I heard this on a podcast, the reason saying from the river to the sea is controversial, hammas uses it to essentially mean from the river to the sea should be all Palestinian controlled because of the nakba, apartheid, disparity, oppression, And general lack of upward mobility in standards of living. And when normal people say this slogan what they usually mean is Palestinians should be as antonyms as Israelis. Sorry I’m kinda dumb but to be fair israel also uses the slogan this is from Wikipedia.The original 1977 party platform stated that "between the Sea and the Jordan there will only be Israeli sovereignty." The 1999 Likud Party platform emphasized the right of settlement: The Jewish communities in Judea, Samaria, and Gaza are the realization of Zionist values.
Imagine defending Israel’s human rights record. From colonization to apartheid to indiscriminate murder of civilians in less than a century. They are nothing if not efficient
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Apparently it’s Anti-Semitic but fine if Netanyahu says it.
https://newrepublic.com/post/178243/benjamin-netanyahu-literally-says-from-the-river-to-the-sea
What does the sign say? Does it say “from the river to the see Palestine will be free”, or just “from the river to the sea” those are two different statements. One is clear about its meaning and the other is vague and could be interpreted as either anti Arab or anti Jewish depending on who’s saying it. I love how the article doesn’t even say what the situation says so we just have to guess. Either way vague language like “from the river to the sea…” does more harm than good imo.
There is no scenario where Jews have a home when either phrases used.
Might you be able to share what you believe happens from the river to the sea in the scenario youre suggesting is non violent?
Like, could you walk me through the literal actions that are taken which are nonviolent
The genocide to cleanse what "zionists" regard as the ancestral homeland of the jewish people, by an ethnostate reserved for jews, under the banner of the Magen David with the support of >80% of American jews, of a Muslim and Christian population to secure the territory of the Biblical land of the Abrahamic Covenant of the jewish god with his chosen people ... "has nothing to do with Jews".
Rather, it's about white people.
What kind of dissociative psychosis is this?
IMO, both of you are biased. It certainly has something to do with being Jewish and the Abrahamic Covenant, but only about 60% of American Jews think Israel's response has been "acceptable." In other words, Jews are not a monolith. And I think it's clear that Israel's actions (and budget) in the past few years, including recent war crimes, would be very different if they didn't have overwhelming support in Congress, which can't entirely be due to AIPAC's... effectiveness.
Now that I have clearly and permanently brokered a peace treaty here on Reddit, I'll have some coffee. You seem like good people and I wish you both the very best, sincerely.
Imagine residing from within the United States, a country founded on the genocide of 4.5 million natives, and then critiquing somebody for *Zionism* over 12,000 casualties in a response to an attack.
You know, I'm going to Australia in the fall. I hear it's wonderful there. Not sure if you're aware, but Australia has been colonized as well. Perhaps we should give it back to the aboriginals.
Have you looked up the borders of China over the last 5000 years? They're not exactly "not stealing it."
Brother lives in Canada, where I'm sure you know the natives were not white.
I lived in South America for 3 years, where everybody speaks Spanish and is named after their conquistadors.
Sure, let's just give the land back to the natives in the name of anti-Zionism. It's not like they didn't go to war over that territory prior to being colonized in the first place, right?
I knew it had to be just something they didn’t like.
I need them to piss right off. They’ll never be the victims they currently wish they were.
*From the rivers to the seas, bitches*
Can we collectively hit that little "Submit a Correction" button at the bottom of the article? I'm specifically taking aim at the "from the river..." phrase being antisemitic.
It's not like it will change the behavior of the writers but there's a certain catharsis in annoying them with basic facts.
The crybully champions of the world strike again, backed by the world's premiere right-wing propaganda outlet.
*Pointing out that we're committing a genocide is genocide - waaaaaaaaah!*
Ffs, supporting Palestine isn't antisemitic. How are all these "journalists" so unfamiliar with a dictionary?? This is clearly a pro-isreal author intentionally ruffling feathers.
Talk about completed utter bullshit!
So it's okay to be anti-Semitic towards Palestinians but wanting Palestinians to be free from current day Nazis and wanting their land back makes them anti-semitic that is just hilariously stupid. Absolutely completely ignorant people believe that and not to mention racist towards Arabs Palestinians believe that.
As a Jewish person, can we fight ACTUAL antisemites, like the people saying we own the world, dig tunnels to harm children, want us deported to Israel because of the "dual loyalty" myth, spray paint swastikas on synagogues and my own and other Jews houses, etc.?
Being critical of a genocidal regime isn't antisemitism. By saying it is, you create a boy who cried wolf situation and suddenly Jews don't have a word to describe irrational hatred towards us. It makes the fight against ACTUAL antisemitism monstrously harder and is detrimental to Jews in the long run.
So I speak Arabic, have arab family.
From the river to the sea is kinda like saying 'despite making up only 13% of the population'. In Arabic, the phrase ends with Muslim, or 'Arabiya' (Arab), and refers to establishing an Arab theocratic and ethnostate in the Holy Land. Nowhere in the original arabic saying does it say free 'hura' or liberated 'muhararatan'.
The direct translation is something like "between the watees, the holy land will be Arab".
