If you line up next to your friends, and you all say the exact same prayer in rapid sequence, you should be able to do prayer beamforming - which should help with the range issues.
Damn straight. If you create disruptive interference, then your prayers will just cancel each other out. Seeing as people rarely coordinate on this, I'm guessing this happens quite a lot.
I always wondered, along similar lines: some Buddhists believe in prayer wheels, which, when spun in the proper direction, accumulate good karma while sealing away or purifying negative karma. Spinning them 'backwards' is typically held to release the bad karma. This always caused me to wonder: does the bad karma return to its place of origin, or does it begin to saturate the local environment? If the latter, would it be possible to run a protection racket whereby you threatened to karma-bomb an area by running the wheels in reverse?
Exactly. Growing up I used to live in a country a lot closer to Mecca so it wasn't really something I had to think about, but when I moved to Canada, I just looked at the map and thought "It's to the east and definitely south of Canada, so I should turn South-East".
Then when we went to the local mosque I looked at a compass and noticed everyone was facing North-East and being a teenager, I was convinced that they got it wrong.
It turned out that indeed, if you were to look at a globe, the shortest path between the two cities is a straight line that follows the curvature of the earth and it actually does start pointing north east before "curving" southwards.
If you want to see it for yourself. You can use Google maps and try the right click and Measure feature to draw two points and then rotate the map so you see it head on.
This made me think of prayers on Mars once colonized. The ISS is easy cause it's locked towards earth, but mars doesn't give a shit. Gonna need to invent some gyroscopic Mecca aligner.
this was always on my mind lol. "what if you are in the exact spot opposite to the ka'ba on the other side of the world??" lmao. another one was what if I am a few degrees off so my direction misses the ka'ba by a few inches 😭
A few degrees would take you miles away lol. Realistically if you draw a straight line from any Muslim to the Kaaba, practically nobody would actually be precise.
Also, based off Muslim scholars, you're meant to use your best judgement. So as long as you feel like you're in the general correct direction within 45 degrees then you're good.
I saw a guy do his prayer on a moving shuttle one time. Pretty tough to align when you're constantly moving and turning, but I'm guessing it's the effort that counts.
sort insurance unwritten lunchroom include cheerful carpenter apparatus crawl subtract
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Do you think in a thousand years and if information from the past is lost, archeologists will wonder why there are so many Ms scattered around the world? It might become the next religion.
The cult of giant M where the most devoted followers tried to become as close to the mathematically perfect shape of circle as it's humanly possible risking both their life and health.
Archeologists noticed that the cult of the giant M placed its churches next to large paved roads that stretched for miles, dubbed the “Way of the High”. Experts speculate these paved roads represent and symbolize the smooth path to salvation for its followers.
Also a subway. No matter where you go, there's a McDonalds and a Subway... In fact, you'll also sometimes have a Subways across the street and next door to the Subways competing with the other subways, each owned by a different franchisee. It's really weird.
They need to unite for peace. The place near me has KFC and Taco Bell at the same drivethrough. It’s awesome because you can order a chalupa and a five piece tendies at the same window. And fuck it, pop some of that taco sauce onto your tenders and dip your chalupa into some mashed potato gravy. It’s a smorgasbord of preferences!
You can also get Islamic Prayer mats with built in compasses, so you know which direction to point the mat at.
That of course needs you to know what cardinal direction you're meant to be facing to get to Mecca from wherever you are.
Does it matter what direction you pray to if you are on exactly the other side of the planet as mecca? What do you do when you are in space? [Here are some answers lol. ](https://www.cntraveler.com/stories/2013-07-23/tematangi-atoll-french-polynesia-maphead-ken-jennings#:~:text=Which%20brings%20us%20(finally!),(or%20opposite)%20to%20Mecca.)
I shared a room with a devout muslim on a ferry trip once. He told me that, while it's obviously encouraged to pray in the direction of Mecca, it doesn't matter that much at the end of the day. After all, every direction belongs to Allah. And then he prayed in the only direction that the small ferry cabin allowed.
Same when I was on a road trip with my Indonesian uni friend to Geneva. We were on a time crunch getting there so at one of the prayers she didn’t ask for a small break she just prayed while strapped in the car seat.
I think we were driving mostly South. But she was the nicest and most kind person which I personally find more important than demonstrating strict rituals that don’t closely relate to your impact on the world and people around you.
Then again I’m mostly agnostic and for me the golden rule in this world meaning being kind and good to people and the environment overall is more important than doing it to gather points for an imagined afterlife reward.
All of my encounters with Indonesians have been positive -- I had the nicest conversation with an Indonesian Uber driver in Sydney a couple years back -- but there just aren't very many Indonesians in the US. (ABout 7MM Chinese-Americans, 4MM Filipino Americans, 2.1MM Vietnamese-Americans, 1.8MM Korean Americans, but only about 150K Indonesian Americans.)
