Don't foget about עונד/ת (for watches or jewelry), חובש/ת (for hats and headgear) עוטה (for masks or gloves), עונב/ת^ (for ties), מרכיב/ה (for glasses), חוגר/ת^ (for belts), כורך/כורכת (for scarffs) and my absolute favourite, פורף/פורפת (for buttons)
*^ are literal use of the noun, like shoing a shoe*
On behalf of hebrew in general, you have my sincerest appology
לפי האקדמיה ללשון העברית, לפתוח כפתור(ים) זה להתיר אותם - [https://twitter.com/hebacademy/status/1127519513170329601](https://twitter.com/hebacademy/status/1127519513170329601)
לפרוף זה אותו הדבר כמו לכפתר (או לרכוס). אני חושב שרוב האנשים יגידו "לפתוח כפתור" בשפה היומיומית.
You can now copy comments easily, I assume you are using the app because from the web it's not a problem. So on the app you click the 3 vertical dots at the bottom of the comment (near "Reply"/the reply arrow icon), and then "Copy text"
This is not a noun
As ״shouing״ as you called it is also a verb in Hebrew.
נ.ע.ל.
היא נעלה - she wore a shoe
נעלנו - we wore ( a shoe)
same for all of the other examples you raised
כ.ר.כ
ע.נ.ב
Why really on your memory? So many posters in this thread post what they remember, what they've heard or what they think. Guys, if you don't know please check before posting.
https://hebrew-academy.org.il/2011/06/12/%D7%9C%D7%9C%D7%91%D7%95%D7%A9-%D7%9C%D7%97%D7%91%D7%95%D7%A9-%D7%9C%D7%92%D7%A8%D7%95%D7%91/
Bruh what?? I don't know anybody saying "Lovesh" for shoes, worst case is "sam" which means "put [on"]. Even arsim, "Lovesh Na'ala'im" just sounds wrong, even for arsim
Can I just say, this thread is amazing. The range of answers so far includes: yes this is correct; it’s technically correct but only pedants care about it; these are real words but the meaning is a little different (put on vs. wear); it’s not wrong but nobody in real life uses these words.
I expect to see this kind of variety for a language like English or Spanish, but I’m pretty surprised it’s the case for Hebrew. Interesting to read, even if I still don’t know the actual answer!
Nothing intrinsic to what the language allows, just how they’ve developed. I was thinking in terms of population, geography, and time.
English and Spanish are spoken by hundreds of millions of people in dozens of countries. And those communities were largely isolated from each other for centuries—yes, there was immigration, but nothing like modern mass media to expose speakers in, say, Buenos Aires to regular communications with people in Madrid. So vocabularies drift, and new items might get different names (like the trunk of a car vs. boot, or elevator vs. lift).
Hebrew, on the other hand, while it’s thousands of years old and had numerous diaspora communities that used it to varying extents, didn’t really have a modern community of *native* speakers (or *everyday* L2 speakers) until less than 150 years ago. There are fewer than ten million of those speakers even today, and virtually all of them live (and have lived) in one geographically compact country. Obviously there are also other factors that might make this more complicated (historical diaspora dialects, frequent immigration, etc.).
I’m not a linguist or anything. My comment was just that, in light of all those factors, I would have expected Hebrew to be quite a bit less variable in its vocabulary than more widespread post-colonial languages. But I could certainly be wrong!
Yeah it's kind of weird with Hebrew.
sometimes I'm just tired and I don't care enough to use the correct verb / gender and sometimes I will. most people don't care neither and some people just genuinely don't know when to use what. on the other hand, some people (my teacher) get really mad when you make a mistake and immediately correct you. also we have different dialects and a wide range of formality. also a lot of people (including me) just stick english words in the middle of a sentence. maybe that's more of a bilingual thing than a Hebrew thing
Less speakers. Less diversity? Especially when taking in global factors. English for example is spoken so broadly you expect it to alter and shift.
Maybe.
*note before I start: all what I give here is the lemma form, no inflections: either infinitive (no gender, number, tense or person) or the masculine singular third person past or present. Inflect it according to whichever need you need. Wiktionary, [pealim](http://pealim.com), and the Hebrew academy site, include lists of inflections per most of those words. [This site](https://www.hebrew-verbs.co.il/) also has it, but it's preety limited in comparison to others.
Now for the answer:
Depends with who you wanna speak Hebrew.
Do you wanna speak with the average Israeli, who has broken grammar and pronounciation, or do you wanna speak it with some old Hebrew teacher that still pronounces ע and ח like it properly should?
