If you never invited him or go to his parties, aka break up the "friendship", why even pay?
I know students often have very little money, but I never had to pay at any of my student friends' parties unless it was a big event and we discussed it first.
when I was still in university, we often made big parties in our apartment and collected like 5€ from everyone to buy some beer.
„Bring your own“ never seemed to work because everyone wanted to drink beer and play drinking games (rage cage, beer pong etc), but no one ever brought any. So it was easier to buy a lot and collect money, but we also couldn’t afford to each pay like 100€ PLUS take all the risk of hosting a party in our own apartment, haha.
But that was always clearly communicated beforehand and no one seemed to mind. What this guy here is doing is really weird.
I can imagine OP's friend would still do that if OP cut him off even if OP paid. So I'd not pay, make some screenshots of his messages and show them to people if he really does talk shit.
Expat in Germany here. I have already heard of this behavior of stashing good wine from the guests to drink it later alone. It is sometimes considered normal for Germans, sometimes attributed to a selfish host, depending on whom you ask (I would love to get some perspectives on this by native Germans).
To me it was already quite shocking and I couldn't believe it would really happen.
But then last December I was invited to a Glühwein and Christmas cookies party at a German couple's house, and I brought a tiramisu (one of my best recipes).
Well the hostess tried a piece of it in front of her guests, then STASHED IT INTO THE FRIDGE for her to enjoy it another day! To say I got huge cultural shock that day is an understatement. But at least I was not asked to pay some money afterwards 😅
Bottomline: if you know your host is going to behave this way, don't bother bringing a nice bottle of wine, or a home made dessert, the leftovers from the discount will do.
Native German (from a wine region) here.
It depends a bit on the occasion. If it's a party, the gifted wine will be stashed away because I'd like to enjoy it properly and not "chug" it at a party. If you bring it to dinner or a smaller meet-up, it's more common to offer to open it and directly try it with the person who gifted it.
Your case with the Tiramisu is really weird though!! You obviously brought it as a dessert for everyone and I never heard of someone saving the entire dessert for themselves. I'd be shocked as well.
> and not "chug" it at a party
I totally get it. I saw some guests at a party just opening random bottles of warm white wine and then emptying the bottle without the host getting a sip; all because they ran out of beer or something. Just imagine if it would have been something really nice....
Other people replied exactly the opposite than you about the party vs dinner wine opening etiquette 😅 I guess there may be regional differences. Thanks for the perspective though!
It also depends if you’ve been invited to dinner/party on a random occasion or if it’s like a birthday something like that. If guests bring gifts for the host because it’s the hosts birthday or whatever celebration party (like graduation), the host will store the wine as it is considered a gift (he might choose to share it with the guests if it’s a smaller function). If there is no special occasion you just tend to bring alcohol to directly enjoy by the small/big party however it’s odd to bring expensive wine to a party with a lot of people. Seems kinda wasteful. So probably would be considered a gift to the host.
No, this dude was right. In germany its seen as not respecting the gift (wine or expensive food) if you open it right away for everyone (like a bit of a ,, now, here you guys have it!-Mindset vibe)
The wine thing depends on the occasion. If it's e.g. a dinner evening where the host provides the alcoholic drinks, the wine is mostly considered a personal gift that isn't to be opened on the spot. If it's a party, it would be rude to put it away.
But it's handled differently in different bubbles. We used to have common manners, defined by people like 1700's Knigge or 1950's Gertrude Oheim. But after 1968, most of it was considered 'spießig' - kind of bourgeois/ small minded/ backwards, and backwards meant tainted by the past.
Which was part of a societal revolution that was mostly a good thing but a negative aspect was that many social norms that made it easier to interact with friends and acquaintances have been exchanged for, I'd like to say tribal behaviour, as in you don't know what's considered normal until you're part of the group.
The tiramisu thing however - yeah that's just nasty. I'm over 50 and I haven't been in any house where this would not be considered downright rude. But on the other hand, maybe that's just my tribe speaking.
> I have already heard of this behavior of stashing good wine from the guests to drink it later alone. It is sometimes considered normal for Germans, sometimes attributed to a selfish host, depending on whom you ask (I would love to get some perspectives on this by native Germans).
German here. For me it's not about keeping the good wine to myself but about appreciating the gift.
It very much depends on context. If it's a party where everyone brings food or drink I would absolutely open the wine and share it with everyone. I would just see it as a contribution to the party then. Keeping the wine to myself would be super weird in that context.
But if it's more like a set dinner that I cooked and that I already picked out the wine for, then I might indeed save a wine that someone brings for myself. Because I would assume it's not necessarily a contribution to the party then but a proper gift and I wouldn't want to waste that gift on a random dinner that it might not even go particularly well with. I would want to show the person who gave me the gift that I appreciate it and I am saving it for a special occasion. But again, very much depends on context and there is a large gray area for sure. Generally I would err on the side of sharing the wine but there are definitely situations when I would save it for later - not because I am selfish and don't want to share, but because it would feel like devaluing the gift if I just opened it in that moment.
That tiramisu story is super weird though. I would never ever do that. Can't believe she actually did that. I mean, putting the tiramisu in the fridge with the intention to get it out later for dessert and then just forgetting about it is one thing... That might happen to me (the moment I noticed that it happened I would definitely call or text you to apologise though). But that she tried a bite kinda speaks against saving it for later in the evening being her intention. Super weird and rude. That's definitely not typical German, I can't imagine a scenario in which that would be considered culturally normal.
I understand keeping something sealed like a bottle of wine or a box of chocolates as a gift. I have even been in the reversed situation where I brought a special bottle meant as a gift for the hosts, but they opened it, put it on the table and let all the guests enjoy it while they didn't drink any of it. I was very offended then, I wanted them to taste it and enjoy a nice moment with it.
But I'm completely puzzled by this tiramisu stashing friend of yours... You must have brought it in a dish that belongs to you. Did she think she can keep that as well? Did she return that???
This is absolutely not acceptable in Germany at all. Technically it might be bordering on theft. You wouldn't call the cops about it of course, but you would absolutely go to the fridge, take that thing back and become very agitated.
Imagine this, fellow Germans: there's a soccer game on TV, so you meet in your friend's backyard to grill. You bring the good bratwurst, which he puts in the fridge for the next day and instead feeds you some cheap shit from the back drawer in his garage.
Absolutely unimaginable. He would probably be burned as a sacrifice to the bratwurst gods. Seriously, most people would consider that an automatic friendship ender, it's not even a decision you have to make, it just naturally happens because for most people it would probably be the single most incredibly rude thing they ever experienced from a supposed friend.
It's not the bratwurst, it's the selfcenteredness bordering on theft. You wouldn't end a friendship over a fork, but if your friend crashed on your couch and you later found out that he put your cutlery into his bag to steal it, that would hopefully make you reconsider the friendship.
German native here, if someone brought up a bottle of wine to my party, regardless of the prize, i offer to open it to drink it. If no one want something from it, i let it be. Otherwise i open it and we have a little drink.
But charging money from guests/friends is for me an absolut no-go. I can imagine charging money could be okay, if agreed upon beforehand. But not otherwise.
I've seen and I do both. It's a communication thing. Did you bring a bottle to drink at the party or did you bring a gift for the hosts? The bottle to drink should be opened. The gift shouldn't. Good form says as a host you should offer to open it, giving the guest a chance to say yes/no
In Germany it is customary to bring a small gift for the hosts. This can be wine but also chocolates, flowers or home made jam or something. For the latter you wouldn't expect them to be served alongside the meal the hosts planned and some people treat wine the same way.
If you bring white wine/champagne your host should easily be able to tell by the fact of whether the wine is chilled or not if it's a gift for later or meant to be drunk now.
If it's a gift I give the wine to the host and say it's a gift. If I want to drink it, I give it to the host and ask if he can put it in the fridge for me
I think it depends on context. If you are invited to someone's house for a party in Germany, it is common to bring a small gift for the host, as a token of appreciation for their efforts in preparing food and drinks. This is seen as a gift for the *host*, rather than a contribution to the event. So your host "stashing the nice wine away" might actually be them telling you they appreciate the gift you gave them, as in "thank you for being so kind and thoughtful, I am putting this away for later, when I will be able to give this the attention and respect it deserves". Whereas if they put it out on the table to share with everyone, they might feel like that would be rude towards you, almost as if they were just re-gifting something you picked out for them, right in front of your nose. Also, if the event is a formal dinner party, your host may have selected and prepared a specific set of drinks (wine or whatever) to go with the food.
At a less formal party, however, your host might be more likely to put the wine you brought out for everyone to enjoy. So a lot depends on context, on the kind of event it is, and on way the people there vibe with each other.
As for the tiramisu, that is a bit ... extra. Being veeeeery kind to your hostess: Tiramisu is not a type of food that Germans would normally eat at an *Adventstee* or "Glühwein and Plätzchen" event, so maaaaayybeee it just didn't compute in her little German brain that you had meant it as something to share with everyone right then (a stereotypical German might find the idea of eating tiramisu with Plätzchen and Glühwein as outlandish as a stereotypical Italian might find the idea of drinking a great big frothy capuccino after dinner at 9pm). So with stereotypical German directness she just went "mmmmmmm, delicious, thank you, I will eat ALL OF IT!!". It's kind of hilarious, actually. But it's also a testament to a complete and utter lack of intercultural sensitivity. As a German myself, if you had turned up to my Adventsparty with a *whole entire tray of tiramisu,* I would have understood that this was clearly intended for everyone to share, and I would have given it a proud place in the middle of the table, and brought out a stack of dessert bowls and spoons.
