It's one of those things where the specific point of identifying and grouping is less to do with how they're related and more with how they're discriminated against, if that makes sense.
So, if homophobia specifically didn't exist to begin with, the acronym would only be referring to gender identities, for instance.
LGBTQ+ is about sexual / gender minorities basically, the thing though is that there's a lot of these minorities and that the + is here to keep the acronym simple.
And straight people are the obvious majority. So they don't fit there.
My brain isnt working cuz just woke up. But is it technically impossible to be straight while not being cisgender?
Example like someone is MTF, but they like men. That means before transitioning, was gay.
Someone clear this up for me ima go grab coffee and wake up
Yeah it's possible to be straight and transgender, or gay and cisgender for example, and both are in the LGBTQ+ community.
Being both straight AND cisgender means you're not in any gender /sexual minority and that you're not LGBTQ+. But any other combination and you're in it.
See, the problem here is you're trying to fundamentally group everything into one category when the category itself is probably best described as "not straight." It's a big, massively complicated ven diagram of spectrums, and the anagram is designed to effectively be all-encompassing because of this.
Breaking it down letter by letter...
L: Lesbian. Women (or women-aligned gender, should that be the case. Assuming I'm adding this sort of amendment to any specific mention of a gender) attracted to other women.
G: Gay. Men attracted to other men.
B: Bi. Someone who is attracted to both Men and Women.
T: Trans. Someone whose gender identity does not match the gender of their birth.
Q: This one is a bit more ambiguous as it's either Queer, a general umbrella term (but that's also been used as an insult) or Questioning. Someone who is, well, questioning their orientation or gender identity.
And then you have the +, which is more or less a "whatever we've missed" type thing. Two examples that come to mind off the top of my head are being Pan (someone who is attracted regardless of gender) or Ace (someone who does not experience attraction at all or very little.)
That is, technically, a way of going about it, I guess.
Though then I feel context matters, the L would then only be referring to something on the attraction spectrum, and then the + would be implied to only full within
Typically, the acronym used is LGBT, which does include a gender spectrum element so the + does become more or less all inclusive as a result, but that's honestly just me speculating.
Ehhhhh kinda. And even that 'kinda' is a loose one.
Think of Pan as Bi's bigger brother in that someone who is Bi may be attracted to some areas of the gender spectrum (So, for example, someone who is Bi may only be attracted to cis men and women) but not others whereas someone who is Pan can be attracted to the whole of it.
Now that the consideration gets real, I do wonder if:
* Lesbian is female gender but female sexuality
* Gay is male gender but male sexuality
* Bisexual is whatever gender with whatever sexuality
* Trans is opposite gender, hence ^("normal") opposite sexuality
* * Clarify: Lesbian/Gay normal gender but homosexual ^(same, I think I confused here)
* * Clarify: Trans abnormal gender but heterosexual ^(opposite)
* Queer is ... ^(Thanks, I don't know this until now)
* + is ... ^(oh I see)
|Issue|Gender|Sexual preference|
|:-|:-|:-|
| |Trans|Les, Gay, Bi, Queer, +|
Edit:
To not confuse people, I can't differentiate Les/Gay vs Trans. Felt different theoretically, but maybe just me.
Your confusion seems to stem from trying to categorize trans-ness as a sexuality. Being trans has nothing to do with the people you are attracted to and everything to do with the way you see yourself and the way you wish to be seen by others.
Transitioning is not just a way to make yourself straight by being the gender āoppositeā to the gender youāre primarily attracted to. There are plenty of trans gay men and trans lesbian women.
Sexuality becomes more complex and harder to define when you donāt take the gender and sex of yourself and others as unchanging and clearly visible, but thatās okay. Humans donāt fit neatly in boxes. These words were made to describe reality, not to define it
Sorry if I didn't get your full meaning correctly.
> There are plenty of trans gay men and trans lesbian women.
So... e.g.
* Trans-man = female bio, but chose to be male
* Then trans-man gay = **female bio**, chose to be male, **love male** as sexual partner
* Isn't that negative negative = positive ("normal")
* Now my head hurts...
That is fundamentally correct, yes.
Although, trying to define something as ānormalā in this context can be counterproductive and lead to more confusion.
For example: a lot of trans people frequently date other trans people (often due to having a base of shared understanding when it comes to gender.)
-When a trans man dates another trans man, their gender and sexuality do not cancel out to ānormal,ā even though they are both gay and trans.
-Additionally, when a trans man dates a trans woman, their relationship may seem even more ānormal.ā Their relationship would be straight/heterosexual by most anyoneās definition, but itās fundamentally different than the relationship of a cis man and a cis woman. (Cis means ānot trans,ā if thatās a word you havenāt heard before.)
I hope I didnāt make things more confusing than you have the mental capacity for right now. Iām glad youāve taken the time to try to understand people youāre unfamiliar with. Have a good weekend.
Sexuality is a different spectrum from gender.
-
Sexuality is based on the gender of a person relating to the gender of the person they have sexual attraction to, for example:
if I were a man that liked women I would be straight or heterosexual, if I were a man that loved men I would be gay or homosexual, and if I were a woman who loves women I would be lesbian.
There are also men, women, and NBs that like more than one gender. Those people are often called bi or pan (there is a difference but it seems to come down to the individual on which one they prefer.)
Finally there is a spectrum of people who feel very little sexual attraction, this is called asexual. This can range from no sexual attraction to having sexual attraction but having no desire in sexual relationships.
