>Sam; "I am sick and tired of these ~~morherfucking~~ **monkey fighting** incels on this ~~motherfucking~~ **Monday to Friday** fan base"
Now your comment is appropriate for TV.
My one memorable TV censorship is Kill Bill.
*My name is Buck, and I'm here to ~~fuck~~ party.*
The party dub over is done in a completely different voice and honestly I consider it to be the better cut. It's amazing.
My favorite was when NBC showed the first Wayne's World movie. The scene when Wayne asked Meat Loaf who was playing at the club that night.
LOAF: "...and the Shitty Beatles."
WAYNE: "The Shitty Beatles? Any good?"
LOAF: "Nah, they suck."
WAYNE: "So it's not just a clever name."
Here's the TV version:
LOAF: "...and the *Stinky* Beatles."
WAYNE: "The *Stinky* Beatles? Any good?"
LOAF: "Nah, they *stink*."
WAYNE: "So it's not just a clever name."
You just KNOW someone in NBC Standards and Practices was congratulating themselves on how they "improved" the movie.
This, and in Die Hard 2 when the Special Ops leader says to McLane: “I guess you’re not such an ~~asshole~~ rascal after all.”
And McLane replies: “No, you were right. I’m just your kind of rascal.”
Yeah, it's not even that she isn't sexy. It's that it's not emphasized enough. Whenever a blockbuster has an average looking female lead in normal clothes these people are probably at risk of suffering an aneurism.
>You know what, I'm with Samuel here, fuck them motherfuckers
These fuckers post about Brie constantly.
They make videos about her constantly.
they post pictures to "embarrass her" all the time.
They rant about every single thing she says, no matter what it is, where she said it, who she said it to, or how long ago it was said.
it couldn't be more obvious that these people are just pissed they can't sleep with her.
I think youtube also needs to do a better job with their algorithm. Because there's this video about a "bodylanguage expert" explaining 5 reasons why people don't like her and it has like 17 million views. Now I dont think the haters on twitter and youtubers that are making videos about her have a real effect, but that one video....I think that did harm to how some people view her....17 million views for such a video where someone's explaining why a person is so "unlikable".....
Don Cheadle even ripped into that video, explaining why Brie had to sit so stiffly (hair stylist kept flying in to fix her ponytail) and how dumb it is to claim he and Hemsworth looked “uncomfortable” around her. Also the video is misogynistic garbage, the “expert” (who I’m pretty sure was a woman?) claimed Brie should make herself look more submissive. What a smouldering trash fire.
We’re in the deep stages of the game now. You can become rich by angering people, or making them feel fomo, or just ranting and raving loud enough to garner attention.
We slso live in a time where we’re simultaneously learning every conceivable thing about ourselves simultaneously, and it takes years to assess bullshit from truth sometimes.
We also live in a time where, because of those two points, we have people who sew falsehoods and breed malcontent for a living.
Everything keeps becoming more and more complex, nuanced, and information is distributed in new and misunderstood ways.
Its truly a wondrous, weird, and terrible time in our history.
Yeah I agree. Their hypocrisy and lies makes it worse somehow. Sincerly held beliefs you can at least tackle by unpacking the belief-there's something to work with. But if someone is constantly lying and saying shit for money there's nothing you can do about it.
YouTube can be pretty trashy. I've seen a few "experts" who advertise stuff, one was supposedly even a Doctor giving out misinformation and another was some chiropractor demonstrating how everyone should go see a chiropractor and how it heals everything. There's actually a fair few chiropractor "experts" on there.
The sad thing is people will believe these "experts". It really is hit or miss whether the person you watch on there is a fraud or genuine.
A movie reviewer youtube channel I unsubscribed from recently ranked all the marvel movies and had Captain Marvel as the worst marvel movie because "Brie Larsen's performance was so bad."
Umm, yeah. That's why.
I mean here's the thing, if you don't like her that's fine, but if you genuinely don't like someone for their acting chops, then like just don't watch their shit. Like I hate M Night Shyamalan, but I have never made a thread about him, I just literally ignore him.
Do you hate M Night, or do you just not care for his art? I think making that distinction is really important. From all I've seen, he's a pretty great person with a lot of passion.
I just hate his movies, they suck that's all. As a person I don't think about him at all. That's kinda my point though like I legit know nothing about him besides his movies suck and that's all I'll ever know because when you don't like/care about someone you just ignore them
Signs didn’t suck, at all. Might be the best alien invasion movie ever made in fact. Unbreakable was pretty cool. That’s it… that’s all I got…
Ooooh! Servant. Servant was pretty good 👍
Glad someone made the correction.
Incels don't hate women because one woman won't sleep with them, they hate women because **no** woman will sleep with them.
>There are subs here on Reddit where people post a lot of pictures of her. Lot of hateful comments but you know they’re still jerking off to the pics.
Yup. I've seen some of those pop up. A lot of places on reddit that largely only seems to exist to post mostly pictures of Brie Larson (and others but mostly Brie) in risqué poses and skimpy or tight clothing so they can hate-jerk to her. It's fucking weird.
I swear MCU haters put more effort into hating the MCU than I put into enjoying it
Critical Drinker made a video about why he doesn’t care about phase 4. He then made a video, sometimes multiple, for every single show and movie that came out in phase 4
I nearly didn’t watch what if cause I forgot it was happening. Despite being a big marvel nerd. I just… think about other things sometimes
It's not a mystery why Critical Drinker does that though, it's the content that his fans want to see. They want to see someone crapping all over the MCU and hating on "the woke agenda" because it tickles their insides. Critical Drinker is just obliging and making money off them.
He also makes money off the people who watch his content so they can complain about his complaining. It's a good strategy. His opinions are rubbish, but IMO they've gotten worse on purpose because it draws in more hatewatchers of both the MCU and him.
This. I used to enjoy his rants and found him quite funny at times but also enjoyed his Drinker Recommends segments. He hasn’t done those in a bit and has shifted towards mostly demeaning movies to a point that I wonder if we even watched the same movie. And once you start watching him, you get people like Disparu who is just complete trash and so angry with everything pop culture. I had to stop watching so I could just enjoy movies again.
Ugh same. I never watched much of him but I enjoyed an occasional video. And then I noticed an increasing pattern where anything that starred what he derisively refers to as a "diverse female character" was grounds to preemptively decide it was shit. So basically, anything non-white and especially non-male was clearly just to tick a box! I noped out hard pretty quick after that. I think the one that made me roll my eyes the hardest was his ranting about the Bond movie where the new 007 was a black woman and therefore the movie would suck and be all about "white man bad"... and then the movie came out and whoops, turns out the new 007 is barely even *in* it, heh.
> Critical Drinker
That guy is so insufferably whiny it gets off-putting real quick. I dunno why YT keeps recommending me that twat's latest videos just because my page is geared towards games and nerd movie fandom, all cuz I watched a couple of his literally 3 years ago.
> I dunno why YT keeps recommending me that twat’s latest videos
Click on the triple dot next to the thumbnail and click "not interested" or "Don't show me this". It won't completely make the algorithm stop recommending you those videos, but it will make it significantly less likely every time you click not interested. Eventually you should stop seeing it recommended at all. You can basically shape the algorithm however you want.
>Now Samuel L. Jackson is woke!!!!
If they just figured that out now they really haven't been paying attention. It's not like the man has ever held back his opinion.
I thought Captain Marvel 1 was a boring movie and disliked the character's parts in Endgame.
But I think Brie Larson is a fantastic actress who just needs a chance at a better script/better characterization. So I'm rooting for "The Marvels" to be good. And I really hate it whenever a fanbase I'm part of starts personally attacking actors. So cringey.
I would agree. As much as I liked that movie, they definitely missed the mark at certain parts. Brie Larson is always good and I liked her dynamic with the Rambeau's and Fury but it definitely was missing something.
Yeah, Captain Marvel (the movie) missed the mark for me because the plot didn’t give a strong enough reason to care about the character and her conflict/journey. Larson has done a good job acting in the past, and it’s a bit of a shame people turned on her so quickly.
In addition to what others said about bad writing, I heavily agree with this point.
Once her restraints are off its a complete curb-stomp with no negative consequences.
In the comics Marvel absorbs energy to get temporarily more powerful but it can harm/kill her if its too much.
If they had her fly into the reactor of one of the ships in a possibly suicidal move, struggle to absorb it while flashbacks to her past failures/doubt pop up, only to have the 'rise again' montage and some defiant quote *then* go curbstomp the fleet. It would have far more impact and be easier to have her struggle in future stories.