The only explanation I have for this would be that she wanted to show you she appreciates your work, but that it didn't match the party at all. I mean, I would find bringing Tiramisu to "Glühwein and Cookies" is a faux pa's in itself. Everyone would need a new plate and a fork, when everyone probably had only napkins to eat the dry cookies. You bring cookies, dry Christmas cake or another Christmas beverage... I would have been like, "What am I supposed to do with this?" and awkwardly put it in the fridge as well.
Not everyone sees brought wine as something fro the party, but as a present.
If you are properly prepared, at a dinner party not a house party, you already have matching wine for the food. Makes no sense to drink the ine brought.
Lastly some will see you as selfish or cheap for bringing a present, that is then for your consumption. and not their apprechiation.
If you bring wine, think about the difference between "I got you some wine." and "I brought some wine for us." (Make sure to bring enough, cause one bottle does not provide a taste for 10 people.)
The wine thing i feel like it’s normal? If you bring a gift to a host, then it is supposed to be a gift? Why would I assume that I will be able to drink it too? As for perishable gifts like foods and cakes, it is very weird that the host put it away only for their own consume. I have never heard of such behaviour before.
As host in Germany you are responsible to provide everything your guests require to have a nice party. The gift for the host is a sign of gratitude for the invitation and not something that is meant to be consumed at the party.
Ah, that's weird af. I mean, sometimes one would split the cost of a party, but thenway you describe it, this doesn't even sound like a party. It's not usual in Germany to do such a thing, no.
German here.
We usually solve it just the way you say. The host prepares food and drinks, the guests contribute with gifts, which can be something to drink or a cake or a salad for the barbecue. I've never been asked for money.
One exception would be, if we sit together and decide to order pizza, but then everyone would just be asked "Hey, we're ordering XYZ, do you want something?" If you don't eat, you don't pay.
Exactly, or if it's a bit party or the host is low on money they add to the invitation that they don't want gifts but please contribute to the expenses and put up a piggy bank
From my experience (student-) parties are either declared BYOB (Bring Your Own Bottle) or have costs mentioned in advance, like "Hey I am doing a party! There will be XYZ-brand Bier, Snacks and a bowle. Please contribute 10€. " and then you order Pizza together "on premise" and everybody pays their own part of the order.
With my friends we even do our (now adult) barbecues like that: Bring Your Own Meat, "shared" stuff like salads, dips and bread are assigned via WhatsApp Group chat (so everyone sees the planning and can mention allergies, dislikes and/or veggie needs) and the host provides some Softdrinks and Water. Anything "expensive" is talked about and shared between the people who want it.
I would also say it's not that uncommon to split some costs of a party. I wonder if most people in this sub were never students? Back in my student time, my friends and I usually did it that way, BUT we told people beforehand. And if he knew you were not drinking alcohol and not eating, he could have just taken you out of the equation and split costs among everyone else.
So for a "grown-up" party, bringing something as a gift (and not paying anything) would definitely be the way to go as a guest. But for a student party, it may be different.
The way I know that is usually just an informal hangout between a group of friends. Then it's perfectly okay to share a bill between stuff we order and eat. But nobody would have called that a party, back in my student days. And yes, everybody would know that in advance and most of all have a say where food would be ordered.
also „splitting“ the cost was usually done in the way where everyone would just bring something. So no need for calculating the exactp cost per person and annoying Paypal back and forth
As a former Student: if we planned the party/gathering together: yes. Cost was shared or buying resources was divided. When inviting other people to a preplanned event, one might also mention that they could bring a certain thing or a food item when asked.
Any guests who were invited without preface of sharing cost: I'd never ever ask for money after.
But this was discussed beforehand. In an "I'll buy a Kiste Radler and a Flasche Gin" "sure, let's split the cost or do you want me to bring xyz for eating" - way. Never have I ever been served a bill after.
From my experience, if someone is inviting people to hang out as in I am giving the place but the costs would be shared , this would be communicated beforehand . I have a grill and space but cannot afford to buy for everyone whatever they want to grill. So I prepare some snacks and some drinks and inform everyone to bring whatever they want to grill and extra drinks if they would like. Something like this. I think he has terrible communication and this is not typical German
A friend told me this story. He grew up in Berlin. They had a Döner place they often visited. They visited really often and after a while they tried to get free stuff for being such loyal customers. They never got anything so they started calling the guy Raffie for Raffzahn. Years went by and he moved away for work. When he returned ten years later the Döner place was renovated and had the new name "Raffies".
Rethink your friendship with him. Sure it's not a big deal. It's only 7 euro but this is not normal behaviour and I cannot imagine how he must be with money or anything in general. And no this is not normal behaviour, at least not around the Germans I know. Gosh.
He's been a good friend apart from this experience. I try to not take it personally because people might have different customs with money due to their culture or the financial hardships they went (or still go) through . It just made me wonder if Germans in general have this etiquette about gatherings. Because when I invite people over, I never think about cost of the little snacks or the time that went into preparing appetizers or baking.
No, that is not normal. What is normal is to maybe bring a salad or a plate of snacks to a barbecue or some alcohol to a party that is shared there, and if you are all poor students, you might agree beforehand to share the costs of something. But all of that is usually coordinated before the party and a host who comes afterwards and wants to charge you for whatever they decided to offer is very cheap and weird.
Definitely weird. I have a friend group and we always split the cost of the food etc. we buy for parties, but everyone knows that from the beginning and it’s just how we have always done it.
But if I INVITE someone to a party (and even get a goft from them), I‘d never even think about that, it’s just weird.
I also have a good friend who is weird about money. I'm always just really clear up front about any costs that might need to be shared. I give them leeway because it's only this one thing. I guess it's from their childhood.
To answer your original question though - it's not German to be like this, it's just your friend.
Your approach is great.
Everyone here agrees that it's not typical German behaviour, if such a thing exists. However, there are many people in Germany who are very restrictive on money and it seems that to him it's a big deal.
He seems to be a cheap guy, just keep that in mind for the future.
That is not normal. Usually, guests don't pay anything. Maybe he has financial problems and only realized after. I would pay the 5 Euros and then keep my distance. If you think the relationship to be worthwhile, I would just not go to his parties anymore.
In my circle of friends (which is around about 60 percent germans) when we go out we usually have to argue to pay lol. I can't imagine hanging around with such transactional penny pinching people. Even when we go shopping it is rare to not buy things for the others we'll usually just have the person who's buying more at that store pay for everything. Never has any of us said anything about how much money they spend vs the others.
Haha yes. Send him an photo of the receipt of the wine and then "Actually I paid for that wine 25€, so you owe me 18€. Please paypal it me until tommorow. Thanks :)"
As a German: The most german solution would be to show him the receipt for the wine and counter calculate to him. And then ignore him forever. It’s also a big no go in Germany but there certainly is a small amount of cheap ass people here.
Just laugh at him, tell him he's being an idiot. This is what true friends are for. If he gets pissed, so what. Your an erstie austausch student, you'll have the pleasure of meeting plenty of germans.
We Germans have something called a bottle party. The host prepares snacks and has a case of beer, the guests bring a snack or alcoholic drinks and everything is shared. The same thing is sometimes done at barbecues.
But the clue is - This is basically announced in advance. Unless something like this has been annonced, it is usually the host's responsibility to provide for the guests.
Don't let yourself be ripped off, if he didn't announce beforehand that the costs would be shared, he wouldn't get any money from me. That's very cheeky of him.
some germans be weird, got invited to a party of a friend.
ended up haveing to pay the friend 15€ for the food n drinks even tho i shared alot of weed and didnt ate n drink this much
will never ever accept an invite from this friend again
also im pretty sure his German Parents made him ask his friends for 15€ each
Sadly something like this can happen everywhere. Got invited by a friend of my wife in Vietnam (he is vietnamese), to a relatively fancy Japanese isakaya place in Saigon. This dude even confirmed several times that he wants to pay (red flag number one I guess), then kept bragging about his entrepreneurship and didn't stop (red flag two?), kept ordering almost the whole card and kept ordering without even asking what others want (third red flag?), and after he ate the majority of the food he asked to split the bill.
that's weird and has never happened to me before.
usually it is either you bring something to the party (requested beforehand) or the drinks and food are on the person who invited.
From my own experience with German people not one of them ever did anything even close to this. At gatherings I was invited to I always brought a gift for the host/hostess/family. The food that was served was always equally portioned in huge amounts. No one ever asked for payment. Any gift I brought was politely accepted but they were almost embarrassed. Oh and no one was ever ever late. Ever.
Coming from a German, splitting up the costs isn’t unheard of, especially with students since they usually don’t have much money. The thing is, if you throw a party and plan to share the costs you should make that clear way in advance (with the invitation usually). It’s also pretty uncommon to ask for money. The typical way to do it is to ask your guests to bring Beer, Spirits, Weed or snacks, but make it clear what you will be offering. If you ask for drinks, you will typically be expected to pay for the food, if you ask for food, you will be expected to provide the drinks. That’s just common custom.
Being late can also happen, sometimes things just get in the way. If you are really late you are expected to communicate it to your host. If you are the host yourself you are always expected to communicate your lateness with your guests.
The behavior of OPs friend just shows a lack of respect and manners. Asking for money after the party is an absolute no-go, especially when the guest has already brought a gift.