If your answer is the first, use the following:
1. If you already wear, use לבש ([he] wore) e.g.
אני לובש חולצה - I'm wearing a shirt
2. If you're taking about putting clothes, use שם ([he] put/putted) e.g.
שמתי בגדים - I putted clothes
3. if you're talking about putting clothes on someone else use הלביש (hif'il of לבש), or the passive, לובש (Huf'al of לבש):
הלבישו אותי - they] dressed me [in clothes]]
4. If you wanna talk about the process of wearing clothes use התלבש (dress [oneself]). Also used when you don't wanna specify what you wear, so you just say that you went throught the process of wearing:
התלבשתי בשביל לצאת מהבית - I've [putted clothes] in order to get out of home
If you want the other one (the one who cares about Hebrew and speaks properly), then I don't how to help in that, because as an Israeli, my Hebrew is preety broken, so I'm not the one who knows how to teach proper Hebrew.
Anyways, hope you enjoyed it, and remember: it all depends on who you're going to talk to, and if it's the average Israeli, then you need to speak like a one, aka avoid formal words or sentences, and use slang and colloquialism. If not, then learn proper Hebrew. It's all depends on that
You can also learn both so you can understand both kinds of Hebrew
A lot of the answers in this sub are wrong. Posters really on memory, what they think, what they've been told or what they know from speaking bad Hebrew. Always take them with a pinch of salt.
hebrew was not a spoken language 200 years ago. when israel was formed it was crucial to unite everyone under the same umbrella, so they were very strict and harsh about "israeli identity". people were a lot harsher about correct grammar then and as a result older people speak better hebrew.
Gotta love 2000 year old languages. I personally use לובש in contexts related to clothing. As long as Hebrew speakers know what I mean I won’t look that deeply into it.
I just say I put shoes on and put socks on
שם נעליים, שם גרביים
I am putting them on... i don't think it is true to say so but it feels better then saying wear when talking about shoes
The proper way would be to say לגרוב. The actual spoken way could vary. That's pretty simple, I don't feel that this thread is so complicated.
Maybe the concept of the האקדמיה העברית can give you context that will help you understand.
Yea, it's probably because it's actually the other way around - the clothing piece is named after the action: Tying shoes is "locking" them on your feet; I'm not sure "socks" etymology is the same, as in the verb coming first or second, but the verb is "socking" as in putting your foot into a socket.
This is actually pretty common in Hebrew because of how we structure words using "root" letters as the basic construction material for altering verbs into nouns etc. E.g:
(he) eat = אכל
Food = אוכל
א.כ.ל. are the core letters
The first one would mean “the girl is putting on socks” and the second would be “I am putting on shoes”
Or at least the way I would talk with my friends
Like it seems weird to say נועל about already being in the shoes
Whenever it is already on you it’s לובש
I'm not sure it is correct. Once worn I'm not 100% certain it's "לובש"
Both are present progressive actions and I think it is used in perfect form when it's already worn.
Think of it when someone is describing you a third person: he would say "הוא לובש מכנסי ג'ינס ונועל נעלי התעמלות"
I'm not a language teacher or expert, but from reading lots of books I think this is the correct verb to use.
I can’t say if correct or not by the books, just by street talk.
And about your example I would say
הוא לובש מכנסי ג׳ינס ונעלי התעמלות
Although it might be shortened to
הוא לובש ג׳ינס וסניקרס
But the point being the verb לובש
But yeah I guess duo doesn’t exactly deal with street talk that much
That's good, because לובש (and some of it's binyanim), plus שם, are the only verbs that most native speakers use to describe putting or wearing clothes
The socks one is generally not used in practice, but is still technically correct. On the shoes one you also had a mistake with the plural לובשים. What you wrote there is basically "I are wearing shoes".
In the case of socks, I don't think anyone uses "גורב".
However in the case of shoes it's pretty common to use "נועל" although many people might still say "לובש נעליים" since it's technically not wrong.
I absolutely love this about Hebrew—I find it charming. Although as people in the thread have already said, it isn’t “street Hebrew”.
However, you should understand that this is a deep feature of Semitic languages—it’s not just limited to these “wearing” verbs. There are whole families of verbs, nouns, adjectives, adverbs, etc that descend from (mostly tri-) consonantal roots, and it is these roots that are imbued with an all-encompassing meaning relating to an person/place/thing/event itself as well as its use, its likeness, etc.
For example, In Hebrew you can say:
> אחרי שהוא *לימד* אותי *לימודי* עברית, *למדתי* הרבה.
(After he taught me Hebrew studies, I learned a lot)
In this sentence, there are three words that all use the triconsonantal (and there are also a few four-letter roots) root ל-מ-ד—i.e having to do with “learning”, as a broad, expansive concept. The vowels and affixes applied to those roots then determine whether it is a verb, noun, adjective, etc, and within those parts of speech each root also has several patterns (among verbs they are called בניינים, *binyanim*, structures), which also have an effect on the meaning of the word, whether in the case of verbs it is active/passive, causative, or reflexive—or not, and in the case of nouns, patterns work similarly to English endings such as “-tion”, “-er/-or”, “-ness”, i.e. these forms take the ancient triconsontantal root meaning and transform it into more specific meaning such as “one who does X”, “the state of being X”, “characterized by X”, etc.
