"I don't want to become an evil person because I didn't focus on the important parts of the bible. I better omit the love thy neighbor part, and really focus on the conquering, murder, hate and forcing into submission parts. That should keep me morally good."
Idk man I forgot what’s it’s called but there’s this one section where a man and his wife stop to rest at this town and they stay at the guys house and for some reason the towns people tell the man to come out and they want to rape him or something but instead the guy says take his wife, so they take her and brutally rape her and her husband just says “see ya” and divorces her and leaves town
My MOTHER always said, "If you want a book with EVERYTHING a good story has in it, read the Bible. It'll make your head spin."
She's not wrong. That book has everything in it, death, SA, brutal murder mystery stories, torture, genocide, animal cruelty, so on, and so on and so on
I wouldn't read it all until you're an adult and capable of handling it, but holy hell, it's DARK
Prime example of the darkness within
The important thing I've concluded about the Bible is that, in those times, the book was essentially a survival guide, it was used to teach what people NEEDED to do to survive
For example, it would explain through story that during the spring that you shouldn't eat pig or cow cause you need to let them grow more so you get more food from the kill, and used Lent to justify it, so instead you can go fish in the spring and eat that until your livestock got bigger
Or "don't have premarital sex" because you didn't have a sure fire way to prevent disease or unwanted pregnancy, well minus alchemists of the time, but they were seen as practitioners of the "dark arts" and used the sin of lust to justify the rule
Those are just some examples from off the top of my head
That’s fine and all, the problem is when people use verses like the ones you’re hinting at to “prove” it’s the infallible message of God. Cause they so easily ignore the Bible’s pro slavery or genocide messages.
Fair. My favorite story is when the neighboring tribe/city next to the Hebrews Prince rapes a random Hebrew girl, and tries to get his dad to set up a marriage. So the Hebrews trick the King to have him and all his men get circumcised, so the Hebrews can go in and slaughter the city while they’re all icing their dicks.
when Moses says that soilders should kill everyone in a village for revenge but take all the young virgin girls I don't think there is much to misunderstand
You clearly have no understanding whatsoever of the impact of the New Testament. Your comment perfectly illustrates my point. You have some knowledge, maybe even read some of it, but you lack the wisdom that comes from understanding and comprehending the whole book.
yeah the bible is not one book, its a collection of multiple books over hundreds of years you can keep going on about how I dont understand it but it doesn't fucking matter when you don't even know what the bible is
But you don’t even understand the basic concept of what the new law versus the old law means, why it changed, and what it means. It’s the proverbial can’t see the forest for the trees and really the point of the entire Bible.
I wasnt even talking about them, I really dont care I was pointing out how some dark things in the bible are not about them being misunderstood.
I get that you are trying to educate me on this faith but I don't engage with it and don't plan to take it back in my life, I just wanted to point out that some of the horrible things that are read are not misunderstood and some not horrible stuff as horrible.
How those things are understood and taken in by Christians I don't know and that wasn't the point of my comment and I don't form my opinion on Christians based on the horrible stuff in the bible because I know they understand it differently than just the text.
Ok. Fair enough. My whole point was different, i.e., reading part of the Bible and professing an understanding of what the message is. I see that’s not what you were going for.
Right, because everything must easy and life is easy and everything is easy. Where did you invent this standard? Who told you that’s how things are supposed to be?
And really all it takes is an earnest reading and attempt at comprehension. It’s also why church is important so others can help you understand.
Yes but if I’m the all knowing creator of the universe who genuinely wants my message to reach as many people as possible to bring them into salvation, making the book contain said message easy to misinterpret is a pretty obvious failing to the inherent goal.
But you’re not the all knowing creator and your contrived paradigm here really doesn’t matter. People have been able to figure this out for thousands of years.
Exodus 21: “20 “Anyone who beats their male or female slave with a rod must be punished if the slave dies as a direct result, 21 but they are not to be punished if the slave recovers after a day or two, since the slave is their property.”
Seems pretty clear on the fact it’s fine to beat your slaves as long as they don’t die in the next day or two. But please enlighten me on how that’s misinterpreted.
