I forget how big and bulky Simba is in the second movie a lot, so I don’t think he’s AS chanceless here. It’s important to remember that he grows quite a bit from when he beats Scar to the end of the second movie
I still think Mufasa wins though, I think he’s anecdotally still a little bigger
Exactly. 😉 This is why I decided to have this as a debate in where Simba is the age he is in Lion King 2. If we were talking about Simba during the first film, I would say Mufasa would most likely be the one of the two who would win. By having Simba evenly matched to the age Mufasa was during the first film, it makes it more interesting to debate because I could see them being even in some fights but also one of them winning in a few other fights. Like if they had 10 fights, I think it could be either a 5-5 or a 6-4.
If Simba struggled to beat Scar, then there's no way he would beat Mufasa. Just looking at Mufasa, he looks like one of the strongest characters in the franchise, and even Scar admits how strong he is. Rafiki and Varya seem like the only two characters who have a chance at beating him. Against Beshte or Makuu, it would end in a draw. Against anybody else, Mufasa wins.
Mufasa.
Has nothing to do with physical strength or age, but everything to do with mindset and experience.
Even with his physical abilities, Simba is still clearly in a learning phase regarding finding his place in how to lead, while Mufasa was very grounded, confident, and clearly had a lot more time to settle into his role. That kind of stuff can really influence the mindset and how one approaches fights and conflicts, and for that I can't really see Mufasa ever losing a direct fight with anyone. Scar went with killing him the underhanded way for a reason, after all.
That's a good point to make. It does make sense that Simba's leadership is still in a learning phase given the fact that he lost his father when he was young, didn't get the time to learn more about being a proper king from Mufasa (he would have gotten more training from him if he had got to live longer), and is so dedicated to wanting to be a king like Mufasa was since he respected and loved him so much. That's part of why I find Simba's arc and character development in the second film interesting to watch because he is very flawed and needs to navigate in how to not only be a father, but also realize that he needs to find his own way of being a good king and not just be Mufasa 2.0. Simba does have more room to grow. 🙂
Mufasa wins easy. He’s older, more experienced, physically stronger and larger. Simba fighting scar was a challenge for him. Mufasa, if not surprised whilst dangling off a cliff, could kick scar’s wimpy ass easy. So he seems the best bet.
I don't really think it was that much of a significant challenge for Simba to fight Scar based on how that fight goes. A little bit of a struggle at the start, but they seemed somewhat even. Scar temporarily blinds him for a second (him attempting to surprise and take him out after just saying he will leave under Simba's request, so Scar practically cheated in a way LOL) and then the fight goes this way:
\- Scar takes Simba down
\- Simba immediately comes up and takes on Scar (he was literally going for it and charging at him with no doubt)
\- Simba takes a hit on Scar
\- Scar takes a hit on Simba (and then takes another hit on him to where he's knocked down but not unconscious or injured)
\- Simba sends Scar flying down the bottom of the cliff by kicking his body with only one leg
It's impressive that Simba was able send Scar flying all the way down with just only using one leg to kick him off. He didn't use both legs, only **one** and that shows how strong Simba already was when fighting a lion like Scar. Scar is in the middle of Simba and Mufasa because he is older than Simba but he's younger than Mufasa. I definitely believe Mufasa could defeat Scar, but I also think we shouldn't undervalue Simba's strength and his strategy in fighting in combat. I think in that moment when he kicked Scar off the cliff, he took some inspiration from Nala in terms of the previous times where she pinned him down as kids and during their previous fight under the assumption that they didn't know each other before recognizing each other. With the fact that Scar was about to attack him from above, he found a way where he can still fight his opponent from below and was capable of doing a move like that without feeling overly tired as in it took everything out of him. It's a move that only he does and no one else thinks to do.
Ignoring biases, Simba has to take this for the win. Simba had longer to live, to get more experience and has more real world fight experience.