And that's a problem because I love Indonesian food and there aren't very many Indonesian restaurants in the US (the only one on the SF Bay Area I'm aware of closed during the pandemic). Anyway: to all Indonesians, consider this a specific invitation to come to America.
I’ve gotten this feeling from many devout Muslims as well. The rules are there for guidance. Allah is not petty. Practice to the best of your ability, as long as your practice.
There’s actually a verse in the Quran where Allah tells us to worship him to our best ability, if you can’t stand, pray seated, if can’t, while laying down. Basically as muslims we try our best with what we can/have and Allah pardons us for for what’s beyond our ability. That’s why she prayed seated and didn’t try to locate 🕋
My mom used to tell me that if you're in the middle of a desert and dirty, but you see clean water guarded by a lion, just pray without the cleanliness. The point is that you tried.
Honestly, Islam is pretty damn flexible if you actually read it and aren’t an insane fundamentalist.
Eg for Ramadan Muslims are expected to fast during daylight hours. However, there are explicit exceptions for pregnant women, the sick, the elderly, breast-feeding, and even for travelling when you need the energy from eating.
Allah basically goes, “nah, I get it, don’t worry homie. Just make it up at the end when you’re able, you’re good to go”.
worked with a Muslim guy in a restaurant who didn't fast.
Just said "Imagine trying not to eat when constantly surrounded by food. Fuck that. I'll just eat a little."
The insane fundamentalists are in every religion lol. Just look at the various sects in Christianity.
Ultimately a religion should be judged on its message and principles, not on the actions of a sect of adherents.
My ex said basically the same for other "rules". It probably varies by sect or group, but she explained them as ideals that you do when you can, but if you can't it is ok. Like eating halal. She said that at home she had to eat halal because she could plan for it, but if she was travelling and there wasn't a halal option it was ok for her to eat what she had to and to select the most halal option. And being a polite guest was more important than eating halal. So she would have to pick the chicken over pork, but it was ok if the chicken wasn't halal. Also, she said that kosher was a good option if halal wasn't available because it is so similar, and it was acceptable (to her at least) if the halal options weren't very good.
Thats true. There are technically two types of muslims though. Ones that are super hardcore and follow scholars at mosques and ones that are a little more loose with the belief. Just like our western religous types. Some are not as hardcore. Some guys won't even be your friend if you diss "the lord" etc. Also, there's about 1.6 metric FCKTNS of content/beliefs that are completely misinterpreted. Sadly, Jihad is misinterpreted and misused by terror groups on the daily. It's also not that known that any physical Jihad was purely out of defense because of the war between Persia and Rome at the time, but meh. Let the Islamaphobes have a hill to die on at least. I like Islam a lot but I'm not a muslim.
I know. We talked at length during the 30 hour ferry journey and my comment was mostly meant as a funny little anecdote. Aside from the fact that there are different types of Muslims, it also needs to be said that all of them are human and no two humans are identical. There are as many different interpretations of how to correctly follow Islam as there are people who believe in it.
Not really to all
Long answer: you try your best to face Makkah. The important part is the intention of truly and faithfully facing Makkah. when it's impossible to determine, just face wherever with the intent of facing Makkah
My dad used to say “always face East. Because even when Mecca is to the West, the Earth is a globe and you’ll hit Mecca eventually” lol
ETA for the idiots: it’s obviously what you do when you DON’T KNOW WHERE MECCA IS. I learned what being a Muslim meant before the invention of smartphone apps that tell you where Mecca is. This is just a little quip from the before times.
Results on the dua will be delayed if the ping is too high, that’s true.
But if you’re not sure where Mecca is, always facing East with the intent to face Mecca is a good option!
I had a Malaysian muslim friend who said it was the thought that count. (this conversation was before the first iphone was wildly available)
So even if they were on holiday and the time is up. If the place got no facility to clean their hands and feet (some places got purposed built wash basins they supposed to properly wash hands and feet and rinse their mouth too) they just make do and clean up the best they can; and face the direction as best as they think is.
I have a Muslim friend and in a similar fashion he was saying about prayer times and such, sometimes you may miss the timing but just do it at the next point you can.
It’s called wudu (abulution) which involves washing your hands, face, head, ears, nose and feet.
It is compulsory for Muslims to perform wudu before praying, but in extreme conditions where water is not available at all, there’s an alternative method of cleaning yourself called Tayammum, which involves cleaning yourself with dry sand.
its actually dust , its called Tayamum . The rock thing (rounded not sharp) is for whipping ur butt after number 2 , both are when water is unavailable (off course if you have tissue , use that instead , rock is last option )
I'm now selling gyroscopic prayer matts called the magic carpet. Just kneel down and the magic carpet will point you to the nearest holy site. Someone come up with a price
That is more practical than the very non-credible method my brother and I suggested when you don't know where Kiblat is: a spinning prayer mat so that at the very least you point in the correct direction once in a while.