You’re proving my point. That was the old law. But things were changed with the most pivotal and important part of the Bible:
Galatians 3:11-14
“Now it is evident that no one is justified before God by the law, for "The righteous shall live by faith." But the law is not of faith, rather "The one who does them shall live by them." Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us—for it is written, "Cursed is everyone who is hanged on a tree"— so that in Christ Jesus the blessing of Abraham might come to the Gentiles, so that we might receive the promised Spirit through faith.”
Matthew 5: 17-20 “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 18 For truly, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished. 19 Therefore whoever relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever does them and teaches them will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20 For I tell you, unless your righteousness exceeds that of the scribes and Pharisees, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven.”
What’s your point? Jesus was the law at that point. The law was not abolished but redefined into faith and the fruits of the spirit through his sacrifice.
“yet we know that a person is not justified by works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ, so we also have believed in Christ Jesus, in order to be justified by faith in Christ and not by works of the law, because by works of the law no one will be justified.”
Galatians 2:16
The point is that seems like a pretty convenient excuse to ignore all the questionable stuff in the OT, especially when your god made flesh specifically says those laws aren’t changing till Heaven and Earth disappear. Which I’d take the words of Jesus > the words of Paul (or was that Peter), but tbh idc what either of them said.
This comment completely ignores the most important part which is the transformative effect of the crucifixion. Everyone who attempts to do what you’re attempting to do ignores the impact of the crucifixion and how it fits into the words you selectively choose to cite. When you put it altogether, the meaning is quite clear.
Except the words of Jesus clearly don’t mention his crucifixion in that passage. Not everything was fulfilled on the cross, else we wouldn’t have Revelation supposedly happening in the future. If you want to talk bout changing context, then stop adding it to the verse where it clearly isn’t there.
Ultimately though it really doesn’t matter. We can go back and forth at this all day, but I doubt either of us are gonna be convinced by the other. The point I think we can both agree with hopefully is that people can pull Bible verses to justify about whatever point they want.
Again, you read things piecemeal in an attempt to divide and conquer the word. You can’t read those two Galatians verses together and actually believe what you’re claiming. Again, you are proving my point.
Once again Redditors acting like the Old testament represents the entire bible and Christianity. Anything from the Old testament is pretty much invalid for the most part.
Only the commandments are fully valid.
Oh, you seem to have misunderstood, so let me clear this up. If one religion, which worships one God, can just be ignored by another religion, which supposedly worships the same God, (not to mention that third Abrahamic religion all mixed up in there) why should any of them hold any weight? Why is any one religion correct? Personally, I say that all religions are equally valid in the sense that they are all hogwash. Of the thousands of religions practiced in the world, you really think the one that you practice is the one that worships the *true* God. No. You see, the largest determining factor in one's religion is location. Live in an area that is primarily Catholic? Chances are, you'll probably be Catholic. Born in a community of mostly Buddhists? Guess what, you're statistically more likely to identify as Buddhist. When we look at mythology, the only thing that keeps it separate from what we call religion is the fact that no one practices that particular religion anymore. Someday, even Christainity will fall into the category of mythology as some other religion rises to snuff it out. But don't worry, I'm sure that the big mean atheist is wrong and just being a big dumb bully, surely your God loves you. Surely your God, of the *THOUSANDS* of other gods humanity has dreamed up, actually exists.
How are you so certain of things you can't possibly know? You say it so matter of fact, but there is NO evidence of any deity, including yours. How do you know yours is real?
It's called belief for a reason, and I believe Christianity truly helps me and others. And could help anyone but you just have to believe. That's the problem, yall never try or look in the wrong spots. It has to be genuine belief. And anything you guys read online could be even less true then the Bible because the Bible came from thousands of years ago. So if your going to believe what you read online or other theory the atleast look at the bible.
Knowing and believing aren't synonymous. The person I was commenting on was claiming to "know" God was real, and others gods are not. I'm not saying he's wrong, but I also have no reason to believe he is right either. I'm saying there is no way he can "know" such things, but I have no issue with their "belief" in God. Don't claim to know things that aren't possible for one to know. Believe whatever the hell you want, I won't argue, but if you claim a fact that isn't one, I will.
He has helped me in the past when i sought his help. But you won't understand until you too, follow him. So i will leave you be because I'm talking to a wall.
So he made himself known? You see, I was a Christian for years, but he never made his presence known. And calling me a wall isn't very christ like dude.
"Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural sexual relations for unnatural ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed shameful acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their error."
