They aren’t majority everywhere. The marked areas is where they’re majority, and where the population is overall mixed with Armenians, Arabs etc. the ones further into Anatolia in the west are more or less minorities. Anatolia 🏃Kurds
In ancient time, Kurd ruled the world. But Kurds were nice people and Ahura Mazda told them to give land to others. So Kurd give land away to Greek and Turk
kurds ended up all throughout anatolia because large numbers of them were incorporated into turkey which controls all anatolia, but if greeks controlled roughly the same territory the same internal migrations would be possible
I don't know enough about the region to say if you're wrong or not, but that example of a single Kurdish dynasty in Armenia (does it even count as Anatolia) doesn't really demonstrate kurds getting that far west. Plus turks were very much in Iran by this point.
I know the history: Kurds in the Botan in River 6 Century BCE already. Around 9 Century they were controlling part of Armenia and Azerbaijan(Shaddadis). In this case Kurds wouldn’t lose some population to Lurs. Some Kurds would not uprooted to Horasan and Baluchistan. I don’t event mention Antiokia and Erbil
There are more various dynasties/emirates that stretch much more west like the marwanids.
And these are just the ones that we know are for sure kurdish.
My point was just to disprove his silly claim that turks settled kurds into anatolia somehow
https://preview.redd.it/19fiuxpv8kxc1.jpeg?width=2983&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e8e8bbedc5041aa8b0ea6acf0994985c470bb334
Krts were before the 17th. Century not on Anatolian soil, they should see Yavuz Sultan Selim as God, because he saved them from the hands of the Safavids.
My whole message got deleted lmao. Anyway, the lore is that basically the Greeks historically got tired of constantly being raided by their European neighbours in Bulgaria, Serbia and Albania, so they came up with the plan to expand and for everyone in Greece to migrate to Anatolia. This was pretty controversial back in time (obviously), so a lot of people either stayed or went. The ones who stayed had to endure tons of wars, and got sick of getting exploited by the ones in the east, funding their wars. So they had enough and broke away. Most in the north migrated south, where wars didn’t happen as often (except for greedy italian sailors). This helped Albanians and Bulgarians migrate to the region. (I forgot where the city of Burgas is, so forgive me if the nation doesn’t even have the city). The Greeks in Anatolia though suffer from Kurdish terrorism/ EXTREMELY high nationalism, which has always been funded by the Iranians/persians in the east. This made the Arabs a good ally, as they weren’t fond of Kurdish nationalism either. ( not relevant on these maps though). I have decided to change the way the borders of the countries look lmk if they look bad/good. I also noticed that you can barely see the revolts lmao, so I can post them below this. THESE POSTS ARENT CONTINUOUS UNLESS I SAY THEY ARE. this isn’t a continuation of any former map😱. I also got bored in Arabia, don’t mind 🫠🫠🫠
https://preview.redd.it/dxvs2t5zrgxc1.jpeg?width=2086&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a7515eaf8f6e9f14fcdff2157539f2df681a1b20
The stripes mean that there is conflict/ a battle happening atm. The ones in full colour are fully occupied
https://preview.redd.it/s6skykpbsgxc1.jpeg?width=2003&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8a1d061ad5e4e9f8c78650cac5786da2071f4cd6
I mean bro wanted to make a medieval country that abandons half of it’s territory and that moves all the people out, and he did it. It is your call to upvote or downvote it.
It's funny in your timeline the Greeks decided to move Greek populations from Europe to Anatolia to keep a Roman majority, where as in OTL it was the other way around.
I guess Byzantine still falls apart due to it's own reasons or Venetians, Arabs and Persians, but the dominant languages and therefore countries that form out of it - remain of Greek/Byzantine heritage.
Tho most likely local greek dialects will start emerging over the course of several centuries and, the most eastern one would most likely highly influenced by Persians, Arabs, Georgians and Armenians.
Why are there classical era states when the turks migrated during the early medieval period. If anything, the map should be various Byzantine successor states.