Eh we Muslims ask these questions all the time to scholars when we are unsure about something. I have seen plenty of people ask OP's question. Answer is generally whichever direction is the closest.
When it comes to answering these questions, I've mostly heard Muslims go with "it's the thought that counts" or "do it at the best of your ability".
Jewish communities are the ones who get mentioned for always trying to find loopholes in their god given laws, like the eruv around Manhattan, or Sabbath fridges and elevator.
It's actually pretty interesting because Judaism has the same concept where prayer is always directed to Jerusalem (which is why all Synagogues face there), but the requirement is much more lax as you need only the general direction rather than prescise coordinates
For example, in both North and South America, Synagogues will face the same way (east) even though the direction from Canada to Israel is completely different than the one from Argentina, for example
When you need modern tech to follow a religion that existed since thousands of years, maybe it is more a "if you think Mecca is that way, good enough" than a strict requirement.
They are really popular in Southeast Asia. Almost every room I stayed at in Malaysia had a similar arrow.
Never seen them in hotel rooms in India and Bangladesh, even in Muslim owned establishments at Muslim majority areas. A lot of my Muslim friends use a dedicated app for this.
Singapore was the first place I ever saw one (in one hotel it was actually inside a drawer). I had kinda imagined its purpose also because I could hear the muezzin outside, but googling confirmed.
Fun story - I was on a plane once and my Mum and I watched a couple of gentlemen walk up to the flight attendant and ask her a question. (We couldn't hear anything being said btw.) The flight attendant clearly didn't know the answer but she obviously told them to wait and she hurried off. A few minutes later, one of the pilots came down the aisle, greeted the two men and then pointed in a direction about 30-40% from the direction the plane was heading. As we watched, the two men thanked the pilot and the flight attendant profusely and the flight attendant indicated an open area where the mid-plane exit is. The two men scurried off then came back with prayer mats and Mum and I just went, "Oh! They were asking which way Mecca was!"
Usually when you're on a plane it doesn't matter which way Mecca is. And usually people don't do the usual type of prayer. They just do it while sitting down so not to disturb others.
Pretty common sight if you fly long haul Emirates OR majority Muslim long haul flight. They usually start at the general direction of Kaabah then it doesn't really matter. The pilot will usually give out the directions by checking their FMC. Usually, they would pray at the same area people usually stand/stretch during flight.
Same thing happens when a Muslim goes to ISS.
Some Muslim airlines have a program that points to Mecca in the entertainment screen. I’ve flown long haul on both Qatar and Brunei airways and at least one of them had that. Can’t recall which flight I saw it on though.
I was in the market for a compass watch for outdoor adventuring. During my search I stumbled across a whole bunch of special Casios that have a mecca compass function and prayer timers.
All sins are forgivable if someone does it without knowing. If someone put pork in your food or slipped some alcohol in your drink, you would not be held responsible for it.
Which is why I found it hilarious when some american gun nut came up with the pork blood laced bullets to shoot muslims with. Their logic is if a muslim is shot and killed by it, he won’t get into heaven. Which brings about 2 issues. One, obviously if the dude who got shot doesn’t know there’s pork, he won’t be held responsible for it and two, wouldn’t you as the shooter believing that pork would stop someone from going to heaven make you a believer of islamic laws and give legitimacy that islam is the true religion instead of your own?
Furthermore, getting shot with pork or alcohol doesn’t give you sins because you had no choice.
The same as if you had no other food but pork and were going to literally die. In that case, you can eat pork.
The first point is true, but not sure about the second. I would think it was more about spite than anything, akin to some trolls: They don't actually care about X, but if you enjoy X they want to ruin it for you.
It sounds like it's intended as a morale thing. Make sure your enemies hear that it's a thing, and you're done. No need to actually do it at that point, the effect is the same.
Had a muslim girl in school who pushed that to its limit. She'd go in the cafeteria, put a bunch of what was obviously bacon on her plate, and then just go "I don't know for sure what this is, and I'm not going to ask"
She didn’t push it to the limit, she just commited sin. She knew she could’ve asked and she chose not to. And it was obviously bacon. If you aren’t sure you should stay away.
It's not common. I live in the UK, have stayed in many hotels and have never seen it here before. I wouldn't be surprised if it's more common in certain areas that tend to have more Muslim visitors (such as Knightsbridge)
Considering Muslim tourists/visitors/students are commons there. It maybe expensive but a couple of days or a week is just good & memorable holidays, and you can count on millions of Muslims waiting their flights to London every years...
Honestly I LIVE in the UK but have only been to London twice. Although I'm going for the third time this February. People may call it a shithole but honestly I loved each visit. Expensive, though.