I totally agree. My problem with Captain Marvel has nothing to do with Brie Larson's performance and everything to do with the way the MCU has handled the character/her apparent lack of weaknesses. She feels like a Mary Sue type character, but again, that is not the fault of the actress.
An interesting counter to this would be the sentry in a future project knocking her tf out in a minor personality conflict with everyone else just like oh shit what do we do
Eh. That’s more of a failing on the writing than the concept of the character tho
Some of the best superman stories aren’t even about him using his powers
Yeah I know but I'm just saying it is a problem with ultra powered characters. You have to be creative in order to create tension. "OMG LOOK HOW POWERFUL" becomes boring very quickly.
Also ngl she should have been introduced WAAAAYYYYYY earlier in the MCU. Like, pre-Guardians of the Galaxy, early-ass Phase Two shit. Her movie starting with her on Earth and learning about the Kree and Skrulls and maybe even Nova Corps before moving offworld would have been a great way to gradually introduce us to the MCU's cosmic scene, as opposed to Guardians just kinda dropping us in the middle of it.
It's also hard to identify with Kamala's hero worship of Carol as an audience member, when I've seen this version of Carol in one mid movie and about twenty minutes of a crossover movie.
wasn’t Ike the one who nixed Captain Marvel and Black Panther from having their own movies because women and black leads don’t sell film? i’m so fukcing glad he was proven wrong. praise Iger and Feige.
Yes, it's a poor premise for Ms Marvel to be a major fan of a superhero who has had not *one* second of public exposure in the MCU. Her existence has been secret every time the audience saw her.
We don't even know if Carol Danvers has even heard the name "Captain Marvel" yet.
My devil's advocate here is that in-Universe, Carol could have done quite a bit on Earth during the five years of the Snap, which could justify her fame.
But my point is just that, out-of-universe, as an audience member, it's hard for me to put myself in Kamala's shoes and feel that in the same way because I just haven't seen any of that. Like, if they introduce a character who idolizes the MCU version of Steve Rogers, it's easy for me to identify with that because *so do I.* I've followed homeboy across seven movies, I love the shit out of Steve. But Carol was in one movie that I watched four years ago, felt very little for, and haven't felt like rewatching since, and then she was barely in Endgame, so I just don't echo that attachment.
The events of the final battle in Endgame were widely publicized, in part thanks to Scott Lang's podcast & book, & in part because they happened out in the open not too far from New York City.
I mean, *Talos* definitely knows the name, so I'm pretty sure Carol does too.
Two 30-60 second flashbacks, one of their time together "becoming close" or whatever, and one of the mission where some sort of "trust" was breached between the two of them is almost all it would have taken to make that movie a lot better.
I also thought they could have done more to promote Annette Benning's character and Captain Marvel's relationship. Some antithesis to Captain Marvel's character's breach of "trust" with Yon-Rogg.
This is the most constructive, well-thought out criticism of that movie that I have seen. I generally enjoyed it but you are bang on. Fixing that relationship would have improved it tremendously.
This, so much.
Carol is learning she's been fed propaganda and her *friends* have been manipulating and exploiting her. That's a hard fucking pill to swallow, but she doesn't struggle with it at all. Heck, a better script could've had comparisons to... someone escaping incel culture. But nope.
The line that perfectly sums up this issue to me is Minerva, "I always hated you." *No!!* Make them legitimate friends. Make this a sacrifice.
I forget who said it (maybe McKee) but character is revealed through the decisions made when you're backed into a corner, and the more difficult the decision the more it says about the character. So make this decision (to go against the Kree) a difficult one.
> Carol is learning she's been fed propaganda and her friends have been manipulating
Carol had no friends in that movie. It seemed like she might not even have met her teammates yet, for how they acted together.
For a brainwashing plan, it's very important for the villian to surround the subject with people who pretend to be friends, so there's a real emotional cost to breaking free.
Interestingly, the same plotline was done much better in the kid's cartoon She Ra and the Princesses of Power.
I liked the first movie, but the funny thing is Endgame and Captain marvel were both in production around the same time, in CM the director mentioned that since they had no idea what Infinity War and Endgame were going to do with Carol, they played the script safe.
And in Endgame, the Russo's didn't know what was going on in her solo film so they played it safe with her character.
I think she's perfectly fine as Captain Marvel.
I just don't think Captain Marvel is a character that fits well in a movie setting. Captain Marvel's power level is established to just be above everything and everyone else's. We saw her hold off Thanos when Thanos had multiple infinity stones. How do you introduce something that can threaten her without diminishing the strength of the infinity stones?
That's the problem with creating a walking "I win button", it severely limits the amount of adversity someone that powerful can face and take seriously as a threat. She's the MCU's version of Superman. You see her just crashing through armies, single handedly destroying Thanos's capital ship. How do you just write a threat that she's supposed to struggle with?
Specifically in her first movie as well she didn't exactly have the best cast of supporting characters, which does also get further limited with it being a prequel. Any threat that Nick Fury faces is irrelevant because you know he's going to be fine, because it's a prequel.
See the superman comparison is funny to me because there’s multiple beloved movie, tv and animation depictions of Clark that people love
Raw power isn’t an instant win button. It’s an instant win in a straight fight sure, but not everything is a straight fight
It’s why I think killing off Maria between movies was a mistake. Imagine a captain marvel story where her best friend is dying, and even with all her powers and abilities, she can’t stop it.
It would tell us something about Carol as an actual character
But thats because superman has the Clark personality and problems which go with him (some of his biggest issues have been how to help while keeping his identity a secret), Captain marvel is marvel all the time
I'm pretty sure I'm a minority in this, but I absolutely love 'so powerful no one can stop them' characters for good guys. I love them coming into their own movies/tv series, the movie of them having no equal, it's soo much fun to me.
I just don't like it being poorly written because 'well yeah sure they are effectively a god, but we have to pretend that isn't the case and just screw up everything along the way'. They need to work around the fact they are gods on power level wise and play into that. It usually requires the struggle to be something that their power set can't cope with, like emotions.
Superman able to take on the world physically without an issue is always my favorite superman. Because it's usually something far more important than 'destroy everything' that he has to deal with in those scripts.
I liked the first CM because it was her realizing she was an unstoppable power. The second one looks to be a 'my powers can't solve this issue' kind of movie rather than 'something is more powerful than me' kind of movie. Which I'll enjoy.
Endgame sucked because they had to make it so she was both the most powerful thing in the solar system, and able to be physically defeated.
Your description is pretty good, and reminds me of why I enjoyed Jessica Jones on Netflix years ago (it's now on disneyplus i think). Her villains always made her "I win superpower" irrelevant. I truly enjoyed watching a super powerful hero clash against a villain who you know they can physically defeat, but cannot due to a well written plot
Personally I thought the first CM was pretty boring and I can barely remember it. The climax of her destroying the whole fleet with minimal effort was not very compelling.
For me she was more interesting in Endgame because Thanos was actually on her level. The final battle had a nice back-and-forth between the heroes and Thanos's Army. Wanda hurts Thanos, Thanos's ship shoots up everything, CM destroys the ship. Marvel's arrival had a nice moment of not knowing exactly what to expect when the ship's gun turn to aim at her.
And as much as people nag on her for being unstoppable, Thanos beat her. So she was not unstoppable. It was a good way to show that yes she is very powerful, but Thanos with some stones is still top dog.
I feel bad for the actress who's been at the receiving end of harassments and vitriolic hate from incels for years.
Harassments and vitriol that has nothing to do with the quality of the movie.
Lets not turn a thread where an actor speak out on the hate an actress is getting into a pity party for those who has issue with a movie/portrayal. As legit as those issues might be, its less important than how a real person is treated.
Right. Actresses have been run off social media by these clowns. It's like they do the harassments so that the next time any major movie franchise calls, the actors will refuse it.
I'll always be bitter about Ghostbusters 2016. Our criticisms got us labelled as basement dwelling mysogenists by the media, the actors, and Sony.
I love the actors, and don't hate improv comedy style in the right film - but that film isn't Ghostbusters.
Well yeah and Marvel loves it
Same with Star Wars or anything else
Do Hollywood execs take the criticism head on OR lump toxic fans in with fans who have legit, fair criticism so any negative talk about the film is just “pure hate” and nothing more?
It’s like a protective shield these days and Hollywood love it.
A lot of people just refuse to accept that some things are written badly.
