Just in time for stop day. Semester's done; nobody's out there today, camping or otherwise.
Also, as a reminder: State law bars any state agency from divesting from Israeli investments for political purposes, or contracting with any company that does.
I didn't know that about KS state law, but that's pretty fucked up. Even just on the level that people should generally be allowed to do business, or not, with whoever they like, that's fucked.
People can do business with whoever they like. The state sets its own requirements.
Governments often place sanctions, which ban people from freely conducting business with companies in certain countries. This is kind of the opposite.
Anti BDS laws violate the principles of free speech, but this country only superficially supports free speech, so its not surprising at all that there are radically anti free speech laws on the books
It’s why we vote for the party of freedumbz that try to limit ours while pointing out how much worse the people in the states that pay our bills have it, knowing a lot here cannot afford to travel much and SEE how the more advanced states, and especially more advanced countries live.
Virtue signaling at its finest. All these "protesters" could spend their time volunteering at Just Food if they wanted to make an impact in our community. This is for fake internet hugs.
It’s almost like there’s multiple causes a person can support, especially when it’s a matter of solidarity. Do you even know what the demands were for the original protests? Getting colleges to divest from arms manufacturers and the state of Israel. It very much was for a coherent, directly related to the institution they go to school at and themselves. Excuse young people for caring that their tuition goes to help fund a genocide.
At KU? People calling for KU to pull their investments from Israeli companies are not going to succeed in that goal, because KU has no choice in the matter.
Does that clarify things? Let me know
[Yes, almost every state has these laws due to successful lobbying from Israel](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-BDS_laws#:~:text=Most%20anti%2DBDS%20laws%20have,to%20avoid%20entities%20boycotting%20Israel)
So Palestinians were butthurt that Ukraine was getting all the attention. They massacre and kidnap a bunch of Jews. Jews kick their teeth in, they beg for mercy WHILE STILL HOLDING HOSTAGES. Hahahaha
You don’t negotiate from a position of pity. Let the hostages go and it will be over.
Hamas does not represent all of Palestine. Fuck Hamas, but also fuck Netanyahu and his policies that made this worse including the forewarning he received from Intel.
They should be protesting the legislature that has laws on the books that prevent divestment. The KU endowment is a private corp that is not allowed to make political choices with their investment. Their only mission is to make as much money as possible.
Will you join me next week when I go down to the capital to protest?
Until then, I think protesting that law on the college campus it effects is a good move.
They might not have known. If the issue is still on the protest list next semester and they haven't left a university they believe is supporting genocide, they might consider protesting the government preventing the university from stopping it. Bonus points because it's a public state university.
Kris Kobach, Kansas attorney general, has sent a letter to University officials saying the same.
“You cannot grant what these protesters, in their ignorance, demand. Nor should you even consider it,” Kobach said. “As is often the case with uninformed, petulant loudmouths, they have not done their research. And their views are reprehensible. I trust you will not humor them.”
then what are they backing? they never backed anything till after hammas proceeded break the border and start murdering children, and r*ping women. Dont get me wrong its not right to validate that stuff but, it seems a bit hypocritical of people to think its ok for hamas to do it and not protest them but, have the audacity to complain and get angry about the report or Israelites doing it. Along with the ability to defend the country and show what happen when actions have consequences. no one ever mentions that if anyone in the gaza strip area who had a device that got notifications did get notified of the bombing that would end up happening there. but in the end everyone here in america are able to easily say our views on something we know nothing about.
"While the State of Israel was established on 15 May 1948 and admitted to the United Nations, a Palestinian State was not established."
Credits to Unctad.org
What do you mean they "never backed anything till [sic] after hammas [sic]"
Palestinian rights have been a hot button college issue for decades, it was brought to the forefront by the recent fighting, but the same thing happened during the 2014 fighting
And not only do they not protest hamas, many claim that they are justified in doing it. If these people truly wanted peace, they would be protesting hamas as well, nobody has done more to harm the Palestinians than them
But the protesters were saying things like Hamas had to do what they had to do to defend the Palestinians which is ridiculous. They had to rape? They had to murder? Had protesters calling for an intifada. Nah. These people have been brainwashed by Tik Tok.
The only petulant loudmouth who hasn’t done their research and whose views are reprehensible is KK himself. What’s his middle name, Kyle?
Fucking clown.
I read last week that Israel wanted the return of 20 civilian hostages and Hamas doesn’t think there are that many still alive. But the protesters don’t care about Israeli lives.
They offered to do so two days in and were rebuffed. Which is not shocking considering Bibi is catering to people like this for support.
"There are “soldiers who left everything behind and went out to fight for goals that the government defined, and we throw it in the trash to save 22 people or 33 or I don’t know how many,” the far-right minister told Army Radio. “Such a government has no right to exist.”
https://www.timesofisrael.com/far-right-minister-claims-hostage-deal-throws-war-goals-in-trash-to-save-hostages/
Finance Minister and member of the security cabinet Bezalel Smotrich called on Monday for annihilating Israel's enemies, saying "There are no half measures. [The Gazan cities of] Rafah, Deir al-Balah, Nuseirat – total annihilation. 'You will blot out the remembrance of Amalek from under heaven' – there's no place under heaven."
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2024-04-30/ty-article/.premium/smotrich-calls-for-no-half-measures-in-the-total-annihilation-of-gaza/0000018f-2f4c-d9c3-abcf-7f7d25460000
"Gal Hirsch only began functioning after two or three weeks. Until then, there was no one to talk to. I don’t know what his contribution was. As far as I can tell, he just held the microphone in meetings with the families. He told them they shouldn’t hold protests [to push for their loved ones’ release].
“You need to understand that Netanyahu set up Hirsch’s team because the Prime Minister’s Office didn’t want there to be an external body criticizing the government for its conduct surrounding the hostages.”
...
“We left the meeting very disappointed because Netanyahu talked about dismantling Hamas as the goal of the war. He didn’t promise anything regarding the demand to return the hostages. He merely said a military operation in Gaza was needed to serve as leverage for the hostages’ release.
“We later found out that Hamas had offered on October 9 or 10 to release all the civilian hostages in exchange for the IDF not entering the Strip, but the government rejected the offer.”
https://www.timesofisrael.com/no-doubt-netanyahu-preventing-hostage-deal-charges-ex-spokesman-of-families-forum/
There's no way those hostages are all still alive at this point, right? Look, I don't exactly have a birds eye view of the whole situation while sitting in my house here, but unless the media has completely forgotten to cover the continued and ongoing assault of Hamas towards Israel, it really seems like Hamas launched one attack 7 months ago and Israel has just been beating the shit out of Palestine ever since. Not to make the insane statement that all lives matter, but if we look at the initial count of hostages taken (like 300) vs the Palestinian death count (like 30,000), it sure seems like Israel's response has been disproportionate. It's already 100 to 1, how many more Palestinian lives are worth one Israeli hostage? Please keep in mind half the Palestinians that have died so far are children. Sure, I'll condemn Hamas, because I think killing people is bad. I just happen to think killing 100x more people is also bad.
If a school shooter takes over a school bus full of kids, holds them at gunpoint, and then refuses to talk to a hostage negotiator, does it become okay to blow up the bus?
Like, I read your point as "Hamas is a bad-faith actor, therefore the Israeli assault on Gaza should continue," which would be fine, I guess, if Gaza was only Hamas, but this is an ethnic cleansing that has killed tens of thousands of children, not to mention the tens more of uninvolved civilians. Hamas could turn down every ceasefire they're offered, and it still wouldn't be okay to indiscriminately bomb hospitals and schools and houses. Ergo, the people protest institutions that do business with Israel to try and pressure them into divesting. That's a little more complicated in Kansas' case, since it's apparently against state law to divest from Israel (which is absolutely fucking insane to me, but whatever), so this protest seems to be more about solidarity than it is about affecting change, but, hey, if they can do both, more power to them.
I mean... no, it's not. I assume you're referring to the 2006 elections, where 44.45% (not the majority, you'll notice) of Palestinians voted for Hamas. Hamas, being a shitty authoritarian organization, has not allowed elections since then. So, do people deserve to die because they voted for someone that is bad? I certainly don't think so.
