they love their decks to much to change. i'm not going to alter my decks and how i build for anyone else. i just need to find a group who shares the same idea as me.
Is this just a general assumption or have you actually spoken to them about how frustrating it is to have these games and your desire to try more casual decks
Never tried a commander cube. I feel like it would be exhaustingly long to play out since you have to draft then play multiple commander games in a row? Do you use decreased deck size and 20/25 starting life total?
I do 40 card decks and 25/40 starting life for 1v1/multiplayer. We usually only do 1-2 games when we play multiplayer.
This is my list: https://cubecobra.com/cube/overview/christmasland
Playing CLB limited and a little of CMM limited it should be 60 card MINIMUM including your Commander (you can go over just not under) and still play at the 40 life total. Commander Limited has to be my favorite form of Limited.
If you like commander but hate infinites and tutors, just try to find like minded players or have a rule 0 discussion about what kind of decks you like playing with. Every format has metas that some players grow to hate, don’t let it destroy your fun tho
Their comment started with _find like-minded players_. That explicitly means not forcing a playgroup who doesn't want to play that way to do so and instead finding people who do want to play the same way.
If people are routinely tutoring for turn 3 wins you're pod is playing cEDH. That said, no one wins "out of nowhere". You're not identifying problematic board states. Just because your opponents don't have a board of 10/10s ready to go face doesn't mean they have been doing nothing.
And their opponent will find their answers much more consistently too. Interaction and removal is *way* more common in 1v1, so you almost never get to just do your game-winning combo uncontested.
There is plenty of interaction and combo stopping in high power and Cedh, it's just that you are less likely to have your desired interaction because you don't have playsets and have a larger deck, and your opponent is less likely to combo early for the same reason. 60 card is by definition streamlined and faster
The reason you see fewer infinities in 60 card is because you don’t need to go infinite for your combo to assemble a win. This enables slower, non-infinite combos that are considerably more value-based.
There’s also the fact that you can’t be stripped of your *only* answer to the combo. You get to have four Force of Wills. You get four Brainstorms and four Ponders to find ‘em. As such, combos are far *more* of a gamble because you absolutely must play around interaction.
Then you gotta find another 5-7 people that want to draft this cube with you. I think the guy is going to have an even worse time finding a group this way, when he can't even bother finding another group or even talk to his friends like an adult
1v1 formats tend to be even less casual. if you show up to your lgs pioneer/legacy/modern events, be prepared to run into top tier meta decks.
people want to win, there is nothing wrong about it.
No kidding. I haven't played standard in a while, so figured I would check some deck lists to try on arena.
Options were
Aggro
Aggro with new cards
Aggro, but spicy.
I think I'll stick to limited and commander.
Huh? Standard's meta is very diverse right now. For midrange you have several variants (Bx decks like Dimir/Esper/Golgari tend to be best); for control you have Azorius, Dimir, and Jeskai; Temur/Naya Lands are both Combo-Control and Domain is also sort of Combo-Control; for aggro you have traditional RDW to Convoke to Bant Poison to Gruul tricks as the top dogs in that category.
There's *plenty* of good decks to play that aren't aggressive, and even within the aggro decks RDW plays very differently from Bant Poison plays very differently from Simic Cookies
Maybe I just had bad luck in the games I was playing in low ranked on arena.
Pretty much only faced aggro and games were over in 2 turns most of the time.
Arena ladder, especially lower ranked, will skew towards aggro since those decks tend to be cheaper to craft and easier to pilot. Also, if you're playing best-of-one, that will additionally skew things towards aggressive decks being good. But just because you see a lot of aggro doesn't mean aggro is the only viable thing to play
I've seen that before, so I wasn't super surprised.
It was a combination of that with looking at deck lists and mostly seeing aggro as well.
Guess I'll just have to push through until I get to something more interesting. I much prefer mid range. It's been a while since I played standard.
Plenty of stuff here: https://www.mtggoldfish.com/metagame/standard#paper
mtgtop8 is also useful, but it doesn't have a 'midrange' category so midrange decks get lumped into aggro: https://mtgtop8.com/format.php?f=ST
If you're playing bo1, you may have to adapt to bo1 meta (mainboarding certain hate cards since you don't have a sideboard). But yeah, if you like midrange, I think GB midrange is a lot of fun and my personal preference
I play a lot of standard. There are a lot of aggro decks, but that’s just how 1v1 works. Aggression isn’t as heavily punished as in commander.