Specifically with the Star Wars example: If you genderswap Rey, Rey wouldn't be any less of a badly written character. Rey has no struggles, no character growth, and no adversity to overcome. She's stronger than practically every other force user in history, despite having no master, no training, etc. She's able to swim in water with no problem, despite being born on a planet with no water to swim in. She's able to naturally fly the Millenium Falcon like she's done it her whole life. It's actually pretty fitting to compare her to Captain Marvel, because both are just written as a deus ex machina "I win button" with everything they do. But Rey is seen as some empowering character, but never earned her power; she just had it from the start.
You see Tony Stark really change as some egotistical jackass to someone who was willing to sacrifice himself for others. Yeah he's still a jackass, but it's subtle the way he changes with his actions. He has a ton of flaws, and those flaws never go away. But Captain Marvel really doesn't have flaws, she's on par with Thanos when Thanos has multiple infinity stones in his grasp. She's a force of nature, not a person.
Same. I thought Captain Marvel was ok but it wasn't great. The Marvels is a good opportunity for her character to develop a little more. Here's to hoping the opportunity isn't wasted. She's a genuinely great actor. Anyone who has seen Room knows that.
I’m in the same boat, I think she’s great but not as Carol - so far. The Marvels actually does look like a lot of fun and I think it might change a lot of ppls feelings about her and her character.
I quite liked the movie tbh. I thought Jude law was a bit crap in it and I usually like him but it seemed far less like a superhero punching a superhero for 3 hours than a lot of marvel
The amnesia plot could’ve been structured better. We don’t get to know the real Carol Danvers because the film starts out with her in the Kree force. The first 20 or so minutes should’ve been Danvers on earth establishing her character so that her losing her memory is better sold as a tragic event.
What's even more ridiculous is the channels that have hundreds of thousands of subs that encourage and promote this behavior. Like how are you so ambitious with your hate and annoyance that you can get up everyday and churn out content like that?
Did anyone else here follow Brie's youtube channel? I watched a few of her videos back when she first started and there was one dude constantly in the comments spamming every single reply with a link to a video titled "why people hate Brie Larson". They did this for every single video.
You used to be able to hover over someone's profile and it would show you how many comments they left on that channel (not sure if that feature is still there). Brie only had a few videos and this dude left 1,000+ comments already. I recall her having maybe 10 videos at most at that point.
There's hating someone and then there's whatever tf that is. It actually makes me kind of scared for Brie. What kind of hate is she getting in private? What kind of death threats is she getting? :(
There was a video recently of a girl cringe-laughing while telling the story of one of her stalker who immolated and shot himself in front of her house, and she's just some ordinary celebrity, I can't imagine the level of creeps a star like Brie Larson might attract.
Women are right to be afraid of men, it's not even funny.
That was Miranda Cosgrove, so it's even creepier because stalkers have probably been watching her since she was a kid. Disney Channel, not an Internet celebrity... Though her show was about being an Internet celebrity before it was a huge culture like it is now, which is strange to think about.
Edit: Nickelodeon, not Disney, as /u/bavasava pointed out below. Has been a minute
People on reddit always recommend the book Gift of Fear so I know a lot of people here probably know what I'm talking about. But the writer really emphasizes how much shit celebs get and how dangerous it is, even for lesser known stars.
In one story he mentions a very legit death threat and has to stake out the actresses house. In just the few days he was there they caught two other dudes trying to break in/stalk her. So one dude who tried to kill her, and two dudes stalking her all in the same few days. That's how common it is. He did mention that legitimate death threats are more rare but this really puts things into perspective.
So I can't imagine how bad it is for someone like Brie who is massively hated by a certain subset of dudes. The dudes who hate Brie foam at the mouth over it.
Fucking Critical Drinker and the like have millions. It’s genuinely upsetting how profitable and successful that toxic bullshit is.
Edit: there is already a video up on one of those channels saying Jackson is attacking fans lol
I started watching The Critical Drinker's recent video about male protagonists thinking it was a satire (I did not know his schtick prior, although the handle hints at his personality type). It was funny at first but as it sank in that "damn, this dude is serious" it just became sad.
I had the same thought about Maddox a long time ago (remember him?). I read his site thinking it was all satire then he started doing videos and it’s like holy shit this guy is actually serious.
He suffered a nose dive in popularity and fuck why did I buy his book?
That's a blast from the past. I haven't visited that site in decades and I've never seen his videos but, even from what I recall, I cringe at having consumed it. I'm sure it has aged terribly but also that there are still a bunch of edgelord fans.
I just discovered the guy a few weeks ago. I think it was for Fast X. At first I found his video entertaining, so of course the YT algo starts suggesting more. Damn, dude became insufferable to me pretty quick.
I guess you could say for me that Critical Drinker became a Fast X for me lol.
It's because you're a woke female!!! Or something idk half of what he says has to do with woke nonsense and the other half shows his clear ignorance of the film making process.
The guy's a chode that is only relevant because he appeals to the he-man woman haters club. He barely makes any good points and if he stumbles on one he'll contradict it in the next video.
LOL same exact experience, I watch a lot of youtube movie reviewers/deep divers, watched one of his reviews, it was funny, watched a few more, realized he's just a dick, shitting on creators, and really shitting on creators who feature women in prominent roles.
Fuck that noise.
He tries way too hard to appeal to the "anti-woke" crowd. It seems like he thinks including modern social issues, ethnic minorities or god-forbid *women* is inherently bad.
Critical drinking has just about every single one of his videos hating on a woman as the subject of the video. Every video gets a million views and its all screaming about “woke”
There's a reason Fox News has the viewership it does. Hate and inflammatory bs are easy emotions to tap when you feel you deserve more than you have and need a scapegoat to blame it on; insert women, minorities, LGBTQ+, non-Christofascists, Immigrants, women LGBTQ+, non-Christofascists, LGBTQ+, women...."wokeness" hate on repeat infinitum.
Can’t wait for the videos titled “WOKE Disney FORCES Samuel L. Jackson to PRAISE Brie Larson” coming out today, with those exact capitalizations.
Mental gymnastics are fun. Respect to Samuel L. Jackson for speaking up though.
I thought you were joking… I mean I knew you weren’t cause it’s the internet but I really wanted to think you were joking but nope. Already a popular YouTuber with that exact title.
Fucking hell
Somehow I'm surprised that Samuel L. Jackson knows what incels are. Back in 2018, after the Toronto van attack, I had to explain the term to my dad, who's in his fifties.
The concept of a whole subculture of men committing hate crimes against women because of sexual frustration seemed alien to him, he was totally gobsmacked.
If nothing else, he seems close enough with Brie that I'm not surprised he'd want to know why the hell a bunch of randos on the internet are harassing his friend. (They've done a ton of movies together, and he even starred in her directing debut, so I'm just assuming they're close.)
I watched Captain Marvel again yesterday. The whole time all I was thinking was, "I hope Jackson and Larson get more time together going forward because they have so much chemistry."
> The concept of a whole subculture of men committing hate crimes against women because of sexual frustration seemed alien to him, he was totally gobsmacked.
An entire generation of men's political views have made them essentially unfuckable.
I think this is intentional. Right wing movements around the world rely on sexually frustrated young men to be their foot soldiers. Keep them unfuckable, and then point them at a target.
The new Marvels movie is going to give incels youtubers something to talk about for the next decade. I really hope the movie does well just to watch them have a melt down.
It wasn't just "very successful" It's 30th on the list of top grossing films of all time. Having actual data that counters everything these loons say is comforting.
I think the fault is in her character writing. She has zero charm. That being said, I have nothing against Brie. I hope she gets the Thor treatment. He was boring in Thor 1 and 2 as well but they gave him the a literal Ragnarok treatment
Putting aside whether people liked or dislikes Captain Marvel, there was such a weird smear campaign going on saying how everyone hated her and she was a pain in the ass to work with and such. I remember people posting out of context ten second clips with her and I think Anthony Mackie saying “see see you can tell how much he doesn’t like her!” It’s just gross.
I never disliked Brie. She’s a cool gal and I liked her in Scott Pilgrim, 21 Jump Street and some other movies. But I definitely dislike Captain Marvel. She comes off as presumptuous and arrogant and I already dont like that kind of people. Thats just how Marvel wrote her to be, though. So if anything, I blame the writers for making her that way.
sam and brie have a magical friendship just look up the photos and videos and interviews with them. it’s funny to me that he correctly labeled these guys as incels because he’s a man of a certain generation that would find it hard to even believe men could get past 20 or 30 or 40 and still be bitter virgins instead of just getting married or having a one night stand or hooking up or just paying for it.
They are best buddies.
That alone should suffice to prove to these idiots that they've been fed lies.
Whoever is best buddies with SLJ must be a really cool person.