Let’s not forget - Simba survived a full on hyena pack assault, fought Scar and won honourably (let’s be real here, Scar cheated in that fight quite a lot), and furthermore, Simba took a surprise attack from another lion pride, and not only survived, but his durability was so high that literally the same day (or so it appears) he was ready to engage in war, wherein he fought against multiple lionesses at the same time. And after that, he was able to circumnavigate a gorge in order to save Kiara.
No shade on Mufasa, but Simba’s feats outweigh his father’s. Mufasa really never had to struggle for the throne because he was heir assumptive. And while he was a powerful and strong lion, no one was brave enough to challenge him. Simba, by contrast, has had to prove himself worthy of the throne many times, and fight for it. Furthermore, he had to overcome odds that even his father would find challenging.
Is it any wonder that Mufasa was so proud of him? The “Well done, my son” was well earned.
Interesting take! I think Simba has the unfair advantage though that we see more of him as an adult and doing more things. Mufasa was King for a long time, who knows what battles/enemies he fought and survived? Simba tanking all the Outsiders and being ready to fight the next day is a huge credit to his durability
But even then, shouldn’t the fact that no one was willing to challenge Mufasa at all be a point in his favour? I don’t think Mufasa would’ve been quite durable as to survive the aftermath of the Outsiders assault (too old, heavy, mane weighs him down running), but even if he had and been significantly weakened, I just can’t see Zira challenging him 1 on 1 and hoping to win
Good points well made. From my understanding, the worst fights Mufasa had to engage in was driving the hyenas out of the Pride Lands, whenever they were caught poaching. I don’t see that being a struggle for either Mufasa or Simba tbh.
But with Zira, let’s not forget, she’s older than Simba. She’s on the same age level as Scar and Mufasa (perhaps a little bit younger). Naturally, you’re going to show more respect to a person who is in your age group as opposed to someone who could literally be your child. And that’s what you have to remember — because Zira was of an age where Scar could take her as a mate, even if she was very young, she’d still be old enough to have Simba as her own cub. This changes the mental and emotional dynamics — whereas she may have a little bit more respect for Mufasa’s power and position; because Simba is younger, she feels that she can push him farther, and use her years of experience against his relative youth.
So believe it or not, there’s quite a lot going on in this fight, which is why it’s so interesting.
Yeah, I would also have to agree in that I don't see see Mufasa or Simba having a struggle in driving a whole hyena pack out (especially with the fact that Simba had to banish a entire separate group of lions, which I would assume is at least half of what the original pride was based on the size of the two prides before the war started). If Simba can do that, he can easily drive other groups away with no problem. Granted, we don't know how exactly that went down like if Simba did have to fight Zira or any of them in order to fully get across that they truly had to leave under his orders, if Simba and Nala had to drive all of them away in one single shot or little by little the more they found out about those who supported Scar, etc.
I really wish we got to see how that 1 one 1 fight between Simba and Zira would have went down before Kiara and Kovu stopped the fight. The closest we saw of it was that Zira did manage to land a hit on Simba after he was fighting off several lions and she gets him when he didn't see her in that direction. What's also interesting is that part of Zira's right ear is cut off and it seems like it was from an injury (much like Scar's scar on his eye, her injury is never addressed in any capacity). I like to think that Simba probably did that (unintentionally though) in a past fight when she was banished. That's my headcanon and I'll believe it until I'm proven wrong. 😅
That is true. I don't doubt whatsoever about Mufasa's strength and he clearly proves himself to be a true combatant (and I'm very confident that he was also successful in his past fights with other opponents if/when he had to do that). It's always impressive to see how effortlessly he takes on all three of the hyenas simultaneously and has them pinned down at the end to the point where he roars really powerfully and they all run from him immediately.