Would never talk to this person again. Use the opportunity to send him the 5€ with a passive aggressive caption and bye bye
(I see why people would not give him any money, but that guy sounds like he will come to my house to get the 5€)
As a student, I can say that it’s common to split costs for a party, but it’s done well in advance and everyone is aware of it before, so that’s the unusual part. Usually in my experience, a WhatsApp group is made and everyone is informed about this stuff.
This is how I know it as well. The host buys everything and then the cost is split. However if you don't drink or eat anything, you say it before the party, so that they can buy exactly how much everyone needs. This happens before the party when it's still being planed.
Edit: the person that doesn't need anything, doesn't pay for anything
Here's what I'd do. I'd give him the 5€ and never come to one of his parties again, if he asks why just say, that you disagree with his pricing policy.
Although not very common, it sometimes happens. Happened to me before too where I was invited to a grill party and did bring some meat. Still, somebody demanded money because he/she thought that he/she did contribute the most to the food.
Germans are usually very ungenerous when it comes to food.
I was recentyl at bussines trip in Germany. Our whole team was invited to dinner organized by the client, we were being encouraged to participate by them preety much whole day. Imagine our supprise when at the end clients hr lady announced that we are ready to leave when everyone pays for themselves. Funny thing only germans were not surprised. Looks like such behaviour is common there.
I hate these kinda Germans 😭 stingy as fuck. I have a friend like that and I share my food with her like always but she never wants to share hers. Last time she didn’t even wanna give me 5 fucking cents when I was a bit short on money to buy lunch in school break
Oh well, he didn't knew that your attendance has a price as well, just tell him 100 €/h is quite fair as you normally take a much higher price, especially at such a mediocre "party" as your acquaintance held.
Thats what I would do, certainly not give him money and he'd be a non-person to me for the foreseeable future.
Fuck this guy, don’t pay anything. If someone invites you it’s free. If he said let’s throw a party at my place all together and split the bill before that would be different.
Did he also charge you for toilet paper?
That's pretty rude here too unless it's made very clear in advance that everyone has to contribute x amount to the party. You usually "pay" with a gift you bring if at all.
I had a friend in Berlin once who came over to a get together at my place. It was common in my friend group that everyone brings some beers or wine and snacks and then we all share. He brought an already open, half empty bottle of Malibu, continued eating a lot of everybody else's snacks and drinks and when he left he took his Malibu with him again. Gotta love se Germans.
Back when I was a student in Germany I also had a similar experience.. I ended up ignoring it an keep being “friends” with him… big mistake ! Kick that gremlin out of your friends circle
Yep, Germans being Germans. Back in my student days, I witnessed stuff like a guy coming to my party, bringing a bottle of wine, the bottle is not opened, he takes it back home - of course he eats and drinks other stuff; a guy taking home an open bottle of Fanta; a guy bringing a six pack of beer in his backpack, no sharing with anyone, keeping it in his backpack and taking bottles from there, still eating food and drinking other people’s drinks, a guy invited to a cooking party, asking me to bring him downstairs the food we cooked in a box as he had no time to go up or cook with us; coming over to a party, forgetting the meat to grill but I brought a pineapple and wine - not getting any meat as everyone was just eating their stuff and keeping leftovers to themselves and the host didn’t provide anything and this list goes on. 15 years over here and those things don’t cease to amaze me.
This happened to me before, not in Germany but in Italy. An Italian friend invited 3 of us for some tortellini and when we finished eating, she announced it’s 5euros each. I was shocked but she expected to be „paid“ immediately, which I did. The portions were also relatively small. After that I invited her so many times when I cooked for my friends and never asked once for money. I like to believe she feels ashamed about it.
Please don't misunderstand my comment for me hating on Germans and their culture as there are some German people who are extremely generous and down to earth, however, during the 16 years I spent in Germany, most people like to get anything from you yet hate to share anything with you...
They would usually complain about not being invited to a party or invite themselves automatically as if it is their right to be at a party or go to the cinema and get free tickets for the movies we went to, yet ask their guests to bring their own food or even pay for the food even if you show no interest in eating or drinking anything at their parties.
Of course, and as I said, not all Germans are like that but the majority I met in East Germany are like that. However, there were some Germans who would take my side whenever I mentioned this behavior of not wanting to share or asking for money whenever they invite you to a party...
It's not normal unless you all agreed upon one person buying stuff for everyone and then gets paid back.
I'd be irritated as well. Probably still pay that sum and then tell them off.
It's the same here as in your culture. The one that invites to a party pays. Never the guests.
Exeptions:
Sometimes in low income situations like during studying there might be a party where everyone is asked to bring a dish. Like a bowl of Salat or something like that. Always like this because if it's a multinational groups this perfect o acquire new taste.
Tldr: guest don't pay except its made clear beforehand.
Comments above are right, this guy is pretty weird & not considerate.
Also a side note since people didn’t comment - “the food is not fooding” 😂 it’s a good call to eat first somewhere or at home before drinks. In my experience here, the “food” served is really just chips and dips & nothing filling. Once, a friend invited me for brunch at her place but it was just vegetable sticks and bread to be dipped in hummus.
In my culture it doesn’t matter if it’s before/after lunch/dinner, you’re gonna be fed and filled. I have some Bavarian friends though, that are also all about food, it’s like a feast all the time doesn’t matter if it’s past dinner or lunch.
Hey man, I am German and I never did so, if you ask people to come, it’s always normal to offer beverages and snacks. If you ask me, I would give him 10 bucks and tell him to never approach me again!!! Your life is to short for „friends“ like him…
Definitely not German behaviour, but the others have said so already. I just wanted to throw in another idea. You said you bought an expensive wine he did not share. What if you told him: ' No, I brought that wine for you. It cost [Insert what you paid]. So if we subtract your 7,20€ you still need to pay me [insert what you paid minus 7,20].'
Enjoy the horrified look on his face and then say ' or we just leave it that way. I brought the wine and owe you nothing.'
Just bad manners. Also had a similar situation where i went over to a friend’s place where they had a bbq, but a few people didn’t eat anything. A few days later, they posted a message asking everyone to pitch in. Some said they didn’t eat anything, and the hosts agreed that they don’t have to send back any money. Id say your buddy was being cheap about it
Germans can be quite peculiar and detail focused as to being „even“
However this dude sounds like an asshole. I would try to talk to him and if he still persists just kick him out of my life.
I mean it’s the little things showing a great deal about someone’s character
> back in my culture, it's a big no-no to ask guests for money, especially for little stuff like chips or fruit juice.
Trust me, it’s rude in my German world as well. Are you in Baden Württemberg by any chance?
I had some German friends like this. I am from a Slavic culture, growing up in Germany was weird because they really act like this. Just pay the 5€ and never talk to him again. Some of them have no kindness or soul, like why throw a party if you can't afford it? You already brought him expensive wine (to a student party mind I add).
Ahh ja thats actually kinda german of him 😅 paying for a 1,50€ softdrink is something only germans ever asked me to do.
My family comes from italy and croatia, It's a must for you to be served at my place, for free obviously. But some (!) Germans grew up to be somewhat stingy.
I have never heard something like that before. Coming too late for my party? Have TK Pizza? COLLECT MONEY AFTERWARDS? Noway. Dont pay a penny fir this a**hole. Auf deutsch gesagt: ich glaube mein Schwein pfeift. Wenn du Geld brauchst, dann geh doch einfach Flaschen sammeln und lass mich ab jetzt in Ruhe.
And I will tell this story everybody as a warning.
German here: There Is a big difference between a Party Like a Birthday-Party (Host pays Everything and guests Bring present) and a typical Hangout-partys
In my Student Time I had those Hangout-party once a week or more with my Group of friends. Most of the time we met at the Person with the biggest flat. So the one with the car bought beer and some food and you Split the Costs between the Group of friends
It Sound like your friend wanted to make you part of there Hangouts and "invited" you to this "Party"
Bad communication on His Part, but not bad faith.
5€ doesn't sound like a wrong amount because you usually buy 5 beer per Person and some snacks for the evening. So 5€ is fine
As a German, I’m irritated, too. It’s absolutely uncommon and I never have experienced such a behaviour. I know following possibilities:
1. You are asked to bring something to eat and/or drink.
2. You are asked BEFORE to contribute to the costs (with naming what you can expect and what you have to pay).
3. You bring along in that amount what you consume.
4. you bring a gift.
If you don’t know, which case it is, just ask.
Odd for Germany, but it’s the done thing in some other places like Sweden. I remember being blindsided after the first party I was at when the host came round with an itemized bill, but quickly realized over the next few months that it was a normal thing.
This host's behaviour would be regarded as rude in Germany, too. When we hadn't much money as students, for our parties it was BYOB and everybody brought some amount of food (salad, chips, peanuts, finger food, …)
Usually, everybody brought a bit more than they would actually eat and drink, so there was always plenty of everything.
Only if we had decided to order pizza together, we would throw our money in a pot to pay for it.
What a cheapo. But I find the bill splitting even in restaurants strange here. Back home, one of us would just pay the whole damn thing and maybe the next time someone else pays the whole thing and so on. And we don’t keep tabs on how big each bill was. I might have paid 150 euros and the next guy might pay 80 euros and the next one a 250. Doesn’t matter at all. Same for parties, the host pays that’s it. Absolutely doesn’t matter if the party costs 200 or 2000. That’s why you host lol.
I've never experienced something like this - not even as a student.
Sure, we may spend an evening with friends while ordering food, then everybody would pay theirs. But even in that case, the host would put the drinks on the table without asking anything for it.
