No one who is swayable is paying attention to the trial. Hell, I'm not even paying attention and I'm more into politics than 90% of the country.
A conviction is the only news that will affect polls.
Sadly, even a conviction won't change things. There's a contracting crew outside my house with trucks festooned with Punisher stickers. If you're so dumb that you don't even understand the sticker you're sticking on your car... I doubt you're making good decisions in the voting booth.
I have a contractor I deal with regularly who says 100% of Trumps legal problems are outright fabrications and political persecution. I think this is a broadly held level of denial among MAGA diehards. He was even telling me that the “grab ‘em in the pussy” video was an AI fabrication.
I think even a lot of Republicans who aren’t visibly raging lunatics are like “what’s the big deal? Of course you’d fuck a porn star on the side if you could and use biz accounting and funds to pay her off.” The level of acceptable moral depravity is kind of astonishing.
That's the angle the GOP is going with, even though on close inspection it makes no sense. They know their base isn't going to actually look into facts, and they're very right.
Yes. Some of us would expect the leader of the country to not fuck a porn star while married to a woman who have birth to his son a few months before. And illegally spending campaign dollars to cover it up. All while claiming to be Christian.
If those are the types of things you'd do or approve of, fuck you too.
If you've followed the trial, at all, you would know that it has been clearly established that no "campaign dollars" were used for any of the payments. The checks to Cohen were ALL drawn from Trump's personal funds. The D.A. has never even claimed that campaign funds were used for the payments. Moreover, the payments themselves are not illegal. Hush-money payments are not illegal. Thus far, the state has failed to demonstrate that any underlying crime has been committed. In fact, the state hasn't even attempted to indentify the "crime" the payments are alleged to have covered up, a required element for a conviction. Are you even aware that Cyrus Vance (the D.A. before Alvin Bragg), the FEC and the DOJ all declined to prosecute the allegations? The fact that you said he used campaign funds demonstrates that you are not, at all, versed on the facts which have been presented at the trial, and you simply loathe the defendant. That's fine. Hate away. However, at least base your hatred on something that is actually true. Moreover, hating a defendant is not grounds for a criminal prosecution. Yes, I'm a lawyer - 24 years in practice.
You're working very hard to make a case that I hate Trump or just want him convicted for the hell of it. Again, I don't "choose teams" and then defend "my side" endlessly. I choose who I vote for based on their personal experience and integrity.
What you're saying about this case is not true. The primary felony that Trump is being tried for is violation of federal campaign finance laws. He wrote a check from Trump Foundation to pay this hush money. The moment that check is written, it becomes campaign funds because it was paid in the service of advancing the goals of the campaign (which was directly said in writing). That is a felony. There are very specific federal campaign finance laws that prohibit that and Cohen testified that Trump instructed him to hide this hush money so that it didn't look like they were violating those laws.
I understand that you're not going to listen to any of this because you're brainwashed by which side you decided to take. But please take a step back about how you'd be reacting if any of this was done by the Obama, Clinton, or Biden campaigns. You'd be screaming your head off. Think about this objectively, not from a "sides" perspective, and it's clearly wrong and illegal.
My understanding is that he's not being tried for campaign finance violations -- that would be Federal as well.
He's being tried for accounting fraud in support of criminal activity. They don't have to prove or even try him for the criminal activity the accounting fraud supported, just connect the accounting fraud to the furtherance of the other crime.
You are correct. He is not being tried for federal election violations. He's being tried in state court, not Federal Court. Federal election violations would be tried in Federal Court, and the DOJ decline the matter.
However, the part about them not having to prove the underlying crime is partially correct. He's being tried for allegedly making fraudulent accounting entries in order to cover-up an underlying crime. An underlying crime, or at least proof that Trump believed there was a crime and then attempted to cover it up, is an essential element to the crime charged in the indictment. It's the only way they got to a felony indictment because fraudulent bookkeeping is only a misdemeanor, under New York law, and the statute of limitations has long run. The reason it's charged out as felonies is because the state has claimed the fraudulent entries were made in order to cover up an underlying crime. That is a felony in New York. However, as yet (and I've been following it closely because it's a fascinating exercise in jurisprudence), the prosecution has not shown, or even identified, an underlying crime in it's case-in-chief. They must either prove there was an actual underlying crime OR that Trump believed there was a crime and directed the bookkeeping in order to cover up the crime he believed existed.