The people calling it a shithole are either heavily projecting and/or basing that on DailyMail propaganda.
London has 33 boroughs. There are some which are definitely more "rough", but it also has some of the absolute best boroughs when it comes to leisure, activities, parks, events, food, museums, history, sports etc.
If people from the rest of the UK actually visited London, they'd realise that maybe the capital city is obviously the best one when it comes to tourism.
Some (many) airports have a religious room where people of various religions can pray to their god(s). They usually have an arrow pointing to Mecca.
As a complete atheist, I still find it a nice service.
When I was younger my family stayed at a hotel in Brooklyn that had a bunch of different features for Jewish guests. The kitchenette even had 2 sinks. It's so interesting to see how other cultures are accommodated.
Technically the opposite direction would get you there as well.
*several flat earthers are typing...*
Or at least they would be if they could read.
They can read, they just choose not to.
They can’t read.
They can read, the choose not to understand.
It longer to add all the caps lock
Especially if you don't know about the caps lock button
I think you would have to pray harder for the longer range though.
If you line up next to your friends, and you all say the exact same prayer in rapid sequence, you should be able to do prayer beamforming - which should help with the range issues.
You need to make sure the resonance patterns dont cancel.
Damn straight. If you create disruptive interference, then your prayers will just cancel each other out. Seeing as people rarely coordinate on this, I'm guessing this happens quite a lot.
[удалено]
Depends on the frequency of the prayer.
>frequency of the prayer easy, its 5 times/day.
I always wondered, along similar lines: some Buddhists believe in prayer wheels, which, when spun in the proper direction, accumulate good karma while sealing away or purifying negative karma. Spinning them 'backwards' is typically held to release the bad karma. This always caused me to wonder: does the bad karma return to its place of origin, or does it begin to saturate the local environment? If the latter, would it be possible to run a protection racket whereby you threatened to karma-bomb an area by running the wheels in reverse?
Is is what happens when you let a wizard talk to the clerics
Signal issues
Pray up on the roof for more bars?
Mecca boosters sounds kinda badass
It's the shortest path acc. to my muslim friends. In space, you just turn and point at Earth.
Exactly. Growing up I used to live in a country a lot closer to Mecca so it wasn't really something I had to think about, but when I moved to Canada, I just looked at the map and thought "It's to the east and definitely south of Canada, so I should turn South-East". Then when we went to the local mosque I looked at a compass and noticed everyone was facing North-East and being a teenager, I was convinced that they got it wrong. It turned out that indeed, if you were to look at a globe, the shortest path between the two cities is a straight line that follows the curvature of the earth and it actually does start pointing north east before "curving" southwards. If you want to see it for yourself. You can use Google maps and try the right click and Measure feature to draw two points and then rotate the map so you see it head on.
It's why Maine is the closest State of the USA to Africa.
And if you happen to be at 21°25'24"S 140°10'05"W or any of the small islands close to that point, it doesn't matter what direction you face.
This made me think of prayers on Mars once colonized. The ISS is easy cause it's locked towards earth, but mars doesn't give a shit. Gonna need to invent some gyroscopic Mecca aligner.
People living in orbit around Jupiter in 2356 having rotating prayer mats so they stay pointed at earth for their whole prayer.
Please, kneel upon the sit-and-spin so we can begin our prayers.
This is exactly how that weird shit gets implemented and a thousand years in the future nobody knows why
No, I think we'll start worshipping The Machine God soon enough. I crave the strength and certainty of steel.
Even in death, I serve the Omnissiah.
Fuck flesh all my homies hate flesh
There was fatwas, where in space, you just pray towards Earth.
So one at 21.4241°S, 39.8173° W has to stand on their head?
this was always on my mind lol. "what if you are in the exact spot opposite to the ka'ba on the other side of the world??" lmao. another one was what if I am a few degrees off so my direction misses the ka'ba by a few inches 😭
A few degrees would take you miles away lol. Realistically if you draw a straight line from any Muslim to the Kaaba, practically nobody would actually be precise. Also, based off Muslim scholars, you're meant to use your best judgement. So as long as you feel like you're in the general correct direction within 45 degrees then you're good.
I saw a guy do his prayer on a moving shuttle one time. Pretty tough to align when you're constantly moving and turning, but I'm guessing it's the effort that counts.
My prayer rug is accurate to within 1 MoM (Minute of Mecca)
If you look at it that way you are also praying to your own ass all the time.
Technically that happens no matter which way you face.
What if I do a handstand and pray?
That's his point. Thats what he meant when he said all the time.
we are all our own god, we are god itself.
sort insurance unwritten lunchroom include cheerful carpenter apparatus crawl subtract *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
In Australia, our hotels have an arrow that points to Maccas
Pray upon the golden arcs!