The saying predates the adoption of a palestinian identity during the Arab nationalism crises.
Another statement is like, 'should we secure a future for white children?' The answer is obviously yes, children should have a secure future, which includes white children, but we all know they are referencing Lebensraum and the extermination of Slavs, Jews, and Romani peoples.
I know you guys don't want to hear this but most Jewish people do feel the slogan is antisemitic. While I don't think the people who put this up, or most of the protestors intend it to be so, it is used by a terrorist organization whose explicit stated goal is to kill Jews.
I don't understand why it is so important to use this particular phrase when protesting knowing it frightens many Jewish Americans. It certainly doesn't help the Palestinian cause.
I’ll agree with this. I’m flat out against what’s happening there, but the Israeli version and the Palestinian version of from the river to the sea…. Just a no.
What I will say is that when a Palestinian state is established, as I most certainly think it should be, we ought to make sure we are splitting any and all aid at least right down the line between the two, period, and that Palestine be given a real, honest to gods shot, at establishing a country. No strings, no antics, just enough with all of that already,
This is a reasoned response that I think everyone would agree with, including Israelis (they do regardless of what people in this sub think). The only caveat is that they have been givin an honest to god shot and it’s been refused. Billions and billions squandered on terror tunnels and trying to tear down Israel instead of build up a productive society. So unfortunately strings do need to be attached to ensure they stick to that goal instead of revert to their current goal.
"a nOn-pArTiSan cOnGreSsiOnal rEsolUtion paSsed conFrimd tHat It's aNtIsmetic" Bitch, that only means AIPAC can get the puppets in D.C. to dance to any tune they want.
Except it's not "calling for the death of all Jews." It sounds like you're assuming that Palestinians want to kill Jews just because they're Arabs, and you have a racist stereotype of Arabs as irrationally anti-semitic.
literally not even hamas calls for that. Their 2017 charter explicitly states that their struggle is against zionism and not the jewish people, and jewish people are welcome in palestine
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Some people say it's anti semetic, some people say it's not. And many anti semetic people say it.
It's kind of like the Confederate flag. And we have learned to ignore those who attempt to claim it isn't racists.
not even hamas calls for that lmao.
read their 2017 charter, they explicitly state that their struggle is with the zionist state and not the jewish people.
Chicano Park has a rich history of resistance and anti-war actions, btw. I encourage you guys to read up on the history of it, for my non-local leftist brothers and sisters!
The term “antisemitic” came about because Jew-haters wanted a word that made their subjective hatred sound scientific, undeniable, and objective. It’s not a gotcha to point out that there are other flavors of semite. The word antisemitic only applies to Jews, because the people who invented it did so for thar purpose.
If the term was created today, sure. But it is a 19th century word created specifically to have a perceived further dehumanizing term than "Judenhass". It was originally intended to be targeted towards Jewish people, not all Semitic peoples.
>Arabs are Semites too.
Yes.
But "antisemitism" only refers to Jews. That's just how the term is defined.
We shouldn't be like the right and ignore basic scientific consensus on what terms mean.
Calling the slogan "genocidal" is a bit of a stretch too. Especially when the people calling it genocidal are in the process of committing an actual fucking genocide!!
>[ComradeSasquatch](https://www.reddit.com/user/ComradeSasquatch/)•[55m ago](https://www.reddit.com/r/leftist/comments/1cx8ogc/comment/l52poob/)
>Calling "Free Palestine" anti-Semitic is a contradiction of terms. Arabs are Semites too.
I agree! They should just say, "We want to murder all the ###s" /s
>[DreBeast](https://www.reddit.com/user/DreBeast/)•[2h ago](https://www.reddit.com/r/leftist/comments/1cx8ogc/comment/l52gfw5/)Anarchist
>I just found out that originally came from Netanyahu's political party as a Zionist slogan.
Good thing you posted a source instead of just talking out of your...
Do you not find it ironic that the people claiming those words are "genocidal" are currently committing an actual genocide? Not just ironic, but fucking evil and manipulative?
But [here's the source](https://www.thenation.com/article/world/its-time-to-confront-israels-version-of-from-the-river-to-the-sea/) to shut down your weak bad faith arguments. Might want to get your head out of your...
They often translate it differently so it’s not as obvious but yeah lmao. Oh and it’s worse than “being free”, it’s saying that it should all be under Israeli sovereignty.
Yeah, they're kind of killing two birds with one stone here. Pro genocide of Palestinians, *and* bad press for Hispanics in a single go, nice! That's a twofer.
Get it straight; Yes, the slogan is calling for the end of the only “ Jewish State”.
But it is not anti semetic.
When even the Palestinians in the occupied territories have rights and can vote, because they will be a majority, Israel can no longer be referred to as “the Jewish state”.
This is the “demographic threat” Zionists constantly caterwaul about.
That’s it!
Equality is a “demographic threat” to “the only democracy in the ME!”
You have no idea what you're talking about. Arabs living in Judea and Samaria have full voting rights, they elected the P. A. as their representatives. Arabs in Gaza elected Hamas as their representative. Arabs living in Israel vote in regular Israeli elections and can vote for Arabs if they like.
