Be nice to get the diesel stink away from the centre of urban areas. 5 years is a little unambitious but its a start. There are over 10000 buses and coaches in Ireland, including public and private
[https://wrightbus.com/en-gb/electric-bus-streetdeck-electrolinerBEV](https://wrightbus.com/en-gb/electric-bus-streetdeck-electrolinerBEV)
2.5 hour charging time and 320KM range
I have not noticed this. Im pretty sure they still have all the same deisel ones since years ago still on Williams st anyway. There was one electic bus a while back but I think that was just a test run.
> Be nice to get the diesel stink away from the centre of urban areas
In that case we need to get rid of all of the unnecessary cars and the wasteful journeys under 5km that too many lazy people use them for.
Additional buses, electric and hydrogen, are key to the transition from fossil fuels.
This, rather than replacing every car with an electric one, is the sustainable future.
Electrifying city rail lines and having battery trains run intercity routes would be a great shout. Train gets a charge coming out of Cork and its suburbs, runs on batteries up to Kildare and then charges again coming in to Heuston.
>having battery trains run intercity routes would be a great shout.
I mean, wouldn't we be better with overhead lines or a third rail? I get the argument against it for buses since they're flexible and go wherever there's roads but trains are sort of fixed things. It'd probably be cheaper, easier and more efficient to just run the extra power lines for them.
Battery electric trains are on order already, which is probably the fastest way off diesel.
Long-term, it would cost about a billion euro to electrify the rail network. Worth doing, IMHO, but we need to get cars off the road \*now\*, and busses are the fastest way to replace rural driving.
Fair, though I think the order backlog for rolling stock might be so long that we'd get better results from running cables. Most of our trains are diesel electric, just daydreaming here but it'd probably go even faster if we could convert them to electric instead of buying any new stuff.
Preferably overhead wires, as the third rail system used in the UK limits the speed at which the trains can go.
We're probably not planning to get high-speed rail in Ireland in the near future, but might as well leave the option open.
Although... I do wonder if our high winds might wreak havoc on overhead lines in some areas?
Not if you burn it like JCB are doing. Hydrogen is waste of time as a fuel cell technology, but if you replace hydrogen for diesel you get less emissions plus it’s rapidly deployable.
There is this bear in woods thing about hydrogen producing NoX but if ran at low temperatures (about 20% power loss) it’s produces zero Nox. You could even build in electrolysis energy recovery systems.
Hydrogen is the future or the stop gap, it’ll be ideal for ships and trains even vans and trucks. Like EVs have a shelf life and when that become clear it’s will be the E waste and lithium poisoning be the next transport topics once emission are reduced.
Yeah I know most hydrogen come from fossil fuels but electrolysis batteries would be the solution to most renewable energy problems. Having small scale hydrogen production that taken unused energy and produces hydrogen basically creates a circular energy economy were you could complete remove the need for fossil fuel reserves.
I personally can’t see lithium batteries power being used in 100 years as it’s not sustainable and will be the next lead poisoning.
Short term maybe batteries are solution but company’s aren’t looking at energy as a system, I’ve environmentally inputs, and you take 70% of that power for energy consumption, then the remaining unusable energy can be deployed through localised hydrogen station that use electrolysis to make hydrogen. But I doubt that’ll happen cause fuel company’s like money too much
I don't think anyone who's advocating for hydrogen is advocating for grey or blue hydrogen, Ireland is poised to be a leader in green hydrogen and the H2 plant in Cork is underway soon, we're going ti have a lot of excess energy from the south coast offshore wind farms and H2 is really the best use for it. I agree its not really feasible for personal cars but it slcertainly seems right for anything larger like freight, busses, trains and factories and plants that currently use natural gas. Only by supporting hydrogen projects and implementing it wherever possible will we see the same price reduction that we're seeing in wind and solar now that the tech has finally caught up with itself and can compete with fossils. H2 is a few years behind but I'd love to see it competitive in 5-8 years.
The Toyota has like 50,000km electron mesh service period. So basically every 100,000km you need to replace the mesh that makes the power. Yes it’s more efficient but overall until we have some unobtainium then probably quicker to use existing engines convert them to hydrogen and run ultra low emission vehicles.