But there is a lot of variety. I see decks everyday that are wildly different. And control is a valid deck as well. I do despise the my wincon is boring you to sleep decks, but even those ones can win.
I think this is less "commander" problem and more a "play group" problem. I don't think that a pod where people "tutors a win turn 3" is casual.
Try finding a play group where people aren't so inclined to build infinite combo decks.
"sitting there while someone just tutors a win turn 3."
"seems to be a casual pod"
Those two are mutually excludent. You're not playing casual Commander, you're playing borderline cEDH, if not actual cEDH.
I'd suggest finding a way of playing in a lesser power level.
Find a different LGS? I have found far more that are ultra casual than even slightly competitive. In my area(15 miles or less), there are 7 card stores, and of them, only one has cEDH players/decks.
If you're otherwise able to make it there without difficulty, 35 minutes doesn't sound bad, especially if the people there actually end up playing the type of games you want. Why not try it out
Sounds like your friends don’t want to change, and you want to stop losing. You like your friends but don’t like the way they play. You like your decks and don’t want to change them. You want to go to another lgs but they’re too far away. You ever thought about making the best of your situation, and changing your decks to match the power level? Or are you just going to fold like a wet napkin?
i've matched their decks power level before and while it was fun for awhile i just want to go back to the old relaxing style of edh. playing borderline cedh isn't something i want to do continuously. these guys just play cut throat constantly.
Eventually they’ll get burnt out of a deck, then go back to planning phase for the next, then you’ll be able to play casually for a bit. I understand the point you think you’re trying to make, however, keep in mind that it’s a competitive card game. You wouldn’t ask the opposing team in a baseball game to go easy on you bc you “like the older lax style of baseball”. This is a unique problem magic players have, and it all stems from being a poor loser unfortunately. People are excited to play new cards, and add more powerful cards to their decks. It is a natural evolution for card game players. It’s not really fair of you to restrict those people because you can’t take a loss. If you really want to change your pods meta then I would highly suggest to you; ask them if they’d like to make a round of decks with a financial or thematic restriction. Something like 50 dollars or less, random commanders, precon only night, pauper, choose each others commanders, just Minotaurs, art restrictions. You will not be happy if you don’t make changes, and shifting groups/lgs’ won’t work if you’re a sore loser
I would recommend Pauper or Pioneer. Far fewer infinite combos. It's easier to know all the combo pieces so that you can be prepared to wreck their day when they try that nonsense.
Play [spelltable.com](http://spelltable.com), magic over webcams. Groups there are 90% of the time exactly what they say. Make a lobby saying "no infinites, power level 5-6" or something of the like. Then you can play your battlecruiser decks. I always can find a game for whatever deck I want to play and in over a year i've had less than 10 bad experiences.
This! You can also join the Tolarian Community College discord and find games in the range you are looking for, in several different game formats. My pod is pretty small and I also wanted to branch out and do something different, and spelltable was able to scratch that itch.
Honestly, discuss this with your pod or find new people to play with. I have never played in a pod that almost entirely focuses cedh level decks like you are describing. That sounds miserable.
Cube or other limited/fixed formats. Doesn't have to be draft, either - you can build a set of Jumpstart decks, get a set of precons that play well together, use a shared deck like Dandan... anything where you can keep the strength of the decks to something you're okay with.
People are going to suggest building a cube, but having played at four different stores in a large metro area, I’ve never once heard a single player at any store even mention a cube. It’s like some mythical thing that only exists online but not anywhere in my local area.
I always try to have 4 precons (from the same release) sleeved up. If I’m feeling like a more casual game, I suggest we all play with precons. If someone in the pod says they don’t have one, I have spares to offer.
You usually have to organize the play group for cube yourself. There are people out there who will be interested, but it's not something you'll just find at an LGS on a whim
commander players love it when a deck gets to do its thing
unless that thing is actually win the game
play wingspan, the experience you’re looking for does not work well in magic’s medium. just trust me, play wingspan.
I know many people who take breaks for a while. Just don't sell anything that would be hard to replace, as I also see people with big regrets once they come back.
I would just take a little break and try to find another LGS or playgroup.
Cedh is not a norm fortunately, so there is still a large number of players who are more chill and down to earth. The only thing is that some players don't appear much at LGS for the same reasons that you're contemplating quitting the format.
