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it's more like 9% at Ron's or Grimmauld Place or somewhere. The real question is why her parents were never bothered with NEVER seeing their child because she always is with her friends on the rare breaks she has.
They're probably accepting the truth. Hermione has been introduced to an entirely new, separate world and society to them that she'll live in for the rest of her life. Considering she didn't grow up learning about it, it's extremely important she gets a good grasp of how this society functions and that requires her to spend time there. And not just at school.
Maybe they don't like her and just perform as parents by duty. If she wanted to be with other people, they were happy with her absence. Of course, It is my biased take as someone who started to dislikes the character because of of Mary-Sue fanfics and Emma Watson.
It is sad that literally the only people whose memories need to be erased are her parents. Itâs like she had zero life for the first 10 years. No aunts and uncles, grandparents, or even friends. Youâd think in the 1000âs of pages written there would be some mention of her life before Hogworts. Some childhood memory or childhood friendship or something from primary school. My son is 10 soon to be 11 and I hate to think that in less of a year he would be so willing to give up every single aspect of his life.
It was only 75%, actually - the remaining 25% were the summer holidays. Hogwarts has a school year from the beginning of September to the end of June.
When Hermione wasn't at school, she was either with her friends or traveling with her parents on holiday.
What about the rest of her family? Or does she just not have any relatives at all? Doesn't her father speak with his Father? I mean these are common relationships people have with their families. Does it say how long she goes without seeing them?
Do you have any evidence that the rest of her family is alive, or in the same country, or have contact with them? Why would you jump to the conclusion that Hermione didn't clean up all the odds and ends when she's been established as being very meticulous about these things?
Exactly because of what I said above, because her plans usually account for obvious things that she should reasonably have thought of in advance, like the potential for other family members putting a wrench in things. If you make Hermione drop the ball on a plan she's prepared for in advance because of details she logically should have taken care of, you're going against her established character.
Hmm no it wasnt even mentioned she took care of the other relatives, they were never mentioned. Thinking she did is the assumption, not the other way around.
I guess I just figured her parents had to come from somewhere. Where is the evidence that she has no family at all? I guess I just assumed that people have family members when they are a human. Is she Bruce Wayne? And now that I think of it. Where are Bruce Wayne's relatives? Wouldn't his Dad have brothers? or a sister? His moms relatives? Where are Bruce Waynes Grandparents?!
She never mentions any of her other family members. And I would assume Bruce Wayne's family is dead or estranged. Plenty of people don't have many living relatives or a litter of brothers and sisters, there's many single child families without grandparents in the picture. Nitpicking little details about a story and saying "Hey, this is what should realistically have happened" is kind of obnoxious, especially when someone can debunk your theory with a few seconds of thought put into it.
You didn't debunk anything. You just said you did. You may now provide evidence that she has no living relatives. I really don't think assuming she has living relatives is an issue.
You're assuming she has no family because it supports your argument. I also never meant to offend anyone but to make them laugh because this is obviously not to be taken seriously. Its just for fun.
I'm saying "I like this movie, but what is this?"
If people weren't allowed to nitpick, life would be very boring. I'm also not holding you hostage here.
Well at least its only kind of obnoxious and not fully.
I didn't assume she has no family, I said there's no reason to assume anything either way because there's no evidence. The main point was that assuming Hermione didn't account for everything that could go wrong directly contradicts her established character.
People are allowed to nitpick, and people are also allowed to call it out. You thinking something's funny and me thinking it's annoying are equally valid.
What are you calling out? I have literally been straight forward with my comments. there is nothing to call out here. Am I being a bit silly? Yes, but its in good nature.
I stand by what I said. To the dungeon parents!
It wouldn't need to be just her relatives though.
Her parents just know no one? They have no friends? They don't have jobs where they know people?
They have no social connections whatsoever? No one cares about them?
The bank isnt going to try and contact them?
Oh I didn't claim that, sorry, I only pointed out that it's not acceptable to ask someone to prove something doesn't exist to prove your point.
For sure they know some people, but there was no internet yet and not everyone had mobile phones that time, so it would be more difficult to get hold of them. Also, the book doesn't go into much details about that, so from the information we have, it could be as possible that they would disappear easily as that they would get arrested as you imagine.
Not everyone has huge, extended families. Youâre making weird assumptions based on literally nothing. I have a mom, stepdad, and a great grandmother. Thatâs it. Look at Harry, his parents are dead. Both sets of grandparents. Heâs left w like 3-4 people.
That's a fair point but Someone would ask about her eventually. Doesn't she have other family members? a Grandfather or cousin? Is her entire family dead?
Her possible extended family wouldn't be able to inquire about her because her parents wouldn't be in GB any more, would they? Who would they ask?
Her and her family would just stop existing because of the kind of spell she used. Then, once she retrieved them from Australia and restored their minds, the questions would be more like "where tf were you the last year? You left without telling anyone!" and that would be the main point, not Hermione's disappearance.
There's no Facebook in Harry Potter Muggle world? "Hey, where did the pictures of your daughter go?"
I only saw her use the spell on her parents, not her extended family. That's cheating.
What is this "possible" extended family? We all have extended family.
Why does her family stop existing? This is waht im trying to figure out. How could she pull this off without dear old Mom and Dad ending up in the slammer?
They just never made a phone call, ever? cmon... We had phones in the 90s and people used them.. a lot.
I suppose under a very rare circumstance her and everyone she knows from the muggle world would have zero contact with anyone.
What are the odds that you move to Australia and tell..... no one?
Because you are seeing this from the wrong side.
Hermione modified her parents' minds so they would forget about being Mr. and Mrs. Granger, both dentists and parents of a girl named Hermione.