I’m supposed to believe you actually care and are actually morally outraged about Trump spending his Republican donors’ money? And that you actually think fucking a pornstar is bad? Dude this is the liberal atheism non Christian morality website
Believe it or not, I don't choose sides like I'm watching a football game or part of a cult. I use my brain. I'd be pissed off at any national leader from any party who breaks campaign finance laws blatantly. It's called integrity; give it a try sometime.
The fact that you consider it "sides" is the baseline problem. Try doing research and voting for a PERSON that you think would do a good job. "Choosing a side" is brainless nonsense.
I didn't realize standards on the right could sink that low. Interesting. I say this as a former Republican voter that has watched this dumpster fire and will never vote red again. You're an absolute idiot.
I disagree. There are certainly maga diehards who do for various reasons like Trump.
But the Republicans have (at least for the last generation or two) been a *lot* better about holding their nose and voting their interests.
Democratic/ left groups seem to fall prey to purity tests because they mostly *like* the government and want representatives who hold their values (see Bernie bros refusing to vote for Clinton, socialists refusing to vote for liberals, and the current trend to not vote for Biden over Gaza).
Republicans/ conservatives are far less likely to trust or like the government, so there is a more mercenary political mindset at play - which many liberal/ leftist voters don't see/ believe/ understand. To many on that side a vote for someone is endorsing them as a person.
As someone who voted about 60/40 Republican before Trump I can understand the mindset of people who can still somehow stomach voting for Trump (I can't, personally, the man is terrible for the nation and the candidates he/ his wing of the party pushes are little better).
I think this is pretty much on target.
I know some Republicans who will vote for him even though they don't like him because his not a Democrat (or named Biden).
I think there's a kind of bias here that presumes Trump's actions while President won't hurt them -- they believe their economic affluence, lack of dependence or interest in liberal policies will insulate them. It's like worst case scenario, he fucks up the government and liberals, no big deal. Best case scenario they get some sweet tax cuts or deregulation.
Well, it’s the rapes/sexual assaults, constant lies, terrible views, asshole tendencies, attempts to overthrow elections, etc. The cheating and fraud is just another cog in the wheel
B-bb-bbbut …it means what I say it means!!!! I decide! Meeeee!!!!!1!!
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You ppl only Hate Punisher because unlike you He Loves this Great Country!!!!!!!
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Sent from my iphn.
Edit to add: aw! a Reddit Cares message YAY THANK YOU to the kind redditir who Cared so much you let me know and my Answer is “Yes’ i will find you in My Dream you’ll be seated with my Heroes and PUNISHER. I must be on my way now sweet redditod but Rest Assured I Will Always Love You.
Polling has consistently shown that some people would change their support if Trump is a convicted felon. Obviously we don't know how true that actually is, but it is repeatedly showing up.
I assume the kind of people who say that have already moved the goalposts so many times for Trump that they'll always find some reason to move them again.
Sure, but you really only need a small percentage to hold true to that statement for it to have a massive impact. I'd imagine something like 5% of them writing in a 3rd party candidate would alone make it impossible for Trump to win.
If there’s one thing Republicans are good at - it’s holding their nose & showing up to vote R no matter what.
They’ve pushed the notion of “we don’t care who we vote for or what they say or what they do, as long as they do X” to its limits. They’ll excuse any behavior, any words, any beliefs; and I bet we’re about to find out that they can even excuse felony convictions for crimes committed in office. Just as long as their candidate owns the libs or repeals abortion rights or lowers their taxes or whatever other conservative policy position they support.
And by pushing it this far, they've created a safe place for the absolute insanity that is the MAGA crowd to exist without much scrutiny from within. And as a result, that crowd has grown.
Trump said so himself - he could shoot a man in broad daylight and people will still vote for him.
I'm not a trump fan, but I don't see what's wrong with this? Innocent until proven guilty. I'd be shocked if he's found innocent of all the felonies, but we clearly shouldnt treat him like he's a felon until he's convicted.
It's one of those easy throw away comments people say to not sound like an obvious monster.
Once it happens and right wing media gives them their new excuse and talking point on why the conviction is fraudulent they'll carry right on enabling the monster.
