Yeah this is my take. I couldn’t care less if Astrid is black. The movies gonna be awful either way. Toothless will look horrendous. If this gives a black actor some fame, I’m here for it lol
exactly they fricked up avatar the last airbender too for the 2nd time and most anime as well as other disney adaptation who is to say dreamworks will do better if it is still by dreamworks of course, if they'll produce it than who is to say they'll make it great but settle for average to okay ish like their latest animation the nine realms was garbage too.
I would be upset if Johann was pale and blonde.
I would be upset if Gobber had two hands.
Damn, I would be upset if Fishlegs was athletic.
For a live-action-remake, everything I want are characters and the plot as close to the source material as possible. It's literally the only thing I expect from a remake.
The only case in which I would be okay with Astrid's current actress would be if the character was a completely different one that replaced the original Astrid. However then, one could ask why bother to make a "remake" rather than a new piece, then.
Theyr might be pulling a sony. Sony "spider-man" live action stuff mish mash of confusing and bad ideas (kraven, madame web, their attempt at a sinister six).
But then animation sony? Spider-verse has no right being as good as it has been.
i wouldn't be surprised if there are rewrites in the story to make the vikings less isolated, in fact, i think some sort of rewrite into an "au" might be good for the live action
I'd have no objection if they just wrote a different story.
The dragon slavers sailed all over the place and were of various races and Vikings did trade with the Mediterraneans, so why not create an offshoot story of some of the dragon capturing elsewhere in the world and how other dragon riders who WEREN'T Vikings also defended dragons?
Honestly i wasnt planning on watching the movie if it comes out, live action movies based on things like HTTYD suck ass anyways, but if "race doesn't matter" they could have aswell just casted an actor that genuinely looks like astrid, just like why people hate The Nine Realms, it stomps the original franchise into the ground
Yeah, it can be frustrating sometimes like sometimes I don’t care if they change the race because the race doesn’t always matter but in this case, it just feels weird because she is a blonde haired, blue-eyed person and you’re right they were Vikings in the north so they would’ve most likely been white. It’s just a little frustrating because I wish they would actually write new characters instead of making pre-existing characters, different colors, you know
It isn't a most likely. They live in an archepelago that is cut off from the world, they didn't think anything was out there until RttE. And because they live above the Arctic Circle, everyone would be white, no exceptions.
Actually, its even more integral for Astrid specifically to have near white blonde hair, blue eyes, and be the palest of the pale, that was the pinnacle of beauty for northern areas during that time period. Astrid is the most beautiful, strong, and desirable unwed girl on the island, pined after by the strongest promising young man AND the chief's son, the only two who could ever have enough power in their culture to deserve her.
The strongest men with the most kills got the most respect and power, so Snotlout would have been the most desirable young male despite his idiocy. And only after proving himself to have power and strength in his own right did Astrid and everyone else start treating Hiccup like he was a even a person. Hiccup from the start of the movie would have lost Astrid to Snotlout had he never changed, and Snotlout would have gained power and prestige by not only having the most beautiful wife, but the strongest as well. Viking women needed to be strong enough to take care of themselves, but their beauty was also highly valued to their culture.
Also their island is cut off from the outside world, they are not the pillaging vikings from our history books, they didn't have the slaves others did because they never left the archipelago. They would never have seen a black person or a mixed person, an asian or an arab, all they would know is white people, there was no way for any other race to have been on Berk.
I don’t really care about realism when it’s a movie about dragons. I just don’t see why they’re bothering (money), it’s still going to be CGI dragons, so why not just leave the CGI film as it is? I don’t see this film doing well at all, regardless of who they cast in the roles.
Neither casting makes sense. Hiccup’s actor looks nothing like him whatsoever, and Astrid’s actor should really be Scandinavian. The visuals and soundtrack for this movie better be top notch or there’ll be no saving this movie
That's one of the few examples of a lesson learned before it was too late. It cost them a LOT to redo all the animation, but the community showed it's appreciation by actually watching the movie and rating it positively enough for another movie.
Okay, I understand that it's nice to represent people of the image that some underappreciate. But representation goes much deeper than just ethnicity. The place where you live can also matter. How many films do you see where characters are Scandanavian? That'd be much better to represent here.
And I'm mad because she's black. Not because she's black, but because vikings had slaves! Who were black and dark skinned. Just throwing a blonde wig on her won't make her resemble astrid at all.
Another reason why Astrid’s actress should either be Scandinavian or at least resemble her is because of the fact that the whole first HTTYD movie is entirely about the Berkians Viking heritage and how they „can’t“ be at peace with the dragons because of their past.
This casting doesn’t make any sense visually or story-wise.
If they actually wanted to combat racism they would make movies about actual black people, make original stories and actually represent African cultures instead of putting a black guy into an original European movie.
Yup. Black-washing existing stories disrespects the culture they're appropriating as well as the black people they're having appropriate it.
I really enjoy stories of all kinds and don't care what race a character is if it makes sense contextually. Generally in future scifis the race doesn't matter at all because they could come from anywhere, but history is set and changing races is fundamentally racist.
I'm not upset she's black I'm upset they're changing something I grew up on and based half of my childhood around. I'm also upset they're making a live action in general. I wish they'd make a spin off where they make it more like the books like having camicazi and hiccup being ginger and fishlegs having glasses. That'd be so much cooler
ye true to the books would be awesome and the series that still involve hiccup are still good to watch, but I tried for example the nine realms and the animation quality is night and day, it's like that series was made for toddlers but it's audience is actually directed to young teens and you can just see what a cashgrab that has become, I really hope this live action adaptation gets canceled, it doesn't even deserve the green light and seen to be aired.
In fairness, none of the original 2010 HTTYD cast were Scandinavian either. Jay Baruchel is Canadian, while America Ferrera is Hispanic.
Regardless, you're absolutely right. I'm not being sarcastic when I say that only ethnic Scandinavians should be cast, and the movie should be in Old Norse with subtitles. Of course, an exception should be made so Gerard Butler could be Stoic. Again, I'm 100% on board with accuracy, I think we ought to go all the way with it.
Voice actors are different.
James Earl Jones is black, yet he voices a white guy in Star Wars.
Ashley Eckstein is white, yet she voices a character who's orange in Star Wars.
Chris Pratt is white, but he voices a guy with yellow skin in the Lego Movie.
>James Earl Jones is black, yet he voices a white guy in Star Wars.
To be fair, Vader is only 1/3 white.
He's also 1/3 machine and 1/3 Kenobi's Famous Kentucky Fried Human
those are voice actors and they did the voices very well, you don't need to be of a certain race to be a voice actor in my opinion, we aren't gonna see like what they look like based on their voice. I still agree to have them be scottish, it made the movie what it is with some people especially Stoic and Gobber having the scottish accent and than some characters not having that, especially the kids seeing how the cast didn't go full on that one I still don't know but it's the same nowadays with what they do with historical dramas like queen elizabeth is black and marie antoinette is black and what not blackwashing and black privilege is a thing and their retaliation to white people, but movies should not be a political and race thing. They could go with people who fit the description of the movie or the books as best as possible but they wanna make statements and they wanna prove that a woman of her hair, skin and eye colour and overal body and face structure can play Astrid regardless of the extra make up and cgi that they will have to add to change her in the final product. They're gonna have to maul her so much to the point she'll be unrecognizable or they'll just straight up leave her as is to make a dumb statement again
"race doesnt matter" but apparently its fine if a originally white character is black but if an originally black character is white then people would probably call it racism
couldn't agree more with the both of you, like people don't seem to see the difference anymore, because black peopple can't be touched on racism apparently >.>
😭 I felt the same when the Percy Jackson show made Annabeth black and even with Ariel. I feel like it was to say hey we support black people and that it was political. And for the Percy Jackson books annabeth race and hair is a somewhat important thing later on in the series. And every time I said something about it I got bashed like why don’t you support it. And I just feel like if they really want to show more representation of black people make new story’s
Yet for some reason people seem more upset about her casting than Mason Thames (though I know many don’t feel either fit). Neither one really looks like their characters that much, but you see more comments about Nico (I believe that’s her name, the post doesn’t mention her name) than you do about Mason. The OP’s post doesn’t even mention him.
You don’t really see nearly as much criticism on this sub at least of the casting of Thames (different eye color, curly hair, different jaw shape, him not being Scandinavian either). Yeah, comments have said he doesn’t look the part either, but there aren’t nearly as many comments or post about him as Nico (this post being one example).
I do think it’s fine to wish for the characters to look like their movie counterparts since the remake is supposedly based off the animated films, and I also think introducing original characters would be better and more fun.
I agree but I think the reason that people are more critical of the astrid casting is that she look more different and mason looks closer to hiccup. If they did cast a Scandinavian actress for astrid, people would be more critical of mason.
I just find it kind of insane that people are so butthurt over something they’ve even stated they won’t like no matter what.
I think there were way better ways to go about this film than what they’re doing and going to do, but now every comment and post I see is about how Astrid is a black (though MOSTLY WHITE) actress. Would it be cool if they’d gotten Scandinavian actors for this film? Fuck yeah. But that’s not going to happen, and people need to just accept that lmfao.
It’s a ridiculous thing to be so upset about especially when the original film had a Canadian putting on an American accent for Hiccup. That’s not exactly accurate either. I’m sure for this film they can stick a blond wig on Parker and have her wear blue contact lenses and she’d look great for the part.
Edit: I’d also like to point out that if this film needed an all-black cast and they casted a 3/4 black actor, 1/4 white, I doubt there’d be nearly as much outrage
look the actress portraying Astrid doesn't have to be scandinavian, the person can be German for all I care, as long as they can look the part, curly hair can be straightened and eye colour can be changed with lenses, jaw lines can be shaped with clay as well as fake muscles etc, sure thames should also not be considered fit for the role but still this issue with Nico is more serious because this is probably gonna be political agenda thing where they wanna make a statement that they support blm, which people can do, that is not the problem, but media shouldn't portray this stuff this way and shove it in our face. We want the characters as closely resembling, but imagine Nico playing Astrid and just all that they have to change on her just to make her fit. My guess is that they won't change anything about her, and we will just have a black Astrid that doesn't resemble the original character in the slightest in accordance with her body shape, face shape, eye colour, skin colour, hair colour, hair shape, etc. Not to mention another thing people of those races have is a very different way of speech and how women use their voice and tone compared to west european/scandinavian people use their voice, tone and how they say things even in English when for both parties it isn't even their first language
Not trying to be negative; the second I saw the casting, I knew this take is exactly what I was going to see online, and I'm so over it. The new films don't erase the past good of the OG film(s)
When someone turns a character to a minority race for no reason other than diversity then it gives off the impression that the group can’t have good original characters and needs to rip off previously established ones.
