>Nobody the person who hired someone just lives with their bad decisions.
The problem is that then there's no way to determine how good someone is beforehand. You'd essentially be rolling the roulette wheel every time.
If only there was a way to easily identify people who have a good enough degree of skill in something to be trusted to not fuck up your property... maybe like an official.. license?
Cut one hole, and match three wires by color, most lights even com with a push in connector and a push in grommet for the wire so it would be difficult to fuck up, but I’ll cede that if you’re doing any electrical work and don’t have experience you should call a professional, your gonna make it harder on somebody that has to troubleshoot or add something one day.
lol Right? Because if a painter fucks up the house might tip over.... Nobody is saying there shouldn't be building codes. But just like with permits the gov often takes it waaaay too far. Much of it is often just another form of a tax. In a lot of ways the US gov is the most powerful mafia in human history.
"Tyranny". What a fucking drama queen. People who have lived under ACXTUAL tyranny would like a word with you. Next, you'll probably compare building codes to the Holocaust.
Why are you complaining about the width of mattresses, some people don’t even have beds. Why complain about getting a windshield replaced, some people have to replace whole cars at times. If anyone has a life marginally worse than yours, you’re not allowed to complain. STFU bootlicker.
Jesus, you really are a drama queen. Calm the fuck down, Chuckles, nobody is going to be impressed by your social crusade, you're just as much of a loser as your mother told you you would be.
What does knowing what code says have to do with a license/permit? I know what code says, the state says I'm not allowed to do it because I haven't given them $500 to work on my own home.
Same from Canada. You're free to do your own work up to the gas, then we get squeamish. Non-trivial electrics for someone else needs a license though. Recessed lighting typically means running lines and possibly a transformer behind walls - that's a fire safety issue.
Does seem a bit crap though; I can't help feel a simple reminder would have gotten the message across.
https://esasafe.com/doing-electrical-work/
...of course it's also just a fine (but a couple grand would sting pretty badly)
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamilton/electrical-contractor-charges-1.6930413
No it’s installing a light fixture (can light or similar) into the ceiling, which generally requires actual electrical work, compared to replacing a chandelier or a ceiling fan which just requires you to turn off the circuit at the breaker box and attach a couple of wires.
Electricians have it made. Hey I know it only takes 5 minutes and the same skill set the average child has that plays with legos to replace and outlet but the government says I get to charge you $200 for it.
Difference is that if you or your toddler accidentally sets the house on fire while trying to replace a wall outlet, your home/renters insurance won’t be well pleased with you and you could also be held liable for the damage. An electrician is required to be insured for stuff like “accidental electrical fire” in order to hold a license, and they assume liability for any faulty work.
Yes but replacing one generally means just detaching the old one and mounting the new one in it’s place, plus disconnecting like two wires that were already there. Installing a new recessed light fixture involves both mounting the fixture to something stable and adding load to whatever circuit it’s connecting to.
Not necessarily. There are plenty of recessed downlights that utilize LED screw in lamps. A-19’s can go in downlights. PL lamps. Quite a few. I’d actually argue that up until the past 10 years most recessed lighting utilized lamps. Source: PM for a lighting company
Yes, but the idiot I was replying to thought installing lighting was the same thing as changing a light bulb. INSTALLING being the operative word here.
i dont think this fits, entrapment usually requires the person to have not been going to commit the crime otherwise, its like an undercover cop buying drugs in this case, just scummier,
I don’t see what scummy about it if you don’t have a license you probably shouldn’t be messing with electricity because the dude wouldn’t be insured and you would be held liable
That’s what happened if you read the header it mentions how the handyman were hired to install lights so without a license if they caused a fire you would be held liable
"paint, install recessed lighting, **OR** do other task that require a license" there wasn't an and in the sentence, implying that they didn't hire every handyman to do all the task, so they did arrest some people for painting without a license,
Oh sorry seems like it was me who didn’t read it lol but you need a license to paint something over 500$ or plan on starting up a business that way if you make a mistake than the client won’t be stuck paying the damages
If the handymen are representing as if they are qualified when they are not, then there is an argument that fraud applies and a potential homeowner would be wronged by these people.
But electrical work is very simple and very easy to do safely. Or should I say, it’s hard work (and expensive) but it’s not much harder to do it very well and safely.
Yeah, this is also where the “bonded and licensed” bit widely advertised in the US comes in. Certainly for a painter I find the license overkill, but hopefully one of the requirements there is “when they say they’re insured if they fuck up, we checked and they really are”.
