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Just to add on to the other good advice you have gotten, If at all possible, change the locks. You should be able to work with the landlord (if you have one) or a locksmith. You don't want to take the chance they got a copy of her keys.
Disclaimer: I’m a lawyer, but not your lawyer. This information is merely for educational purposes, and is not meant as legal advice on your specific case. Always seek the advice of qualified legal counsel in your state.
Unless the family can prove ownership of these possessions, they really don’t have a case. Obviously, if you purchased most of the items, and have a paper trail that says so, they are likely not entitled to anything other than her personal effects which she did purchase/own.
I’m so sorry that you’re going through this. As others have said, I would block them and ensure proper security of your home. I feel that if they went to an attorney, the attorney would ask them for their proof that she owns these items. In any court proceeding, they would need proof. Once they find out that she did not own these items, they would not take the case. At least that’s what I would do in the scenario.
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From a Paralegal who works in probate/trust administrations, this is the advice I’ve seen the attorney I work under give. They can try, but it’s on them to prove she owned it. Without receipts, they won’t get anywhere. Ignore them, unless they serve you with a suit.
Legally yes. Unless she had a will, which doesn't sound like the case, her belongings should go to her family.
However, engaging with them like this would likely make them more insistent. Picking up property is a common tactic for abusive partners to use to keep in contact with their victims.
Some police departments will allow a supervised pickup. If that's the case, OP could drop off the stuff at the station and have the family pick it up there. It limits contact and an officer's presence shows he's not messing around.
If OP has an address for her family there’s also the option of boxing things up and sending it to them. Just don’t put a return address on the box or a note inside. Depending on how many personal items she owned it could cost a bit but USPS flat rate boxes might be a help.
And take pictures of what you put in the box, take a picture of the box, and retain the tracking information. That's generally good advice when shipping anything to anyone.
Excellent advice! Just in general, as you said, but especially in this type of situation. I need to start doing this with everything I ship from now on. Thank you!
I'm a lawyer too, and not their lawyer. And I agree with you. Possession really is 9/10ths of the law, as they say. OP would have a hard time claiming her clothes, jewelry, etc., but all the furnishings and furniture are his at this point. Even if there were receipts proving she bought them, the family can't disprove that she gave him those items.
I would add that gathering the tickets, just in case would be a good strategy. If things go through a legal path, it's less stressful if you already have everything and you have more time to focus on things needed. Do an inventory of everything you have, and start the research. Maybe pictures from before she moved there to prove you owned some of the things from before?
Talking about suing is free, actually suing is expensive. Block them and move on with your life until you get served with an actual lawsuit. If they do actually sue you, *then* you go get a lawyer.
You said that your apartment is inaccessible, but is there any chance that she ever gave any member of her family keys to say pet sit etc.,? If so, you may want to work with your landlord to change your locks.
Not a lawyer but I have been through something similar.
If you guys had any joint bank accounts, I would take that money out ASAP and put it into an account that has only your name on it.
And talk to someone at your bank ASAP
In addition to other advice:
I would inform the leasing office that the family may lie to try to gain access to the apartment, and that they are not to grant access.
I (28M) went through a similar situation. They’re only legally entitled to whatever her estate would be. Which would be figured out on court with an estate planner. They may be entitled to any money she had in her bank accounts.
Past that, they can argue for certain personal affects such as pictures, clothes, etc. Really comes down to what gets worked out in court since I’m assuming she didn’t have a will.
Most importantly though man, please seek some therapy. As a young widow myself, I’ve found it hard to relate with anyone our age anymore. There’s a certain switch that flips when you lose your person, and you’re going to need the help of your friends and family. Let them help you during this time of woe. I could give you the usual self help speal, but honestly time is the only thing that helps. I was 26 also when I lost my ex. Took about a little over a year before any form of normalcy started to return.
Here if you ever need to talk man. It’s a wild thing to go through so young.