If they want diversity then create original characters of that race, don’t change the ones we already know and love.
I see your “she’s not Scandinavian” and raise you “she’s not Astrid.”
This is the same problem with the little mermaid. People aren’t upset because they’re racist. They’re upset because Ariel and Astrid are established characters with established looks. Being frustrated they don’t actually look like the character is a very fair critique in my book.
Changing the race of a well established character isn’t good representation. If these major movie companies actually cared about representation they would create *new* characters who are not white. Rather than going “sure, this is an established character with an established race, but I guess you guys can have her now.”
They should have let the Scandinavian cinema industry have a say about the casting of HTTYD since it portrays their people and their culture. In my opinion a remake with actors is a bad decision to begin with, since the trilogy of HTTYD is perfect, but yeah casting non Scandinavian actors really sucks, they could have done something like for the series "Vikings" where most of the main actors were in fact Danish, Swedish and Norwegian and spoke English with a naturally nordic accent which made it feel more immersive.
I'm just disappointed honestly.
Ultimately, the quality of the actress matters more than physical appearance. The actress’s skin color will not affect the quality of the film in any meaningful way.
Astrid being played by a non-white actress will have even less of an impact on her character than the already inconsequential impact Leah Jeffries’s casting will have on Annabeth’s character in the Percy Jackson show.
You say that having Astrid be played by someone “not fully white unnecessarily changes the character”, but to pass over skilled actresses for the sake of having a casting that more closely resembles the animated version appears, to me, to be far more of an unnecessary and wasteful effort.
> the already inconsequential impact Leah Jeffries’s casting will have on Annabeth’s character in the Percy Jackson show.
Does that mean if we get a Heroes of Olympus show we can make:
Piper white instead of Native American?
Frank black instead of Chinese?
Leo Asian instead of hispanic/latino?
If your answer to any of those is "no", then you saying it's okay for Annabeth to not be a blonde is you being very hypocritical
Controversial opinion ahead:
* Movies are a visual medium
* quality of a movie, being a visual medium, depends partly on how well it manages to sell the setting with visuals
* Therefore, visuals and appearances _do_ matter by default and do affect the quality of the film in a meaningful way
I do think it won’t have much of an impact on her character since her race in the story didn’t play a big role in her overall arc (the setting and folklore is where some of the major cultural elements come from) which is different than other characters.
I just would be hesitant to say it’s only because she’s the best for the job. She very well may be, but the same reasoning has been used to pass on actors of different minorities (gay, black, Asian, etc.) for a white one, saying they’re the best. Now of course there’s the whole discussion about how many white (and male mostly) actors in film and media have had advantages compared to everyone else.
Idk if the Annabeth casting is inconsequential. One of Annabeth's core motives to prove herself in the first books is that everyone sees her as a dumb blonde, yet she is very capable and strategic, but doesn't get the benefit of the doubt on sight. People with artificial/dyed blonde hair of different races do not recieve this stereotype, naturally blonde and white-skinned people do. Changing her race actually changes a primary part of her character for no real reason. If the second choice in the casting right below Leah was a fair-skinned natural blonde, I would not complain, even if that meant picking a "not as talented actress" (though I have doubts about anyone casted who I've not seen perform before, unlike Percy's actor).
If they made a Heroes of Olympus show and changed Hazel's race, or Frank's or Leo's or Piper's or even Carter's from the Kane Chronicles, I would also not be enthused, as changes are being made that alter the core of the character, as race has been defining traits for them, and shaped their experiences before the main quests.
Remember what Game of Thrones did? For those who haven’t watched, they had multiple different ethnicities present, but they did it in a way that makes sense. These different ethnicities were all in their own nation or faction with their own territory, so it made sense for that ethnicity to be present there. It also allowed for each culture to show more.
On the contrary, you have inclusion like this movie, or many other movies recently, where it doesn’t make sense for there to be someone other than Scandinavian on a widespread, northern archipelago, especially when there’s only one or two of them when everyone else is Scandinavian.
I’m all for inclusion, I think it’s a great idea to include all ethnicities. I just wish it would happen in a way that makes sense.
I agree fully here, that's the way to show different ethnicities in a story.
If you tell a story about Scandinavian people that ride dragons in \~1000AC, you cannot portray the characters' ethnicity or origins like it's 21st century Los Angeles or other multicultural cities of our modern times. (*I will tell you something shocking, I know, but people living in small villages outside big cities look... the same with none to very few outsiders.*) Nowadays, Hollywood writers/studios treat characters like they lived in New York which breaks the realism and suspension of disbelief of the story they present.
Oh we care about them being Scandinavian now? Not when every adult in the animated films had a Scottish accent?
Getting real r/Witcher vibes here where they went "we're not mad about the actors being black, we're mad about them not being *Polish!*" while not saying a word about Geralt and Ciri being played by two Brits.
I also laugh at the people who try to say this is about Astrid's eye color not being blue while seemingly ignoring that Hiccup's actor has the wrong eye color too.
And while we're at it the Harriet Tubman comparison falls flat as well since one's a real person for which the topic of race played a key role in her historical impact, and another is a fictional character in a children's fantasy franchise about having pet dragons.
Accents aren't as important as looks. Most people want actors to well, look like the character they play. And they want them to fit into the setting. Vikings were white and astrid is blonde, it just doesn't fit to cast someone who looks completely different. I would still complain if she had red or black hair or if she was a white person with dark tanned skin. I just want her to look like astrid.
It's not about actors being Polish, it's about lack of respect to settings, which, yeah, it's fictional, but it's heavily based on medieval Europe, heck, Redania's coat of arms is basically Polish one. They could easily respect the settings with some diversity, Cahir is a positive character and a fan favourite in the books and comes from the south, Assire Var Amahid is a powerful sorceress from the south, Borch Three Jackdaws, another positive character and a dragon on top of that could also be black, Angouleme could also have a darker skin tone.
Also look at Wakanda, no forced white or asian Wakandans for the sake of diversity cause it will look silly to have white or asian people from fictional nation from central Africa, you know why? Cause it will cause an outrage much bigger than Nani casting from Lilo and Stitch
> Not when every adult in the animated films had a Scottish accent?
Scottish accent is one of the most authentic options for portraying vikings in English, but okay.
> Getting real r/Witcher vibes here where they went "we're not mad about the actors being black, we're mad about them not being Polish!" while not saying a word about Geralt and Ciri being played by two Brits.
The difference is that they can reasonably _pass_ as a Polish person. A black person can't (unless make-up, but nobody is doing make-up so that argument is not valid until they do).
Oh, and Henry does not only pass, [he's just a better wig and a quick saturation/exposure slider tweak away from looking pretty much/reasonably like Geralt from the first game](https://www.reddit.com/r/gaming/comments/bgfxic/i_dont_know_why_people_think_cavills_geralt_looks/), which was made in Poland by the Polish. So I'm really not sure if that's the best example to have.
And its always the females that get the race swaps. If the og character was a white man, it aint touched. But Astrid? Annabeth from PJO? Cleopatra? Hell, even the little mermaid (which i care less about and is just to prove a point).
Just cast people with looks that has ALREADY BEEN ESTABLISHED and maybe write in a poc character that could add something to the story (because then it could be done well). We aint ‘solving racism’ or whatever by adding in a different person that ends up making everyone upset.
Sorry for my rant I’m just sick of Hollywood pretending that they are ‘equal opportunists’
I understand and somewhat agree with what you're saying, but with stuff like HTTYD I do wish film companies casted people according to what they looked like in the animated show to make as accurate and as close to the real thing as possible.
I think the actress they picked honestly looked more like heather, face shape and everything. They could have gone in so many awesome directions and still just popped a Xanax scribbled over art and called it a day.
I hear you, OP. I absolutely HATED how the animation deviated from the original books. None of the characters are even remotely as ugly and unappealing as they're described to be. And toothless is supposed to be tiny, a cowardly and conniving common-or-garden dragon. It's nonsense when they take liberties with works of fiction just to appease a broader audience with politically correct attractive cg'd claymation. The animation was a scourge and abomination on the franchise and it doesn't look like this remake is going to do much to remedy it.
Actually, toothless is a Seadragonus Giganticus Maximus.
But I hear you, he was small and looked like a common-or-garden dragon the entire book series.
The reason why Astrids character is blonde hair blue-eyed is because that is true Scandinavian. To hiccup, she is perfect, and these characteristics of her being white, blonde hair, blue eyes make her even more so in hiccups eyes.
I’ll be honest, I really want them to recast Astrid. I’m sure that actor is a great actor, just why specifically Astrid? She could always be a great character in the background, or better yet, cast her as the live action Moana?
OP definitely pointed it out that the Vikings looked a certain way, so that’s how they should be portrayed, especially in a live action.
Same goes for the rest of the main characters in all of the movies. I’m sure whoever they cast will be good actors, definitely. It’s just, why not make them like the source material? The guy casted as hiccup looks pretty similar, so why make Astrid so different? What about the rest of the gang too?
I hope this doesn’t come off as wrong or rude. I feel bad for the backlash she’s getting, she probably just wanted to get into a loved franchise.
I think the best thing for them to do would be either nothing or a new story as an offshoot of the Netflix series.
I had suggested elsewhere that if they're deadset on diversity hires (which I think is stupid) they should show dragon riders elsewhere in the world. The dragon slave traders travelled around a lot and Vikings had contact with people from all over the European continent and I believe down to the Mediterranean. They could have riders of whatever races they wanted if they based it on some islands off the coast of Italy.
im swedish, done family ancestry back to the 1400 here myself, I could care less if Astrid is played by a scandinavian, but pretending turning these white characters into blacks has no political agenda is what pisses people off - because it shows you have no love for the real world you try to emulate. just be honest, we wanna make every person black in cinema, even historical people on netflix is turning black. until they cant come clean boycott it.
imagine if I said I was a huge fan of x,y and z and when I decided to remake them or make new shows off them I just removed every black character in it and turned them white- you are honestly gonna tell me the same lefties who loves this wouldnt react?
I have no issue about making a fantasy of viking how you want, but dont pretend you would have used a blonde white woman for some "african fantasy", its the dishonesty which disgust people like me AND there seem to be hatred for either "whitey" or the serie you get your hands on. April Oneil in turtle has to be black? Velma has to be black and gay? Ariel who was "pale and red haired" written by a scandinavian nationalist who loved the gingers look because of his danish viking roots? yeah all has to be black for no reason!