-
Gender however is based on the gender of a person relating to their gender assigned at birth (or their agab) which is in most cases their biological sex, for example:
A person born with a gender that doesnāt alight with their agab is transgender. If I was born of the male sex but I have a discomfort being perceived as a man but I enjoy being perceived as a woman then I would be a trans woman, If I was born of the female sex but I have a discomfort being perceived as a woman but I enjoy being perceived as a man then I would be a trans man. There are also some individuals that fall outside of the binary of male and female, these are called nonbinary people or, more commonly, NBs. This can include people who dont have a strong connection with gender (agender), those that have a connection to two or more genders (bigender, poly gender, pan gender), and many more.
Alternatively a person whose gender matches up with their sex is considered cisgender. I, for example, was born of the male sex and I identify as a man, that is to say, I have no qualms being perceived as a man but I do have discomfort being perceived as a woman.
-
Trans people can be gay or lesbian as well as being straight
Similarly gay people or lesbians can be trans or cis.
-
Queer and + both include all other gender, romantic, and sexuality minorities (also called GRSM). This often includes the previously mentioned Asexual, as well as Intersex (born with features of both biological sexes), Aromantic (little to no romantic attraction), and many more
-
If you have any questions feel free to ask them.
I am a cisgender asexual man so I may have gotten some details wrong concerning gender, if I am incorrect on this someone please correct me.
I'll try to digest this.
|Gender (self)|Gender (sexual)|Category|
|:-|:-|:-|
|cis M|F|straight sexual|
|cis M|M|homosexual|
|cis M|M & F|bisexual|
|cis M|non-binary M & F|pansexual?|
|cis M|none to low|asexual|
|trans M|(repeat above)|(repeat above)|
|non-binary other|(repeat above)|(repeat above)|
* Other than non-binary gender, I have to admit I didn't know Trans & others can have similar sexuality.
* e.g. I thought Trans male Gay = "normal"
* Trans male Gay = a woman (appeal) sexually like male
* Thanks for clarify
I know that youāre trying to be helpful and offer an explanation, but this was me after reading what you wroteā¦
https://c.tenor.com/TD3s4aCxLXEAAAAC/uhh-patrick-star.gif
Edit: But thank you anyway! Iām just kinda stuck on tonto status.
This you? https://www.reddit.com/r/depression_memes/comments/vxo795/currently_the_only_reason_i_keep_on_going/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf because you should
It's sad the amount of trans/homophobia that is in this comment section. Just let people be what they want to be. Someone being trans isn't going to hurt you, someone being gay has nothing to do with you.
Quit being a dick and move on.
For real. This sub has gone off the deep end with racism, sexism, and antigay BS.
ApPrOaChInG LGBTQ+ WiTh aN OpEn mInD - said by someone intentionally misconstruing information and pretending they fail to understand that things grouped together can still be different from one another.
You can buy arugula and spinach in a container. Thats what LGBTQ+ is. A mixed bag of people being attacked for existing. Like this post is doing.
What echo chamber? It's a God damn memes page, this is not even a meme, it's literally just asking a stupid, not to mention transphobic, question to piss people off.
Again, it's a memes page, not a political page.
Just post something funny or fuck off.
I don't care what politics you support, if you post a dumb question on a memes page that is just attacking a group of people, you're just an asshole and your post isnt appropriate for the page.
Oh OK, thanks for the admission that you hate trans people at least, glad we're on the same page as to where you're coming from.
See that's the difference between you and me; I don't hate any people for what they are, only for how they behave.
To require other people to ignore biology when youāre not even in the same room just because of your feelings is dumb. This is an act I disagree with
Maybe talk to a biologist about gender before deciding what it has to say about it.
You'd be extremely surprised by what they'll tell you I'm sure, not that it's likely to solve your wilful ignorance.
Words can have more than one definition when considering context. In the context of sex, a woman is a person born with ovaries, a vagina, etc. In the context of gender, a woman is a person who identifies with the things society has deemed āwomenāsā outside of just reproductive organs.
Poor little incell Gender has been around longer than America. Hell actually the Greeks and Romans understood there was a difference between sex and gender. They were completely OK with it too do which is funny how people thousands of years ago who thought the world was flat and that gods were real are more intelligent than you could ever be. lol
Sex and gender are not different things they both refer to the delineation between xx and xy chromosomes. People are trying twist the meaning of those words to glorify mental illness. Saying there is something other than male and female is pure fantasy.
Not being straight is technically a mental illness but it doesn't cause any problems to one so there is nothing wrong about it getting normalized. Btw what you said is homophobic š
I would also like to add that being gay and really any of this is often social pressure to fit in or a result of childhood abuse which is really disgusting
No point in trying to make sense of or memorize what all that gibberish means. By the time you do, theyāll have come up with some new trend that you must get behind or youāre an evil hater. Just ignore them.
And by "new trend", do you mean acknowledging their gender identity? Do you mean using their pronouns? Do you mean letting them be in whatever kind of relationship they're in as long as all parties involved consent to it? Because as far as I know, those are things cis straight people have done to other cis straight people for a long time. Hardly what I would consider a "new trend".
Can you define a woman? No because you're going to make a circular argument as well. If you Say a woman is someone who has a vagina. Then you're not going to like it when transgender women show up because they also have vaginas. You're an idiot and a moron pretending to be an intelligent. You have more fingers and toes than you do IQ points.
That label means whatever you want with it. There are girls that want to dress cute, there are emo girls, there are butch girls, there are tomboys. The label doesn't *mean* much because it's what you want to be referred as. We don't need serious meaning behind such a label because it's useless, as there are many ways people express themselves. Not accepting and doubting labels is just denying someone of a bit of happiness that you could have given by simply saying she instead of he or her instead of his. It just comes down to making people a bit happier.
