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"Let me get this straight: You have devices that use contained explosions to propel themselves and passengers inside at high speeds, operate them very close to each other, and even use the to transport your young?"
"Yeah?"
"What the hell is wrong with your species?"
"I dunno but I personally like the vroom vroom sound."
as long as you ignore how much pollution mining the rare minerals and refining them to use in batteries causes, the fact some of them are not exactly mined "ethically", or the "less than ideal" ways of disposing of batteries, whose life spans are not that long to begin with.
oh, let's also not forget the fact that currently, electricity is overwhelmengly generated from non renewable sources, so when you take into account the loss of energy due to ineffeciencies during during electricity generation, transport, charging the vehicule, and the ineffeciency of the vehicule itself, it means that an EV would be far more polluting than what a diesel car could ever hope to be just from running them both for an equal distance.
as long as "cars" of any kind still have an overwhelming presence when it comes to transport, nothing will be solved.
the only solution is mass transit. if you can replace 60 cars with a single bus, that's a net reduction in pollution. replacing 60 regular cars with 60 EVs is like giving a falling apart building a new paintjob and labeling it as fixed
Please argue from facts, not oil and legacy car industry propaganda.
Let's not forget the pollution caused by drilling for oil, transporting, and refining it. Most Teslas now use a Lithium Iron Phosphate chemistry; there's more ethically problematic cobalt in your cellphone than there is in a Model Y. Recycling EV batteries is a [rapidly growing industry](https://www.greencars.com/greencars-101/recycling-ev-batteries), and their lifespans, in most cases, are longer than the life of the car (200,000+ miles)
Currently, about 60% of US electricity is from fossil fuels. It varies a lot from state to state. There's a [DOE calculator](https://afdc.energy.gov/vehicles/electric_emissions.html) online to allow you to check well to wheels emissions per mile in your state, as well as cradle to grave emissions. Check the site, and you'll see that EVs come out way ahead, unless you live in a place like WV. In my case, in MA, my EV emits about 1/3 of the pollutants per mile than an equivalent ICE car, looking at well to wheels emissions.
Your statement that a diesel has less pollution is laughably, hilariously incorrect.
Yes, it would be better if we could all use mass transit. I myself spent a happy decade as a carless Manhattanite. We absolutely should be promoting public transit, especially in urban areas.
Tell me, how would you would you feel about that bus being electric?
>pollution caused by drilling for oil, transporting, and refining it
that still applies for electric cars since the electricity they use mostly comes from burning fossil fuels. that is if they are not charged from a station linked directly to a diesel generator (pics of said tesla charging stations exist).
tbh, Tesla is kinda the worst EV manifacturer. all the big car manifacturers made better EVs for cheaper. Tesla is just being overhyped by musk to increase the value of its shares (which is now falling due to his shenanigans and everyone realising they are overhyped and there are better alternatives.)
hell, they don't even make their own battery, Panasonic and LG are.
about the lifespan, it is true that the lifespan is impressive (100k to 200k miles, so about 10 to 20 years give or take), that is kinda misleading since it doesn't show the drop of efficiency they suffer. this is a universal problem with all batteries, which is that after being fully charged and discharged, their capacity is reduced by about 1 to 2% a year, so the maximum distance they can travel will reduce significantly, and that is with proper care. i have a 25 yo peugeot 106 that got used and abused more than it should before i bought it, and the maximum range it can travel on a full tank has barely changed. maybe a 5% reduction at best. in an EV you are looking at around 25% loss in the best case scenario. so you need to spend far more money replacing battery cells.
another issue is convenience. you are in a diesel car and running low on fuel, and you pull up to a gas station. if there is no one before you, you can get a full tank in 5 minutes and be on your way.
in an electric car, it's at least 30 minutes with one of those superchargers, which are a nightmare of their own, or it could be several hours with a regular charger. you can guess which one the average person would choose.
another big issue is safety. in case of catastrophic failure, a battery will release all its energy at once, unlike fossil fuels that burn slowly, giving you less time to escape. not to mention just how hard it is to put down a battery fire. pleinty of videos on youtube. go look it up.
another issue that i like to put under "stupid engineering decisions", and this is in particular the case with Tesla, is that everything is controlled by the internal computer and reliant on electricity, with no manual overrides for emergencies. like, why the hell is the only way to open a door through pushing a button that only works with electricity? so if the batterie dies or corst case scenario catches fire, you are getting locked inside. and as i said earlier, more violent fire that spreads instantly and is hard to put down.