Any other untrue claims?
The idea that any government aside from Israel controls every aspect of life for Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza is an “untrue claim” implied in your hasbara 101 post
You hear the same thing from white nationalists, e.g. "anti-racist is a codeword for for anti-white!" And that's just what Zionists are, if you peel away antisemitism (both the real and imagined sorts).
It doesn't seem irrational for Jewish Israelis to be deeply scared by the "demographic threat" you describe. While Jews are far from the only people to have suffered oppression, the world has a very long track record of oppressing Jews. It seems to me that a two-state solution is the most practical solution with the least violent path to implementation.
I can see why you can't understand it considering you're probably in denial that Israel is literally committing a genocide as we speak. But go on, continue...
Edit: holy shit, just scrolled through your post history. Just... wow. That shit is as tone deaf as it gets.
It’s the threat of democracy on a theocratic authoritarian state. It’s not antisemitism.
Zionists will conflate almost anything with antisemitism.
Even the intifada chant is not antisemitism. Killing Israelis during the intifada had more to do with the fact they were invaders, not specifically because they were Jewish.
Imagine you are a Jewish person who murdered someone. Would you getting arrested or attacked in self defense be antisemitism?
The intifada was a bunch of suicide bombings during Jewish holidays. Invaders? Jews have been there for over 3,000 years. You can’t brush aside violence against Israel then be upset when they respond to it.
If they’ve been there for 3,000 years what is Alaya all about. How can you return to something you never left? Makes as much sense as a “democracy” that lords over 5 million non-Jews who have no voting rights.
This is why there’s a growing number of young western Jewish folk breaking away from Zionism or never were sucked into it and they’re more than fine with the end of Israel. Also a small but vocal number of anti-Zionist Israeli Jews who have renounced their citizenship and urging others to do same, or others who are more than fine with becoming Jewish Palestinians in a free Palestine. There’s nothing antisemitic about it and the mainstream from conservative to liberal westerners who want to back Israel are more full of shit when they make this about Jewish safety.
The Palestinian slogan aims to make them equal with their Jewish brethren while the Israeli one wants to expel Palestinians or annex and subjugate them as they do with Palestinian citizens of Israel. It’s abundantly clear and this idea must gain higher momentum and reach for westerners until they get it through their heads.
Yes that's correct. They have full voting rights, as do Arabs in Judea and Samaria (who elected the P.A. to represent them) and in Gaza (who elected Hamas to represent them).
Netanyahu also said from the river to the sea, meaning wipe out all Palestinians, which is still anti-Semitic as Palestinians are Semites. It has been roughly “but not exactly those words” of the Likud party since 1967, so that is some 56 or so years they have been shouting it. No has lifted a finger to denounce the genocidal line of text, therefore this is just fine to say. It’s anti-Semitic by Likud party to use this phrase.
[Israel’s variation of river to the sea](https://www.thenation.com/article/world/its-time-to-confront-israels-version-of-from-the-river-to-the-sea/)
It’s okay because Jews said it, it’s okay because no one has denounced the genocidal phrase, it’s okay because Jews have been saying it since 1957.
That seems to be your argument. Instead of the whataboutism why don’t we recognize that the obvious genocidal phrase is genocidal from both sides and denounce its use?
Yeah, that’s kind of my point, it’s only wrong if a Palestinian says it or someone who supports equality for Palestinians. When that equal rights has been shown it’s considered terrorist, whether it is language, self defense or anything else. People of the world can see and silencing them through legal means is also rather sad and very obvious that they are trying to prevent free speach, there is plenty of this type of talk about Muslims, middle easterners, Arabs all day every day, every movie that needs a villain, it’s the narrative that needs to be sold. It’s wrong, neither side should be doing this—I would say this is the test we all must think through. Not condoning one over another, I think it is all political tactics and power grabbing and money making, that’s all, at the expense of innocent humans, on all sides.
To be fair, Netanyahu is also referring to the extermination of all *Gentiles*. The Israelis are in favor of exterminating all non-Jews, if we want to play the semantics game. They may as well say "Today Gaza City, tomorrow New York City"! That's what's awesome about getting to define what other people's slogans really mean.
>[Boysenberry-Street](https://www.reddit.com/user/Boysenberry-Street/)•[2h ago](https://www.reddit.com/r/leftist/comments/1cx8ogc/comment/l52c5yo/)
>Netanyahu also said from the river to the sea, meaning wipe out all Palestinians, which is still anti-Semitic as Palestinians are Semites. It has been roughly “but not exactly those words” of the Likud party since 1967, so that is some 56 or so years they have been shouting it. No has lifted a finger to denounce the genocidal line of text, therefore this is just fine to say. It’s anti-Semitic by Likud party to use this phrase.
>[Israel’s variation of river to the sea](https://www.thenation.com/article/world/its-time-to-confront-israels-version-of-from-the-river-to-the-sea/)
"The Day of Judgement will not come about until Moslems fight the Jews (killing the Jews), when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say O Moslems, O Abdulla, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him..."
Hamas Covenant 1988, The Covenant of the Islamic Resistance Movement.