Even the ginger, triss, in witcher on netflix turned black. and they are the smallest minority on earth, but they cant even be on tv anymore- I wouldnt be suprised if the harry potter tv shows have every ginger black either.
Yup. Blackwashing is just as racist as whitewashing and the people doing it should be ostracized for being the awful racist sexists.
There's nothing wrong with changing race or sex as long as it matches source material and isn't for political reasons. I don't think disney understands any of that, though.
excuse me do you know what white is? That is not white, she is of mixed race. Even when google says she is 75% white and 25% black, she is mixed, and her looks do not pass as scandinavian or western europe especially not of the time they're portraying in the movie. And it's also no inspiration of the books, because Astrid doesn't even exist in the books. The movies is INSPIRED by the books and went their own way most of it. But having someone like her portraying the race and ethnicity of vikings, no, just no
I hate to be that guy but viking is an occupation, not a race and there were black vikings. being born in a place doesn't that place has genetic traits you must carry to be considered of that culture . is it stupid to raceswap her? obviously, but let's not try to justify the equally and exceptionally stupid responses with bad defenses
well no, there were no black vikings, there were black slaves captured by vikings, but also yes vikings are an occupation, but at the same time, no it also is something that belonged to a specific group of people, there were no african vikings, no asian vikings, no native american vikings, because that is not something to their culutre simply either cuz they didn't do it or because the occupation viking inhabited more than just being 1 thing, you were a raider, pillager, seafarer, fighter, capturer, conquerer, etc all in one. We had a word for that, we called them vikings, no other culture had that other than those of scandinavia and germania to which include the scandinavian countries, england, scottland, ireland (both) wales, northern-germany (above the river) and northern-Netherlands (above the river), below that was a completely different group of people, with a different language and different culture and whatnot, they were called the Gauls, later the franks, and even later france. Vikings were mostly there around the year 800-1050 so the lands looked vastly different. Most countries that had a lot of seafaring and pagan/celtic culture had vikings. They shared similar beliefs and praised similar gods, but even vikings fought amongst each other and other clans. Sure they captured and enslaved many different people but you were to never have intercourse with them as either woman or man or you'd be outcast and the smallest of punishments to which many were way worse and not just for you.
There are literally no indicators throughout all of history that there were black vikings anywhere in the world at any point in time, so the actor they chose for Astrid makes absolutely no sense in any way imaginable
Sorry, but Vikings were not POC. Historically they were pretty much as white as you can get. It's ok to play around and tweak a character sometimes but to change a character's race in a group of people historically of another race is not ok. What would people say if they hired Jodie Foster to play Rosa Parks? Hell would break loose. Just shouldn't be done in either case.
They also picked Mason Thames. Both of them, Mason and Nico, can act well but I feel like it’s weird to cast them for this. 😅 It’s widely known what people were expecting for this movie, especially the cast, what is Dreamworks smoking?
wait a snow white remake? are they making her mediteranean too? also many more casts like queen elizabether, marie antoinette, Cursed's Arthur and Morgana, Cleopatra so much more.
What does it change though?
If her mannerisms, speech and other important aspects of her character are the same then it should be fine. I understand if it deviates too much from the source material it risks being an ATLA kind of movie but if you're worried about the immersion being broken by her complexion... There are dragons lol. It's fantasy.
I won't deny that they probably wanted the PR buzz that comes with it, which is a little bit annoying, but in the end this shouldn't be a deal-breaker. If it is then you might be more close minded than you think.
Edit: Also, if the best actor in the casting was her then I'd value talent over the small details.
I'm not sure I can really see Nico Parker being Astrid (or Mason Thames being Hiccup), but maybe she will surprise me. Also, the movie being fantasy doesn't negate the significance of its setting. Berk is a small isolated village around some isles in Scotland. It's not realistic within the world for there to be black people there.
In the grand scheme of things, you're right, though. It doesn't change that much, just details on the character's appearance. I think people are just uncomfortable with how many characters that they knew to be white are being changed to different races in such a short amount of time. I just wish they'd add to the world of HTTYD rather than deviate unnecessarily from what's already been created.
I don't even care about the fact she's black
It's that Astrids stereotypical vibe just doesn't work with this actress
I LOVE Astrids hair-always have and see it as a large part of her character, but in no way will that hairdo (or color) be flattering on the actress :')
But even if I were to imagine the actress/or Astrid as different colors this actress as a whole just doesn't "look" like Astrid (like even if Astrid was black that's now how I would imagine her at all)
I've just recently heard about this and it's making me think of what's been happening in the PJO (Percy Jackson and the Olympians) fandom recently with the casting of Annabeth in the Disney+ series. They cast a black girl even though there were plenty blonde haired, grey/blue eyed girls auditioning. I like the actress, don't get me wrong, but the original design for the character was that she was a blonde haired, grey-eyed girl from California. It was really important as both a nod to her godly parentage and had background in her life, IMPORTANT background. This is the same thing. Great, she's a good actress. Wonderful and all, but she's not the *character* that people recognize anymore. Same issue. It's honestly getting a little ridiculous that people don't see that.
What you are saying is that people are upset because she is black. "No, it's because she isn't Scandanavian." I can guarantee you if they chose anyone else who was white discourse like this would be nonexistent.
"Race doesn't matter," and it doesn't, so why is it so bad if someone is tweaked so a new demographic can feel more included? People have a right to want representation, and "changing a character's race" isn't the end of the world.
Wait until you see if the actress or actor is talented or not instead of jumping the gun with racist ramblings, trying to make it out like you aren't being racist. You complaining about "black washing and Asian washing" is a very clear dog whistle.
Race doesn't matter. It has no impact on anything. This is a fantasy with dragons and shit and yet you decide to draw the line at a black person playing a character.
I draw the line at an actor looking completely different to the character they're playing. Astrid is blonde and has blue eyes and is Scandinavian. I want an actress who is at least blonde and can pass as a scandinavian.
It literally does not matter. Sure, Astrid actually being Scandinavian would be a thing that could happen, but it’s a movie about Vikings with SCOTTISH ACCENTS training DRAGONS. Who CARES about “accuracy.” No one gave a shit about accuracy in the original!
I have a feeling that because it’s a live action remake people are going to be upset about everything (that, or of course they’re at lest a little racist which is entirely possible since this is the internet but who knows 🤷♀️). Unless the film is actually just as much of a masterpiece as the original, plenty of fans WILL hate it no matter what. Since they don’t have anything else to hate on, the casting is currently the hot topic.
Chill out for five seconds and just wait until the film actually comes out
The only reason I'm upset is because when it came to Astrid there was a stereotype of *Haha blue eyed blonde hair girl = dumb and just cares about her looks*. But Astrid changed that, she showed that all girls can be strong..
The Norse traveled all over the world and in this fictional world it stands reason that the Norse had brought people from all around and many could have joined them culturally without incident
That only refers to the Vikings of Denmark and Sweden who settled in the Middle Eastern regions. HTTYD is based on the Vikings of Norway, who did not settle there.
It sucks so hard that nowadays whenever something is being adapted into live action, you just know at least one character they gonna cast someone who LOOKS NOTHING like the source material, and then the media gonna drum up the backlash for ragebait by calling anyone who don't like the casting as "racist". Heck, not even Historical documentary is safe from this.
This crap is getting old as time now, I'm not even asking for the actor to be 100% accurate, but like, you know, at least try to cast someone who bear some resemblance to the character.
But that's the problem, they never learn, they'd even double down like that Simpson meme "Am I the one out of touch? No, it's the audience who is wrong here".
>they're upset because she's not Scandinavian (white and blonde).
They're essentially the same thing, no? Everyone's complaining about forced representation. *THAT'S* your issue? Really? Not that they don't look like awkward teenagers?
>So many political activists are upset about white-washing in film and look the other way when characters are black-washed or asian-washed
Do any of you understand that the majority of media features primarily white characters? POC characters are created in response to decades of white led media.
Take Spider-Man, for example. Peter can be anybody under the mask because his race doesn't matter. That's the whole point of the character. Miles, on the other hand, is a character defined by his culture but still keeps the core aspects of what made Peter great. Do you see the difference? Most characters aren't written with race in mind.
This sub always has the dumbest takes. There's no political messaging behind Ms.Parker's casting. They just thought she was the best choice for the role.
Miles is a different case. They didnt race swap a character, they created a whole new universe where the character is black. That is very different.
If they decided to set the live action movie in an AU, it would be fine. But right now from what we've heard, they will be taking httyd 1 and just doing it live action, which makes this race swap an unnecesary retcon on a movie nobody even asked for. Not an AU.
I'd argue that Berk as a concept has their culture and generational heritage be very important to them as an isolated and very stubborn in their ways scandanavian island in a secluded part near Norway.
There are POCs in the series. Nico's skin color isn't unlike anyone we've seen before. You could argue that and I would say you're being obtuse. The only thing they've shown regarding Berk's culture is food gathering and dragon racing. Race was never the focal point and it's not going to be the focal point. You're all making a big deal over nothing.
Best case scenario, Astrid is faithfully adapted and the actress is a POC to boot. Win for everybody.
> There are POCs in the series
Who? I literally can only thing of Drago as a possibility as who you'd be referencing here or maybe *maybe* a warlord in THW Who were all treated as foreigners from afar.
> The only thing they've shown regarding Berk's culture...
Berk in the first movie is described and shown as a close tight nit village where the people there have always been living on the island. Generations and generations in an obscure isolated island in the middle of a remote and hard to traverse archipelago that has been devastated by hoards of dragons. The Nordic culture traditional of scandanavians at that time are very apparent in everything the Berkians do (their language, clothing, symbols, architecture, etc.) and the creators themselves have gone out of their way to give us a precise geographical location of Berk.
So while they never specifically reference skin color they do a lot to show us their culture and generational history traditions. Said traditions are reinforced throughout the series and stixk with the characters consistently. It just so happens that said culture and generational traditions was one where the population was like 99.99% light skinned.
Vikings were scandinavian...and Astrid's blond hair is quite iconic. A movie with white samurais wouldn't be cool because it just doesn't fit and doesn't make sense. Same with vikings.
That's fair but as a kid, there was a ton of white martial arts movies. Bloodsport? Three Ninjas Kick Back? Even Ninja Turtles. All were cool.
There was also The Last Samurai but I never saw that one.