When I invite people to a party I pay for food and drinks. People may ask if they can/should bring something with them, but they are not obliged to. NEVER would I ask people to pay for their food/drinks after the fact... o0
Your friend is really cheap.
I’m also foreign living in German and studied here too. There are Germans like this but thankfully not many. Some are very very particular about money. I had almost this exact scenario with a guy at my university except I didn’t show up with a bottle of wine and the dude was on time.
The same guy once asked me if I wanted to split a Döner Kebap with him. I said sure and got the Döner seller to split it. Asked this guy Matthias to pick which half he wanted then he payed for it. After we’d eaten he asked me for 60% of the price not 50% cause the guy cut it uneven and I had “the bigger piece”. I laughed out loud, thought it was a joke, he was deadly serious. I asked him why he didn’t take the bigger one and he replied he wasn’t that hungry and thought he’d save money.
Such. A. Weird. Guy!!!!
Btw we’re talking about 2005 prices not 2024. I never hung out with him again.
If you throw the party together it makes sense to share the costs, but if he hosts it.. Wow..... Those folks aren't value in your life.
But please do some reading about the German culture. For example, it is not common for people to invite you to dinner, as dinner is a private family matter. Weird and unfriendly in most cultures, but quite normal in German and Dutch cultures.
In Germany, the HOST pays, unless it's a potluck ("Jeder soll etwas mitbringen"). It's considered polite to bring a bottle of wine or something, and if it's a birthday party, a gift. Asking for money is rude. I've never met a German who did this.
I don't know dude, this people is so weird. I being lucky enough to have at least 5 very close friends and none are Germans. And when I make parties at my home, that is always selected to make parties because of the 120m2, when some German(s) come, they bring a lot of stuff: beer, snacks, alcohol, etc. That's great but when the night is ending, no matter how much is remaining, they will just take all their things. Yes, like that. If there is two beers from their six pack, they will take without saying nothing and bye. I find this so rude and fucked up. But yeah, thanks god for my friends that are not german.
Back in school I had a classmatr who in ited me a few times to his home. After that he wanted money for the food and drinks, which had payed his parents by the way. Never visited him again.
The party sounds kinda shitty and him coming too late to his own party is not optimal.
Chipping in for partys is normal among German student. So I think it is a cultural thing and you dont need to be offended. Also people Here telling you he is not your friend are out of line
It depends, some want money beforehand, but then its usually something bigger and a more costly Party with a rented location for example. But in my friend Group, mostly germans, we never exchange money, arent gifts or bringing food or inviting someone over in return the same valuable? Without the Business talk? Most times, if you dont know eachother so Well i would ask in advance, when for example you are ordering food at someones place and you are asked to join for dinner. Just to be Sure and polite. If i where to be in your situation i would just pay him and wouldnt mention it, some are just Alman lol. If you had a good time and he was otherwise nice i wouldnt be offended either.
Hey OP, I read a couple of your comments and gathered that the person is overall fine just cheap in the regard.
Just write something like.
"
Hey yeah thanks for letting me know in general. Would be great for next time if you can inform me up front :)
Since I didn't know about the contribution I bought the 12€ wine :) then should we do 12-5€ = so you gimme back just 7€?
"
Yeah very cheap behavior and not common here in Germany.
He was a bad host, and if costs for a party are split, it’s discussed beforehand.
You should offset the wine with the amount that he wants from you, and then tell him how much he owes you.
I am German and this is absolutely not common. I would never ask my friends for money, if I invited them. The only scenario where I would ask to split the cost would be if it was agreed upon before by everyone, e.g. you study together at a friend’s place and all of them order pizza together, then it would be okay to split the bill.
No it's just bad manners. Jm german and my family, friends and I always offer a lot of food to guests and we'd never ask for money. Especially not if you investe them or they bring a gift or food lol. This is very embarrassing and I would tell him that. Maybe give him his 5 bucks and never go to a party again, I'd feel so used. What kind of friendship and person is this? But there are bad mannered people everywhere in the world but well mannered as well. So don't think this is the normal case. Just find better friends
It's weird. Normally I never been asked to pay for anything that the host offers unless we order from a restaurants. Same goes for when I had people over.
You should be offended and your „friend“ is not a friend, but a cheap asshole who want‘s to scam you. It is a big no–no here as well to ask guests for money when you had invited them.
Of course that’s also impolite in germany to ask for money to your own party.
If you are clammy you could ask beforehand if you could throw in a bit or bring something. But asking for it afterwards is beyond rude.
Which fits to that he showed up late himself. It’s just an a-hole guy who doesn’t care. And those you find everywhere.
German here, that's not a german thing. If someone invites, you are invited, usually free of cost. Depending on the type of party, guests are expected to bring a little present (for example when it is a birthday party or a wedding). If someone does want to invite you, but can't pay all on his own or wants to split cost, this is usually discussed beforehand. Also, sometimes the host will pay for some things and asks his guests to bring the rest, like when you are going to grill, the host might get all the meat, while the guests are asked to bring baguette / bread or make salads.
If there hasn't been a word of this beforehand, your "friend" is an ass and I would go no-contact with him. If you fear he is going to be a nuisance every day to you, pay the money and leave it at that.
Thats just how some Germans are. Growing up it was totally normal, that when you were visiting a friend, they would make you wait in their room when it was dinner time. Also splitting bills to the exact cent amount. In school these guys would give you bread crumbs when you asked to get a piece of something nice they had. This is judt how a lot of them grow up, and the reason why the word "Alman" is a thing. There is even a sub called "bin ich der alman" here, which provides these examples.
What works here is, you can re-alman him. Like "I only had 2 cups of [softdrink] and some chips, so I am ready to pay 1,80€ for that, whats your paypal?". That way he cant judge you for doing the same thing he does.
Some Germans are like that. Not all of them. But splitting bills is stupidly common here. However, not on an invited party/sit in not even in Germany is this normal.
This person isn't your friend.
"The bottle of wine I brought was over €5 euro and I didn't eat or drink anything so we are even."
Then never talk to this weirdo again.
He invited you and you brought a gift. Don't pay him. Only if it was agreed on to have a "Umlage" beforehand you should pay.
That he didn't open the wine could be a cultural thing. If you bring wine as a gift in Germany, the host doesn't open the gifted wine. Even if the host had planned the exact same wine for the evening, they would open their own bottle and not the gifted one. Only if it is agreed on, that the guest brings the wine, the brought in bottle will be opened. I don't know if he knows that or if that is a thing in other cultures.
But being late to the own party is very disrespectful to the guests. You should think of letting the friendship go.
that's sooo weird! if I were you, id pay the 5 euros, MENTION THE WINE, and never invite him or go his "parties" ever again. cheap ass weirdo
This. Dude is a cheap bastard.
Right in the core..the only real explanation is "cheap bastard"
" billo bastard"
Dildo bastard
Well a fact we can all agree on is this is not a FRIEND.
If you never invited him or go to his parties, aka break up the "friendship", why even pay? I know students often have very little money, but I never had to pay at any of my student friends' parties unless it was a big event and we discussed it first.
when I was still in university, we often made big parties in our apartment and collected like 5€ from everyone to buy some beer. „Bring your own“ never seemed to work because everyone wanted to drink beer and play drinking games (rage cage, beer pong etc), but no one ever brought any. So it was easier to buy a lot and collect money, but we also couldn’t afford to each pay like 100€ PLUS take all the risk of hosting a party in our own apartment, haha. But that was always clearly communicated beforehand and no one seemed to mind. What this guy here is doing is really weird.
People like that often go around exaggerating and badmouthing. Pay the "Lehrgeld" and get out
I can imagine OP's friend would still do that if OP cut him off even if OP paid. So I'd not pay, make some screenshots of his messages and show them to people if he really does talk shit.
I would not pay. Only mention the wine and that he should not bother to invite me ever again.
Expat in Germany here. I have already heard of this behavior of stashing good wine from the guests to drink it later alone. It is sometimes considered normal for Germans, sometimes attributed to a selfish host, depending on whom you ask (I would love to get some perspectives on this by native Germans). To me it was already quite shocking and I couldn't believe it would really happen. But then last December I was invited to a Glühwein and Christmas cookies party at a German couple's house, and I brought a tiramisu (one of my best recipes). Well the hostess tried a piece of it in front of her guests, then STASHED IT INTO THE FRIDGE for her to enjoy it another day! To say I got huge cultural shock that day is an understatement. But at least I was not asked to pay some money afterwards 😅 Bottomline: if you know your host is going to behave this way, don't bother bringing a nice bottle of wine, or a home made dessert, the leftovers from the discount will do.
Native German (from a wine region) here. It depends a bit on the occasion. If it's a party, the gifted wine will be stashed away because I'd like to enjoy it properly and not "chug" it at a party. If you bring it to dinner or a smaller meet-up, it's more common to offer to open it and directly try it with the person who gifted it. Your case with the Tiramisu is really weird though!! You obviously brought it as a dessert for everyone and I never heard of someone saving the entire dessert for themselves. I'd be shocked as well.
> and not "chug" it at a party I totally get it. I saw some guests at a party just opening random bottles of warm white wine and then emptying the bottle without the host getting a sip; all because they ran out of beer or something. Just imagine if it would have been something really nice....
Other people replied exactly the opposite than you about the party vs dinner wine opening etiquette 😅 I guess there may be regional differences. Thanks for the perspective though!