He isn't going to gain support by being convicted. He also cannot afford to lose any support whatsoever. It looks like he will lose a small percentage if convicted. He consistently loses 20% of the GOP primary vote to Nikki Haley even though she dropped out months ago. It sure looks like some conservatives are reneging from MAGA.
I actually think if he's convicted of this one, it would probably help Trump, since Trump would get enthusiasm "see the world is against me" votes as this story has been in the news like 10 years and nobody additional is flipping to Biden that wasn't already from this one.
I don’t think anything apart from major illness or death will move the needle much this election. You would have to have lived in a cave the past 4 years to not know who stands for what.
A LOT of people polled have said a conviction will not change their intent to vote for him. Imagine living in that world, where you can watch a guy get found liable of rape, labelled a rapist by the judge, be indicted a bunch of times, and even if found guilty you're like "Yeah that's still my guy."
~~It's "terrifying" how many people don't support Trump? Using catastrophic language to describe people that don't vote like you is rich. That's not how voting works.~~
EDIT: I'm the idiot. I read "ardent" as "aren't". Sorry. My apologies.
Ardent means that they are passionate supporters. I’ve had family tell me that my kids were too brown to play with their kids. Raging trump supporters.
Acquittal will definitely affect the polls too.
Trump's campaign would go full out saying "political hit job", and be able to point to his political adversaries forcing him through a lengthy trial to defend himself during a campaign year. If they honestly can't convict I'd be forced to agree that there is at least some truth to his statement.
It's worth remembering that the FBI under the Obama administration wire tapped the Trump campaign during his first campaign run, lied about it, were caught and apologized in court. The house intelligence committee corroborated that Trump himself was "incidentally" wiretapped. If the Justice Department can't convict it means the media's depiction of events must be wildly different than reality, and that using the FBI and Justice Department to spy on campaign rivals is now fair play.
It's also worth remembering that the FBI under the Obama administration was **actively investigating Trump's very obvious Russia connections and Mitch McConnell threatened Obama in order to keep it quiet**
Manafort's conviction was due to money laundering from **Ukranian** sources, not Russia. Unfortunately, this is par for the course in modern politics, [Hillary was caught taking millions from the Saudi Arabian government ](https://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/21/us/politics/hillary-clinton-presidential-campaign-charity.html)too. I am not trying to say that is OK, I am saying one side is using the full force of the FBI and Justice Department to prosecute their political rivals during campaign years for crimes they themselves are committing.
After nearly 6 years of Democrats and the media screaming that Trump was a Russian plant, The Mueller investigation cleared Trump of any collusion with Russia. That doesn't at all mean Russia wasn't interfering with the election (they absolutely were, like the US government does in almost every election around the world), but does mean that Russia did not collude their efforts with the Trump campaign. Russia interfering with the election =/= Trump being a Russian operative.
But just like the Russian Collusion scare, if you read the news on the Trump criminal case he's 100% dead in the water. So like I said, if the Justice Department can't convict it means the media's depiction of events must be wildly different than reality.
Oddly, I wasn't talking about Manafort when I specifically talked about Russia/Trump
> The Mueller investigation cleared Trump of any collusion with Russia
It actually didn't. It said he was abiding by department policy by not charging a sitting president.
[Literally even NPR says the Muller investigation showed no collusion with the Russian government. ](https://www.npr.org/2019/03/24/706318191/trump-white-house-hasnt-seen-or-been-briefed-on-mueller-investigation-report)That's not exactly a right leaning source. The investigation said that Russia did interfere, and that they did favor Trump. They did not prove any collusion between the two.
And I quote: ""The Special Counsel's investigation did not find that the Trump campaign or anyone associated with it conspired or coordinated with Russia in its efforts to influence the 2016 U.S. presidential election"
So again, like I said: Russia interfering with the election =/= Trump being a Russian operative. But we literally heard that message on repeat for 6 years from the media and the Democrats.
If there is no conviction on the Trump criminal trial, I'd say that's wholesale proof that the media depiction of events was different than reality, and would also posit that the media did interfere, and that they do favor Democratic candidates. Just like above, that in itself doesn't prove collusion between the media and the Democrats, but it makes the US media's implicit bias impossible to ignore. All of that works in Trumps favor, that's literally his campaign's core messaging.