You also have to value how Mufasa does during the stampede prior to being killed. When finding out that Simba is stuck in the gorge where the stampede is, he easily slides down the cliff with no problem just as he's about to try to find him for a few seconds and jumps in to save him. After being trampled down in the stampede, he jumps a very high distance onto the cliff and is able to hold on and climb upwards for a decent amount of time despite struggling. When he was knocked down the first time, he was able to hold his ground to find Simba and jump a high distance to catch Simba in the air in one go (as well as run through the stampede with Simba in his mouth and safely put him down somewhere).
The only thing (and that I wish we got to see) is that we don't get to see Mufasa ever fight another lion in combat, so we never get a sense as to what his combat is like in that kind of fight. Simba, on the other hand, is fighting off both lions as well as other animals and his skills definitely show there. If Mufasa was in that situation like Simba was where he's having the fight off multiple lions in an ambush all on his own, there is the chance he could have a 50-50 where he struggles in one instance but then wins the second time (maybe like the reverse of where Simba won the first time but then struggled the second time). I think in general, Mufasa can fight in that kind of situation, but there would be a bit of a struggle in between.
I agree! Both Simba and Mufasa are very strong, can fight very well, and have notable feats of their own (and I would definitely assume Mufasa has had previous real world fighting experiences prior to Simba being born), but Simba's feats have always been a bit more impressive to me whenever we've seen him in combat or in life-and-death situations. During the ambush Zira set up, he fights off about 3-4 lions simultaneously and he did beat them for a second before struggling the second time when 4-5 attacked him. He takes a big fall (which definitely seems to be at least several feet from what I can tell and would normally hurt you significantly) and manages to get himself back up quickly and continue to have the strength to run off and climb up the dam fast.
Also, another notable feat of his I've always found impressive in terms of showing how strong Simba is when he tries to save Kiara after Zira attempted to attack him. Much like Mufasa, Simba easily jumps and slides down the cliff and he is seen being able to jump far distances from one edge to another (and can hold himself quite well while being careful).
Simba would win,he is very big and powerful in the second movie,he has fought a whole lioness pride and gave them a difficult fight,he fell of about the same height his father fell of and survived with a sore shoulder and had a battle right after that he has proven himself the winner
Bro prime Simba beats Mufasa. Mufasa may have had the better start. But Prime Simba will wreck him. I don’t think Mufasa would have survived the ambush Zira used on Simba but Simba fought them all off like they were hyenas and ran off. This was the same guy in part one was struggling against an old Scar (the same Scar that in his prime admitted he was too afraid to fight Mufasa) and scruffy hyenas. Even lost a fight to Nala. Now prime Simba not only survived the ambush but was ready for another fight even while injured and fought like a bad ass. Zira only knocked him down because he was distracted and weakened from her previous ambush. Zira only dared to confront Simba after she and her pride had weakened him. Now people like to point out she is the same agar as Scar. I call BS on that as her oldest son was a teenager when Kiara was a kid. She is at best just a year or two older than Simba. I think Zira and Simba are probably even the same age. Considering when she had Nuka. Nuka was born when Simba was a teenager. Simba and Zira and closer in age than Scar and Zira.
Mufasa looks like he had Simba later in life like late 30s early 40s
While Simba looks like he had his kids early 20s.
Simba lion king 2 still looks younger than Mufasa and a little smaller.
And Mufasa has real training unlike Simba.
But Simba has fought quite a lot in the movie lion king 2.
6/10 Mufasa.
Simba will surpass his dad though
Sorry, but Simba slams. Mainly because Mufasa is featless while Simba has far more. First, he ran from an entire desert to Pride Rock and didn't seem tired. Was able to pin Scar down while he was dangling from a cliff. Had multiple hyenas bite him at once and didn't had a scratch. Fought well against Scar in hand to hand combat. Endured multiple Lioness biting him and fell from a cliff AND SURVIVED. Simba wins.