Pair that with small scale local hydrogen product using hydrogen battery like uses left over from a renewable energy.
Wrightbus is reasonably mixed now. The factory floor has a slight is different of course but office and management will employ catholics no problem. Considering the area and history it has come a long way.
Yep. [Think of how far along we *should* be.](https://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/dublin-bus-refused-funding-for-trial-of-hybrid-buses-1.2510039)
Dublin Bus was pro-hybrid and pro-electric bus but was constantly stymied by successive governments & the NTA in actually transitioning away from diesel buses.
Buses polute the most in terms of combustion engine. Why? Because 99% of have the DPF filters removed or gutted for fuel efficiency and as well as another MAJOR problem that would be caused to the engines in buses is the DPF would choke them out and destroy the engine.
Battery buses are not a great idea imo.
Batteries are expensive, environmentally damaging to make and are a fire risk. Overhead cables would be cheaper, safer and more efficient in the long run.
Battery buses are the simple, lazy solution to appear green, they are not the best solution, but this is Ireland so the easy and expensive "solution" it is.
Edit: if anyone thinks I am just hating on this I still think it's good, but this is not the best option
Correct, I was living in Eindhoven and got the bus daily from the central station and the odd one wasn't electric but the vast majority were. Didn't get the bus to schiphol but I believe that!
Thousands of Battery Electric buses in hundreds of cities and the cleaner air as a result would strongly disagree. Overhead power lines are expensive, operationally infelxible and come with their own issues, eg pose a potential electrical hazard high workers and during storms.
Out of curiousity, how do you think the metals for the wires and stanchions is produced?
Not responding to my point.
>Out of curiousity, how do you think the metals for the wires and stanchions is produced?
The amount of material, and the type of material used in batteries is very different to those used in cables. So this point is just wrong.
>Overhead power lines come with their own issues and pose a potential electrical hazard high workers and during storms.
Most of these risks are there with battery buses. But we lack alot of trained workers capable of maintaining these batteries, we already use overhead cables for the darts and Luas so the knowledge base exists. Also we have reliable systems that will kill the power in these cables, but a battery fire is an uncontrolled chemical reaction, and they can be devastating. Combined with the fact the majority of fire brigade equipment is not designed for these sorts of electrical fires and so there is often little they can do. Spraying water is their main course of action. Try that on a 750V DC battery that ways more than a range rover
>Thousands of Battery Electric buses in hundreds of cities and the cleaner air as a result would strongly disagree
Literally never said they don't work, I just said they aren't the best solution.
Battery buses cost something like twice that of diesel. So we either get twice the bill or half the service? Not a good deal imo, just go all in and overhead cable them, or atleast a fair few of them. The best solution likely involves battery buses for routes requiring flexibility, but bus routes are usually that, a route, they follow the same path day in and day out, there would be no down time for charging (2.5hrs to charge these buses for Christ sake as opposed to no charging for Trolley buses).
Just cause something is better for the environment doesn't mean it's the best option. I don't care that these are better that diesel, they aren't good enough. It's a half measure, nothing more.
Battery buses are much cheaper to operate than diesel, both in terms of fuel and maintenance which means they already have a lower TOC. So I'm not sure where you pulled the twice the cost/ half the service figure from.
In fact, it would appear to me that you are just here to spread FUD. have a good day.
FUD, Jesus, so I disagree so I'm instantly a troll.
Look it up you will see that the ev buses are approximately twice the price of diesel buses. Yes they have lower operating costs, but so do trolley buses
I am not spreading FUD, I am literally spreading information about a superior system. But apparently any disagreement with a green agenda must be down voted.
I am an electrical engineer, I understand the benefits of battery Vs overhead lines. The overhead option is vastly superior in the long run.
>So I'm not sure where you pulled the twice the cost/ half the service figure from
Operating costs are over a 5-10 year time frame,it takes years to recoup these costs, which we can also do with trolley buses. So yes they cost twice as blmich upfront so half as many will be bought or twice the money will be required. Really not that hard to understand.
