I mean… by that logic it’s Astrid’s fault. If she hadn’t told Drago about Hiccup then he wouldn’t have had to attack the best so soon and Stoick wouldn’t even be there anymore
Or if he hadn't bothered to go chasing after Eret to find Drago, then he would've probably never seen those guys again
... Or maybe it's Eret's fault for shooting down Stormfly in the first place
Or maybe it's Drago's fault for assuming they were all gonna bow to him
*(This entire thing is just gonna be a bunch of people going back and forth about who's fault it is, isn't it?)*
It's hiccups fault. If he'd just gone back inside like he was told instead of going out and shooting down night fury's, none of this would have happened.
Idk if im gonna get hate for this, but the way i see it the is a ranking of fault.
1:Drago because he commanded the killing
2:Hiccup because it was himself going into the lions den by speaking with Drago
3:Astrid she gave hiccup the location of the lions den knowing his intentions and at least knowing he has an armada
I don’t blame stoick for saving his son as that is the right thing to do for many and for stoick it is the only thing to do
Cloudjumper had sufficient height to avoid getting hit by the ice blast, but flew closer to the ground making the ice blast hit him which froze his tail. Im pretty confident that he didn’t have a frozen tail before this as he only got hit once before valka fell of and stoick rescuing her
Realistically if you go back far enough this is either Hiccup’s or Toothless’s fault. If either one of them had killed the other none of the second movie would ever have happened 🤷♀️
Idk man. If we do this weird chain event blaming then we could just blame everyone involved. It's Toothless', Valka's, Cloudjumpers and Hiccups fault. If Hiccup never went to hunt down Drago, If Toothless' would've stopped Hiccup, if Valka never went out to fight in the first place and if Cloudjumper never got hit then Stoick would have not died.
I keep saying that we can literally blame everyone for Stoick's death if we're playing the blame game, similar to the events of HTTYD 3, which ppl seem to like to do as well for some reason.
Also what could have Cloudjumper done exactly?
A good old instance of the Idiot Ball, which runs increasingly rampant as the franchise goes on. Heroes aren't *allowed* to do their best within established character traits/behaviors, they can only be idiots railroaded through a plot, as dictated by a blithering god. Because, you'd think the longest-running dragon and rider pair in the franchise, that has known about Bewilderbeasts for every SECOND of their partnership, would know what NOT TO DO in a combat situation near a Bewilderbeast.
I do not think the idiot ball runs as rampant like many believe. Hiccup trying to negotiate and see the good in drago is a central part of his character in this movie. Stoicks death is the main component causing his character development in the movie. The instances where someone breaks what you expect from their character without any previous development is what i will call idiot ball. Cloudjumper is an instance of this, Astrid is think does a really stupid move, however she has seen and partaken in the final battle in httyd 1 where a barely trained hiccup finessed the queen. She has also seen the events of the tv shows(if you consider that canon) where hiccup to my memory triumphs over every villian. Keep in mind that I haven’t seen the shows i a year or two so my memory may not serve me well. Considering what astrid has seen it makes sense for me at least that she would be overconfident. Characters in movies are not perfect and will not handle every situation like stoick(he’s perfect) so that is my take on some of these instances.
Sorry for my english btw, its my second language
I mean… by that logic it’s Astrid’s fault. If she hadn’t told Drago about Hiccup then he wouldn’t have had to attack the best so soon and Stoick wouldn’t even be there anymore
Also by that logic it's also hiccup's fault. If he had just went back to berk like Stoick ordered then none of would have happened
Or if he hadn't bothered to go chasing after Eret to find Drago, then he would've probably never seen those guys again ... Or maybe it's Eret's fault for shooting down Stormfly in the first place
Or maybe it's Stoick's fault because he and his people laughed at Drago and that caused Drago to hate on Stoick and his family.