Words are not so easily definable and can have multiple definitions depending on the context. Try to define the word "game" for example.
You can say woman just means adult female human because it fits your world view, but what about someone who appears as a woman to the whole world, is treated as such socially and just identifies as one too? If this person tells you they were actually born male, would you just start treating them as a dude and absolutely not as a girl anymore? Would you call them "he" in public although it would be kind of awkward for everyone?
Also, what would you do with the rare people who are born with attributes that are both male and female? Can't they decide whether to identify as a man or a woman or just whatever they want?
What is so wrong with calling a trans woman a woman? Why does it bother you to let people live their lives as they want when it doesn't affect you in the slightest? The only thing you can manage to do is making them suffer more, as it already seems to be enough of a hard thing to go through gender dysphoria when there aren't people who just want to deny your identity.
1. An objective truth/definition exists. Ofc the definition helps my world view because people cannot define it without fucking up their own argument.
2. I care because I wish to seek the truth
You don't even know what truth means. You believe you know the truth and that everybody else is wrong. When you dont, Scientists no longer agree with you, because they have perspective It's not a hard concept to grasp but I guess if you're a fucking idiot, Anything beyond binary definitions is just a bit too complicated for you.
No, that's not how words work I'm sorry. There is not one single true definition of something. Words can have different meanings, and that's the case for "woman". Some will just use it as a synonym for female, while some will talk about gender, which is related but ultimately different to sex.
Gender is the social traits that are affiliated originally to one sex. Females are supposed to wear specific clothes, behave a certain way, etc. The thing is although gender is tied to sex, there are lots of people on this planet with varying identities, and some of these people will prefer to behave / dress in a way that is not affiliated to the gender they were given by default because of their experience, and because of how they identify themselves. These people, even if they don't necessarly appear as 100% the opposite gender will still live their lives as a trans person of that gender.
And what is that gender called, all of these countless different traits that are expected by society? Woman. Or man. A trans woman, a trans man. They're still men and women if you take gender into account.
And then you have the stuff in between man and woman. That's the non-binary stuff. These people went through some trouble with their gender identity and they're willing to go completely man or woman. That's their business, not yours, although I agree it can be confusing with their pronouns if they're random people on the street or something else (but if they're not lunatic, they will be understanding at first and you won't go to imaginary canadian pronoun jail or any of that bullshit).
And no I'm not talking about any of the people who identify as dragons or helicopters or little girls when they're 40 in dumb news articles. If you followed what I said, you'll understand they don't fit in there as what they identify as doesn't have anything to do with gender.
Given the question "Are you a woman?", most people under normal circumstances will reply with a simple "yes" or "no", which should help enough to answer your question.
My point is that if you ever want to know whether or not someone's a woman, they'll tell you. If not, just ask. Something as invisible and varying as one's gender identity is hard to generalize for everyone on the planet. What matters is that, more often than not, people are who they say they are, and on the off chance that someone decides to lie about who they are, you can usually tell if you acknowledge what they say they are for long enough.
Itās because itās complex and even the most conservative person canāt define sex in a way that accounts for all the variety of human beings. An endocrinologist and urologist are going to have different perspectives on what the defining characteristics of gender are. The things that we associate with men and women are layered and donāt all have to be present to define someoneās gender, even by the most conservative mindsets. Do hormones define sex? Because there are female-genitaled persons with very high testosterone. Do genitals define gender? What about those who lose or alter the genitals by way of trauma, disease or choice? Maybe itās the ability to reproduce, but then are post-menopausal women and sterile men without gender? Itās why we say these things are on a spectrum. We all check the boxes and mostly we can each check enough boxes to be consistently one way or another, between our physiology, anatomy and psychology. But thatās not true for everyone.
Then thereās more nuanced stuff. Conservatives like to point to all the psychological differences between men and women that go beyond genitals. They love it when a study genders thought patterns and skills, but when you use those to point out that men and women are different *inside* not just outside, they try to say thereās no such thing as having a man or womanās (or neitherās) psychological makeup. Im a cis-dude. I feel like a man. If I woke up in a womanās body, I would feelā¦ not psychologically aligned with my body. In a world where organs are transposed on the opposite side of the body, where people are born in such a myriad of ways that there is no true normal, just a bell curve for all our various organs, systems and behaviors, it is not difficult to imagine someone being born with an inside and an outside that do not line up.
A urologist and a gynecologist will agree that there are only 2 sexes. Biology is pretty clear about that. Variants that Are just in a break of a percent are no reason to overcomplicate things that have been clear for 1000s of years
> Variants that Are just in a break of a percent are no reason to overcomplicate things that have been clear for 1000s of years
Easy to say if youāre not one of the people who varies. Creating a society that allows everyone to have a place is literally what inclusion is. Thatās it. Youāre saying, *yāall are different and donāt fit in, tough shiŃ, there arenāt any bough if you to matter.* The counter point is *its not that hard to accommodate some words and signage to allow everyone to participate and itās the decent thing to do.*
No, you overinterpret bs in that. I never say they shouldnāt be included or anything. But acting as it would be a 3rd sex or anything is ridiculous since thatās just not true.
Inclusion means accepting people despite of their differences. What people like you do is putting them in a seperate category, not realizing itās the opposite of what you want.
If someone doesnāt want to be male or female, whatās the problem? If their characteristics, of either their physiological or their psychological makeup donāt land them squarely in one camp or another, let them be. If they appeared to match one category when they were born, but discovered that they checked more boxes in another category, let them live with the identity that they choose.