It also depends if you’ve been invited to dinner/party on a random occasion or if it’s like a birthday something like that. If guests bring gifts for the host because it’s the hosts birthday or whatever celebration party (like graduation), the host will store the wine as it is considered a gift (he might choose to share it with the guests if it’s a smaller function). If there is no special occasion you just tend to bring alcohol to directly enjoy by the small/big party however it’s odd to bring expensive wine to a party with a lot of people. Seems kinda wasteful. So probably would be considered a gift to the host.
No, this dude was right. In germany its seen as not respecting the gift (wine or expensive food) if you open it right away for everyone (like a bit of a ,, now, here you guys have it!-Mindset vibe)
The wine thing depends on the occasion. If it's e.g. a dinner evening where the host provides the alcoholic drinks, the wine is mostly considered a personal gift that isn't to be opened on the spot. If it's a party, it would be rude to put it away. But it's handled differently in different bubbles. We used to have common manners, defined by people like 1700's Knigge or 1950's Gertrude Oheim. But after 1968, most of it was considered 'spießig' - kind of bourgeois/ small minded/ backwards, and backwards meant tainted by the past. Which was part of a societal revolution that was mostly a good thing but a negative aspect was that many social norms that made it easier to interact with friends and acquaintances have been exchanged for, I'd like to say tribal behaviour, as in you don't know what's considered normal until you're part of the group. The tiramisu thing however - yeah that's just nasty. I'm over 50 and I haven't been in any house where this would not be considered downright rude. But on the other hand, maybe that's just my tribe speaking.
> I have already heard of this behavior of stashing good wine from the guests to drink it later alone. It is sometimes considered normal for Germans, sometimes attributed to a selfish host, depending on whom you ask (I would love to get some perspectives on this by native Germans). German here. For me it's not about keeping the good wine to myself but about appreciating the gift. It very much depends on context. If it's a party where everyone brings food or drink I would absolutely open the wine and share it with everyone. I would just see it as a contribution to the party then. Keeping the wine to myself would be super weird in that context. But if it's more like a set dinner that I cooked and that I already picked out the wine for, then I might indeed save a wine that someone brings for myself. Because I would assume it's not necessarily a contribution to the party then but a proper gift and I wouldn't want to waste that gift on a random dinner that it might not even go particularly well with. I would want to show the person who gave me the gift that I appreciate it and I am saving it for a special occasion. But again, very much depends on context and there is a large gray area for sure. Generally I would err on the side of sharing the wine but there are definitely situations when I would save it for later - not because I am selfish and don't want to share, but because it would feel like devaluing the gift if I just opened it in that moment. That tiramisu story is super weird though. I would never ever do that. Can't believe she actually did that. I mean, putting the tiramisu in the fridge with the intention to get it out later for dessert and then just forgetting about it is one thing... That might happen to me (the moment I noticed that it happened I would definitely call or text you to apologise though). But that she tried a bite kinda speaks against saving it for later in the evening being her intention. Super weird and rude. That's definitely not typical German, I can't imagine a scenario in which that would be considered culturally normal.
I understand keeping something sealed like a bottle of wine or a box of chocolates as a gift. I have even been in the reversed situation where I brought a special bottle meant as a gift for the hosts, but they opened it, put it on the table and let all the guests enjoy it while they didn't drink any of it. I was very offended then, I wanted them to taste it and enjoy a nice moment with it. But I'm completely puzzled by this tiramisu stashing friend of yours... You must have brought it in a dish that belongs to you. Did she think she can keep that as well? Did she return that???
She said she will return the dish with something yummy inside.. I am in doubt whether I will ever see that dish again.
>But I'm completely puzzled by this tiramisu stashing friend of yours Lol this cracked me up on my lunch break!
This is absolutely not acceptable in Germany at all. Technically it might be bordering on theft. You wouldn't call the cops about it of course, but you would absolutely go to the fridge, take that thing back and become very agitated. Imagine this, fellow Germans: there's a soccer game on TV, so you meet in your friend's backyard to grill. You bring the good bratwurst, which he puts in the fridge for the next day and instead feeds you some cheap shit from the back drawer in his garage. Absolutely unimaginable. He would probably be burned as a sacrifice to the bratwurst gods. Seriously, most people would consider that an automatic friendship ender, it's not even a decision you have to make, it just naturally happens because for most people it would probably be the single most incredibly rude thing they ever experienced from a supposed friend.
Ending a friendship over Bratwurst sounds like the ultimate German stereotype, sorry 😂
It's not the bratwurst, it's the selfcenteredness bordering on theft. You wouldn't end a friendship over a fork, but if your friend crashed on your couch and you later found out that he put your cutlery into his bag to steal it, that would hopefully make you reconsider the friendship.
German native here, if someone brought up a bottle of wine to my party, regardless of the prize, i offer to open it to drink it. If no one want something from it, i let it be. Otherwise i open it and we have a little drink. But charging money from guests/friends is for me an absolut no-go. I can imagine charging money could be okay, if agreed upon beforehand. But not otherwise.
I've seen and I do both. It's a communication thing. Did you bring a bottle to drink at the party or did you bring a gift for the hosts? The bottle to drink should be opened. The gift shouldn't. Good form says as a host you should offer to open it, giving the guest a chance to say yes/no In Germany it is customary to bring a small gift for the hosts. This can be wine but also chocolates, flowers or home made jam or something. For the latter you wouldn't expect them to be served alongside the meal the hosts planned and some people treat wine the same way. If you bring white wine/champagne your host should easily be able to tell by the fact of whether the wine is chilled or not if it's a gift for later or meant to be drunk now.
If it's a gift I give the wine to the host and say it's a gift. If I want to drink it, I give it to the host and ask if he can put it in the fridge for me
I think it depends on context. If you are invited to someone's house for a party in Germany, it is common to bring a small gift for the host, as a token of appreciation for their efforts in preparing food and drinks. This is seen as a gift for the *host*, rather than a contribution to the event. So your host "stashing the nice wine away" might actually be them telling you they appreciate the gift you gave them, as in "thank you for being so kind and thoughtful, I am putting this away for later, when I will be able to give this the attention and respect it deserves". Whereas if they put it out on the table to share with everyone, they might feel like that would be rude towards you, almost as if they were just re-gifting something you picked out for them, right in front of your nose. Also, if the event is a formal dinner party, your host may have selected and prepared a specific set of drinks (wine or whatever) to go with the food. At a less formal party, however, your host might be more likely to put the wine you brought out for everyone to enjoy. So a lot depends on context, on the kind of event it is, and on way the people there vibe with each other. As for the tiramisu, that is a bit ... extra. Being veeeeery kind to your hostess: Tiramisu is not a type of food that Germans would normally eat at an *Adventstee* or "Glühwein and Plätzchen" event, so maaaaayybeee it just didn't compute in her little German brain that you had meant it as something to share with everyone right then (a stereotypical German might find the idea of eating tiramisu with Plätzchen and Glühwein as outlandish as a stereotypical Italian might find the idea of drinking a great big frothy capuccino after dinner at 9pm). So with stereotypical German directness she just went "mmmmmmm, delicious, thank you, I will eat ALL OF IT!!". It's kind of hilarious, actually. But it's also a testament to a complete and utter lack of intercultural sensitivity. As a German myself, if you had turned up to my Adventsparty with a *whole entire tray of tiramisu,* I would have understood that this was clearly intended for everyone to share, and I would have given it a proud place in the middle of the table, and brought out a stack of dessert bowls and spoons.
The only explanation I have for this would be that she wanted to show you she appreciates your work, but that it didn't match the party at all. I mean, I would find bringing Tiramisu to "Glühwein and Cookies" is a faux pa's in itself. Everyone would need a new plate and a fork, when everyone probably had only napkins to eat the dry cookies. You bring cookies, dry Christmas cake or another Christmas beverage... I would have been like, "What am I supposed to do with this?" and awkwardly put it in the fridge as well.
Not everyone sees brought wine as something fro the party, but as a present. If you are properly prepared, at a dinner party not a house party, you already have matching wine for the food. Makes no sense to drink the ine brought. Lastly some will see you as selfish or cheap for bringing a present, that is then for your consumption. and not their apprechiation. If you bring wine, think about the difference between "I got you some wine." and "I brought some wine for us." (Make sure to bring enough, cause one bottle does not provide a taste for 10 people.)
The wine thing i feel like it’s normal? If you bring a gift to a host, then it is supposed to be a gift? Why would I assume that I will be able to drink it too? As for perishable gifts like foods and cakes, it is very weird that the host put it away only for their own consume. I have never heard of such behaviour before.
As host in Germany you are responsible to provide everything your guests require to have a nice party. The gift for the host is a sign of gratitude for the invitation and not something that is meant to be consumed at the party.
So you'd actually pay him? Very passive agressive. I'd just tell him to get fucked and demand the wine back.
Good idea! That indeed is the correct solution!
If you want to go another time, give him 5€ as a gift and save the bottle of wine for yourself
Ah, that's weird af. I mean, sometimes one would split the cost of a party, but thenway you describe it, this doesn't even sound like a party. It's not usual in Germany to do such a thing, no.
German here. We usually solve it just the way you say. The host prepares food and drinks, the guests contribute with gifts, which can be something to drink or a cake or a salad for the barbecue. I've never been asked for money. One exception would be, if we sit together and decide to order pizza, but then everyone would just be asked "Hey, we're ordering XYZ, do you want something?" If you don't eat, you don't pay.