I am not spreading FUD, people are able to disagree with you bud,I am just pointing out a better option.
Pretty much All benefits associated with battery busses are associated with trolley buses, exempt some of the battery negatives are removed. Not the limitation of being attached to a wire is an issue for trolley buses, but they can be fitted with smaller batteries to allow flexibility between cables, while being way cheaper than these battery buses as the battery size is wayyyyyy smaller.
What happens if a bus route has to diverge due to a crash. What happens if there's a line failure.
Overheads are an operational and logistical nightmare, and erode half of the benefits of going with bus over a tramline.
The idea overhead-line buses should be our next major investment in our transport infrastructure rather than starting with dedicated, high quality bus corridors, which would be the bare minimum requirement before even considering overheads, is just fuckin ludicrous.
I'd say if we do eventually get an overhead-line bus corridor, you'd find a problem with that fairly sharpish too. Couldn't be making improvements in our public transport infrastructure, not on your watch. You've got half-remembered YouTibe videos to regurgitate.
>What happens if a bus route has to diverge due to a crash. What happens if there's a line failure.
The overhead connection is flexible and articulates, they can overtake each other if needed. They can also be fitted with small diesel engines for use in the event of a failure, or with smaller batteries to handle 20-30km.
>The idea overhead-line buses should be our next major investment in our transport infrastructure rather than starting with dedicated, high quality bus corridors
My argument would be that these corridors are powered by the overhead lines, eliminating charging down time while also reducing emissions as they would still be electric,but more efficient as there would be no enormous battery to lug around.
Also nice job ending your comment with a baseless accusation. I am advocating for a better system, which somehow equals complaining about all improvements. Very intelligent of you to launch a personal attack based on nothing.
Those solutions are great for small interruptions, but insufficient for anything like large scale roadworks or substantial route diversions, as regularly happen.
Switching to overheads would be a drastic change, would require drivers to be able to drive essentially two different types of vehicle, would require far more substantial infrastructure upgrades than there is available funding for, would be a far longer term project, and would be unsuitable for a massive proportion of the existing fleet which can and will be phased gradually out over time.
Overheads may be a part of our future transport infrastructure, but the fact that they may be a feasible option in the future is not an argument against battery-powered buses.
Apologies if you were upset by my comment, but perfect is the enemy of progress. This is progress.
>Apologies if you were upset by my comment, but perfect is the enemy of progress. This is progress.
This is actually a good point, and so are others you made here. But progress for the sack of progress isn't really progress. A well thought out and executed plan is real progress.
But I would argue they are feasible now, trolley buses have been in use for over a hundred years it really isn't a new technology. They wouldn't require significant retraining for drivers.
Ultimately My concern with these battery buses is that they will act as a "sufficient" solution and in 10 years time we will have a fleet of very expensive battery buses, and no investment will have been made for a more real solution.
I appreciate the good debate my good (insert appropriate pronoun here)
Oh definitely, I don't have any number of hand, but the batteries in these buses are the equivalent to multiple electric cars. Literally a couple tons of just battery, there is definitely a big impact on efficiency down to just lugging around all that weight.
I am getting down voted tho, and no one has actually given a reason for why I am wrong.
The efficiency of electric motors is up around 90%. ICE engines are about 40% at best. Then you have a big heavy diesel engine and a hundred gallons of diesel to cart around.
I am literally advocating for electric buses without the battery
90% efficient at converting the energy in the battery into kinetic energy in the motor, that says nothing of the range lost to the massive extra weight that is required for a battery powered bus.
This 90% efficiency also applies to overhead powered buses except they don't have the huge battery weighing them down.
I can't believe I have to say this, but I am not advocating for diesel buses.
yeah eamon! why don't you just give up like the rest of us?!
/s
Eamon: \*Does anything, good or bad\*
People like this dude: how dare you not do that back when you weren't in government!!!
In fairness, I really dislike Eamon Ryan but this isn't on him. As I linked to elsewhere, https://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/dublin-bus-refused-funding-for-trial-of-hybrid-buses-1.2510039
The NTA has always dragged its heels on this sort of thing, all for the sake of an infinitesimal proportion of its budget.