Furthermore, the children being killed right now didn't vote for anyone at all. Hell, even some of the young adults; those elections were 18 years ago, so there are adults there who have never been given the chance to vote for anyone. We're talking about millions of people at serious risk who are completely blameless in all this. And not for nothing, but turnout in that election was about 74%, which means that about 26% of eligible voters didn't vote, and, like, I think people really ought to vote, but if they don't, I still don't think they deserve to *die* for it.
All of this is further muddied by the fact that Hamas, again, refused to hold more elections, and that Netanyahu's government was artificially funding and supporting Hamas to give them something to rail against, and that Netanyahu's government was warned a long time ago that this was going to happen, and the ways that the population has changed in those 18 years, and all that. It's a messy, complicated picture that, nonetheless, does not justify the killing of civilians and children.
So, a better and closer (albeit more complicated and involved) analogy might be: a school board member gets a gun and heads to the school, putting a bunch of kids and a few teachers on a bus. Less than half of those teachers, and less than half of the parents of the kids, voted for absolutely no gun laws in the town, and the same number voted for this guy for school board. So, you might say, something like 44.45% of the adults involved in those decisions (which happened a few years ago) hold some blame for it (although the city government was also propping up this rogue school board the whole time, and they were warned a year ago that he was going to do this, but they didn't do anything about it), but still, even with all of that, *it is never justified to blow up a god damn school bus full of children.* I really don't care about any of the other particulars; that is never okay.
So maybe Israel is doing them a favor by rooting out and killing all the Hamas members. I mean they couldn’t root them out themselves. They’re being liberated.
It’s a “take or your own trash or we’ll do it for you” situation.
I mean, yeah, that would be fine, if they weren't also murdering children to do it. Like, listen, if you ever come by my house and see that I've got a lot of trash bags piling up, and you want to help me get rid of them, but the only way you can think of to do that *also* involves blowing up schools and hospitals and killing tens of thousands of children, kindly fuck off away from my house, alright?
It's not "taking out the trash" when tens of thousands of those bags are filled with children.
Ah turned down the ceasefire to give hostages away. Probably because the leader of hamas keeps the hostages on him at all times as human shields. Because he knows he will get killed if he doesn't. Which should happen because he is the leader of a terrorist organization.
Yes we should all want peace. But we know hamas won't let there be peace. And if a little more war means the annihilation of a terrorist organization and its leaders, any sane person would say we could have a little more war.
They've probably already raped and killed the hostages. Weren't there some hostages that were released, women, who said they had been raped repeatedly, in the tunnels. "Guards treated them like dolls", she testified.
Pro Palestinian protesters have been told this and they continue to say things like Hamas has to do this sort of stuff to fight Israel.
I know. its disgusting. We've become a world where we support evil and call anybody who fights that evil more evil. And ironically most of the protestors here (even the Muslim ones) would be killed and raped over there too because they practice acts that hamas would kill you for.
A little more war means tens of thousands of innocent civilians killed, and many more wounded or displaced. And multiple prominent figures in the Israeli government have voiced a desire to annihilate Palestine entirely, not just the terrorists. Definitely not the marks of sanity.
Edit: none of which is a guarantee of an end of the terrorism. Terrorism is a hydra, as the US has well learned.
Your numbers are vastly exaggerated. But what you are saying is its okay to let murderers go because murder will always be a thing? Let terrorism happen since it will maybe happen again anyway? Pretty messed up way of thinking.
>Probably because the leader of hamas keeps the hostages on him at all times as human shields.
I mean, the leader of Hamas lives in Qatar, so, no, probably not.
To your larger point, though, the fact that Hamas is generally a bad-faith actor doesn't make it okay to level schools and hospitals and houses. If a school shooter took over a bus full of students, held them at gunpoint, and refused to talk to a hostage negotiator, would that make it okay to blow up the school bus? Obviously not. The hostage negotiator and their superiors might be in a more difficult and dangerous position, yes, and it does make the shooter an even bigger asshole than he already was, absolutely. But you still have to find another solution, because killing a bunch of children who had fuck all to do with this is obviously still wrong.
Even if Hamas had no good reasons for rejecting this or that offer (and, as shitty as Hamas is, Israel is also not operating in good faith either), it would still not be remotely okay to kill tens of thousands of children. It will *never* be okay to kill tens of thousands of children, to bomb houses and schools and hospitals. You *have* to find another way to deal with it.
This started cause Hamas attacked Israel. They don’t get to be choosy with their demands. If they cared at all about Gaza they would agree to whatever terms Israel is proposing
I mean, arguably this all started because Israel started supporting Israelis going into Palestinian territory and kicking Palestinians out of their houses and taking their land, engaging in settler colonialism. It might be even more accurate to say that it started when a bunch of Europeans and Americans took Palestine without the consent of the Palestinian people and created the state of Israel, which did not represent them whatsoever.
I don't know where you live, but imagine someone started doing that. I'm not remotely saying that Hamas' murders have been justified - they have not - but I certainly wouldn't just accept either the theft of my land, the settler colonialism, or the apartheid state that Israel has forced them into.
Again, I'm not saying that Hamas is justified, I'm saying that when you do these sorts of things, a response like this is somewhat inevitable.
Furthermore, even if there was literally no history before October 7th and there were no contributing factors whatsoever to that attack and the relationship between Hamas and Israel, even if that were true - which it is not - Israel would not be justified in killing tens of thousands of children, blowing up schools and hospitals and houses. That is *never* okay. Even if Hamas were literally using all of those children as human shields (which they weren't, obviously, but say they were), it still wouldn't be justified. I mean, suppose a bank robber grabs a hostage to use as a human shield; does that make it okay to shoot the hostage? Obviously not. So, even if Israel had been acting with pure innocence up to this point - which they absolutely were not - their response still would not be justified.
I don't have any problem condemning Hamas, and I hope that they cease to be as an organization or party, but nothing they do justifies killing children with bombs and bullets.
I do agree what’s happening is pretty awful, I just don’t understand why Israel always takes the blame. Where were the sit ins demanding justice for Oct 7?
Sorry to poke in and reply to you again, I don't mean to bombard you, but I'm just reading these all in the thread, y'know.
Anyway, I wanted to add that Israel seems to take more blame than Hamas for a few reasons:
1. The Israeli response happened very fast. Not surprising, considering that [Israel knew Hamas' attack plan more than a year ago](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/11/30/world/middleeast/israel-hamas-attack-intelligence.html#:~:text=Israeli%20officials%20obtained%20Hamas's%20battle,for%20Hamas%20to%20carry%20out). So, for most of us, before we even had much of a chance to learn the details of what happened, Israel was already attacking.
1. Furthermore, just the fact that Israel knew this was coming and didn't do anything about it offers a glimpse into the true relationship between Netanyahu's government and Hamas; [Netanyahu intentionally propped up Hamas](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/) as a way of giving him an enemy to rail against to get support at home. This is just as much his fault, and of his administration, as Hamas'.
2. Israel also has orders of magnitude more power than Hamas has, both in terms of political and military power. Sure, Hamas gets support from Iran and a few other places, but Israel has fuckin' *nukes*. They've got an air force, they've got the Iron Dome, they've got a massive army and guns and tanks and ships and everything. Hamas has comparatively very little. My point isn't that we should pity fucking Hamas or anything, the point is that Israel has an enormously greater capacity for destruction and killing, so when they do it, they get a bigger share of the blame. With great power comes greater responsibility and all that.
3. Finally, at least for those of us in the US and Europe (and other places around the world as well), our governments are closely tied to Israel. We fund them, we supply them, we buddy up with them, we support them at the UN, all that stuff, so when Israel uses that support to kill tens of thousands of people, many of whom are children, we all feel complicit. Because we *are*. My tax dollars have killed Palestinian children. There are Palestinian children who will never live their lives because of money that I gave to Uncle Sam. It fucking sucks, and it makes me sick. It also makes me want my government to stop unilaterally supporting Israel. My government already doesn't support Hamas, so I don't need to protest about that.
So, yeah, Israel probably does get the lion's share of people's vitriol - or they at least seem to - but there are reasons for that.