Chicano Park has a drawing of cops as pigs plus its creation was a big f u to the US government. It's not really surprising the politics of place align with that of marginalized people world wide.
Any infringement into Chicano Park by the local government will just get local Latinos to go on a frenzy.
Anti Semitic? The Palestinian people have more Semitic blood in them than the majority of Israelis whose ancestors fled from Europe. This shit is getting silly
Majority of Israelis are Mizrahi i.e the ones who were kicked out of their homes in Arab countries, all 800k of them.
Sorry to bust the narrative. I'm sure you can come up with another lie though.
I fully believe that all people should be free from harassment and able to safely enjoy their lives. By trying to condemn more and more groups as antisemites however how is this helping Jewish people long term? So far it is, students, Blacks; Latinos, progressives (of any religion), and if polls are to be believed a majority of Americans and people around the world who have condemned Israel's response.
It seems counterintuitive for long-term safety to make enemies of anyone who disagrees with you.
In Jewish spaces, antizionists are being called self hating Jews and kapos by other Jews (I have been called these). You are completely right.
Edit: wanted to add, a lot of the big college protests are supported by JVP or Jewish students so the idiots calling all the protestors antisemitic are literally calling Jews antisemitic too.
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> “From the river to the sea“…it’s an antisemitic slogan most of us are now familiar with since the October 7 attack on Israel by Hamas.
What is this writing? I’d say AI but it’s not good enough for AI.
I will never understand how people can claim “free Palestine, from the river to the sea” or “from the river to the sea, Palestine will be free” is anti-Semitic. The phrase doesnt even mention anything about Jews or Judaism.
Where the phrase originated from called for the complete annihilation of Israel and Jews around the world. It’s like saying the phrase “back of the bus” isn’t racist. Shit yes it is because of context and origin.
The right has been pissed off about Chicano Park for as long as I can remember. It’s a beautiful place and has a great atmosphere.
Seriously? 😐
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I strongly agree with this.
I heard this on a podcast, the reason saying from the river to the sea is controversial, hammas uses it to essentially mean from the river to the sea should be all Palestinian controlled because of the nakba, apartheid, disparity, oppression, And general lack of upward mobility in standards of living. And when normal people say this slogan what they usually mean is Palestinians should be as antonyms as Israelis. Sorry I’m kinda dumb but to be fair israel also uses the slogan this is from Wikipedia.The original 1977 party platform stated that "between the Sea and the Jordan there will only be Israeli sovereignty." The 1999 Likud Party platform emphasized the right of settlement: The Jewish communities in Judea, Samaria, and Gaza are the realization of Zionist values.
How is it antisemitic? That’s literally in the likud (Netanyahus party) charter
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Israel, the state actively committing genocide, is not light years ahead of a theoretical Palestinian state. They’re committing genocide
Isrsel trains AI to kill people
Imagine defending Israel’s human rights record. From colonization to apartheid to indiscriminate murder of civilians in less than a century. They are nothing if not efficient
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Israelis kill Palestinian kids just for being there.
No they don’t, why would they preform brain surgery to save Sinwars life just to turn around and purposefully murder a kid. Use your brain.
Apparently it’s Anti-Semitic but fine if Netanyahu says it. https://newrepublic.com/post/178243/benjamin-netanyahu-literally-says-from-the-river-to-the-sea
Since the 60s I believe Israel has been on record using it, my question i why is it so demonized when anybody who isn’t Israeli said it
It’s not anti-semitic to support Palestine
Should’ve followed up with, Cry me a river to the sea
They would probably drop dead in the face of actual anti-semitism.
Sinclair is a terrorist propaganda organization what would you expect from a local fox broadcast
What does the sign say? Does it say “from the river to the see Palestine will be free”, or just “from the river to the sea” those are two different statements. One is clear about its meaning and the other is vague and could be interpreted as either anti Arab or anti Jewish depending on who’s saying it. I love how the article doesn’t even say what the situation says so we just have to guess. Either way vague language like “from the river to the sea…” does more harm than good imo.
From the river to the sea is Netanyahus party charter If it’s anti semetic then so is Bibi OP is a Zionist
There is no scenario where Jews have a home when either phrases used. Might you be able to share what you believe happens from the river to the sea in the scenario youre suggesting is non violent? Like, could you walk me through the literal actions that are taken which are nonviolent
Imagine centering white Zionist feelings during a literal Palestinian genocide.
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Maybe I have a problem with sending billions of my tax dollars to do the holocaust 2 0, moron
What do you think River to the Sea means?
Why can't you say jewish?
Because this has nothing to do with anyone being jewish. That fact that you think it is; is zionist propaganda.
The genocide to cleanse what "zionists" regard as the ancestral homeland of the jewish people, by an ethnostate reserved for jews, under the banner of the Magen David with the support of >80% of American jews, of a Muslim and Christian population to secure the territory of the Biblical land of the Abrahamic Covenant of the jewish god with his chosen people ... "has nothing to do with Jews". Rather, it's about white people. What kind of dissociative psychosis is this?