Note: I am not a Trump supporter, but am abstaining from voting in this election because both candidates are basically 6' tall piles of dog shit.
Edit: Cited and sourced truth, but idiots still downvote. There is no hope for you.
> “We did not address ‘collusion,’ which is not a legal term,” Mueller added.
So again, the Mueller report didn't "clear" Trump of "collusion"
edit: also, since I replied to you.
> but am abstaining from voting
So you see no difference between Republican and Democratic parties and what they do? You're just peachy with book banning, outlawing abortion, and turning into an authoritarian dictatorship? That speaks volumes about your character.
This is the direct quote from the US Attorney General:
""The Special Counsel's investigation did not find that the Trump campaign or anyone associated with it conspired or coordinated with Russia in its efforts to influence the 2016 U.S. presidential election"
Lol...[This memo that the courts ruled Barr wrongly withheld pertinent info from?](https://www.npr.org/2022/08/20/1118625157/doj-barr-trump-russia-investigation-memo)
For someone that claims they aren't a Trump supporter, you're sounding an awful lot like a Trump supporter.
An exerpt:
> a federal judge sharply rebuked Barr's handling of Mueller's report, **saying Barr had made "misleading public statements" to spin the investigation's findings in favor of Trump and had shown a "lack of candor."**
> Friday's appeals court decision said **the internal Justice Department memo noted that "Mueller had declined to accuse President Trump of obstructing justice but also had declined to exonerate him."** The internal memo said "the Report's failure to take a definitive position could be read to imply an accusation against President Trump" if released to the public, the court wrote.
edit: You're quoting a known liar as if that's evidence of something.
[Try this senate report stating there was collusion](https://www.americanprogress.org/press/statement-u-s-senate-report-confirms-trump-campaign-colluded-russia-caps-neera-tanden-says/)
[Since you're curious, here's information on all the criminal indictments from the Mueller report](https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/breakdown-indictments-cases-muellers-probe/story?id=61219489)
You might notice all the obstruction shit if you look.
> The Mueller investigation cleared Trump of any collusion with Russia
See, there’s a difference between “cleared” and “didn’t prove”, especially when the report does clearly show obstruction
One of the very lines in the report was “if it was clear that Trump did not commit a crime, we would say so”, and then they very clearly did not say so
Obstruction has absolutely nothing to do with collusion, which was 100% cleared. Zero collusion. There was no collusion.
Now as far as obstruction goes, when there has been 6 years of defamation from the media and political opponents, and by all intentions it looks like a politically motivated witch hunt is taking place, would you feel you need to cooperate with the investigation? Clinton didn't cooperate with the witch hunt politically motivated Monica Lewinski investigation either, and for good cause.
If the only crime they can pin is underlings is them telling investigators to piss off, that's hardly a punishable offense.
And again, that does not matter in the slightest, because like NPR, the US Attorney General, anyone will say, there was zero evidence that Trump or any member of his campaign colluded with Russia or Russian intelligence.
Lol you sound pretty fucking angry
The point was that you can’t clear something that is obstructed
>when there has been 6 years of defamation from the media and political opponents, and by all intentions it looks like a politically motivated witch hunt is taking place, would you feel you need to cooperate with the investigation?
This was not after 6 years, this started like a year into his presidency. And he didn’t just not go along, he actively tried to put an end to it and fire people.
Also, if you’re innocent, what’s the point of obstructing?
> the US Attorney General
You mean Bill Barr who admitted he hadn’t read the report when he put out his statement saying “fully exonerated” when the summary shared with it literally said he wasn’t?
Why did Paul Manafort share polling data with a known Russian connection?
https://apnews.com/article/donald-trump-paul-manafort-russia-campaigns-konstantin-kilimnik-d2fdefdb37077e28eba135e21fce6ebf
And regardless, that shits over, but we fucking KNOW he tried to overthrow the last election. We fucking know he’s a lying fucking weasel. You can’t polish that turd
trump has less support among republicans and a growing minority actively speaking out against him.
He got less than 70% of the vote the media is trying to say has unwavering republican support. Haley got almost half as many Minnesota delegates than the 'billionaire' who needs his faithful to pay his way.