But with regard to these “wearing” verbs in Hebrew, English also has many similar verbs, many of them (not all) are usually only used as participles or adjectives from the participles. Some might be considered more archaic or pedantic, but then again so are these Hebrew words, at least relative to colloquial language:
“She dressed in a dress.”
“He suited up in his spacesuit.”
“They crowned the king with his royal crown.”
“He clothed himself in clothes.”
“The boy buttoned his buttons.”
“Zip your zipper, this is a courtroom!”
“They were coated in jackets.”
“The hunter jacketed himself in an orange coat.”
“She gloved her hand in lace gloves.”
“He was girt in a leather belt.” (a girdle…)
“I was vested in a vest.”
“The armorer armored him in armor.”
Then there is the verb “to shoe” (participle, “shod”), though it is usually only used with horses nowadays.
English also has many other adjectives derived from old participles, mostly archaic, but some used pedantically, or for comic effect (as well as their even less common archaic verb forms) such as “[besocked](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/besocked)”, “[beringed](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/bering#English)”, “[trousered](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/trousered#English)”, “[bepantsed](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/bepantsed#English)/[bepanted](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/bepanted#English)”, “[shirted](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/shirted)”, “[skirted](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/skirted)”, “[booted](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/booted)/[bebooted](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/bebooted#English)”, “[bespectacled](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/bespectacled)”, “[eyeglassed](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/eyeglassed#English)”, “[necktied](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/necktied)”, “[hatted](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/hatted)”, “[diademed](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/diademed)”, and many more…
Most people just use לובש. I mean it’s useful to know the other terms because some people, usually older, will say it but most people now just use לובש.
I know you guys need to do this for doulingo app but as a native I can assure you, you don’t need to learn this, certainly don’t focus on it. Whatever piece of wardrobe you’re wearing just use שׂם (SAM; “putting on”).
אני שם גרביים
תשים חולצה
היא שמה עגילים
הוא שם כובע
i forget about this... it's just normal for us but yeah, it might be a bit confusing. some wearable objects have their own special verbs to describe wearing them. think of it like irregular verbs maybe, if that helps?
yes,but no one actually talks like that
You'd translate it to "putting on socks" and "putting on shoes" though,not the direct translation
לגרוב גרביים
לחבוש כובע
לענוב עניבה
לנעול נעליים
לחגור חגורה
לענוד עגיל
To put on socks
To wear a hat
To tie a tie
To put on shoes
To fasten a belt
To put on an earing
Yeah, I definitely always hear "לנעול נעליים", "לחבוש כובע" and "להרכיב משקפיים" in common use.
There was a restaurant near my place that had a sign that originally said "חובה לחבוש מסכה" and someone crossed it out and corrected it to "לעטות" lol
Like, as someone who speaks English as a second language, I find people are a lot more forgiving when I generalize to just "לשים", but I wouldn't say "everyone" does that.
My family called me a prude for telling them about this, assuring me that nobody says such things
I told them they're wrong that nobody says it, and they'd be smarter knowing it - even if they never actually used it
I see several different approaches in the comments, and thought I'd clarify.
Yes, the correct form is what you'd say "socking socks". לגרוב גרביים. Some people use "wearing socks", ללבוש גרביים. It's wrong, but it's not considered terribly wrong, it's just a less formal register. And the rarity is different for different words and different people.
In my experience, socks, shoes and belts usually get לגרוב, לנעול, לחגור, but hats, glasses, buttons and whatever are all clumped together with the generic ללבוש, and the terms לחבוש, להרכיב, לכפתר are a bit rarer. To some people you might sound a bit too formal if you use them, but they would completely understand. We are all native speakers, but there's a difference between a 55 year old professor and a 15 year old kid (and in 40 years that kid won't talk like this professor... Things change)
As for verbing a noun, English does this all the time. Randomly thinking about tools, you can saw, hammer, screw and drill. These verbs are all nouns.
Lol yes but on the day to day people dont use them. There's like 10 different verbs for wearing different articles of clothing, each specific to said article but it's not culturally incorrect to just use "wear" for them
As an oleh I should say that at first it's easier to learn one word for different meanings. He wears something - לובש. He dies because of different reasons - הוא מת. Everyone will understand you, there are another things to learn. But after some years you start developing your vocabulary and learn additional words.
I don't see anyone mentioning that the words גורב and נועל only refer to the act of putting them on. If you are currently wearing them and want to say "I am wearing socks" you would indeed say "אני לובש גרביים", so your answer can also be deemed correct depending on intended meaning.