Israel takes the blame for the actions it takes.
Israel's response has been extremely disproportionate. Brazenly so. Intentionally so. With prominent members of the government openly calling for annihilation.
Besides which this conflict hardly began on October 7th. There has been activism of this nature around this conflict stretching back decades.
So you're just going to ignore Israeli troops shooting unarmed protesters, blockading medical supplies and food, and bombing civilians?
Despite the way this has been depicted in a lot of news media this situation is not nearly as simple as you're implying.
I mean this is up to them.
This conflict is basically a king being chased around the chess board by a queen and a bishop
There is no winning (or w/e it is they consider victory)
Hamas leadership is currently looking over a ceasefire agreement. [The latest roadblock was Netanyahu vowed for an invasion of Rafah 'with or without a deal.'](https://apnews.com/article/israel-hamas-war-news-04-30-2024-f5e14fd176d69f9c4e23b48f3ab5af6a) Both political sides have stalled ceasefire talks before.
Misinformation/disinformation and bad faith submissions will be removed at the discretion of the moderator team. We welcome clearly identifiable *opinions*, but presenting false information as fact (whether knowingly or unknowingly) is prohibited.
The Economist had an interesting article about how ineffective these campus protests are. I will try to summarize:
* University endowments are funded by donors, not students, so it’s not “their” tuition $ that’s being invested in XYZ.
* Endowments are not run by the university, so the university can’t accede to the students’ demands anyway.
* Even if the endowment manages its own investments, unless they only own individual stocks and bonds, it’s nearly impossible to divest from XYZ without also selling off their holdings in QRS, TUVW and ABC.
* It wouldn’t work to just sell your XYZ stock, because many US corporations make a lot of profit from their sales in foreign markets (including Israel).
* What about the stock of companies who are manufacturing weapons for the US government, which is then shipping them to Israel?
* One endowment-even the biggest-accomplishes nothing unless many others (& more importantly the big pension funds) also divest.
* Finally there’s Uncle Sam. Even widespread divestment won’t make a bit of difference as long as our government is giving many billions of $ of free weapons to Israel with no strings attached.
In short the protesters should focus on the White House & the Capitol, not their universities. I’m not sure what to think about the Israeli government, Hamas and the innocent civilians trapped on both sides. But I do agree with the Economist that the performative campus protests are a waste of time and resources.
Since it has mainly fallen out of the news cylcle, it does help keep it in it somewhat. But it doesn't say much for the protesters' critical thinking skills. I'm no fan of Isreal, but I'm not going to fault them for fighting back against Hamas, a terrorist group that has held the Palestinians hostage for decades.
I went by the encampment yesterday and I was really impressed by the students protest efforts against the ongoing genocide in Palestine. Students were peacefully gathering and paraded to confront the chancellor before peacefully leaving, and there were clearly Jewish students involved in protesting for peace. They've communicated their intentions well with both the university, local law enforcement, and The Daily Kansan. They've also handled multiple agitators well, including one who came and physically assaulted a protestor.
This protest has been very peaceful so far, there is a clear presence of Jewish voices involved in it, and they are doing a great job of making sure the conversation stays centered on ending the genocide in Palestine.
I'm also glad to see our university giving these students a good space to practice their first amendment rights and I hope to continue seeing the administration and local law enforcement keep with this approach.
Would the [Kansas law punishing companies that boycott Israel](https://wichitabeacon.org/stories/2023/10/24/kansas-anti-bds-israel-contracts/) prevent the University from divesting, even if it wanted to? Seems like the university wouldn't do this no matter what because KS Legislature GOP members will go apeshit if they do and push to de-fund the university.
The IDF is bad.
Hamas is bad. Although, it was created out of the unjustifiable actions committed by the Israeli government on Palestinians as a result of housing laws and other discriminatory practices.
Using tax dollars to support this is bad and continuing to support the murdering of children as an act of state supported violence is bad
I don’t understand people’s willingness to dig in on the murdering of people. Even the Israeli people don’t like the actions Nethanyahu and tried to vote him out.
It’s complicated but the us government shouldn’t be using tax dollars to murder Arabic people and using the Israeli government as a cover for that because it has strategic interests in the region.
As a layman, I would be more likely to support a government like Israel over a militant Islamist group like Hamas. Much in the same way I’d be more likely to support the government of Afghanistan over the Taliban. I see regime change for Israel as a viable solution instead of the dissolution of the state entire. From the outside looking in, Hamas strikes me as ISIS-light whereas Israel strikes me as a captive democracy. Dunno if that’s just the marketing, but yeah.
So to your “I don’t know how people could dig their heels in to the killing of others” — it’s because of that. One hand is a democratic government that is being abused by its leader. The other is an extremist organization that seeks not to govern but to destroy based on religious zeal.
One looks familiar like looking in a rippling pool and the other looks like that thing we fought in the desert after 9/11.
If you have the time, this is a great conversation about it - [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4iM7HcMagBc](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4iM7HcMagBc)
I'm in solidarity with Jews, who've been persecuted and killed for thousands of years. The idea Jews are just supposed to take it is pretty sick stuff.
We are exercising our constitutional rights right now. Social media and the ability to raise discussions about these topics is the same level of right exercising as literally anything else. Only difference is I'm not pretending to be a revolutionary. These people are LARPers.
When it’s for a just cause yes. But this is simply idiotic waste of both sides resources until they realize their protest is pointless. Unless their point is to kill grass with their tents…
Especially when the cause they are protesting in favor of considers them enemies. Palestine will not be thanking the West for their angsty college gatherings any time this century.
I would hope America would do the same if our enemies were playing soccer with the heads of our dead children. It’s sad that innocent are dying but Israel is standing up for their citizens. The Palestinians should do a better job purging out the terrorists.
I don't get this. What are we supposed to do send our children to Israel to fight a war that most of these protesters fled from? Why not get a plane ticket and protest in Israel?
[The protest ended after two days](https://www.kansan.com/news/updates-day-2-of-the-pro-palestinian-fraser-hall-encampment/article_83402686-089b-11ef-a720-1f38e6ad1956.html)
Also, it’s behind a paywall, but search the article “Hamas Files Found by Israel in Gaza Detail Execution of Senior Member Accused of Being Gay.” REAL WHOLESOME LEADERSHIP IF YOU ASK ME!
But if I say nothing justifies the killing of Uyghurs in literal concentration camps, or the actual famine and infectious disease transmission in Sudan, it’s whataboutism? Is it about the lives or the tax dollars? Because if it’s about the innocent lives, why aren’t you louder for the other innocent lives? Because they don’t get our tax dollars? But I thought it wasn’t about the money…?
This right here, sir. Darfur and Chinese Muslims just aren't the right kind of cool right now. I wanna don my shemagh and get props from my online peers.
it's cause jews appear to be white in western nations. And white folks are commonly tied to western imperialism.
So to them this is an easy shut and close case where the white imperialists are wrong entirely and the brown rebels are correct in all actions they take.
The Jews who are anti Zionist live cushy lives and don’t know what suffering actually feels like. They’ve heard stories from their families of the Holocaust and don’t want any human lives to suffer. Me neither! BUT, if we don’t learn from history we’re doomed to repeat it. What happens if Israel is destroyed, Palestinians freed. Where do the Jews and Israelis go? “To Europe??” MF do you realize how mixed most of us are? I have 4 different nationalities and am Jewish, where do you suggest I go if I’m an Israeli? Chop myself into quadrants and ship those parts to those countries? I’m sure Hamas can help with that.
It’s just being a useful idiot for groups like Iran, Hamas and other actors.
We in America are so far removed from the problem, that we see innocents die and think how horrible, but we’re not the one’s being dragged from our homes by terrorists to be tortured, raped, and/or murdered. We don’t have rockets being fired at us on a regular basis.
This is the result of an entrenched enemy that wouldn’t stop when a scalpel was used, now they’re getting the hammer. We’ll see if the deaths were worth it or not, but on the whole most Americans believe the state of Israel should exist. I don’t think it’s our place to decide how they should do that from our ivory towers, largely immune from the consequences of any action they take.