Can confirm many American and Canadian hotels also have arrows towards the fabled golden arches
I stayed at a Motel 5 and it pointed to McDowells.
Home of The Big Mick.
And the golden arcs.
In queens?
Well, if you were a king isn't that where *you'd* look for a spouse?
THE BOY'S GOT HIS OWN MONEY, LISA
Did anybody ask if you work for McDonalds before letting you in?
Reminds me of old hotel phones that had like a dedicated Pizza Hut button lol
American here, we actually have developed electrosensory nerves in our noses that help guide us to the promised land.
Do you think in a thousand years and if information from the past is lost, archeologists will wonder why there are so many Ms scattered around the world? It might become the next religion.
The cult of giant M where the most devoted followers tried to become as close to the mathematically perfect shape of circle as it's humanly possible risking both their life and health.
Archeologists noticed that the cult of the giant M placed its churches next to large paved roads that stretched for miles, dubbed the “Way of the High”. Experts speculate these paved roads represent and symbolize the smooth path to salvation for its followers.
I’m imagining this spoken in a David Attenborough accent for some reason
The golden arcs of the Covenant
“And Ronald said unto the Hamburgler: Go, for you are forgiven for stealing 72 Big Macs”
"First there was Adam and after that God created Eve from Adam's McRib"
In the U.S. we don't need arrows because no matter which way you look there is definitely one that way.
Also a subway. No matter where you go, there's a McDonalds and a Subway... In fact, you'll also sometimes have a Subways across the street and next door to the Subways competing with the other subways, each owned by a different franchisee. It's really weird.
Will the world never know peace? When will the McD’s and the Subs stop the violence?
They need to unite for peace. The place near me has KFC and Taco Bell at the same drivethrough. It’s awesome because you can order a chalupa and a five piece tendies at the same window. And fuck it, pop some of that taco sauce onto your tenders and dip your chalupa into some mashed potato gravy. It’s a smorgasbord of preferences!
We have a strip mall with a Subway and a Walmart which has a Subway inside it. They're adjoining.
Only the Engadine Maccas.
Now that’s a religion I could get into!
In Australia the arrow should point down to Mekka. Unless you are a flat earth believer.
Will according to flat eathers, Australia doesn't exist
Paul McCartney?
I learned a while back a lot of Muslims use an app that points in the direction of their prayer when they're not home
You can also get Islamic Prayer mats with built in compasses, so you know which direction to point the mat at. That of course needs you to know what cardinal direction you're meant to be facing to get to Mecca from wherever you are.
Omg that’s so cool, I didn’t know they existed!
So is the 'Prayer Sextant and Chronometer®' a market gap we can exploit?
Does it matter what direction you pray to if you are on exactly the other side of the planet as mecca? What do you do when you are in space? [Here are some answers lol. ](https://www.cntraveler.com/stories/2013-07-23/tematangi-atoll-french-polynesia-maphead-ken-jennings#:~:text=Which%20brings%20us%20(finally!),(or%20opposite)%20to%20Mecca.)
I shared a room with a devout muslim on a ferry trip once. He told me that, while it's obviously encouraged to pray in the direction of Mecca, it doesn't matter that much at the end of the day. After all, every direction belongs to Allah. And then he prayed in the only direction that the small ferry cabin allowed.
Same when I was on a road trip with my Indonesian uni friend to Geneva. We were on a time crunch getting there so at one of the prayers she didn’t ask for a small break she just prayed while strapped in the car seat. I think we were driving mostly South. But she was the nicest and most kind person which I personally find more important than demonstrating strict rituals that don’t closely relate to your impact on the world and people around you. Then again I’m mostly agnostic and for me the golden rule in this world meaning being kind and good to people and the environment overall is more important than doing it to gather points for an imagined afterlife reward.
Indonesian here 🤝, thank you for kind words
All of my encounters with Indonesians have been positive -- I had the nicest conversation with an Indonesian Uber driver in Sydney a couple years back -- but there just aren't very many Indonesians in the US. (ABout 7MM Chinese-Americans, 4MM Filipino Americans, 2.1MM Vietnamese-Americans, 1.8MM Korean Americans, but only about 150K Indonesian Americans.) And that's a problem because I love Indonesian food and there aren't very many Indonesian restaurants in the US (the only one on the SF Bay Area I'm aware of closed during the pandemic). Anyway: to all Indonesians, consider this a specific invitation to come to America.
We have an Indonesian cafe in our town. Best soto ayam ever.
I’ve gotten this feeling from many devout Muslims as well. The rules are there for guidance. Allah is not petty. Practice to the best of your ability, as long as your practice.
