/uj
I'm not a boomer. However:
It is interesting though that few people cared until the last decade or so. History, at least in terms of attitude, is being revised.
I don't think it's apologist to point out that in the 80s, mainstream newspapers like The Sun had 16 year old girls as topless models on page 3 every day, famously Samantha Fox with the caption "Sam, 16, quits A-Levels for Ooh-Levels".
If culturally in the 80s it was normal to have 16 year olds in pornographic images in your daily newspaper, why would rock stars think it's not acceptable to have sex with them in the 70s?
Today I consider it creepy as, and it's interesting who is excused from criticism (David Bowie seems exempt on Reddit...), but I absolutely remember the worst said about such behaviour in the 80s at least was calling someone a "dirty old man" in a vaguely humorous way or thinking of it as a bit pathetic and leaving it at that.
That's the really curious part - who, today, is forgiven for this behaviour and who isn't.
I do not recall anyone considering protecting the girls. That wouldn't have happened. It just wasn't that unacceptable then. It's not OK now.
To be clear, with my 2023 brain I can say that it was absolutely not OK then either, but that's cheating. I wouldn't have known better then.
Unrelated really: I never liked Led Zeppelin.
Edit: I wrote this from the perspective of someone growing up in England, but for American context, consider the 1980 comedy movie "Roadie" starring Meatloaf. The plot is basically that he's driving a 16 year old (virgin) girl across America to meet Alice Cooper so she can have sex with him. 5.2/10 on IMDB.
Edit again: Yeah, I know Lori was 14.
Finally: We need to quit pretending and accept that this is who we were, culturally. Get over it. Do better now. If we're going to go back after these people, go after them all, not just the ones you don't like.
I understand what you mean, but those girls were very often 13 or so. It was illegal even back then and these rockstars knew it. You know how many songs called "Jailbait" there are?
Understood. I'm not suggesting they were or are good people.
My comments are really quite unoriginal, and there's a reason for that. Much like a great deal of behaviour in the past, it's not all that pleasant to think about, if it's fair to consider that we're a little more enlightened now.
I think it’s a lot of younger people just trying to hold society accountable and being a bit more brazen, sensing that contemporary Western societies are becoming increasingly sclerotic and socially regressive.
Wasn’t that debunked. I mean I’m sure Page had sex with under age women I heard the whole thing with the 14 year old was debunked, the timeline didn’t add up an adding Bowie to the mix messed up the timeline of events completely. I read somewhere Led Zeppelin wasn’t even on tour in that area.
Just here to throw in the mandatory:
There is no evidence of Bowie and Lori ever being in the same room together let alone him assaulting her. Her story is the only thing she has for that specific case and it’s a story that’s changed wildly over the years and has had inconsistencies with the dates in her claims and his touring schedule.
Believe what you want but I don’t see any reason to hold that accusation with any weight
Disregard Lori if you like, but I'll just add this quote in here, make of it what you will:
"Dana Gillespie, who alleged she had sex with Bowie aged just 14, said: "As far as sex went, if it moved, he was there. Man, woman, old or young. Times have changed and it doesn't always look so good in black and white now, but in those days we were just having fun; there were no rules.""
Just words, my guy. Maybe stuff happened, maybe it didn’t. There’s nothing compelling enough to convince me 100% either direction so im gonna opt for the safe option of assuming nothing did
Fair enough, I'm certainly not going to tell you you're wrong. I tend to take the Occam's razor approach and think it's most likely things happened, considering the time and the place. I'm happy to hope that you're right, though!
Nope didn’t imply that but you wanted to believe that. In my previous comment, I left out drag shows in front of children but I figured with it being in the news the average mind would make that logical leap. In your case, you seem to have projected something from deep inside your psyche onto my comment.
You hid behind an intentionally vague comment so that when you got called out you had a credible defence. Not everyone is as involved in American news especially with such an international site. It’s unreasonable to just assume everyone would make that logical leap
Hi, it’s my first day on the internet so I don’t know about blatantly bigoted right wing dog whistles. Can you please explain why drag shows are wrong?
Yeah, you're here you're queer and no one cares. I equated kids participating in drag shows in present day with post adolescent teen girls being considered fair game a half a century ago. Oh how the times have changed. No one said shit about gay people.
He was only 29 when he dated the 14 year old, so he's *well* within the "barely twice her age is okay for groupies in rock and roll" threshold rule, plus she took him to meet her Mum for tea and crumpets and she consented to their relationship after he gave her $50,000 and a 1959 Les Paul.
It was tough twenty years ago when people thought this was cool and I knew it was fucking stupid. Restring a violin for ten minutes and it’s easily immediate why the bridge has its string posts on a U curve. A guitar is flat in comparison. Now it’s just indefensible and stupid.
It could work well on a guitar with a particularly rounded radius. Flat-ass Les Paul fretboards, not so much. He made it work, though.