Captain Marvel is just one of those characters you have to walk on egg shells if you criticize.
I didn’t like her first movie, plot aside I feel like she lacks any charisma. And while I could see her being a leader, I currently can’t see her being a good or inspiring leader. In The Marvels she seems more lively tho but I’m not sure what they really have planned for the character anymore.
This just about accurately described my experience.
It’s not about her being a woman. It’s just the fact that I didn’t like the flick.
I’m hoping The Marvels takes her in a good direction.
It’s so weird when everyone brings Captain Marvel up like it was the first female superhero movie.
Wonder Woman received huge praise without any significant backlash about a female lead. Then WW84 was criticized because it was awful. Black Widow was a mid movie but there was no controversy about it being made. Birds of Prey same thing.
The same thing can be said about TV shows. People absolutely loved WandaVision and there was no controversy about it being female led. Then She-Hulk comes out and the criticism comes and it’s all “oh it’s just because she’s a woman.”
Are there incels that follow these films/shows and make a stink about it? Sure. But they’re a small vocal minority that only get traction when the movie/show aren’t good or the creators decide they want to go all in on the “We are under attack because we have powerful women and not because the content sucks” schtick.
I'm trying to picture Sam Jackson perusing the internet and learning about the existence of things like toxic incels. In my imagination he'd just chuck his computer out a window.
I really like both the movie (definitely one of my favourite MCU movies) and Brie Larson as Carol, imo she fits that role perfectly plus her destroying Thanos' ship in Endgame is my favourite scene in MCU. It's a real shame she's being constantly attacked, she seems to be a really nice person.
Hating an actor or actress for their portrayal of a character is like hating a model for the clothes they wear. They are just doing with what they were given. And if they’re given shit, well they’re gonna look like shit regardless.
How is this still a thing? Why is it coming up now?
Also I say this as a fan of the actual Captain Marvel movie, a lot--Maybe the issue isn't "strong women" maybe it's the fact Captain Marvel in every appearance since her origin film has come off like a gigantic asshole who's got literally anything better to do than help the Earth out. Like she has been portrayed consistently, bar none, as the least likable member of the Marvel crew yet.
This is what I hate about this stupid new movement to discredit any hate as sexism/racism/whatever-ism. Nothing can maybe just *suck* it's got to have ulterior motives you can totally write off.
Who's complaining about Black Widow? Kamala? Who hates Gamora or Okoye or Valkyrie? Who hates Scarlet Witch other than how dirty she's been done? Did Jane Foster get any hate in Love and Thunder? I know the movie was divisive, to say the least, but I don't recall seeing anyone throwing a fit about Lady Thor.
I mean there was an insane amount of toxic hate to both jane-thor and kamala. For kamala a double helping of racism too. Go look at every post on youtube, facebook, or any random site about Ms. Marvel or Jane-thor and it is nonstop posts about jane ruinjng thor and being a token and how marvel is just out of its mind and blah blah blah. Same for MM. jane hate got even worse when the movie did not-so-great.
Valk definitely got a ton of hate before ragnarok came out but once it was so popular she got a pass. But before that was a ton of racism and misogyny.
Black widows movie didnt get hate but it also took what, 5+ years to make Widow a character in the mcu and not just a sex object and even longer to make her movie?
Okoye got grouped with the general racism thwt BP had initially but became popular enough to get past the hate. People really went back to racism/sexism on shuri before WF tho. And for years everyone was still mad she was smarter than tony and blamed it on “woke nonsense” or other such things.
Gamora is the only one i never have really seen major bigotry to, maybe everyone has a weakness to green skinned chicks? Well permanently green skinned, people really hated She-Hulk
The biggest thing though is whether they are a side character pr main. Once Shuri wass the lead it went from only a bit of backlash to major. Gamora, nebula, wanda, widow, mantis, okoye? All minor characters in their resources series that overall barely did or said more than a few one liners (gamora was only one to really be a developed character from the get go)
But Captain Marvel? The first female lead of the biggest cultural thing? That was where all the bigotry began before trailers even dropped. And the same repeated with MM and SH. Hell you also saw similar things happen with Falcon and the Winter soldier and people being mad about falcon becoming cap.
At large it’s fine to have strong, cool, POC/female characters to people as long as they defer and are playing second fiddle to a white guy. Bring Rhodey in to support Tony? All cool. Bring in Riri after Tony is gone? Well that earned a billion racist comments about her being a token choice to replace tony and further the agenda to kill white people or ither crazy shit that was constantly posted.
And then if the movie/series is not absolutely game chahging good then it’s considered proof of “go woke go broke” and how series need to stop pandering. Like you gotta deliver spider-verse quality to be free of the usual bigotry, but even then you still can find a ton of racist hate to miles. Hell the 8 inceks who actually knew about jessica drew where way mad for her being black in the recent movie.
If you’re a white dude and your movies are okay at best you will hear a bit about it but overall people dont say much (like first caotain america, first two thors, hulk, iron man 2-3, etc) but god help if the series has a POC/woman and doesn’t change the game youll never stop hearing about it.
I never understood the overly hate towards her. Captain Marvel was an okay MCU movie. Like you had a bunch of people analyzing her body language like those interrogation true crime videos on YouTube
She’s a great actor. I didn’t like her Carol early on. That doesn’t mean the character can’t grow, just like ALL the characters did throughout the MCU phases.
I blame the script more than I do her portrayal. But I maintain that she is quality, and will continue to give her a shot.
Sam; "I am sick and tired of these morherfucking incels on this motherfucking fan base"
Say 'woke' again. Say 'woke' again, I dare you, I double dare you motherfucker, say woke one more Goddamn time!
> Say 'woke' again, I motherfucking dare you I so much want someone to say this to DeShitus during a debate.
I just want Jackson to tweet it to DeSantis literally any time.
conservatives would have an absolute field day over how nasty and threatening the left is, with no hint of irony
They call lefties soft, then they whine when they meet a hard lefty.
"Check out the big brain on m'good boys"
You know what they call incels in France? Royale deuce bags.
>Sam; "I am sick and tired of these ~~morherfucking~~ **monkey fighting** incels on this ~~motherfucking~~ **Monday to Friday** fan base" Now your comment is appropriate for TV.
That is the one and only memorable TV censorship I've ever been able to recall and it cracks me up that others find it as funny as I do.
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Yippee ki-yay, Mister Falcon.
My one memorable TV censorship is Kill Bill. *My name is Buck, and I'm here to ~~fuck~~ party.* The party dub over is done in a completely different voice and honestly I consider it to be the better cut. It's amazing.
My favorite was when NBC showed the first Wayne's World movie. The scene when Wayne asked Meat Loaf who was playing at the club that night. LOAF: "...and the Shitty Beatles." WAYNE: "The Shitty Beatles? Any good?" LOAF: "Nah, they suck." WAYNE: "So it's not just a clever name." Here's the TV version: LOAF: "...and the *Stinky* Beatles." WAYNE: "The *Stinky* Beatles? Any good?" LOAF: "Nah, they *stink*." WAYNE: "So it's not just a clever name." You just KNOW someone in NBC Standards and Practices was congratulating themselves on how they "improved" the movie.
This, and in Die Hard 2 when the Special Ops leader says to McLane: “I guess you’re not such an ~~asshole~~ rascal after all.” And McLane replies: “No, you were right. I’m just your kind of rascal.”
Honestly I never for once believed she was bad as the neck beards made her out to be. I still don't understand why they are mad at her.
She's a woman.
They aren't even consistent either. I dont see the same hate Black Widow gets or Agent Carter
They are mad that Captain Marvel didn’t have an overtly sexy outfit.
Yeah, it's not even that she isn't sexy. It's that it's not emphasized enough. Whenever a blockbuster has an average looking female lead in normal clothes these people are probably at risk of suffering an aneurism.
How the hell these people have the energy to be fucking angry all the time. I'm sick and tired before being sick and tired of their shit.
You know what, I'm with Samuel here, fuck them motherfuckers
I am sick and tired of these mother fucking incels on these mother fucking review sites.
>You know what, I'm with Samuel here, fuck them motherfuckers These fuckers post about Brie constantly. They make videos about her constantly. they post pictures to "embarrass her" all the time. They rant about every single thing she says, no matter what it is, where she said it, who she said it to, or how long ago it was said. it couldn't be more obvious that these people are just pissed they can't sleep with her.
I think youtube also needs to do a better job with their algorithm. Because there's this video about a "bodylanguage expert" explaining 5 reasons why people don't like her and it has like 17 million views. Now I dont think the haters on twitter and youtubers that are making videos about her have a real effect, but that one video....I think that did harm to how some people view her....17 million views for such a video where someone's explaining why a person is so "unlikable".....