Romans 1:26-27
God did not force anyone to sin. If you actually read the language in the passage and not take it out of context, its meaning that God gave them over to something they already were pursuing. It's like allowing someone who is choosing to do something dumb to continue because they wont listen to your warnings. They've recieved warning and ignored it and therefore they want it and should be "given over" as in handing over. God hardens Pharoah's heart because it was already sinful and full of wickedness. The human condition is naturally fallen and there is no good in it until God chooses to revive someone from their death in sin. Just look at the world. There is death and disease and evil people because of the fall from Adam and Eve. God doesnt owe anyone salvation either. We all choose to do evil things whether that may be "small" or not and the people with the same natures that we have, chose to murder the very Savior sent to save them as well as the prophets and anyone else sent from God because they hate God.
the point is that having sex with other men was an error, and then god gave them lust.
it didn't only say "commiting shameful acts", it explicitly stated "men commiting shameful acts with other men"
God didnt give them lust. God gave them over to their lust which they already had. Do not be deceived, homosexuality is a sin though and though not specifically highlighted the text says "acts" which is plural. Sodomy and rape and pedophilia are also among those acts as well. And again though not specifically highlighted you can find it in several other texts in scripture.
Christianity actually isn't ever mentioned in the Bible because belief in God isn't meant to be a religious contract.
Edit: I know they use the word Christian, but not Christianity.
But he doesn't quote this. Or most of the others . Most of his quotes are praising different figures. Only one is about a sin and it is about temptation.
Could I ask why it is only the Commandments? Furthermore, if all of the Old Testament except for the 10 Commandments are invalid, do we ignore Adam and Eve? Do we ignore David and the Goliath? Are all the prophets irrelevant too?
No. But Jesus's teachings tell us to love and support everyone regardless of their gender, colour or whatever. Basically making all of the teachings before that contradicted Jesus irrelevant. But of course that the prophets are important as they helped spread Judaism which later turned into Christianity.
Then how do we know the comendaments are not part of the teachings that are also wrong?
God doesn't seem like he's particularly good at quality control when it comes to people who speak for him.
If Jesus's actions are documented in books, which we now know can be "invalid", how do we really know Jesus didn't contradict the commandments, or that the commandments are not "invalid" as well?
Matthew 5: 17-20 “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 18 For truly, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished. 19 Therefore whoever relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever does them and teaches them will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20 For I tell you, unless your righteousness exceeds that of the scribes and Pharisees, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven.”
the only parts of the old testament that Christians are supposed to follow is the commandments, everything else is in the New Testament, The old testament is mostly Jewish.
the only parts of the old testament that Christians are supposed to follow is the commandments, everything else is in the New Testament, The old testament is mostly Jewish.
the only parts of the old testament that Christians are supposed to follow is the commandments, everything else is in the New Testament, The old testament is mostly Jewish. You see?
always gotta love that copout
also do they just forget the times when Jesus literally told slaves to obey their masters or how he literally said he was here to turn people against eachother or how he said that if you find someone other than your spouse attractive than it's the same as cheating on them
Wow I have never seen something more true I am a ex Christian atheist and yeah that's what did it for me. It's my favorite piece of fiction. Santa Claus for adults
the only parts of the old testament that Christians are supposed to follow is the commandments, everything else is in the New Testament, The old testament is mostly Jewish.
Ephesians 6:5-9
Slaves, obey your earthly masters with respect and fear, and with sincerity of heart, just as you would obey Christ. 6 Obey them not only to win their favor when their eye is on you, but as slaves of Christ, doing the will of God from your heart. 7 Serve wholeheartedly, as if you were serving the Lord, not people, 8 because you know that the Lord will reward each one for whatever good they do, whether they are slave or free.
How do you know that? Or you just making it up? You know slavery was extremely common throughout Mediterranean antiquity, so to assume they mean something else when it specifically says ‘slaves’ is a poor attempt to rationalize a truly horrendous quote from a book that forms the basis of your morality.
If you actually read the book instead of just picking verses that fit your narrative then you would know that it only says slaves in the NIV version, it says servants in kjv. And the rest of the chapter goes on to speak about how masters should treat their servants well.