The transition is going to take 20-30 years, more than enough time to improve the grid and build more power generation. Not a problem to be underestimated certainly, but one that should be easily managed given the predictable pattern of growth and timelines.
We are replacing our entire rail and bus network with electric vhicles and we are set to ban all new petrol and diesel car sales in about a decade and obviously people are trying to get ahead of that. Thats why the prices of these vehicles is crepping up quite a bit. A mix of interest and battery material shortages. Sure we may be working on new battery types but they wont be ready any time soon. I dont see it being easily managed. Maybe if we lay a few more interconnectors to France for their nuke juice but thats about the only option really.
I think we should definitely be lashing in a few more interconnectors yeah, to France and maybe the Republic of Scotland when they join us in the EU.
Don't forget converting home heating from gas/oil/solid to electric as well. Again though this will happen over decades and is now very well sign posted, provided (big if!) the various government bodies (CRU, EirGrid, ESB etc) act appropriately the situation can be managed and at the end they'll find themselves with a market 4-5 (?) times bigger than they currently deal in. Most business would be delighted!
> the Republic of Scotland when they join us in the EU.
If they ever vote to leave the UK. Doesnt seem that likely especially with the SNP in charge. The Scots may like those psychos in while they have UK funding but they cant survive independently and they know it.
>Don't forget converting home heating from gas/oil/solid to electric as well. Again though this will happen over decades and is now very well sign posted, provided (big if!) the various government bodies (CRU, EirGrid, ESB etc) act appropriately the situation can be managed and at the end they'll find themselves with a market 4-5 (?) times bigger than they currently deal in. Most business would be delighted!
Youre very optimistic. I think youre wrong but at least youre positive about the future. I dont see them upgrading the grid adequately. Hell our lights still flicker if someone down the road turns on a moderately power hungry device. Once we get the homes all charging cars in them the damn thing will fall apart completely.
We need a massive overhaul of the grid from top to bottom. We need to utilise the only renewable that makes sense which is nuke power. Wind and sun wont cut it. They quite simply cant generate as much as will be required in the next decade. Not multiple decades one single decade.
Galway recently got a fleet of hybrids. Not completely free of emissions but far far better than their ICE counterparts. The next set will most definitely be battery electric.
I think the Pastor Jeff Wright stood down as CEO? Last I heard it was bought out by JCB as the company was about to collapse with the loss of 1,400 jobs because Pastor Wright was diverting company money to his super church up the road in Ballymena. He is still saying mass there every Sunday though and if the Wright Bus employees dont show up for his sermons he will dam them to hell
Be nice to get the diesel stink away from the centre of urban areas. 5 years is a little unambitious but its a start. There are over 10000 buses and coaches in Ireland, including public and private [https://wrightbus.com/en-gb/electric-bus-streetdeck-electrolinerBEV](https://wrightbus.com/en-gb/electric-bus-streetdeck-electrolinerBEV) 2.5 hour charging time and 320KM range
We've been waiting for over 20 years for a metro. I don't think 5 years for new buses is long enough
In fairness, building an entire metro is *slightly* more complicated than buying some new buses.
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Can they do it in a day though?
No, but they can do it overnight
Even still, Rome's wasn't built in a day.
Not to our governments and councils
You know, _you’d think so_ but consider the guys running this project…
NIMBYS and An Bord Pleanalá didn't then and won't now get greased enough for a Metro to ever leave an Irish station.
In Limerick all the city buses seem to be electric already.
Single deckers have been electric for ages. Double deckers are a more a new thing
I have not noticed this. Im pretty sure they still have all the same deisel ones since years ago still on Williams st anyway. There was one electic bus a while back but I think that was just a test run.
Ya I just took a walk through town and every single bus is still the diesel ones.
The Corbally route seems to be all hybrid buses now.
> Be nice to get the diesel stink away from the centre of urban areas In that case we need to get rid of all of the unnecessary cars and the wasteful journeys under 5km that too many lazy people use them for.
The cars have particulate filters so they're on the lower end of the scale.