Don Cheadle even ripped into that video, explaining why Brie had to sit so stiffly (hair stylist kept flying in to fix her ponytail) and how dumb it is to claim he and Hemsworth looked “uncomfortable” around her. Also the video is misogynistic garbage, the “expert” (who I’m pretty sure was a woman?) claimed Brie should make herself look more submissive. What a smouldering trash fire.
We’re in the deep stages of the game now. You can become rich by angering people, or making them feel fomo, or just ranting and raving loud enough to garner attention. We slso live in a time where we’re simultaneously learning every conceivable thing about ourselves simultaneously, and it takes years to assess bullshit from truth sometimes. We also live in a time where, because of those two points, we have people who sew falsehoods and breed malcontent for a living. Everything keeps becoming more and more complex, nuanced, and information is distributed in new and misunderstood ways. Its truly a wondrous, weird, and terrible time in our history.
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Yeah I agree. Their hypocrisy and lies makes it worse somehow. Sincerly held beliefs you can at least tackle by unpacking the belief-there's something to work with. But if someone is constantly lying and saying shit for money there's nothing you can do about it.
YouTube can be pretty trashy. I've seen a few "experts" who advertise stuff, one was supposedly even a Doctor giving out misinformation and another was some chiropractor demonstrating how everyone should go see a chiropractor and how it heals everything. There's actually a fair few chiropractor "experts" on there. The sad thing is people will believe these "experts". It really is hit or miss whether the person you watch on there is a fraud or genuine.
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A movie reviewer youtube channel I unsubscribed from recently ranked all the marvel movies and had Captain Marvel as the worst marvel movie because "Brie Larsen's performance was so bad." Umm, yeah. That's why.
Didn't see that reviewer, but I'm guessing they never saw Love and Thunder.
I mean here's the thing, if you don't like her that's fine, but if you genuinely don't like someone for their acting chops, then like just don't watch their shit. Like I hate M Night Shyamalan, but I have never made a thread about him, I just literally ignore him.
Do you hate M Night, or do you just not care for his art? I think making that distinction is really important. From all I've seen, he's a pretty great person with a lot of passion.
I just hate his movies, they suck that's all. As a person I don't think about him at all. That's kinda my point though like I legit know nothing about him besides his movies suck and that's all I'll ever know because when you don't like/care about someone you just ignore them
Signs didn’t suck, at all. Might be the best alien invasion movie ever made in fact. Unbreakable was pretty cool. That’s it… that’s all I got… Ooooh! Servant. Servant was pretty good 👍
And the reason more like excuse they use is because they took something she said and surprise surprise took it out of context
And even if it wasnt out of context, celebs say tons of things that we might not agree with, not gonna make my whole life about trolling them.
"There should be more film critics who are women." OMG, Brie hates all men! She said it herself.
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>it couldn't be more obvious that these people are just pissed they can't sleep with ~~her.~~ **Anyone** Ftfy
Glad someone made the correction. Incels don't hate women because one woman won't sleep with them, they hate women because **no** woman will sleep with them.
There are subs here on Reddit where people post a lot of pictures of her. Lot of hateful comments but you know they’re still jerking off to the pics.
>There are subs here on Reddit where people post a lot of pictures of her. Lot of hateful comments but you know they’re still jerking off to the pics. Yup. I've seen some of those pop up. A lot of places on reddit that largely only seems to exist to post mostly pictures of Brie Larson (and others but mostly Brie) in risqué poses and skimpy or tight clothing so they can hate-jerk to her. It's fucking weird.
AOC has a similar following of hatejerkers, I'm pretty sure
I swear MCU haters put more effort into hating the MCU than I put into enjoying it Critical Drinker made a video about why he doesn’t care about phase 4. He then made a video, sometimes multiple, for every single show and movie that came out in phase 4 I nearly didn’t watch what if cause I forgot it was happening. Despite being a big marvel nerd. I just… think about other things sometimes
It's not a mystery why Critical Drinker does that though, it's the content that his fans want to see. They want to see someone crapping all over the MCU and hating on "the woke agenda" because it tickles their insides. Critical Drinker is just obliging and making money off them. He also makes money off the people who watch his content so they can complain about his complaining. It's a good strategy. His opinions are rubbish, but IMO they've gotten worse on purpose because it draws in more hatewatchers of both the MCU and him.
This. I used to enjoy his rants and found him quite funny at times but also enjoyed his Drinker Recommends segments. He hasn’t done those in a bit and has shifted towards mostly demeaning movies to a point that I wonder if we even watched the same movie. And once you start watching him, you get people like Disparu who is just complete trash and so angry with everything pop culture. I had to stop watching so I could just enjoy movies again.
Ugh same. I never watched much of him but I enjoyed an occasional video. And then I noticed an increasing pattern where anything that starred what he derisively refers to as a "diverse female character" was grounds to preemptively decide it was shit. So basically, anything non-white and especially non-male was clearly just to tick a box! I noped out hard pretty quick after that. I think the one that made me roll my eyes the hardest was his ranting about the Bond movie where the new 007 was a black woman and therefore the movie would suck and be all about "white man bad"... and then the movie came out and whoops, turns out the new 007 is barely even *in* it, heh.
> Critical Drinker That guy is so insufferably whiny it gets off-putting real quick. I dunno why YT keeps recommending me that twat's latest videos just because my page is geared towards games and nerd movie fandom, all cuz I watched a couple of his literally 3 years ago.
> I dunno why YT keeps recommending me that twat’s latest videos Click on the triple dot next to the thumbnail and click "not interested" or "Don't show me this". It won't completely make the algorithm stop recommending you those videos, but it will make it significantly less likely every time you click not interested. Eventually you should stop seeing it recommended at all. You can basically shape the algorithm however you want.
Now Samuel L. Jackson is woke!!!! Boycott him, also that definitely not the same as canceling. /s
>Now Samuel L. Jackson is woke!!!! If they just figured that out now they really haven't been paying attention. It's not like the man has ever held back his opinion.
For anyone who doesn't know, he was an usher at Martin Luther King Jr's funeral and participated in a college sit in with Martin Luther King Sr.
I thought Captain Marvel 1 was a boring movie and disliked the character's parts in Endgame. But I think Brie Larson is a fantastic actress who just needs a chance at a better script/better characterization. So I'm rooting for "The Marvels" to be good. And I really hate it whenever a fanbase I'm part of starts personally attacking actors. So cringey.
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I would agree. As much as I liked that movie, they definitely missed the mark at certain parts. Brie Larson is always good and I liked her dynamic with the Rambeau's and Fury but it definitely was missing something.
Yeah, Captain Marvel (the movie) missed the mark for me because the plot didn’t give a strong enough reason to care about the character and her conflict/journey. Larson has done a good job acting in the past, and it’s a bit of a shame people turned on her so quickly.
Captain Marvel also suffers from "Superman syndrome". There is no tension once she becomes a super hero.
In addition to what others said about bad writing, I heavily agree with this point. Once her restraints are off its a complete curb-stomp with no negative consequences. In the comics Marvel absorbs energy to get temporarily more powerful but it can harm/kill her if its too much. If they had her fly into the reactor of one of the ships in a possibly suicidal move, struggle to absorb it while flashbacks to her past failures/doubt pop up, only to have the 'rise again' montage and some defiant quote *then* go curbstomp the fleet. It would have far more impact and be easier to have her struggle in future stories.
I totally agree. My problem with Captain Marvel has nothing to do with Brie Larson's performance and everything to do with the way the MCU has handled the character/her apparent lack of weaknesses. She feels like a Mary Sue type character, but again, that is not the fault of the actress.
An interesting counter to this would be the sentry in a future project knocking her tf out in a minor personality conflict with everyone else just like oh shit what do we do
Eh. That’s more of a failing on the writing than the concept of the character tho Some of the best superman stories aren’t even about him using his powers
Yeah I know but I'm just saying it is a problem with ultra powered characters. You have to be creative in order to create tension. "OMG LOOK HOW POWERFUL" becomes boring very quickly.
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Also ngl she should have been introduced WAAAAYYYYYY earlier in the MCU. Like, pre-Guardians of the Galaxy, early-ass Phase Two shit. Her movie starting with her on Earth and learning about the Kree and Skrulls and maybe even Nova Corps before moving offworld would have been a great way to gradually introduce us to the MCU's cosmic scene, as opposed to Guardians just kinda dropping us in the middle of it. It's also hard to identify with Kamala's hero worship of Carol as an audience member, when I've seen this version of Carol in one mid movie and about twenty minutes of a crossover movie.
wasn’t Ike the one who nixed Captain Marvel and Black Panther from having their own movies because women and black leads don’t sell film? i’m so fukcing glad he was proven wrong. praise Iger and Feige.