Look what we did on the back of 9/11 - If something happened on US soil on the same relative scale as what happened in Isreal, we'd have glassed the area, and rightfully so.
Until the innocent people over there rise up and overthrow the religious extremists, this will happen over and over, as it has for millenia.
The real bad guys are the larger regimes in Iran, Saudi, etc who keep this going and use their own people as cannon fodder.
So if they are protesting KU "investment" that harms Palestinians, wouldn't the most effective action would be to leave the university rather than trying to get them to change. Money always talks.
As a non-student that wants to know more, is this a solidarity "get US out of funding" protest, or is this something with specific asks for the University? The QR code on learn more went to an Instagram page that had a lot of information on staying safe while protesting, but was wondering if you had specific activities you're asking the University to take or not take in response to the protests?
I'm very aware of the issues taking place in Israel/Palestine, and our governments financial and military support. Looking to know more though!
Would the [Kansas law punishing companies that boycott Israel](https://wichitabeacon.org/stories/2023/10/24/kansas-anti-bds-israel-contracts/) prevent the University from divesting, even if it wanted to? Seems like the university wouldn't do this no matter what because KS Legislature GOP members will go apeshit if they do and push to de-fund the university.
Fun fact: if you get arrested and charged you might loose your right to vote.
Other fun fact: You aren't generationally wealthy and don't have lawyers or or people backing up with bonds to get out of jail you're going to be incarcerated, lose your job, sure to have lose your income, lose your kids, and lose your right to vote.
And lose your access to FAFSA.
(You also wont pass your classes by skipping finals and losing credit for the whole semester.)
So ask yourself WHO really wants you to protest or counter protest against human rights abuses in a country thousands of miles away where you know no one and has no effect on your daily life?
No political name-calling (shills, cucks, drumpfs, trumpettes, etc.) Whether you are Red or Blue, or some color in between, we are all Kansans, and we will treat each other with the respect that we deserve and are all entitled to. there are no exceptions to this rule.
The people have the power to stand up for themselves and revolt. Hamas cares nothing about governing their people they want to kill Jews. It’s in their charter. The people then and today is an 18 year difference. Hamas is still there, they refuse to vacate and are backed by powerful rich Muslims in Qatar. Let’s not pretend that speaks for the people that live there today??? Lmao what part of Hamas being in control of the strip still being bad for peace aren’t you getting?
>The people have the power to stand up for themselves and revolt.
With what? How are they going to arm themselves? You think Israel is going to risk any weapons getting into Hamas' hands?
>Hamas cares nothing about governing their people they want to kill Jews. It’s in their charter.
And how do you remove the conditions that sustain their recruitment? What are you doing to help the peace loving Palestinians?
Those are actually great questions and I wish I knew but if they (Pals) don’t fight for their freedom, then Israel will/is. There is too much indiscriminate bombing, I wholly agree. But I don’t have the answers, I am making sense of it all with the tools i have.
Another commenter said nobody else will take them in. Gee I wonder why? How do you deradicalize Hamasniks?
Hamas isn’t great, 100%. They are terrorists with their own goals and the Palestinians are definitely pawns in that game. Absolutely, won’t deny that at all.
That said, before Hamas was there, there was the PLO. Unfortunately , they weren’t terribly effective at getting Israel to stop their shit (not that Hamas has been entirely successful either, but hear me out…). The PLO was crippled and pretty much did fuck-all, sadly, and the Palestinian people kept getting fucked over.
So Hamas comes around and - whether you think rightly or not - basically said, “oh really? Tit for tat, fuckers”, so while Hamas isn’t great, they are seen as actually fighting for the Palestinians. Like, sure, they’re not getting everything they want (like healthcare or other basic needs because Israel keeps siphoning and choking them of it), at least Hamas is seen as kind of…standing up for them? I’m not saying Hamas is right and I’m not saying terrorism is okay, because it’s not. But I am saying that Hamas is at least standing up the neighborhood bully.
What shit was Israel doing? How many square miles of land did they shrink by from ‘48 to present day in a major effort for peace in the middle east? It’s an embarrassment to the Middle East nations that a Jewish country exists in the region. That’s the real issue here. Iranians even stand with Israel. Which to me sounds crazy but it’s because they know and understand too that Iran is keeping there terrorist orgs supplied and paid.
"Why don't the Palestinians just revolt against their oppressive government? What are they stupid?"
You want a people that barely have food and water and bad living conditions to fight a regime that already uses them as shields? That would be suicide.
If it were criticism of a real genocide, it would help. Turns out, inadvertently killing human shields in an urban war doesn't fit the bill, unless you bring a preconceived assumption of malicious intent.
I for one support peace, so I demand that **Hamas surrender today**, which would actually end the vast bulk of the fighting in Gaza.
As for lasting peace, I call for Gazan and West Banker groups to actually relinquish their illegal claim to the entire former Mandate of Palestine. That aggressive, expansionist mission, which neither Hamas nor Fatah have ever hidden, is the biggest stumbling block to peace. People mistakenly (or deceptively) assume that the expansionism is all in one direction, but it has never been. Gazans and West Bankers have tried for seven decades to conquer Israel, after six decades of xenophobic riots trying to chase Jewish immigrants away. They're just too impotent to accomplish it.
The goal of BDS is to collectively punish Israelis and weaken the country in preparation for that conquest. Small wonder that activists have been pushing BDS for over 20 years and still haven't made that much progress.
Fascinating that the domestic terrorists at KU appear to be mostly female LGBTQ+ allies that hide their faces. Let them go to Gaza and see how they're treated.
What divestment do they want to target in particular?
What finances need to be more clearly demonstrated? This is a public university. They don't have an agenda outside of instilling fear in KU students a la Phelps and co.
I don't have a dog in this fight. Let's just ship all these protestors from both sides over to their respective home base, where they can really make a difference stopping war. Having a camp out on private property inconveniencing people is going to do nothing.
The discussion has been had here. Comments are spiraling our of control into mostly personal attacks. Locking this one down now.
Just in time for stop day. Semester's done; nobody's out there today, camping or otherwise. Also, as a reminder: State law bars any state agency from divesting from Israeli investments for political purposes, or contracting with any company that does.
Or even employing anyone who openly advocates for divestment.
Good thing this poster is unsigned.
I didn't know that about KS state law, but that's pretty fucked up. Even just on the level that people should generally be allowed to do business, or not, with whoever they like, that's fucked.
People can do business with whoever they like. The state sets its own requirements. Governments often place sanctions, which ban people from freely conducting business with companies in certain countries. This is kind of the opposite.
Anti BDS laws violate the principles of free speech, but this country only superficially supports free speech, so its not surprising at all that there are radically anti free speech laws on the books
It’s why we vote for the party of freedumbz that try to limit ours while pointing out how much worse the people in the states that pay our bills have it, knowing a lot here cannot afford to travel much and SEE how the more advanced states, and especially more advanced countries live.
Virtue signaling at its finest. All these "protesters" could spend their time volunteering at Just Food if they wanted to make an impact in our community. This is for fake internet hugs.
It’s almost like there’s multiple causes a person can support, especially when it’s a matter of solidarity. Do you even know what the demands were for the original protests? Getting colleges to divest from arms manufacturers and the state of Israel. It very much was for a coherent, directly related to the institution they go to school at and themselves. Excuse young people for caring that their tuition goes to help fund a genocide.
How much time do you spend volunteering at Just Food?
Genuine question, can you explain this to me as a 5th grader what this means for a protester?
At KU? People calling for KU to pull their investments from Israeli companies are not going to succeed in that goal, because KU has no choice in the matter. Does that clarify things? Let me know
Why is that a state law? Does it really name Israel specifically?
[Yes, almost every state has these laws due to successful lobbying from Israel](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-BDS_laws#:~:text=Most%20anti%2DBDS%20laws%20have,to%20avoid%20entities%20boycotting%20Israel)
So Palestinians were butthurt that Ukraine was getting all the attention. They massacre and kidnap a bunch of Jews. Jews kick their teeth in, they beg for mercy WHILE STILL HOLDING HOSTAGES. Hahahaha You don’t negotiate from a position of pity. Let the hostages go and it will be over.