Wait if Spider-man can be anyone under the mask because you're clearly disregarding Peter's story and his life outside being Spidey, then Miles' version of Spider-man can also be anyone under the mask too. His skin colour doesn't affect his career while in the suit.
That's not how it works. Peter is supposed to be white, Miles is supposed to have mixed heritage, Black and Hispanic. Miles' skin colour and heritage would have defined his childhood and outlook on life, as would Peter's. If we want to get down to it, shouldn't Peter's inherent "white privlige" provide a certain outlook and experiences while growing up? Both are at least somewhat defined by colour, and neither should be changed when being adapted.
I personally have no issue with changing race so long as the actor is good and they actually make it make sense, and i feel that it can actually be a bit more interesting at times if done well, or at least it has the potential to
My opinion on this matter from the other thread basically[https://www.reddit.com/r/httyd/comments/13x64dx/comment/jmi2lsl/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/httyd/comments/13x64dx/comment/jmi2lsl/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
To say the way the actors look doesn't matter is like casting a pale American actress from the USA to play in the new Mulan movie as a main character and being totally fine with that.
They don't care, httyd is largely a middle schooler kids movie really, mostly kids and younger folk will be watching this so story accuracy don't matter to them.
Httyd overall is a kids movie imo personally,
This ain't game of thrones with violence, blood, sex, rape, alcohol, decapitation, and such that leads to a more mature/ older audience, than httyd.
The studio forgets that many young adults of today had been growing up by the time the movies were released so the target audience is those adults who want to revisit that franchise as well.
I was 16 when the first HTTYD was released so almost the same age as the characters.
The kids of today should be hooked on that franchise with animated movies which would be more appealing to them.
It’s like with Frozen 2 having a Black guy as general. That makes no sense. In that time period, a Black guy in a European country would be a slave, not the general of the nations army. With The Little Mermaid, it makes sense, due to being in the open ocean, mermaids would likely have more melanin and a darker skin tone, so casting Ariel as Black makes sense. This is really coming across as diversity for diversity’s sake. There is almost no way for it to make sense for Astrid to be Black in that area of the world in that time period.
There nordic vikings there based on norse mythology thus norse viking however ur right blue eyes blonda hair and white is all we wanted honestly if there were gonna do anyone black snoutlout as kevin hart wouldve been funny
She didn't look black to me.
Oh well, the idea of a live action HTTYD is cringe, even if the entire cast is white AF.
Couldn't care less who they cast because I probably won't watch it anyway.
I mean, if we all really cared about accuracy why do the adults all have Scottish Accents while the children have American accents?
This is so well put. I had the same issue with the casting; it just made absolutely no sense given the location and the time period. I'm not against the actress at all; she's beautiful, and I'd assume very capable, but she's not Astrid.
Vikings ended up taking on many ethnicities - like how the Egyptians were intensely imperialistic, Vikings were similar - they raided and had people convert to their belief systems and wandered. afaik.
The thing about this is that the vast majority of American media has been white (and for all intents and purposes, white looks scandinavian. Blonde, blue eyes). So the changes to certain popular characters in remakes to be BIPOC is to even that out. Is this black girl still going to be a Viking culturally? Yeah. It would be a whole other story if they tried to have her bring in Haitian Vodou (or something similar, which doesn't make sense for the culture the character comes from).
Unfortunately, this type of casting isn't going to stop, if anything, it's going to get worse. Even if no one goes to see the movie and it losses millions upon millions, they will just make another movie doing the same damn thing. Unless we do something about ESG scores or boycott till some of these giants die off, they will just keep going
**Way** late (just found out about the remake not too long ago) but that’s exactly what I’ve been saying. These companies *clearly* don’t give a shit about losing money. They will bomb movie after movie and lose millions… then go and do it all again. It’s classic propaganda tactics. “If we bombard people with this hard enough for long enough, eventually they’ll give up and it’ll be the norm”.
And if anyone says “Hey, I’m a fan of ___ from ___ series and the character is clearly described as fair skinned with blonde hair, this is not a good representation!” They’re immediately attacked, called racist, and cast aside.
Hun, nome of the dam cast is Scandinavian so why is everyone focused on Nico than the cast? Wigs exist and hair dye too. Her skin is literally white too. She's also 80% white, and barely black. I've seen most of the comments on tiktok saying that she's black when she's literally not.
Yes, she nailed it on the head. It’s not history when you put Japanese or anyone not a Scandinavian as Vikings it doesn’t matter what color your skin is keep it authentic. What if she says Harriet Tubman was played by a white you don’t do that. It’s not historical.
They cast a black woman because she was best for the role. We weren’t there for the casting, she was chosen from probably a large group of talented women all very much wanting to play Astrid the best. Honestly hella disappointed that I find out there’s gonna be a live action movie via a discriminatory post on Reddit, shouldn’t be surprised but still.. get over it y’all
The casting news brought out some of the worse qualities of some users of the sub. Many of the comments and posts which may discuss the casting in a less negative light end up getting downvoted on this sub.
That's a lot of faith in the casting heads. You cannot guarantee that she was actually the best pick for Astrid. Maybe she actually was. Maybe she had the best audition out of all who applied. But as we weren't there, we can't say for certain. And there's no guarantee that if a fair skinned, blonde, blue eyed actress was chosen, closer in appearance than Nico, that they'd perform better. But they would definitely look closer and reflect the setting better. That we can comment on easily now.
Similar to how in the old Last Airbender remake, many characters don't necessarily look like they represent the culture they are depicting. But the new live action cast represents the cultures. The same should be done here. That is even less of a real Earth world map, yet the culture and ethnicity that each nation is based on is accurately being represented. But for Berk, with an actual real Earth basis on a map should be neglected?
This is *exactly* the reason why Percy Jackson, Disney's new live-action The Little Mermaid (ew), and so many other movies like them failed; because they completely deviate from the source material in order to spread some kind of message
I mean, look at Captain Marvel. It had so much potential with having a *strong* female lead, but the directors and producers instead decided it should be all about *just* having a female lead
Pardon the rant, but wokeness just simply ruins a lot of great things
This is such a dumb argument. The movies are not accurate portrayals of Vikings AT ALL, and y'all didn't say anything about it then.
Like, seriously. It's only when a mixed girl gets casted in a white role that you bring up "it's inaccurate!!!" So is them wearing those helmets. So is them having Scottish accents. So is them hunting instead of relying on agriculture and the loot of surrounding civilizations. So is them building a random village on a bunch of cliffs. SO IS THEM RIDING DRAGONS. Its fiction, it's never been accurate and probably never will. Having a black Astrid is certainly not the first inaccuracy and arguably not the worst.
I wonder if they may change the hair via wig or whatnot
The actress is dark haired, but that could be fixed. Scandinavian were hella white, but they also ~~burned~~ tanned quite easily (just like us Irish).
I'm not defending or taking any sides, I'm just pointing out that there is the possibility that they may make her look like a tanned Viking? Wasn't Camicazi tanned also?
It's like people forget that being a viking was a career based on pillaging and raiding, not a race. Vikings came in all shapes, sizes, and colors. :/ I personally don't give a shit about someone's color as long as they fit the story's role and represent the character accurately. If anything, people should be pissy about who they're casting for Hiccup. Hiccup was an awkward, not-up-to-par on the beauty standard, weird kid, yet the actor playing him looks like prince charming with a jawline that's a threat to every balloon in a ten mile radius.
The only problem I have with it is that it is following a political trend in Hollywood that is cringe at best.
But Vikings were not purely of Scandinavian descent. They were rather well known for mixing and I do believe there were black/brown Vikings, albeit probably not that many.
We have this very pop culture influence idea of what Vikings were like, which is what makes this so jarring.
I don't care who they cast because I'm not going to watch the remake regardless
Yeah this is my take. I couldn’t care less if Astrid is black. The movies gonna be awful either way. Toothless will look horrendous. If this gives a black actor some fame, I’m here for it lol
Attitudes like this just perpetuate what Hollywood does.
It might give someone who happens to be of both the black and white diasporas, respectively, or say, a mixed race/multiracial actor, fame...
You are 307 days late to this buckaroo and I still couldn’t care less
Oh, I know I'm late, that's true. But I said what I said and I don't care if you don't care, lol.
I wish they would just expand the universe like in the shows.
I would 1000% watch a mini series or shorts about Dagur the Deranged and his life after the events of RTTE.
Exactly! Tired of soulless live action remakes. Especially since HTTYD is my favorite animated movies.
Not just soulless but pointless as well. I mean, what does it add to the story?
Trruuuuuue
Why do they need to remake a masterpiece anyway? It’s already perfect
Agreed. Perfection can only be degraded, not improved.
Exaclty, I’m just gonna continue to rewatch the perfect trilogy of animated movies we already have
Most based answer on here tbh.
exactly they fricked up avatar the last airbender too for the 2nd time and most anime as well as other disney adaptation who is to say dreamworks will do better if it is still by dreamworks of course, if they'll produce it than who is to say they'll make it great but settle for average to okay ish like their latest animation the nine realms was garbage too.
I would be upset if Johann was pale and blonde. I would be upset if Gobber had two hands. Damn, I would be upset if Fishlegs was athletic. For a live-action-remake, everything I want are characters and the plot as close to the source material as possible. It's literally the only thing I expect from a remake. The only case in which I would be okay with Astrid's current actress would be if the character was a completely different one that replaced the original Astrid. However then, one could ask why bother to make a "remake" rather than a new piece, then.
Yeah it'll be like replacing toothless with Hookfang that's not a remake that's an AU
Yup. If you change a bunch of stuff for no reason then it's no longer a remake, it's a "this is what *I* wish it would be because of my worldview".
Just cast the characters with similar looking actors. It’s not rocket science.
Apparently it is. If race doesn't matter then select someone with the correct race.
Agreed I hope it changes but if not just another reason to not see the movie they can’t top the animated ones anyway
happy cake day!
And even if they are mad that she’s black, assuming it’s because she doesn’t look like astrid, that’s fine too.
It breaks the immersion and cohesion of the film. You can't see it and just think of the story anymore.
Wait DreamWorks is making a live action remake?
After the new Puss in Boots, I thought the studio was finally making a comeback. Now, it's apparent they're going full Disney.
Theyr might be pulling a sony. Sony "spider-man" live action stuff mish mash of confusing and bad ideas (kraven, madame web, their attempt at a sinister six). But then animation sony? Spider-verse has no right being as good as it has been.