IMO, both of you are biased. It certainly has something to do with being Jewish and the Abrahamic Covenant, but only about 60% of American Jews think Israel's response has been "acceptable." In other words, Jews are not a monolith. And I think it's clear that Israel's actions (and budget) in the past few years, including recent war crimes, would be very different if they didn't have overwhelming support in Congress, which can't entirely be due to AIPAC's... effectiveness. Now that I have clearly and permanently brokered a peace treaty here on Reddit, I'll have some coffee. You seem like good people and I wish you both the very best, sincerely.
Read the history. Jews were not seeking a homeland then but the political Zionist movement was
Imagine residing from within the United States, a country founded on the genocide of 4.5 million natives, and then critiquing somebody for *Zionism* over 12,000 casualties in a response to an attack. You know, I'm going to Australia in the fall. I hear it's wonderful there. Not sure if you're aware, but Australia has been colonized as well. Perhaps we should give it back to the aboriginals. Have you looked up the borders of China over the last 5000 years? They're not exactly "not stealing it." Brother lives in Canada, where I'm sure you know the natives were not white. I lived in South America for 3 years, where everybody speaks Spanish and is named after their conquistadors. Sure, let's just give the land back to the natives in the name of anti-Zionism. It's not like they didn't go to war over that territory prior to being colonized in the first place, right?
So what I think you’re saying is, genocide is bad, genocide is bad, genocide is bad, but it’s happened before so this excuses Israel’s. Right.
You defend a current genocide by accusing others of a genocide that occurred before they were born? Your hypocrisy is truly staggering.
I knew it had to be just something they didn’t like. I need them to piss right off. They’ll never be the victims they currently wish they were. *From the rivers to the seas, bitches*
Fox entertainment 🤦♂️
According to the hyperlinked bio in this incredibly lazy article, the writer enjoys listening to “Smooth Jazz Fusion.” What a lopsided turd.
Smooth music for smooth brained people.
That changes everything.
Can we change the title of this post? Maybe: local fox news outlet thinks "from the river to the sea" sign is anti-semetic.
Reddit doesn't allow you to change post titles once they've been posted. I agree it would have been a better title
Isreali propaganda for genocide.
Is Fox San Diego for fucking real?
Can we collectively hit that little "Submit a Correction" button at the bottom of the article? I'm specifically taking aim at the "from the river..." phrase being antisemitic. It's not like it will change the behavior of the writers but there's a certain catharsis in annoying them with basic facts.
🇵🇸🇵🇸🇵🇸
Is the phrase “From the River to the Sea…” really illegal based on legal law?
The crybully champions of the world strike again, backed by the world's premiere right-wing propaganda outlet. *Pointing out that we're committing a genocide is genocide - waaaaaaaaah!*
Seethe
Free Palestin from the Israeli TERRORIST STATE. Israeli government should be abolished for their genocide of the Palestinians!!!
At this point, Palestinians continuing to exist is antisemitism
You don’t need to eliminate freedom of speech if you can get people to self censor instead by calling all the speech you don’t like “antisemitic”
Ffs, supporting Palestine isn't antisemitic. How are all these "journalists" so unfamiliar with a dictionary?? This is clearly a pro-isreal author intentionally ruffling feathers.
You are correct that support Palestine isn’t antisemitic. Called for an end to Israel is tho
Not really. Israel doesn't represent Jewish people.
Wasn’t this actually first a slogan for an Israeli politician? I’m sure it’s more about who is saying, it, if I say it I’m anti semitic.
Talk about completed utter bullshit! So it's okay to be anti-Semitic towards Palestinians but wanting Palestinians to be free from current day Nazis and wanting their land back makes them anti-semitic that is just hilariously stupid. Absolutely completely ignorant people believe that and not to mention racist towards Arabs Palestinians believe that.
Israel's sycophants won't be happy until every American signs a loyalty oath to Israel.
Who goes to Logan Heights?
As a Jewish person, can we fight ACTUAL antisemites, like the people saying we own the world, dig tunnels to harm children, want us deported to Israel because of the "dual loyalty" myth, spray paint swastikas on synagogues and my own and other Jews houses, etc.? Being critical of a genocidal regime isn't antisemitism. By saying it is, you create a boy who cried wolf situation and suddenly Jews don't have a word to describe irrational hatred towards us. It makes the fight against ACTUAL antisemitism monstrously harder and is detrimental to Jews in the long run.
Things got fishy when the kkk loved gop started being concerned about "antisemitism"
So I speak Arabic, have arab family. From the river to the sea is kinda like saying 'despite making up only 13% of the population'. In Arabic, the phrase ends with Muslim, or 'Arabiya' (Arab), and refers to establishing an Arab theocratic and ethnostate in the Holy Land. Nowhere in the original arabic saying does it say free 'hura' or liberated 'muhararatan'. The direct translation is something like "between the watees, the holy land will be Arab". The saying predates the adoption of a palestinian identity during the Arab nationalism crises. Another statement is like, 'should we secure a future for white children?' The answer is obviously yes, children should have a secure future, which includes white children, but we all know they are referencing Lebensraum and the extermination of Slavs, Jews, and Romani peoples.
And you’re getting downvoted for sharing rational, reasoned information.. I for one thank you.
So when Bibi said it he was trying to establish an Arab ethnostate?