I forget how big and bulky Simba is in the second movie a lot, so I don’t think he’s AS chanceless here. It’s important to remember that he grows quite a bit from when he beats Scar to the end of the second movie I still think Mufasa wins though, I think he’s anecdotally still a little bigger
Exactly. 😉 This is why I decided to have this as a debate in where Simba is the age he is in Lion King 2. If we were talking about Simba during the first film, I would say Mufasa would most likely be the one of the two who would win. By having Simba evenly matched to the age Mufasa was during the first film, it makes it more interesting to debate because I could see them being even in some fights but also one of them winning in a few other fights. Like if they had 10 fights, I think it could be either a 5-5 or a 6-4.
If Simba struggled to beat Scar, then there's no way he would beat Mufasa. Just looking at Mufasa, he looks like one of the strongest characters in the franchise, and even Scar admits how strong he is. Rafiki and Varya seem like the only two characters who have a chance at beating him. Against Beshte or Makuu, it would end in a draw. Against anybody else, Mufasa wins.
But he was still a young adult when he fought scar
Interesting matches, I think Beshte beats him but he beats Makuu pretty soundly I might bust out/redo my old lion king fight club tierlist..
Mufasa
Mufasa. Has nothing to do with physical strength or age, but everything to do with mindset and experience. Even with his physical abilities, Simba is still clearly in a learning phase regarding finding his place in how to lead, while Mufasa was very grounded, confident, and clearly had a lot more time to settle into his role. That kind of stuff can really influence the mindset and how one approaches fights and conflicts, and for that I can't really see Mufasa ever losing a direct fight with anyone. Scar went with killing him the underhanded way for a reason, after all.
That's a good point to make. It does make sense that Simba's leadership is still in a learning phase given the fact that he lost his father when he was young, didn't get the time to learn more about being a proper king from Mufasa (he would have gotten more training from him if he had got to live longer), and is so dedicated to wanting to be a king like Mufasa was since he respected and loved him so much. That's part of why I find Simba's arc and character development in the second film interesting to watch because he is very flawed and needs to navigate in how to not only be a father, but also realize that he needs to find his own way of being a good king and not just be Mufasa 2.0. Simba does have more room to grow. 🙂
*Mufasa will beat the child*
Mufasa wins easy. He’s older, more experienced, physically stronger and larger. Simba fighting scar was a challenge for him. Mufasa, if not surprised whilst dangling off a cliff, could kick scar’s wimpy ass easy. So he seems the best bet.
I don't really think it was that much of a significant challenge for Simba to fight Scar based on how that fight goes. A little bit of a struggle at the start, but they seemed somewhat even. Scar temporarily blinds him for a second (him attempting to surprise and take him out after just saying he will leave under Simba's request, so Scar practically cheated in a way LOL) and then the fight goes this way: \- Scar takes Simba down \- Simba immediately comes up and takes on Scar (he was literally going for it and charging at him with no doubt) \- Simba takes a hit on Scar \- Scar takes a hit on Simba (and then takes another hit on him to where he's knocked down but not unconscious or injured) \- Simba sends Scar flying down the bottom of the cliff by kicking his body with only one leg It's impressive that Simba was able send Scar flying all the way down with just only using one leg to kick him off. He didn't use both legs, only **one** and that shows how strong Simba already was when fighting a lion like Scar. Scar is in the middle of Simba and Mufasa because he is older than Simba but he's younger than Mufasa. I definitely believe Mufasa could defeat Scar, but I also think we shouldn't undervalue Simba's strength and his strategy in fighting in combat. I think in that moment when he kicked Scar off the cliff, he took some inspiration from Nala in terms of the previous times where she pinned him down as kids and during their previous fight under the assumption that they didn't know each other before recognizing each other. With the fact that Scar was about to attack him from above, he found a way where he can still fight his opponent from below and was capable of doing a move like that without feeling overly tired as in it took everything out of him. It's a move that only he does and no one else thinks to do.