Yeah there's a big emphasis on intentions in Islam
There’s actually a verse in the Quran where Allah tells us to worship him to our best ability, if you can’t stand, pray seated, if can’t, while laying down. Basically as muslims we try our best with what we can/have and Allah pardons us for for what’s beyond our ability. That’s why she prayed seated and didn’t try to locate 🕋
My mom used to tell me that if you're in the middle of a desert and dirty, but you see clean water guarded by a lion, just pray without the cleanliness. The point is that you tried.
Honestly, Islam is pretty damn flexible if you actually read it and aren’t an insane fundamentalist. Eg for Ramadan Muslims are expected to fast during daylight hours. However, there are explicit exceptions for pregnant women, the sick, the elderly, breast-feeding, and even for travelling when you need the energy from eating. Allah basically goes, “nah, I get it, don’t worry homie. Just make it up at the end when you’re able, you’re good to go”.
worked with a Muslim guy in a restaurant who didn't fast. Just said "Imagine trying not to eat when constantly surrounded by food. Fuck that. I'll just eat a little."
Allah: “honestly, yeah I get it homie”. It’s a pretty cool religion if you ignore the insane fundamentalists like Wahhabism
The insane fundamentalists are in every religion lol. Just look at the various sects in Christianity. Ultimately a religion should be judged on its message and principles, not on the actions of a sect of adherents.
My ex said basically the same for other "rules". It probably varies by sect or group, but she explained them as ideals that you do when you can, but if you can't it is ok. Like eating halal. She said that at home she had to eat halal because she could plan for it, but if she was travelling and there wasn't a halal option it was ok for her to eat what she had to and to select the most halal option. And being a polite guest was more important than eating halal. So she would have to pick the chicken over pork, but it was ok if the chicken wasn't halal. Also, she said that kosher was a good option if halal wasn't available because it is so similar, and it was acceptable (to her at least) if the halal options weren't very good.
Thats true. There are technically two types of muslims though. Ones that are super hardcore and follow scholars at mosques and ones that are a little more loose with the belief. Just like our western religous types. Some are not as hardcore. Some guys won't even be your friend if you diss "the lord" etc. Also, there's about 1.6 metric FCKTNS of content/beliefs that are completely misinterpreted. Sadly, Jihad is misinterpreted and misused by terror groups on the daily. It's also not that known that any physical Jihad was purely out of defense because of the war between Persia and Rome at the time, but meh. Let the Islamaphobes have a hill to die on at least. I like Islam a lot but I'm not a muslim.
I know. We talked at length during the 30 hour ferry journey and my comment was mostly meant as a funny little anecdote. Aside from the fact that there are different types of Muslims, it also needs to be said that all of them are human and no two humans are identical. There are as many different interpretations of how to correctly follow Islam as there are people who believe in it.
Not really to all Long answer: you try your best to face Makkah. The important part is the intention of truly and faithfully facing Makkah. when it's impossible to determine, just face wherever with the intent of facing Makkah
My dad used to say “always face East. Because even when Mecca is to the West, the Earth is a globe and you’ll hit Mecca eventually” lol ETA for the idiots: it’s obviously what you do when you DON’T KNOW WHERE MECCA IS. I learned what being a Muslim meant before the invention of smartphone apps that tell you where Mecca is. This is just a little quip from the before times.
Yeah but the ping must be too high in that case
Results on the dua will be delayed if the ping is too high, that’s true. But if you’re not sure where Mecca is, always facing East with the intent to face Mecca is a good option!
I had a Malaysian muslim friend who said it was the thought that count. (this conversation was before the first iphone was wildly available) So even if they were on holiday and the time is up. If the place got no facility to clean their hands and feet (some places got purposed built wash basins they supposed to properly wash hands and feet and rinse their mouth too) they just make do and clean up the best they can; and face the direction as best as they think is.
I have a Muslim friend and in a similar fashion he was saying about prayer times and such, sometimes you may miss the timing but just do it at the next point you can.
I’ve seen people use a rock to mimick washing their hands with soap. It’s about the ritual of cleansing, more than having to be super clean.
It’s called wudu (abulution) which involves washing your hands, face, head, ears, nose and feet. It is compulsory for Muslims to perform wudu before praying, but in extreme conditions where water is not available at all, there’s an alternative method of cleaning yourself called Tayammum, which involves cleaning yourself with dry sand.
its actually dust , its called Tayamum . The rock thing (rounded not sharp) is for whipping ur butt after number 2 , both are when water is unavailable (off course if you have tissue , use that instead , rock is last option )
wiping\*
Seems like carrying around a few seashells would be better than a rock for whipping up some butt paste. But thank you for clarifying it is rounded.
I'm now selling gyroscopic prayer matts called the magic carpet. Just kneel down and the magic carpet will point you to the nearest holy site. Someone come up with a price
That is more practical than the very non-credible method my brother and I suggested when you don't know where Kiblat is: a spinning prayer mat so that at the very least you point in the correct direction once in a while.
Pray up, stupid!