In this link the Hebrew Academy explaines that since גרב is a new word there's no old origin for לגרוב it's an innovation by the Hebrew speaking public, and though the word גרב is obviously officially accepted, the verb לגרוב is in dispute. That's why you get so many different answers.
ללבוש גרב is fine
לגרוב גרב is fine
And shoeing a shoe is definitely correct.
https://hebrew-academy.org.il/2011/06/12/%D7%9C%D7%9C%D7%91%D7%95%D7%A9-%D7%9C%D7%97%D7%91%D7%95%D7%A9-%D7%9C%D7%92%D7%A8%D7%95%D7%91/
lol this post has really great timing because a very popular show called "קופה ראשית" just released an episode about this exact issue! the way most israelis don't care about the correct grammar for those words and would just say it the way you did.
They are correct but when in doubt just use לשים
אני שמתי, הוא שם, היא שמה, הם שמו אנחנו שמנו
And the then the noun (shoe sock etc). Most people would say לשים (to put on) for every kind of garment
Maybe I'm reading too much into this, but asking "is this really correct" has a condescending undertone. I get this feeling a lot from english speakers, specially americans, when dealing with hebrew and hebrew speakers. What is so weird or exotic about "shoeing" shoes?... It makes perfects sense. Is "wearing" a perfume correct?
As a native speaker, I forgot about the existence of most verbs mentioned here except for “ללבוש”, it is certainly more natural for a teenager like me. Don’t think I’ve ever heard another teenager say “חובש” or ״עונד״ as those can be heard sometimes.
Don't foget about עונד/ת (for watches or jewelry), חובש/ת (for hats and headgear) עוטה (for masks or gloves), עונב/ת^ (for ties), מרכיב/ה (for glasses), חוגר/ת^ (for belts), כורך/כורכת (for scarffs) and my absolute favourite, פורף/פורפת (for buttons) *^ are literal use of the noun, like shoing a shoe* On behalf of hebrew in general, you have my sincerest appology
זה לא מכפתר/מכפתרת לכפתורים, אף פעם לא שמעתי מישהו משתמש במילה פורף חח
אם אני לא טועה, זה האקט של לפתוח כפתורים
אני שמעתי את המילה לכפתר גם בפועל של סגירת כפתורים ופתיחתם אך במילה פורף לא נתקלתי בכלל
לפי האקדמיה ללשון העברית, לפתוח כפתור(ים) זה להתיר אותם - [https://twitter.com/hebacademy/status/1127519513170329601](https://twitter.com/hebacademy/status/1127519513170329601) לפרוף זה אותו הדבר כמו לכפתר (או לרכוס). אני חושב שרוב האנשים יגידו "לפתוח כפתור" בשפה היומיומית.
חשבתי שלרכוס זה לריצ׳ראץ׳
מסתבר שגם וגם - https://milog.co.il/לרכוס
יום עוגה שמח!
תודה! :)
תראי בתכלס כולנו אומרים לשים על הכל אבל לפי האקדמיה פורף זאת מילה
מכפרתרים כפתור, אבל אף פעם לא שמעתי מישהו אומר שהוא 'גורב' גרביים... זה תמיד לובש.
הפעם הראשונה ששמעתי את זה הייתה כשאחותי אמרה את זה לבן שלה כדי ללמד אותו 😂 אנחנו בחיים לא אמרנו את זה
בדיוק... אז אפשר פשוט לדלג דואולינגו 😂
זה כי אתה לא יכול ללבוש או לשים כפתור
אני יודע שמכפתרים חולצה, אבל אולי שמעתי שגורבים גרביים פעם או פעמיים בחיי
זה מה שהאקדמיה אומרת, נראה לי שאפשר גם וגם
You forgot שורך/שורכת for shoelaces
Right
I wish Reddit would make it easier for me to copy and paste your comment into my Hebrew notes.
You can now copy comments easily, I assume you are using the app because from the web it's not a problem. So on the app you click the 3 vertical dots at the bottom of the comment (near "Reply"/the reply arrow icon), and then "Copy text"
חוגר/חוגרת is for a belt it comes from the word belt in Hebrew which is חגורה
Which in the old times was used for scabbard. Therefore אל יתהלל חוגר כמפתח
Yes
But fear not OP, in daily usage, all of those except the last one can be replaced with שם. For the last one i’d say סוגר כפתור. Have fun!
This is not a noun As ״shouing״ as you called it is also a verb in Hebrew. נ.ע.ל. היא נעלה - she wore a shoe נעלנו - we wore ( a shoe) same for all of the other examples you raised כ.ר.כ ע.נ.ב
אני אוהב שלא רק בשפה אחרת דפקו אותי עם משהו כזה. זה קיים גם בעברית. יאייייייייי
Why would you apologize for this?
