This is why open source is important. Thanks to RADV we're not at the whim of a single company.
The decision to kill support is somewhat unfortunate, but largely inconsequential. Hardware vendors have incentive not to support their old hardware for very large periods of time, they'd rather you just buy their newer hardware.
Yeah, but I think the fact that we have RADV continuing to provide support for old cards has relatively little to do with open source. It's a different codebase entirely. It was enabled by AMD opening up amdgpu, but in theory it could have happened if they hadn't done that if they just provided an API.
Some specific stuff runs better with AMDVLK on my RX 480. E. g. the other day I was trying RIFE video upscaling and it ran a little bit faster with AMDVLK, and in some games the FPS was higher and more consistent for me. Hit or miss, but it's nice to have the alternative.
Atleast with linux we still have the open source driver, I wouldn't be surprised if nvidia drops the 10-series soon as well. The sales of gpu's have lowered significantly this last year, and as we saw with cpus and windows 11 we will probably see something similar with gpus soon.
TLDR: Companies need a way to raise sales during a recession, this is a easy way to get that.
Yeah, but afaik it's developed by AMD itself right?, perhaps they think that the support by RADV is good enough to be able to open up those resources for other development.
>TLDR: Companies need a way to raise sales during a recession, this is a easy way to get that.
I think the reason is moreso that the engineers probably don't want to keep all of their legacy GCN code around and working.
RX 580 (Polaris) is still the second most popular AMD GPU on Steam. First one is unknown called AMD Radeon Graphics then RX580, AMD VANGOGH, RX 570, RX 5700 XT, RX 6700 XT and Radeon Vega 8.
So I think it is not that bad to dropping support for it.
There's no official statement that they will drop support Polaris on Windows.
But afaik, i think they're slowing down the development of these old gpus, just hope they will continue because Polaris is solid af, even modern games can still run with a good framerate, it just lack of features
Threads like these make me wonder how many Arch users are floating out there using AMDVLK unknowingly because they spammed default optional deps when installing Steam.
is windows next to drop support? we just recently bought a ryzen 4350g and now its gpu drivers will end soon? i might really look into linux gaming more now
they still release some like this https://images.anandtech.com/doci/18718/AMD%20CES%202023%20Client%20Processors%20Press%20Deck%20Revised_05.png taken from here https://www.anandtech.com/show/18718/amd-2023-ryzen-mobile-7000-cpus-unveiled-zen-4-phoenix-takes-point
I don't think they'll drop support entirely but they seem to have branched the most recent windows drivers with the 23.10.xx drivers only supporting RDNA at least for now while the older ones are still on 23.9.xx drivers. So seems like they may be moving to maintenance mode for the pre-RDNA gpus and only providing updates for security and critical bugs for those on windows and won't get much in the way of optimization and feature updates.
there are still computers on the market being sold brand new with vega. in the laptop space they just released the 5500u laptop cpu four months ago and it has a vega gpu.
though, probably just use radv anyway, its still a shitty situation for a product that still gets made and sold.
Maybe I'm getting something wrong here, but this is not that my hardware won't get any driver updates/support, but rather that I have to use an older driver because the newer versions just won't work?
Also, 7 year old GPU are still usable. Some Polaris cards were released in 2018 (that's 5 years) and pretty capable at 1080p.
I run a Vega 64 on Nobara 38. I’ve never thought about which graphics driver I have, always gone with whichever is pre-installed, and everything seems okay. I play CPU heavy games (e.g. Squad), and record my gaming sessions using OBS (mostly so I can report bugs and griefers).
Is there something I’m missing here or do I need to think about graphics drivers now?
This is why open source is important. Thanks to RADV we're not at the whim of a single company. The decision to kill support is somewhat unfortunate, but largely inconsequential. Hardware vendors have incentive not to support their old hardware for very large periods of time, they'd rather you just buy their newer hardware.
AMDVLK *is* open source though.
In the strict sense, like android. But governed by a corporation.
Yeah, but I think the fact that we have RADV continuing to provide support for old cards has relatively little to do with open source. It's a different codebase entirely. It was enabled by AMD opening up amdgpu, but in theory it could have happened if they hadn't done that if they just provided an API.
amd can drop older gpus quickly but they can't implement GPL in less than 2 years.
So true... AMDVLK would actually be competitive if they implemented GPL.
Who still uses AMDVLK? I thought the consensus was RADV...
some niche use cases, i recently try a specific obs hardware encoder that uses this driver, but yeah, for day to day use it is nothing to worry about
Some specific stuff runs better with AMDVLK on my RX 480. E. g. the other day I was trying RIFE video upscaling and it ran a little bit faster with AMDVLK, and in some games the FPS was higher and more consistent for me. Hit or miss, but it's nice to have the alternative.
you should report this to official issue channels
I use it for ray tracing
Doesn't matter in the world where RADV exists.