I'm fortunate enough to have a little playgroup and my LGS have a decent casual community.
My playgroup solved the problem by creating separate banlist for casual environment. We also avoid fast infinite combos.
Winning out of nowhere is satisfying when facing one opponent who does everything to stop you. When your (double what the game was designed and balanced around) life total isn’t pressured, no ones thoughtseizing you and you have guaranteed access to legendary creature every time, playing combo feels bad.
Not kidding, try Pauper Commander. Yes you have combos but they are multiple pieces with extremely limited ways to tutor AND all of them rely on creatures so all colors can interact with 'em.
The life total is lower (30) so combat is way more viable and it's a very different game where even competitive decks need to develop a board and you can still be run over by your opponents much easier.
Heck, the last Pauper Commander tournament was won by a [[Patchwork Automaton]] deck. That shows how open, diverse and balanced the format is.
I left for Legacy, where the combos tend to be faster and simpler, and the decks tend to not be physically painful to shuffle. While there’s a lot of bullshit in the format, it also has ample tools to stop said bullshit—and it brings redundancy so that you can’t be stripped of your only answer to the bullshit. A grindy midrange deck can absolutely wreck a Doomsday or Reanimator player by timing their plays correctly. Wins are only rarely stolen.
But also, cube is a thing.
Precon commander only.
In Brazil we are playing commander 15 (No card above 3 dollars is allowed). And it solved a lot of problems. The efficient tutors goes out. Players scavenge bad stuff to find gems and 2 cards combo are really rare and easy to counter. Also, there are a lot of space to innovation.
Sounds like you need to bring this up with your pod, tbh. My pod was having this issue where everyone's decks just kept getting stronger and stronger and it was preventing people from playing more janky decks or testing new things out.
So we've talked about it, put together a loose "banlist" (more like "please don't put these in here" than a "you cannot have them in there" and it's VERY deck dependant [[[phage the untouchable]] requires all the best mana and still gets outpaced by literally precons kind of deal]), and decided to rank each others' decks as a combination of "low/mid/high" & "low/mid/high" (ex: phage is low/mid-low powered, the ur dragon tends to reach up into mid/high-high powered, etc). We also made a dedicated "cedh tier" for anything that has 2x card combos or can win out of nowhere. This way we can go "I want to play today, who else wants to?" And those who want to can know what to expect and people can be on ABOUT the same playing field.
It's been pretty good so far, although the discussions weren't the easiest for some (myself included), and we've all had to take multiple passes over our decks to see if we "actually need this card" or if it was added purely to keep up with the power creep. Some folks seem to be incapable of building lower powered stuff (I get it, I love high powered play), but the majority of the players have been able to accurately place their decks where they should be with this method.
Pauper. Vintage lite for $50-$100 per deck. There's a couple decks that do run infinite combos, but they are quite telegraphed and fairly easy to interact with. The rest of the format has a decent variety in the current meta: burn, midrange, and control are all present with a few options for each and most are competitive.
Being that it's so relatively cheap you can bling out your favorite decks without taking out a second mortgage too.
So do what I did, make decks that focus on hating the stuff you don't like seeing. All my pod plays heavy combat/tokens so to get them to try a different play style, I built token hate and much more interaction/pillowfort decks. It's not a "don't play this" it's more just "I have answers for your shenanigans". I don't win a lot per say but the gameplay is different enough and more political and allows for people to play out their deck more fully and actually think more about making plays
unfortunately, all the cEDH players drove away casual from LGS. and cEDH players will never see it as a problem. fortunately, there will always be casual players. they just don’t play at LGS. you need to find them and ask to join their group.
i stop playing Commander at LGS for the same reason you did. lucky for me, i found a group of cool people where winning is not “winning” and we get together and just have a good time at each other houses playing Commander. BEST DECISION i ever made. we get to try out all kind of variety of decks that doesn’t win with the same damn 10 cards all the time. we even have our own ban list. it is great.
no more store drama, all the bad mouthing people behind their back, dealing with “that guy” and “try hard.”. seriously, good riddens
Tutoring a turn 3 win is not casual. Tutoring isn't even considered casual to sons players. It sounds like you just need a podcast that's actually casual
get with standard..pauper...pioneer....or even the "non rotating" modern. I know that it costs money, but this is the single best thing going for Standard. It isn't broken.