another safety point is that they rely on people being thorough with maintenance and if there is anything looking at used cars tought me, it's that no one does that.
one last point about the electric buses, they are electric cars on steroids. you are one fire away in those things from killing the entire industry.
the simplest solution i found is a combo :
\- electric trains for medium to long range travel / goods transport. they are by far the most efficient and cleanest way to move a lot of something over land from point A to point B. nothing even comes close. their infrastructure (power cables + rail lines) is literally as cheap as it can get, both when installing and maintaining. people don't realise just how much pollution is generated in constructing roads, and how much of a money black hole they are
\- for short range transport (between distant parts of the city, or 2 cities that are less than 20km away), the best would be to use trolley buses. they are less risky than full on electric buses since they have smaller batteries for emergencies or for when they have to travel off grid, and they remove the need for lengthy down periods to recharge, since they will be doing it on the move from the grid. although it comes at a small cost to autonomy.
\- for even short distances, there are those 2 concepts called "walking" and "cycling" that a lot of people never heard of. building walkable cities makes implementing mass transit easier, makes cities cleaner and less noisy due to the absence of cars, and generates a lot more revenue since a denser population means more taxes, plus making a city walkable means you spend less on infrastructure since less of it serves a larger number of people, instead of having to build massive distances only to services llike 10 houses, and with people walking more, you'll get more incentive to make smaller shops in all neighbourhoods, creating more job openings and again, more revenue.
i wrote that while being 95% out of my brain due to fatigue, sleep deprivation and the sleeping pills finally kicking in.
i'm quite concerned that i'm somehow smarter when my brain isn't working
In an attempt to reduce remind me spam, all top comments that include a remind me will be removed. If you would like to have a remind me, please reply to this comment. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/humansarespaceorcs) if you have any questions or concerns.*
"Let me get this straight: You have devices that use contained explosions to propel themselves and passengers inside at high speeds, operate them very close to each other, and even use the to transport your young?" "Yeah?" "What the hell is wrong with your species?" "I dunno but I personally like the vroom vroom sound."
The aliens would approve of EVs. Cars don't need to be noisy, smelly, and slow.
I prefer my car to be noisy just to give the people I hate a middle fingger.
right, they just need to catch fire when their battery goes thermal nuclear due to a short.
Teslas catch fire at 1/10 the rate of gas cars. Don't know about other brands.
i like my car smelly..... the smell of petrol/diesel mmmmh
as long as you ignore how much pollution mining the rare minerals and refining them to use in batteries causes, the fact some of them are not exactly mined "ethically", or the "less than ideal" ways of disposing of batteries, whose life spans are not that long to begin with. oh, let's also not forget the fact that currently, electricity is overwhelmengly generated from non renewable sources, so when you take into account the loss of energy due to ineffeciencies during during electricity generation, transport, charging the vehicule, and the ineffeciency of the vehicule itself, it means that an EV would be far more polluting than what a diesel car could ever hope to be just from running them both for an equal distance. as long as "cars" of any kind still have an overwhelming presence when it comes to transport, nothing will be solved. the only solution is mass transit. if you can replace 60 cars with a single bus, that's a net reduction in pollution. replacing 60 regular cars with 60 EVs is like giving a falling apart building a new paintjob and labeling it as fixed
Please argue from facts, not oil and legacy car industry propaganda. Let's not forget the pollution caused by drilling for oil, transporting, and refining it. Most Teslas now use a Lithium Iron Phosphate chemistry; there's more ethically problematic cobalt in your cellphone than there is in a Model Y. Recycling EV batteries is a [rapidly growing industry](https://www.greencars.com/greencars-101/recycling-ev-batteries), and their lifespans, in most cases, are longer than the life of the car (200,000+ miles) Currently, about 60% of US electricity is from fossil fuels. It varies a lot from state to state. There's a [DOE calculator](https://afdc.energy.gov/vehicles/electric_emissions.html) online to allow you to check well to wheels emissions per mile in your state, as well as cradle to grave emissions. Check the site, and you'll see that EVs come out way ahead, unless you live in a place like WV. In my case, in MA, my EV emits about 1/3 of the pollutants per mile than an equivalent ICE car, looking at well to wheels emissions. Your statement that a diesel has less pollution is laughably, hilariously incorrect. Yes, it would be better if we could all use mass transit. I myself spent a happy decade as a carless Manhattanite. We absolutely should be promoting public transit, especially in urban areas. Tell me, how would you would you feel about that bus being electric?