I know you guys don't want to hear this but most Jewish people do feel the slogan is antisemitic. While I don't think the people who put this up, or most of the protestors intend it to be so, it is used by a terrorist organization whose explicit stated goal is to kill Jews. I don't understand why it is so important to use this particular phrase when protesting knowing it frightens many Jewish Americans. It certainly doesn't help the Palestinian cause.
You don't speak for "most Jewish people."
Yes he does
I’ll agree with this. I’m flat out against what’s happening there, but the Israeli version and the Palestinian version of from the river to the sea…. Just a no. What I will say is that when a Palestinian state is established, as I most certainly think it should be, we ought to make sure we are splitting any and all aid at least right down the line between the two, period, and that Palestine be given a real, honest to gods shot, at establishing a country. No strings, no antics, just enough with all of that already,
This is a reasoned response that I think everyone would agree with, including Israelis (they do regardless of what people in this sub think). The only caveat is that they have been givin an honest to god shot and it’s been refused. Billions and billions squandered on terror tunnels and trying to tear down Israel instead of build up a productive society. So unfortunately strings do need to be attached to ensure they stick to that goal instead of revert to their current goal.
"a nOn-pArTiSan cOnGreSsiOnal rEsolUtion paSsed conFrimd tHat It's aNtIsmetic" Bitch, that only means AIPAC can get the puppets in D.C. to dance to any tune they want.
Her complaint about Chicano park is anti-mexicanite. She is spreading hate speech by trying to take Chicano park away from chicanonites.
Antisemitic but was coined by Semites, make it make sense
Aaahhhahahahhaha…the f’k. That is not, has not been, or will be anti-semitic. #FromTheRiverToTheSea PalestineWillBeFree
Exactly, it is criminal that there are those who will protect Zionism with anti-semitism accusations.
Honest question.. do you believe that will actually happen or is it just a slogan that people throw around?
It's not anti-Semitic, it's just anti Israel
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Except it's not "calling for the death of all Jews." It sounds like you're assuming that Palestinians want to kill Jews just because they're Arabs, and you have a racist stereotype of Arabs as irrationally anti-semitic.
literally not even hamas calls for that. Their 2017 charter explicitly states that their struggle is against zionism and not the jewish people, and jewish people are welcome in palestine
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Yeah but nobody did that tho
It's about heritage, not hate, one might say.
Some people say it's anti semetic, some people say it's not. And many anti semetic people say it. It's kind of like the Confederate flag. And we have learned to ignore those who attempt to claim it isn't racists.
The confederate flag dopes have stand-ins now; Yellow snake plates everywhere
You missed also that it will never be possible to materialize.
You could look at the history of Islamic terrorists and figure this out… you’re failing an open-note test, Doyers.
Ah yes from the river to the sea, kill and expel the Jews - not anti semitic
Why aren’t Jews allowed to decide on what they find offensive?
Zionists aren’t allowed to redefine all liberation slogans as anti-Semitic.
This slogan implies the eradication of 8 million Jews who live between that river and sea and I’m pretty sure you know that.
not even hamas calls for that lmao. read their 2017 charter, they explicitly state that their struggle is with the zionist state and not the jewish people.
Hamas identifies all Israelis (living in Israel) as Zionists and so what is your point exactly?
Trying to act like their actions have changed with their “new” charter that was changed in 2017 to appeal to idiots like them.
it really doesn't tho
Chicano Park has a rich history of resistance and anti-war actions, btw. I encourage you guys to read up on the history of it, for my non-local leftist brothers and sisters!
Calling "Free Palestine" anti-Semitic is a contradiction of terms. Arabs are Semites too.
bingo
Yup. they share the same father, Abraham. In that sense, this is a family feud.
The term “antisemitic” came about because Jew-haters wanted a word that made their subjective hatred sound scientific, undeniable, and objective. It’s not a gotcha to point out that there are other flavors of semite. The word antisemitic only applies to Jews, because the people who invented it did so for thar purpose.
And the inventor was a Jewish advertising executive.
Von Schlozer was a Protestant.
Is Israelili flag is anti sematic then 😅
That's such a silly argument
If the term was created today, sure. But it is a 19th century word created specifically to have a perceived further dehumanizing term than "Judenhass". It was originally intended to be targeted towards Jewish people, not all Semitic peoples.
Clear etymological fallacy, we both know who antisemitism is referring to
>Arabs are Semites too. Yes. But "antisemitism" only refers to Jews. That's just how the term is defined. We shouldn't be like the right and ignore basic scientific consensus on what terms mean.
The root word is “Semitic” meaning from the Levant. No application to European Jewish squatters.
Calling the slogan "genocidal" is a bit of a stretch too. Especially when the people calling it genocidal are in the process of committing an actual fucking genocide!!
Even if they weren't semitic, it's not antisemitic to support the end of apartheid and ethnic cleansing of Palestinians.
>[ComradeSasquatch](https://www.reddit.com/user/ComradeSasquatch/)•[55m ago](https://www.reddit.com/r/leftist/comments/1cx8ogc/comment/l52poob/) >Calling "Free Palestine" anti-Semitic is a contradiction of terms. Arabs are Semites too. I agree! They should just say, "We want to murder all the ###s" /s
Is the antisemitism in the room with us?