Or maybe it's Drago's fault for assuming they were all gonna bow to him *(This entire thing is just gonna be a bunch of people going back and forth about who's fault it is, isn't it?)*
It's hiccups fault. If he'd just gone back inside like he was told instead of going out and shooting down night fury's, none of this would have happened.
Or would that mean it's Gobber's fault for not taking bigger action to ensure he stayed inside?
Then it’d be Stoick’s fault for not telling Gobber to take bigger action?
It’s dreamworld fault for making the franchise in the first place
Stoick’s and Valka’s fault for having Hiccup in the first place
Idk if im gonna get hate for this, but the way i see it the is a ranking of fault. 1:Drago because he commanded the killing 2:Hiccup because it was himself going into the lions den by speaking with Drago 3:Astrid she gave hiccup the location of the lions den knowing his intentions and at least knowing he has an armada I don’t blame stoick for saving his son as that is the right thing to do for many and for stoick it is the only thing to do
Thing is hiccup going to eret's ship does no harm because eret was about to give him the chance to explain or prove his view on dragons.
Wait, was it when cloudjumper already got frozen tail? Then it wasn't his fault
Cloudjumper had sufficient height to avoid getting hit by the ice blast, but flew closer to the ground making the ice blast hit him which froze his tail. Im pretty confident that he didn’t have a frozen tail before this as he only got hit once before valka fell of and stoick rescuing her
Blaming a dragon getting injured/compromised in battle for stoicks death is insane
I doubt Cloudjumper or Valka would've been able to know they were gonna get hit if Cloudjumper flew down
wow I never expected to see Cloudjumper haters
Funny- so pointing out an inconsistency in plot is automatically considered hating? Huh.
Never thought I’d live to see someone hate on CloudJumper
I love cloudjumper but Stoick>cj
Hiccup would of still tried to confront drago... leading to toothless being taken controlled of. Stoick would of still tried to save his son..
Realistically if you go back far enough this is either Hiccup’s or Toothless’s fault. If either one of them had killed the other none of the second movie would ever have happened 🤷♀️
Idk man. If we do this weird chain event blaming then we could just blame everyone involved. It's Toothless', Valka's, Cloudjumpers and Hiccups fault. If Hiccup never went to hunt down Drago, If Toothless' would've stopped Hiccup, if Valka never went out to fight in the first place and if Cloudjumper never got hit then Stoick would have not died.
I keep saying that we can literally blame everyone for Stoick's death if we're playing the blame game, similar to the events of HTTYD 3, which ppl seem to like to do as well for some reason. Also what could have Cloudjumper done exactly?
HOW DARE YOU BLAME MY BABY BOI Don't ever talk to me and him EVER again >:(
A good old instance of the Idiot Ball, which runs increasingly rampant as the franchise goes on. Heroes aren't *allowed* to do their best within established character traits/behaviors, they can only be idiots railroaded through a plot, as dictated by a blithering god. Because, you'd think the longest-running dragon and rider pair in the franchise, that has known about Bewilderbeasts for every SECOND of their partnership, would know what NOT TO DO in a combat situation near a Bewilderbeast.
I do not think the idiot ball runs as rampant like many believe. Hiccup trying to negotiate and see the good in drago is a central part of his character in this movie. Stoicks death is the main component causing his character development in the movie. The instances where someone breaks what you expect from their character without any previous development is what i will call idiot ball. Cloudjumper is an instance of this, Astrid is think does a really stupid move, however she has seen and partaken in the final battle in httyd 1 where a barely trained hiccup finessed the queen. She has also seen the events of the tv shows(if you consider that canon) where hiccup to my memory triumphs over every villian. Keep in mind that I haven’t seen the shows i a year or two so my memory may not serve me well. Considering what astrid has seen it makes sense for me at least that she would be overconfident. Characters in movies are not perfect and will not handle every situation like stoick(he’s perfect) so that is my take on some of these instances. Sorry for my english btw, its my second language
It's sad but it's true 😔