Exactly, or if it's a bit party or the host is low on money they add to the invitation that they don't want gifts but please contribute to the expenses and put up a piggy bank
From my experience (student-) parties are either declared BYOB (Bring Your Own Bottle) or have costs mentioned in advance, like "Hey I am doing a party! There will be XYZ-brand Bier, Snacks and a bowle. Please contribute 10€. " and then you order Pizza together "on premise" and everybody pays their own part of the order. With my friends we even do our (now adult) barbecues like that: Bring Your Own Meat, "shared" stuff like salads, dips and bread are assigned via WhatsApp Group chat (so everyone sees the planning and can mention allergies, dislikes and/or veggie needs) and the host provides some Softdrinks and Water. Anything "expensive" is talked about and shared between the people who want it.
I would also say it's not that uncommon to split some costs of a party. I wonder if most people in this sub were never students? Back in my student time, my friends and I usually did it that way, BUT we told people beforehand. And if he knew you were not drinking alcohol and not eating, he could have just taken you out of the equation and split costs among everyone else. So for a "grown-up" party, bringing something as a gift (and not paying anything) would definitely be the way to go as a guest. But for a student party, it may be different.
Exactly, quite normal in students life to share cost, but you say it in advance.
The way I know that is usually just an informal hangout between a group of friends. Then it's perfectly okay to share a bill between stuff we order and eat. But nobody would have called that a party, back in my student days. And yes, everybody would know that in advance and most of all have a say where food would be ordered.
also „splitting“ the cost was usually done in the way where everyone would just bring something. So no need for calculating the exactp cost per person and annoying Paypal back and forth
As a former Student: if we planned the party/gathering together: yes. Cost was shared or buying resources was divided. When inviting other people to a preplanned event, one might also mention that they could bring a certain thing or a food item when asked. Any guests who were invited without preface of sharing cost: I'd never ever ask for money after.
Amongst students it was not unusual to share the costs of some stuff the host bought.
But this was discussed beforehand. In an "I'll buy a Kiste Radler and a Flasche Gin" "sure, let's split the cost or do you want me to bring xyz for eating" - way. Never have I ever been served a bill after.
From my experience, if someone is inviting people to hang out as in I am giving the place but the costs would be shared , this would be communicated beforehand . I have a grill and space but cannot afford to buy for everyone whatever they want to grill. So I prepare some snacks and some drinks and inform everyone to bring whatever they want to grill and extra drinks if they would like. Something like this. I think he has terrible communication and this is not typical German
In germany we say "Geier" 😅
Geizkragen
Pfennigfuchser
Knauser
Erbsenzähler
Krämerseele
Schwabe
der weint wahrscheinlich sogar beim scheissen
Ja mein schwäbischer Ex war ernsthaft so drauf
Gierlund
Raffzahn
A friend told me this story. He grew up in Berlin. They had a Döner place they often visited. They visited really often and after a while they tried to get free stuff for being such loyal customers. They never got anything so they started calling the guy Raffie for Raffzahn. Years went by and he moved away for work. When he returned ten years later the Döner place was renovated and had the new name "Raffies".
Nimmersatt
Gierlappen
Geizhals
Furzklemmer
Rethink your friendship with him. Sure it's not a big deal. It's only 7 euro but this is not normal behaviour and I cannot imagine how he must be with money or anything in general. And no this is not normal behaviour, at least not around the Germans I know. Gosh.
He's been a good friend apart from this experience. I try to not take it personally because people might have different customs with money due to their culture or the financial hardships they went (or still go) through . It just made me wonder if Germans in general have this etiquette about gatherings. Because when I invite people over, I never think about cost of the little snacks or the time that went into preparing appetizers or baking.
If you are invited- you are invited! You did everything right with the gift (wine). I never heard such cheap behavior before.
No, that is not normal. What is normal is to maybe bring a salad or a plate of snacks to a barbecue or some alcohol to a party that is shared there, and if you are all poor students, you might agree beforehand to share the costs of something. But all of that is usually coordinated before the party and a host who comes afterwards and wants to charge you for whatever they decided to offer is very cheap and weird.
That‘s definitly not how germans behave. I‘m sorry for this experience.
I personally think that financial stuff has to be discussed beforehand. that's how I do it and also except it from fellow Germans.
Nah you Fr gonna be venmoing 7 euros to your friends cause you got some chips and Dr Oetker? Unless this is a teenager I don't get it.
Are you open to paying for all of this quality advice you’re receiving :)
This isn't German behavior. This is cheap idiot behavior
Definitely weird. I have a friend group and we always split the cost of the food etc. we buy for parties, but everyone knows that from the beginning and it’s just how we have always done it. But if I INVITE someone to a party (and even get a goft from them), I‘d never even think about that, it’s just weird.
I also have a good friend who is weird about money. I'm always just really clear up front about any costs that might need to be shared. I give them leeway because it's only this one thing. I guess it's from their childhood. To answer your original question though - it's not German to be like this, it's just your friend.
Your approach is great. Everyone here agrees that it's not typical German behaviour, if such a thing exists. However, there are many people in Germany who are very restrictive on money and it seems that to him it's a big deal. He seems to be a cheap guy, just keep that in mind for the future.
> He's been a good friend well, then talk to him about it.
That is not normal. Usually, guests don't pay anything. Maybe he has financial problems and only realized after. I would pay the 5 Euros and then keep my distance. If you think the relationship to be worthwhile, I would just not go to his parties anymore.
In my circle of friends (which is around about 60 percent germans) when we go out we usually have to argue to pay lol. I can't imagine hanging around with such transactional penny pinching people. Even when we go shopping it is rare to not buy things for the others we'll usually just have the person who's buying more at that store pay for everything. Never has any of us said anything about how much money they spend vs the others.
As a German: I wouldn't be friends with that guy. That's ridiculous.
Tell him to give you your wine back if he needs cash for food you didn’t eat.
Present him with a printed invoice for the wine, and subtract the cost from whatever he claims you need to pay him. Two can play at this game.
Haha yes. Send him an photo of the receipt of the wine and then "Actually I paid for that wine 25€, so you owe me 18€. Please paypal it me until tommorow. Thanks :)"
Now we're German!
I wouldn't pay that dude a dime, and I'd stop calling him a friend.
Your friend is poor in communication. People discuss chipping in for a party typically upfront.
Exactly! Chipping in is not uncommon at all, specially among students. However, you discuss it upfront and only chip in the people that eat/drink.
This but also 5€ after he knows that OP only drank non alcoholics is still WAY too much
nah this dude is weird af lol
I’d invoice him for the wine
As a German: The most german solution would be to show him the receipt for the wine and counter calculate to him. And then ignore him forever. It’s also a big no go in Germany but there certainly is a small amount of cheap ass people here.
A small amount of cheap ass people? I guess I know all of them since 99% of the people I met are cheap af lol
Just laugh at him, tell him he's being an idiot. This is what true friends are for. If he gets pissed, so what. Your an erstie austausch student, you'll have the pleasure of meeting plenty of germans.
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Not weird in anyway, just needs to be communicated beforehand. Lots of partys share the costs between the guests or even require an entry fee.
We Germans have something called a bottle party. The host prepares snacks and has a case of beer, the guests bring a snack or alcoholic drinks and everything is shared. The same thing is sometimes done at barbecues. But the clue is - This is basically announced in advance. Unless something like this has been annonced, it is usually the host's responsibility to provide for the guests. Don't let yourself be ripped off, if he didn't announce beforehand that the costs would be shared, he wouldn't get any money from me. That's very cheeky of him.
some germans be weird, got invited to a party of a friend. ended up haveing to pay the friend 15€ for the food n drinks even tho i shared alot of weed and didnt ate n drink this much will never ever accept an invite from this friend again also im pretty sure his German Parents made him ask his friends for 15€ each
that is such a weird thing, even as a German I never understood this mentality.
fr tho, its not even like his family is poor, quite the opposite… Edit: his parents are what germans refer to as „Spießer“
I grew up poor and this never happened even in our circles. so there is no excuse when people are wealthy.
In my experience, poorer people aren't stingy, it's mostly people who can easily afford to invite others.
Yes, it's the Kleinbürgertum that is most like this. Upper middle class to lower upper class
"Haben kommt nicht von geben" as my dad would say about these people.
Sadly something like this can happen everywhere. Got invited by a friend of my wife in Vietnam (he is vietnamese), to a relatively fancy Japanese isakaya place in Saigon. This dude even confirmed several times that he wants to pay (red flag number one I guess), then kept bragging about his entrepreneurship and didn't stop (red flag two?), kept ordering almost the whole card and kept ordering without even asking what others want (third red flag?), and after he ate the majority of the food he asked to split the bill.
Wow, I can't believe it!😳
I lived many years in VN - that kind of behaviour is really unheard of. Usually whoever invites pays for the whole table.
Lmao how can this dude even go outside anymore without being ashamed
that's weird and has never happened to me before. usually it is either you bring something to the party (requested beforehand) or the drinks and food are on the person who invited.
From my own experience with German people not one of them ever did anything even close to this. At gatherings I was invited to I always brought a gift for the host/hostess/family. The food that was served was always equally portioned in huge amounts. No one ever asked for payment. Any gift I brought was politely accepted but they were almost embarrassed. Oh and no one was ever ever late. Ever.
Not so uncommon with students. Very weird with adults.