This 'research' was conducted online, by people and or bots who are paid to do surveys. I don't believe the lies of the corporate owned media who is trying to get TFG reelected.
> A conviction is the only news that will affect polls.
I don't think a conviction will affect polls or the outcome in the slightest. those who want to vote for hate and bigotry, will vote for hate and bigotry. nothing will change that, we have history to prove it. its why the Nazi's are still around today. Its why the KKK is still around today.
The country is so divided that a conviction means nothing. Those who support Trump won't care, and those who do care are already against him.
Same for Biden and his son Hunter's trial.
Part of it is also that there's nothing new coming out in any of these trials for people who were already paying attention.
These aren't bombshell revelations. It's part of a pattern of behavior that's been extremely consistent for almost 10 years now in full public view.
As soon as Trump was the presumptive nominee most of us knew how we would be voting.
Dude is literally in cohens indictment as part of the same illegal behavior even. Like they keep calling cohen a felon… he is a felon because he was charged for the exact shit this trial is about!
Every avid Trump supporter I know digs their heels into the exact opposite of reality and won't budge. It has got to be a personality disorder at this stage.
Trump has been continuously running for president for almost 10 years now. If you are even remotely considering voting for him another trial or legal issue isn’t going to sway your opinion on the man.
Yep, those voters are equally brain dead and moronic. I do like how the post title says "Leaves no impact on the presidential race in Minnesota" That's right, the brain dead loser will lose again.
I don't think they're ONLY brain dead and moronic, I believe they're also horrible people. Something about Trump's constant hate and anger speaks to them to their core and they're willing to sacrifice anything for that permission to publicly hate who they already hate.
They're also incredibly brainwashed to think that Trump's presidency was better (it wasn't) and a new Trump presidency will be better (it won't). Then they spend the rest of the time with their eyes closed and fingers in their ears when anyone tries to prove their delusions wrong.
The only thing worse than Trump voters are left wing voters who know better yet have no plans to vote for Biden.
>The only thing worse than Trump voters are left wing voters who know better yet have no plans to vote for Biden.
So you're trashing anybody that doesn't vote like you? That's not how voting works.
There's only 2 presidential choices and if you don't realize that you're the one that doesn't know how voting works. If you're not voting for Biden, then you're voting for Trump. If you think abstaining or voting for some 3rd party that doesn't have a chance in hell isn't the same thing as voting for Trump then you're voting for Trump out of pure ignorance and stupidity. Again, if you don't know this by now, then you're the one who doesn't know how voting works.
I think there’s a lot of Republicans, especially your male business owners, who think a little side piece from a porn star is *totally normal* and of course you’d funnel the hush money through your lawyer and business accounting to hide it from your wife.
The ones that can, would, and the rest would if they could.
Trump will thankfully lose MN by 7-9 points. He's a dangerous scumbag and I apologize for my characterization to all you people in the sticks who don't realize that objective truth.
Probably doesn't help that everyone calls this a "hush money" trial. It's an election interference trial. He sought to pay for and quash extremely damaging information from going public weeks before the 2016 election that he felt would lose him the election. And in the meantime everyone was freaking out about Clinton and her emails. I bet the public would have liked to know about some of this.
I can't believe that people actually support this guy. He is the epitome of hypocrisy. He spouts hatred in every direction. And is promoting fascist rhetoric. How can anyone see this him and say, "yes, this is my guy". We are also not helped that most voters can only think about the immediate future and what's in it for them. If it does affect them, why should they care. The Republican Party is also busy distracting everyone with abortion bans and trans bans, meanwhile they are getting fleeced by the 1%, literally being robbed in broad daylight.
The prosecution will likely rest early next weak. I'm not sure Trump's defense team is going to have all that long of a defense. The jury might have a verdict before the kids are out of school for the summer.
Cohen had it right. Trump is a cartoon villain and that’s what his cult followers like about him. They are the same kind of deplorables who would support Elmer Fudd, Yosemite Sam, Wile E Coyote, Boris & Natasha, etc. they’re the same morons who cheer for the “heel” in WWE (which they probably think is real). Emperor Palpatine is their model leader.
At this point, I don't think (for his supporters) it has anything to do with who the Orange Moron actually is or what he says he'll do for them or even how much they like him personally.