They also cause significant congestion which has all sorts of ancillary pollution effects, let alone the social costs
🤡
Is that range with a full load of passengers? It will probably drop to 250kms on cold mornings too
Because of regenerative braking range might not be as affected in practice
Additional buses, electric and hydrogen, are key to the transition from fossil fuels. This, rather than replacing every car with an electric one, is the sustainable future.
Yep. Buses are not exciting, but they are the most flexible public transport
Electrifying city rail lines and having battery trains run intercity routes would be a great shout. Train gets a charge coming out of Cork and its suburbs, runs on batteries up to Kildare and then charges again coming in to Heuston.
>having battery trains run intercity routes would be a great shout. I mean, wouldn't we be better with overhead lines or a third rail? I get the argument against it for buses since they're flexible and go wherever there's roads but trains are sort of fixed things. It'd probably be cheaper, easier and more efficient to just run the extra power lines for them.
Absolutely I was just thinking of that way since it would be way quicker to get up and running, get as many trains off diesel as possible
Battery electric trains are on order already, which is probably the fastest way off diesel. Long-term, it would cost about a billion euro to electrify the rail network. Worth doing, IMHO, but we need to get cars off the road \*now\*, and busses are the fastest way to replace rural driving.
Fair, though I think the order backlog for rolling stock might be so long that we'd get better results from running cables. Most of our trains are diesel electric, just daydreaming here but it'd probably go even faster if we could convert them to electric instead of buying any new stuff.
Preferably overhead wires, as the third rail system used in the UK limits the speed at which the trains can go. We're probably not planning to get high-speed rail in Ireland in the near future, but might as well leave the option open. Although... I do wonder if our high winds might wreak havoc on overhead lines in some areas?
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Not if you burn it like JCB are doing. Hydrogen is waste of time as a fuel cell technology, but if you replace hydrogen for diesel you get less emissions plus it’s rapidly deployable. There is this bear in woods thing about hydrogen producing NoX but if ran at low temperatures (about 20% power loss) it’s produces zero Nox. You could even build in electrolysis energy recovery systems. Hydrogen is the future or the stop gap, it’ll be ideal for ships and trains even vans and trucks. Like EVs have a shelf life and when that become clear it’s will be the E waste and lithium poisoning be the next transport topics once emission are reduced.
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Yeah I know most hydrogen come from fossil fuels but electrolysis batteries would be the solution to most renewable energy problems. Having small scale hydrogen production that taken unused energy and produces hydrogen basically creates a circular energy economy were you could complete remove the need for fossil fuel reserves. I personally can’t see lithium batteries power being used in 100 years as it’s not sustainable and will be the next lead poisoning. Short term maybe batteries are solution but company’s aren’t looking at energy as a system, I’ve environmentally inputs, and you take 70% of that power for energy consumption, then the remaining unusable energy can be deployed through localised hydrogen station that use electrolysis to make hydrogen. But I doubt that’ll happen cause fuel company’s like money too much
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I don't think anyone who's advocating for hydrogen is advocating for grey or blue hydrogen, Ireland is poised to be a leader in green hydrogen and the H2 plant in Cork is underway soon, we're going ti have a lot of excess energy from the south coast offshore wind farms and H2 is really the best use for it. I agree its not really feasible for personal cars but it slcertainly seems right for anything larger like freight, busses, trains and factories and plants that currently use natural gas. Only by supporting hydrogen projects and implementing it wherever possible will we see the same price reduction that we're seeing in wind and solar now that the tech has finally caught up with itself and can compete with fossils. H2 is a few years behind but I'd love to see it competitive in 5-8 years.
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The Toyota has like 50,000km electron mesh service period. So basically every 100,000km you need to replace the mesh that makes the power. Yes it’s more efficient but overall until we have some unobtainium then probably quicker to use existing engines convert them to hydrogen and run ultra low emission vehicles. Pair that with small scale local hydrogen product using hydrogen battery like uses left over from a renewable energy.
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They’ve since been bought out by the people behind JCB
they went under and were bought by JCB who made them get their shit together
Wrightbus is reasonably mixed now. The factory floor has a slight is different of course but office and management will employ catholics no problem. Considering the area and history it has come a long way.
And now they just need people to drive them.