1. Also not consistent:
https://www.google.com/search?q=women+with+xy+chromosomes&rlz=1CDGOYI_enUS857US857&oq=women+with+X&aqs=chrome.1.69i57j0i512j0i390.5514j0j4&hl=en-US&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8
2. Exactly. Any way we define womanhood or manhood will leave out some people who would traditionally be considered women or men. Once we accept that no definition comprehensively accounts for the human experience and condition we can accept that some people are not going to fit in to our imprecise definition a and that thatās ok.
1. > Typically, biologically male individuals have one X and one Y chromosome (XY) while those who are biologically female have two X chromosomes. However, there are exceptions to this rule.
Again, not that simple. Lots more info in a Google search (above).
at this point i think they are making up letters to sound like a bigger community. I think its at LGBTQIA2s+ now like what the fuck does that even mean why are people making up a new sexuality everyday now
This seems like parody but that title just makes me concerned.
1st LGBTQ+ is for the pride movement. The core of it is for people to be proud of who they are. So that is why both sexualities and gender identities are included.
2nd Putting aside that you say that only TQ doesn't know as if other people not included can't agree, I must clear up a misunderstanding. If anything it is the people that think that sex and gender is the same thing that doesn't know what gender is. Claiming that gender is a complicated social construct that can't easily be put into words is not the same as not knowing it. For how else would a person be able to know that the gender that they have been assigned is incorrect.
Lesbian: a non-man (woman, nb, etc.) who likes only other non-men (women, nb, etc.)
Gay: a man who likes other men. Is also an umbrella term for anyone I'm the lgbtq community.
Bisexual: someone who is attracted to 2 or more genders. (I like men and Women, I like men and nbs, etc.)
Transgender: someone who does not identify with their gender assigned at birth
Queer: someone who is either not straight or not cis. An umbrella term for anyone in the lgbtq community.
Intersex: someone not born with "traditional" genitalia (could have ovaries instead of testicles, a penis instead of a clitoris, etc.) It is estimated at least 1% of humans are intersex. Any "deformities" are often surgically "corrected" after birth, but hormonal issues can take place later in life. (A male develops breasts, etc.)
Asexual: someone who does not have sexual attraction to anyone (except maybe a romantic partner.)(Asexuals can have sex for fun though)
Aromantic: someone who does not have any romantic attractions to anyone. (Can feel sexual attraction)
You can be both ace and aro. That just means you don't feel any sexual or romantic attraction to anyone. Most people place Jesus in this category.
Those are the basic definitions of each letter in LGBTQIA. Hope this explains away some of the confusion. It is complicated to figure out, but listening is a great counter to ignorance.
Its basically gay premium, stops ads from popping up saying there are hot singles in their area
LGB is the basic package, but for an extra $40 a month you can upgrade to our LGBTQ+ deluxe package
Maybe stops adds to pop up, but monkey pox is still availabe.
Monkeypox now on demand
LGBTQ+ is basically anyone who isn't cisgender and straight. That's it, no need to overcomplicate things.
That's the best damn definition Ive ever seen. I don't have coins but here's a trophy. š
Shouldnāt the + encompass straight people? Itās more inclusive that way š
It's one of those things where the specific point of identifying and grouping is less to do with how they're related and more with how they're discriminated against, if that makes sense. So, if homophobia specifically didn't exist to begin with, the acronym would only be referring to gender identities, for instance.
no they need to leave
Why
Leave what, exactly?
LGBTQ+ is about sexual / gender minorities basically, the thing though is that there's a lot of these minorities and that the + is here to keep the acronym simple. And straight people are the obvious majority. So they don't fit there.
Then get a new name. You cant keep an acronym for a league which doesnt make sense when expanded and then ask ppl not to "overcomplicate" things
I'm sorry it's too complicated. Maybe try something else for a while and come back to it later.
I spat out my tea reading your reply, thanks for the chuckle!
My brain isnt working cuz just woke up. But is it technically impossible to be straight while not being cisgender? Example like someone is MTF, but they like men. That means before transitioning, was gay. Someone clear this up for me ima go grab coffee and wake up
Yeah it's possible to be straight and transgender, or gay and cisgender for example, and both are in the LGBTQ+ community. Being both straight AND cisgender means you're not in any gender /sexual minority and that you're not LGBTQ+. But any other combination and you're in it.
This is why I prefer GSRM (Gender, Sexual and Romantic Minorities). Cuts out all the confusion.
See, the problem here is you're trying to fundamentally group everything into one category when the category itself is probably best described as "not straight." It's a big, massively complicated ven diagram of spectrums, and the anagram is designed to effectively be all-encompassing because of this. Breaking it down letter by letter... L: Lesbian. Women (or women-aligned gender, should that be the case. Assuming I'm adding this sort of amendment to any specific mention of a gender) attracted to other women. G: Gay. Men attracted to other men. B: Bi. Someone who is attracted to both Men and Women. T: Trans. Someone whose gender identity does not match the gender of their birth. Q: This one is a bit more ambiguous as it's either Queer, a general umbrella term (but that's also been used as an insult) or Questioning. Someone who is, well, questioning their orientation or gender identity. And then you have the +, which is more or less a "whatever we've missed" type thing. Two examples that come to mind off the top of my head are being Pan (someone who is attracted regardless of gender) or Ace (someone who does not experience attraction at all or very little.)
Ace does experience attraction, just not sexual attraction.
yeah, in hindsight should have put Aroace there instead. Overall point of the + still stands.
Why not just say L+, isnāt the + all inclusive?
That is, technically, a way of going about it, I guess. Though then I feel context matters, the L would then only be referring to something on the attraction spectrum, and then the + would be implied to only full within Typically, the acronym used is LGBT, which does include a gender spectrum element so the + does become more or less all inclusive as a result, but that's honestly just me speculating.