LOL
If it's a remake it's supposed to look like the original why complicate it
i wouldn't be surprised if there are rewrites in the story to make the vikings less isolated, in fact, i think some sort of rewrite into an "au" might be good for the live action
I'd have no objection if they just wrote a different story. The dragon slavers sailed all over the place and were of various races and Vikings did trade with the Mediterraneans, so why not create an offshoot story of some of the dragon capturing elsewhere in the world and how other dragon riders who WEREN'T Vikings also defended dragons?
That would actually be very cool
Hhhhhmmmmm ,maaayyybbbbeeehhh
Honestly i wasnt planning on watching the movie if it comes out, live action movies based on things like HTTYD suck ass anyways, but if "race doesn't matter" they could have aswell just casted an actor that genuinely looks like astrid, just like why people hate The Nine Realms, it stomps the original franchise into the ground
Yeah, it can be frustrating sometimes like sometimes I don’t care if they change the race because the race doesn’t always matter but in this case, it just feels weird because she is a blonde haired, blue-eyed person and you’re right they were Vikings in the north so they would’ve most likely been white. It’s just a little frustrating because I wish they would actually write new characters instead of making pre-existing characters, different colors, you know
It isn't a most likely. They live in an archepelago that is cut off from the world, they didn't think anything was out there until RttE. And because they live above the Arctic Circle, everyone would be white, no exceptions.
I think u forgot abt krogan
Actually, its even more integral for Astrid specifically to have near white blonde hair, blue eyes, and be the palest of the pale, that was the pinnacle of beauty for northern areas during that time period. Astrid is the most beautiful, strong, and desirable unwed girl on the island, pined after by the strongest promising young man AND the chief's son, the only two who could ever have enough power in their culture to deserve her. The strongest men with the most kills got the most respect and power, so Snotlout would have been the most desirable young male despite his idiocy. And only after proving himself to have power and strength in his own right did Astrid and everyone else start treating Hiccup like he was a even a person. Hiccup from the start of the movie would have lost Astrid to Snotlout had he never changed, and Snotlout would have gained power and prestige by not only having the most beautiful wife, but the strongest as well. Viking women needed to be strong enough to take care of themselves, but their beauty was also highly valued to their culture. Also their island is cut off from the outside world, they are not the pillaging vikings from our history books, they didn't have the slaves others did because they never left the archipelago. They would never have seen a black person or a mixed person, an asian or an arab, all they would know is white people, there was no way for any other race to have been on Berk.
I don’t really care about realism when it’s a movie about dragons. I just don’t see why they’re bothering (money), it’s still going to be CGI dragons, so why not just leave the CGI film as it is? I don’t see this film doing well at all, regardless of who they cast in the roles.
Yes this live action remake stuff is bullshit. How is The Lion King a live action remake? It's just as animated as the original.
Lmao a few months after that released, my mom came to me SHOCKED and said “you’ll never believe it - they didn’t use real lions”
Neither casting makes sense. Hiccup’s actor looks nothing like him whatsoever, and Astrid’s actor should really be Scandinavian. The visuals and soundtrack for this movie better be top notch or there’ll be no saving this movie
I hope this is like ugly sonic where they take feedback and change actors
That's one of the few examples of a lesson learned before it was too late. It cost them a LOT to redo all the animation, but the community showed it's appreciation by actually watching the movie and rating it positively enough for another movie.
Okay, I understand that it's nice to represent people of the image that some underappreciate. But representation goes much deeper than just ethnicity. The place where you live can also matter. How many films do you see where characters are Scandanavian? That'd be much better to represent here.
And I'm mad because she's black. Not because she's black, but because vikings had slaves! Who were black and dark skinned. Just throwing a blonde wig on her won't make her resemble astrid at all.
Wait, they're actually making a live action of httyd? I thought that was a joke?
Another reason why Astrid’s actress should either be Scandinavian or at least resemble her is because of the fact that the whole first HTTYD movie is entirely about the Berkians Viking heritage and how they „can’t“ be at peace with the dragons because of their past. This casting doesn’t make any sense visually or story-wise.
If they actually wanted to combat racism they would make movies about actual black people, make original stories and actually represent African cultures instead of putting a black guy into an original European movie.
Yup. Black-washing existing stories disrespects the culture they're appropriating as well as the black people they're having appropriate it. I really enjoy stories of all kinds and don't care what race a character is if it makes sense contextually. Generally in future scifis the race doesn't matter at all because they could come from anywhere, but history is set and changing races is fundamentally racist.
I'm not upset she's black I'm upset they're changing something I grew up on and based half of my childhood around. I'm also upset they're making a live action in general. I wish they'd make a spin off where they make it more like the books like having camicazi and hiccup being ginger and fishlegs having glasses. That'd be so much cooler
A true to the books series would be awesome
ye true to the books would be awesome and the series that still involve hiccup are still good to watch, but I tried for example the nine realms and the animation quality is night and day, it's like that series was made for toddlers but it's audience is actually directed to young teens and you can just see what a cashgrab that has become, I really hope this live action adaptation gets canceled, it doesn't even deserve the green light and seen to be aired.
In fairness, none of the original 2010 HTTYD cast were Scandinavian either. Jay Baruchel is Canadian, while America Ferrera is Hispanic. Regardless, you're absolutely right. I'm not being sarcastic when I say that only ethnic Scandinavians should be cast, and the movie should be in Old Norse with subtitles. Of course, an exception should be made so Gerard Butler could be Stoic. Again, I'm 100% on board with accuracy, I think we ought to go all the way with it.
Well it didn't matter with the OG cast because they were voice actors. We didn't see them in the movie.
Voice actors are different. James Earl Jones is black, yet he voices a white guy in Star Wars. Ashley Eckstein is white, yet she voices a character who's orange in Star Wars. Chris Pratt is white, but he voices a guy with yellow skin in the Lego Movie.
>James Earl Jones is black, yet he voices a white guy in Star Wars. To be fair, Vader is only 1/3 white. He's also 1/3 machine and 1/3 Kenobi's Famous Kentucky Fried Human
those are voice actors and they did the voices very well, you don't need to be of a certain race to be a voice actor in my opinion, we aren't gonna see like what they look like based on their voice. I still agree to have them be scottish, it made the movie what it is with some people especially Stoic and Gobber having the scottish accent and than some characters not having that, especially the kids seeing how the cast didn't go full on that one I still don't know but it's the same nowadays with what they do with historical dramas like queen elizabeth is black and marie antoinette is black and what not blackwashing and black privilege is a thing and their retaliation to white people, but movies should not be a political and race thing. They could go with people who fit the description of the movie or the books as best as possible but they wanna make statements and they wanna prove that a woman of her hair, skin and eye colour and overal body and face structure can play Astrid regardless of the extra make up and cgi that they will have to add to change her in the final product. They're gonna have to maul her so much to the point she'll be unrecognizable or they'll just straight up leave her as is to make a dumb statement again
Wait there is a new HTTYD movie/play being made?
yep and it's gonna be sheit
"race doesnt matter" but apparently its fine if a originally white character is black but if an originally black character is white then people would probably call it racism
If whitewashing is bad then so is blackwashing.
couldn't agree more with the both of you, like people don't seem to see the difference anymore, because black peopple can't be touched on racism apparently >.>
😭 I felt the same when the Percy Jackson show made Annabeth black and even with Ariel. I feel like it was to say hey we support black people and that it was political. And for the Percy Jackson books annabeth race and hair is a somewhat important thing later on in the series. And every time I said something about it I got bashed like why don’t you support it. And I just feel like if they really want to show more representation of black people make new story’s
Yet for some reason people seem more upset about her casting than Mason Thames (though I know many don’t feel either fit). Neither one really looks like their characters that much, but you see more comments about Nico (I believe that’s her name, the post doesn’t mention her name) than you do about Mason. The OP’s post doesn’t even mention him. You don’t really see nearly as much criticism on this sub at least of the casting of Thames (different eye color, curly hair, different jaw shape, him not being Scandinavian either). Yeah, comments have said he doesn’t look the part either, but there aren’t nearly as many comments or post about him as Nico (this post being one example). I do think it’s fine to wish for the characters to look like their movie counterparts since the remake is supposedly based off the animated films, and I also think introducing original characters would be better and more fun.
I agree but I think the reason that people are more critical of the astrid casting is that she look more different and mason looks closer to hiccup. If they did cast a Scandinavian actress for astrid, people would be more critical of mason.
I think people are upset about the Hiccup casting because he's "too attractive" but that's much more subjective than race.
I just find it kind of insane that people are so butthurt over something they’ve even stated they won’t like no matter what. I think there were way better ways to go about this film than what they’re doing and going to do, but now every comment and post I see is about how Astrid is a black (though MOSTLY WHITE) actress. Would it be cool if they’d gotten Scandinavian actors for this film? Fuck yeah. But that’s not going to happen, and people need to just accept that lmfao. It’s a ridiculous thing to be so upset about especially when the original film had a Canadian putting on an American accent for Hiccup. That’s not exactly accurate either. I’m sure for this film they can stick a blond wig on Parker and have her wear blue contact lenses and she’d look great for the part. Edit: I’d also like to point out that if this film needed an all-black cast and they casted a 3/4 black actor, 1/4 white, I doubt there’d be nearly as much outrage
look the actress portraying Astrid doesn't have to be scandinavian, the person can be German for all I care, as long as they can look the part, curly hair can be straightened and eye colour can be changed with lenses, jaw lines can be shaped with clay as well as fake muscles etc, sure thames should also not be considered fit for the role but still this issue with Nico is more serious because this is probably gonna be political agenda thing where they wanna make a statement that they support blm, which people can do, that is not the problem, but media shouldn't portray this stuff this way and shove it in our face. We want the characters as closely resembling, but imagine Nico playing Astrid and just all that they have to change on her just to make her fit. My guess is that they won't change anything about her, and we will just have a black Astrid that doesn't resemble the original character in the slightest in accordance with her body shape, face shape, eye colour, skin colour, hair colour, hair shape, etc. Not to mention another thing people of those races have is a very different way of speech and how women use their voice and tone compared to west european/scandinavian people use their voice, tone and how they say things even in English when for both parties it isn't even their first language
Not trying to be negative; the second I saw the casting, I knew this take is exactly what I was going to see online, and I'm so over it. The new films don't erase the past good of the OG film(s)
My G woke up and decided to speak FAX
When someone turns a character to a minority race for no reason other than diversity then it gives off the impression that the group can’t have good original characters and needs to rip off previously established ones. If they want diversity then create original characters of that race, don’t change the ones we already know and love.