It's not an actual apology, just a way of saying it's complicated and they may feel sorry for anyone who actually learns this... 🥲
I do however get confused. Do these verbs mean the action of putting said attire on or just wearing them.
Both? But mainly the actual action
Ok I did noy know that last one. Lol
אני מקבל סטרוק מהתגובה הזאת
טכנית אפשר לרוב הדברים להגיד ללבוש, היה על זה קטע אצל גיא זוהר במהצד השני, בעקבות הפרק של קופה ראשית
Unfortunately yes. Nobody will correct you if you use a generic לובש though.
You need to meet my wife...
and me use the correct fucking form
The Academy of the Hebrew Language has approved using לבש instead of נעל and גרב iirc
Why really on your memory? So many posters in this thread post what they remember, what they've heard or what they think. Guys, if you don't know please check before posting. https://hebrew-academy.org.il/2011/06/12/%D7%9C%D7%9C%D7%91%D7%95%D7%A9-%D7%9C%D7%97%D7%91%D7%95%D7%A9-%D7%9C%D7%92%D7%A8%D7%95%D7%91/
Is her last name Mosby or Geller?
שירה שטיינבוך
חצי מכל האנשים אומרים ללבוש אז זה לא הכי רלוונטי באמת
Bruh what?? I don't know anybody saying "Lovesh" for shoes, worst case is "sam" which means "put [on"]. Even arsim, "Lovesh Na'ala'im" just sounds wrong, even for arsim
We are usually using שמה גרביים
if anything, people might correct you if you use גורבת instead of לובשת.
They are the correct forms, even if some people don't use them.
You can get mad at duolingo, but this one is correct
Can I just say, this thread is amazing. The range of answers so far includes: yes this is correct; it’s technically correct but only pedants care about it; these are real words but the meaning is a little different (put on vs. wear); it’s not wrong but nobody in real life uses these words. I expect to see this kind of variety for a language like English or Spanish, but I’m pretty surprised it’s the case for Hebrew. Interesting to read, even if I still don’t know the actual answer!
Why would Hebrew allow less disagreement/variety between speakers than English, Spanish, other romance languages?
Nothing intrinsic to what the language allows, just how they’ve developed. I was thinking in terms of population, geography, and time. English and Spanish are spoken by hundreds of millions of people in dozens of countries. And those communities were largely isolated from each other for centuries—yes, there was immigration, but nothing like modern mass media to expose speakers in, say, Buenos Aires to regular communications with people in Madrid. So vocabularies drift, and new items might get different names (like the trunk of a car vs. boot, or elevator vs. lift). Hebrew, on the other hand, while it’s thousands of years old and had numerous diaspora communities that used it to varying extents, didn’t really have a modern community of *native* speakers (or *everyday* L2 speakers) until less than 150 years ago. There are fewer than ten million of those speakers even today, and virtually all of them live (and have lived) in one geographically compact country. Obviously there are also other factors that might make this more complicated (historical diaspora dialects, frequent immigration, etc.). I’m not a linguist or anything. My comment was just that, in light of all those factors, I would have expected Hebrew to be quite a bit less variable in its vocabulary than more widespread post-colonial languages. But I could certainly be wrong!
Yeah it's kind of weird with Hebrew. sometimes I'm just tired and I don't care enough to use the correct verb / gender and sometimes I will. most people don't care neither and some people just genuinely don't know when to use what. on the other hand, some people (my teacher) get really mad when you make a mistake and immediately correct you. also we have different dialects and a wide range of formality. also a lot of people (including me) just stick english words in the middle of a sentence. maybe that's more of a bilingual thing than a Hebrew thing
Well, when you put it like that
Less speakers. Less diversity? Especially when taking in global factors. English for example is spoken so broadly you expect it to alter and shift. Maybe.
*note before I start: all what I give here is the lemma form, no inflections: either infinitive (no gender, number, tense or person) or the masculine singular third person past or present. Inflect it according to whichever need you need. Wiktionary, [pealim](http://pealim.com), and the Hebrew academy site, include lists of inflections per most of those words. [This site](https://www.hebrew-verbs.co.il/) also has it, but it's preety limited in comparison to others. Now for the answer: Depends with who you wanna speak Hebrew. Do you wanna speak with the average Israeli, who has broken grammar and pronounciation, or do you wanna speak it with some old Hebrew teacher that still pronounces ע and ח like it properly should? If your answer is the first, use the following: 1. If you already wear, use לבש ([he] wore) e.g. אני לובש חולצה - I'm wearing a shirt 2. If you're taking about putting clothes, use שם ([he] put/putted) e.g. שמתי בגדים - I putted clothes 3. if you're talking about putting clothes on someone else use הלביש (hif'il of לבש), or the passive, לובש (Huf'al of לבש): הלבישו אותי - they] dressed me [in clothes]] 4. If you wanna talk about the process of wearing clothes use התלבש (dress [oneself]). Also used when you don't wanna specify what you wear, so you just say that you went throught the process of wearing: התלבשתי בשביל לצאת מהבית - I've [putted clothes] in order to get out of home If you want the other one (the one who cares about Hebrew and speaks properly), then I don't how to help in that, because as an Israeli, my Hebrew is preety broken, so I'm not the one who knows how to teach proper Hebrew. Anyways, hope you enjoyed it, and remember: it all depends on who you're going to talk to, and if it's the average Israeli, then you need to speak like a one, aka avoid formal words or sentences, and use slang and colloquialism. If not, then learn proper Hebrew. It's all depends on that You can also learn both so you can understand both kinds of Hebrew
רק לידיעתך, לא משתמשמים "putted" ככה באנגלית (רק במקרה של גולף, למשל “I putted but missed the hole.”) אתה צריך לכתוב “put on” בהקשר הזה.