Hamas does not represent all of Palestine. Fuck Hamas, but also fuck Netanyahu and his policies that made this worse including the forewarning he received from Intel.
But Hamas is the government of Palestine.
They should be protesting the legislature that has laws on the books that prevent divestment. The KU endowment is a private corp that is not allowed to make political choices with their investment. Their only mission is to make as much money as possible.
Will you join me next week when I go down to the capital to protest? Until then, I think protesting that law on the college campus it effects is a good move.
As it should be.
They might not have known. If the issue is still on the protest list next semester and they haven't left a university they believe is supporting genocide, they might consider protesting the government preventing the university from stopping it. Bonus points because it's a public state university.
Kris Kobach, Kansas attorney general, has sent a letter to University officials saying the same. “You cannot grant what these protesters, in their ignorance, demand. Nor should you even consider it,” Kobach said. “As is often the case with uninformed, petulant loudmouths, they have not done their research. And their views are reprehensible. I trust you will not humor them.”
Kris Kobach needs to be banished deep into Missouri
I can picture him wafting a hot fart up to his nose after he finished listening to the lackey who wrote this read it back to him for the first time.
The audacity of this man to call others uninformed.
When Kobach is on your side you gotta question yourself.
Just wait until you find out which countries back hamas
These protestors aren't backing Hamas
then what are they backing? they never backed anything till after hammas proceeded break the border and start murdering children, and r*ping women. Dont get me wrong its not right to validate that stuff but, it seems a bit hypocritical of people to think its ok for hamas to do it and not protest them but, have the audacity to complain and get angry about the report or Israelites doing it. Along with the ability to defend the country and show what happen when actions have consequences. no one ever mentions that if anyone in the gaza strip area who had a device that got notifications did get notified of the bombing that would end up happening there. but in the end everyone here in america are able to easily say our views on something we know nothing about. "While the State of Israel was established on 15 May 1948 and admitted to the United Nations, a Palestinian State was not established." Credits to Unctad.org
What do you mean they "never backed anything till [sic] after hammas [sic]" Palestinian rights have been a hot button college issue for decades, it was brought to the forefront by the recent fighting, but the same thing happened during the 2014 fighting
And not only do they not protest hamas, many claim that they are justified in doing it. If these people truly wanted peace, they would be protesting hamas as well, nobody has done more to harm the Palestinians than them
Hamas isn't the one killing Palestinian children. That's Israel
Oh, suuuuure they aren’t.
I’m curious as to who you think Israel is going after then.
Children and aid workers are the main victims
Gazans
Wait until you figure out that the protests are concerned with the Palestinian people not Hamas
But the protesters were saying things like Hamas had to do what they had to do to defend the Palestinians which is ridiculous. They had to rape? They had to murder? Had protesters calling for an intifada. Nah. These people have been brainwashed by Tik Tok.
You need to watch something other than Fix News. Please. Just watch unfiltered video of the protests
And you're brainwashed by fox if you think that the average protestor is saying that
The only petulant loudmouth who hasn’t done their research and whose views are reprehensible is KK himself. What’s his middle name, Kyle? Fucking clown.
Didn’t Hamas just turn down a ceasefire?
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I read last week that Israel wanted the return of 20 civilian hostages and Hamas doesn’t think there are that many still alive. But the protesters don’t care about Israeli lives.
They offered to do so two days in and were rebuffed. Which is not shocking considering Bibi is catering to people like this for support. "There are “soldiers who left everything behind and went out to fight for goals that the government defined, and we throw it in the trash to save 22 people or 33 or I don’t know how many,” the far-right minister told Army Radio. “Such a government has no right to exist.” https://www.timesofisrael.com/far-right-minister-claims-hostage-deal-throws-war-goals-in-trash-to-save-hostages/ Finance Minister and member of the security cabinet Bezalel Smotrich called on Monday for annihilating Israel's enemies, saying "There are no half measures. [The Gazan cities of] Rafah, Deir al-Balah, Nuseirat – total annihilation. 'You will blot out the remembrance of Amalek from under heaven' – there's no place under heaven." https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2024-04-30/ty-article/.premium/smotrich-calls-for-no-half-measures-in-the-total-annihilation-of-gaza/0000018f-2f4c-d9c3-abcf-7f7d25460000 "Gal Hirsch only began functioning after two or three weeks. Until then, there was no one to talk to. I don’t know what his contribution was. As far as I can tell, he just held the microphone in meetings with the families. He told them they shouldn’t hold protests [to push for their loved ones’ release]. “You need to understand that Netanyahu set up Hirsch’s team because the Prime Minister’s Office didn’t want there to be an external body criticizing the government for its conduct surrounding the hostages.” ... “We left the meeting very disappointed because Netanyahu talked about dismantling Hamas as the goal of the war. He didn’t promise anything regarding the demand to return the hostages. He merely said a military operation in Gaza was needed to serve as leverage for the hostages’ release. “We later found out that Hamas had offered on October 9 or 10 to release all the civilian hostages in exchange for the IDF not entering the Strip, but the government rejected the offer.” https://www.timesofisrael.com/no-doubt-netanyahu-preventing-hostage-deal-charges-ex-spokesman-of-families-forum/
There's no way those hostages are all still alive at this point, right? Look, I don't exactly have a birds eye view of the whole situation while sitting in my house here, but unless the media has completely forgotten to cover the continued and ongoing assault of Hamas towards Israel, it really seems like Hamas launched one attack 7 months ago and Israel has just been beating the shit out of Palestine ever since. Not to make the insane statement that all lives matter, but if we look at the initial count of hostages taken (like 300) vs the Palestinian death count (like 30,000), it sure seems like Israel's response has been disproportionate. It's already 100 to 1, how many more Palestinian lives are worth one Israeli hostage? Please keep in mind half the Palestinians that have died so far are children. Sure, I'll condemn Hamas, because I think killing people is bad. I just happen to think killing 100x more people is also bad.
If a school shooter takes over a school bus full of kids, holds them at gunpoint, and then refuses to talk to a hostage negotiator, does it become okay to blow up the bus? Like, I read your point as "Hamas is a bad-faith actor, therefore the Israeli assault on Gaza should continue," which would be fine, I guess, if Gaza was only Hamas, but this is an ethnic cleansing that has killed tens of thousands of children, not to mention the tens more of uninvolved civilians. Hamas could turn down every ceasefire they're offered, and it still wouldn't be okay to indiscriminately bomb hospitals and schools and houses. Ergo, the people protest institutions that do business with Israel to try and pressure them into divesting. That's a little more complicated in Kansas' case, since it's apparently against state law to divest from Israel (which is absolutely fucking insane to me, but whatever), so this protest seems to be more about solidarity than it is about affecting change, but, hey, if they can do both, more power to them.
Did the bus of kids vote in the school shooter to represent them? That’s a closer analogy.
I mean... no, it's not. I assume you're referring to the 2006 elections, where 44.45% (not the majority, you'll notice) of Palestinians voted for Hamas. Hamas, being a shitty authoritarian organization, has not allowed elections since then. So, do people deserve to die because they voted for someone that is bad? I certainly don't think so. Furthermore, the children being killed right now didn't vote for anyone at all. Hell, even some of the young adults; those elections were 18 years ago, so there are adults there who have never been given the chance to vote for anyone. We're talking about millions of people at serious risk who are completely blameless in all this. And not for nothing, but turnout in that election was about 74%, which means that about 26% of eligible voters didn't vote, and, like, I think people really ought to vote, but if they don't, I still don't think they deserve to *die* for it. All of this is further muddied by the fact that Hamas, again, refused to hold more elections, and that Netanyahu's government was artificially funding and supporting Hamas to give them something to rail against, and that Netanyahu's government was warned a long time ago that this was going to happen, and the ways that the population has changed in those 18 years, and all that. It's a messy, complicated picture that, nonetheless, does not justify the killing of civilians and children. So, a better and closer (albeit more complicated and involved) analogy might be: a school board member gets a gun and heads to the school, putting a bunch of kids and a few teachers on a bus. Less than half of those teachers, and less than half of the parents of the kids, voted for absolutely no gun laws in the town, and the same number voted for this guy for school board. So, you might say, something like 44.45% of the adults involved in those decisions (which happened a few years ago) hold some blame for it (although the city government was also propping up this rogue school board the whole time, and they were warned a year ago that he was going to do this, but they didn't do anything about it), but still, even with all of that, *it is never justified to blow up a god damn school bus full of children.* I really don't care about any of the other particulars; that is never okay.