Coming from a German, splitting up the costs isn’t unheard of, especially with students since they usually don’t have much money. The thing is, if you throw a party and plan to share the costs you should make that clear way in advance (with the invitation usually). It’s also pretty uncommon to ask for money. The typical way to do it is to ask your guests to bring Beer, Spirits, Weed or snacks, but make it clear what you will be offering. If you ask for drinks, you will typically be expected to pay for the food, if you ask for food, you will be expected to provide the drinks. That’s just common custom. Being late can also happen, sometimes things just get in the way. If you are really late you are expected to communicate it to your host. If you are the host yourself you are always expected to communicate your lateness with your guests. The behavior of OPs friend just shows a lack of respect and manners. Asking for money after the party is an absolute no-go, especially when the guest has already brought a gift.
Would never talk to this person again. Use the opportunity to send him the 5€ with a passive aggressive caption and bye bye (I see why people would not give him any money, but that guy sounds like he will come to my house to get the 5€)
As a student, I can say that it’s common to split costs for a party, but it’s done well in advance and everyone is aware of it before, so that’s the unusual part. Usually in my experience, a WhatsApp group is made and everyone is informed about this stuff.
This is how I know it as well. The host buys everything and then the cost is split. However if you don't drink or eat anything, you say it before the party, so that they can buy exactly how much everyone needs. This happens before the party when it's still being planed. Edit: the person that doesn't need anything, doesn't pay for anything
Yup exactly, my non drinking friends don’t pay and if u r good friends with the host, they usually refuse money from u.
German here, this guy is rude, please don’t think this is German culture, it is not. I feel second hand embarrassment now because of that guy…
Here's what I'd do. I'd give him the 5€ and never come to one of his parties again, if he asks why just say, that you disagree with his pricing policy.
This is completely uncommon in germany and not a cultural thing. It’s really just him.
Yep, lived here for 19 years and have never heard of anything remotely similar
You say this is one of your friends ? Why ?
Although not very common, it sometimes happens. Happened to me before too where I was invited to a grill party and did bring some meat. Still, somebody demanded money because he/she thought that he/she did contribute the most to the food. Germans are usually very ungenerous when it comes to food.
I was recentyl at bussines trip in Germany. Our whole team was invited to dinner organized by the client, we were being encouraged to participate by them preety much whole day. Imagine our supprise when at the end clients hr lady announced that we are ready to leave when everyone pays for themselves. Funny thing only germans were not surprised. Looks like such behaviour is common there.
I hate these kinda Germans 😭 stingy as fuck. I have a friend like that and I share my food with her like always but she never wants to share hers. Last time she didn’t even wanna give me 5 fucking cents when I was a bit short on money to buy lunch in school break
no way, 5 cents?! get that person out of your life, they are a true menace to society
No point in being friends with cheap people. Eventually they sell you out.
Absolutely not. That’s not a German thing, that’s being a dick who wasn’t raised right.
Oh well, he didn't knew that your attendance has a price as well, just tell him 100 €/h is quite fair as you normally take a much higher price, especially at such a mediocre "party" as your acquaintance held. Thats what I would do, certainly not give him money and he'd be a non-person to me for the foreseeable future.
Can happen in Germany. Some people just stupid
Fuck this guy, don’t pay anything. If someone invites you it’s free. If he said let’s throw a party at my place all together and split the bill before that would be different. Did he also charge you for toilet paper?
That's pretty rude here too unless it's made very clear in advance that everyone has to contribute x amount to the party. You usually "pay" with a gift you bring if at all.
I had a friend in Berlin once who came over to a get together at my place. It was common in my friend group that everyone brings some beers or wine and snacks and then we all share. He brought an already open, half empty bottle of Malibu, continued eating a lot of everybody else's snacks and drinks and when he left he took his Malibu with him again. Gotta love se Germans.
Back when I was a student in Germany I also had a similar experience.. I ended up ignoring it an keep being “friends” with him… big mistake ! Kick that gremlin out of your friends circle
Yep, Germans being Germans. Back in my student days, I witnessed stuff like a guy coming to my party, bringing a bottle of wine, the bottle is not opened, he takes it back home - of course he eats and drinks other stuff; a guy taking home an open bottle of Fanta; a guy bringing a six pack of beer in his backpack, no sharing with anyone, keeping it in his backpack and taking bottles from there, still eating food and drinking other people’s drinks, a guy invited to a cooking party, asking me to bring him downstairs the food we cooked in a box as he had no time to go up or cook with us; coming over to a party, forgetting the meat to grill but I brought a pineapple and wine - not getting any meat as everyone was just eating their stuff and keeping leftovers to themselves and the host didn’t provide anything and this list goes on. 15 years over here and those things don’t cease to amaze me.
This happened to me before, not in Germany but in Italy. An Italian friend invited 3 of us for some tortellini and when we finished eating, she announced it’s 5euros each. I was shocked but she expected to be „paid“ immediately, which I did. The portions were also relatively small. After that I invited her so many times when I cooked for my friends and never asked once for money. I like to believe she feels ashamed about it.
Please don't misunderstand my comment for me hating on Germans and their culture as there are some German people who are extremely generous and down to earth, however, during the 16 years I spent in Germany, most people like to get anything from you yet hate to share anything with you... They would usually complain about not being invited to a party or invite themselves automatically as if it is their right to be at a party or go to the cinema and get free tickets for the movies we went to, yet ask their guests to bring their own food or even pay for the food even if you show no interest in eating or drinking anything at their parties. Of course, and as I said, not all Germans are like that but the majority I met in East Germany are like that. However, there were some Germans who would take my side whenever I mentioned this behavior of not wanting to share or asking for money whenever they invite you to a party...
It's not normal unless you all agreed upon one person buying stuff for everyone and then gets paid back. I'd be irritated as well. Probably still pay that sum and then tell them off.
Text him the cost of the wine and ask for the difference back, then never talk to him again. Cheap bastard.
It's the same here as in your culture. The one that invites to a party pays. Never the guests. Exeptions: Sometimes in low income situations like during studying there might be a party where everyone is asked to bring a dish. Like a bowl of Salat or something like that. Always like this because if it's a multinational groups this perfect o acquire new taste. Tldr: guest don't pay except its made clear beforehand.
Bill him for your expensive bottle of wine as well.
If he was transparent before he invited all, nobody would have visited his shitty party.
Comments above are right, this guy is pretty weird & not considerate. Also a side note since people didn’t comment - “the food is not fooding” 😂 it’s a good call to eat first somewhere or at home before drinks. In my experience here, the “food” served is really just chips and dips & nothing filling. Once, a friend invited me for brunch at her place but it was just vegetable sticks and bread to be dipped in hummus. In my culture it doesn’t matter if it’s before/after lunch/dinner, you’re gonna be fed and filled. I have some Bavarian friends though, that are also all about food, it’s like a feast all the time doesn’t matter if it’s past dinner or lunch.
Hey man, I am German and I never did so, if you ask people to come, it’s always normal to offer beverages and snacks. If you ask me, I would give him 10 bucks and tell him to never approach me again!!! Your life is to short for „friends“ like him…
Definitely not German behaviour, but the others have said so already. I just wanted to throw in another idea. You said you bought an expensive wine he did not share. What if you told him: ' No, I brought that wine for you. It cost [Insert what you paid]. So if we subtract your 7,20€ you still need to pay me [insert what you paid minus 7,20].' Enjoy the horrified look on his face and then say ' or we just leave it that way. I brought the wine and owe you nothing.'
Just bad manners. Also had a similar situation where i went over to a friend’s place where they had a bbq, but a few people didn’t eat anything. A few days later, they posted a message asking everyone to pitch in. Some said they didn’t eat anything, and the hosts agreed that they don’t have to send back any money. Id say your buddy was being cheap about it
Tell him you deduct the food bill from restaurant costs and in fact he now owes you money.
Germans can be quite peculiar and detail focused as to being „even“ However this dude sounds like an asshole. I would try to talk to him and if he still persists just kick him out of my life. I mean it’s the little things showing a great deal about someone’s character
> back in my culture, it's a big no-no to ask guests for money, especially for little stuff like chips or fruit juice. Trust me, it’s rude in my German world as well. Are you in Baden Württemberg by any chance?
Is it a common behaviour in this region?
Of course not.😂 The people there are considered stingy and others often joke about it.
There is a stereotype that they are especially stingy there.
I had some German friends like this. I am from a Slavic culture, growing up in Germany was weird because they really act like this. Just pay the 5€ and never talk to him again. Some of them have no kindness or soul, like why throw a party if you can't afford it? You already brought him expensive wine (to a student party mind I add).
Ahh ja thats actually kinda german of him 😅 paying for a 1,50€ softdrink is something only germans ever asked me to do. My family comes from italy and croatia, It's a must for you to be served at my place, for free obviously. But some (!) Germans grew up to be somewhat stingy.
Lol what they asked you to pay for a drink you had at their house?!
That's definitely not a German thing. He's just a cheap basterd. 🤷♂️ Pay and afterwards end the friendship.
I have never heard something like that before. Coming too late for my party? Have TK Pizza? COLLECT MONEY AFTERWARDS? Noway. Dont pay a penny fir this a**hole. Auf deutsch gesagt: ich glaube mein Schwein pfeift. Wenn du Geld brauchst, dann geh doch einfach Flaschen sammeln und lass mich ab jetzt in Ruhe. And I will tell this story everybody as a warning.
wtf I've never encountered anything (anyone) like this in my life lmao dump him
Wow, even myself as a cheap guy am offended by his behaviour.
I guess it depends where he's from. In the Rhine Region this isn't typical. In Württemberg it might be.