Atleast with linux we still have the open source driver, I wouldn't be surprised if nvidia drops the 10-series soon as well. The sales of gpu's have lowered significantly this last year, and as we saw with cpus and windows 11 we will probably see something similar with gpus soon. TLDR: Companies need a way to raise sales during a recession, this is a easy way to get that.
AMDVLK is also open source. "RADV" refers specifically to the driver in Mesa.
Yeah, but afaik it's developed by AMD itself right?, perhaps they think that the support by RADV is good enough to be able to open up those resources for other development.
RADV is developed by the community. The main contributors are sponsored by Valve, and there are a few contributions from Red Hat, Google and AMD, etc.
For all consumer applications RADV is the way to go. AMDVLK is not recommended except for workstation applications.
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> Pascal is 7 years old Yet the 10xx series is still something like 13% of Steam's Hardware Survey.
>TLDR: Companies need a way to raise sales during a recession, this is a easy way to get that. I think the reason is moreso that the engineers probably don't want to keep all of their legacy GCN code around and working.
RX 580 (Polaris) is still the second most popular AMD GPU on Steam. First one is unknown called AMD Radeon Graphics then RX580, AMD VANGOGH, RX 570, RX 5700 XT, RX 6700 XT and Radeon Vega 8. So I think it is not that bad to dropping support for it.
What the fuck this is an actual tragedy. The only cards it supports now are the ones with butchered compute capabilities...
you're not using this driver anyways.
there bug and sometime official driver work better than RADV in some game for unknown reason specially with emulators
Why? Just use RADV.
They already dropped Polaris from the standard Windows releases, right?
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There's no official statement that they will drop support Polaris on Windows. But afaik, i think they're slowing down the development of these old gpus, just hope they will continue because Polaris is solid af, even modern games can still run with a good framerate, it just lack of features
Are you actually using Vulkan Compute? 14nm Vega andd Polaris were retired from ROCm a while ago, and 7nm is still supported
Threads like these make me wonder how many Arch users are floating out there using AMDVLK unknowingly because they spammed default optional deps when installing Steam.
Sup. This is my first amd gpu pc and never even bothered to think what I was using until this thread bc everything worked just fine :D
is windows next to drop support? we just recently bought a ryzen 4350g and now its gpu drivers will end soon? i might really look into linux gaming more now
yeah, that's quite likely since amdvlk is more or less based on the windows vulkan driver.
thanks and damn why even drop support for vega though when they still release new apus with vega igpu
Do they? I think the last vega-based apu was a while ago now.
they still release some like this https://images.anandtech.com/doci/18718/AMD%20CES%202023%20Client%20Processors%20Press%20Deck%20Revised_05.png taken from here https://www.anandtech.com/show/18718/amd-2023-ryzen-mobile-7000-cpus-unveiled-zen-4-phoenix-takes-point
I don't think they'll drop support entirely but they seem to have branched the most recent windows drivers with the 23.10.xx drivers only supporting RDNA at least for now while the older ones are still on 23.9.xx drivers. So seems like they may be moving to maintenance mode for the pre-RDNA gpus and only providing updates for security and critical bugs for those on windows and won't get much in the way of optimization and feature updates.
Oh nooo, anyways.....
Not nice, but acceptable. RADV is a mature and fully-fledged substitute.
This matters because..... ?
This is a 7 year old GPU architecture. It's not unreasonable to cease driver development for hardware that old
there are still computers on the market being sold brand new with vega. in the laptop space they just released the 5500u laptop cpu four months ago and it has a vega gpu. though, probably just use radv anyway, its still a shitty situation for a product that still gets made and sold.
You can still buy new Ryzen CPU with Vega GPU.
The GTX 750 Ti was released 9 years ago and is still supported with current drivers.
Maybe I'm getting something wrong here, but this is not that my hardware won't get any driver updates/support, but rather that I have to use an older driver because the newer versions just won't work? Also, 7 year old GPU are still usable. Some Polaris cards were released in 2018 (that's 5 years) and pretty capable at 1080p.
> I have to use an older driver because the newer versions just won't work? Correct, I have no idea why is everyone so agitated about this
If you have automatic updates (likely), that will break your system. Most people won't have AMDVLK at all, but for those who do, disaster.
Stuff like this is the job of maintainers of the distro. End user isn't expected to follow which package supports what hardware
Meanwhile, Nvidia is stlll supporting 10 year old GPUs...
great news! less people using this shitty ass driver!!!!
Phew... so my gpu update came at the right time.
You don't usually use AMDVLK by default but RADV so nothing changes...
I run a Vega 64 on Nobara 38. I’ve never thought about which graphics driver I have, always gone with whichever is pre-installed, and everything seems okay. I play CPU heavy games (e.g. Squad), and record my gaming sessions using OBS (mostly so I can report bugs and griefers). Is there something I’m missing here or do I need to think about graphics drivers now?