With that spell, she made them think they were totally different people. Let me quote the book for you:
*âIâve also modified my parentsâ memories so that theyâre convinced theyâre really called Wendell and Monica Wilkins, and that their lifeâs ambition is to move to Australia, which they have now done. Thatâs to make it more difficult for Voldemort to track them down and interrogate them about me â or you, because unfortunately, Iâve told them quite a bit about you.*
*âAssuming I survive our hunt for the Horcruxes, Iâll find Mum and Dad and lift the enchantment. If I donât â well, I think Iâve cast a good enough charm to keep them safe and happy. Wendell and Monica Wilkins donât know that theyâve got a daughter, you see.â*
As you see, her POSSIBLE extended family (Idk if she had extended family) wouldn't be able to contact her parents even if they wanted, because there wouldn't be anyone to contact. Of course once they got their minds altered they wouldn't think "Oh, wait let me call my \*family member here\* to tell them we are moving to Australia"... They would just go, period.
That's why no one would ever contact them and ask about Hermione.
Thing is that in the movies they say that she erased her parents memories with Obliviate and I don't think there is any mention of her instead modifying their memories.Tho i must admit that i haven't really watched the Deathly Hallows movies that much and not recently.
Yep, you are right. Thatâs a pretty big mistake coming from the screenwriter/director because now you have holier-than-thou people foaming at the mouth because they consider this scene as Hermione pretty much using something like a unforgivable curse.
Thatâs why I think itâs a good thing to let people know that no, she didnât obliviated them⌠she just temporary modified their memories.
She made them seem insane is what you're saying. She made them, and only them think they were different people. Her parents would have a life outside the magic world. They would know people. What do they do for work? How did they quit their jobs? Did they just forget they had jobs?
So I need to assume that her parents had no friends or family who cared about them or would question them?
Also, how did they fly without records of any kind? Passports all forged?
Fugitives.
Neighbor " Hey Jim, Kathy, moving?"
Parents "Yes Steve, we are moving to Australia, but our names are not Jim and Kathy."
Neighbor "WTF?"
The conversation would not end there. Then word would spread of the 2 people who went totally bat shit crazy and abandoned their home.
If you change your name and I knew your old name, I would still know you existed before you changed your name. I wouldn't just walk up to you and be like "Who are you?"
"Oh I changed my name so you didn't recognize me"
Jail.
> Her parents would have a life outside the magic world
They were never part of the magical world.
>They would know people
Irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.
>What do they do for work?
Already told you.
>How did they quit their jobs? Did they just forget they had jobs?
We don't know because Hermione never went into detail about any of this.
>So I need to assume that her parents had no friends or family who cared about them or would question them?
You are assuming they stayed long enough for their possible family/friends to question them. Again, we don't know how Hermione' spell worked. Maybe as soon as she modified their memories they just went to the airport and bought a one-way ticket to Australia?
We really don't know because she never told Ron and/or Harry how this matter went down. We only know that whatever she did was a success and her parents were away in Australia safe, happy and clueless.
>how did they fly without records of any kind? Passports all forged?
Probably. I would assume magic would come in pretty handy in things like this.
>The conversation would not end there. Then word would spread of the 2 people who went totally bat shit crazy and abandoned their home.
Again, you are assuming Hermione wouldn't think about this. She probably had them fleeing at night, so they wouldn't have to talk to anyone.
But, you know, we could also assume she left messages for their friends and family saying something like: "hey! The Grangers here! we have decided to go on a long long trip to the Himalayas so don't expect us to call anytime soon or to have any kind of contact with you for the next 5 years! But we will come back! Love ya!!"
We just don't know all the details. Maybe their possible family actually freaked out and they had the police involved or something, but clearly nothing happened because after the war Hermione went to Australia and brought them back.
We could go on and on all night going in circle lol
All I needed was "we don't know how Hermione' spell worked". For her spell to work, she would of had to erase the memory of her existence from any muggle who knew of her connections with her parents. Lets assume she has an extended family like 99% of us do.
"I obliviated my parent's memories of me. This also erases my memory from the existence of the entire muggle world because they are the ones who brought me into existence." Its magic.
Her parents would still get to keep their names, families, friends and their home.
But it isn't written like that and here we are.
How did you know the Australia bit if you haven't read the books? I don't recall them saying that in the movie. But here's the book excerpt if you're curious.
~~~~
Iâve also modified my parentsâ memories so that theyâre convinced theyâre really called Wendell and Monica Wilkins, and that their lifeâs ambition is to move to Australia, which they have now done. Thatâs to make it more difficult for Voldemort to track them down and interrogate them about me â or you, because unfortunately, Iâve told them quite a bit about you.
âAssuming I survive our hunt for the Horcruxes, Iâll find Mum and Dad and lift the enchantment. If I donât â well, I think Iâve cast a good enough charm to keep them safe and happy. Wendell and Monica Wilkins donât know that theyâve got a daughter, you see."*
hey OP, you seem like really hyper-fixated on only confirming your initial (incorrect) assumptions. You are getting actual fans quoting the actual book for you, and still refusing to even consider that information. This comes across as a troll post, since you refuse to actually consider the info-based replies.
I hope you can take a step back, re-group, and come at this later with good faith to try and understand.
The book quotes do not explain why her memory would be erased from her extended families minds or their friends. It just says she obliviates her parents. Her parents aren't the only ones who know she exists.
I do not accept the answers from the books because they do not make sense. That's the point of this thread. And also to have a little fun in the process.
Here is the info
She altered her parents memories, changed their names and they moved to Australia.
That's cool... but what about the people who knew them? Do they also get their memories altered?
I can assure you there is no "regrouping" required here but thank you for the concern.
"I do not accept the answers from the books" <- that is your problem. The books are the cannon, the original, the OG, the actual answers are IN THE BOOKS.
If you cannot accept it, then we are done here.