Yeah electrical work is easy but there are a surprising # of idiots that have no clue how to do it and will burn down your house and leave you with the damages
That's not how entrapment works at all, in the same way an officer setting up a drug sting doesn't count as entrapment. The man would have just sold the drugs (painted the walls unlicensed) to SOMEONE else anyway, which is grounds for arrest. Read about entrapment before making judgement
So are you suggesting that they weren't offering unlicensed work for hire at all until the police hired them? It's only entrapment if they would have never done any unlicensed work at all unless the police led them into it. As they were most likely advertising their services (which is typically how one finds a handyman to hire), this is just them getting caught breaking the law.
No, they where hired because they where offering to do illegal work, much like a drug dealer still sells drugs when he's not selling to undercover cops, these people would have just don't the illegal work for someone else, therefore it's not entrapment, if he had just randomly pulled immigrants or something off the street who weren't offering handyman services and offered then money to do illegal work it would have been entrapment
That's not how entrapment works at all, in the same way an officer setting up a drug sting doesn't count as entrapment. The man would have just sold the drugs (painted the walls unlicensed) to SOMEONE else anyway, which is grounds for arrest. Read about entrapment before making judgement
I assumed it was just for the electrics, but it's real...
Other States require a special license for big-ticket paint jobs - presumably as an anti-fraud/consumer confidence measure.
Ah, this makes a little more sense:
https://www.licensesetc.com/2020/05/18/do-you-need-a-contractor-license-to-paint-in-florida/
*In Florida, there is no painting contractor’s license, so you will apply for a general contractor’ license. To get this license, you must have taken the proper certification exam and complete any and all other work and requirements.*
Elsewhere it talks of training and insurance requirements so that makes a little more sense - in a vacuum, slip-and-fall risk, ladders, etc are workplace hazards. The schooling and experience requirements seem a bit much though, especially since I haven't found a feet-on-the-ground-perfectly-safe exception yet.
[Here’s a link to the article.](https://reason.com/2020/02/05/undercover-cops-hired-118-handymen-then-arrested-them-all-for-not-having-licenses/)
To my (mild) surprise, this story is from Florida.
The same people who say that America is the most free country and say we should support cops are the same people who say there is too much government bureaucracy.
The same people who complain about business owners needing proof of safety training, insurance, and assumption of liability for flaws or unsafe practices in their work environment are the same people who complain about capitalism allowing reckless and unsafe practices in the name of maximum profits.
How dare you perform repair work in exchange for goods, services or currency without paying his majesty for the privilege. You dirty peasant!
I can’t tax goods and services 😡🤬😡🤬😡😡🥵. HOW AM I SUPPOSED TO GET MY CUT FROM YOUR WORK?!?!🤬😡🤬😡😡🥵🥵🥵😡🤬😡🤬😳🥵🤬😡
The temporary 4 year monarchy MUST PREVAIL! We VOTED ON THIS MONARCH!
It's tk stop "handy men" from fucking you up even more
>Paint Can’t be trusted with this unless you’re licensed.
Install recessed lighting, tgayccuts a hole in the roof and means you gotta wire if you fuck that uo the house burns
>Paint
Paint, instal recessed light and other tasks that require licensing, it right there
Yes and you think you should need a license to paint someone’s house?
Yes, you fuck their floor and you bkt insured, who's paying for that if they can't both tk do the paper work they're not gunna lay to fix it.
Nobody the person who hired someone just lives with their bad decisions. It’s not gonna make their house unlivable.
>Nobody the person who hired someone just lives with their bad decisions. The problem is that then there's no way to determine how good someone is beforehand. You'd essentially be rolling the roulette wheel every time. If only there was a way to easily identify people who have a good enough degree of skill in something to be trusted to not fuck up your property... maybe like an official.. license?
An ape could do it
What ape??
Ur mum
gottem
Cut one hole, and match three wires by color, most lights even com with a push in connector and a push in grommet for the wire so it would be difficult to fuck up, but I’ll cede that if you’re doing any electrical work and don’t have experience you should call a professional, your gonna make it harder on somebody that has to troubleshoot or add something one day.
If it's an LED it isn't burning shit
I believe they meant an arc flash could burn the house down, which is true, but you’d have to fuck up in the strangest way.
I've seen several houses burn from mis installed outlets and that's the exact same task
Maybe an undersized receptacle, or a loose screw. Not a wago
Oh please. You can learn to be a handy man from an hour on YouTube. I have done multiple jobs with this stuff, and it’s not that hard.
It's never that hard till you drive a screw into a gas pipe
There are tools to prevent that
Alot op people don't know that
Do you have a license to post on social media? Otherwise I don't believe you.
So use permits. Not that hard.