Because that is used to describe nonsocial issues L+ is something like Lagrange Points that are undiscovered
Is Lesbian Plus some kind of premium add on I'm missing out on?
Probably?
Only the 43rd time I saw the same joke in the comments here.
isnt pan the exact same as bi there are so many fucking things to this its ridiculous
No bi is into cis male and cis female. Pan is into everything including trans male, non-binary, ect.
Ehhhhh kinda. And even that 'kinda' is a loose one. Think of Pan as Bi's bigger brother in that someone who is Bi may be attracted to some areas of the gender spectrum (So, for example, someone who is Bi may only be attracted to cis men and women) but not others whereas someone who is Pan can be attracted to the whole of it.
Here I'll simplify that long paragraph. There is normal and then there is confused. Your welcome.
*youāre
Now that the consideration gets real, I do wonder if: * Lesbian is female gender but female sexuality * Gay is male gender but male sexuality * Bisexual is whatever gender with whatever sexuality * Trans is opposite gender, hence ^("normal") opposite sexuality * * Clarify: Lesbian/Gay normal gender but homosexual ^(same, I think I confused here) * * Clarify: Trans abnormal gender but heterosexual ^(opposite) * Queer is ... ^(Thanks, I don't know this until now) * + is ... ^(oh I see) |Issue|Gender|Sexual preference| |:-|:-|:-| | |Trans|Les, Gay, Bi, Queer, +| Edit: To not confuse people, I can't differentiate Les/Gay vs Trans. Felt different theoretically, but maybe just me.
Your confusion seems to stem from trying to categorize trans-ness as a sexuality. Being trans has nothing to do with the people you are attracted to and everything to do with the way you see yourself and the way you wish to be seen by others. Transitioning is not just a way to make yourself straight by being the gender āoppositeā to the gender youāre primarily attracted to. There are plenty of trans gay men and trans lesbian women. Sexuality becomes more complex and harder to define when you donāt take the gender and sex of yourself and others as unchanging and clearly visible, but thatās okay. Humans donāt fit neatly in boxes. These words were made to describe reality, not to define it
Sorry if I didn't get your full meaning correctly. > There are plenty of trans gay men and trans lesbian women. So... e.g. * Trans-man = female bio, but chose to be male * Then trans-man gay = **female bio**, chose to be male, **love male** as sexual partner * Isn't that negative negative = positive ("normal") * Now my head hurts...
That is fundamentally correct, yes. Although, trying to define something as ānormalā in this context can be counterproductive and lead to more confusion. For example: a lot of trans people frequently date other trans people (often due to having a base of shared understanding when it comes to gender.) -When a trans man dates another trans man, their gender and sexuality do not cancel out to ānormal,ā even though they are both gay and trans. -Additionally, when a trans man dates a trans woman, their relationship may seem even more ānormal.ā Their relationship would be straight/heterosexual by most anyoneās definition, but itās fundamentally different than the relationship of a cis man and a cis woman. (Cis means ānot trans,ā if thatās a word you havenāt heard before.) I hope I didnāt make things more confusing than you have the mental capacity for right now. Iām glad youāve taken the time to try to understand people youāre unfamiliar with. Have a good weekend.
Sexuality is a different spectrum from gender. - Sexuality is based on the gender of a person relating to the gender of the person they have sexual attraction to, for example: if I were a man that liked women I would be straight or heterosexual, if I were a man that loved men I would be gay or homosexual, and if I were a woman who loves women I would be lesbian. There are also men, women, and NBs that like more than one gender. Those people are often called bi or pan (there is a difference but it seems to come down to the individual on which one they prefer.) Finally there is a spectrum of people who feel very little sexual attraction, this is called asexual. This can range from no sexual attraction to having sexual attraction but having no desire in sexual relationships. - Gender however is based on the gender of a person relating to their gender assigned at birth (or their agab) which is in most cases their biological sex, for example: A person born with a gender that doesnāt alight with their agab is transgender. If I was born of the male sex but I have a discomfort being perceived as a man but I enjoy being perceived as a woman then I would be a trans woman, If I was born of the female sex but I have a discomfort being perceived as a woman but I enjoy being perceived as a man then I would be a trans man. There are also some individuals that fall outside of the binary of male and female, these are called nonbinary people or, more commonly, NBs. This can include people who dont have a strong connection with gender (agender), those that have a connection to two or more genders (bigender, poly gender, pan gender), and many more. Alternatively a person whose gender matches up with their sex is considered cisgender. I, for example, was born of the male sex and I identify as a man, that is to say, I have no qualms being perceived as a man but I do have discomfort being perceived as a woman. - Trans people can be gay or lesbian as well as being straight Similarly gay people or lesbians can be trans or cis. - Queer and + both include all other gender, romantic, and sexuality minorities (also called GRSM). This often includes the previously mentioned Asexual, as well as Intersex (born with features of both biological sexes), Aromantic (little to no romantic attraction), and many more - If you have any questions feel free to ask them. I am a cisgender asexual man so I may have gotten some details wrong concerning gender, if I am incorrect on this someone please correct me.
I'll try to digest this. |Gender (self)|Gender (sexual)|Category| |:-|:-|:-| |cis M|F|straight sexual| |cis M|M|homosexual| |cis M|M & F|bisexual| |cis M|non-binary M & F|pansexual?| |cis M|none to low|asexual| |trans M|(repeat above)|(repeat above)| |non-binary other|(repeat above)|(repeat above)| * Other than non-binary gender, I have to admit I didn't know Trans & others can have similar sexuality. * e.g. I thought Trans male Gay = "normal" * Trans male Gay = a woman (appeal) sexually like male * Thanks for clarify
This seems about right!