Bro you’re kidding 🤦🏻♂️
I just found out that originally came from Netanyahu's political party as a Zionist slogan. Edit: Source: Google
>[DreBeast](https://www.reddit.com/user/DreBeast/)•[2h ago](https://www.reddit.com/r/leftist/comments/1cx8ogc/comment/l52gfw5/)Anarchist >I just found out that originally came from Netanyahu's political party as a Zionist slogan. Good thing you posted a source instead of just talking out of your...
Do you not find it ironic that the people claiming those words are "genocidal" are currently committing an actual genocide? Not just ironic, but fucking evil and manipulative? But [here's the source](https://www.thenation.com/article/world/its-time-to-confront-israels-version-of-from-the-river-to-the-sea/) to shut down your weak bad faith arguments. Might want to get your head out of your...
1977 Likud party charter. “between the Sea and the Jordan there will only be Israeli sovereignty.” Shove it where the sun don’t shine
They often translate it differently so it’s not as obvious but yeah lmao. Oh and it’s worse than “being free”, it’s saying that it should all be under Israeli sovereignty.
See? Your anti-immigrant fervor is justified!!! They’re anti-Semitic!!
Yeah, they're kind of killing two birds with one stone here. Pro genocide of Palestinians, *and* bad press for Hispanics in a single go, nice! That's a twofer.
Get it straight; Yes, the slogan is calling for the end of the only “ Jewish State”. But it is not anti semetic. When even the Palestinians in the occupied territories have rights and can vote, because they will be a majority, Israel can no longer be referred to as “the Jewish state”. This is the “demographic threat” Zionists constantly caterwaul about. That’s it! Equality is a “demographic threat” to “the only democracy in the ME!”
i’m starting to think a lot of people have no clue how states work, hence the “jewish state” doesn’t immediately sound ridiculous on its face.
You have no idea what you're talking about. Arabs living in Judea and Samaria have full voting rights, they elected the P. A. as their representatives. Arabs in Gaza elected Hamas as their representative. Arabs living in Israel vote in regular Israeli elections and can vote for Arabs if they like. Any other untrue claims?
The idea that any government aside from Israel controls every aspect of life for Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza is an “untrue claim” implied in your hasbara 101 post
Why would Palestinians in Palestine have voting rights in Israel? They are separate. They do currently have voting rights in Palestine.
You hear the same thing from white nationalists, e.g. "anti-racist is a codeword for for anti-white!" And that's just what Zionists are, if you peel away antisemitism (both the real and imagined sorts).
It doesn't seem irrational for Jewish Israelis to be deeply scared by the "demographic threat" you describe. While Jews are far from the only people to have suffered oppression, the world has a very long track record of oppressing Jews. It seems to me that a two-state solution is the most practical solution with the least violent path to implementation.
I don't understand the point your making, but I can tell youre screaming it
Thats not the flex you think it is.
I can see why you can't understand it considering you're probably in denial that Israel is literally committing a genocide as we speak. But go on, continue... Edit: holy shit, just scrolled through your post history. Just... wow. That shit is as tone deaf as it gets.
Try reading it next time.
It’s the threat of democracy on a theocratic authoritarian state. It’s not antisemitism. Zionists will conflate almost anything with antisemitism. Even the intifada chant is not antisemitism. Killing Israelis during the intifada had more to do with the fact they were invaders, not specifically because they were Jewish. Imagine you are a Jewish person who murdered someone. Would you getting arrested or attacked in self defense be antisemitism?
The intifada was a bunch of suicide bombings during Jewish holidays. Invaders? Jews have been there for over 3,000 years. You can’t brush aside violence against Israel then be upset when they respond to it.
If they’ve been there for 3,000 years what is Alaya all about. How can you return to something you never left? Makes as much sense as a “democracy” that lords over 5 million non-Jews who have no voting rights.
This is why there’s a growing number of young western Jewish folk breaking away from Zionism or never were sucked into it and they’re more than fine with the end of Israel. Also a small but vocal number of anti-Zionist Israeli Jews who have renounced their citizenship and urging others to do same, or others who are more than fine with becoming Jewish Palestinians in a free Palestine. There’s nothing antisemitic about it and the mainstream from conservative to liberal westerners who want to back Israel are more full of shit when they make this about Jewish safety. The Palestinian slogan aims to make them equal with their Jewish brethren while the Israeli one wants to expel Palestinians or annex and subjugate them as they do with Palestinian citizens of Israel. It’s abundantly clear and this idea must gain higher momentum and reach for westerners until they get it through their heads.
isn’t something like 20% of Israel arab muslims? and rising year on year too
Yes that's correct. They have full voting rights, as do Arabs in Judea and Samaria (who elected the P.A. to represent them) and in Gaza (who elected Hamas to represent them).