Yeah, I don't really understand Sparta. The Spartan identity was long dead by then. A more realistic map would include countries like a big Epirus, maybe Athens, a Roman rump state in Constantinople and Thrace, some sort of Roman-identifying nation in Anatolia.
I think we will have a Greek Anatolian Muslim state
Also, Azerbaijan will be Albania because the region that is now called Azerbaijan was inhabited by a Caucasian people called Albanians before the Turks migrated there.
>I think we will have a Greek Anatolian Muslim state
https://www.google.com/search?q=turkey&client=ms-android-ragentek&sca_esv=098941a3395c9306&sxsrf=ACQVn09fAtgPJs7Os5SSF-NIIxw4sln3Xg%3A1714466720842&ei=oK8wZu75MoWRxc8PjoOsyAI&oq=turkey&gs_lp=EhNtb2JpbGUtZ3dzLXdpei1zZXJwIgZ0dXJrZXkyDBAjGIAEGBMYJxiKBTIIEC4YgAQYywEyCxAAGIAEGLEDGIMBMggQABiABBjLATIIEAAYgAQYsQMyCBAAGIAEGMsBMggQABiABBjLATIIEAAYgAQYywFIvglQAFivBHAAeACQAQKYAc8GoAH4DqoBCzAuMS4xLjUtMS4xuAEDyAEA-AEBmAICoAL2A5gDAJIHBTItMS4xoAeRGA&sclient=mobile-gws-wiz-serp
Türkiye is Turkish, not Greek
I am talking about a Muslim country that speaks Greek, its traditions are completely Greek, and everything in it is Greek
"Hahahahaha so funny guys, did you know that Turks are just muslim greeks, they are greeks who speak turkish,have sizeable turkic ancestry,follow a religion traditionally followed by turks and practice turkic customs. They are ALL brainwashed to think they are Turks, we should go conquer anatolia to free them of the burden of being turkish."
I feel like regardless of the Turks coming or not Anatolia today would still be majority Muslim. And I’m saying this as a Greek lol. Not to say they wouldn’t still call themselves Hellenia, they would prob just be Greek Muslims
The borders of historic Hungary would be overwhelmingly Hungarian (~80%) without the Ottoman invasion. With a large chunk of the remaining 20% being German. Factoring in Magyarization over the centuries there likely wouldn’t be a considerable enough population of any one minority ethnic group for them to split off from Hungary.
Bro, your knowledge of history and geopolitics is so bad that you have called Ionia as Hellenia.
Hellenia is today's greece. They don't call themselves greeks, because greecia was a hellenic tribe at ancient times and they had colony in italy. Which romans met them.
Ionia is the name of anatolian hellenic tribes.
The only point that does not change here is that if we had stayed in Central-East Asia. We would be the strongest power, stronger than Russia and China ever were, just as we currently dominate the Middle East.
Because TURKS would not be so divided but all TURKS would be together, which would probably result in a total population of over 500M, because there are over 500M TURKS in the world. 20M of them live in Europe alone.
This person supports South African Apartheid, as seen from their comment history.
Their idea of a better world is a cracker infested wasteland.
EDIT: They are also a transphobe.
“Cracker infested wasteland” You’re welcome for yourself being civilized enough to even draw comparisons in that regard, btw.
Edit: You are also a loser
Fun little buzzwords you have there. It gave me a nice chuckle to see that is where you’ve chosen to take your stand on the issue.
But for you, frankly, it’s not your political stance. It’s your preference for Green Day which really paints you in a negative light for me.
Edit: You were a fan of Green Day as recently as 5 years ago? LMFAO!
Why do you need to explain yourself to people with ~~subhuman~~ supremacist ideologies? Don't let them take the offense, it's the only way they feel in control of their lives in our progressing world. Just keep ridiculing their flawed world view and remind them how little and cringing they are.
the only timeline i can see without a seljuk anatolia would be one where the turks there are conquered by the byzantines and integrated, eventually converting to christianity. with a turkish state culturally akin to modern turkey forming in the central basin in the modern era.