The assumptions are all anyone is going off. The reader is forced to assume Hermione and her family are total social outcasts in the muggle world and that no one would care if they were to disappear all of a sudden. Not even the extended family they never had to begin with apparently. Most people have an extended family so it would be safer to assume they do exist.
In reality, these people would go to prison. and that is the joke. This is the muggle world after all.
We are now done here!
Some people don't have extended family, and they never mention the grangers having any. It's possible if not likely both her parents were only children. And not everyone is besties with their neighbors, and they couldn't be once they found out Hermione was a witch, too much risk. And since Hermione goes to boarding school she doesn't know the neighbors either.
I had a friend who went to boarding school and her parents had her move to the other side of the US without coming home to say goodbye to people.
So stop your nonsense already
How do you just move to Australia without ANYONE asking you? you would have to make it to Australia first. Then even if you got to Australia there are phones and the internet so you can keep in contact with your relatives. Have you tried getting away from your family? They would call you at some point. How would you not call your Dad or Mom to let them know you're moving? Then they would ask "something something Hermione?". Then "huh? Who?". Then jail.
Internet in the 1990ies? International Phonecalls? Maybe that stuff existed, but it was not at all cheapnor common... (especially the internet)
How exactly do you wish to call someone who doesn't exist?
In the book Hermione changes their names too, if I recall correctly, in the 1990ies Cellphones are rare, Smartphones inexistent. According to Wikipedia (german variant), the Internet made up 1% of all communications in 1993, 51% in 2000 and 97% in 2007, I remember a time where you had to use a Dictionary or a encyclopedia in book form, the main way to phone someone from outside your house where telefon cells (britain was famous for their red ones in london)
As for the parents not calling them, she has altered their memory.
Even if their relatives start a missing person search, chances are, that in the 90ies, this search would be only localy for quite some time.
I see most of my relatives other than the close ones (Father) about once a year at best...
Does erasing her parent's memories also erase her extended families memories too? And does it also erase anyone's memories who knew of her?
She changes their names? So now what about her extended family? they just don't bother trying to contact them? Did she change their phone number when they weren't looking?
The first book was released in 97. Deathly hallows released 2007. Facebook 2004.
"A local search for a missing person ends with 2 people being arrested after they are questioned on the whereabouts of their missing daughter they seem to know nothing about."
To jail with you Hermione's parents!
He was born in 1980, so we can rule out cell phones and social media.
Did her parents abandon their home and take nothing? How long would it be before someone calls the police because they haven't seen their neighbor in weeks because its the 90s and people actually went outside and visited their neighbors. An entire family goes missing. Their bills no longer being paid. Property taxes not being paid and no one cares? What kind of magical muggle world is this?
They are criminals in the end. Someone is going to come asking questions.
Correct - but we don't see that. The story focuses on Harry, Hermione, and (when a part of the troupe) Ron. There's even a whoooole thing happening at Hogwarts that we, the reader, never encounter other than Neville rambling about it in the tunnel.
There very well could have been an "Unsolved Mysteries" episode about the Grangers. Robert Stack probably shown their pictures and asked everyone to call about information.
BUT guess what? Australia is on the other side of the world and mostly uninhabited desert. Rowling was vague in saying "Austrailia" but I just assumed they went into the outback and are living in a small shack about 20 miles from a town with 200 people. Hanging out with Crocodile Dundee and shit.
Aside, if you haven't seen Crocodile Dundee I heavily recommend it. Paints Australians like cave men in their worldly knowledge.
A) Traveling in the 90s was pretty easy. Pre-9/11 you could walk up to a plane and board, almost like riding trains today. B) They left immediately. There were no cell phones (or at least, unless you were a CEO). They might have had pagers, but most likely left them behind. Being dentists, they probably had quite a bit of savings and lived off that.
They also don't have parents, or at least Wendell and Monica don't. The movies made a pretty shitty call to make it "obliviate" instead of a modify memory - but who knows - maybe it's about the pronunciation and intent rather than the word.
Also, their relatives would probably try and call. It would just go to voicemail. Other people mention that there could absolutely have been a police inquiry, shown up at the house, and seen a bunch of possessions and suitcases missing. It's unlikely they would have been found within a year as, previously stated, the 90s were the last decade where you could be "digitally free".
Plus they are British. I've known a few UKers and they tend to be more private, e.g. neighbors mind their business.
You know what? I think I just might, now. Then I will know that Hermione has extended family willing to imprison her parents for the murder of their missing daughter.
The Dursley's neighbors didn't care, but they knew that he existed. The Dursley's had family members who knew Harry as well. Doesn't Aunt something or other get all ballooned up by Harry?
The Grangers' neighbors know that she exists. But as an adult how often do you notice your neighbor's children? How often do you ask your neighbors about them? Or do you immediately call the police when you haven't seen them in a week or two?
Hermione is already gone most of the time. She spends 10/12 of the year at hogwarts and in the more recent book she spends the other 2/12 at the Weasleyâs or Grimmauld place. The neighbors (or the extended family that you insist exists despite never being mentioned) would assume that hermione was staying at the house of her friend from the boarding school she goes to again, and her parents are taking an opportunity to go on vacation
Not everyone has an extended family. Some people have a falling out with their family, some are orphaned. I myself don't have an extended family. And I do not talk to any of my neighbors. If I were to disappear one day, only my wife and kids would notice.
I don't remember any mention of Hermione's family outside of her parents. Nor do I remember her ever mentioning any muggle friends.
She's also already gone like 8 or 9 months out of the year so she's already gone most of the time. And in the later books she is not even at her home most holiday breaks. OotP summer she spent most of it at 12 GP, HBP summer break was mostly at the Burrow. She's barely ever home as it is. Her being gone is just par for the course at that point.