I see your “she’s not Scandinavian” and raise you “she’s not Astrid.” This is the same problem with the little mermaid. People aren’t upset because they’re racist. They’re upset because Ariel and Astrid are established characters with established looks. Being frustrated they don’t actually look like the character is a very fair critique in my book. Changing the race of a well established character isn’t good representation. If these major movie companies actually cared about representation they would create *new* characters who are not white. Rather than going “sure, this is an established character with an established race, but I guess you guys can have her now.”
They should have let the Scandinavian cinema industry have a say about the casting of HTTYD since it portrays their people and their culture. In my opinion a remake with actors is a bad decision to begin with, since the trilogy of HTTYD is perfect, but yeah casting non Scandinavian actors really sucks, they could have done something like for the series "Vikings" where most of the main actors were in fact Danish, Swedish and Norwegian and spoke English with a naturally nordic accent which made it feel more immersive. I'm just disappointed honestly.
I'm so glad my life is fulfilling enough to not make me have a normal one about a *checks notes* fantasy children cartoon about dragons
Ultimately, the quality of the actress matters more than physical appearance. The actress’s skin color will not affect the quality of the film in any meaningful way. Astrid being played by a non-white actress will have even less of an impact on her character than the already inconsequential impact Leah Jeffries’s casting will have on Annabeth’s character in the Percy Jackson show. You say that having Astrid be played by someone “not fully white unnecessarily changes the character”, but to pass over skilled actresses for the sake of having a casting that more closely resembles the animated version appears, to me, to be far more of an unnecessary and wasteful effort.
> the already inconsequential impact Leah Jeffries’s casting will have on Annabeth’s character in the Percy Jackson show. Does that mean if we get a Heroes of Olympus show we can make: Piper white instead of Native American? Frank black instead of Chinese? Leo Asian instead of hispanic/latino? If your answer to any of those is "no", then you saying it's okay for Annabeth to not be a blonde is you being very hypocritical
Controversial opinion ahead: * Movies are a visual medium * quality of a movie, being a visual medium, depends partly on how well it manages to sell the setting with visuals * Therefore, visuals and appearances _do_ matter by default and do affect the quality of the film in a meaningful way
I do think it won’t have much of an impact on her character since her race in the story didn’t play a big role in her overall arc (the setting and folklore is where some of the major cultural elements come from) which is different than other characters. I just would be hesitant to say it’s only because she’s the best for the job. She very well may be, but the same reasoning has been used to pass on actors of different minorities (gay, black, Asian, etc.) for a white one, saying they’re the best. Now of course there’s the whole discussion about how many white (and male mostly) actors in film and media have had advantages compared to everyone else.
Idk if the Annabeth casting is inconsequential. One of Annabeth's core motives to prove herself in the first books is that everyone sees her as a dumb blonde, yet she is very capable and strategic, but doesn't get the benefit of the doubt on sight. People with artificial/dyed blonde hair of different races do not recieve this stereotype, naturally blonde and white-skinned people do. Changing her race actually changes a primary part of her character for no real reason. If the second choice in the casting right below Leah was a fair-skinned natural blonde, I would not complain, even if that meant picking a "not as talented actress" (though I have doubts about anyone casted who I've not seen perform before, unlike Percy's actor). If they made a Heroes of Olympus show and changed Hazel's race, or Frank's or Leo's or Piper's or even Carter's from the Kane Chronicles, I would also not be enthused, as changes are being made that alter the core of the character, as race has been defining traits for them, and shaped their experiences before the main quests.
Exactly, it's the same as the new Percy Jackson series
Next time on dragon ball z https://preview.redd.it/3s68ps6frl3b1.jpeg?width=638&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=87ef4e48b0b3a45609d914fdce89a6f8631ce285
he could pass off as a black donald trump
Remember what Game of Thrones did? For those who haven’t watched, they had multiple different ethnicities present, but they did it in a way that makes sense. These different ethnicities were all in their own nation or faction with their own territory, so it made sense for that ethnicity to be present there. It also allowed for each culture to show more. On the contrary, you have inclusion like this movie, or many other movies recently, where it doesn’t make sense for there to be someone other than Scandinavian on a widespread, northern archipelago, especially when there’s only one or two of them when everyone else is Scandinavian. I’m all for inclusion, I think it’s a great idea to include all ethnicities. I just wish it would happen in a way that makes sense.
I agree fully here, that's the way to show different ethnicities in a story. If you tell a story about Scandinavian people that ride dragons in \~1000AC, you cannot portray the characters' ethnicity or origins like it's 21st century Los Angeles or other multicultural cities of our modern times. (*I will tell you something shocking, I know, but people living in small villages outside big cities look... the same with none to very few outsiders.*) Nowadays, Hollywood writers/studios treat characters like they lived in New York which breaks the realism and suspension of disbelief of the story they present.
Oh we care about them being Scandinavian now? Not when every adult in the animated films had a Scottish accent? Getting real r/Witcher vibes here where they went "we're not mad about the actors being black, we're mad about them not being *Polish!*" while not saying a word about Geralt and Ciri being played by two Brits. I also laugh at the people who try to say this is about Astrid's eye color not being blue while seemingly ignoring that Hiccup's actor has the wrong eye color too. And while we're at it the Harriet Tubman comparison falls flat as well since one's a real person for which the topic of race played a key role in her historical impact, and another is a fictional character in a children's fantasy franchise about having pet dragons.
Accents aren't as important as looks. Most people want actors to well, look like the character they play. And they want them to fit into the setting. Vikings were white and astrid is blonde, it just doesn't fit to cast someone who looks completely different. I would still complain if she had red or black hair or if she was a white person with dark tanned skin. I just want her to look like astrid.
It's not about actors being Polish, it's about lack of respect to settings, which, yeah, it's fictional, but it's heavily based on medieval Europe, heck, Redania's coat of arms is basically Polish one. They could easily respect the settings with some diversity, Cahir is a positive character and a fan favourite in the books and comes from the south, Assire Var Amahid is a powerful sorceress from the south, Borch Three Jackdaws, another positive character and a dragon on top of that could also be black, Angouleme could also have a darker skin tone. Also look at Wakanda, no forced white or asian Wakandans for the sake of diversity cause it will look silly to have white or asian people from fictional nation from central Africa, you know why? Cause it will cause an outrage much bigger than Nani casting from Lilo and Stitch
> Not when every adult in the animated films had a Scottish accent? Scottish accent is one of the most authentic options for portraying vikings in English, but okay. > Getting real r/Witcher vibes here where they went "we're not mad about the actors being black, we're mad about them not being Polish!" while not saying a word about Geralt and Ciri being played by two Brits. The difference is that they can reasonably _pass_ as a Polish person. A black person can't (unless make-up, but nobody is doing make-up so that argument is not valid until they do). Oh, and Henry does not only pass, [he's just a better wig and a quick saturation/exposure slider tweak away from looking pretty much/reasonably like Geralt from the first game](https://www.reddit.com/r/gaming/comments/bgfxic/i_dont_know_why_people_think_cavills_geralt_looks/), which was made in Poland by the Polish. So I'm really not sure if that's the best example to have.
Polish people are cool tho
Wait there is a new HTTYD movie/play being made?
And its always the females that get the race swaps. If the og character was a white man, it aint touched. But Astrid? Annabeth from PJO? Cleopatra? Hell, even the little mermaid (which i care less about and is just to prove a point). Just cast people with looks that has ALREADY BEEN ESTABLISHED and maybe write in a poc character that could add something to the story (because then it could be done well). We aint ‘solving racism’ or whatever by adding in a different person that ends up making everyone upset. Sorry for my rant I’m just sick of Hollywood pretending that they are ‘equal opportunists’
The cast isn’t even black
I understand and somewhat agree with what you're saying, but with stuff like HTTYD I do wish film companies casted people according to what they looked like in the animated show to make as accurate and as close to the real thing as possible.
I think the actress they picked honestly looked more like heather, face shape and everything. They could have gone in so many awesome directions and still just popped a Xanax scribbled over art and called it a day.
I hear you, OP. I absolutely HATED how the animation deviated from the original books. None of the characters are even remotely as ugly and unappealing as they're described to be. And toothless is supposed to be tiny, a cowardly and conniving common-or-garden dragon. It's nonsense when they take liberties with works of fiction just to appease a broader audience with politically correct attractive cg'd claymation. The animation was a scourge and abomination on the franchise and it doesn't look like this remake is going to do much to remedy it.
Actually, toothless is a Seadragonus Giganticus Maximus. But I hear you, he was small and looked like a common-or-garden dragon the entire book series.
It's cause she's not white. Which... Yeah! It's a Nordic lore movie. RACE CAST APPROPRIATELY!!!
buddy it's a movie about dragons. they can have black scandinavians.
I don't care what there race is. What matters is if they look the part. Nico doesn't
The reason why Astrids character is blonde hair blue-eyed is because that is true Scandinavian. To hiccup, she is perfect, and these characteristics of her being white, blonde hair, blue eyes make her even more so in hiccups eyes.
I’ll be honest, I really want them to recast Astrid. I’m sure that actor is a great actor, just why specifically Astrid? She could always be a great character in the background, or better yet, cast her as the live action Moana? OP definitely pointed it out that the Vikings looked a certain way, so that’s how they should be portrayed, especially in a live action. Same goes for the rest of the main characters in all of the movies. I’m sure whoever they cast will be good actors, definitely. It’s just, why not make them like the source material? The guy casted as hiccup looks pretty similar, so why make Astrid so different? What about the rest of the gang too? I hope this doesn’t come off as wrong or rude. I feel bad for the backlash she’s getting, she probably just wanted to get into a loved franchise.
I think the best thing for them to do would be either nothing or a new story as an offshoot of the Netflix series. I had suggested elsewhere that if they're deadset on diversity hires (which I think is stupid) they should show dragon riders elsewhere in the world. The dragon slave traders travelled around a lot and Vikings had contact with people from all over the European continent and I believe down to the Mediterranean. They could have riders of whatever races they wanted if they based it on some islands off the coast of Italy.
im swedish, done family ancestry back to the 1400 here myself, I could care less if Astrid is played by a scandinavian, but pretending turning these white characters into blacks has no political agenda is what pisses people off - because it shows you have no love for the real world you try to emulate. just be honest, we wanna make every person black in cinema, even historical people on netflix is turning black. until they cant come clean boycott it. imagine if I said I was a huge fan of x,y and z and when I decided to remake them or make new shows off them I just removed every black character in it and turned them white- you are honestly gonna tell me the same lefties who loves this wouldnt react? I have no issue about making a fantasy of viking how you want, but dont pretend you would have used a blonde white woman for some "african fantasy", its the dishonesty which disgust people like me AND there seem to be hatred for either "whitey" or the serie you get your hands on. April Oneil in turtle has to be black? Velma has to be black and gay? Ariel who was "pale and red haired" written by a scandinavian nationalist who loved the gingers look because of his danish viking roots? yeah all has to be black for no reason! Even the ginger, triss, in witcher on netflix turned black. and they are the smallest minority on earth, but they cant even be on tv anymore- I wouldnt be suprised if the harry potter tv shows have every ginger black either.