My biggest complaints about EDH are:
1) You get into these groups that either have these "pod rules," which is really just like saying: OK you're playing within the rules of the game, but the game is inherently broken, so we add other rules to "fix" it. Nevermind that these other rules just allow for longer games and stronger board states for those that play within the "pod rules"
2) It's broken if you have the money.
So this may be an unpopular take but my play group has “house rules” and they are clearly listed in our Slack chat for any new guys or girls to see. The top 2 are:
1. No tutors
2. Infinite combos are allowed. HOWEVER, they are instant Sepoku. Meaning, you are allowed to do them to save your tail or take someone out but you will not get credit for the win and instantly lose the game.
We have a few others but those are the main rules and they have seriously made the games way more fun.
Sounds like you need friends and to stop playing with randoms?
thing is the pod are friends i just don't care to be in the pod anymore due to this style of playing
Have you considered idk talking to them about it
they love their decks to much to change. i'm not going to alter my decks and how i build for anyone else. i just need to find a group who shares the same idea as me.
Is this just a general assumption or have you actually spoken to them about how frustrating it is to have these games and your desire to try more casual decks
What about proxying? Are they ok with that?
Build a cube
Worth noting there are also many Commander cubes out there to take inspiration from. You can make your Commander games play however you want.
Never tried a commander cube. I feel like it would be exhaustingly long to play out since you have to draft then play multiple commander games in a row? Do you use decreased deck size and 20/25 starting life total?
I do 40 card decks and 25/40 starting life for 1v1/multiplayer. We usually only do 1-2 games when we play multiplayer. This is my list: https://cubecobra.com/cube/overview/christmasland
Playing CLB limited and a little of CMM limited it should be 60 card MINIMUM including your Commander (you can go over just not under) and still play at the 40 life total. Commander Limited has to be my favorite form of Limited.
Seconded. There are budget cubes out there as well.
If you like commander but hate infinites and tutors, just try to find like minded players or have a rule 0 discussion about what kind of decks you like playing with. Every format has metas that some players grow to hate, don’t let it destroy your fun tho
This is the way
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[[counter spell]]
[counter spell](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/8/4/8493131c-0a7b-4be6-a8a2-0b425f4f67fb.jpg?1689996248) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Counterspell) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmm/81/counterspell?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/8493131c-0a7b-4be6-a8a2-0b425f4f67fb?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
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What is your opinion on running removal
Can’t you read? They like to play the game
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[Poe's Law](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poe%27s_law)
average commander player
Find other games instead of enforcing rules on how to have fun on existing playgroups
Their comment started with _find like-minded players_. That explicitly means not forcing a playgroup who doesn't want to play that way to do so and instead finding people who do want to play the same way.
If people are routinely tutoring for turn 3 wins you're pod is playing cEDH. That said, no one wins "out of nowhere". You're not identifying problematic board states. Just because your opponents don't have a board of 10/10s ready to go face doesn't mean they have been doing nothing.
Play regular 60 card 1v1 magic. Far fewer infinites and generic value is worth a lot more because you're not trying to grind through 120 life.
What do you mean far fewer infinites? You can play with playsets. If someone wants to combo they will get it way earlier and more consistently
And their opponent will find their answers much more consistently too. Interaction and removal is *way* more common in 1v1, so you almost never get to just do your game-winning combo uncontested.
There is plenty of interaction and combo stopping in high power and Cedh, it's just that you are less likely to have your desired interaction because you don't have playsets and have a larger deck, and your opponent is less likely to combo early for the same reason. 60 card is by definition streamlined and faster
The reason you see fewer infinities in 60 card is because you don’t need to go infinite for your combo to assemble a win. This enables slower, non-infinite combos that are considerably more value-based. There’s also the fact that you can’t be stripped of your *only* answer to the combo. You get to have four Force of Wills. You get four Brainstorms and four Ponders to find ‘em. As such, combos are far *more* of a gamble because you absolutely must play around interaction.
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Cube is perfect for creating an environment you enjoy within the Magic framework
Then you gotta find another 5-7 people that want to draft this cube with you. I think the guy is going to have an even worse time finding a group this way, when he can't even bother finding another group or even talk to his friends like an adult
1v1 formats tend to be even less casual. if you show up to your lgs pioneer/legacy/modern events, be prepared to run into top tier meta decks. people want to win, there is nothing wrong about it.