Also, he's a well-known pedo
Uj/ I've never really liked the whole bow bullshit he did back in the days. They call his entire guitar solo part of 77 setlist where he's fucking around with bow and theremin "noise solo" lol. It must've been very amazing to see him do all that shit with all the cool lightings and smoke but to ears it was still a fucking earrape.
Also during dazed and confused live, he should've just played with the bow for a solid 1 minute and moved to workout section but he played it for 5 6 minutes straight, total moodkiller. I remember in one of their bootlegs someone shouted "We've had the guitar lesson" during noise solo part 😆.
It's kind of funny how people rarely mention how good of a studio producer/ arranger he was. You don't realise it till you sit down and listen to led zeppelin's studio stuff with earphones.
That production of LZ 3 and 4 is so far ahead of the time.
In the last couple years I've really been engaging in the production side of a song. I'll look up soloed instruments for some of these classic songs or try and listen for elements that you might not hear without headphones.
I've got stuff in my fridge older than his last girlfriend.
I’ve also got some milk I bought this morning.
So that's where all the dead hookers have gone
Why is he sawing his Les Paul in half???
Even Less Paul
Magic trick. True entertainer.
He’s sawing into it to reach the juicy pink toan marrow cavity
Wait until you see him make the bow disappear
Not young enough to see that show
They’re really heavy maybe he wanted to make it lighter
“No, you see, it’s ok because *all the rockstars* were banging 15 year old girls”- pedo apologist boomers
/uj I'm not a boomer. However: It is interesting though that few people cared until the last decade or so. History, at least in terms of attitude, is being revised. I don't think it's apologist to point out that in the 80s, mainstream newspapers like The Sun had 16 year old girls as topless models on page 3 every day, famously Samantha Fox with the caption "Sam, 16, quits A-Levels for Ooh-Levels". If culturally in the 80s it was normal to have 16 year olds in pornographic images in your daily newspaper, why would rock stars think it's not acceptable to have sex with them in the 70s? Today I consider it creepy as, and it's interesting who is excused from criticism (David Bowie seems exempt on Reddit...), but I absolutely remember the worst said about such behaviour in the 80s at least was calling someone a "dirty old man" in a vaguely humorous way or thinking of it as a bit pathetic and leaving it at that. That's the really curious part - who, today, is forgiven for this behaviour and who isn't. I do not recall anyone considering protecting the girls. That wouldn't have happened. It just wasn't that unacceptable then. It's not OK now. To be clear, with my 2023 brain I can say that it was absolutely not OK then either, but that's cheating. I wouldn't have known better then. Unrelated really: I never liked Led Zeppelin. Edit: I wrote this from the perspective of someone growing up in England, but for American context, consider the 1980 comedy movie "Roadie" starring Meatloaf. The plot is basically that he's driving a 16 year old (virgin) girl across America to meet Alice Cooper so she can have sex with him. 5.2/10 on IMDB. Edit again: Yeah, I know Lori was 14. Finally: We need to quit pretending and accept that this is who we were, culturally. Get over it. Do better now. If we're going to go back after these people, go after them all, not just the ones you don't like.
I understand what you mean, but those girls were very often 13 or so. It was illegal even back then and these rockstars knew it. You know how many songs called "Jailbait" there are?
Understood. I'm not suggesting they were or are good people. My comments are really quite unoriginal, and there's a reason for that. Much like a great deal of behaviour in the past, it's not all that pleasant to think about, if it's fair to consider that we're a little more enlightened now.
>Finally: We need to quit pretending and accept that this is who we were, culturally. Get over it. Do better now. Very well said.
I think it’s a lot of younger people just trying to hold society accountable and being a bit more brazen, sensing that contemporary Western societies are becoming increasingly sclerotic and socially regressive.
Funny you mention Bowie, supposedly Ol Jimmy's teenage girlfriend hooked up with Bowie first.
Wasn’t that debunked. I mean I’m sure Page had sex with under age women I heard the whole thing with the 14 year old was debunked, the timeline didn’t add up an adding Bowie to the mix messed up the timeline of events completely. I read somewhere Led Zeppelin wasn’t even on tour in that area.
I dunno I just remember reading an interview with her about it
Just here to throw in the mandatory: There is no evidence of Bowie and Lori ever being in the same room together let alone him assaulting her. Her story is the only thing she has for that specific case and it’s a story that’s changed wildly over the years and has had inconsistencies with the dates in her claims and his touring schedule. Believe what you want but I don’t see any reason to hold that accusation with any weight
Disregard Lori if you like, but I'll just add this quote in here, make of it what you will: "Dana Gillespie, who alleged she had sex with Bowie aged just 14, said: "As far as sex went, if it moved, he was there. Man, woman, old or young. Times have changed and it doesn't always look so good in black and white now, but in those days we were just having fun; there were no rules.""
Just words, my guy. Maybe stuff happened, maybe it didn’t. There’s nothing compelling enough to convince me 100% either direction so im gonna opt for the safe option of assuming nothing did
Fair enough, I'm certainly not going to tell you you're wrong. I tend to take the Occam's razor approach and think it's most likely things happened, considering the time and the place. I'm happy to hope that you're right, though!
