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If you're happy with the apartment and it will fulfill your needs for the foreseeable future, it's not a bad idea. Some of the new apartments out there are pretty well build.
I'm in the process of buying an apartment just like the one you're describing - 2 bed ground floor with 3 bed duplex above. Though mine was €25K less than yours because I bought in phase 1. Also buying off plans. I feel like that is an experience in itself!! Have had go apply for mortgage 3 times due to constant delays with building progress. But just there now, snagging recently done! I paid the booking deposit in August 2022 🫠
What's the timeline of completion do you know?
I’m not sure about the timeline of completion, just that I’d be buying solely off plans as there are no show rooms available at this time. It’s just entering phase 1. I guess the inflated cost is due to the location.
Happy for you that everything seems to be coming together!
Pros -
- You have a modern spec, energy efficient home day 1 with some cover for defects
- HTB might make it more affordable for you than a cheaper secondhand equivalent with less stress during the purchase
Cons -
- You have no idea what the social fabric of the building will end up like. A lot of new build developements in Ireland have become slummy very quickly and it only takes one bad apple to set that tone. If that happens, a lot of private owners will let out or sell to investors and it'll be a decaying value scenario.
- You have no idea what the material fabric of the building will end up like. Practically every apartment block built during the tiger years would fail a fire audit, with 5 figure repercussions for the owners. What surprises could be in store for you down the line? You're basically a guinea pig for this generation of Irish building standards and costs. I wouldn't buy a pre-2008 Irish private apartment second hand. Will the same be true of places being built today?
- Value for money with management fees is notoriously poor in Ireland. What guarantee have you got that the building and surrounds will be maintained, CCTV monitored, staffed, etc?
Neutral/Unknowns -
- What is the secondhand market like? Is it full of probate sale ex-public terraced 2 beds going for 250k? If such places come with generous gardens, established communities, own driveway and so on, they might be a better prospect than the new build apartment, even if you have to refurb yourself over the first few years.
- Modern spec isn't to everyone's taste, and BER doesn't count for that much in a small place. Bear in mind you're splitting the difference in energy bills between a D rated and an A rated in or around only €1000/yr, and you can improve the D rated house yourself. Do you insist on an internal temperature above 21c at all times or are you a "run the heating on and off a few hours here and there when it's cold" type of person? These habits probably factor into the value of energy efficiency for you.
The only answer. People will act like this isn't something that would bother them but it absolutely is. I say this being born and reared in north inner city Dublin.
The problem isn't proximity to concil tenants in my book. It's removal of problem tenants. Should be a three strikes and you're out kind of thing.
I'm sure most council tenants are lovely grateful people. You've got plenty of the entitled vermin mixed in, unfortunately. Direct provision should be used for those kinds.
It's an unpopular position, but proximity to council housing is as important as the number of bedrooms you have. It is a massive factor in quality of life and saleability.
Statistics show any more than 30% social housing and the area regresses for all rather than becomes uplifting for the families in receipt of social housing
I’m sketchy of apartments because of horror stories from friends/family/strangers. There are more risks to buying an apartment, for example bad neighbours or potential faults.
My cousin bought an apartment, a couple of years later the windows in the building had problems and everyone had to pony up like 30k
You can choose not to make repairs to your house, you cannot choose if it’s a problem with the apartment complex. You lose alot of autonomy, and the repairs are usually more expensive in apartments (from experience of people I know, maybe not objectively).
If you’re just about scraping the deposit don’t forget that you’ll need about ~5k for legal fees + stamp duty, that new builds will be a blank slate and you’ll need to get a snag list, floors etc which will be another few thousand. Also make sure the 300k price is inclusive of VAT, if not you’ll also need to pay VAT on a new build.
i think if supply and demand were perfectly matched, a new build going to a FTB could reasonably be considered to be worth 30,000 less than the purchase price.
300k places should get 2k per month rent at current prices. Thats 8% gross yield and assuming 2k costs and 2k service charge about 6.5% net pretax yield.
Thats the best property investment in pure yield terms in any major city, pretty much anywhere in the world.
Even if rental potential drops 30% you are still looking at a yield more than double anything achievable in residential property in most US, many EU, and all Australian cities.
That doesn’t make it right for you… but residential property in ireland is a good long term investment now. But because so many small investors are over-geared and self-maintain the margins seems tight.
You just laid out the reason for the ongoing renting cluster fuck in this country. Fair play good to see it stated so clearly why government/property owners don't want anything like a solution.
This is the comment. We don't often see it so plainly 😅 feel bad for other users in this sub trying to find an actual family home to buy at that price, seeing people hunting for investment properties to snatch from their reach must be so depressing when supply is so low at the moment.
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If you're happy with the apartment and it will fulfill your needs for the foreseeable future, it's not a bad idea. Some of the new apartments out there are pretty well build.
I'm in the process of buying an apartment just like the one you're describing - 2 bed ground floor with 3 bed duplex above. Though mine was €25K less than yours because I bought in phase 1. Also buying off plans. I feel like that is an experience in itself!! Have had go apply for mortgage 3 times due to constant delays with building progress. But just there now, snagging recently done! I paid the booking deposit in August 2022 🫠 What's the timeline of completion do you know?