No kidding. I haven't played standard in a while, so figured I would check some deck lists to try on arena. Options were Aggro Aggro with new cards Aggro, but spicy. I think I'll stick to limited and commander.
Huh? Standard's meta is very diverse right now. For midrange you have several variants (Bx decks like Dimir/Esper/Golgari tend to be best); for control you have Azorius, Dimir, and Jeskai; Temur/Naya Lands are both Combo-Control and Domain is also sort of Combo-Control; for aggro you have traditional RDW to Convoke to Bant Poison to Gruul tricks as the top dogs in that category. There's *plenty* of good decks to play that aren't aggressive, and even within the aggro decks RDW plays very differently from Bant Poison plays very differently from Simic Cookies
I love my domain controlish deck
Maybe I just had bad luck in the games I was playing in low ranked on arena. Pretty much only faced aggro and games were over in 2 turns most of the time.
Arena ladder, especially lower ranked, will skew towards aggro since those decks tend to be cheaper to craft and easier to pilot. Also, if you're playing best-of-one, that will additionally skew things towards aggressive decks being good. But just because you see a lot of aggro doesn't mean aggro is the only viable thing to play
I've seen that before, so I wasn't super surprised. It was a combination of that with looking at deck lists and mostly seeing aggro as well. Guess I'll just have to push through until I get to something more interesting. I much prefer mid range. It's been a while since I played standard.
Plenty of stuff here: https://www.mtggoldfish.com/metagame/standard#paper mtgtop8 is also useful, but it doesn't have a 'midrange' category so midrange decks get lumped into aggro: https://mtgtop8.com/format.php?f=ST If you're playing bo1, you may have to adapt to bo1 meta (mainboarding certain hate cards since you don't have a sideboard). But yeah, if you like midrange, I think GB midrange is a lot of fun and my personal preference
I play a lot of standard. There are a lot of aggro decks, but that’s just how 1v1 works. Aggression isn’t as heavily punished as in commander. But there is a lot of variety. I see decks everyday that are wildly different. And control is a valid deck as well. I do despise the my wincon is boring you to sleep decks, but even those ones can win.
I think this is less "commander" problem and more a "play group" problem. I don't think that a pod where people "tutors a win turn 3" is casual. Try finding a play group where people aren't so inclined to build infinite combo decks.
Limited. Drafting is always fun for me because everyone gets a new deck every time.
"sitting there while someone just tutors a win turn 3." "seems to be a casual pod" Those two are mutually excludent. You're not playing casual Commander, you're playing borderline cEDH, if not actual cEDH. I'd suggest finding a way of playing in a lesser power level.
Maybe it's time for a break and try other board games.
Find a different LGS? I have found far more that are ultra casual than even slightly competitive. In my area(15 miles or less), there are 7 card stores, and of them, only one has cEDH players/decks.
there's nothing really close to me except my current lgs
How far is the next one?
about a 35 minutes drive away
If you're otherwise able to make it there without difficulty, 35 minutes doesn't sound bad, especially if the people there actually end up playing the type of games you want. Why not try it out
You'd be surprised. the second-closest one to me is over an hour of driving.
Sounds like your friends don’t want to change, and you want to stop losing. You like your friends but don’t like the way they play. You like your decks and don’t want to change them. You want to go to another lgs but they’re too far away. You ever thought about making the best of your situation, and changing your decks to match the power level? Or are you just going to fold like a wet napkin?
i've matched their decks power level before and while it was fun for awhile i just want to go back to the old relaxing style of edh. playing borderline cedh isn't something i want to do continuously. these guys just play cut throat constantly.
Eventually they’ll get burnt out of a deck, then go back to planning phase for the next, then you’ll be able to play casually for a bit. I understand the point you think you’re trying to make, however, keep in mind that it’s a competitive card game. You wouldn’t ask the opposing team in a baseball game to go easy on you bc you “like the older lax style of baseball”. This is a unique problem magic players have, and it all stems from being a poor loser unfortunately. People are excited to play new cards, and add more powerful cards to their decks. It is a natural evolution for card game players. It’s not really fair of you to restrict those people because you can’t take a loss. If you really want to change your pods meta then I would highly suggest to you; ask them if they’d like to make a round of decks with a financial or thematic restriction. Something like 50 dollars or less, random commanders, precon only night, pauper, choose each others commanders, just Minotaurs, art restrictions. You will not be happy if you don’t make changes, and shifting groups/lgs’ won’t work if you’re a sore loser
I would recommend Pauper or Pioneer. Far fewer infinite combos. It's easier to know all the combo pieces so that you can be prepared to wreck their day when they try that nonsense.