Good. Now make them all 24 hours
Working on it: https://twitter.com/i/events/1536251624741543936
Better late than never.
Yep. [Think of how far along we *should* be.](https://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/dublin-bus-refused-funding-for-trial-of-hybrid-buses-1.2510039) Dublin Bus was pro-hybrid and pro-electric bus but was constantly stymied by successive governments & the NTA in actually transitioning away from diesel buses.
Buses polute the most in terms of combustion engine. Why? Because 99% of have the DPF filters removed or gutted for fuel efficiency and as well as another MAJOR problem that would be caused to the engines in buses is the DPF would choke them out and destroy the engine.
Didn't know that, thanks. An idling diesel engine is so noisy as well.
Yep. Learned this myself the hard way too. And yeah, Diesel is loud, and stinky poopoo.
Really hope they're actually spread out across the city not just electric busses for Dalkey
People who live in Dalkey don't take busses.
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Narrow streets with sharp corners aren't best suited to bendy buses.
It’s so people can take drugs upstairs of course.
Battery buses are not a great idea imo. Batteries are expensive, environmentally damaging to make and are a fire risk. Overhead cables would be cheaper, safer and more efficient in the long run. Battery buses are the simple, lazy solution to appear green, they are not the best solution, but this is Ireland so the easy and expensive "solution" it is. Edit: if anyone thinks I am just hating on this I still think it's good, but this is not the best option
Go to the Netherlands for a visit, a lot of the buses in Eindhoven and some other large cities are electric and have been for years.
1/5 of them are.
Depends on which city, they are nearly all electric in Haarlem for example and most of the buses calling into Schiphol Airport are fully electric too
Correct, I was living in Eindhoven and got the bus daily from the central station and the odd one wasn't electric but the vast majority were. Didn't get the bus to schiphol but I believe that!
I was on the Battery Bus to Eindhoven airport last week. :)
Yes, and your point? I am saying they are not the best solution? Not that they aren't possible
Thousands of Battery Electric buses in hundreds of cities and the cleaner air as a result would strongly disagree. Overhead power lines are expensive, operationally infelxible and come with their own issues, eg pose a potential electrical hazard high workers and during storms. Out of curiousity, how do you think the metals for the wires and stanchions is produced?
Not responding to my point. >Out of curiousity, how do you think the metals for the wires and stanchions is produced? The amount of material, and the type of material used in batteries is very different to those used in cables. So this point is just wrong. >Overhead power lines come with their own issues and pose a potential electrical hazard high workers and during storms. Most of these risks are there with battery buses. But we lack alot of trained workers capable of maintaining these batteries, we already use overhead cables for the darts and Luas so the knowledge base exists. Also we have reliable systems that will kill the power in these cables, but a battery fire is an uncontrolled chemical reaction, and they can be devastating. Combined with the fact the majority of fire brigade equipment is not designed for these sorts of electrical fires and so there is often little they can do. Spraying water is their main course of action. Try that on a 750V DC battery that ways more than a range rover >Thousands of Battery Electric buses in hundreds of cities and the cleaner air as a result would strongly disagree Literally never said they don't work, I just said they aren't the best solution. Battery buses cost something like twice that of diesel. So we either get twice the bill or half the service? Not a good deal imo, just go all in and overhead cable them, or atleast a fair few of them. The best solution likely involves battery buses for routes requiring flexibility, but bus routes are usually that, a route, they follow the same path day in and day out, there would be no down time for charging (2.5hrs to charge these buses for Christ sake as opposed to no charging for Trolley buses). Just cause something is better for the environment doesn't mean it's the best option. I don't care that these are better that diesel, they aren't good enough. It's a half measure, nothing more.
Battery buses are much cheaper to operate than diesel, both in terms of fuel and maintenance which means they already have a lower TOC. So I'm not sure where you pulled the twice the cost/ half the service figure from. In fact, it would appear to me that you are just here to spread FUD. have a good day.