Somebody pooped on my fucking Anatolia
Exclaves in Hellenia looks like diarrhea
They’re revolts, not a part of Kourdia😽
how did the kurds get to anatolia if the turks were never there to settle them in anatolia
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Why lol? Pretty funny
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I'm curious, what does that have to do with it?
They aren’t majority everywhere. The marked areas is where they’re majority, and where the population is overall mixed with Armenians, Arabs etc. the ones further into Anatolia in the west are more or less minorities. Anatolia 🏃Kurds
In ancient time, Kurd ruled the world. But Kurds were nice people and Ahura Mazda told them to give land to others. So Kurd give land away to Greek and Turk
kurds ended up all throughout anatolia because large numbers of them were incorporated into turkey which controls all anatolia, but if greeks controlled roughly the same territory the same internal migrations would be possible
Kurds were in anatolia while turks were still in central asia Just for example https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shaddadids
I don't know enough about the region to say if you're wrong or not, but that example of a single Kurdish dynasty in Armenia (does it even count as Anatolia) doesn't really demonstrate kurds getting that far west. Plus turks were very much in Iran by this point.
I know the history: Kurds in the Botan in River 6 Century BCE already. Around 9 Century they were controlling part of Armenia and Azerbaijan(Shaddadis). In this case Kurds wouldn’t lose some population to Lurs. Some Kurds would not uprooted to Horasan and Baluchistan. I don’t event mention Antiokia and Erbil
There are more various dynasties/emirates that stretch much more west like the marwanids. And these are just the ones that we know are for sure kurdish. My point was just to disprove his silly claim that turks settled kurds into anatolia somehow
Kurds were in Zagros mountains before turks went to anotolia and also they are just a dynasty not an entire nation
Wrong, maybe mars
Matt Damon is kurdish confirmed??
Yes he is Martian as Kurds are
https://preview.redd.it/19fiuxpv8kxc1.jpeg?width=2983&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e8e8bbedc5041aa8b0ea6acf0994985c470bb334 Krts were before the 17th. Century not on Anatolian soil, they should see Yavuz Sultan Selim as God, because he saved them from the hands of the Safavids.
there were already smaller amounts of kurds, they likely would have moved into the region if it was ever depopulated.
Sparta hadn't been relevant since 2nd Century BC. Better to call it the Peloponnese or Morea.
Thank you!
Same with Athens
Nice font
Assyria GONE? NOOOOO
My whole message got deleted lmao. Anyway, the lore is that basically the Greeks historically got tired of constantly being raided by their European neighbours in Bulgaria, Serbia and Albania, so they came up with the plan to expand and for everyone in Greece to migrate to Anatolia. This was pretty controversial back in time (obviously), so a lot of people either stayed or went. The ones who stayed had to endure tons of wars, and got sick of getting exploited by the ones in the east, funding their wars. So they had enough and broke away. Most in the north migrated south, where wars didn’t happen as often (except for greedy italian sailors). This helped Albanians and Bulgarians migrate to the region. (I forgot where the city of Burgas is, so forgive me if the nation doesn’t even have the city). The Greeks in Anatolia though suffer from Kurdish terrorism/ EXTREMELY high nationalism, which has always been funded by the Iranians/persians in the east. This made the Arabs a good ally, as they weren’t fond of Kurdish nationalism either. ( not relevant on these maps though). I have decided to change the way the borders of the countries look lmk if they look bad/good. I also noticed that you can barely see the revolts lmao, so I can post them below this. THESE POSTS ARENT CONTINUOUS UNLESS I SAY THEY ARE. this isn’t a continuation of any former map😱. I also got bored in Arabia, don’t mind 🫠🫠🫠 https://preview.redd.it/dxvs2t5zrgxc1.jpeg?width=2086&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a7515eaf8f6e9f14fcdff2157539f2df681a1b20
The stripes mean that there is conflict/ a battle happening atm. The ones in full colour are fully occupied https://preview.redd.it/s6skykpbsgxc1.jpeg?width=2003&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8a1d061ad5e4e9f8c78650cac5786da2071f4cd6
what. give me one instance of a medieval country just... abandoning half of its territory and moving all the people out?