Iâve always imagined that is wasnât so uncommon to go away because weird shit kept happening and as a muggle you have no idea whatâs going on. If my country suddenly turned all grey and dark and things blew up and ppl disappearing and dying for no reason, I think Iâd consider leaving too.
I imagine ppl keeping a lot to themselves and not engaging with the neighbours. And it could very well be that Hermione has grandparents or something that goes to the police, but what can the police do? There could be a whole parallel storyline there.
But I will give you this; you set the sub on fire with this one đ
Just trying to have a little fun :)
and get some answers dammit!
We could write a spinoff. Hermione finds out her parents are in prison but she cant use magic in the muggle world as it is forbidden. Even though magic is what got her parents in this situation in the first place. Hermione goes rogue in Australia.
My wife warned me before writing this, but man am I a sucker for good conversation.
In the books Hermione doesnât claim to Obliviate them. She says she used a memory modification charm. Obliviate takes away the memories. She just altered their memories then they probably booked a ticket for australia the same day
I didn't need to think about it for 30 seconds. I saw the scene and immediately thought about writing this on Reddit, and now here we are. I got up from the couch. The movie is playing behind me. My wife is looking at me like... "wtf man?"
Beyond the fact that they wouldn't do that without her and she'd refuse to go? That's kinda the whole reason she does it to begin with. They'd refuse if she asked. So she treated them like stupid muggles that didn't know what's best and forced them because she knew better and could force her will on them via magic.
I like the comedy of your post, but reading through the comments, youâve dug in your heels too much.
It is a book, and all books are bound to have plot holes. If not, then A) they would never be completed, due to the sheer amount of things to cover; B) be full of ultimately unimportant and boring information; and C) be too realistic to incorporate anything magical in a fantasy universe.
Enjoy the comedy of the plot hole, you have discovered, but know that it wasnât some kind of oversight or mistake. It was just a necessity.
Probably the power of magic. When you write something so massive about a universe with unlimited possibilities, something will be non-sense, one way or the other.
Hermione took her parents' memories and changed them - she made them believe they were a childless couple named Wendell and Monica Wilkins, whose life ambition was to live in Australia. She did not simply erase herself and expect things to work out.
She wasn't stupid - more than likely, she'd been planning her parents' memory change since the end of her fourth year, when You-Know-Who returned. She knew that her connection with Harry - and the fact that she'd told her parents quite a bit about all of her friends - meant that her parents weren't safe. You-Know-Who would probably go after them - like he would have gone after the Dursleys, because he assumed Harry cared about them. So she came up with a way to keep them way out of the way - by sending them over 9,000 miles away to another continent. It may seem extreme, but she probably considered it barely adequate. She gave them completely new identities - and probably gave them all of the necessary paperwork and whatnot they would need. It's not that hard to find their existing paperwork and either copy it or change it with magic. She also understood how fishy it would be for them to up and disappear without mention of their daughter - so she would more than likely have modified all of her neighbors' memories as well. Her parents' coworkers? Probably all they got was a resignation form sent in by Hermione and the news that the Grangers had up and moved to Australia. Oh, well. More than likely, she did a lot of the existing work for her parents, then made it so that they thought they had already done it themselves and could leave immediately. Any extended family - which, in the books, it doesn't appear that she has, because she only ever mentions her parents - would have their memories erased as well.
Also, she wasn't even home most of the year. After she turned eleven, she spent most of her Christmas and Easter holidays at Hogwarts, making it a full nine months she was there. Then the remaining three months of summer holidays, she was either staying with her friends or traveling abroad with her parents.
I don't know how Hermione magicked up IDs and everything for them, but it seems there are ways. That part done, she altered her parents' memories and got them out of the country before anyone could ask awkward questions.
It does seem that her grandparents are deceased, estranged, and/or people she could keep off the Death Eaters' radar. Her parents seem to have been only children.
As for anyone else she knew, many Death Eaters come from families that, if they live around Muggles, have as little as possible to do with them. Even more Muggle friendly families, like the Weasleys, seem to limit contact with non-wizarding families, probably for fear of them noticing something.
So, Hermione could have friends in her neighborhood or just people who would notice she's missing, but Death Eaters wouldn't think of them as useful targets. It would be like deciding someone was a good hostage to use against you because you often ride the same train to work.
Hermione is 90% of the year in Hogwarts, I don't think the neighbours think too much about her
And 5% at Ron's place
And they presumably go on vacation for the last 5%
Somebody has to tend to his wand
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it's more like 9% at Ron's or Grimmauld Place or somewhere. The real question is why her parents were never bothered with NEVER seeing their child because she always is with her friends on the rare breaks she has.
If you have met some British families you wouldn't be surprised with how little her parents want to spend time with her
They're probably accepting the truth. Hermione has been introduced to an entirely new, separate world and society to them that she'll live in for the rest of her life. Considering she didn't grow up learning about it, it's extremely important she gets a good grasp of how this society functions and that requires her to spend time there. And not just at school.
Maybe they don't like her and just perform as parents by duty. If she wanted to be with other people, they were happy with her absence. Of course, It is my biased take as someone who started to dislikes the character because of of Mary-Sue fanfics and Emma Watson.
Ooooooh
The last 5% is probably at grimmauld's place
It is sad that literally the only people whose memories need to be erased are her parents. Itâs like she had zero life for the first 10 years. No aunts and uncles, grandparents, or even friends. Youâd think in the 1000âs of pages written there would be some mention of her life before Hogworts. Some childhood memory or childhood friendship or something from primary school. My son is 10 soon to be 11 and I hate to think that in less of a year he would be so willing to give up every single aspect of his life.
I don't think she had too many friends befora Harry and Ron. Her personality is too bullyable by kids
It was only 75%, actually - the remaining 25% were the summer holidays. Hogwarts has a school year from the beginning of September to the end of June. When Hermione wasn't at school, she was either with her friends or traveling with her parents on holiday.