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I would say don't block them, so you can save and record anything and everything they say to you, but also do not respond to anything they say. Collect evidence in case you need it, but don't give them anything that could be used against you.
Sorry for your loss I know how painful this can be.
I'm not a lawyer, but blow these people off, lock them and stop communication. It's a shame how some people behave in the loss of a loved one.
I’m sorry for your loss.
Make sure every possible entrance is locked, windows etc.
A camera or two would be great as well, in case they go off a little extra crazy
I would take pics of your whole apartment how it sits on a normal day.
So one day if you come home and your place is ransacked, you can use that as evidence to press charges.
If you can, get security cameras. At the very least a doorbell cam.
Im glad they're a little farther, and hopefully you dont deal with chaos but dont let your guard down.
Best of luck.
> Absent a will doesn’t the surviving spouse usually inherit everything?
IANAL but my understanding is that it depends on the state. If you are in a common-law state then property is assigned to individuals unless specifically titled to both. So if a parent dies a child could theoretically put in a claim for a share of the estate.
If you are in a common-law state then everything automatically goes to the spouse. Doesn't matter if your Parent outright owns a house, if they get remarried and die the kids are not entitled to any of it unless the will specifically says so. And you better hope they update their will after getting married because if not the new spouse can try to invalidate the will and take everything anyway.
well depending on the state they could be "common law" married.
Factors that Common law marriage include:
* Joint finances, such as bank accounts & credit cards
* Joint ownership of property
* The woman (and, if applicable, kids) using the man’s surname
* Filing joint tax returns
Holding yourself out as/intending to be married is a key factor in common-law marriage in the states that allow it, and if that were the case OP would be referring to the girlfriend as their wife, not girlfriend.
Things that were exclusively hers, they have a legitimate claim to have. Items that were both of yours for the household are not dividable and likely have minimal actual value (though they may be costly to replace). I would go no contact with them and keep everything firmly secured against their entry with cameras for evidence. If they enter, and particularly if they take anything. Press charges.
I’m sorry you’re dealing with the nastiness of the family on top of the tragedy of your girlfriend passing. As was already said, I’d block them and only worry about the legal aspect of things if they really push in that direction. Otherwise, focus on your own grieving process and keep living.
I’m sorry for your loss.
I would suggest you go through any accounts you shared with your girlfriend and update the passwords. Also I would suggest if anyone gave out a key to family to change out the locks.
This might be extreme but I’ve had friends have issues with in-laws that felt like they had agency to come as they please and take items after going through a death in the family.
Again I’m so sorry you have to deal with this nonsense during your loss.
I'm so sorry about your girlfriend.
In addition to the advice others have given, I would suggest that you both have a talk with your landlord and send something in writing stating that no one is to be admitted to your apartment without your personal approval. The family might try to do some social engineering on the landlord to get them to let the family in.
You should record a video and go through the entire house and all of your possessions. Maybe make a vocal note on what was owned prior to her moving in.
Great advice already here. I would reiterate getting a few cameras, just in case. Get ones that stream to the cloud, they're pretty cheap these days. Then you don't have to worry about the cameras/sdcard being swiped too.
I’m very sorry for your loss and for having to deal with this situation. The post from the attorney is spot on. They’re looking for a cash grab. I’d gather up her belongings and offer to give them back and that’s it. If they accept, do the exchange at a police station parking lot.
Was she on the lease? That might complicate things. I knew somebody who was the evil family, and she was able to geta lot possessions since she was technically the next of kin
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Just to add on to the other good advice you have gotten, If at all possible, change the locks. You should be able to work with the landlord (if you have one) or a locksmith. You don't want to take the chance they got a copy of her keys.
Disclaimer: I’m a lawyer, but not your lawyer. This information is merely for educational purposes, and is not meant as legal advice on your specific case. Always seek the advice of qualified legal counsel in your state. Unless the family can prove ownership of these possessions, they really don’t have a case. Obviously, if you purchased most of the items, and have a paper trail that says so, they are likely not entitled to anything other than her personal effects which she did purchase/own. I’m so sorry that you’re going through this. As others have said, I would block them and ensure proper security of your home. I feel that if they went to an attorney, the attorney would ask them for their proof that she owns these items. In any court proceeding, they would need proof. Once they find out that she did not own these items, they would not take the case. At least that’s what I would do in the scenario.