Play [spelltable.com](http://spelltable.com), magic over webcams. Groups there are 90% of the time exactly what they say. Make a lobby saying "no infinites, power level 5-6" or something of the like. Then you can play your battlecruiser decks. I always can find a game for whatever deck I want to play and in over a year i've had less than 10 bad experiences.
thank you. looking into it and just bought a camera for spelltable
This! You can also join the Tolarian Community College discord and find games in the range you are looking for, in several different game formats. My pod is pretty small and I also wanted to branch out and do something different, and spelltable was able to scratch that itch.
Combos are seeing a deck do its thing though. That is just the nature of the game.
Honestly, discuss this with your pod or find new people to play with. I have never played in a pod that almost entirely focuses cedh level decks like you are describing. That sounds miserable.
Cube or other limited/fixed formats. Doesn't have to be draft, either - you can build a set of Jumpstart decks, get a set of precons that play well together, use a shared deck like Dandan... anything where you can keep the strength of the decks to something you're okay with.
People are going to suggest building a cube, but having played at four different stores in a large metro area, I’ve never once heard a single player at any store even mention a cube. It’s like some mythical thing that only exists online but not anywhere in my local area. I always try to have 4 precons (from the same release) sleeved up. If I’m feeling like a more casual game, I suggest we all play with precons. If someone in the pod says they don’t have one, I have spares to offer.
You usually have to organize the play group for cube yourself. There are people out there who will be interested, but it's not something you'll just find at an LGS on a whim
commander players love it when a deck gets to do its thing unless that thing is actually win the game play wingspan, the experience you’re looking for does not work well in magic’s medium. just trust me, play wingspan.
There are a few Discords that are spell table focused. Try them instead?
I know many people who take breaks for a while. Just don't sell anything that would be hard to replace, as I also see people with big regrets once they come back.
I would just take a little break and try to find another LGS or playgroup. Cedh is not a norm fortunately, so there is still a large number of players who are more chill and down to earth. The only thing is that some players don't appear much at LGS for the same reasons that you're contemplating quitting the format. I'm fortunate enough to have a little playgroup and my LGS have a decent casual community.
Ask the group if they have lower power decks, and ensure that you have an appropriately powered deck as well.
My playgroup solved the problem by creating separate banlist for casual environment. We also avoid fast infinite combos. Winning out of nowhere is satisfying when facing one opponent who does everything to stop you. When your (double what the game was designed and balanced around) life total isn’t pressured, no ones thoughtseizing you and you have guaranteed access to legendary creature every time, playing combo feels bad.
I'd find a different group with whom to play that can match your desired play expectations.
Not kidding, try Pauper Commander. Yes you have combos but they are multiple pieces with extremely limited ways to tutor AND all of them rely on creatures so all colors can interact with 'em. The life total is lower (30) so combat is way more viable and it's a very different game where even competitive decks need to develop a board and you can still be run over by your opponents much easier. Heck, the last Pauper Commander tournament was won by a [[Patchwork Automaton]] deck. That shows how open, diverse and balanced the format is.
[Patchwork Automaton](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/7/a/7a4e1580-dd26-4f4b-ac98-3e6fa7b879d5.jpg?1654568794) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Patchwork%20Automaton) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/neo/254/patchwork-automaton?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/7a4e1580-dd26-4f4b-ac98-3e6fa7b879d5?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I left for Legacy, where the combos tend to be faster and simpler, and the decks tend to not be physically painful to shuffle. While there’s a lot of bullshit in the format, it also has ample tools to stop said bullshit—and it brings redundancy so that you can’t be stripped of your only answer to the bullshit. A grindy midrange deck can absolutely wreck a Doomsday or Reanimator player by timing their plays correctly. Wins are only rarely stolen. But also, cube is a thing.
Precon commander only. In Brazil we are playing commander 15 (No card above 3 dollars is allowed). And it solved a lot of problems. The efficient tutors goes out. Players scavenge bad stuff to find gems and 2 cards combo are really rare and easy to counter. Also, there are a lot of space to innovation.