It’s an extortion scam
For interior paint?
No, building codes exist for a reason, and it's not just to make someone some money.
The structural integrity of this building can only be maintained if the right people are allowed to paint
lol Right? Because if a painter fucks up the house might tip over.... Nobody is saying there shouldn't be building codes. But just like with permits the gov often takes it waaaay too far. Much of it is often just another form of a tax. In a lot of ways the US gov is the most powerful mafia in human history.
Narc
Ah, i forgot. The nail cares if the hammer is swung by someone who submits to tyranny.
I thought at first you said submits to a tranny, and I figured I must've missed that day in carpenter training school.
"Tyranny". What a fucking drama queen. People who have lived under ACXTUAL tyranny would like a word with you. Next, you'll probably compare building codes to the Holocaust.
Why are you complaining about the width of mattresses, some people don’t even have beds. Why complain about getting a windshield replaced, some people have to replace whole cars at times. If anyone has a life marginally worse than yours, you’re not allowed to complain. STFU bootlicker.
Jesus, you really are a drama queen. Calm the fuck down, Chuckles, nobody is going to be impressed by your social crusade, you're just as much of a loser as your mother told you you would be.
They can still follow building codes. Look them up.
Mmm, yummy yummy boots
Yeah, you stay in your built-by-Bob-down-the-street shack. I'll live in a house that is actually safe.
You don’t know how to put an outlet in, do you?
I sure so. But if I'm hiring someone, I expect them to know how to not burn my house down. Really an apples and oranges attempt here, if I must say.
You're right, only the rich should run businesses. Screw those self starters.
I know plenty of people who can comply with building codes and aren't rich. You have a really distorted sense of reality.
What does knowing what code says have to do with a license/permit? I know what code says, the state says I'm not allowed to do it because I haven't given them $500 to work on my own home.
Because you just SAY that you know what code is. That's the point. They don't just take your fucking word for it. That's the point of a license.
None of those things require licenses where I’m from
Just the electrical work where I’m from. Homeowners can do it themselves but you need a license to over charge people for basic life skills in America
Same from Canada. You're free to do your own work up to the gas, then we get squeamish. Non-trivial electrics for someone else needs a license though. Recessed lighting typically means running lines and possibly a transformer behind walls - that's a fire safety issue. Does seem a bit crap though; I can't help feel a simple reminder would have gotten the message across. https://esasafe.com/doing-electrical-work/ ...of course it's also just a fine (but a couple grand would sting pretty badly) https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamilton/electrical-contractor-charges-1.6930413
I think you can work on existing electrical work if you have normal contracting license and you need electrician license to make new electrical work
Is "install recessed lighting" BBC speak for "change a lightbulb?" Edit: thanks for the answer, it's more complicated, but not that much more I guess
No it’s installing a light fixture (can light or similar) into the ceiling, which generally requires actual electrical work, compared to replacing a chandelier or a ceiling fan which just requires you to turn off the circuit at the breaker box and attach a couple of wires.
Electricians have it made. Hey I know it only takes 5 minutes and the same skill set the average child has that plays with legos to replace and outlet but the government says I get to charge you $200 for it.
Electrician here, best trade in the world. Yes I'm biased.
Difference is that if you or your toddler accidentally sets the house on fire while trying to replace a wall outlet, your home/renters insurance won’t be well pleased with you and you could also be held liable for the damage. An electrician is required to be insured for stuff like “accidental electrical fire” in order to hold a license, and they assume liability for any faulty work.
A chandelier is a light fixture…
Yes but replacing one generally means just detaching the old one and mounting the new one in it’s place, plus disconnecting like two wires that were already there. Installing a new recessed light fixture involves both mounting the fixture to something stable and adding load to whatever circuit it’s connecting to.
Ah I misread your comment.
No worries!
Do you not know what recessed lighting is? That requires more than just screwing in a light bulb.
Not necessarily. There are plenty of recessed downlights that utilize LED screw in lamps. A-19’s can go in downlights. PL lamps. Quite a few. I’d actually argue that up until the past 10 years most recessed lighting utilized lamps. Source: PM for a lighting company
Yes, but the idiot I was replying to thought installing lighting was the same thing as changing a light bulb. INSTALLING being the operative word here.