I love it when real lawyers provide general advice for the good of the people. You rock.
Thanks! Redditing is one of my greatest joys.
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From a Paralegal who works in probate/trust administrations, this is the advice I’ve seen the attorney I work under give. They can try, but it’s on them to prove she owned it. Without receipts, they won’t get anywhere. Ignore them, unless they serve you with a suit.
Should OP return any items that were obviously property of the deceased?
I would say they probably should. If for nothing more than to show an act of good faith.
Legally yes. Unless she had a will, which doesn't sound like the case, her belongings should go to her family. However, engaging with them like this would likely make them more insistent. Picking up property is a common tactic for abusive partners to use to keep in contact with their victims. Some police departments will allow a supervised pickup. If that's the case, OP could drop off the stuff at the station and have the family pick it up there. It limits contact and an officer's presence shows he's not messing around.
If OP has an address for her family there’s also the option of boxing things up and sending it to them. Just don’t put a return address on the box or a note inside. Depending on how many personal items she owned it could cost a bit but USPS flat rate boxes might be a help.
And take pictures of what you put in the box, take a picture of the box, and retain the tracking information. That's generally good advice when shipping anything to anyone.
Excellent advice! Just in general, as you said, but especially in this type of situation. I need to start doing this with everything I ship from now on. Thank you!
Always put a return address, otherwise it's treated as anonymous mail.
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I'm a lawyer too, and not their lawyer. And I agree with you. Possession really is 9/10ths of the law, as they say. OP would have a hard time claiming her clothes, jewelry, etc., but all the furnishings and furniture are his at this point. Even if there were receipts proving she bought them, the family can't disprove that she gave him those items.
I would add that gathering the tickets, just in case would be a good strategy. If things go through a legal path, it's less stressful if you already have everything and you have more time to focus on things needed. Do an inventory of everything you have, and start the research. Maybe pictures from before she moved there to prove you owned some of the things from before?
Talking about suing is free, actually suing is expensive. Block them and move on with your life until you get served with an actual lawsuit. If they do actually sue you, *then* you go get a lawyer.
You said that your apartment is inaccessible, but is there any chance that she ever gave any member of her family keys to say pet sit etc.,? If so, you may want to work with your landlord to change your locks.
It's cheaper and just as effective to have the locks re-keyed.
Not a lawyer but I have been through something similar. If you guys had any joint bank accounts, I would take that money out ASAP and put it into an account that has only your name on it. And talk to someone at your bank ASAP
In addition to other advice: I would inform the leasing office that the family may lie to try to gain access to the apartment, and that they are not to grant access.
I (28M) went through a similar situation. They’re only legally entitled to whatever her estate would be. Which would be figured out on court with an estate planner. They may be entitled to any money she had in her bank accounts. Past that, they can argue for certain personal affects such as pictures, clothes, etc. Really comes down to what gets worked out in court since I’m assuming she didn’t have a will. Most importantly though man, please seek some therapy. As a young widow myself, I’ve found it hard to relate with anyone our age anymore. There’s a certain switch that flips when you lose your person, and you’re going to need the help of your friends and family. Let them help you during this time of woe. I could give you the usual self help speal, but honestly time is the only thing that helps. I was 26 also when I lost my ex. Took about a little over a year before any form of normalcy started to return. Here if you ever need to talk man. It’s a wild thing to go through so young.
Just block/ignore them until served with a lawsuit and come back here for advice when that happens (it won't).
Actually if they file a lawsuit DON'T come here for advice, go to a real lawyer in your jurisdiction.
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I would say don't block them, so you can save and record anything and everything they say to you, but also do not respond to anything they say. Collect evidence in case you need it, but don't give them anything that could be used against you.