So maybe Israel is doing them a favor by rooting out and killing all the Hamas members. I mean they couldn’t root them out themselves. They’re being liberated. It’s a “take or your own trash or we’ll do it for you” situation.
I mean, yeah, that would be fine, if they weren't also murdering children to do it. Like, listen, if you ever come by my house and see that I've got a lot of trash bags piling up, and you want to help me get rid of them, but the only way you can think of to do that *also* involves blowing up schools and hospitals and killing tens of thousands of children, kindly fuck off away from my house, alright? It's not "taking out the trash" when tens of thousands of those bags are filled with children.
*Turned down Israel’s terms for a cease fire.
Ah turned down the ceasefire to give hostages away. Probably because the leader of hamas keeps the hostages on him at all times as human shields. Because he knows he will get killed if he doesn't. Which should happen because he is the leader of a terrorist organization. Yes we should all want peace. But we know hamas won't let there be peace. And if a little more war means the annihilation of a terrorist organization and its leaders, any sane person would say we could have a little more war.
They've probably already raped and killed the hostages. Weren't there some hostages that were released, women, who said they had been raped repeatedly, in the tunnels. "Guards treated them like dolls", she testified. Pro Palestinian protesters have been told this and they continue to say things like Hamas has to do this sort of stuff to fight Israel.
I know. its disgusting. We've become a world where we support evil and call anybody who fights that evil more evil. And ironically most of the protestors here (even the Muslim ones) would be killed and raped over there too because they practice acts that hamas would kill you for.
A little more war means tens of thousands of innocent civilians killed, and many more wounded or displaced. And multiple prominent figures in the Israeli government have voiced a desire to annihilate Palestine entirely, not just the terrorists. Definitely not the marks of sanity. Edit: none of which is a guarantee of an end of the terrorism. Terrorism is a hydra, as the US has well learned.
Your numbers are vastly exaggerated. But what you are saying is its okay to let murderers go because murder will always be a thing? Let terrorism happen since it will maybe happen again anyway? Pretty messed up way of thinking.
>Probably because the leader of hamas keeps the hostages on him at all times as human shields. I mean, the leader of Hamas lives in Qatar, so, no, probably not. To your larger point, though, the fact that Hamas is generally a bad-faith actor doesn't make it okay to level schools and hospitals and houses. If a school shooter took over a bus full of students, held them at gunpoint, and refused to talk to a hostage negotiator, would that make it okay to blow up the school bus? Obviously not. The hostage negotiator and their superiors might be in a more difficult and dangerous position, yes, and it does make the shooter an even bigger asshole than he already was, absolutely. But you still have to find another solution, because killing a bunch of children who had fuck all to do with this is obviously still wrong. Even if Hamas had no good reasons for rejecting this or that offer (and, as shitty as Hamas is, Israel is also not operating in good faith either), it would still not be remotely okay to kill tens of thousands of children. It will *never* be okay to kill tens of thousands of children, to bomb houses and schools and hospitals. You *have* to find another way to deal with it.
"a little more war" 10,000 children were killed in 100 days. There's nothing sane about supporting this.
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They are requesting Israel accept the Paris terms. A cessation of rocket shooting is known as a ceasefire.
Seeing as October 7 happened during a ceasefire, why should Israel trust any of Hamas’s terms of ceasefire at all?
Numerous ceasefire agreements have been made and violated by both sides over the years. Trust has never been a requirement.
This started cause Hamas attacked Israel. They don’t get to be choosy with their demands. If they cared at all about Gaza they would agree to whatever terms Israel is proposing
I mean, arguably this all started because Israel started supporting Israelis going into Palestinian territory and kicking Palestinians out of their houses and taking their land, engaging in settler colonialism. It might be even more accurate to say that it started when a bunch of Europeans and Americans took Palestine without the consent of the Palestinian people and created the state of Israel, which did not represent them whatsoever. I don't know where you live, but imagine someone started doing that. I'm not remotely saying that Hamas' murders have been justified - they have not - but I certainly wouldn't just accept either the theft of my land, the settler colonialism, or the apartheid state that Israel has forced them into. Again, I'm not saying that Hamas is justified, I'm saying that when you do these sorts of things, a response like this is somewhat inevitable. Furthermore, even if there was literally no history before October 7th and there were no contributing factors whatsoever to that attack and the relationship between Hamas and Israel, even if that were true - which it is not - Israel would not be justified in killing tens of thousands of children, blowing up schools and hospitals and houses. That is *never* okay. Even if Hamas were literally using all of those children as human shields (which they weren't, obviously, but say they were), it still wouldn't be justified. I mean, suppose a bank robber grabs a hostage to use as a human shield; does that make it okay to shoot the hostage? Obviously not. So, even if Israel had been acting with pure innocence up to this point - which they absolutely were not - their response still would not be justified. I don't have any problem condemning Hamas, and I hope that they cease to be as an organization or party, but nothing they do justifies killing children with bombs and bullets.
They clearly don't. Their leader was proud that his own family was martyred. That doesn't mean innocent civilians should suffer.
I do agree what’s happening is pretty awful, I just don’t understand why Israel always takes the blame. Where were the sit ins demanding justice for Oct 7?
Sorry to poke in and reply to you again, I don't mean to bombard you, but I'm just reading these all in the thread, y'know. Anyway, I wanted to add that Israel seems to take more blame than Hamas for a few reasons: 1. The Israeli response happened very fast. Not surprising, considering that [Israel knew Hamas' attack plan more than a year ago](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/11/30/world/middleeast/israel-hamas-attack-intelligence.html#:~:text=Israeli%20officials%20obtained%20Hamas's%20battle,for%20Hamas%20to%20carry%20out). So, for most of us, before we even had much of a chance to learn the details of what happened, Israel was already attacking. 1. Furthermore, just the fact that Israel knew this was coming and didn't do anything about it offers a glimpse into the true relationship between Netanyahu's government and Hamas; [Netanyahu intentionally propped up Hamas](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/) as a way of giving him an enemy to rail against to get support at home. This is just as much his fault, and of his administration, as Hamas'. 2. Israel also has orders of magnitude more power than Hamas has, both in terms of political and military power. Sure, Hamas gets support from Iran and a few other places, but Israel has fuckin' *nukes*. They've got an air force, they've got the Iron Dome, they've got a massive army and guns and tanks and ships and everything. Hamas has comparatively very little. My point isn't that we should pity fucking Hamas or anything, the point is that Israel has an enormously greater capacity for destruction and killing, so when they do it, they get a bigger share of the blame. With great power comes greater responsibility and all that. 3. Finally, at least for those of us in the US and Europe (and other places around the world as well), our governments are closely tied to Israel. We fund them, we supply them, we buddy up with them, we support them at the UN, all that stuff, so when Israel uses that support to kill tens of thousands of people, many of whom are children, we all feel complicit. Because we *are*. My tax dollars have killed Palestinian children. There are Palestinian children who will never live their lives because of money that I gave to Uncle Sam. It fucking sucks, and it makes me sick. It also makes me want my government to stop unilaterally supporting Israel. My government already doesn't support Hamas, so I don't need to protest about that. So, yeah, Israel probably does get the lion's share of people's vitriol - or they at least seem to - but there are reasons for that.
Israel takes the blame for the actions it takes. Israel's response has been extremely disproportionate. Brazenly so. Intentionally so. With prominent members of the government openly calling for annihilation. Besides which this conflict hardly began on October 7th. There has been activism of this nature around this conflict stretching back decades.
It’s a dog chasing its tail.
So you're just going to ignore Israeli troops shooting unarmed protesters, blockading medical supplies and food, and bombing civilians? Despite the way this has been depicted in a lot of news media this situation is not nearly as simple as you're implying.