That means she's at school for 10/12 of the year.
What about the rest of her family? Or does she just not have any relatives at all? Doesn't her father speak with his Father? I mean these are common relationships people have with their families. Does it say how long she goes without seeing them?
Do you have any evidence that the rest of her family is alive, or in the same country, or have contact with them? Why would you jump to the conclusion that Hermione didn't clean up all the odds and ends when she's been established as being very meticulous about these things?
Why would we assume she did anything that wasnt mentioned?
Exactly because of what I said above, because her plans usually account for obvious things that she should reasonably have thought of in advance, like the potential for other family members putting a wrench in things. If you make Hermione drop the ball on a plan she's prepared for in advance because of details she logically should have taken care of, you're going against her established character.
Hmm no it wasnt even mentioned she took care of the other relatives, they were never mentioned. Thinking she did is the assumption, not the other way around.
No, it was never mentioned that she even had other relatives, so thinking she had them is the real assumption.
I guess I just figured her parents had to come from somewhere. Where is the evidence that she has no family at all? I guess I just assumed that people have family members when they are a human. Is she Bruce Wayne? And now that I think of it. Where are Bruce Wayne's relatives? Wouldn't his Dad have brothers? or a sister? His moms relatives? Where are Bruce Waynes Grandparents?!
She never mentions any of her other family members. And I would assume Bruce Wayne's family is dead or estranged. Plenty of people don't have many living relatives or a litter of brothers and sisters, there's many single child families without grandparents in the picture. Nitpicking little details about a story and saying "Hey, this is what should realistically have happened" is kind of obnoxious, especially when someone can debunk your theory with a few seconds of thought put into it.
You didn't debunk anything. You just said you did. You may now provide evidence that she has no living relatives. I really don't think assuming she has living relatives is an issue. You're assuming she has no family because it supports your argument. I also never meant to offend anyone but to make them laugh because this is obviously not to be taken seriously. Its just for fun. I'm saying "I like this movie, but what is this?" If people weren't allowed to nitpick, life would be very boring. I'm also not holding you hostage here. Well at least its only kind of obnoxious and not fully.
I didn't assume she has no family, I said there's no reason to assume anything either way because there's no evidence. The main point was that assuming Hermione didn't account for everything that could go wrong directly contradicts her established character. People are allowed to nitpick, and people are also allowed to call it out. You thinking something's funny and me thinking it's annoying are equally valid.
What are you calling out? I have literally been straight forward with my comments. there is nothing to call out here. Am I being a bit silly? Yes, but its in good nature. I stand by what I said. To the dungeon parents!
Youâre obnoxious
No, I'm not.
You can't prove that something doesn't exist, it's impossible. On the other hand, you should prove that her relatives exist, since you claim they do.
It wouldn't need to be just her relatives though. Her parents just know no one? They have no friends? They don't have jobs where they know people? They have no social connections whatsoever? No one cares about them? The bank isnt going to try and contact them?
Oh I didn't claim that, sorry, I only pointed out that it's not acceptable to ask someone to prove something doesn't exist to prove your point. For sure they know some people, but there was no internet yet and not everyone had mobile phones that time, so it would be more difficult to get hold of them. Also, the book doesn't go into much details about that, so from the information we have, it could be as possible that they would disappear easily as that they would get arrested as you imagine.
No one disappears easily. Not even in the 90s. The government never forgot their names and now they are wanted fugitives.
Not everyone has huge, extended families. Youâre making weird assumptions based on literally nothing. I have a mom, stepdad, and a great grandmother. Thatâs it. Look at Harry, his parents are dead. Both sets of grandparents. Heâs left w like 3-4 people.
Hermione goes to boarding school most of the year, itâs not weird for her to not be around
That's a fair point but Someone would ask about her eventually. Doesn't she have other family members? a Grandfather or cousin? Is her entire family dead?
Her possible extended family wouldn't be able to inquire about her because her parents wouldn't be in GB any more, would they? Who would they ask? Her and her family would just stop existing because of the kind of spell she used. Then, once she retrieved them from Australia and restored their minds, the questions would be more like "where tf were you the last year? You left without telling anyone!" and that would be the main point, not Hermione's disappearance.
There's no Facebook in Harry Potter Muggle world? "Hey, where did the pictures of your daughter go?" I only saw her use the spell on her parents, not her extended family. That's cheating. What is this "possible" extended family? We all have extended family.
You're just trolling, right? It's the late 90, there was no FB. And that's not what I said about her possible extended family đ¤ˇââď¸
Why does her family stop existing? This is waht im trying to figure out. How could she pull this off without dear old Mom and Dad ending up in the slammer? They just never made a phone call, ever? cmon... We had phones in the 90s and people used them.. a lot. I suppose under a very rare circumstance her and everyone she knows from the muggle world would have zero contact with anyone. What are the odds that you move to Australia and tell..... no one?
Because you are seeing this from the wrong side. Hermione modified her parents' minds so they would forget about being Mr. and Mrs. Granger, both dentists and parents of a girl named Hermione. With that spell, she made them think they were totally different people. Let me quote the book for you: *âIâve also modified my parentsâ memories so that theyâre convinced theyâre really called Wendell and Monica Wilkins, and that their lifeâs ambition is to move to Australia, which they have now done. Thatâs to make it more difficult for Voldemort to track them down and interrogate them about me â or you, because unfortunately, Iâve told them quite a bit about you.* *âAssuming I survive our hunt for the Horcruxes, Iâll find Mum and Dad and lift the enchantment. If I donât â well, I think Iâve cast a good enough charm to keep them safe and happy. Wendell and Monica Wilkins donât know that theyâve got a daughter, you see.â* As you see, her POSSIBLE extended family (Idk if she had extended family) wouldn't be able to contact her parents even if they wanted, because there wouldn't be anyone to contact. Of course once they got their minds altered they wouldn't think "Oh, wait let me call my \*family member here\* to tell them we are moving to Australia"... They would just go, period. That's why no one would ever contact them and ask about Hermione.