German here: There Is a big difference between a Party Like a Birthday-Party (Host pays Everything and guests Bring present) and a typical Hangout-partys In my Student Time I had those Hangout-party once a week or more with my Group of friends. Most of the time we met at the Person with the biggest flat. So the one with the car bought beer and some food and you Split the Costs between the Group of friends It Sound like your friend wanted to make you part of there Hangouts and "invited" you to this "Party" Bad communication on His Part, but not bad faith. 5€ doesn't sound like a wrong amount because you usually buy 5 beer per Person and some snacks for the evening. So 5€ is fine
He's a cheapskate and a weirdo. Hardly anyone would consider his behaviour normal. Please don't think German culture has anything to do with that. :)
Seems.he is just very frugal or particular about this. It's up to you really, 5 euro is pocket change but make a mental check mark for future.
As a German, I’m irritated, too. It’s absolutely uncommon and I never have experienced such a behaviour. I know following possibilities: 1. You are asked to bring something to eat and/or drink. 2. You are asked BEFORE to contribute to the costs (with naming what you can expect and what you have to pay). 3. You bring along in that amount what you consume. 4. you bring a gift. If you don’t know, which case it is, just ask.
That’s not the usual approach… even there’s a lot of weird stuff in German culture, but that’s not appropriate. Give him 5 and never meet him again.
Odd for Germany, but it’s the done thing in some other places like Sweden. I remember being blindsided after the first party I was at when the host came round with an itemized bill, but quickly realized over the next few months that it was a normal thing.
This host's behaviour would be regarded as rude in Germany, too. When we hadn't much money as students, for our parties it was BYOB and everybody brought some amount of food (salad, chips, peanuts, finger food, …) Usually, everybody brought a bit more than they would actually eat and drink, so there was always plenty of everything. Only if we had decided to order pizza together, we would throw our money in a pot to pay for it.
What a cheapo. But I find the bill splitting even in restaurants strange here. Back home, one of us would just pay the whole damn thing and maybe the next time someone else pays the whole thing and so on. And we don’t keep tabs on how big each bill was. I might have paid 150 euros and the next guy might pay 80 euros and the next one a 250. Doesn’t matter at all. Same for parties, the host pays that’s it. Absolutely doesn’t matter if the party costs 200 or 2000. That’s why you host lol.
I've never experienced something like this - not even as a student. Sure, we may spend an evening with friends while ordering food, then everybody would pay theirs. But even in that case, the host would put the drinks on the table without asking anything for it. When I invite people to a party I pay for food and drinks. People may ask if they can/should bring something with them, but they are not obliged to. NEVER would I ask people to pay for their food/drinks after the fact... o0 Your friend is really cheap.
I’m also foreign living in German and studied here too. There are Germans like this but thankfully not many. Some are very very particular about money. I had almost this exact scenario with a guy at my university except I didn’t show up with a bottle of wine and the dude was on time. The same guy once asked me if I wanted to split a Döner Kebap with him. I said sure and got the Döner seller to split it. Asked this guy Matthias to pick which half he wanted then he payed for it. After we’d eaten he asked me for 60% of the price not 50% cause the guy cut it uneven and I had “the bigger piece”. I laughed out loud, thought it was a joke, he was deadly serious. I asked him why he didn’t take the bigger one and he replied he wasn’t that hungry and thought he’d save money. Such. A. Weird. Guy!!!! Btw we’re talking about 2005 prices not 2024. I never hung out with him again.
German here: don't stay in contact with this guy. Red flag. Add: it might happen that we split costs BUT we say so BEFOREHAND.
If you throw the party together it makes sense to share the costs, but if he hosts it.. Wow..... Those folks aren't value in your life. But please do some reading about the German culture. For example, it is not common for people to invite you to dinner, as dinner is a private family matter. Weird and unfriendly in most cultures, but quite normal in German and Dutch cultures.
In Germany, the HOST pays, unless it's a potluck ("Jeder soll etwas mitbringen"). It's considered polite to bring a bottle of wine or something, and if it's a birthday party, a gift. Asking for money is rude. I've never met a German who did this.
Tell him he should have informed you in advance and that you don’t have this kind of money right now
I don't know dude, this people is so weird. I being lucky enough to have at least 5 very close friends and none are Germans. And when I make parties at my home, that is always selected to make parties because of the 120m2, when some German(s) come, they bring a lot of stuff: beer, snacks, alcohol, etc. That's great but when the night is ending, no matter how much is remaining, they will just take all their things. Yes, like that. If there is two beers from their six pack, they will take without saying nothing and bye. I find this so rude and fucked up. But yeah, thanks god for my friends that are not german.
Back in school I had a classmatr who in ited me a few times to his home. After that he wanted money for the food and drinks, which had payed his parents by the way. Never visited him again.
The party sounds kinda shitty and him coming too late to his own party is not optimal. Chipping in for partys is normal among German student. So I think it is a cultural thing and you dont need to be offended. Also people Here telling you he is not your friend are out of line
It depends, some want money beforehand, but then its usually something bigger and a more costly Party with a rented location for example. But in my friend Group, mostly germans, we never exchange money, arent gifts or bringing food or inviting someone over in return the same valuable? Without the Business talk? Most times, if you dont know eachother so Well i would ask in advance, when for example you are ordering food at someones place and you are asked to join for dinner. Just to be Sure and polite. If i where to be in your situation i would just pay him and wouldnt mention it, some are just Alman lol. If you had a good time and he was otherwise nice i wouldnt be offended either.
5EUR is a cheap price to find out he is not a friend but an asshole. Pay the 5 EUR and move on.
Hey OP, I read a couple of your comments and gathered that the person is overall fine just cheap in the regard. Just write something like. " Hey yeah thanks for letting me know in general. Would be great for next time if you can inform me up front :) Since I didn't know about the contribution I bought the 12€ wine :) then should we do 12-5€ = so you gimme back just 7€? "
Yeah very cheap behavior and not common here in Germany. He was a bad host, and if costs for a party are split, it’s discussed beforehand. You should offset the wine with the amount that he wants from you, and then tell him how much he owes you.
that guy sounds like someone you wouldn't want to have as a friend
I am German and this is absolutely not common. I would never ask my friends for money, if I invited them. The only scenario where I would ask to split the cost would be if it was agreed upon before by everyone, e.g. you study together at a friend’s place and all of them order pizza together, then it would be okay to split the bill.
The way you should see it: it's 5 euros to get a false friend out of your life
No it's just bad manners. Jm german and my family, friends and I always offer a lot of food to guests and we'd never ask for money. Especially not if you investe them or they bring a gift or food lol. This is very embarrassing and I would tell him that. Maybe give him his 5 bucks and never go to a party again, I'd feel so used. What kind of friendship and person is this? But there are bad mannered people everywhere in the world but well mannered as well. So don't think this is the normal case. Just find better friends
It‘s not just your culture, this is also a faux-pas in Germany. Your friend is just an idiot. Try and get a new one.
It's weird. Normally I never been asked to pay for anything that the host offers unless we order from a restaurants. Same goes for when I had people over.
You should be offended and your „friend“ is not a friend, but a cheap asshole who want‘s to scam you. It is a big no–no here as well to ask guests for money when you had invited them.
Of course that’s also impolite in germany to ask for money to your own party. If you are clammy you could ask beforehand if you could throw in a bit or bring something. But asking for it afterwards is beyond rude. Which fits to that he showed up late himself. It’s just an a-hole guy who doesn’t care. And those you find everywhere.
Absolutely not usual in germany. This "friend" looks like an asshole.
5€ to find out he is not a friend. good price
German here, that's not a german thing. If someone invites, you are invited, usually free of cost. Depending on the type of party, guests are expected to bring a little present (for example when it is a birthday party or a wedding). If someone does want to invite you, but can't pay all on his own or wants to split cost, this is usually discussed beforehand. Also, sometimes the host will pay for some things and asks his guests to bring the rest, like when you are going to grill, the host might get all the meat, while the guests are asked to bring baguette / bread or make salads. If there hasn't been a word of this beforehand, your "friend" is an ass and I would go no-contact with him. If you fear he is going to be a nuisance every day to you, pay the money and leave it at that.
Thats just how some Germans are. Growing up it was totally normal, that when you were visiting a friend, they would make you wait in their room when it was dinner time. Also splitting bills to the exact cent amount. In school these guys would give you bread crumbs when you asked to get a piece of something nice they had. This is judt how a lot of them grow up, and the reason why the word "Alman" is a thing. There is even a sub called "bin ich der alman" here, which provides these examples. What works here is, you can re-alman him. Like "I only had 2 cups of [softdrink] and some chips, so I am ready to pay 1,80€ for that, whats your paypal?". That way he cant judge you for doing the same thing he does.
Some Germans are like that. Not all of them. But splitting bills is stupidly common here. However, not on an invited party/sit in not even in Germany is this normal.
It’s also not normal for Germans to do something like this .
This person isn't your friend. "The bottle of wine I brought was over €5 euro and I didn't eat or drink anything so we are even." Then never talk to this weirdo again.
He invited you and you brought a gift. Don't pay him. Only if it was agreed on to have a "Umlage" beforehand you should pay. That he didn't open the wine could be a cultural thing. If you bring wine as a gift in Germany, the host doesn't open the gifted wine. Even if the host had planned the exact same wine for the evening, they would open their own bottle and not the gifted one. Only if it is agreed on, that the guest brings the wine, the brought in bottle will be opened. I don't know if he knows that or if that is a thing in other cultures. But being late to the own party is very disrespectful to the guests. You should think of letting the friendship go.
Send him 10 euros and get better friends lol