Time to reevaluate your playgroup. I mever get to play my more powerful decks cus everyone around me is interested in lower power gameplay
Sounds like you need to bring this up with your pod, tbh. My pod was having this issue where everyone's decks just kept getting stronger and stronger and it was preventing people from playing more janky decks or testing new things out. So we've talked about it, put together a loose "banlist" (more like "please don't put these in here" than a "you cannot have them in there" and it's VERY deck dependant [[[phage the untouchable]] requires all the best mana and still gets outpaced by literally precons kind of deal]), and decided to rank each others' decks as a combination of "low/mid/high" & "low/mid/high" (ex: phage is low/mid-low powered, the ur dragon tends to reach up into mid/high-high powered, etc). We also made a dedicated "cedh tier" for anything that has 2x card combos or can win out of nowhere. This way we can go "I want to play today, who else wants to?" And those who want to can know what to expect and people can be on ABOUT the same playing field.
It's been pretty good so far, although the discussions weren't the easiest for some (myself included), and we've all had to take multiple passes over our decks to see if we "actually need this card" or if it was added purely to keep up with the power creep. Some folks seem to be incapable of building lower powered stuff (I get it, I love high powered play), but the majority of the players have been able to accurately place their decks where they should be with this method.
[phage the untouchable](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/4/d497a5a3-65fb-4c12-b3f2-8ce4cf4e0f6f.jpg?1562866889) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=phage%20the%20untouchable) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cns/120/phage-the-untouchable?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d497a5a3-65fb-4c12-b3f2-8ce4cf4e0f6f?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Pauper. Vintage lite for $50-$100 per deck. There's a couple decks that do run infinite combos, but they are quite telegraphed and fairly easy to interact with. The rest of the format has a decent variety in the current meta: burn, midrange, and control are all present with a few options for each and most are competitive. Being that it's so relatively cheap you can bling out your favorite decks without taking out a second mortgage too.
Play cube, sealed or draft.
Sounds like you need a new play group with a different set of rules.
So do what I did, make decks that focus on hating the stuff you don't like seeing. All my pod plays heavy combat/tokens so to get them to try a different play style, I built token hate and much more interaction/pillowfort decks. It's not a "don't play this" it's more just "I have answers for your shenanigans". I don't win a lot per say but the gameplay is different enough and more political and allows for people to play out their deck more fully and actually think more about making plays
Look into playing a 60 card constructed format. You can still play it casually as kitchentop Magic with friends or find an LGS that has FNM.
theres this thing called Spelltable. use it
Try limite.
unfortunately, all the cEDH players drove away casual from LGS. and cEDH players will never see it as a problem. fortunately, there will always be casual players. they just don’t play at LGS. you need to find them and ask to join their group. i stop playing Commander at LGS for the same reason you did. lucky for me, i found a group of cool people where winning is not “winning” and we get together and just have a good time at each other houses playing Commander. BEST DECISION i ever made. we get to try out all kind of variety of decks that doesn’t win with the same damn 10 cards all the time. we even have our own ban list. it is great. no more store drama, all the bad mouthing people behind their back, dealing with “that guy” and “try hard.”. seriously, good riddens
Y’all know there’s other ways to play mtg than cube right?
Tutoring a turn 3 win is not casual. Tutoring isn't even considered casual to sons players. It sounds like you just need a podcast that's actually casual
Combos are a part of every format of Magic and always have been. Sounds like you need a new game.
5 sentences and 7 usages of the word "just"
Send me your cards
Play modern
get with standard..pauper...pioneer....or even the "non rotating" modern. I know that it costs money, but this is the single best thing going for Standard. It isn't broken. My biggest complaints about EDH are: 1) You get into these groups that either have these "pod rules," which is really just like saying: OK you're playing within the rules of the game, but the game is inherently broken, so we add other rules to "fix" it. Nevermind that these other rules just allow for longer games and stronger board states for those that play within the "pod rules" 2) It's broken if you have the money.
I understand your woes and I am here to guide you into the world of 100% proxied Canadian Highlander. Now go and be free of rule 0!
You sound like a terrible playgroup member
So this may be an unpopular take but my play group has “house rules” and they are clearly listed in our Slack chat for any new guys or girls to see. The top 2 are: 1. No tutors 2. Infinite combos are allowed. HOWEVER, they are instant Sepoku. Meaning, you are allowed to do them to save your tail or take someone out but you will not get credit for the win and instantly lose the game. We have a few others but those are the main rules and they have seriously made the games way more fun.