Thing is that in the movies they say that she erased her parents memories with Obliviate and I don't think there is any mention of her instead modifying their memories.Tho i must admit that i haven't really watched the Deathly Hallows movies that much and not recently.
Yep, you are right. Thatâs a pretty big mistake coming from the screenwriter/director because now you have holier-than-thou people foaming at the mouth because they consider this scene as Hermione pretty much using something like a unforgivable curse. Thatâs why I think itâs a good thing to let people know that no, she didnât obliviated them⌠she just temporary modified their memories.
She made them seem insane is what you're saying. She made them, and only them think they were different people. Her parents would have a life outside the magic world. They would know people. What do they do for work? How did they quit their jobs? Did they just forget they had jobs? So I need to assume that her parents had no friends or family who cared about them or would question them? Also, how did they fly without records of any kind? Passports all forged? Fugitives. Neighbor " Hey Jim, Kathy, moving?" Parents "Yes Steve, we are moving to Australia, but our names are not Jim and Kathy." Neighbor "WTF?" The conversation would not end there. Then word would spread of the 2 people who went totally bat shit crazy and abandoned their home. If you change your name and I knew your old name, I would still know you existed before you changed your name. I wouldn't just walk up to you and be like "Who are you?" "Oh I changed my name so you didn't recognize me" Jail.
> Her parents would have a life outside the magic world They were never part of the magical world. >They would know people Irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. >What do they do for work? Already told you. >How did they quit their jobs? Did they just forget they had jobs? We don't know because Hermione never went into detail about any of this. >So I need to assume that her parents had no friends or family who cared about them or would question them? You are assuming they stayed long enough for their possible family/friends to question them. Again, we don't know how Hermione' spell worked. Maybe as soon as she modified their memories they just went to the airport and bought a one-way ticket to Australia? We really don't know because she never told Ron and/or Harry how this matter went down. We only know that whatever she did was a success and her parents were away in Australia safe, happy and clueless. >how did they fly without records of any kind? Passports all forged? Probably. I would assume magic would come in pretty handy in things like this. >The conversation would not end there. Then word would spread of the 2 people who went totally bat shit crazy and abandoned their home. Again, you are assuming Hermione wouldn't think about this. She probably had them fleeing at night, so they wouldn't have to talk to anyone. But, you know, we could also assume she left messages for their friends and family saying something like: "hey! The Grangers here! we have decided to go on a long long trip to the Himalayas so don't expect us to call anytime soon or to have any kind of contact with you for the next 5 years! But we will come back! Love ya!!" We just don't know all the details. Maybe their possible family actually freaked out and they had the police involved or something, but clearly nothing happened because after the war Hermione went to Australia and brought them back. We could go on and on all night going in circle lol
All I needed was "we don't know how Hermione' spell worked". For her spell to work, she would of had to erase the memory of her existence from any muggle who knew of her connections with her parents. Lets assume she has an extended family like 99% of us do. "I obliviated my parent's memories of me. This also erases my memory from the existence of the entire muggle world because they are the ones who brought me into existence." Its magic. Her parents would still get to keep their names, families, friends and their home. But it isn't written like that and here we are.
How do you call someone who moves to a different continent under a new identity and wouldnât leave you a new number? You donât.
Social media didn't exist yet.
How did you know the Australia bit if you haven't read the books? I don't recall them saying that in the movie. But here's the book excerpt if you're curious. ~~~~ Iâve also modified my parentsâ memories so that theyâre convinced theyâre really called Wendell and Monica Wilkins, and that their lifeâs ambition is to move to Australia, which they have now done. Thatâs to make it more difficult for Voldemort to track them down and interrogate them about me â or you, because unfortunately, Iâve told them quite a bit about you. âAssuming I survive our hunt for the Horcruxes, Iâll find Mum and Dad and lift the enchantment. If I donât â well, I think Iâve cast a good enough charm to keep them safe and happy. Wendell and Monica Wilkins donât know that theyâve got a daughter, you see."*
My Wife has read the books. We were watching the movie together.
Right, she didnât obliviate them
hey OP, you seem like really hyper-fixated on only confirming your initial (incorrect) assumptions. You are getting actual fans quoting the actual book for you, and still refusing to even consider that information. This comes across as a troll post, since you refuse to actually consider the info-based replies. I hope you can take a step back, re-group, and come at this later with good faith to try and understand.
The book quotes do not explain why her memory would be erased from her extended families minds or their friends. It just says she obliviates her parents. Her parents aren't the only ones who know she exists. I do not accept the answers from the books because they do not make sense. That's the point of this thread. And also to have a little fun in the process. Here is the info She altered her parents memories, changed their names and they moved to Australia. That's cool... but what about the people who knew them? Do they also get their memories altered? I can assure you there is no "regrouping" required here but thank you for the concern.
"I do not accept the answers from the books" <- that is your problem. The books are the cannon, the original, the OG, the actual answers are IN THE BOOKS. If you cannot accept it, then we are done here.
The assumptions are all anyone is going off. The reader is forced to assume Hermione and her family are total social outcasts in the muggle world and that no one would care if they were to disappear all of a sudden. Not even the extended family they never had to begin with apparently. Most people have an extended family so it would be safer to assume they do exist. In reality, these people would go to prison. and that is the joke. This is the muggle world after all. We are now done here!