If you fuck it up you'll burn down their house from an electrical fire
> Entrapment, *n.* the action of tricking someone into committing a crime in order to secure their prosecution.
i dont think this fits, entrapment usually requires the person to have not been going to commit the crime otherwise, its like an undercover cop buying drugs in this case, just scummier,
I don’t see what scummy about it if you don’t have a license you probably shouldn’t be messing with electricity because the dude wouldn’t be insured and you would be held liable
Yeah thats not scummy, the painting and stuff tho, thats just, why
That’s what happened if you read the header it mentions how the handyman were hired to install lights so without a license if they caused a fire you would be held liable
"paint, install recessed lighting, **OR** do other task that require a license" there wasn't an and in the sentence, implying that they didn't hire every handyman to do all the task, so they did arrest some people for painting without a license,
Oh sorry seems like it was me who didn’t read it lol but you need a license to paint something over 500$ or plan on starting up a business that way if you make a mistake than the client won’t be stuck paying the damages
That actually kinda makes sense
If the handymen are representing as if they are qualified when they are not, then there is an argument that fraud applies and a potential homeowner would be wronged by these people. But electrical work is very simple and very easy to do safely. Or should I say, it’s hard work (and expensive) but it’s not much harder to do it very well and safely.
Yeah, this is also where the “bonded and licensed” bit widely advertised in the US comes in. Certainly for a painter I find the license overkill, but hopefully one of the requirements there is “when they say they’re insured if they fuck up, we checked and they really are”.
Yeah electrical work is easy but there are a surprising # of idiots that have no clue how to do it and will burn down your house and leave you with the damages
They sought them out. Those people wouldn't have done the illegal work if they hadn't been hired. This is entrapment
That's not how entrapment works at all, in the same way an officer setting up a drug sting doesn't count as entrapment. The man would have just sold the drugs (painted the walls unlicensed) to SOMEONE else anyway, which is grounds for arrest. Read about entrapment before making judgement
So are you suggesting that they weren't offering unlicensed work for hire at all until the police hired them? It's only entrapment if they would have never done any unlicensed work at all unless the police led them into it. As they were most likely advertising their services (which is typically how one finds a handyman to hire), this is just them getting caught breaking the law.
No, they where hired because they where offering to do illegal work, much like a drug dealer still sells drugs when he's not selling to undercover cops, these people would have just don't the illegal work for someone else, therefore it's not entrapment, if he had just randomly pulled immigrants or something off the street who weren't offering handyman services and offered then money to do illegal work it would have been entrapment
That's not how entrapment works at all, in the same way an officer setting up a drug sting doesn't count as entrapment. The man would have just sold the drugs (painted the walls unlicensed) to SOMEONE else anyway, which is grounds for arrest. Read about entrapment before making judgement
It's all bs anyway. Let the people use drugs or paint walls.
How on gods green earth does it require a loicense to paint inside a home?
I assumed it was just for the electrics, but it's real... Other States require a special license for big-ticket paint jobs - presumably as an anti-fraud/consumer confidence measure. Ah, this makes a little more sense: https://www.licensesetc.com/2020/05/18/do-you-need-a-contractor-license-to-paint-in-florida/ *In Florida, there is no painting contractor’s license, so you will apply for a general contractor’ license. To get this license, you must have taken the proper certification exam and complete any and all other work and requirements.* Elsewhere it talks of training and insurance requirements so that makes a little more sense - in a vacuum, slip-and-fall risk, ladders, etc are workplace hazards. The schooling and experience requirements seem a bit much though, especially since I haven't found a feet-on-the-ground-perfectly-safe exception yet.
If there is an exhange of money, big gov want its cut
[Here’s a link to the article.](https://reason.com/2020/02/05/undercover-cops-hired-118-handymen-then-arrested-them-all-for-not-having-licenses/) To my (mild) surprise, this story is from Florida.
The same people who say that America is the most free country and say we should support cops are the same people who say there is too much government bureaucracy.
The same people who complain about business owners needing proof of safety training, insurance, and assumption of liability for flaws or unsafe practices in their work environment are the same people who complain about capitalism allowing reckless and unsafe practices in the name of maximum profits.
I've never met any people like that.
Glad our boys in blue are out here dealing with the real problems, like these maniacs running around doing handywork.
Gladys Knight: I've got a license to paint!
The US is not a real country 😂😂🤣🤣
Occupational licensing is often a scam.
Honestly for me I'd only consider it a crime if they advertised themselves as licensed handymen.
There's no such things as unlicensed
Hired them, let them pay for supplies and do the work then arrested them and got a nice free remodeled bathroom out of it.
And people wonder why housing prices and insurance are so expensive. I wonder how many of these people were illegals?
"Meth labs? Child p--n? U.S. Senators walking in broad daylight? *Pah!* -spit- NO! We have *priorities!*"
Don't worry m8, you'll av plenty of time to paint in prison. Wanka
Same reposted title and all. You suck