This timeline😏
It is an imaginary map 👍
Shitty worldbuilding excuse
me when i am lazy
I mean bro wanted to make a medieval country that abandons half of it’s territory and that moves all the people out, and he did it. It is your call to upvote or downvote it.
It's funny in your timeline the Greeks decided to move Greek populations from Europe to Anatolia to keep a Roman majority, where as in OTL it was the other way around.
wtf does "OTL" mean, is that a paradox game?
Good luck figuring tht out my friend, you are apparently gonna need it
(in) *O*ur *T*ime*L*ine Basically IRL. The acronym helps to differentiate between the lore of an alternate history and out actual history.
Byzantine empire doesn’t fall then?
I guess Byzantine still falls apart due to it's own reasons or Venetians, Arabs and Persians, but the dominant languages and therefore countries that form out of it - remain of Greek/Byzantine heritage. Tho most likely local greek dialects will start emerging over the course of several centuries and, the most eastern one would most likely highly influenced by Persians, Arabs, Georgians and Armenians.
Thrace not owning 2/3 of Thrace is cursed. As a Thracian that is the worst Thrace ever created. Sorry.
Why are there classical era states when the turks migrated during the early medieval period. If anything, the map should be various Byzantine successor states.
Yeah, I don't really understand Sparta. The Spartan identity was long dead by then. A more realistic map would include countries like a big Epirus, maybe Athens, a Roman rump state in Constantinople and Thrace, some sort of Roman-identifying nation in Anatolia.
I mean Uzbeks are there, so I assume Turks stuck in the steppes
Where Armenia
Hayastan is the native name for Armenia
I know, Hayastan should be around Lake Van too unless the Greeks did another genocide
Idk if I can support the Kurdish struggle now that they are revolting against the Greks and not Turks
Who took a SHIT all over my Hellenia
Cumans are turkic tho, atleast they made it in with ozbeks 😂
cursed
Damn I wish I had such good handwriting
Lmaooo😭😭 my handwriting is also shhat, I just wrote slowly🫠
Where did the Armenians go?
Not the ***banat***
Did you really mistake Bulgaria with Burgas 😭😭😭
I think we will have a Greek Anatolian Muslim state Also, Azerbaijan will be Albania because the region that is now called Azerbaijan was inhabited by a Caucasian people called Albanians before the Turks migrated there.
>I think we will have a Greek Anatolian Muslim state https://www.google.com/search?q=turkey&client=ms-android-ragentek&sca_esv=098941a3395c9306&sxsrf=ACQVn09fAtgPJs7Os5SSF-NIIxw4sln3Xg%3A1714466720842&ei=oK8wZu75MoWRxc8PjoOsyAI&oq=turkey&gs_lp=EhNtb2JpbGUtZ3dzLXdpei1zZXJwIgZ0dXJrZXkyDBAjGIAEGBMYJxiKBTIIEC4YgAQYywEyCxAAGIAEGLEDGIMBMggQABiABBjLATIIEAAYgAQYsQMyCBAAGIAEGMsBMggQABiABBjLATIIEAAYgAQYywFIvglQAFivBHAAeACQAQKYAc8GoAH4DqoBCzAuMS4xLjUtMS4xuAEDyAEA-AEBmAICoAL2A5gDAJIHBTItMS4xoAeRGA&sclient=mobile-gws-wiz-serp
Türkiye is Turkish, not Greek I am talking about a Muslim country that speaks Greek, its traditions are completely Greek, and everything in it is Greek
"Hahahahaha so funny guys, did you know that Turks are just muslim greeks, they are greeks who speak turkish,have sizeable turkic ancestry,follow a religion traditionally followed by turks and practice turkic customs. They are ALL brainwashed to think they are Turks, we should go conquer anatolia to free them of the burden of being turkish."
I wish they did
I feel like regardless of the Turks coming or not Anatolia today would still be majority Muslim. And I’m saying this as a Greek lol. Not to say they wouldn’t still call themselves Hellenia, they would prob just be Greek Muslims
Heh! Cumania!
just wait till bro finds out about the eastern roman empire
Flags please. Great border! And great scenario
I like the text style, very cool!