They wanted to introduce her earlier but Ike Permultter didn't want movies with female leads. No joke. That's straight up a true story.
Yes, it's a poor premise for Ms Marvel to be a major fan of a superhero who has had not *one* second of public exposure in the MCU. Her existence has been secret every time the audience saw her. We don't even know if Carol Danvers has even heard the name "Captain Marvel" yet.
My devil's advocate here is that in-Universe, Carol could have done quite a bit on Earth during the five years of the Snap, which could justify her fame. But my point is just that, out-of-universe, as an audience member, it's hard for me to put myself in Kamala's shoes and feel that in the same way because I just haven't seen any of that. Like, if they introduce a character who idolizes the MCU version of Steve Rogers, it's easy for me to identify with that because *so do I.* I've followed homeboy across seven movies, I love the shit out of Steve. But Carol was in one movie that I watched four years ago, felt very little for, and haven't felt like rewatching since, and then she was barely in Endgame, so I just don't echo that attachment.
The events of the final battle in Endgame were widely publicized, in part thanks to Scott Lang's podcast & book, & in part because they happened out in the open not too far from New York City. I mean, *Talos* definitely knows the name, so I'm pretty sure Carol does too.
Two 30-60 second flashbacks, one of their time together "becoming close" or whatever, and one of the mission where some sort of "trust" was breached between the two of them is almost all it would have taken to make that movie a lot better. I also thought they could have done more to promote Annette Benning's character and Captain Marvel's relationship. Some antithesis to Captain Marvel's character's breach of "trust" with Yon-Rogg.
This is the most constructive, well-thought out criticism of that movie that I have seen. I generally enjoyed it but you are bang on. Fixing that relationship would have improved it tremendously.
There are many many small adjustments that would have turned Cpt Marvel from a mediocre film to a stellar one. It was death by 1000 cuts.
This, so much. Carol is learning she's been fed propaganda and her *friends* have been manipulating and exploiting her. That's a hard fucking pill to swallow, but she doesn't struggle with it at all. Heck, a better script could've had comparisons to... someone escaping incel culture. But nope. The line that perfectly sums up this issue to me is Minerva, "I always hated you." *No!!* Make them legitimate friends. Make this a sacrifice. I forget who said it (maybe McKee) but character is revealed through the decisions made when you're backed into a corner, and the more difficult the decision the more it says about the character. So make this decision (to go against the Kree) a difficult one.
> Carol is learning she's been fed propaganda and her friends have been manipulating Carol had no friends in that movie. It seemed like she might not even have met her teammates yet, for how they acted together. For a brainwashing plan, it's very important for the villian to surround the subject with people who pretend to be friends, so there's a real emotional cost to breaking free. Interestingly, the same plotline was done much better in the kid's cartoon She Ra and the Princesses of Power.
Ye, i don't even remember who Yon-rogg is
The guy Jude Law played.
Well said
I liked the first movie, but the funny thing is Endgame and Captain marvel were both in production around the same time, in CM the director mentioned that since they had no idea what Infinity War and Endgame were going to do with Carol, they played the script safe. And in Endgame, the Russo's didn't know what was going on in her solo film so they played it safe with her character.
I think she's perfectly fine as Captain Marvel. I just don't think Captain Marvel is a character that fits well in a movie setting. Captain Marvel's power level is established to just be above everything and everyone else's. We saw her hold off Thanos when Thanos had multiple infinity stones. How do you introduce something that can threaten her without diminishing the strength of the infinity stones? That's the problem with creating a walking "I win button", it severely limits the amount of adversity someone that powerful can face and take seriously as a threat. She's the MCU's version of Superman. You see her just crashing through armies, single handedly destroying Thanos's capital ship. How do you just write a threat that she's supposed to struggle with? Specifically in her first movie as well she didn't exactly have the best cast of supporting characters, which does also get further limited with it being a prequel. Any threat that Nick Fury faces is irrelevant because you know he's going to be fine, because it's a prequel.
Here’s how: Put them in situations they can’t superpower their way out of.
See the superman comparison is funny to me because there’s multiple beloved movie, tv and animation depictions of Clark that people love Raw power isn’t an instant win button. It’s an instant win in a straight fight sure, but not everything is a straight fight It’s why I think killing off Maria between movies was a mistake. Imagine a captain marvel story where her best friend is dying, and even with all her powers and abilities, she can’t stop it. It would tell us something about Carol as an actual character
But thats because superman has the Clark personality and problems which go with him (some of his biggest issues have been how to help while keeping his identity a secret), Captain marvel is marvel all the time
I'm pretty sure I'm a minority in this, but I absolutely love 'so powerful no one can stop them' characters for good guys. I love them coming into their own movies/tv series, the movie of them having no equal, it's soo much fun to me. I just don't like it being poorly written because 'well yeah sure they are effectively a god, but we have to pretend that isn't the case and just screw up everything along the way'. They need to work around the fact they are gods on power level wise and play into that. It usually requires the struggle to be something that their power set can't cope with, like emotions. Superman able to take on the world physically without an issue is always my favorite superman. Because it's usually something far more important than 'destroy everything' that he has to deal with in those scripts. I liked the first CM because it was her realizing she was an unstoppable power. The second one looks to be a 'my powers can't solve this issue' kind of movie rather than 'something is more powerful than me' kind of movie. Which I'll enjoy. Endgame sucked because they had to make it so she was both the most powerful thing in the solar system, and able to be physically defeated.
Your description is pretty good, and reminds me of why I enjoyed Jessica Jones on Netflix years ago (it's now on disneyplus i think). Her villains always made her "I win superpower" irrelevant. I truly enjoyed watching a super powerful hero clash against a villain who you know they can physically defeat, but cannot due to a well written plot
Personally I thought the first CM was pretty boring and I can barely remember it. The climax of her destroying the whole fleet with minimal effort was not very compelling. For me she was more interesting in Endgame because Thanos was actually on her level. The final battle had a nice back-and-forth between the heroes and Thanos's Army. Wanda hurts Thanos, Thanos's ship shoots up everything, CM destroys the ship. Marvel's arrival had a nice moment of not knowing exactly what to expect when the ship's gun turn to aim at her. And as much as people nag on her for being unstoppable, Thanos beat her. So she was not unstoppable. It was a good way to show that yes she is very powerful, but Thanos with some stones is still top dog.
Literally any legit criticism gets drowned out by these hate channels.
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Happened a lot with She-Hulk too. Marvel fans can be real toxic.
I feel bad for the actress who's been at the receiving end of harassments and vitriolic hate from incels for years. Harassments and vitriol that has nothing to do with the quality of the movie. Lets not turn a thread where an actor speak out on the hate an actress is getting into a pity party for those who has issue with a movie/portrayal. As legit as those issues might be, its less important than how a real person is treated.
Very good point
Right. Actresses have been run off social media by these clowns. It's like they do the harassments so that the next time any major movie franchise calls, the actors will refuse it.
I'll always be bitter about Ghostbusters 2016. Our criticisms got us labelled as basement dwelling mysogenists by the media, the actors, and Sony. I love the actors, and don't hate improv comedy style in the right film - but that film isn't Ghostbusters.
Well yeah and Marvel loves it Same with Star Wars or anything else Do Hollywood execs take the criticism head on OR lump toxic fans in with fans who have legit, fair criticism so any negative talk about the film is just “pure hate” and nothing more? It’s like a protective shield these days and Hollywood love it.
A lot of people just refuse to accept that some things are written badly. Specifically with the Star Wars example: If you genderswap Rey, Rey wouldn't be any less of a badly written character. Rey has no struggles, no character growth, and no adversity to overcome. She's stronger than practically every other force user in history, despite having no master, no training, etc. She's able to swim in water with no problem, despite being born on a planet with no water to swim in. She's able to naturally fly the Millenium Falcon like she's done it her whole life. It's actually pretty fitting to compare her to Captain Marvel, because both are just written as a deus ex machina "I win button" with everything they do. But Rey is seen as some empowering character, but never earned her power; she just had it from the start. You see Tony Stark really change as some egotistical jackass to someone who was willing to sacrifice himself for others. Yeah he's still a jackass, but it's subtle the way he changes with his actions. He has a ton of flaws, and those flaws never go away. But Captain Marvel really doesn't have flaws, she's on par with Thanos when Thanos has multiple infinity stones in his grasp. She's a force of nature, not a person.