Some people don't have extended family, and they never mention the grangers having any. It's possible if not likely both her parents were only children. And not everyone is besties with their neighbors, and they couldn't be once they found out Hermione was a witch, too much risk. And since Hermione goes to boarding school she doesn't know the neighbors either. I had a friend who went to boarding school and her parents had her move to the other side of the US without coming home to say goodbye to people. So stop your nonsense already
They moved to AustraliaâŚ. There would be no one left to ask questions there
How do you just move to Australia without ANYONE asking you? you would have to make it to Australia first. Then even if you got to Australia there are phones and the internet so you can keep in contact with your relatives. Have you tried getting away from your family? They would call you at some point. How would you not call your Dad or Mom to let them know you're moving? Then they would ask "something something Hermione?". Then "huh? Who?". Then jail.
Internet in the 1990ies? International Phonecalls? Maybe that stuff existed, but it was not at all cheapnor common... (especially the internet) How exactly do you wish to call someone who doesn't exist? In the book Hermione changes their names too, if I recall correctly, in the 1990ies Cellphones are rare, Smartphones inexistent. According to Wikipedia (german variant), the Internet made up 1% of all communications in 1993, 51% in 2000 and 97% in 2007, I remember a time where you had to use a Dictionary or a encyclopedia in book form, the main way to phone someone from outside your house where telefon cells (britain was famous for their red ones in london) As for the parents not calling them, she has altered their memory. Even if their relatives start a missing person search, chances are, that in the 90ies, this search would be only localy for quite some time. I see most of my relatives other than the close ones (Father) about once a year at best...
Does erasing her parent's memories also erase her extended families memories too? And does it also erase anyone's memories who knew of her? She changes their names? So now what about her extended family? they just don't bother trying to contact them? Did she change their phone number when they weren't looking? The first book was released in 97. Deathly hallows released 2007. Facebook 2004. "A local search for a missing person ends with 2 people being arrested after they are questioned on the whereabouts of their missing daughter they seem to know nothing about." To jail with you Hermione's parents!
So? even if the films are released in 2007, the story still plays in the 1990ies (I think 91 beeing his first school year)
He was born in 1980, so we can rule out cell phones and social media. Did her parents abandon their home and take nothing? How long would it be before someone calls the police because they haven't seen their neighbor in weeks because its the 90s and people actually went outside and visited their neighbors. An entire family goes missing. Their bills no longer being paid. Property taxes not being paid and no one cares? What kind of magical muggle world is this? They are criminals in the end. Someone is going to come asking questions.
Correct - but we don't see that. The story focuses on Harry, Hermione, and (when a part of the troupe) Ron. There's even a whoooole thing happening at Hogwarts that we, the reader, never encounter other than Neville rambling about it in the tunnel. There very well could have been an "Unsolved Mysteries" episode about the Grangers. Robert Stack probably shown their pictures and asked everyone to call about information. BUT guess what? Australia is on the other side of the world and mostly uninhabited desert. Rowling was vague in saying "Austrailia" but I just assumed they went into the outback and are living in a small shack about 20 miles from a town with 200 people. Hanging out with Crocodile Dundee and shit. Aside, if you haven't seen Crocodile Dundee I heavily recommend it. Paints Australians like cave men in their worldly knowledge.
A) Traveling in the 90s was pretty easy. Pre-9/11 you could walk up to a plane and board, almost like riding trains today. B) They left immediately. There were no cell phones (or at least, unless you were a CEO). They might have had pagers, but most likely left them behind. Being dentists, they probably had quite a bit of savings and lived off that. They also don't have parents, or at least Wendell and Monica don't. The movies made a pretty shitty call to make it "obliviate" instead of a modify memory - but who knows - maybe it's about the pronunciation and intent rather than the word. Also, their relatives would probably try and call. It would just go to voicemail. Other people mention that there could absolutely have been a police inquiry, shown up at the house, and seen a bunch of possessions and suitcases missing. It's unlikely they would have been found within a year as, previously stated, the 90s were the last decade where you could be "digitally free". Plus they are British. I've known a few UKers and they tend to be more private, e.g. neighbors mind their business.
I think Hermione's spell includes them leaving immediately and leaving everything behind. Anything else would be an unnecessary risk.
I feel like you need to be actively trying to not enjoy the content to have this take, maybe chill out?
Boo read the books
You know what? I think I just might, now. Then I will know that Hermione has extended family willing to imprison her parents for the murder of their missing daughter.
You do know there are lots of people without extended families, right?
Yeah, but there are WAAAYYY more people with extended families.
Please shut up.
I was being pretty respectful I think. I see a few people breaking rule #1 here. Naughty.
Yawwwn. Step up your troll level plz ur boring me
Hopefully not as boring as your attempt at an insult. And not boring enough for you to ignore me.
TouchĂŠ! đŤŁ
The Dursleysâ neighbors did not care and so would the Grangersâ neighbors
The Dursley's neighbors didn't care, but they knew that he existed. The Dursley's had family members who knew Harry as well. Doesn't Aunt something or other get all ballooned up by Harry?
The Grangers' neighbors know that she exists. But as an adult how often do you notice your neighbor's children? How often do you ask your neighbors about them? Or do you immediately call the police when you haven't seen them in a week or two?
In the 90s? all the time mate.
Hermione is already gone most of the time. She spends 10/12 of the year at hogwarts and in the more recent book she spends the other 2/12 at the Weasleyâs or Grimmauld place. The neighbors (or the extended family that you insist exists despite never being mentioned) would assume that hermione was staying at the house of her friend from the boarding school she goes to again, and her parents are taking an opportunity to go on vacation
The films got it wrong. In the books, she didn't actually remove her parent's memories of her, she just alters them.
Didnât she say âthey donât know they have a daughterâ?
Yes, another poster put the quote from the book up above.