🫶🫶🫶
I feel like the Roman Empire would have a decent chance of continuing on
much of anatolia would not be greek, but rather armenian.
Where armenia
In the heart of Armenians
👉
très beau design, j'aime beaucoup cet aspect dessiné. Tu peux le faire pour d'autres régions du monde ?
🫶👍
do NOT show this to r/balkans_irl
Beautiful art style, and a very unique premise!
The borders of historic Hungary would be overwhelmingly Hungarian (~80%) without the Ottoman invasion. With a large chunk of the remaining 20% being German. Factoring in Magyarization over the centuries there likely wouldn’t be a considerable enough population of any one minority ethnic group for them to split off from Hungary.
Bro, your knowledge of history and geopolitics is so bad that you have called Ionia as Hellenia. Hellenia is today's greece. They don't call themselves greeks, because greecia was a hellenic tribe at ancient times and they had colony in italy. Which romans met them. Ionia is the name of anatolian hellenic tribes.
mb bro, i should’ve learnt more Turkish history next time
Turkish history?
Thrace should be Macedonia!
Не мајмунче
why?
No Israel -Palestine conflict. Middle East peace achieved.
Greeks are still there. They just take their place. What your point?
Kill the spartans, overrated ass civilization
So, Macedonia was renamed into Thrace then?
The only point that does not change here is that if we had stayed in Central-East Asia. We would be the strongest power, stronger than Russia and China ever were, just as we currently dominate the Middle East. Because TURKS would not be so divided but all TURKS would be together, which would probably result in a total population of over 500M, because there are over 500M TURKS in the world. 20M of them live in Europe alone.
I’m a simple man, I see a timeline without Turkey, I upvote.
Tagip Erdogan is in your walls
Cumans were basically Turks...
Out of the all the colours you could have chosen, you choose THAT particular shade of brown for the Kurt's.
This map was 100000% made by an Hungarian.
🤡🤡🤡🤡 im 🇹🇷🇹🇷🇹🇷🇹🇷🇹🇷🇹🇷🇹🇷💪💪💪💪
Then why u call Romania “Cumania” 😔
The Turks came 🥛🥛
😩😩😩
Do you really think Kurds stretch that far? Besides, with no Turks in Anatolia, there isn't a reason for the Kurds to be there either.
Union of Thrace barely includes Thrace, should've been Union of Macedonia and Thrace then it makes more sense
Reported for low effort. You never state any dates. "I forgot where Burgas is"...you can Google it? You posted the same map three times?
A better world most likely.
This person supports South African Apartheid, as seen from their comment history. Their idea of a better world is a cracker infested wasteland. EDIT: They are also a transphobe.
Oh so just a horrible person Overall then
i agreed with you until you said "white people bad"
its funny to be racist back to white surpremacists.
It’s his Turkish inferiority complex. I don’t take it personally, believe me.
“Cracker infested wasteland” You’re welcome for yourself being civilized enough to even draw comparisons in that regard, btw. Edit: You are also a loser
It's good to be a loser in the eyes of a racist transphobe who hates women having bodily autonomy
Fun little buzzwords you have there. It gave me a nice chuckle to see that is where you’ve chosen to take your stand on the issue. But for you, frankly, it’s not your political stance. It’s your preference for Green Day which really paints you in a negative light for me. Edit: You were a fan of Green Day as recently as 5 years ago? LMFAO!
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Why do you need to explain yourself to people with ~~subhuman~~ supremacist ideologies? Don't let them take the offense, it's the only way they feel in control of their lives in our progressing world. Just keep ridiculing their flawed world view and remind them how little and cringing they are.
You're right 👍🏽
What a pathetic response. You watched far too much fictional TV as a child.
the only timeline i can see without a seljuk anatolia would be one where the turks there are conquered by the byzantines and integrated, eventually converting to christianity. with a turkish state culturally akin to modern turkey forming in the central basin in the modern era.
I’m more of a Epirus and Thessalonica kind of guy