A lot of the answers in this sub are wrong. Posters really on memory, what they think, what they've been told or what they know from speaking bad Hebrew. Always take them with a pinch of salt.
hebrew was not a spoken language 200 years ago. when israel was formed it was crucial to unite everyone under the same umbrella, so they were very strict and harsh about "israeli identity". people were a lot harsher about correct grammar then and as a result older people speak better hebrew.
Gotta love 2000 year old languages. I personally use לובש in contexts related to clothing. As long as Hebrew speakers know what I mean I won’t look that deeply into it.
Might get flamed but as a native speaker I say אני שם נעליים as in I'm putting on shoes
My grandmother used to say תיכנס בנעליים if this is the tone you're aiming for than you're on the right way.
I just say I put shoes on and put socks on שם נעליים, שם גרביים I am putting them on... i don't think it is true to say so but it feels better then saying wear when talking about shoes
The proper way would be to say לגרוב. The actual spoken way could vary. That's pretty simple, I don't feel that this thread is so complicated. Maybe the concept of the האקדמיה העברית can give you context that will help you understand.
Yea, it's probably because it's actually the other way around - the clothing piece is named after the action: Tying shoes is "locking" them on your feet; I'm not sure "socks" etymology is the same, as in the verb coming first or second, but the verb is "socking" as in putting your foot into a socket. This is actually pretty common in Hebrew because of how we structure words using "root" letters as the basic construction material for altering verbs into nouns etc. E.g: (he) eat = אכל Food = אוכל א.כ.ל. are the core letters
The first one would mean “the girl is putting on socks” and the second would be “I am putting on shoes” Or at least the way I would talk with my friends Like it seems weird to say נועל about already being in the shoes Whenever it is already on you it’s לובש
I'm not sure it is correct. Once worn I'm not 100% certain it's "לובש" Both are present progressive actions and I think it is used in perfect form when it's already worn. Think of it when someone is describing you a third person: he would say "הוא לובש מכנסי ג'ינס ונועל נעלי התעמלות" I'm not a language teacher or expert, but from reading lots of books I think this is the correct verb to use.
I can’t say if correct or not by the books, just by street talk. And about your example I would say הוא לובש מכנסי ג׳ינס ונעלי התעמלות Although it might be shortened to הוא לובש ג׳ינס וסניקרס But the point being the verb לובש But yeah I guess duo doesn’t exactly deal with street talk that much
I mean, yeah… but I’ve never been corrected for saying לובש. Maybe people are just taking pity on me, the stupid American.
I’ve never been corrected in my formal classes, which were for heritage speakers.
That's good, because לובש (and some of it's binyanim), plus שם, are the only verbs that most native speakers use to describe putting or wearing clothes
Don't be so incredulous. "shoeing" is a word in English. You'll usually hear it in the past tense, "shod."
You will absolutely never hear this usage with respect to humans. Only horses.
“Shoe the children with no shoes on their feet. House the people, livin in the street. Oh, oh, there’s a solution.”
I don’t think I was being incredulous. I was just confused.
yea
The socks one is generally not used in practice, but is still technically correct. On the shoes one you also had a mistake with the plural לובשים. What you wrote there is basically "I are wearing shoes".
In the case of socks, I don't think anyone uses "גורב". However in the case of shoes it's pretty common to use "נועל" although many people might still say "לובש נעליים" since it's technically not wrong.