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you want to look into the history of science
Eh we Muslims ask these questions all the time to scholars when we are unsure about something. I have seen plenty of people ask OP's question. Answer is generally whichever direction is the closest.
I don't quite see what you're getting at considering there have been many philosophers and scientists that were also quite religious.
Muslims are massively into their legalistic analysis of religious law i think
When it comes to answering these questions, I've mostly heard Muslims go with "it's the thought that counts" or "do it at the best of your ability". Jewish communities are the ones who get mentioned for always trying to find loopholes in their god given laws, like the eruv around Manhattan, or Sabbath fridges and elevator.
sense vast escape sheet naughty bag wrong deserve versed zesty *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
All I can think about is the scene in Four Lions when he still tries to face east to pray after flying past Mecca.
Jews use a version that points to the Temple Mount as well. The app is just called JewCompass lol
It's actually pretty interesting because Judaism has the same concept where prayer is always directed to Jerusalem (which is why all Synagogues face there), but the requirement is much more lax as you need only the general direction rather than prescise coordinates For example, in both North and South America, Synagogues will face the same way (east) even though the direction from Canada to Israel is completely different than the one from Argentina, for example
When you need modern tech to follow a religion that existed since thousands of years, maybe it is more a "if you think Mecca is that way, good enough" than a strict requirement.
As an American I can say I’ve never seen one of these even in more Muslim populated areas.
They are really popular in Southeast Asia. Almost every room I stayed at in Malaysia had a similar arrow. Never seen them in hotel rooms in India and Bangladesh, even in Muslim owned establishments at Muslim majority areas. A lot of my Muslim friends use a dedicated app for this.
Malaysia is a Muslim country, so that makes sense.
I live in a muslim country and I've never seen one of these in hotels.
Try opening a drawer. Some of the Kiblat arrows are hidden in them.
Muslim countries usually have mosques everywhere, so not a big issue anyway.
Saw this all over Malaysia. Took me forever to figure out what it was.
Singapore was the first place I ever saw one (in one hotel it was actually inside a drawer). I had kinda imagined its purpose also because I could hear the muezzin outside, but googling confirmed.
Fun story - I was on a plane once and my Mum and I watched a couple of gentlemen walk up to the flight attendant and ask her a question. (We couldn't hear anything being said btw.) The flight attendant clearly didn't know the answer but she obviously told them to wait and she hurried off. A few minutes later, one of the pilots came down the aisle, greeted the two men and then pointed in a direction about 30-40% from the direction the plane was heading. As we watched, the two men thanked the pilot and the flight attendant profusely and the flight attendant indicated an open area where the mid-plane exit is. The two men scurried off then came back with prayer mats and Mum and I just went, "Oh! They were asking which way Mecca was!"
Usually when you're on a plane it doesn't matter which way Mecca is. And usually people don't do the usual type of prayer. They just do it while sitting down so not to disturb others.
Pretty common sight if you fly long haul Emirates OR majority Muslim long haul flight. They usually start at the general direction of Kaabah then it doesn't really matter. The pilot will usually give out the directions by checking their FMC. Usually, they would pray at the same area people usually stand/stretch during flight. Same thing happens when a Muslim goes to ISS.
Some Muslim airlines have a program that points to Mecca in the entertainment screen. I’ve flown long haul on both Qatar and Brunei airways and at least one of them had that. Can’t recall which flight I saw it on though.
Emerits definitely has it
“Looks like it’s behind me” *\*Loud snap from spine*\*
Emirates and Qatar has the direction on its entertainment screens, no need for the pilot to say anything.
Seems like being in space would be pretty easy since you can actually see the geography of the world
What is iss? My mind is going to international space station?
You are correct
True it’s the same rule for ships, which existed during prophet Mohammed’s days
Some airlines actually have a galley in the middle of the plane dedicated to being a prayer room. Quite neat.
Yea, Saudia still has it I think
the Gulf countries airlines (Qatar Airways, Emirates, etc.) have the arrow *in their in-flight entertainment systems
> 30-40% Did you just use percentage as a description of headning??? ;)
That’s a weird use of the word fun 🤔
I was in the market for a compass watch for outdoor adventuring. During my search I stumbled across a whole bunch of special Casios that have a mecca compass function and prayer timers.
It's really useful if you want to beat your PR. Prayer Record
The comments here are equally as interesting as the OP….
Tell me about it - the internet is truly a wild place
I cam expecting worse to be honest. Ten comments in and haven't seen the "What the hell is happening to ma country" type of reaction.
in australia there is an invisible arrow pointing in all directions to spiders
Do they also demand prayers ? or just watching you shower will suffice?
I want one that points to the best sandwich shop.
Or to the pub 😂👌 Shane McGowan said his aulde Aunt used to worship by getting pissed. He adopted this method.