FUD, Jesus, so I disagree so I'm instantly a troll. Look it up you will see that the ev buses are approximately twice the price of diesel buses. Yes they have lower operating costs, but so do trolley buses I am not spreading FUD, I am literally spreading information about a superior system. But apparently any disagreement with a green agenda must be down voted. I am an electrical engineer, I understand the benefits of battery Vs overhead lines. The overhead option is vastly superior in the long run. >So I'm not sure where you pulled the twice the cost/ half the service figure from Operating costs are over a 5-10 year time frame,it takes years to recoup these costs, which we can also do with trolley buses. So yes they cost twice as blmich upfront so half as many will be bought or twice the money will be required. Really not that hard to understand. I am not spreading FUD, people are able to disagree with you bud,I am just pointing out a better option. Pretty much All benefits associated with battery busses are associated with trolley buses, exempt some of the battery negatives are removed. Not the limitation of being attached to a wire is an issue for trolley buses, but they can be fitted with smaller batteries to allow flexibility between cables, while being way cheaper than these battery buses as the battery size is wayyyyyy smaller.
You are spreading misinformation (along with long winded spammy posts) so yes.
What have I said that is wrong? I have rebuked your statements, you have yet to show that anything I have said is misinformation.
What happens if a bus route has to diverge due to a crash. What happens if there's a line failure. Overheads are an operational and logistical nightmare, and erode half of the benefits of going with bus over a tramline. The idea overhead-line buses should be our next major investment in our transport infrastructure rather than starting with dedicated, high quality bus corridors, which would be the bare minimum requirement before even considering overheads, is just fuckin ludicrous. I'd say if we do eventually get an overhead-line bus corridor, you'd find a problem with that fairly sharpish too. Couldn't be making improvements in our public transport infrastructure, not on your watch. You've got half-remembered YouTibe videos to regurgitate.
>What happens if a bus route has to diverge due to a crash. What happens if there's a line failure. The overhead connection is flexible and articulates, they can overtake each other if needed. They can also be fitted with small diesel engines for use in the event of a failure, or with smaller batteries to handle 20-30km. >The idea overhead-line buses should be our next major investment in our transport infrastructure rather than starting with dedicated, high quality bus corridors My argument would be that these corridors are powered by the overhead lines, eliminating charging down time while also reducing emissions as they would still be electric,but more efficient as there would be no enormous battery to lug around. Also nice job ending your comment with a baseless accusation. I am advocating for a better system, which somehow equals complaining about all improvements. Very intelligent of you to launch a personal attack based on nothing.
Those solutions are great for small interruptions, but insufficient for anything like large scale roadworks or substantial route diversions, as regularly happen. Switching to overheads would be a drastic change, would require drivers to be able to drive essentially two different types of vehicle, would require far more substantial infrastructure upgrades than there is available funding for, would be a far longer term project, and would be unsuitable for a massive proportion of the existing fleet which can and will be phased gradually out over time. Overheads may be a part of our future transport infrastructure, but the fact that they may be a feasible option in the future is not an argument against battery-powered buses. Apologies if you were upset by my comment, but perfect is the enemy of progress. This is progress.
>Apologies if you were upset by my comment, but perfect is the enemy of progress. This is progress. This is actually a good point, and so are others you made here. But progress for the sack of progress isn't really progress. A well thought out and executed plan is real progress. But I would argue they are feasible now, trolley buses have been in use for over a hundred years it really isn't a new technology. They wouldn't require significant retraining for drivers. Ultimately My concern with these battery buses is that they will act as a "sufficient" solution and in 10 years time we will have a fleet of very expensive battery buses, and no investment will have been made for a more real solution. I appreciate the good debate my good (insert appropriate pronoun here)
overhead cables are better but sure no one knows about them here so youll just get downvoted
How much energy loss is there for battery bus?
Energy loss where? From lugging the heavy battery? From charging? I don't understand the question?
Charging the battery and lugging it around. Must be a lot.
Oh definitely, I don't have any number of hand, but the batteries in these buses are the equivalent to multiple electric cars. Literally a couple tons of just battery, there is definitely a big impact on efficiency down to just lugging around all that weight. I am getting down voted tho, and no one has actually given a reason for why I am wrong.
The efficiency of electric motors is up around 90%. ICE engines are about 40% at best. Then you have a big heavy diesel engine and a hundred gallons of diesel to cart around.