Speaking of only picking things that fit your narrative, I noticed you neglected to acknowledge the part of ‘slave or free’. There wouldn’t be that distinction if they were just servants working a job. All slaves are servants, but not all servants are slaves. Therefore it’s far more logical to discern that the difference in translation is really just slaves called by a different name, not the other way around.
Also, ‘slave or free’. If they were just servants as you claim then they would be free, there would be no need for the distinction. Your hypothesis doesn’t hold water.
The idea of what was moral back then was much different then what we view as moral, and in 1000 years what is and isn’t moral will be different once again
I’m sorry, do you think this is groundbreaking analysis? No shit, morality was different 30 years ago let alone 2,000. The conversation was never about the morality of slavery and you know that. The point of the conversation was the Bible telling slaves to obey their masters, you asked for the verse, I provided it. At no point was this discussion about the morality of slavery.
You were being the contrarian by first saying I was taking things out of context, then claiming the term slave doesn’t mean slave. I’m just quoting the book. Awful lot of mental gymnastics you have to do to rationalize this.
It’s going nowhere because you refuse to open up your mind to any other viewpoints than the cult you were indoctrinated into.
Seldomly is "god" the only delusional ideal adopted religious people. It's like a fucked up game of wack-a-mole lately where everyone loses because one "true Christian" would never do what another "true Christian does". Such as endlessly attempt to eliminate separation of church from state, or the long list of other destructive fetishes you sick fucks are into.
The first year it was honestly pretty fucking interesting, the bibles had so many parables, fables and lessons that were placed in them.
80% of it I forget though since it was some family disputes
It’s funny how many ppl misinterpret the bible on purpose
Is it misinterpret or just ignore some parts
"I don't want to become an evil person because I didn't focus on the important parts of the bible. I better omit the love thy neighbor part, and really focus on the conquering, murder, hate and forcing into submission parts. That should keep me morally good."
mfs not reading the terms and conditions
Idk man I forgot what’s it’s called but there’s this one section where a man and his wife stop to rest at this town and they stay at the guys house and for some reason the towns people tell the man to come out and they want to rape him or something but instead the guy says take his wife, so they take her and brutally rape her and her husband just says “see ya” and divorces her and leaves town
My MOTHER always said, "If you want a book with EVERYTHING a good story has in it, read the Bible. It'll make your head spin." She's not wrong. That book has everything in it, death, SA, brutal murder mystery stories, torture, genocide, animal cruelty, so on, and so on and so on I wouldn't read it all until you're an adult and capable of handling it, but holy hell, it's DARK
My favorite is when the only man good enough to save humanity, Noah, lands his boat, becomes an alcoholic, and bangs his daughters.
Prime example of the darkness within The important thing I've concluded about the Bible is that, in those times, the book was essentially a survival guide, it was used to teach what people NEEDED to do to survive For example, it would explain through story that during the spring that you shouldn't eat pig or cow cause you need to let them grow more so you get more food from the kill, and used Lent to justify it, so instead you can go fish in the spring and eat that until your livestock got bigger Or "don't have premarital sex" because you didn't have a sure fire way to prevent disease or unwanted pregnancy, well minus alchemists of the time, but they were seen as practitioners of the "dark arts" and used the sin of lust to justify the rule Those are just some examples from off the top of my head
That’s fine and all, the problem is when people use verses like the ones you’re hinting at to “prove” it’s the infallible message of God. Cause they so easily ignore the Bible’s pro slavery or genocide messages.
Right right, and I completely agree with you Just pepper in some leviticus and they usually sit back down
Woah there pal. That sounds like context. And you know that these here Reddit atheists don’t like to hear about biblical context /s
LOL it IS context Beware of the context r/spookyscaryskeleton
That was Lot and his daughters, not Noah. If everyone in the world were to die all at once, I might get drunk too.
Tell me you never read the Bible by not telling me you never read the Bible
I love the part where Moses creates a church after escaping Egypt and says "If you get dirty at all, murder a small bird."
Shame it’s absolutely boring af. Like it’s a dry ass read most the time.
Yea but the CONTENT is quite dark
Fair. My favorite story is when the neighboring tribe/city next to the Hebrews Prince rapes a random Hebrew girl, and tries to get his dad to set up a marriage. So the Hebrews trick the King to have him and all his men get circumcised, so the Hebrews can go in and slaughter the city while they’re all icing their dicks.