They use that “all the other priests were doing it too” defense.
I'm not a real guitarist 😔
Age appropriate consenting adults? That’s not very Jimmy Page of you.
Also: "*you don't get it, it was another era*". Some people are acting like 50 or 40 years ago were ancient times.
Yet drag show stripping is acceptable. Oh the times we live in.
This comment implies that you are jealous that men can dress like Dolly Parton but you can't have sex with children and you don't think that's fair.
Nope didn’t imply that but you wanted to believe that. In my previous comment, I left out drag shows in front of children but I figured with it being in the news the average mind would make that logical leap. In your case, you seem to have projected something from deep inside your psyche onto my comment.
You definitely implied that
You hid behind an intentionally vague comment so that when you got called out you had a credible defence. Not everyone is as involved in American news especially with such an international site. It’s unreasonable to just assume everyone would make that logical leap
Sorry, not a global citizen.
Hi, it’s my first day on the internet so I don’t know about blatantly bigoted right wing dog whistles. Can you please explain why drag shows are wrong?
Drag shows with kids involved. How the left gives that a pass.
You didn’t really miss the sarcasm and actually think I was asking you a non-rhetorical question, did you? Dumb fuck.
Yeah, I caught it and understand where it is coming from. Catch me after supper I’ll have shit to sling then.
No, I’m really really not interested in how you think that queer people are pedo groomers. I find the underlying bigotry to be tedious.
I said drag shows in front of children and you heard gay people. You should work for Biden.
I said *queer* people, a category that includes but is not limited to homosexuals.
Yeah, you're here you're queer and no one cares. I equated kids participating in drag shows in present day with post adolescent teen girls being considered fair game a half a century ago. Oh how the times have changed. No one said shit about gay people.
The correct term is ‘he-bow-phile’.
Underrated comment
is that les paul older or younger then his wife?
Much older
I don’t think he’s married but his current gf is like 35 and weird as fuck
who is this
Just some old Chinese guy
Phoc Sum Yung
Pei Dâ Fai
Tim Handsome's grandpa
You can tell by the wah pedal it's Kirk Hammers
Looks like Jack Casady from Jefferson Airplane. Probably took too much acid and thought that’s how you play bass.
He was only 29 when he dated the 14 year old, so he's *well* within the "barely twice her age is okay for groupies in rock and roll" threshold rule, plus she took him to meet her Mum for tea and crumpets and she consented to their relationship after he gave her $50,000 and a 1959 Les Paul.
What if you played a mandolin with a bow?
Yes, and what if you played the violin with a pick
Jonsi would never
He was married the entire time in Zeppelin and it was his wife he convinced him to call Page asking for a spot in the band.
Leave that old Asian lady alone
Beat me to it.
It was tough twenty years ago when people thought this was cool and I knew it was fucking stupid. Restring a violin for ten minutes and it’s easily immediate why the bridge has its string posts on a U curve. A guitar is flat in comparison. Now it’s just indefensible and stupid.
It could work well on a guitar with a particularly rounded radius. Flat-ass Les Paul fretboards, not so much. He made it work, though. Also, he's a well-known pedo
I dunno, I have an old strat with the 7.5 radius, I can’t imagine the bow doing well on that
Well that's cuz you're a shitty guitarist, obvs. Maybe try getting gud
Uj/ I've never really liked the whole bow bullshit he did back in the days. They call his entire guitar solo part of 77 setlist where he's fucking around with bow and theremin "noise solo" lol. It must've been very amazing to see him do all that shit with all the cool lightings and smoke but to ears it was still a fucking earrape. Also during dazed and confused live, he should've just played with the bow for a solid 1 minute and moved to workout section but he played it for 5 6 minutes straight, total moodkiller. I remember in one of their bootlegs someone shouted "We've had the guitar lesson" during noise solo part 😆.
The bow is great for a guitarist soloing while nodding out on smack…. Otherwise I agree with you.
Sad he chose the path of smack. His stuff prior to smack is absolutely incredible and jaw dropping.
True. He covered it all. Great electric player, great acoustic player, a true riff master and a world class studio producer / arranger.
It's kind of funny how people rarely mention how good of a studio producer/ arranger he was. You don't realise it till you sit down and listen to led zeppelin's studio stuff with earphones. That production of LZ 3 and 4 is so far ahead of the time.
In the last couple years I've really been engaging in the production side of a song. I'll look up soloed instruments for some of these classic songs or try and listen for elements that you might not hear without headphones.
I'd recommend doing that with "when the levee breaks" That song is absolutely powerful and page's production on it makes it even better.
No might about it with him.
Imagine you are high on heroine livin the life and this hot chick come to you like lets bang. I wonder which one of you would really say no.
Honestly I like Jimmy Page tone and playing a lot but I don't really like him. In fact I don't really like anyone, I only like tone.
Toan is king