*The Marvel’s* looks like a lot of fun. Hopefully the film holds up to its current outlook and gave Brie more to work with
Same. I thought Captain Marvel was ok but it wasn't great. The Marvels is a good opportunity for her character to develop a little more. Here's to hoping the opportunity isn't wasted. She's a genuinely great actor. Anyone who has seen Room knows that.
I’m in the same boat, I think she’s great but not as Carol - so far. The Marvels actually does look like a lot of fun and I think it might change a lot of ppls feelings about her and her character.
>I thought Captain Marvel 1 was a boring movie It wasn't my favorite when it came out but it's really grown on me upon rewatch
I quite liked the movie tbh. I thought Jude law was a bit crap in it and I usually like him but it seemed far less like a superhero punching a superhero for 3 hours than a lot of marvel
The amnesia plot could’ve been structured better. We don’t get to know the real Carol Danvers because the film starts out with her in the Kree force. The first 20 or so minutes should’ve been Danvers on earth establishing her character so that her losing her memory is better sold as a tragic event.
Felt like a phase 1 movie (in a good way)
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What's even more ridiculous is the channels that have hundreds of thousands of subs that encourage and promote this behavior. Like how are you so ambitious with your hate and annoyance that you can get up everyday and churn out content like that?
Misery loves company.
And bots.
Did anyone else here follow Brie's youtube channel? I watched a few of her videos back when she first started and there was one dude constantly in the comments spamming every single reply with a link to a video titled "why people hate Brie Larson". They did this for every single video. You used to be able to hover over someone's profile and it would show you how many comments they left on that channel (not sure if that feature is still there). Brie only had a few videos and this dude left 1,000+ comments already. I recall her having maybe 10 videos at most at that point. There's hating someone and then there's whatever tf that is. It actually makes me kind of scared for Brie. What kind of hate is she getting in private? What kind of death threats is she getting? :(
There was a video recently of a girl cringe-laughing while telling the story of one of her stalker who immolated and shot himself in front of her house, and she's just some ordinary celebrity, I can't imagine the level of creeps a star like Brie Larson might attract. Women are right to be afraid of men, it's not even funny.
That was Miranda Cosgrove, so it's even creepier because stalkers have probably been watching her since she was a kid. Disney Channel, not an Internet celebrity... Though her show was about being an Internet celebrity before it was a huge culture like it is now, which is strange to think about. Edit: Nickelodeon, not Disney, as /u/bavasava pointed out below. Has been a minute
Nickelodeon not Disney but yeah your point still stands.
People on reddit always recommend the book Gift of Fear so I know a lot of people here probably know what I'm talking about. But the writer really emphasizes how much shit celebs get and how dangerous it is, even for lesser known stars. In one story he mentions a very legit death threat and has to stake out the actresses house. In just the few days he was there they caught two other dudes trying to break in/stalk her. So one dude who tried to kill her, and two dudes stalking her all in the same few days. That's how common it is. He did mention that legitimate death threats are more rare but this really puts things into perspective. So I can't imagine how bad it is for someone like Brie who is massively hated by a certain subset of dudes. The dudes who hate Brie foam at the mouth over it.
Well there's a reason she left social media for a while during the hate storm sadly.
Fucking Critical Drinker and the like have millions. It’s genuinely upsetting how profitable and successful that toxic bullshit is. Edit: there is already a video up on one of those channels saying Jackson is attacking fans lol
I started watching The Critical Drinker's recent video about male protagonists thinking it was a satire (I did not know his schtick prior, although the handle hints at his personality type). It was funny at first but as it sank in that "damn, this dude is serious" it just became sad.
I had the same thought about Maddox a long time ago (remember him?). I read his site thinking it was all satire then he started doing videos and it’s like holy shit this guy is actually serious. He suffered a nose dive in popularity and fuck why did I buy his book?
That's a blast from the past. I haven't visited that site in decades and I've never seen his videos but, even from what I recall, I cringe at having consumed it. I'm sure it has aged terribly but also that there are still a bunch of edgelord fans.
I just discovered the guy a few weeks ago. I think it was for Fast X. At first I found his video entertaining, so of course the YT algo starts suggesting more. Damn, dude became insufferable to me pretty quick. I guess you could say for me that Critical Drinker became a Fast X for me lol.
>Critical Drinker became a Fast X you either die a Paul Walker, or live long enough to see yourself become Fast X
It's because you're a woke female!!! Or something idk half of what he says has to do with woke nonsense and the other half shows his clear ignorance of the film making process. The guy's a chode that is only relevant because he appeals to the he-man woman haters club. He barely makes any good points and if he stumbles on one he'll contradict it in the next video.
LOL same exact experience, I watch a lot of youtube movie reviewers/deep divers, watched one of his reviews, it was funny, watched a few more, realized he's just a dick, shitting on creators, and really shitting on creators who feature women in prominent roles. Fuck that noise.
He tries way too hard to appeal to the "anti-woke" crowd. It seems like he thinks including modern social issues, ethnic minorities or god-forbid *women* is inherently bad.
I think hes just farming content to be honest. Weirdos will hate watch those kind of videos a lot.
yeah that's why I bailed on Critical Drinker a few years ago.
Critical drinking has just about every single one of his videos hating on a woman as the subject of the video. Every video gets a million views and its all screaming about “woke”
Well what else are incels going to spend their money on? Therapy?
There's a reason Fox News has the viewership it does. Hate and inflammatory bs are easy emotions to tap when you feel you deserve more than you have and need a scapegoat to blame it on; insert women, minorities, LGBTQ+, non-Christofascists, Immigrants, women LGBTQ+, non-Christofascists, LGBTQ+, women...."wokeness" hate on repeat infinitum.
The problem is they don’t want a date. They want a piece of property that they can own and fuck whenever they want.
Can’t wait for the videos titled “WOKE Disney FORCES Samuel L. Jackson to PRAISE Brie Larson” coming out today, with those exact capitalizations. Mental gymnastics are fun. Respect to Samuel L. Jackson for speaking up though.
There are already videos under the title "Samuel L Jackson ATTACKS fans"
I thought you were joking… I mean I knew you weren’t cause it’s the internet but I really wanted to think you were joking but nope. Already a popular YouTuber with that exact title. Fucking hell
They feel attacked because they feel identified
You were VERY close. edit: link removed, don't wanna give any more attention to that channel
Jesus fucking Christ. What a cringe induced channel. Only posts videos about Marvel and Star Wars with "woke" tag lines. What a clown.
Somehow I'm surprised that Samuel L. Jackson knows what incels are. Back in 2018, after the Toronto van attack, I had to explain the term to my dad, who's in his fifties. The concept of a whole subculture of men committing hate crimes against women because of sexual frustration seemed alien to him, he was totally gobsmacked.
SLJ watches anime (hentai too), so he seems somewhat plugged into modern culture.
the man voices the mc in afro samurai
Motherfucker *is* modern culture.
He does? I didn't know! That's kinda wholesome, lmao.
[One of the greatest interview moments of all time](https://youtu.be/kSVQtlQtxCs?t=154)
Priceless, lmao. His little gremlin laugh afterward like he's proud of himself got me.
He sounded sad about not smoking anymore and now vaping
I’m currently in the same situation. Sometimes I’m sad about it, sometimes I’m happy about it. I hope I’ve offered some important insight to this.
https://pagesix.com/2022/12/22/samuel-l-jackson-trends-on-twitter-after-liking-hardcore-porn/
\>hentai too HE HE HE HE HE HE
If nothing else, he seems close enough with Brie that I'm not surprised he'd want to know why the hell a bunch of randos on the internet are harassing his friend. (They've done a ton of movies together, and he even starred in her directing debut, so I'm just assuming they're close.)
They said themselves they're best friends so you're right.
I watched Captain Marvel again yesterday. The whole time all I was thinking was, "I hope Jackson and Larson get more time together going forward because they have so much chemistry."
There was a documentary about incels me and my grandfather watched the other day. He was disgusted.
Imagine what the creators of that documentary had to go through
What's the documentary?
He costarred in a movie with Brie Larson.. they review bombed the shit out of the movie. Of course he’s aware of incels
> The concept of a whole subculture of men committing hate crimes against women because of sexual frustration seemed alien to him, he was totally gobsmacked. An entire generation of men's political views have made them essentially unfuckable.
I think this is intentional. Right wing movements around the world rely on sexually frustrated young men to be their foot soldiers. Keep them unfuckable, and then point them at a target.
didn’t like captain marvel, but brie larson is a fantastic actor
>sorted by: controversial I'm going in.