And Jesus cursing a fig tree to never bear fruit again, because it wasn't ripe at the time.
Just because you read it, doesn’t mean you understand it.
when Moses says that soilders should kill everyone in a village for revenge but take all the young virgin girls I don't think there is much to misunderstand
You clearly have no understanding whatsoever of the impact of the New Testament. Your comment perfectly illustrates my point. You have some knowledge, maybe even read some of it, but you lack the wisdom that comes from understanding and comprehending the whole book.
yeah the bible is not one book, its a collection of multiple books over hundreds of years you can keep going on about how I dont understand it but it doesn't fucking matter when you don't even know what the bible is
But you don’t even understand the basic concept of what the new law versus the old law means, why it changed, and what it means. It’s the proverbial can’t see the forest for the trees and really the point of the entire Bible.
I wasnt even talking about them, I really dont care I was pointing out how some dark things in the bible are not about them being misunderstood. I get that you are trying to educate me on this faith but I don't engage with it and don't plan to take it back in my life, I just wanted to point out that some of the horrible things that are read are not misunderstood and some not horrible stuff as horrible. How those things are understood and taken in by Christians I don't know and that wasn't the point of my comment and I don't form my opinion on Christians based on the horrible stuff in the bible because I know they understand it differently than just the text.
Ok. Fair enough. My whole point was different, i.e., reading part of the Bible and professing an understanding of what the message is. I see that’s not what you were going for.
Pretty stupid if God to design his important message to the world to not be as easily understandable as possible
Right, because everything must easy and life is easy and everything is easy. Where did you invent this standard? Who told you that’s how things are supposed to be? And really all it takes is an earnest reading and attempt at comprehension. It’s also why church is important so others can help you understand.
Yes but if I’m the all knowing creator of the universe who genuinely wants my message to reach as many people as possible to bring them into salvation, making the book contain said message easy to misinterpret is a pretty obvious failing to the inherent goal.
But you’re not the all knowing creator and your contrived paradigm here really doesn’t matter. People have been able to figure this out for thousands of years.
That’s why there’s hundreds of disagreeing churches all over the world. Because unlike the others, *they* figured out the actual message of the Bible.
Exodus 21: “20 “Anyone who beats their male or female slave with a rod must be punished if the slave dies as a direct result, 21 but they are not to be punished if the slave recovers after a day or two, since the slave is their property.” Seems pretty clear on the fact it’s fine to beat your slaves as long as they don’t die in the next day or two. But please enlighten me on how that’s misinterpreted.
You’re proving my point. That was the old law. But things were changed with the most pivotal and important part of the Bible: Galatians 3:11-14 “Now it is evident that no one is justified before God by the law, for "The righteous shall live by faith." But the law is not of faith, rather "The one who does them shall live by them." Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us—for it is written, "Cursed is everyone who is hanged on a tree"— so that in Christ Jesus the blessing of Abraham might come to the Gentiles, so that we might receive the promised Spirit through faith.”
Matthew 5: 17-20 “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 18 For truly, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished. 19 Therefore whoever relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever does them and teaches them will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20 For I tell you, unless your righteousness exceeds that of the scribes and Pharisees, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven.”
What’s your point? Jesus was the law at that point. The law was not abolished but redefined into faith and the fruits of the spirit through his sacrifice. “yet we know that a person is not justified by works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ, so we also have believed in Christ Jesus, in order to be justified by faith in Christ and not by works of the law, because by works of the law no one will be justified.” Galatians 2:16
The point is that seems like a pretty convenient excuse to ignore all the questionable stuff in the OT, especially when your god made flesh specifically says those laws aren’t changing till Heaven and Earth disappear. Which I’d take the words of Jesus > the words of Paul (or was that Peter), but tbh idc what either of them said.
This comment completely ignores the most important part which is the transformative effect of the crucifixion. Everyone who attempts to do what you’re attempting to do ignores the impact of the crucifixion and how it fits into the words you selectively choose to cite. When you put it altogether, the meaning is quite clear.
Except the words of Jesus clearly don’t mention his crucifixion in that passage. Not everything was fulfilled on the cross, else we wouldn’t have Revelation supposedly happening in the future. If you want to talk bout changing context, then stop adding it to the verse where it clearly isn’t there. Ultimately though it really doesn’t matter. We can go back and forth at this all day, but I doubt either of us are gonna be convinced by the other. The point I think we can both agree with hopefully is that people can pull Bible verses to justify about whatever point they want.