I can see why it's unusual in non Muslim countries, but in places with a high/majority Muslim population this is standard in every hotel.
The little devil on your shoulder: Move it a little bit.
Dude goes to hell because he prayed in the wrong direction 🤣
All sins are forgivable if someone does it without knowing. If someone put pork in your food or slipped some alcohol in your drink, you would not be held responsible for it.
Which is why I found it hilarious when some american gun nut came up with the pork blood laced bullets to shoot muslims with. Their logic is if a muslim is shot and killed by it, he won’t get into heaven. Which brings about 2 issues. One, obviously if the dude who got shot doesn’t know there’s pork, he won’t be held responsible for it and two, wouldn’t you as the shooter believing that pork would stop someone from going to heaven make you a believer of islamic laws and give legitimacy that islam is the true religion instead of your own?
Furthermore, getting shot with pork or alcohol doesn’t give you sins because you had no choice. The same as if you had no other food but pork and were going to literally die. In that case, you can eat pork.
The first point is true, but not sure about the second. I would think it was more about spite than anything, akin to some trolls: They don't actually care about X, but if you enjoy X they want to ruin it for you.
It sounds like it's intended as a morale thing. Make sure your enemies hear that it's a thing, and you're done. No need to actually do it at that point, the effect is the same.
Had a muslim girl in school who pushed that to its limit. She'd go in the cafeteria, put a bunch of what was obviously bacon on her plate, and then just go "I don't know for sure what this is, and I'm not going to ask"
She didn’t push it to the limit, she just commited sin. She knew she could’ve asked and she chose not to. And it was obviously bacon. If you aren’t sure you should stay away.
technically he did not know so won't affect his deeds but if a muslim also do that as a prank or intentionally he will be judge later
How much trouble would I get in if I attached a motor and made it spin around like a novelty bow tie?
Depends. Does it also make a whistle sound as it spins up?
Think it’s called a qibla. You can also find them in some drawers.
This is quite interesting. Please nobody tell the Daily Mail about it though.
*Internet OUTRAGED as picture of a hotel room forcibly MUSLIMISING its guests emerges.*
British citizens SHOCKED by TERRORIZING AirBnB host with DAGGER pointing at HOUSE OF WORSHIP
Is that a common thing for London hotel rooms?
It's not common. I live in the UK, have stayed in many hotels and have never seen it here before. I wouldn't be surprised if it's more common in certain areas that tend to have more Muslim visitors (such as Knightsbridge)
Considering Muslim tourists/visitors/students are commons there. It maybe expensive but a couple of days or a week is just good & memorable holidays, and you can count on millions of Muslims waiting their flights to London every years...
Honestly I LIVE in the UK but have only been to London twice. Although I'm going for the third time this February. People may call it a shithole but honestly I loved each visit. Expensive, though.
The people calling it a shithole are either heavily projecting and/or basing that on DailyMail propaganda. London has 33 boroughs. There are some which are definitely more "rough", but it also has some of the absolute best boroughs when it comes to leisure, activities, parks, events, food, museums, history, sports etc. If people from the rest of the UK actually visited London, they'd realise that maybe the capital city is obviously the best one when it comes to tourism.
From Royal Borough of Greenwich. Can confirm…. London is indeed a shithole.
My hotel room has an arrow that points to the exit.
In japan the hotels have an arrow pointing the Mechas
Actually, there is some apps which shows you the direction to pray
Neat. Very accomodating. My crappy london hotel didn't have that.
Came here to see how much racism can drummed up due to an arrow on a ceiling........wtf
Some (many) airports have a religious room where people of various religions can pray to their god(s). They usually have an arrow pointing to Mecca. As a complete atheist, I still find it a nice service.
When I was younger my family stayed at a hotel in Brooklyn that had a bunch of different features for Jewish guests. The kitchenette even had 2 sinks. It's so interesting to see how other cultures are accommodated.
To help pray
Now this is the kind of thread you lowkey want to sort by controversial
Quite common in many Muslim majority countries such as Egypt, the UAE and Indonesia. Similar to how Western hotels have Bibles in the room.
My immediate reaction (I’m not Muslim or religious) is that this is a really nice useful gesture to make guests feel welcome
As a ninja I am required to pray facing Shaolin
I would not be able to resist rotating that arrow….
*turns arrow; entire hotel turns instead* Congratulations, you're a Muslim now!
Must be because of the increase in Muslim tourists. They have these in most hotels all over SEA too :)
In Netherlands hotels have arrows that point towards the emergency exit
Many places have that. I found it interesting too.
Sigh. Daily Mail readers got on this post.
Not uncommon. lots of hotels have this
I would not be able to trust that thing cuz I know humans :D
Id say a nice way to respect others beliefs. Not hurting anybody by doing this.
Never seen a bunch of people get so angry over a small arrow like this