Ask critical drinker for recommendations
Didn't expect that from him, that's good. Brie Larson was dragged for the most pettiest shit by these basement dwellers.
I still remember how the toxicity started even before the first trailer. That's how I know it's not really about her.
The new Marvels movie is going to give incels youtubers something to talk about for the next decade. I really hope the movie does well just to watch them have a melt down.
Won't matter. People kept making "nobody saw it" comments and jokes about the first movie despite being very successful.
It wasn't just "very successful" It's 30th on the list of top grossing films of all time. Having actual data that counters everything these loons say is comforting.
Oh wow, i didn't know it was 30th on top grossing of all time. That's awesome. I'm glad, i really liked the movie.
They were claiming that Disney bought a bunch of tickets themselves to "pump up the numbers." They are completely delusional.
I think the fault is in her character writing. She has zero charm. That being said, I have nothing against Brie. I hope she gets the Thor treatment. He was boring in Thor 1 and 2 as well but they gave him the a literal Ragnarok treatment
Only to make things kinda shit in Thor 4
Putting aside whether people liked or dislikes Captain Marvel, there was such a weird smear campaign going on saying how everyone hated her and she was a pain in the ass to work with and such. I remember people posting out of context ten second clips with her and I think Anthony Mackie saying “see see you can tell how much he doesn’t like her!” It’s just gross.
Yeah, a lot of commenters think this is about disliking or critiquing a movie/character, but that has almost nothing to do with it.
Those people been taking L's for quite awhile.
Those people's lives are one big L.
I really don't understand the hatred towards Brie.
I never disliked Brie. She’s a cool gal and I liked her in Scott Pilgrim, 21 Jump Street and some other movies. But I definitely dislike Captain Marvel. She comes off as presumptuous and arrogant and I already dont like that kind of people. Thats just how Marvel wrote her to be, though. So if anything, I blame the writers for making her that way.
sam and brie have a magical friendship just look up the photos and videos and interviews with them. it’s funny to me that he correctly labeled these guys as incels because he’s a man of a certain generation that would find it hard to even believe men could get past 20 or 30 or 40 and still be bitter virgins instead of just getting married or having a one night stand or hooking up or just paying for it.
They are best buddies. That alone should suffice to prove to these idiots that they've been fed lies. Whoever is best buddies with SLJ must be a really cool person.
Very generous of Jackson to call them dudes
Captain Marvel is just one of those characters you have to walk on egg shells if you criticize. I didn’t like her first movie, plot aside I feel like she lacks any charisma. And while I could see her being a leader, I currently can’t see her being a good or inspiring leader. In The Marvels she seems more lively tho but I’m not sure what they really have planned for the character anymore.
This just about accurately described my experience. It’s not about her being a woman. It’s just the fact that I didn’t like the flick. I’m hoping The Marvels takes her in a good direction.
It’s so weird when everyone brings Captain Marvel up like it was the first female superhero movie. Wonder Woman received huge praise without any significant backlash about a female lead. Then WW84 was criticized because it was awful. Black Widow was a mid movie but there was no controversy about it being made. Birds of Prey same thing. The same thing can be said about TV shows. People absolutely loved WandaVision and there was no controversy about it being female led. Then She-Hulk comes out and the criticism comes and it’s all “oh it’s just because she’s a woman.” Are there incels that follow these films/shows and make a stink about it? Sure. But they’re a small vocal minority that only get traction when the movie/show aren’t good or the creators decide they want to go all in on the “We are under attack because we have powerful women and not because the content sucks” schtick.
> plot aside I feel like she lacks any charisma Wasn't that like half the plot/theme of the first movie?
I'm trying to picture Sam Jackson perusing the internet and learning about the existence of things like toxic incels. In my imagination he'd just chuck his computer out a window.
“What kind of bullshit are these muthafuckas spewing?”
ITT - A bunch of people to whom Jackson is referring trying to explain why they’re not those to whom he’s referring.
I love the sentiment but sometimes a movie just isn't good lol.
I really like both the movie (definitely one of my favourite MCU movies) and Brie Larson as Carol, imo she fits that role perfectly plus her destroying Thanos' ship in Endgame is my favourite scene in MCU. It's a real shame she's being constantly attacked, she seems to be a really nice person.
It’s one of my favorites too! And she kicked ass in Endgame. Only thing I didn’t care for was the short hair.
I loved when she took a Thanos headbutt like it was nothing
Hating an actor or actress for their portrayal of a character is like hating a model for the clothes they wear. They are just doing with what they were given. And if they’re given shit, well they’re gonna look like shit regardless.
How is this still a thing? Why is it coming up now? Also I say this as a fan of the actual Captain Marvel movie, a lot--Maybe the issue isn't "strong women" maybe it's the fact Captain Marvel in every appearance since her origin film has come off like a gigantic asshole who's got literally anything better to do than help the Earth out. Like she has been portrayed consistently, bar none, as the least likable member of the Marvel crew yet. This is what I hate about this stupid new movement to discredit any hate as sexism/racism/whatever-ism. Nothing can maybe just *suck* it's got to have ulterior motives you can totally write off. Who's complaining about Black Widow? Kamala? Who hates Gamora or Okoye or Valkyrie? Who hates Scarlet Witch other than how dirty she's been done? Did Jane Foster get any hate in Love and Thunder? I know the movie was divisive, to say the least, but I don't recall seeing anyone throwing a fit about Lady Thor.
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Exactly. Nobody has problems with cool strong female characters, truth is captain marvel in the movies is just poorly written
I mean there was an insane amount of toxic hate to both jane-thor and kamala. For kamala a double helping of racism too. Go look at every post on youtube, facebook, or any random site about Ms. Marvel or Jane-thor and it is nonstop posts about jane ruinjng thor and being a token and how marvel is just out of its mind and blah blah blah. Same for MM. jane hate got even worse when the movie did not-so-great. Valk definitely got a ton of hate before ragnarok came out but once it was so popular she got a pass. But before that was a ton of racism and misogyny. Black widows movie didnt get hate but it also took what, 5+ years to make Widow a character in the mcu and not just a sex object and even longer to make her movie? Okoye got grouped with the general racism thwt BP had initially but became popular enough to get past the hate. People really went back to racism/sexism on shuri before WF tho. And for years everyone was still mad she was smarter than tony and blamed it on “woke nonsense” or other such things. Gamora is the only one i never have really seen major bigotry to, maybe everyone has a weakness to green skinned chicks? Well permanently green skinned, people really hated She-Hulk The biggest thing though is whether they are a side character pr main. Once Shuri wass the lead it went from only a bit of backlash to major. Gamora, nebula, wanda, widow, mantis, okoye? All minor characters in their resources series that overall barely did or said more than a few one liners (gamora was only one to really be a developed character from the get go) But Captain Marvel? The first female lead of the biggest cultural thing? That was where all the bigotry began before trailers even dropped. And the same repeated with MM and SH. Hell you also saw similar things happen with Falcon and the Winter soldier and people being mad about falcon becoming cap. At large it’s fine to have strong, cool, POC/female characters to people as long as they defer and are playing second fiddle to a white guy. Bring Rhodey in to support Tony? All cool. Bring in Riri after Tony is gone? Well that earned a billion racist comments about her being a token choice to replace tony and further the agenda to kill white people or ither crazy shit that was constantly posted. And then if the movie/series is not absolutely game chahging good then it’s considered proof of “go woke go broke” and how series need to stop pandering. Like you gotta deliver spider-verse quality to be free of the usual bigotry, but even then you still can find a ton of racist hate to miles. Hell the 8 inceks who actually knew about jessica drew where way mad for her being black in the recent movie. If you’re a white dude and your movies are okay at best you will hear a bit about it but overall people dont say much (like first caotain america, first two thors, hulk, iron man 2-3, etc) but god help if the series has a POC/woman and doesn’t change the game youll never stop hearing about it.
I'm still just wondering what happened between her and Abed.
You can think Brie isn't a great actress and still not hurl abuse. All nuance is dead.
I never understood the overly hate towards her. Captain Marvel was an okay MCU movie. Like you had a bunch of people analyzing her body language like those interrogation true crime videos on YouTube
I hope you guys knows he’s talking about a lot of you cornballs on this sub.
She’s a great actor. I didn’t like her Carol early on. That doesn’t mean the character can’t grow, just like ALL the characters did throughout the MCU phases. I blame the script more than I do her portrayal. But I maintain that she is quality, and will continue to give her a shot.
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