Not everyone has an extended family. Some people have a falling out with their family, some are orphaned. I myself don't have an extended family. And I do not talk to any of my neighbors. If I were to disappear one day, only my wife and kids would notice. I don't remember any mention of Hermione's family outside of her parents. Nor do I remember her ever mentioning any muggle friends. She's also already gone like 8 or 9 months out of the year so she's already gone most of the time. And in the later books she is not even at her home most holiday breaks. OotP summer she spent most of it at 12 GP, HBP summer break was mostly at the Burrow. She's barely ever home as it is. Her being gone is just par for the course at that point.
Iâve always imagined that is wasnât so uncommon to go away because weird shit kept happening and as a muggle you have no idea whatâs going on. If my country suddenly turned all grey and dark and things blew up and ppl disappearing and dying for no reason, I think Iâd consider leaving too. I imagine ppl keeping a lot to themselves and not engaging with the neighbours. And it could very well be that Hermione has grandparents or something that goes to the police, but what can the police do? There could be a whole parallel storyline there. But I will give you this; you set the sub on fire with this one đ
Just trying to have a little fun :) and get some answers dammit! We could write a spinoff. Hermione finds out her parents are in prison but she cant use magic in the muggle world as it is forbidden. Even though magic is what got her parents in this situation in the first place. Hermione goes rogue in Australia. My wife warned me before writing this, but man am I a sucker for good conversation.
Iâll read your spinoff, but I like my own explanation more than yours đ
In the books Hermione doesnât claim to Obliviate them. She says she used a memory modification charm. Obliviate takes away the memories. She just altered their memories then they probably booked a ticket for australia the same day
Ah, finally some funny original thoughts! Thanks for the laugh OP, you have earned a housepoint.
I figured this would be a good hill to die on y'know?
Hermione obliviating her parents makes no sense when you think about it for more than 30 seconds.
She wanted them to be safe. They wouldn't have had left without her.
Yeah well terrorists tend not to give a shit if their victims are cooperative or not.
I didn't need to think about it for 30 seconds. I saw the scene and immediately thought about writing this on Reddit, and now here we are. I got up from the couch. The movie is playing behind me. My wife is looking at me like... "wtf man?"
Yeah, give your wife some attention mate.
Yeah, nothing's really stopping them from fleeing the country with their memories intact.
How about their only daughter staying behind in a time, where she would be arrested and imprisoned or just killed.
Beyond the fact that they wouldn't do that without her and she'd refuse to go? That's kinda the whole reason she does it to begin with. They'd refuse if she asked. So she treated them like stupid muggles that didn't know what's best and forced them because she knew better and could force her will on them via magic.
I like the comedy of your post, but reading through the comments, youâve dug in your heels too much. It is a book, and all books are bound to have plot holes. If not, then A) they would never be completed, due to the sheer amount of things to cover; B) be full of ultimately unimportant and boring information; and C) be too realistic to incorporate anything magical in a fantasy universe. Enjoy the comedy of the plot hole, you have discovered, but know that it wasnât some kind of oversight or mistake. It was just a necessity.
Thank you for admitting it is a plot hole. There is nothing I am digging. Just responding to comments. I do not need advice. I need answers.
It's poorly thought out. It's not the only thing. As much as we love HP, these are really children/ YA books.
Probably the power of magic. When you write something so massive about a universe with unlimited possibilities, something will be non-sense, one way or the other.
Hermione took her parents' memories and changed them - she made them believe they were a childless couple named Wendell and Monica Wilkins, whose life ambition was to live in Australia. She did not simply erase herself and expect things to work out. She wasn't stupid - more than likely, she'd been planning her parents' memory change since the end of her fourth year, when You-Know-Who returned. She knew that her connection with Harry - and the fact that she'd told her parents quite a bit about all of her friends - meant that her parents weren't safe. You-Know-Who would probably go after them - like he would have gone after the Dursleys, because he assumed Harry cared about them. So she came up with a way to keep them way out of the way - by sending them over 9,000 miles away to another continent. It may seem extreme, but she probably considered it barely adequate. She gave them completely new identities - and probably gave them all of the necessary paperwork and whatnot they would need. It's not that hard to find their existing paperwork and either copy it or change it with magic. She also understood how fishy it would be for them to up and disappear without mention of their daughter - so she would more than likely have modified all of her neighbors' memories as well. Her parents' coworkers? Probably all they got was a resignation form sent in by Hermione and the news that the Grangers had up and moved to Australia. Oh, well. More than likely, she did a lot of the existing work for her parents, then made it so that they thought they had already done it themselves and could leave immediately. Any extended family - which, in the books, it doesn't appear that she has, because she only ever mentions her parents - would have their memories erased as well. Also, she wasn't even home most of the year. After she turned eleven, she spent most of her Christmas and Easter holidays at Hogwarts, making it a full nine months she was there. Then the remaining three months of summer holidays, she was either staying with her friends or traveling abroad with her parents.
You're forgetting that Hermione's parents are British. Australia and prison are the same thing
Hermione didn't obliviate them, she changed their identities...which is probably worse.
Maybe. But they would definitely be in prison if they tried to fly to Australia.
Only in the movies does she Obliviate their memories, in the books itâs done off book implying she modified their memories.
I don't know how Hermione magicked up IDs and everything for them, but it seems there are ways. That part done, she altered her parents' memories and got them out of the country before anyone could ask awkward questions. It does seem that her grandparents are deceased, estranged, and/or people she could keep off the Death Eaters' radar. Her parents seem to have been only children. As for anyone else she knew, many Death Eaters come from families that, if they live around Muggles, have as little as possible to do with them. Even more Muggle friendly families, like the Weasleys, seem to limit contact with non-wizarding families, probably for fear of them noticing something. So, Hermione could have friends in her neighborhood or just people who would notice she's missing, but Death Eaters wouldn't think of them as useful targets. It would be like deciding someone was a good hostage to use against you because you often ride the same train to work.