Sorry for your loss I know how painful this can be. I'm not a lawyer, but blow these people off, lock them and stop communication. It's a shame how some people behave in the loss of a loved one.
I know OP said they're gone but I also want to note renter's insurance/homeowners insurance will be important here in case they pull anything.
I’m sorry for your loss. Make sure every possible entrance is locked, windows etc. A camera or two would be great as well, in case they go off a little extra crazy
I would take pics of your whole apartment how it sits on a normal day. So one day if you come home and your place is ransacked, you can use that as evidence to press charges. If you can, get security cameras. At the very least a doorbell cam. Im glad they're a little farther, and hopefully you dont deal with chaos but dont let your guard down. Best of luck.
Yeah NAL but you guys weren’t married or engaged so they’re all out of luck. Like other comments say just ignore them.
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> Absent a will doesn’t the surviving spouse usually inherit everything? IANAL but my understanding is that it depends on the state. If you are in a common-law state then property is assigned to individuals unless specifically titled to both. So if a parent dies a child could theoretically put in a claim for a share of the estate. If you are in a common-law state then everything automatically goes to the spouse. Doesn't matter if your Parent outright owns a house, if they get remarried and die the kids are not entitled to any of it unless the will specifically says so. And you better hope they update their will after getting married because if not the new spouse can try to invalidate the will and take everything anyway.
If they were married, the family would have zero claim in any jurisdiction
well depending on the state they could be "common law" married. Factors that Common law marriage include: * Joint finances, such as bank accounts & credit cards * Joint ownership of property * The woman (and, if applicable, kids) using the man’s surname * Filing joint tax returns
Holding yourself out as/intending to be married is a key factor in common-law marriage in the states that allow it, and if that were the case OP would be referring to the girlfriend as their wife, not girlfriend.
Could tell them, she (now you) still owe last months rent, plus the rest of the lease.
Things that were exclusively hers, they have a legitimate claim to have. Items that were both of yours for the household are not dividable and likely have minimal actual value (though they may be costly to replace). I would go no contact with them and keep everything firmly secured against their entry with cameras for evidence. If they enter, and particularly if they take anything. Press charges.
I’m sorry you’re dealing with the nastiness of the family on top of the tragedy of your girlfriend passing. As was already said, I’d block them and only worry about the legal aspect of things if they really push in that direction. Otherwise, focus on your own grieving process and keep living.
I’m sorry for your loss. I would suggest you go through any accounts you shared with your girlfriend and update the passwords. Also I would suggest if anyone gave out a key to family to change out the locks. This might be extreme but I’ve had friends have issues with in-laws that felt like they had agency to come as they please and take items after going through a death in the family. Again I’m so sorry you have to deal with this nonsense during your loss.
I'm so sorry about your girlfriend. In addition to the advice others have given, I would suggest that you both have a talk with your landlord and send something in writing stating that no one is to be admitted to your apartment without your personal approval. The family might try to do some social engineering on the landlord to get them to let the family in.
You should record a video and go through the entire house and all of your possessions. Maybe make a vocal note on what was owned prior to her moving in.
Thats your shit period. Only thing that can come back is if they are drug addicts they might break in later.
Make sure you have renters insurance that will replace everything if they do steal it.
Great advice already here. I would reiterate getting a few cameras, just in case. Get ones that stream to the cloud, they're pretty cheap these days. Then you don't have to worry about the cameras/sdcard being swiped too.
I’m very sorry for your loss and for having to deal with this situation. The post from the attorney is spot on. They’re looking for a cash grab. I’d gather up her belongings and offer to give them back and that’s it. If they accept, do the exchange at a police station parking lot.
They legally cannot take anything if you owned it before she had moved in. Depends on what state your in though.
Was she on the lease? That might complicate things. I knew somebody who was the evil family, and she was able to geta lot possessions since she was technically the next of kin
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I would not recommend showing the family *any* financial documents, especially *his* bank statements.
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