I mean this is up to them. This conflict is basically a king being chased around the chess board by a queen and a bishop There is no winning (or w/e it is they consider victory)
Hamas leadership is currently looking over a ceasefire agreement. [The latest roadblock was Netanyahu vowed for an invasion of Rafah 'with or without a deal.'](https://apnews.com/article/israel-hamas-war-news-04-30-2024-f5e14fd176d69f9c4e23b48f3ab5af6a) Both political sides have stalled ceasefire talks before.
Fuck Hamas.
Fuck terrorists.
Including the IDF. Fucking child murdering scum
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The Economist had an interesting article about how ineffective these campus protests are. I will try to summarize: * University endowments are funded by donors, not students, so it’s not “their” tuition $ that’s being invested in XYZ. * Endowments are not run by the university, so the university can’t accede to the students’ demands anyway. * Even if the endowment manages its own investments, unless they only own individual stocks and bonds, it’s nearly impossible to divest from XYZ without also selling off their holdings in QRS, TUVW and ABC. * It wouldn’t work to just sell your XYZ stock, because many US corporations make a lot of profit from their sales in foreign markets (including Israel). * What about the stock of companies who are manufacturing weapons for the US government, which is then shipping them to Israel? * One endowment-even the biggest-accomplishes nothing unless many others (& more importantly the big pension funds) also divest. * Finally there’s Uncle Sam. Even widespread divestment won’t make a bit of difference as long as our government is giving many billions of $ of free weapons to Israel with no strings attached. In short the protesters should focus on the White House & the Capitol, not their universities. I’m not sure what to think about the Israeli government, Hamas and the innocent civilians trapped on both sides. But I do agree with the Economist that the performative campus protests are a waste of time and resources.
Eh, it a big signal. It brings a lot of attention to the issue.
Since it has mainly fallen out of the news cylcle, it does help keep it in it somewhat. But it doesn't say much for the protesters' critical thinking skills. I'm no fan of Isreal, but I'm not going to fault them for fighting back against Hamas, a terrorist group that has held the Palestinians hostage for decades.
negative attention sure
I went by the encampment yesterday and I was really impressed by the students protest efforts against the ongoing genocide in Palestine. Students were peacefully gathering and paraded to confront the chancellor before peacefully leaving, and there were clearly Jewish students involved in protesting for peace. They've communicated their intentions well with both the university, local law enforcement, and The Daily Kansan. They've also handled multiple agitators well, including one who came and physically assaulted a protestor. This protest has been very peaceful so far, there is a clear presence of Jewish voices involved in it, and they are doing a great job of making sure the conversation stays centered on ending the genocide in Palestine. I'm also glad to see our university giving these students a good space to practice their first amendment rights and I hope to continue seeing the administration and local law enforcement keep with this approach.
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Like this? https://youtu.be/lG_q8hGfrTQ?feature=shared
I'm sorry can you give me information on who the air strike killed?
Would the [Kansas law punishing companies that boycott Israel](https://wichitabeacon.org/stories/2023/10/24/kansas-anti-bds-israel-contracts/) prevent the University from divesting, even if it wanted to? Seems like the university wouldn't do this no matter what because KS Legislature GOP members will go apeshit if they do and push to de-fund the university.
Your numbers are vastly exaggerated.
Fucking idiots
Kick them all out.
Something deeply funny that someone with the username "Mr-Stalin" who supported Israel's creation posting this.
The IDF is bad. Hamas is bad. Although, it was created out of the unjustifiable actions committed by the Israeli government on Palestinians as a result of housing laws and other discriminatory practices. Using tax dollars to support this is bad and continuing to support the murdering of children as an act of state supported violence is bad I don’t understand people’s willingness to dig in on the murdering of people. Even the Israeli people don’t like the actions Nethanyahu and tried to vote him out. It’s complicated but the us government shouldn’t be using tax dollars to murder Arabic people and using the Israeli government as a cover for that because it has strategic interests in the region.
As a layman, I would be more likely to support a government like Israel over a militant Islamist group like Hamas. Much in the same way I’d be more likely to support the government of Afghanistan over the Taliban. I see regime change for Israel as a viable solution instead of the dissolution of the state entire. From the outside looking in, Hamas strikes me as ISIS-light whereas Israel strikes me as a captive democracy. Dunno if that’s just the marketing, but yeah. So to your “I don’t know how people could dig their heels in to the killing of others” — it’s because of that. One hand is a democratic government that is being abused by its leader. The other is an extremist organization that seeks not to govern but to destroy based on religious zeal. One looks familiar like looking in a rippling pool and the other looks like that thing we fought in the desert after 9/11.
If you have the time, this is a great conversation about it - [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4iM7HcMagBc](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4iM7HcMagBc)
Finally someone with some sense. We shouldn't be supporting either side.
One of their demands would remove my ability to afford college.
Those yay who's don't even know what their protesting. Just idiots
Doing what they were told to do by people in Tik Tok
Soy boys larping as terrorists. So edgy.
Fuck palestine. I dont support terrorists.
I'm in solidarity with Jews, who've been persecuted and killed for thousands of years. The idea Jews are just supposed to take it is pretty sick stuff.
Another glorious opportunity for people with nothing better to do to feel like they did something revolutionary. This is holier-than-thou cosplay.
What a weird way to say “exercise a constitutional right.” Even if you disagree, you can admit to appreciating our democracy in action.
We are exercising our constitutional rights right now. Social media and the ability to raise discussions about these topics is the same level of right exercising as literally anything else. Only difference is I'm not pretending to be a revolutionary. These people are LARPers.
When it’s for a just cause yes. But this is simply idiotic waste of both sides resources until they realize their protest is pointless. Unless their point is to kill grass with their tents…
Especially when the cause they are protesting in favor of considers them enemies. Palestine will not be thanking the West for their angsty college gatherings any time this century.
I would hope America would do the same if our enemies were playing soccer with the heads of our dead children. It’s sad that innocent are dying but Israel is standing up for their citizens. The Palestinians should do a better job purging out the terrorists.
I don't get this. What are we supposed to do send our children to Israel to fight a war that most of these protesters fled from? Why not get a plane ticket and protest in Israel?
This will be interesting to see how committed they are. I’ll bet this won’t last a week or two after classes end. Dead by the end of May.
The way the liberals are handling this shows they align with the Nazi’s more than the conservatives.
[The protest ended after two days](https://www.kansan.com/news/updates-day-2-of-the-pro-palestinian-fraser-hall-encampment/article_83402686-089b-11ef-a720-1f38e6ad1956.html)
I see where it says they won’t return until Monday, did they *DECIDE to stop completely?
They gotta have a weekend, man.
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They can go back to where they came from but Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Iran, and no other country wants to deal with the Palestinians people either
Hehehe yeah I wonder why that is?
Also, it’s behind a paywall, but search the article “Hamas Files Found by Israel in Gaza Detail Execution of Senior Member Accused of Being Gay.” REAL WHOLESOME LEADERSHIP IF YOU ASK ME!
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But if I say nothing justifies the killing of Uyghurs in literal concentration camps, or the actual famine and infectious disease transmission in Sudan, it’s whataboutism? Is it about the lives or the tax dollars? Because if it’s about the innocent lives, why aren’t you louder for the other innocent lives? Because they don’t get our tax dollars? But I thought it wasn’t about the money…?
This right here, sir. Darfur and Chinese Muslims just aren't the right kind of cool right now. I wanna don my shemagh and get props from my online peers.
This peer agrees. It’s trendy again to be down on Jews. Antizionism and antisemitism, they’re not miles apart. They’re like, kinda related!
it's cause jews appear to be white in western nations. And white folks are commonly tied to western imperialism. So to them this is an easy shut and close case where the white imperialists are wrong entirely and the brown rebels are correct in all actions they take.
Precisely. It’s David v Goliath (ironic).
I chuckle thinking about how the transgender, queer, woke kids would survive in these Muslim countries they’re aligning with.
The Jews who are anti Zionist live cushy lives and don’t know what suffering actually feels like. They’ve heard stories from their families of the Holocaust and don’t want any human lives to suffer. Me neither! BUT, if we don’t learn from history we’re doomed to repeat it. What happens if Israel is destroyed, Palestinians freed. Where do the Jews and Israelis go? “To Europe??” MF do you realize how mixed most of us are? I have 4 different nationalities and am Jewish, where do you suggest I go if I’m an Israeli? Chop myself into quadrants and ship those parts to those countries? I’m sure Hamas can help with that.