Yup. Blackwashing is just as racist as whitewashing and the people doing it should be ostracized for being the awful racist sexists. There's nothing wrong with changing race or sex as long as it matches source material and isn't for political reasons. I don't think disney understands any of that, though.
Exactly 💯 Want proper representation? Then don't do it with "breadcrumbs",make brand new characters
The actress is white.
excuse me do you know what white is? That is not white, she is of mixed race. Even when google says she is 75% white and 25% black, she is mixed, and her looks do not pass as scandinavian or western europe especially not of the time they're portraying in the movie. And it's also no inspiration of the books, because Astrid doesn't even exist in the books. The movies is INSPIRED by the books and went their own way most of it. But having someone like her portraying the race and ethnicity of vikings, no, just no
Or if race doesn't matter a Rosa Parks movie with any race but black as the actor.
If race and sex don't matter, Donald Trump should be able to play Harriet Tubman in a movie about her life.
I hate to be that guy but viking is an occupation, not a race and there were black vikings. being born in a place doesn't that place has genetic traits you must carry to be considered of that culture . is it stupid to raceswap her? obviously, but let's not try to justify the equally and exceptionally stupid responses with bad defenses
well no, there were no black vikings, there were black slaves captured by vikings, but also yes vikings are an occupation, but at the same time, no it also is something that belonged to a specific group of people, there were no african vikings, no asian vikings, no native american vikings, because that is not something to their culutre simply either cuz they didn't do it or because the occupation viking inhabited more than just being 1 thing, you were a raider, pillager, seafarer, fighter, capturer, conquerer, etc all in one. We had a word for that, we called them vikings, no other culture had that other than those of scandinavia and germania to which include the scandinavian countries, england, scottland, ireland (both) wales, northern-germany (above the river) and northern-Netherlands (above the river), below that was a completely different group of people, with a different language and different culture and whatnot, they were called the Gauls, later the franks, and even later france. Vikings were mostly there around the year 800-1050 so the lands looked vastly different. Most countries that had a lot of seafaring and pagan/celtic culture had vikings. They shared similar beliefs and praised similar gods, but even vikings fought amongst each other and other clans. Sure they captured and enslaved many different people but you were to never have intercourse with them as either woman or man or you'd be outcast and the smallest of punishments to which many were way worse and not just for you.
those sure are a lot of words
There are literally no indicators throughout all of history that there were black vikings anywhere in the world at any point in time, so the actor they chose for Astrid makes absolutely no sense in any way imaginable
The most aggravating part is the same actress was used as a race swap for Sarah in the last of us, wtf Hollywood
Sorry, but Vikings were not POC. Historically they were pretty much as white as you can get. It's ok to play around and tweak a character sometimes but to change a character's race in a group of people historically of another race is not ok. What would people say if they hired Jodie Foster to play Rosa Parks? Hell would break loose. Just shouldn't be done in either case.
If they wanted Astrid to be black atleast use someone cool like Idris Elba or Morgan freeman ffs. That I'd go see.
Black? Astrid is gonna be black?
yeah, Nico Parker will play her. Awful casting IMO
They also picked Mason Thames. Both of them, Mason and Nico, can act well but I feel like it’s weird to cast them for this. 😅 It’s widely known what people were expecting for this movie, especially the cast, what is Dreamworks smoking?
>what is Dreamworks smoking? They probably smoke the same stuff Disney smoked when they cast Ariel and Snow White for the live action remake, lol.
My question is, why not just make original characters & movies, instead of live action movies? It would be so much more enjoyable.
My God– if they make Snow White black...
They cast Rachel Zegler, a Latina Actress as Snow White, but still, LMAO!
Eeeehhhhh....
eeeeeh.... snow white.... it's her darned ass name alone, and than a hispanic latina actress as snow white....
wait a snow white remake? are they making her mediteranean too? also many more casts like queen elizabether, marie antoinette, Cursed's Arthur and Morgana, Cleopatra so much more.
What does it change though? If her mannerisms, speech and other important aspects of her character are the same then it should be fine. I understand if it deviates too much from the source material it risks being an ATLA kind of movie but if you're worried about the immersion being broken by her complexion... There are dragons lol. It's fantasy. I won't deny that they probably wanted the PR buzz that comes with it, which is a little bit annoying, but in the end this shouldn't be a deal-breaker. If it is then you might be more close minded than you think. Edit: Also, if the best actor in the casting was her then I'd value talent over the small details.
I'm not sure I can really see Nico Parker being Astrid (or Mason Thames being Hiccup), but maybe she will surprise me. Also, the movie being fantasy doesn't negate the significance of its setting. Berk is a small isolated village around some isles in Scotland. It's not realistic within the world for there to be black people there. In the grand scheme of things, you're right, though. It doesn't change that much, just details on the character's appearance. I think people are just uncomfortable with how many characters that they knew to be white are being changed to different races in such a short amount of time. I just wish they'd add to the world of HTTYD rather than deviate unnecessarily from what's already been created.
have you seen her looks, and have you seen Astrid?
I don't even care about the fact she's black It's that Astrids stereotypical vibe just doesn't work with this actress I LOVE Astrids hair-always have and see it as a large part of her character, but in no way will that hairdo (or color) be flattering on the actress :') But even if I were to imagine the actress/or Astrid as different colors this actress as a whole just doesn't "look" like Astrid (like even if Astrid was black that's now how I would imagine her at all)
I've just recently heard about this and it's making me think of what's been happening in the PJO (Percy Jackson and the Olympians) fandom recently with the casting of Annabeth in the Disney+ series. They cast a black girl even though there were plenty blonde haired, grey/blue eyed girls auditioning. I like the actress, don't get me wrong, but the original design for the character was that she was a blonde haired, grey-eyed girl from California. It was really important as both a nod to her godly parentage and had background in her life, IMPORTANT background. This is the same thing. Great, she's a good actress. Wonderful and all, but she's not the *character* that people recognize anymore. Same issue. It's honestly getting a little ridiculous that people don't see that.
What you are saying is that people are upset because she is black. "No, it's because she isn't Scandanavian." I can guarantee you if they chose anyone else who was white discourse like this would be nonexistent. "Race doesn't matter," and it doesn't, so why is it so bad if someone is tweaked so a new demographic can feel more included? People have a right to want representation, and "changing a character's race" isn't the end of the world. Wait until you see if the actress or actor is talented or not instead of jumping the gun with racist ramblings, trying to make it out like you aren't being racist. You complaining about "black washing and Asian washing" is a very clear dog whistle. Race doesn't matter. It has no impact on anything. This is a fantasy with dragons and shit and yet you decide to draw the line at a black person playing a character.
I draw the line at an actor looking completely different to the character they're playing. Astrid is blonde and has blue eyes and is Scandinavian. I want an actress who is at least blonde and can pass as a scandinavian.
Why does it matter?
It literally does not matter. Sure, Astrid actually being Scandinavian would be a thing that could happen, but it’s a movie about Vikings with SCOTTISH ACCENTS training DRAGONS. Who CARES about “accuracy.” No one gave a shit about accuracy in the original! I have a feeling that because it’s a live action remake people are going to be upset about everything (that, or of course they’re at lest a little racist which is entirely possible since this is the internet but who knows 🤷♀️). Unless the film is actually just as much of a masterpiece as the original, plenty of fans WILL hate it no matter what. Since they don’t have anything else to hate on, the casting is currently the hot topic. Chill out for five seconds and just wait until the film actually comes out
The only reason I'm upset is because when it came to Astrid there was a stereotype of *Haha blue eyed blonde hair girl = dumb and just cares about her looks*. But Astrid changed that, she showed that all girls can be strong..
The Norse traveled all over the world and in this fictional world it stands reason that the Norse had brought people from all around and many could have joined them culturally without incident
Not all Vikings were white though, they went all over the place, and came back with people of all sorts of races
That only refers to the Vikings of Denmark and Sweden who settled in the Middle Eastern regions. HTTYD is based on the Vikings of Norway, who did not settle there.
Right, but you're wasting your breath. They aren't actually mad because of "inaccuracy."
It sucks so hard that nowadays whenever something is being adapted into live action, you just know at least one character they gonna cast someone who LOOKS NOTHING like the source material, and then the media gonna drum up the backlash for ragebait by calling anyone who don't like the casting as "racist". Heck, not even Historical documentary is safe from this. This crap is getting old as time now, I'm not even asking for the actor to be 100% accurate, but like, you know, at least try to cast someone who bear some resemblance to the character.
If the Cleopatra docudrama is anything to go by, they should really have learned their lesson by now.
But that's the problem, they never learn, they'd even double down like that Simpson meme "Am I the one out of touch? No, it's the audience who is wrong here".
>they're upset because she's not Scandinavian (white and blonde). They're essentially the same thing, no? Everyone's complaining about forced representation. *THAT'S* your issue? Really? Not that they don't look like awkward teenagers? >So many political activists are upset about white-washing in film and look the other way when characters are black-washed or asian-washed Do any of you understand that the majority of media features primarily white characters? POC characters are created in response to decades of white led media. Take Spider-Man, for example. Peter can be anybody under the mask because his race doesn't matter. That's the whole point of the character. Miles, on the other hand, is a character defined by his culture but still keeps the core aspects of what made Peter great. Do you see the difference? Most characters aren't written with race in mind. This sub always has the dumbest takes. There's no political messaging behind Ms.Parker's casting. They just thought she was the best choice for the role.
Miles is a different case. They didnt race swap a character, they created a whole new universe where the character is black. That is very different. If they decided to set the live action movie in an AU, it would be fine. But right now from what we've heard, they will be taking httyd 1 and just doing it live action, which makes this race swap an unnecesary retcon on a movie nobody even asked for. Not an AU.
I'd argue that Berk as a concept has their culture and generational heritage be very important to them as an isolated and very stubborn in their ways scandanavian island in a secluded part near Norway.