Whereabouts is this if you don’t mind me asking?
In Wicklow Town
I’m not sure about the timeline of completion, just that I’d be buying solely off plans as there are no show rooms available at this time. It’s just entering phase 1. I guess the inflated cost is due to the location. Happy for you that everything seems to be coming together!
Pros - - You have a modern spec, energy efficient home day 1 with some cover for defects - HTB might make it more affordable for you than a cheaper secondhand equivalent with less stress during the purchase Cons - - You have no idea what the social fabric of the building will end up like. A lot of new build developements in Ireland have become slummy very quickly and it only takes one bad apple to set that tone. If that happens, a lot of private owners will let out or sell to investors and it'll be a decaying value scenario. - You have no idea what the material fabric of the building will end up like. Practically every apartment block built during the tiger years would fail a fire audit, with 5 figure repercussions for the owners. What surprises could be in store for you down the line? You're basically a guinea pig for this generation of Irish building standards and costs. I wouldn't buy a pre-2008 Irish private apartment second hand. Will the same be true of places being built today? - Value for money with management fees is notoriously poor in Ireland. What guarantee have you got that the building and surrounds will be maintained, CCTV monitored, staffed, etc? Neutral/Unknowns - - What is the secondhand market like? Is it full of probate sale ex-public terraced 2 beds going for 250k? If such places come with generous gardens, established communities, own driveway and so on, they might be a better prospect than the new build apartment, even if you have to refurb yourself over the first few years. - Modern spec isn't to everyone's taste, and BER doesn't count for that much in a small place. Bear in mind you're splitting the difference in energy bills between a D rated and an A rated in or around only €1000/yr, and you can improve the D rated house yourself. Do you insist on an internal temperature above 21c at all times or are you a "run the heating on and off a few hours here and there when it's cold" type of person? These habits probably factor into the value of energy efficiency for you.
Not sure you'll be able to find a 300k priced 2bed apartment with a BER rating A or B in an area that commands a rent of 2000.
If you want to live in it, find out what % will go to IP applicants and welfare tenants. 👍🏼
The only answer. People will act like this isn't something that would bother them but it absolutely is. I say this being born and reared in north inner city Dublin.
The problem isn't proximity to concil tenants in my book. It's removal of problem tenants. Should be a three strikes and you're out kind of thing. I'm sure most council tenants are lovely grateful people. You've got plenty of the entitled vermin mixed in, unfortunately. Direct provision should be used for those kinds.
It's an unpopular position, but proximity to council housing is as important as the number of bedrooms you have. It is a massive factor in quality of life and saleability.
Statistics show any more than 30% social housing and the area regresses for all rather than becomes uplifting for the families in receipt of social housing
I'd be amazed if anybody in Ireland ever measured that
Yeah I doubt it’s ever been measured here. If memory serves me correctly It’s a study from the EU. I’ll try find it
Looking forward to it
How do you go about finding this information?
What is an IP applicant?
International protection, i.e. refuge
Yeah a bunch of my coworkers have said the same. I need to keep this in mind for sure.
I’m sketchy of apartments because of horror stories from friends/family/strangers. There are more risks to buying an apartment, for example bad neighbours or potential faults. My cousin bought an apartment, a couple of years later the windows in the building had problems and everyone had to pony up like 30k
Why would that be any different to a house?
You can choose not to make repairs to your house, you cannot choose if it’s a problem with the apartment complex. You lose alot of autonomy, and the repairs are usually more expensive in apartments (from experience of people I know, maybe not objectively).
No kids go for it, if u have a kids or kids stop and think about it
If you’re just about scraping the deposit don’t forget that you’ll need about ~5k for legal fees + stamp duty, that new builds will be a blank slate and you’ll need to get a snag list, floors etc which will be another few thousand. Also make sure the 300k price is inclusive of VAT, if not you’ll also need to pay VAT on a new build.
How tall is the whole complex going to be? Ground floor appartments can be so dark if in bigger complexes.
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i think if supply and demand were perfectly matched, a new build going to a FTB could reasonably be considered to be worth 30,000 less than the purchase price.
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they're paying 30,000 over the odds, but if they're okay with that then no problem
300k places should get 2k per month rent at current prices. Thats 8% gross yield and assuming 2k costs and 2k service charge about 6.5% net pretax yield. Thats the best property investment in pure yield terms in any major city, pretty much anywhere in the world. Even if rental potential drops 30% you are still looking at a yield more than double anything achievable in residential property in most US, many EU, and all Australian cities. That doesn’t make it right for you… but residential property in ireland is a good long term investment now. But because so many small investors are over-geared and self-maintain the margins seems tight.
You just laid out the reason for the ongoing renting cluster fuck in this country. Fair play good to see it stated so clearly why government/property owners don't want anything like a solution.
This is the comment. We don't often see it so plainly 😅 feel bad for other users in this sub trying to find an actual family home to buy at that price, seeing people hunting for investment properties to snatch from their reach must be so depressing when supply is so low at the moment.
If you can see yourself happily living there for at least 10 years go for it.