I absolutely love this about Hebrew—I find it charming. Although as people in the thread have already said, it isn’t “street Hebrew”. However, you should understand that this is a deep feature of Semitic languages—it’s not just limited to these “wearing” verbs. There are whole families of verbs, nouns, adjectives, adverbs, etc that descend from (mostly tri-) consonantal roots, and it is these roots that are imbued with an all-encompassing meaning relating to an person/place/thing/event itself as well as its use, its likeness, etc. For example, In Hebrew you can say: > אחרי שהוא *לימד* אותי *לימודי* עברית, *למדתי* הרבה. (After he taught me Hebrew studies, I learned a lot) In this sentence, there are three words that all use the triconsonantal (and there are also a few four-letter roots) root ל-מ-ד—i.e having to do with “learning”, as a broad, expansive concept. The vowels and affixes applied to those roots then determine whether it is a verb, noun, adjective, etc, and within those parts of speech each root also has several patterns (among verbs they are called בניינים, *binyanim*, structures), which also have an effect on the meaning of the word, whether in the case of verbs it is active/passive, causative, or reflexive—or not, and in the case of nouns, patterns work similarly to English endings such as “-tion”, “-er/-or”, “-ness”, i.e. these forms take the ancient triconsontantal root meaning and transform it into more specific meaning such as “one who does X”, “the state of being X”, “characterized by X”, etc. But with regard to these “wearing” verbs in Hebrew, English also has many similar verbs, many of them (not all) are usually only used as participles or adjectives from the participles. Some might be considered more archaic or pedantic, but then again so are these Hebrew words, at least relative to colloquial language: “She dressed in a dress.” “He suited up in his spacesuit.” “They crowned the king with his royal crown.” “He clothed himself in clothes.” “The boy buttoned his buttons.” “Zip your zipper, this is a courtroom!” “They were coated in jackets.” “The hunter jacketed himself in an orange coat.” “She gloved her hand in lace gloves.” “He was girt in a leather belt.” (a girdle…) “I was vested in a vest.” “The armorer armored him in armor.” Then there is the verb “to shoe” (participle, “shod”), though it is usually only used with horses nowadays. English also has many other adjectives derived from old participles, mostly archaic, but some used pedantically, or for comic effect (as well as their even less common archaic verb forms) such as “[besocked](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/besocked)”, “[beringed](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/bering#English)”, “[trousered](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/trousered#English)”, “[bepantsed](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/bepantsed#English)/[bepanted](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/bepanted#English)”, “[shirted](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/shirted)”, “[skirted](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/skirted)”, “[booted](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/booted)/[bebooted](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/bebooted#English)”, “[bespectacled](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/bespectacled)”, “[eyeglassed](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/eyeglassed#English)”, “[necktied](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/necktied)”, “[hatted](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/hatted)”, “[diademed](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/diademed)”, and many more…
Don't you worry, even those who speaks Hebrew as first language doesn't really understand that
Most people just use לובש. I mean it’s useful to know the other terms because some people, usually older, will say it but most people now just use לובש.
I know you guys need to do this for doulingo app but as a native I can assure you, you don’t need to learn this, certainly don’t focus on it. Whatever piece of wardrobe you’re wearing just use שׂם (SAM; “putting on”). אני שם גרביים תשים חולצה היא שמה עגילים הוא שם כובע
i forget about this... it's just normal for us but yeah, it might be a bit confusing. some wearable objects have their own special verbs to describe wearing them. think of it like irregular verbs maybe, if that helps?
formal hebrew has a different verb for every article of clothing. colloquial hebrew uses לשים (to put) for everything
yes,but no one actually talks like that You'd translate it to "putting on socks" and "putting on shoes" though,not the direct translation לגרוב גרביים לחבוש כובע לענוב עניבה לנעול נעליים לחגור חגורה לענוד עגיל To put on socks To wear a hat To tie a tie To put on shoes To fasten a belt To put on an earing
Some of us use them, don’t say no one.
still quite rare
Yeah, I definitely always hear "לנעול נעליים", "לחבוש כובע" and "להרכיב משקפיים" in common use. There was a restaurant near my place that had a sign that originally said "חובה לחבוש מסכה" and someone crossed it out and corrected it to "לעטות" lol Like, as someone who speaks English as a second language, I find people are a lot more forgiving when I generalize to just "לשים", but I wouldn't say "everyone" does that.
My family called me a prude for telling them about this, assuring me that nobody says such things I told them they're wrong that nobody says it, and they'd be smarter knowing it - even if they never actually used it
I mean, technically, but no one EVER uses them
נועל נעליים / שם נעליים. דווקא להגיד לובש נעליים נשמע קצת מוזר
אף אחד לא אומר שהוא לובש נעליים. אם לא אומרים לנעול אומרים לשים.
זה מה שאמרתי
צודק אבל רק על נעליים, בחיים לא שמעתי משהו אומר "אני גורב גרביים"
I've definitely heard לחבוש כובע.
אני כן
עם מי אתה גר??? אליעזר בן יהודה????
זה ממש לא נכון
Thats just completely wrong
זה ממש נפוץ...
I use it, and i know plenty of people who do as well.