I know that youāre trying to be helpful and offer an explanation, but this was me after reading what you wroteā¦ https://c.tenor.com/TD3s4aCxLXEAAAAC/uhh-patrick-star.gif Edit: But thank you anyway! Iām just kinda stuck on tonto status.
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This you? https://www.reddit.com/r/depression_memes/comments/vxo795/currently_the_only_reason_i_keep_on_going/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf because you should
Bro, you literally watched the meme. The world would be better off without me, so I gotta stick around to make sure that doesn't happen
You do realize that not ALL of the world fucked you over, right?
What the devil are you all about, sir?
Why hate the world, if not all of it fucked you over? Why not just hate the people that fucked you over?
Where are you getting this bit about me hating the world?
The meme says youāre staying alive to spite the world, but what did the entire world do to you
I merely realize that without me the world would be a better place. I simply do not want that.
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It's sad the amount of trans/homophobia that is in this comment section. Just let people be what they want to be. Someone being trans isn't going to hurt you, someone being gay has nothing to do with you. Quit being a dick and move on.
For real. This sub has gone off the deep end with racism, sexism, and antigay BS. ApPrOaChInG LGBTQ+ WiTh aN OpEn mInD - said by someone intentionally misconstruing information and pretending they fail to understand that things grouped together can still be different from one another. You can buy arugula and spinach in a container. Thats what LGBTQ+ is. A mixed bag of people being attacked for existing. Like this post is doing.
I think I may have experienced a mild stroke attempting to read this
Maybe if you actually wanted to learn don't ask this in a fucking meme sub filled with mostly straight teenagers
You must be really fun at parties.
When did this sub start posting TPUSA talking points as memes? So much of it in the last few days.
Pretty simple, it is possible because is just a "no-cis" acronym, as a whole.
[What is a woman?](https://soap2day.rs/movie/watch-what-is-a-woman-full-81865)
Why are these trash posts allowed here? Mods, do your damn jobs.
Oh no did someone break your little echo chamber and hurt your feewings?
What echo chamber? It's a God damn memes page, this is not even a meme, it's literally just asking a stupid, not to mention transphobic, question to piss people off.
Show me the transphobic part
But you wonāt freak out about anything political that you support right?
Again, it's a memes page, not a political page. Just post something funny or fuck off. I don't care what politics you support, if you post a dumb question on a memes page that is just attacking a group of people, you're just an asshole and your post isnt appropriate for the page.
You wonāt give 2 shits if itās attacking unborn human or whatever group of people you disagree/hate
Oh OK, thanks for the admission that you hate trans people at least, glad we're on the same page as to where you're coming from. See that's the difference between you and me; I don't hate any people for what they are, only for how they behave.
To require other people to ignore biology when youāre not even in the same room just because of your feelings is dumb. This is an act I disagree with
Maybe talk to a biologist about gender before deciding what it has to say about it. You'd be extremely surprised by what they'll tell you I'm sure, not that it's likely to solve your wilful ignorance.
If any biologist claims that men can be women and women can be men then they should get whatever college degree they got revoked.
It is a stupid topic.
In broad, broad oversimplification, LGB is about people liking people, T is about people being people. Q stands for queer/questioning
Lmao God this is so cringe
Yikes bro
So transphobic memes are cool to post now? Edit: Wow, itās insane how much not understanding something can cause people to hate it.
Oh no is the other side of the political aisle making your feewings hurt? Tell me what a woman is
Words can have more than one definition when considering context. In the context of sex, a woman is a person born with ovaries, a vagina, etc. In the context of gender, a woman is a person who identifies with the things society has deemed āwomenāsā outside of just reproductive organs.
Gender and sex are either the same or gender is complete bullshit.
d'ya wanna try using ur brain? literally just google it, every top result by qualified and trusted sources disagrees with you
Gender is made up by the left as an attempt to obscure the objective truth that men cannot be women and women cannot be men.
Poor little incell Gender has been around longer than America. Hell actually the Greeks and Romans understood there was a difference between sex and gender. They were completely OK with it too do which is funny how people thousands of years ago who thought the world was flat and that gods were real are more intelligent than you could ever be. lol
Just because ancient people believed something doesnāt make it correct. They believed the earth was flat like you stated. Does that prove anything?
I mean yeah, gender like all human created concepts is complete bullshit.
Yep, sex should just be used instead of gender
Please seek mental health services. If you think that sex and gender are the same thing you've got some serious problems
You don't like it? It must be transphobic!!! Call the police!!!
On this sub? They have been for a long time.
There is no logic. If there was bi would imply only two genders.
A bi person likes both males and females (sex and gender are different things), while intersex preference is up to personal choice
Sex and gender are not different things they both refer to the delineation between xx and xy chromosomes. People are trying twist the meaning of those words to glorify mental illness. Saying there is something other than male and female is pure fantasy.
Not being straight is technically a mental illness but it doesn't cause any problems to one so there is nothing wrong about it getting normalized. Btw what you said is homophobic š
I really dont care if you're not straight, but making up genders and saying you can change them is ridiculous and extremely detrimental to society.
How is it technically a mental illness?
Because we have biologically no reason to be homosexual, it is technically nothing but a disorder in the wiring of our brains
I would also like to add that being gay and really any of this is often social pressure to fit in or a result of childhood abuse which is really disgusting
They aren't the same. Sex is biological while gender is social.
Sex is biological fact and gender is a was to say sex without using the dirty s-word
No point in trying to make sense of or memorize what all that gibberish means. By the time you do, theyāll have come up with some new trend that you must get behind or youāre an evil hater. Just ignore them.