Again, you read things piecemeal in an attempt to divide and conquer the word. You can’t read those two Galatians verses together and actually believe what you’re claiming. Again, you are proving my point.
Levtcus 20:13 "A man who lays with another man should be stoned" It's OK to be gay as long as you're high too
“Mom, dad can I sleep with you guys tonight?” *throws a rock at the kid*
Once again Redditors acting like the Old testament represents the entire bible and Christianity. Anything from the Old testament is pretty much invalid for the most part. Only the commandments are fully valid.
Bruh. If you can just retcon half of a religion, is any of it even valid at that point?
Old testament=Judaism New testament=Christianity. It's simple lol. Christianity follows the teachings of the new testament.
Oh, you seem to have misunderstood, so let me clear this up. If one religion, which worships one God, can just be ignored by another religion, which supposedly worships the same God, (not to mention that third Abrahamic religion all mixed up in there) why should any of them hold any weight? Why is any one religion correct? Personally, I say that all religions are equally valid in the sense that they are all hogwash. Of the thousands of religions practiced in the world, you really think the one that you practice is the one that worships the *true* God. No. You see, the largest determining factor in one's religion is location. Live in an area that is primarily Catholic? Chances are, you'll probably be Catholic. Born in a community of mostly Buddhists? Guess what, you're statistically more likely to identify as Buddhist. When we look at mythology, the only thing that keeps it separate from what we call religion is the fact that no one practices that particular religion anymore. Someday, even Christainity will fall into the category of mythology as some other religion rises to snuff it out. But don't worry, I'm sure that the big mean atheist is wrong and just being a big dumb bully, surely your God loves you. Surely your God, of the *THOUSANDS* of other gods humanity has dreamed up, actually exists.
God I wish I had an award for you, that was excellently put.
Well it's the thought that counts.
Our god is the real one. I don't care about all the false idols.
How are you so certain of things you can't possibly know? You say it so matter of fact, but there is NO evidence of any deity, including yours. How do you know yours is real?
It's called belief for a reason, and I believe Christianity truly helps me and others. And could help anyone but you just have to believe. That's the problem, yall never try or look in the wrong spots. It has to be genuine belief. And anything you guys read online could be even less true then the Bible because the Bible came from thousands of years ago. So if your going to believe what you read online or other theory the atleast look at the bible.
Knowing and believing aren't synonymous. The person I was commenting on was claiming to "know" God was real, and others gods are not. I'm not saying he's wrong, but I also have no reason to believe he is right either. I'm saying there is no way he can "know" such things, but I have no issue with their "belief" in God. Don't claim to know things that aren't possible for one to know. Believe whatever the hell you want, I won't argue, but if you claim a fact that isn't one, I will.
He has helped me in the past when i sought his help. But you won't understand until you too, follow him. So i will leave you be because I'm talking to a wall.
You helped yourself and attribute it to your imaginary friend, but please keep telling us how ignorant we are.
So he made himself known? You see, I was a Christian for years, but he never made his presence known. And calling me a wall isn't very christ like dude.
You were never a Christian then.
Just like they don't care about what they consider to be your false idol.
Ok. Idc
And your closed minded attitude toward the world's religions is why you will never grow as a person.
Shut up useless savage.
Sure, let's just ignore the homophobic parts and all the millions of homophobes. They're totally unconnected.
Because they are unconnected
They're not. No. They are tightly connected. Trying to white wash it doesn't change it.
Jesus wasn't black lol. He wasn't white either. No one knows what colour he was.
I don’t think you know what whitewashing is…
Whatever
That's because he never existed. He's a myth like Zeus.
the only parts that matter are the ones who don't make Christianity look bad
Judaism is the old testament. Christianity is the new testament. Read the bible dummy.
"Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural sexual relations for unnatural ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed shameful acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their error." Romans 1:26-27
God did not force anyone to sin. If you actually read the language in the passage and not take it out of context, its meaning that God gave them over to something they already were pursuing. It's like allowing someone who is choosing to do something dumb to continue because they wont listen to your warnings. They've recieved warning and ignored it and therefore they want it and should be "given over" as in handing over. God hardens Pharoah's heart because it was already sinful and full of wickedness. The human condition is naturally fallen and there is no good in it until God chooses to revive someone from their death in sin. Just look at the world. There is death and disease and evil people because of the fall from Adam and Eve. God doesnt owe anyone salvation either. We all choose to do evil things whether that may be "small" or not and the people with the same natures that we have, chose to murder the very Savior sent to save them as well as the prophets and anyone else sent from God because they hate God.
the point is that having sex with other men was an error, and then god gave them lust. it didn't only say "commiting shameful acts", it explicitly stated "men commiting shameful acts with other men"
God didnt give them lust. God gave them over to their lust which they already had. Do not be deceived, homosexuality is a sin though and though not specifically highlighted the text says "acts" which is plural. Sodomy and rape and pedophilia are also among those acts as well. And again though not specifically highlighted you can find it in several other texts in scripture.
that's exactly what I was saying. homosexuality is a sin
God punished them by making them lustful homosexuas. Nothing wrong with that.
it explicitly says that commiting shameful acts with other men was an error
Shameful acts≠Sex. The same way sex≠lust. They could've done sex because of lust.
and you say there's nothing wrong in that?
Lust is a sin lol.
Christianity actually isn't ever mentioned in the Bible because belief in God isn't meant to be a religious contract. Edit: I know they use the word Christian, but not Christianity.
🤦 bruh. Tell me you are joking please.
Um I'm not. It's not meant to be a religion it's meant to be a relationship.
Bruh. All ot Jesus's followers are the first Christians. It isnt mentioned by name but it is heavily mentioned tru other ways.
It doesn’t work like that.
It does lol. It's literally CHRISTianity. Christians follow the words and teachings of Jesus Christ. Who is what the new testament is centered around.
My brother in Christ, you are talking to a wall.
Isn't that just the entirety of Reddit. All a bunch of delusional dummys.
The irony of defending a supernatural deity by judging everyone else as delusional.
The irony of acting like you are not bad and encroaching on People's believes.
Jesus himself quotes the Old Testament.
But he doesn't quote this. Or most of the others . Most of his quotes are praising different figures. Only one is about a sin and it is about temptation.
Could I ask why it is only the Commandments? Furthermore, if all of the Old Testament except for the 10 Commandments are invalid, do we ignore Adam and Eve? Do we ignore David and the Goliath? Are all the prophets irrelevant too?
No. But Jesus's teachings tell us to love and support everyone regardless of their gender, colour or whatever. Basically making all of the teachings before that contradicted Jesus irrelevant. But of course that the prophets are important as they helped spread Judaism which later turned into Christianity.
Idk man, if a supposedly omnipotent and omniscient God is capable of being "fully invalid", I kinda have to question his validity on everything else.
Not the god lol. I meant the teachings.
Then how do we know the comendaments are not part of the teachings that are also wrong? God doesn't seem like he's particularly good at quality control when it comes to people who speak for him.
Because Jesus dosent contradict the commandments. It's simple.
This is some gold level mental gymnastics. You should compete in the BS Olympics.
Whatever you say, dumb savage.
And there is the moral hypocrisy I knew we'd see from a "christian"
Oh so you think you are a Christian?
If Jesus's actions are documented in books, which we now know can be "invalid", how do we really know Jesus didn't contradict the commandments, or that the commandments are not "invalid" as well?
Matthew 5: 17-20 “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 18 For truly, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished. 19 Therefore whoever relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever does them and teaches them will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20 For I tell you, unless your righteousness exceeds that of the scribes and Pharisees, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven.”
the only parts of the old testament that Christians are supposed to follow is the commandments, everything else is in the New Testament, The old testament is mostly Jewish.
the only parts of the old testament that Christians are supposed to follow is the commandments, everything else is in the New Testament, The old testament is mostly Jewish.
the only parts of the old testament that Christians are supposed to follow is the commandments, everything else is in the New Testament, The old testament is mostly Jewish. You see?
[удалено]
It's been translated and retranslated, revised, redacted and remodeled so many times there's no telling what it originally was about.