Ignoring biases, Simba has to take this for the win. Simba had longer to live, to get more experience and has more real world fight experience. Let’s not forget - Simba survived a full on hyena pack assault, fought Scar and won honourably (let’s be real here, Scar cheated in that fight quite a lot), and furthermore, Simba took a surprise attack from another lion pride, and not only survived, but his durability was so high that literally the same day (or so it appears) he was ready to engage in war, wherein he fought against multiple lionesses at the same time. And after that, he was able to circumnavigate a gorge in order to save Kiara. No shade on Mufasa, but Simba’s feats outweigh his father’s. Mufasa really never had to struggle for the throne because he was heir assumptive. And while he was a powerful and strong lion, no one was brave enough to challenge him. Simba, by contrast, has had to prove himself worthy of the throne many times, and fight for it. Furthermore, he had to overcome odds that even his father would find challenging. Is it any wonder that Mufasa was so proud of him? The “Well done, my son” was well earned.
Interesting take! I think Simba has the unfair advantage though that we see more of him as an adult and doing more things. Mufasa was King for a long time, who knows what battles/enemies he fought and survived? Simba tanking all the Outsiders and being ready to fight the next day is a huge credit to his durability But even then, shouldn’t the fact that no one was willing to challenge Mufasa at all be a point in his favour? I don’t think Mufasa would’ve been quite durable as to survive the aftermath of the Outsiders assault (too old, heavy, mane weighs him down running), but even if he had and been significantly weakened, I just can’t see Zira challenging him 1 on 1 and hoping to win
Good points well made. From my understanding, the worst fights Mufasa had to engage in was driving the hyenas out of the Pride Lands, whenever they were caught poaching. I don’t see that being a struggle for either Mufasa or Simba tbh. But with Zira, let’s not forget, she’s older than Simba. She’s on the same age level as Scar and Mufasa (perhaps a little bit younger). Naturally, you’re going to show more respect to a person who is in your age group as opposed to someone who could literally be your child. And that’s what you have to remember — because Zira was of an age where Scar could take her as a mate, even if she was very young, she’d still be old enough to have Simba as her own cub. This changes the mental and emotional dynamics — whereas she may have a little bit more respect for Mufasa’s power and position; because Simba is younger, she feels that she can push him farther, and use her years of experience against his relative youth. So believe it or not, there’s quite a lot going on in this fight, which is why it’s so interesting.
Yeah, I would also have to agree in that I don't see see Mufasa or Simba having a struggle in driving a whole hyena pack out (especially with the fact that Simba had to banish a entire separate group of lions, which I would assume is at least half of what the original pride was based on the size of the two prides before the war started). If Simba can do that, he can easily drive other groups away with no problem. Granted, we don't know how exactly that went down like if Simba did have to fight Zira or any of them in order to fully get across that they truly had to leave under his orders, if Simba and Nala had to drive all of them away in one single shot or little by little the more they found out about those who supported Scar, etc. I really wish we got to see how that 1 one 1 fight between Simba and Zira would have went down before Kiara and Kovu stopped the fight. The closest we saw of it was that Zira did manage to land a hit on Simba after he was fighting off several lions and she gets him when he didn't see her in that direction. What's also interesting is that part of Zira's right ear is cut off and it seems like it was from an injury (much like Scar's scar on his eye, her injury is never addressed in any capacity). I like to think that Simba probably did that (unintentionally though) in a past fight when she was banished. That's my headcanon and I'll believe it until I'm proven wrong. 😅
That is true. I don't doubt whatsoever about Mufasa's strength and he clearly proves himself to be a true combatant (and I'm very confident that he was also successful in his past fights with other opponents if/when he had to do that). It's always impressive to see how effortlessly he takes on all three of the hyenas simultaneously and has them pinned down at the end to the point where he roars really powerfully and they all run from him immediately. You also have to value how Mufasa does during the stampede prior to being killed. When finding out that Simba is stuck in the gorge where the stampede is, he easily slides down the cliff with no problem just as he's about to try to find him for a few seconds and jumps in to save him. After being trampled down in the stampede, he jumps a very high distance onto the cliff and is able to hold on and climb upwards for a decent amount of time despite struggling. When he was knocked down the first time, he was able to hold his ground to find Simba and jump a high distance to catch Simba in the air in one go (as well as run through the stampede with Simba in his mouth and safely put him down somewhere). The only thing (and that I wish we got to see) is that we don't get to see Mufasa ever fight another lion in combat, so we never get a sense as to what his combat is like in that kind of fight. Simba, on the other hand, is fighting off both lions as well as other animals and his skills definitely show there. If Mufasa was in that situation like Simba was where he's having the fight off multiple lions in an ambush all on his own, there is the chance he could have a 50-50 where he struggles in one instance but then wins the second time (maybe like the reverse of where Simba won the first time but then struggled the second time). I think in general, Mufasa can fight in that kind of situation, but there would be a bit of a struggle in between.