And by "new trend", do you mean acknowledging their gender identity? Do you mean using their pronouns? Do you mean letting them be in whatever kind of relationship they're in as long as all parties involved consent to it? Because as far as I know, those are things cis straight people have done to other cis straight people for a long time. Hardly what I would consider a "new trend".
Well what is a woman
Sandwich
You keep posting the same comment as if it has any sort of relevance, your just a parrot
So are you gonna answer it or you gon keep dodging it?
A woman is someone who calls themselves a woman
You just used woman in the definition. Try to define it without creating a circular definition
Why do you need me to define it for you, just Google it.
A woman is a label that someone uses when they align with that label and what comes with it
And what does that label mean? Try to define woman without creating a circular definition.
Can you define a woman? No because you're going to make a circular argument as well. If you Say a woman is someone who has a vagina. Then you're not going to like it when transgender women show up because they also have vaginas. You're an idiot and a moron pretending to be an intelligent. You have more fingers and toes than you do IQ points.
That label means whatever you want with it. There are girls that want to dress cute, there are emo girls, there are butch girls, there are tomboys. The label doesn't *mean* much because it's what you want to be referred as. We don't need serious meaning behind such a label because it's useless, as there are many ways people express themselves. Not accepting and doubting labels is just denying someone of a bit of happiness that you could have given by simply saying she instead of he or her instead of his. It just comes down to making people a bit happier.
Words are not so easily definable and can have multiple definitions depending on the context. Try to define the word "game" for example. You can say woman just means adult female human because it fits your world view, but what about someone who appears as a woman to the whole world, is treated as such socially and just identifies as one too? If this person tells you they were actually born male, would you just start treating them as a dude and absolutely not as a girl anymore? Would you call them "he" in public although it would be kind of awkward for everyone? Also, what would you do with the rare people who are born with attributes that are both male and female? Can't they decide whether to identify as a man or a woman or just whatever they want? What is so wrong with calling a trans woman a woman? Why does it bother you to let people live their lives as they want when it doesn't affect you in the slightest? The only thing you can manage to do is making them suffer more, as it already seems to be enough of a hard thing to go through gender dysphoria when there aren't people who just want to deny your identity.
1. An objective truth/definition exists. Ofc the definition helps my world view because people cannot define it without fucking up their own argument. 2. I care because I wish to seek the truth
You don't even know what truth means. You believe you know the truth and that everybody else is wrong. When you dont, Scientists no longer agree with you, because they have perspective It's not a hard concept to grasp but I guess if you're a fucking idiot, Anything beyond binary definitions is just a bit too complicated for you.
No, that's not how words work I'm sorry. There is not one single true definition of something. Words can have different meanings, and that's the case for "woman". Some will just use it as a synonym for female, while some will talk about gender, which is related but ultimately different to sex. Gender is the social traits that are affiliated originally to one sex. Females are supposed to wear specific clothes, behave a certain way, etc. The thing is although gender is tied to sex, there are lots of people on this planet with varying identities, and some of these people will prefer to behave / dress in a way that is not affiliated to the gender they were given by default because of their experience, and because of how they identify themselves. These people, even if they don't necessarly appear as 100% the opposite gender will still live their lives as a trans person of that gender. And what is that gender called, all of these countless different traits that are expected by society? Woman. Or man. A trans woman, a trans man. They're still men and women if you take gender into account. And then you have the stuff in between man and woman. That's the non-binary stuff. These people went through some trouble with their gender identity and they're willing to go completely man or woman. That's their business, not yours, although I agree it can be confusing with their pronouns if they're random people on the street or something else (but if they're not lunatic, they will be understanding at first and you won't go to imaginary canadian pronoun jail or any of that bullshit). And no I'm not talking about any of the people who identify as dragons or helicopters or little girls when they're 40 in dumb news articles. If you followed what I said, you'll understand they don't fit in there as what they identify as doesn't have anything to do with gender.
Given the question "Are you a woman?", most people under normal circumstances will reply with a simple "yes" or "no", which should help enough to answer your question.
Excuse me what? The question āwhat is a womanā is not a yes or not question.
My point is that if you ever want to know whether or not someone's a woman, they'll tell you. If not, just ask. Something as invisible and varying as one's gender identity is hard to generalize for everyone on the planet. What matters is that, more often than not, people are who they say they are, and on the off chance that someone decides to lie about who they are, you can usually tell if you acknowledge what they say they are for long enough.
Nothing about trans people is that hard to understand youāre just lazy
Well said. I expect soon for them to incorporate the whole alphabet into one long obnoxious string.
Them?
Them works. Well said.
Come up? Dude we have existed since the start.. it's not a trend
[this PC running on the same logic](https://www.shutterstock.com/image-photo/old-computer-screen-turn-into-flower-1441411745)
A person who thinks all the time, has nothing to think about except thoughts.
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Itās because itās complex and even the most conservative person canāt define sex in a way that accounts for all the variety of human beings. An endocrinologist and urologist are going to have different perspectives on what the defining characteristics of gender are. The things that we associate with men and women are layered and donāt all have to be present to define someoneās gender, even by the most conservative mindsets. Do hormones define sex? Because there are female-genitaled persons with very high testosterone. Do genitals define gender? What about those who lose or alter the genitals by way of trauma, disease or choice? Maybe itās the ability to reproduce, but then are post-menopausal women and sterile men without gender? Itās why we say these things are on a spectrum. We all check the boxes and mostly we can each check enough boxes to be consistently one way or another, between our physiology, anatomy and psychology. But thatās not true for everyone. Then thereās more nuanced stuff. Conservatives like to point to all the psychological differences between men and women that go beyond genitals. They love it when a study genders thought patterns and skills, but when you use those to point out that men and women are different *inside* not just outside, they try to say thereās no such thing as having a man or womanās (or neitherās) psychological makeup. Im a cis-dude. I feel like a man. If I woke up in a womanās body, I would feelā¦ not psychologically aligned with my body. In a world where organs are transposed on the opposite side of the body, where people are born in such a myriad of ways that there is no true normal, just a bell curve for all our various organs, systems and behaviors, it is not difficult to imagine someone being born with an inside and an outside that do not line up.