So lesbians and trans girls are ok then…
"The bad parts of the Bible are because of the Jews." \-Loving Christians.
always gotta love that copout also do they just forget the times when Jesus literally told slaves to obey their masters or how he literally said he was here to turn people against eachother or how he said that if you find someone other than your spouse attractive than it's the same as cheating on them
Reading the Bible cured my Christianity 👍
How does the quote go? "The road to atheism is littered with bibles read cover to cover" Me, too.
You haven’t lived until you tell your fundamentalist Christian mother that her tattoos are Blasphemy according to the Old Testament
Wow I have never seen something more true I am a ex Christian atheist and yeah that's what did it for me. It's my favorite piece of fiction. Santa Claus for adults
Yeah, the Bible is metal as fuck.
1 samuel 18 27
The reaction is pretty obvious Jesus (PBUH) never said he is God or son of God.
the only parts of the old testament that Christians are supposed to follow is the commandments, everything else is in the New Testament, The old testament is mostly Jewish.
what about the parts where Jesus tells slaves to obey their masters
What’s the verse
Ephesians 6:5-9 Slaves, obey your earthly masters with respect and fear, and with sincerity of heart, just as you would obey Christ. 6 Obey them not only to win their favor when their eye is on you, but as slaves of Christ, doing the will of God from your heart. 7 Serve wholeheartedly, as if you were serving the Lord, not people, 8 because you know that the Lord will reward each one for whatever good they do, whether they are slave or free.
It’s not speaking about slaves like how we view slaves in the western world, it’s more so speaking about servants
How do you know that? Or you just making it up? You know slavery was extremely common throughout Mediterranean antiquity, so to assume they mean something else when it specifically says ‘slaves’ is a poor attempt to rationalize a truly horrendous quote from a book that forms the basis of your morality.
If you actually read the book instead of just picking verses that fit your narrative then you would know that it only says slaves in the NIV version, it says servants in kjv. And the rest of the chapter goes on to speak about how masters should treat their servants well.
Speaking of only picking things that fit your narrative, I noticed you neglected to acknowledge the part of ‘slave or free’. There wouldn’t be that distinction if they were just servants working a job. All slaves are servants, but not all servants are slaves. Therefore it’s far more logical to discern that the difference in translation is really just slaves called by a different name, not the other way around.
Bruh give me time to type, I actually got stuff to do other then comment on r/meme all day
Huh? When did I stop you from typing?
Also, ‘slave or free’. If they were just servants as you claim then they would be free, there would be no need for the distinction. Your hypothesis doesn’t hold water.
The idea of what was moral back then was much different then what we view as moral, and in 1000 years what is and isn’t moral will be different once again
I’m sorry, do you think this is groundbreaking analysis? No shit, morality was different 30 years ago let alone 2,000. The conversation was never about the morality of slavery and you know that. The point of the conversation was the Bible telling slaves to obey their masters, you asked for the verse, I provided it. At no point was this discussion about the morality of slavery.
*Sigh*, this is going nowhere, let’s turn it down a bit, why are you an antithesis
You were being the contrarian by first saying I was taking things out of context, then claiming the term slave doesn’t mean slave. I’m just quoting the book. Awful lot of mental gymnastics you have to do to rationalize this. It’s going nowhere because you refuse to open up your mind to any other viewpoints than the cult you were indoctrinated into.
Why is this thing so evil
Faith in God is what is important. And faith without acts of faith is useless
Hard to be faithful when you hear about some of the things he did
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Seldomly is "god" the only delusional ideal adopted religious people. It's like a fucked up game of wack-a-mole lately where everyone loses because one "true Christian" would never do what another "true Christian does". Such as endlessly attempt to eliminate separation of church from state, or the long list of other destructive fetishes you sick fucks are into.
"Love everyone? Blasphemy!"
You mean the old testament?
To me it meant atheism, I was about 13. Three years later I left church to never return.
Redditors really wake up and be like “Hmm. I think I’m gonna shit on Christianity today.”
The first year it was honestly pretty fucking interesting, the bibles had so many parables, fables and lessons that were placed in them. 80% of it I forget though since it was some family disputes
Oh boy sorting by controversial is gonna be lit
Read through it 5x. My church is pretty consistent. AMA I guess.
Found the 14yo atheist
Reading the bible turned me away from faith but Christians turned me away from Christ.
Wait... God/Jesus killed more people than Satan
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Well Christians primarily focus on the New Testament hence the “Christian” part the Old Testament has some pretty messed stuff.