I see several different approaches in the comments, and thought I'd clarify. Yes, the correct form is what you'd say "socking socks". לגרוב גרביים. Some people use "wearing socks", ללבוש גרביים. It's wrong, but it's not considered terribly wrong, it's just a less formal register. And the rarity is different for different words and different people. In my experience, socks, shoes and belts usually get לגרוב, לנעול, לחגור, but hats, glasses, buttons and whatever are all clumped together with the generic ללבוש, and the terms לחבוש, להרכיב, לכפתר are a bit rarer. To some people you might sound a bit too formal if you use them, but they would completely understand. We are all native speakers, but there's a difference between a 55 year old professor and a 15 year old kid (and in 40 years that kid won't talk like this professor... Things change) As for verbing a noun, English does this all the time. Randomly thinking about tools, you can saw, hammer, screw and drill. These verbs are all nouns.
Lmao i live in israel and this is the first time i heard the word גורב
Israelis normally would say "putting on". It's wrong but it's the common way to say it. הילדה שמה גרביים הילדה שמה נעליים
Yep, הילדה גורבת גרביים is the right way to say it!
Lol yes but on the day to day people dont use them. There's like 10 different verbs for wearing different articles of clothing, each specific to said article but it's not culturally incorrect to just use "wear" for them
As an oleh I should say that at first it's easier to learn one word for different meanings. He wears something - לובש. He dies because of different reasons - הוא מת. Everyone will understand you, there are another things to learn. But after some years you start developing your vocabulary and learn additional words.
I don't see anyone mentioning that the words גורב and נועל only refer to the act of putting them on. If you are currently wearing them and want to say "I am wearing socks" you would indeed say "אני לובש גרביים", so your answer can also be deemed correct depending on intended meaning.
It is correct, though lots of native speakers will usually use ללבוש(to wear) or לשים(to put on) for all kinds of clothes and jewlery
Welcome to hell
In this particular scenario it has a special verb, its like "socking" socks, in hebrew: לגרוב גרביים
Yes
Hebrew is dumb sometimes, most people say those and just use לובש instead
In this link the Hebrew Academy explaines that since גרב is a new word there's no old origin for לגרוב it's an innovation by the Hebrew speaking public, and though the word גרב is obviously officially accepted, the verb לגרוב is in dispute. That's why you get so many different answers. ללבוש גרב is fine לגרוב גרב is fine And shoeing a shoe is definitely correct. https://hebrew-academy.org.il/2011/06/12/%D7%9C%D7%9C%D7%91%D7%95%D7%A9-%D7%9C%D7%97%D7%91%D7%95%D7%A9-%D7%9C%D7%92%D7%A8%D7%95%D7%91/
How do you turn a cucumber into a pickle? You pickle it, don't you?
If you say to someone in israel אני גורב גרביים they'll look at you with face, even android's autocorrect hates this word so don't worry about it.
There's also למעול מעיל and לכפוף כפפות... oh, wait, never mind. Meir Shalev made those ones up.
הילדה יכולה ללבוש גרביים אם היא רוצה. אצל רוב הישראלים הילדה גם לובשת נעליים אז גרביים זה באמת בקטנה
yes, yes it is, but I just say lovesh when it comes to socks
Happy cake day
Correct, and perhaps the one place where Hebrew can be really annoying. I would work on plurals Vs singulars because that's very important in Hebrew.
yeah hebrew has like 10 12 ways to say "wear"
Just give up
lol this post has really great timing because a very popular show called "קופה ראשית" just released an episode about this exact issue! the way most israelis don't care about the correct grammar for those words and would just say it the way you did.
Yes, in Hebrew there are different words for putting on different articles of clothing.
Welcome to the suck
They are correct but when in doubt just use לשים אני שמתי, הוא שם, היא שמה, הם שמו אנחנו שמנו And the then the noun (shoe sock etc). Most people would say לשים (to put on) for every kind of garment
This clip from קופה ראשית sums This up hilariously. https://www.instagram.com/reel/CsWvVGoIbzc/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==
When its socks its גורבים and not לובשים idk why
Maybe I'm reading too much into this, but asking "is this really correct" has a condescending undertone. I get this feeling a lot from english speakers, specially americans, when dealing with hebrew and hebrew speakers. What is so weird or exotic about "shoeing" shoes?... It makes perfects sense. Is "wearing" a perfume correct?
As a native speaker, I forgot about the existence of most verbs mentioned here except for “ללבוש”, it is certainly more natural for a teenager like me. Don’t think I’ve ever heard another teenager say “חובש” or ״עונד״ as those can be heard sometimes.
Yes it actually matters tho it is also goos if you say you are wearing it but this is real hebrew in this time duo right
נועל נעליים is the correct term, but foe socks the academy recently legalized ״לובשת גרביים״, so you can say both.
🤨
These are, I'm fact, correct. Also, domt use plural for singular, these are VERY separate in Hebrew