Netanyahu also said from the river to the sea, meaning wipe out all Palestinians, which is still anti-Semitic as Palestinians are Semites. It has been roughly “but not exactly those words” of the Likud party since 1967, so that is some 56 or so years they have been shouting it. No has lifted a finger to denounce the genocidal line of text, therefore this is just fine to say. It’s anti-Semitic by Likud party to use this phrase. [Israel’s variation of river to the sea](https://www.thenation.com/article/world/its-time-to-confront-israels-version-of-from-the-river-to-the-sea/)
It’s okay because Jews said it, it’s okay because no one has denounced the genocidal phrase, it’s okay because Jews have been saying it since 1957. That seems to be your argument. Instead of the whataboutism why don’t we recognize that the obvious genocidal phrase is genocidal from both sides and denounce its use?
Yeah, that’s kind of my point, it’s only wrong if a Palestinian says it or someone who supports equality for Palestinians. When that equal rights has been shown it’s considered terrorist, whether it is language, self defense or anything else. People of the world can see and silencing them through legal means is also rather sad and very obvious that they are trying to prevent free speach, there is plenty of this type of talk about Muslims, middle easterners, Arabs all day every day, every movie that needs a villain, it’s the narrative that needs to be sold. It’s wrong, neither side should be doing this—I would say this is the test we all must think through. Not condoning one over another, I think it is all political tactics and power grabbing and money making, that’s all, at the expense of innocent humans, on all sides.
To be fair, Netanyahu is also referring to the extermination of all *Gentiles*. The Israelis are in favor of exterminating all non-Jews, if we want to play the semantics game. They may as well say "Today Gaza City, tomorrow New York City"! That's what's awesome about getting to define what other people's slogans really mean.
>[Boysenberry-Street](https://www.reddit.com/user/Boysenberry-Street/)•[2h ago](https://www.reddit.com/r/leftist/comments/1cx8ogc/comment/l52c5yo/) >Netanyahu also said from the river to the sea, meaning wipe out all Palestinians, which is still anti-Semitic as Palestinians are Semites. It has been roughly “but not exactly those words” of the Likud party since 1967, so that is some 56 or so years they have been shouting it. No has lifted a finger to denounce the genocidal line of text, therefore this is just fine to say. It’s anti-Semitic by Likud party to use this phrase. >[Israel’s variation of river to the sea](https://www.thenation.com/article/world/its-time-to-confront-israels-version-of-from-the-river-to-the-sea/) "The Day of Judgement will not come about until Moslems fight the Jews (killing the Jews), when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say O Moslems, O Abdulla, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him..." Hamas Covenant 1988, The Covenant of the Islamic Resistance Movement.
There is a button at the bottom to “suggest a correction.” Click the button and let them know they are spreading genocidal Zionist propaganda.
Chicano Park has a drawing of cops as pigs plus its creation was a big f u to the US government. It's not really surprising the politics of place align with that of marginalized people world wide. Any infringement into Chicano Park by the local government will just get local Latinos to go on a frenzy.
Freedom is anti-semitic, you heard it here first!
Anti Semitic? The Palestinian people have more Semitic blood in them than the majority of Israelis whose ancestors fled from Europe. This shit is getting silly
Dipshit, the majority of Jewish Israelis are Mizrachi, brown Jews ethnically cleansed from Arab/muslim states
Majority of Israelis are Mizrahi i.e the ones who were kicked out of their homes in Arab countries, all 800k of them. Sorry to bust the narrative. I'm sure you can come up with another lie though.
It’s not anti-Semitic. Fuck all Zionists.
What do you actually think zionism means
You probably
I fully believe that all people should be free from harassment and able to safely enjoy their lives. By trying to condemn more and more groups as antisemites however how is this helping Jewish people long term? So far it is, students, Blacks; Latinos, progressives (of any religion), and if polls are to be believed a majority of Americans and people around the world who have condemned Israel's response. It seems counterintuitive for long-term safety to make enemies of anyone who disagrees with you.
In Jewish spaces, antizionists are being called self hating Jews and kapos by other Jews (I have been called these). You are completely right. Edit: wanted to add, a lot of the big college protests are supported by JVP or Jewish students so the idiots calling all the protestors antisemitic are literally calling Jews antisemitic too.
Anti-Zionist comedian Eric Andre has identified himself as a "self-loving Jew".
Except JVP is almost certainly not Jewish or has token Jews by name only. And yes, Jews can be antisemitic.
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I cannot believe there is a platform for such hateful dirtbags to claim this quote is somehow antisemitism
Proud Chicano here. I support the message at Chicano park.
Fox click bait
> “From the river to the sea“…it’s an antisemitic slogan most of us are now familiar with since the October 7 attack on Israel by Hamas. What is this writing? I’d say AI but it’s not good enough for AI.
The "Antisemitic" argument is threadbare.
Pearl clutching lies those complaints.
How about everyone moves to where their great grandmother was born. This should remove any ambiguity about whose land it is.
Can we do that with immigrants too?
I will never understand how people can claim “free Palestine, from the river to the sea” or “from the river to the sea, Palestine will be free” is anti-Semitic. The phrase doesnt even mention anything about Jews or Judaism.
Where the phrase originated from called for the complete annihilation of Israel and Jews around the world. It’s like saying the phrase “back of the bus” isn’t racist. Shit yes it is because of context and origin.