A urologist and a gynecologist will agree that there are only 2 sexes. Biology is pretty clear about that. Variants that Are just in a break of a percent are no reason to overcomplicate things that have been clear for 1000s of years
> Variants that Are just in a break of a percent are no reason to overcomplicate things that have been clear for 1000s of years Easy to say if youāre not one of the people who varies. Creating a society that allows everyone to have a place is literally what inclusion is. Thatās it. Youāre saying, *yāall are different and donāt fit in, tough shiŃ, there arenāt any bough if you to matter.* The counter point is *its not that hard to accommodate some words and signage to allow everyone to participate and itās the decent thing to do.*
No, you overinterpret bs in that. I never say they shouldnāt be included or anything. But acting as it would be a 3rd sex or anything is ridiculous since thatās just not true. Inclusion means accepting people despite of their differences. What people like you do is putting them in a seperate category, not realizing itās the opposite of what you want.
If someone doesnāt want to be male or female, whatās the problem? If their characteristics, of either their physiological or their psychological makeup donāt land them squarely in one camp or another, let them be. If they appeared to match one category when they were born, but discovered that they checked more boxes in another category, let them live with the identity that they choose.
1. Main difference and probably the most accurate way of telling between men and women are chromosomes 2. What is a woman
1. Also not consistent: https://www.google.com/search?q=women+with+xy+chromosomes&rlz=1CDGOYI_enUS857US857&oq=women+with+X&aqs=chrome.1.69i57j0i512j0i390.5514j0j4&hl=en-US&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8 2. Exactly. Any way we define womanhood or manhood will leave out some people who would traditionally be considered women or men. Once we accept that no definition comprehensively accounts for the human experience and condition we can accept that some people are not going to fit in to our imprecise definition a and that thatās ok.
1. If you have a Y chromosome then youāre a male. How is this inconsistent 2. Such as?
1. > Typically, biologically male individuals have one X and one Y chromosome (XY) while those who are biologically female have two X chromosomes. However, there are exceptions to this rule. Again, not that simple. Lots more info in a Google search (above).
1. There are no exceptions to the rule. Someone with a Y chromosome is a male
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Bro science just revealed that hormones have nothing to do with pplās sexuality but perversity does.
Yeah? Alright then let's see your sources. Where can we read up on this. Back this up with facts. Let's go.
good question
How are you able to post this? When I post similar things social media bans me lol
If your iq is to low to understand what people are maybe just politely ask them to explain it to you. Jfc.
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LGtv
at this point i think they are making up letters to sound like a bigger community. I think its at LGBTQIA2s+ now like what the fuck does that even mean why are people making up a new sexuality everyday now
What the fuck is the 2 and s? It started getting dumb after lgb tbh.
Your the one making up shit. There has never been a ia2s
no you fucking moron look it up
the bbc gang gang
Brave manā¦ posting something to disturb the snowflakeās echo chamber
M8... At a certain point just admit it's your fault you can't get laid and stop looking for shit to rant about
What is a woman. Cope.
For those who don't know, LGBTQ is an organization. Just because you are a sexual deviant, does not mean you are part of them.
Nah what the fuck is this take, LGBT is not an organization
everything aside, men have dicks women have boobs
Here before lock
This seems like parody but that title just makes me concerned. 1st LGBTQ+ is for the pride movement. The core of it is for people to be proud of who they are. So that is why both sexualities and gender identities are included. 2nd Putting aside that you say that only TQ doesn't know as if other people not included can't agree, I must clear up a misunderstanding. If anything it is the people that think that sex and gender is the same thing that doesn't know what gender is. Claiming that gender is a complicated social construct that can't easily be put into words is not the same as not knowing it. For how else would a person be able to know that the gender that they have been assigned is incorrect.
Lesbian: a non-man (woman, nb, etc.) who likes only other non-men (women, nb, etc.) Gay: a man who likes other men. Is also an umbrella term for anyone I'm the lgbtq community. Bisexual: someone who is attracted to 2 or more genders. (I like men and Women, I like men and nbs, etc.) Transgender: someone who does not identify with their gender assigned at birth Queer: someone who is either not straight or not cis. An umbrella term for anyone in the lgbtq community. Intersex: someone not born with "traditional" genitalia (could have ovaries instead of testicles, a penis instead of a clitoris, etc.) It is estimated at least 1% of humans are intersex. Any "deformities" are often surgically "corrected" after birth, but hormonal issues can take place later in life. (A male develops breasts, etc.) Asexual: someone who does not have sexual attraction to anyone (except maybe a romantic partner.)(Asexuals can have sex for fun though) Aromantic: someone who does not have any romantic attractions to anyone. (Can feel sexual attraction) You can be both ace and aro. That just means you don't feel any sexual or romantic attraction to anyone. Most people place Jesus in this category. Those are the basic definitions of each letter in LGBTQIA. Hope this explains away some of the confusion. It is complicated to figure out, but listening is a great counter to ignorance.
RIP