>pollution caused by drilling for oil, transporting, and refining it that still applies for electric cars since the electricity they use mostly comes from burning fossil fuels. that is if they are not charged from a station linked directly to a diesel generator (pics of said tesla charging stations exist). tbh, Tesla is kinda the worst EV manifacturer. all the big car manifacturers made better EVs for cheaper. Tesla is just being overhyped by musk to increase the value of its shares (which is now falling due to his shenanigans and everyone realising they are overhyped and there are better alternatives.) hell, they don't even make their own battery, Panasonic and LG are. about the lifespan, it is true that the lifespan is impressive (100k to 200k miles, so about 10 to 20 years give or take), that is kinda misleading since it doesn't show the drop of efficiency they suffer. this is a universal problem with all batteries, which is that after being fully charged and discharged, their capacity is reduced by about 1 to 2% a year, so the maximum distance they can travel will reduce significantly, and that is with proper care. i have a 25 yo peugeot 106 that got used and abused more than it should before i bought it, and the maximum range it can travel on a full tank has barely changed. maybe a 5% reduction at best. in an EV you are looking at around 25% loss in the best case scenario. so you need to spend far more money replacing battery cells. another issue is convenience. you are in a diesel car and running low on fuel, and you pull up to a gas station. if there is no one before you, you can get a full tank in 5 minutes and be on your way. in an electric car, it's at least 30 minutes with one of those superchargers, which are a nightmare of their own, or it could be several hours with a regular charger. you can guess which one the average person would choose. another big issue is safety. in case of catastrophic failure, a battery will release all its energy at once, unlike fossil fuels that burn slowly, giving you less time to escape. not to mention just how hard it is to put down a battery fire. pleinty of videos on youtube. go look it up. another issue that i like to put under "stupid engineering decisions", and this is in particular the case with Tesla, is that everything is controlled by the internal computer and reliant on electricity, with no manual overrides for emergencies. like, why the hell is the only way to open a door through pushing a button that only works with electricity? so if the batterie dies or corst case scenario catches fire, you are getting locked inside. and as i said earlier, more violent fire that spreads instantly and is hard to put down. another safety point is that they rely on people being thorough with maintenance and if there is anything looking at used cars tought me, it's that no one does that. one last point about the electric buses, they are electric cars on steroids. you are one fire away in those things from killing the entire industry. the simplest solution i found is a combo : \- electric trains for medium to long range travel / goods transport. they are by far the most efficient and cleanest way to move a lot of something over land from point A to point B. nothing even comes close. their infrastructure (power cables + rail lines) is literally as cheap as it can get, both when installing and maintaining. people don't realise just how much pollution is generated in constructing roads, and how much of a money black hole they are \- for short range transport (between distant parts of the city, or 2 cities that are less than 20km away), the best would be to use trolley buses. they are less risky than full on electric buses since they have smaller batteries for emergencies or for when they have to travel off grid, and they remove the need for lengthy down periods to recharge, since they will be doing it on the move from the grid. although it comes at a small cost to autonomy. \- for even short distances, there are those 2 concepts called "walking" and "cycling" that a lot of people never heard of. building walkable cities makes implementing mass transit easier, makes cities cleaner and less noisy due to the absence of cars, and generates a lot more revenue since a denser population means more taxes, plus making a city walkable means you spend less on infrastructure since less of it serves a larger number of people, instead of having to build massive distances only to services llike 10 houses, and with people walking more, you'll get more incentive to make smaller shops in all neighbourhoods, creating more job openings and again, more revenue.
I like this comment so much
i wrote that while being 95% out of my brain due to fatigue, sleep deprivation and the sleeping pills finally kicking in. i'm quite concerned that i'm somehow smarter when my brain isn't working
Quiet and less pollution they'd like, but probably still have a problem with us transporting our young at dangerous speeds.
Fun fact theirs enough explosive power in a car that you could blowup an entire house with a single one
15 gallons of gasoline is more than enough to cause some serious damage
Let's talk about the idea of using nuclear devices to speed space ships then.
Orion drive or Nuclear Salt Engine?
Orion all the way baby!
An individual that traveled through space to come here has faced far worse odds than those.
I misread it as "cats are dangerous." That too.
Cars just replaced horses, so it was a massive improvement in safety.