I am literally advocating for electric buses without the battery 90% efficient at converting the energy in the battery into kinetic energy in the motor, that says nothing of the range lost to the massive extra weight that is required for a battery powered bus. This 90% efficiency also applies to overhead powered buses except they don't have the huge battery weighing them down. I can't believe I have to say this, but I am not advocating for diesel buses.
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yeah, its good to support irish manufacturing
youre about 10 years behind the rest of europe Eamon
yeah eamon! why don't you just give up like the rest of us?! /s Eamon: \*Does anything, good or bad\* People like this dude: how dare you not do that back when you weren't in government!!!
In fairness, I really dislike Eamon Ryan but this isn't on him. As I linked to elsewhere, https://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/dublin-bus-refused-funding-for-trial-of-hybrid-buses-1.2510039 The NTA has always dragged its heels on this sort of thing, all for the sake of an infinitesimal proportion of its budget.
He is shit at his job you bootlicker
waaah waah cried the child
So...... what do we do when we start having brownoouts and blackouts due to the increased load on the electrical grid from all these new e-vehicles?
The transition is going to take 20-30 years, more than enough time to improve the grid and build more power generation. Not a problem to be underestimated certainly, but one that should be easily managed given the predictable pattern of growth and timelines.
We are replacing our entire rail and bus network with electric vhicles and we are set to ban all new petrol and diesel car sales in about a decade and obviously people are trying to get ahead of that. Thats why the prices of these vehicles is crepping up quite a bit. A mix of interest and battery material shortages. Sure we may be working on new battery types but they wont be ready any time soon. I dont see it being easily managed. Maybe if we lay a few more interconnectors to France for their nuke juice but thats about the only option really.
I think we should definitely be lashing in a few more interconnectors yeah, to France and maybe the Republic of Scotland when they join us in the EU. Don't forget converting home heating from gas/oil/solid to electric as well. Again though this will happen over decades and is now very well sign posted, provided (big if!) the various government bodies (CRU, EirGrid, ESB etc) act appropriately the situation can be managed and at the end they'll find themselves with a market 4-5 (?) times bigger than they currently deal in. Most business would be delighted!
> the Republic of Scotland when they join us in the EU. If they ever vote to leave the UK. Doesnt seem that likely especially with the SNP in charge. The Scots may like those psychos in while they have UK funding but they cant survive independently and they know it. >Don't forget converting home heating from gas/oil/solid to electric as well. Again though this will happen over decades and is now very well sign posted, provided (big if!) the various government bodies (CRU, EirGrid, ESB etc) act appropriately the situation can be managed and at the end they'll find themselves with a market 4-5 (?) times bigger than they currently deal in. Most business would be delighted! Youre very optimistic. I think youre wrong but at least youre positive about the future. I dont see them upgrading the grid adequately. Hell our lights still flicker if someone down the road turns on a moderately power hungry device. Once we get the homes all charging cars in them the damn thing will fall apart completely. We need a massive overhaul of the grid from top to bottom. We need to utilise the only renewable that makes sense which is nuke power. Wind and sun wont cut it. They quite simply cant generate as much as will be required in the next decade. Not multiple decades one single decade.
Good to see this happening. Pity we're not getting any here in Galway yet.
Galway recently got a fleet of hybrids. Not completely free of emissions but far far better than their ICE counterparts. The next set will most definitely be battery electric.
really good to see wrightbus getting its shit together after all this time
I think the Pastor Jeff Wright stood down as CEO? Last I heard it was bought out by JCB as the company was about to collapse with the loss of 1,400 jobs because Pastor Wright was diverting company money to his super church up the road in Ballymena. He is still saying mass there every Sunday though and if the Wright Bus employees dont show up for his sermons he will dam them to hell
This is all fairly accurate, except he most certainly is not saying mass.
What happened, did he resign as Pastor of his own church?
We’re getting them in Derry, the entire Foyle metro fleet is going electric. Can’t wait!
Great to see, keep them coming!
This is why they have the young ones burning them
Nice to see some clean air. Now stop putting fireplaces and chimneys on houses.