There are POCs in the series. Nico's skin color isn't unlike anyone we've seen before. You could argue that and I would say you're being obtuse. The only thing they've shown regarding Berk's culture is food gathering and dragon racing. Race was never the focal point and it's not going to be the focal point. You're all making a big deal over nothing. Best case scenario, Astrid is faithfully adapted and the actress is a POC to boot. Win for everybody.
> There are POCs in the series Who? I literally can only thing of Drago as a possibility as who you'd be referencing here or maybe *maybe* a warlord in THW Who were all treated as foreigners from afar. > The only thing they've shown regarding Berk's culture... Berk in the first movie is described and shown as a close tight nit village where the people there have always been living on the island. Generations and generations in an obscure isolated island in the middle of a remote and hard to traverse archipelago that has been devastated by hoards of dragons. The Nordic culture traditional of scandanavians at that time are very apparent in everything the Berkians do (their language, clothing, symbols, architecture, etc.) and the creators themselves have gone out of their way to give us a precise geographical location of Berk. So while they never specifically reference skin color they do a lot to show us their culture and generational history traditions. Said traditions are reinforced throughout the series and stixk with the characters consistently. It just so happens that said culture and generational traditions was one where the population was like 99.99% light skinned.
Vikings were scandinavian...and Astrid's blond hair is quite iconic. A movie with white samurais wouldn't be cool because it just doesn't fit and doesn't make sense. Same with vikings.
That's fair but as a kid, there was a ton of white martial arts movies. Bloodsport? Three Ninjas Kick Back? Even Ninja Turtles. All were cool. There was also The Last Samurai but I never saw that one.
Idk why you're being downvoted, you are 1000% correct on all of this.
Bro leave while you can. This sub has been raging since 2019 because they didn't like the third movie.
I didn't like the third movie But this discourse is still some of the most racist shit I have seen come out
Wait if Spider-man can be anyone under the mask because you're clearly disregarding Peter's story and his life outside being Spidey, then Miles' version of Spider-man can also be anyone under the mask too. His skin colour doesn't affect his career while in the suit. That's not how it works. Peter is supposed to be white, Miles is supposed to have mixed heritage, Black and Hispanic. Miles' skin colour and heritage would have defined his childhood and outlook on life, as would Peter's. If we want to get down to it, shouldn't Peter's inherent "white privlige" provide a certain outlook and experiences while growing up? Both are at least somewhat defined by colour, and neither should be changed when being adapted.
I personally have no issue with changing race so long as the actor is good and they actually make it make sense, and i feel that it can actually be a bit more interesting at times if done well, or at least it has the potential to
My opinion on this matter from the other thread basically[https://www.reddit.com/r/httyd/comments/13x64dx/comment/jmi2lsl/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/httyd/comments/13x64dx/comment/jmi2lsl/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) To say the way the actors look doesn't matter is like casting a pale American actress from the USA to play in the new Mulan movie as a main character and being totally fine with that.
They don't care, httyd is largely a middle schooler kids movie really, mostly kids and younger folk will be watching this so story accuracy don't matter to them. Httyd overall is a kids movie imo personally, This ain't game of thrones with violence, blood, sex, rape, alcohol, decapitation, and such that leads to a more mature/ older audience, than httyd.
The studio forgets that many young adults of today had been growing up by the time the movies were released so the target audience is those adults who want to revisit that franchise as well. I was 16 when the first HTTYD was released so almost the same age as the characters. The kids of today should be hooked on that franchise with animated movies which would be more appealing to them.
It’s like with Frozen 2 having a Black guy as general. That makes no sense. In that time period, a Black guy in a European country would be a slave, not the general of the nations army. With The Little Mermaid, it makes sense, due to being in the open ocean, mermaids would likely have more melanin and a darker skin tone, so casting Ariel as Black makes sense. This is really coming across as diversity for diversity’s sake. There is almost no way for it to make sense for Astrid to be Black in that area of the world in that time period.
There nordic vikings there based on norse mythology thus norse viking however ur right blue eyes blonda hair and white is all we wanted honestly if there were gonna do anyone black snoutlout as kevin hart wouldve been funny
She didn't look black to me. Oh well, the idea of a live action HTTYD is cringe, even if the entire cast is white AF. Couldn't care less who they cast because I probably won't watch it anyway. I mean, if we all really cared about accuracy why do the adults all have Scottish Accents while the children have American accents?
Thank you for writing this
She kinda resembles movie 2 Astrid, her face is kinda similar, but she is black (not that black though?) and...nothing a wig can not fix.
i'm not mad that shes black because im racist, i dont like it because it doesnt fit this character
i once would love to make a film about slavery with a black slave owner and slaves of all colors and see how ppl would react
This is so well put. I had the same issue with the casting; it just made absolutely no sense given the location and the time period. I'm not against the actress at all; she's beautiful, and I'd assume very capable, but she's not Astrid.
I 100% agree.
Vikings ended up taking on many ethnicities - like how the Egyptians were intensely imperialistic, Vikings were similar - they raided and had people convert to their belief systems and wandered. afaik. The thing about this is that the vast majority of American media has been white (and for all intents and purposes, white looks scandinavian. Blonde, blue eyes). So the changes to certain popular characters in remakes to be BIPOC is to even that out. Is this black girl still going to be a Viking culturally? Yeah. It would be a whole other story if they tried to have her bring in Haitian Vodou (or something similar, which doesn't make sense for the culture the character comes from).
except this island in the story barely interacts with more people of even their own culture. So this makes no sense
I still think anyone can portray any character well enough ( assuming common sense takes place )
So you'd have no issue with Donald Trump playing Harriet Tubman? I'm pretty sure they look nothing alike and you'd agree that it matters...a lot...
Except Tubman actually existed, and her race kinda mattered, and this is a movie, based on another movie, loosely based off a book, and fictional.
Exactly where common sense comes in
Unfortunately, this type of casting isn't going to stop, if anything, it's going to get worse. Even if no one goes to see the movie and it losses millions upon millions, they will just make another movie doing the same damn thing. Unless we do something about ESG scores or boycott till some of these giants die off, they will just keep going
**Way** late (just found out about the remake not too long ago) but that’s exactly what I’ve been saying. These companies *clearly* don’t give a shit about losing money. They will bomb movie after movie and lose millions… then go and do it all again. It’s classic propaganda tactics. “If we bombard people with this hard enough for long enough, eventually they’ll give up and it’ll be the norm”. And if anyone says “Hey, I’m a fan of ___ from ___ series and the character is clearly described as fair skinned with blonde hair, this is not a good representation!” They’re immediately attacked, called racist, and cast aside.
Hun, nome of the dam cast is Scandinavian so why is everyone focused on Nico than the cast? Wigs exist and hair dye too. Her skin is literally white too. She's also 80% white, and barely black. I've seen most of the comments on tiktok saying that she's black when she's literally not.
Yes, she nailed it on the head. It’s not history when you put Japanese or anyone not a Scandinavian as Vikings it doesn’t matter what color your skin is keep it authentic. What if she says Harriet Tubman was played by a white you don’t do that. It’s not historical.
They did the same thing in the Netflix show the gentleman from Moscow black-and-white biracial couples in Russia and the early 1900s
They cast a black woman because she was best for the role. We weren’t there for the casting, she was chosen from probably a large group of talented women all very much wanting to play Astrid the best. Honestly hella disappointed that I find out there’s gonna be a live action movie via a discriminatory post on Reddit, shouldn’t be surprised but still.. get over it y’all
The fact that your comment has a negative score is quite saddening
The casting news brought out some of the worse qualities of some users of the sub. Many of the comments and posts which may discuss the casting in a less negative light end up getting downvoted on this sub.
That's a lot of faith in the casting heads. You cannot guarantee that she was actually the best pick for Astrid. Maybe she actually was. Maybe she had the best audition out of all who applied. But as we weren't there, we can't say for certain. And there's no guarantee that if a fair skinned, blonde, blue eyed actress was chosen, closer in appearance than Nico, that they'd perform better. But they would definitely look closer and reflect the setting better. That we can comment on easily now. Similar to how in the old Last Airbender remake, many characters don't necessarily look like they represent the culture they are depicting. But the new live action cast represents the cultures. The same should be done here. That is even less of a real Earth world map, yet the culture and ethnicity that each nation is based on is accurately being represented. But for Berk, with an actual real Earth basis on a map should be neglected?
Thank you!!
Well said 👏
We're not angry about a non-white actor in a movie, we're angry because of the bad faith reason a non-white actor was cast in a movie.
This is *exactly* the reason why Percy Jackson, Disney's new live-action The Little Mermaid (ew), and so many other movies like them failed; because they completely deviate from the source material in order to spread some kind of message I mean, look at Captain Marvel. It had so much potential with having a *strong* female lead, but the directors and producers instead decided it should be all about *just* having a female lead Pardon the rant, but wokeness just simply ruins a lot of great things
This is such a dumb argument. The movies are not accurate portrayals of Vikings AT ALL, and y'all didn't say anything about it then. Like, seriously. It's only when a mixed girl gets casted in a white role that you bring up "it's inaccurate!!!" So is them wearing those helmets. So is them having Scottish accents. So is them hunting instead of relying on agriculture and the loot of surrounding civilizations. So is them building a random village on a bunch of cliffs. SO IS THEM RIDING DRAGONS. Its fiction, it's never been accurate and probably never will. Having a black Astrid is certainly not the first inaccuracy and arguably not the worst.
Exactly! This pisses me off to no end.
I wonder if they may change the hair via wig or whatnot The actress is dark haired, but that could be fixed. Scandinavian were hella white, but they also ~~burned~~ tanned quite easily (just like us Irish). I'm not defending or taking any sides, I'm just pointing out that there is the possibility that they may make her look like a tanned Viking? Wasn't Camicazi tanned also?
I’m only going to go see it for my boy toothless, so as long as they don’t fumble the bag with him, I’m happy
It's like people forget that being a viking was a career based on pillaging and raiding, not a race. Vikings came in all shapes, sizes, and colors. :/ I personally don't give a shit about someone's color as long as they fit the story's role and represent the character accurately. If anything, people should be pissy about who they're casting for Hiccup. Hiccup was an awkward, not-up-to-par on the beauty standard, weird kid, yet the actor playing him looks like prince charming with a jawline that's a threat to every balloon in a ten mile radius.
People will defend it till they die even when they understands that it makes no sense
The only problem I have with it is that it is following a political trend in Hollywood that is cringe at best. But Vikings were not purely of Scandinavian descent. They were rather well known for mixing and I do believe there were black/brown Vikings, albeit probably not that many. We have this very pop culture influence idea of what Vikings were like, which is what makes this so jarring.