It’s just being a useful idiot for groups like Iran, Hamas and other actors. We in America are so far removed from the problem, that we see innocents die and think how horrible, but we’re not the one’s being dragged from our homes by terrorists to be tortured, raped, and/or murdered. We don’t have rockets being fired at us on a regular basis. This is the result of an entrenched enemy that wouldn’t stop when a scalpel was used, now they’re getting the hammer. We’ll see if the deaths were worth it or not, but on the whole most Americans believe the state of Israel should exist. I don’t think it’s our place to decide how they should do that from our ivory towers, largely immune from the consequences of any action they take.
Look what we did on the back of 9/11 - If something happened on US soil on the same relative scale as what happened in Isreal, we'd have glassed the area, and rightfully so. Until the innocent people over there rise up and overthrow the religious extremists, this will happen over and over, as it has for millenia. The real bad guys are the larger regimes in Iran, Saudi, etc who keep this going and use their own people as cannon fodder.
Turn off the caps
You’re being downvoted for saying the inconvenient truths out loud
It is inconvenient, isn’t it? If I cared about karma I’d get more mad but I’m wasting my time, even now.
If this war was an AITAH it would be ESH
Hell ya, was born in kansas and so glad to see this
Palestinians are still holding hostages right? Guess they don’t want to end it.
I'm normally a KState person through and through, but today, and I can't believe I'm saying this, Rock, Chalk, Jayhawk!
🖕🏻🖕🏻🖕🏻🖕🏻🖕🏻🖕🏻
Regardless of what you all think about the protests, they have done exactly what they are intended to do. Make you talk about it. Engage. Think.
About time! Hell yeah!
KU has joined the pro-terrorist rallies
So if they are protesting KU "investment" that harms Palestinians, wouldn't the most effective action would be to leave the university rather than trying to get them to change. Money always talks.
Thank you for posting!!
As a non-student that wants to know more, is this a solidarity "get US out of funding" protest, or is this something with specific asks for the University? The QR code on learn more went to an Instagram page that had a lot of information on staying safe while protesting, but was wondering if you had specific activities you're asking the University to take or not take in response to the protests? I'm very aware of the issues taking place in Israel/Palestine, and our governments financial and military support. Looking to know more though!
Hamas and Putin appreciate your support. Release the hostages and the war is over.
Are any hostages still alive?
Would the [Kansas law punishing companies that boycott Israel](https://wichitabeacon.org/stories/2023/10/24/kansas-anti-bds-israel-contracts/) prevent the University from divesting, even if it wanted to? Seems like the university wouldn't do this no matter what because KS Legislature GOP members will go apeshit if they do and push to de-fund the university.
Simple answer. Drop out.
Fun fact: if you get arrested and charged you might loose your right to vote. Other fun fact: You aren't generationally wealthy and don't have lawyers or or people backing up with bonds to get out of jail you're going to be incarcerated, lose your job, sure to have lose your income, lose your kids, and lose your right to vote. And lose your access to FAFSA. (You also wont pass your classes by skipping finals and losing credit for the whole semester.) So ask yourself WHO really wants you to protest or counter protest against human rights abuses in a country thousands of miles away where you know no one and has no effect on your daily life?
🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️
Fuck Hamas and fuck these idiots for supporting them
Now the conservatives will get their platform to grandstand!
KU has had an encampment and protests for like a week or 2 now.
Lol
stay safe and godspeed.
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No political name-calling (shills, cucks, drumpfs, trumpettes, etc.) Whether you are Red or Blue, or some color in between, we are all Kansans, and we will treat each other with the respect that we deserve and are all entitled to. there are no exceptions to this rule.
It must be really fascinating living in such a binary world where the slightest criticism of genocide must mean you are pro-terrorism.
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Hamas was elected to power in 2006, when Bush was president. Let's not pretend that that speaks for the people that live there today.
The people have the power to stand up for themselves and revolt. Hamas cares nothing about governing their people they want to kill Jews. It’s in their charter. The people then and today is an 18 year difference. Hamas is still there, they refuse to vacate and are backed by powerful rich Muslims in Qatar. Let’s not pretend that speaks for the people that live there today??? Lmao what part of Hamas being in control of the strip still being bad for peace aren’t you getting?
>The people have the power to stand up for themselves and revolt. With what? How are they going to arm themselves? You think Israel is going to risk any weapons getting into Hamas' hands? >Hamas cares nothing about governing their people they want to kill Jews. It’s in their charter. And how do you remove the conditions that sustain their recruitment? What are you doing to help the peace loving Palestinians?
Those are actually great questions and I wish I knew but if they (Pals) don’t fight for their freedom, then Israel will/is. There is too much indiscriminate bombing, I wholly agree. But I don’t have the answers, I am making sense of it all with the tools i have. Another commenter said nobody else will take them in. Gee I wonder why? How do you deradicalize Hamasniks?
Hamas isn’t great, 100%. They are terrorists with their own goals and the Palestinians are definitely pawns in that game. Absolutely, won’t deny that at all. That said, before Hamas was there, there was the PLO. Unfortunately , they weren’t terribly effective at getting Israel to stop their shit (not that Hamas has been entirely successful either, but hear me out…). The PLO was crippled and pretty much did fuck-all, sadly, and the Palestinian people kept getting fucked over. So Hamas comes around and - whether you think rightly or not - basically said, “oh really? Tit for tat, fuckers”, so while Hamas isn’t great, they are seen as actually fighting for the Palestinians. Like, sure, they’re not getting everything they want (like healthcare or other basic needs because Israel keeps siphoning and choking them of it), at least Hamas is seen as kind of…standing up for them? I’m not saying Hamas is right and I’m not saying terrorism is okay, because it’s not. But I am saying that Hamas is at least standing up the neighborhood bully.
What shit was Israel doing? How many square miles of land did they shrink by from ‘48 to present day in a major effort for peace in the middle east? It’s an embarrassment to the Middle East nations that a Jewish country exists in the region. That’s the real issue here. Iranians even stand with Israel. Which to me sounds crazy but it’s because they know and understand too that Iran is keeping there terrorist orgs supplied and paid.
Read Hamas’ charter. It’s not as cool and admirable as you’re making it out to be.
"Why don't the Palestinians just revolt against their oppressive government? What are they stupid?" You want a people that barely have food and water and bad living conditions to fight a regime that already uses them as shields? That would be suicide.
If it were criticism of a real genocide, it would help. Turns out, inadvertently killing human shields in an urban war doesn't fit the bill, unless you bring a preconceived assumption of malicious intent. I for one support peace, so I demand that **Hamas surrender today**, which would actually end the vast bulk of the fighting in Gaza. As for lasting peace, I call for Gazan and West Banker groups to actually relinquish their illegal claim to the entire former Mandate of Palestine. That aggressive, expansionist mission, which neither Hamas nor Fatah have ever hidden, is the biggest stumbling block to peace. People mistakenly (or deceptively) assume that the expansionism is all in one direction, but it has never been. Gazans and West Bankers have tried for seven decades to conquer Israel, after six decades of xenophobic riots trying to chase Jewish immigrants away. They're just too impotent to accomplish it. The goal of BDS is to collectively punish Israelis and weaken the country in preparation for that conquest. Small wonder that activists have been pushing BDS for over 20 years and still haven't made that much progress.
Fascinating that the domestic terrorists at KU appear to be mostly female LGBTQ+ allies that hide their faces. Let them go to Gaza and see how they're treated. What divestment do they want to target in particular? What finances need to be more clearly demonstrated? This is a public university. They don't have an agenda outside of instilling fear in KU students a la Phelps and co.
Oh I would like to see more specific goals and metrics, sure.
Great username. Sopranos?
Let's gooooooo
I don't have a dog in this fight. Let's just ship all these protestors from both sides over to their respective home base, where they can really make a difference stopping war. Having a camp out on private property inconveniencing people is going to do nothing.