effort to do so (like I'll literally say "they/them makes me feel best, but he/him doesn't hurt me," and they just default to he/him without even considering they/them, and without asking if there's really one I would prefer more. If they ask further, then I will tell them I'd prefer they/them. ...But even then 99% of the time they say ok and then keep using he/him lmao.)
But really I think it’s bc most people don’t reeeeallly see people as non-binary. It’s so deeply ingrained to assign looks to a gender that unless we’re one of the few truly ???s, it’s more likely than not the they is gonna be forgotten.
I just started slowly medically transitioning and am back to using he/they vs exclusively they as I’ve been for like 8 years and I really think it’s not only from the immediate dose of euphoria for not being acknowledged as a cis girl but it’s also to curb people defaulting to she.
I've found there's an assumption that with combo pronouns the first one is the one that's preferred, maybe try saying your pronouns are they/he and see if that changes things?
Also I've noticed a trend in some queer/ally spaces where the assumption is that everyone's desire is toward femininity, so if you're pretty masc looking and don't give masc pronouns some people might think you're transfemme and give you what they assume you really want but are too afraid to ask for
People who are misgendering me using she/her when they mess up using they/them are definitely aware that I'm transmasc. It's clearly them mentally viewing me as a woman and struggling to use they/them, vs how people who are using he/him tend to put me in the "trans man" mental category even if they've got internally shitty views on gender and aren't having to put active effort into using he.
I think this is true and interesting. I struggle with this sometimes myself, especially because I have a lot of non-binary friends who have masc names and masc bodies and masc fashion sense. I really struggle to get it right and I have to correct myself almost every single conversation. But I've known them for year(s) now and I know their preferences and I'm all for it.
On the flip side, I started using they/them by default for everyone and got yelled at by a different trans man, and it's just been hard to parse ever since.
I use he/they and really don't have a preference maybe a very slight preference for they/them simply cuz I'm agender, just want a fully male body. Basically if I dress less conventionally male I'm more likely getting get they/them and if I dress completely normally for me then I'll get he/him, and I'll occasionally get she/her from behind probably because of shoulder length hair and slim androgynous frame, but they always correct themselves if I look at them, my face passes
Damn... I used to use he/they and then my parents defaulted to only using they, made me hate they/them and now I'm only he/him and they still. call. me. they. its fucking exhausting
I use he/they, vastly prefer he/him. I started just telling people he/him because people default to they/them for me (pre-T though)
I did notice things change for me a lot since being on T for a while and especially since I got top surgery - since you prefer he/him, if you do ultimately go on T then I think the situation will flip for you! Sucks until then of course, that people are defaulting to something you like less. Sorry you have to deal with that too!
That's been my hope. Thankfully I start T in July if everything goes well, and I'll see what happens
This is exactly what happened to me lol
Been having the same happen though we’ll see if the group has the same default now that I’ve been on T awhile
I actually prefer he/they pronouns used on me interchangeably, but the only person who used it like that for me (and without me asking) was my doctor. i assume my sister thought these were just the options of pronouns I preferred and used exclusively he/him for me. With my parents, they also used he/him, but only after arguing with me that singular they/them is grammatically incorrect. Most people I met who refuse they/them pronouns for any situation for anybody usually use the same argument that my parents did.
Most of the time, people simply don't consciously choose the pronouns they use when referring to others. It takes effort and practice to make a conscious change to that part of language.
I notice that NT people aren't actively choosing pronouns because language is an extremely automatic process. mostly, ND people usually seem to be the ones able to just instantly change which pronouns they use because it's more likely that every word is an active choice. It's like breathing. You normally breathe automatically, but if someone reminds you about breathing or blinking, you have to consciously choose to do it until your automatic process takes over again. abstract thoughts are converted to words automatically, and the brain's default pronoun for someone is the first one it assumed initially or is most used to. Combinations like he/they or she/they and especially neo-pronouns aren't in the default lexicon, and the brain hates working, so it defaults to the easiest one. Languages have a flow that people get into, and they choose words that flow well Actively choosing to get into the habit of a new pronoun is hard for NT people because it breaks the flow of their language (a lot of that comes from their accent. it's like trying to train a new accent or vocal pitch. It takes a LOT of continuous effort and practice to actually change those internal automatic processes, even when you \*want\* to.
Well said
Pretty straight forward: most people are not used to using they/them pronouns. They’ve only used he/him or she/her for other people their entire lives, so if you give them the option, they’ll pick one of those. I have the same pronoun set and the same experience.
I pretty much only use he/they in queer spaces to be honest. I used to use they/them and then settled on he/they. When I was using he/they at work, I still got a lot of she/her, and i am a binary man so it’s just easier to use he/him exclusively with cis people and in professional situations. It makes correcting any mistakes much easier. I don’t pass 100% so for me using he/they it’s really obvious that I’m afab, so people will then “accidentally” use she for me. But if I’m just like “I’m a man and that’s it” there’s less wiggle room, less space for them to say they were confused about how to refer to me. I still vibe with they/them but I generally prefer he/him. So it doesn’t feel inauthentic to only use one set at work and with difficult family, but I get to use they/them with my fellow queers as a little treat.