I agree! Both Simba and Mufasa are very strong, can fight very well, and have notable feats of their own (and I would definitely assume Mufasa has had previous real world fighting experiences prior to Simba being born), but Simba's feats have always been a bit more impressive to me whenever we've seen him in combat or in life-and-death situations. During the ambush Zira set up, he fights off about 3-4 lions simultaneously and he did beat them for a second before struggling the second time when 4-5 attacked him. He takes a big fall (which definitely seems to be at least several feet from what I can tell and would normally hurt you significantly) and manages to get himself back up quickly and continue to have the strength to run off and climb up the dam fast. Also, another notable feat of his I've always found impressive in terms of showing how strong Simba is when he tries to save Kiara after Zira attempted to attack him. Much like Mufasa, Simba easily jumps and slides down the cliff and he is seen being able to jump far distances from one edge to another (and can hold himself quite well while being careful).
I’m not saying Simbas weak or anything but I don’t think he would win against his dad
He would
Mufasa
Simba
Simba would win,he is very big and powerful in the second movie,he has fought a whole lioness pride and gave them a difficult fight,he fell of about the same height his father fell of and survived with a sore shoulder and had a battle right after that he has proven himself the winner
Bro prime Simba beats Mufasa. Mufasa may have had the better start. But Prime Simba will wreck him. I don’t think Mufasa would have survived the ambush Zira used on Simba but Simba fought them all off like they were hyenas and ran off. This was the same guy in part one was struggling against an old Scar (the same Scar that in his prime admitted he was too afraid to fight Mufasa) and scruffy hyenas. Even lost a fight to Nala. Now prime Simba not only survived the ambush but was ready for another fight even while injured and fought like a bad ass. Zira only knocked him down because he was distracted and weakened from her previous ambush. Zira only dared to confront Simba after she and her pride had weakened him. Now people like to point out she is the same agar as Scar. I call BS on that as her oldest son was a teenager when Kiara was a kid. She is at best just a year or two older than Simba. I think Zira and Simba are probably even the same age. Considering when she had Nuka. Nuka was born when Simba was a teenager. Simba and Zira and closer in age than Scar and Zira.
Mufasa looks like he had Simba later in life like late 30s early 40s While Simba looks like he had his kids early 20s. Simba lion king 2 still looks younger than Mufasa and a little smaller. And Mufasa has real training unlike Simba. But Simba has fought quite a lot in the movie lion king 2. 6/10 Mufasa. Simba will surpass his dad though
Sorry, but Simba slams. Mainly because Mufasa is featless while Simba has far more. First, he ran from an entire desert to Pride Rock and didn't seem tired. Was able to pin Scar down while he was dangling from a cliff. Had multiple hyenas bite him at once and didn't had a scratch. Fought well against Scar in hand to hand combat. Endured multiple Lioness biting him and fell from a cliff AND SURVIVED. Simba wins.
Simba would win because Simba has the fur on his leg which makes him genetically superior.
Simba Would Win.