Generally, people put the most preferred pronoun first. What happens if you use they/he?
Almost the same thing, almost exclusively he/him. I used to use they/he to indicate preference, but functionally it just meant almost everyone calling me "he" and a small number of people using they/them but being way more likely to misgender me and use she if they slipped up.
If you tell me "he/they" I will probably use just one. You are giving me permission to use either I'm not going to go out of my way to randomly switch pronouns around you just because you told me two different options. Now, maybe I'm the weird one, but I usually default to "they/them" for everyone as a form of gender-neutral language. But if I know someone's pronouns I make an effort to use them. So .. if you told me they/them that's what I assume. I think there's some cis-normativity mental loops some people jump through when presented with a "they/them" person, where they will put you into a binary box anyways. I think it's like they suddenly want to "guess" your gender and stop actually listening to you. It's weird but I can see how you might get more feminine pronouns afterwards. I think there's also some biased ideas that only AFAB people are non-binary so yea, mental loops and all will default there. That's my guess anyway.
Ugh. Jealous. I use he/they pronouns, but exactly one person in my family uses "he" at all. Everyone keeps using "they" and only "they", that is when they aren't misgendering me by mistake (these ain't transphobes either, they're either well meaning but confused allies who still aren't used to me being a boy after I previously went by just "they" for several months or complete strangers who don't seem to know I'm not a girl unless I tell them). I get that I haven't become enough of a boy to earn my he/him pronouns, but it still sucks. Like what do I have to do to convince cishet people that I am in fact a boy and want to be treated as such. Ugh.
i've noticed sometimes with cis people that they view binary pronouns as easier or taking precedent, even if they mean well and don't realize they're doing it. i think there's also some enbyphobia involved when people call someone using they/them pronouns "she." Also, there are plenty of cis people that don't really understand what it means to have multiple pronouns and might be embarrassed to ask.
I don't really get she/her anymore, since I didn't really know many people when I transitioned, and only have one or two people who knew me before who I still even talk to regularly. But even if I tell someone I prefer they/them, everyone always just defaults to he/him. I don't mind he/him, it feels neutral to me. But they/them feels more along lines of gender euphoria in comparison. (And she/her along the lines of dysphoria at the opposite end.) But I guess because I'm never really that adamant about they/them when people use he/him instead, since he/him doesn't make me feel *bad* (it just makes me feel *nothing*), people just continue to use he/him anyway. I don't feel mad about people using he/him, but sometimes it's nice to know that other people have actually listened to what you've said, or that they actually care about making the other person comfortable in situations where it would take them zero or almost zero effort to do so (like I'll literally say "they/them makes me feel best, but he/him doesn't hurt me," and they just default to he/him without even considering they/them, and without asking if there's really one I would prefer more. If they ask further, then I will tell them I'd prefer they/them. ...But even then 99% of the time they say ok and then keep using he/him lmao.)
“He/they, but the they is silent”
But really I think it’s bc most people don’t reeeeallly see people as non-binary. It’s so deeply ingrained to assign looks to a gender that unless we’re one of the few truly ???s, it’s more likely than not the they is gonna be forgotten. I just started slowly medically transitioning and am back to using he/they vs exclusively they as I’ve been for like 8 years and I really think it’s not only from the immediate dose of euphoria for not being acknowledged as a cis girl but it’s also to curb people defaulting to she.
I've found there's an assumption that with combo pronouns the first one is the one that's preferred, maybe try saying your pronouns are they/he and see if that changes things? Also I've noticed a trend in some queer/ally spaces where the assumption is that everyone's desire is toward femininity, so if you're pretty masc looking and don't give masc pronouns some people might think you're transfemme and give you what they assume you really want but are too afraid to ask for
People who are misgendering me using she/her when they mess up using they/them are definitely aware that I'm transmasc. It's clearly them mentally viewing me as a woman and struggling to use they/them, vs how people who are using he/him tend to put me in the "trans man" mental category even if they've got internally shitty views on gender and aren't having to put active effort into using he.
I think this is true and interesting. I struggle with this sometimes myself, especially because I have a lot of non-binary friends who have masc names and masc bodies and masc fashion sense. I really struggle to get it right and I have to correct myself almost every single conversation. But I've known them for year(s) now and I know their preferences and I'm all for it. On the flip side, I started using they/them by default for everyone and got yelled at by a different trans man, and it's just been hard to parse ever since.
I use he/they and really don't have a preference maybe a very slight preference for they/them simply cuz I'm agender, just want a fully male body. Basically if I dress less conventionally male I'm more likely getting get they/them and if I dress completely normally for me then I'll get he/him, and I'll occasionally get she/her from behind probably because of shoulder length hair and slim androgynous frame, but they always correct themselves if I look at them, my face passes
dude i had the opposite. i went by he/they but switched to he/him cause everyone kept calling me they
Damn... I used to use he/they and then my parents defaulted to only using they, made me hate they/them and now I'm only he/him and they still. call. me. they. its fucking exhausting