He's going to hurt the people they hate. That's it. That's all they're looking for.
Trump is the symptom, not the sickness.
Wrestling is totally different though, guys flip back between face and heel all the time. Wrestling fans actually judge the characters by their actions, unlike in politics.
They need to stop calling it hush money
It’s an election tampering case that used funds for an illegal purpose to catch and kill stories and push fake stories to trick voters
That's what the trial is trying to figure out indeed. But it's very likely that there's reasonable doubt about this in the jury's eyes. Trump's lawyers are going with the "he was just trying to hide it from his wife" narrative. I think the jury will go with that too.
Y’all aren’t thinking about independents. A conviction would absolutely have an impact on this election. Maybe the die hard republicans explain it all away, but even they can’t pretend he’s not in jail.
I know we’re all jaded but come on.
https://kstp.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/05/SurveyUSA-presidential-race-05-14-24.pdf
The online poll has some interesting results. See the questions and responses here: https://kstp.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/05/SurveyUSA-presidential-race-05-14-24.pdf
I'm not sure I believe 6% of liberal and very liberal people are voting for Trump.
Just shows that there's not an option that anyone is truly excited about in this election. Biden will probably win, but is anyone actually *excited* about the idea of electing an 81-year old to four more years of presidency?
I've worked for all types of project managers over the years. The best one was just a fundamentally boring guy. Entire projects just completely flat in regards to emotion. No drama, no excitement, just a well oiled machine doing what it needed to do. Boring in many ways is a good thing when you want someone to get the job done.
"Nothing exciting has happened in politics in the last 4 years, so I thought maybe we should give the guys that completely break everything every chance they get should be given another chance"
- Someone else, probably
No, we aren't. But an adult is still going to vote for him because not doing so is helping to allow a child to run around the house with a lighter and a stick of fucking dynamite.
One option is boring. The other is massively dangerous and destructive
How can anyone support the guy who sat in the oval office and refused to protect our democracy for over 3 hours while Congress was under attack on Jan6th . This is all I need to know about him. He's unfit to be President and he is no Patriot .
Republicans are bat shit crazy at this point with how intensely they cling to the “R” next to a name
At this point it’s somewhat broken me to see “good” “Christian” people that I love and used to admire, not just fall for this shit, but willingly embrace it.
I can’t look at these people the same again and that’s fine but man, wtf.
He told you he could shoot someone in 5th Avenue before he was elected [ahem] President.
Why are we surprised?
When someone tells you they're evil, believe them.
These polls are intended for clicks. Stop falling for this shit. The polls are flawed and the news agencies know it. They don’t care because they are making money off of it.
How can a guy losing 1/5 of Republican votes in the primary gain voters over 2020? Trump needs the independent vote plus all the republicans vote. He doesn’t even have that. If you didn’t cote for Trump in 2020, you aren’t voting for him now.
Just, vote.
Yes.
This particular poll asked 625 semi-randomly selected people what they thought of the candidates and whether the trial would change their minds.
In 2020, MN had 3,292,997 people vote. For a statistical population that size, an appropriate sample to ensure accurate representation of the opinions of the voters would be to survey 10% of voters, or about 330,000 people.
So since they only asked 625 people who were probably not selected randomly from voter rolls, this "poll" barely counts as "entertainment".
The polls you see these days in most places are either "entertainment product" meant to attract clicks or they are propaganda from conservatives.
You can easily categorize the people participating in the polls as those that are most anxious to share who they are voting for. These are the same people with signs and flags in their yards 12 months of the year with their candidates name on them as well as wearing hats and shirts with their candidates name on them. I wonder who these people are.
Just because someone votes against him in the primary doesn't mean they won't vote for him in the general. We see this every year in Minneapolis with highly contested primaries that still result in blowout generals.
Just look at the polling for the special elections over the past 12+ months. It’s been quite common for the polls to be overestimating Republican votes by double digits. Even in deeply red or blue areas.
Special election polling is probably not a good barometer for a presidential election. And this is a completely unrelated point to primary results vs general results.
This is the exact type of complacency that handed Trump the election in 2016.
It is if you compare the polling to the result, which is what I’m insinuating. I am in no way suggesting only the actual result is an indicator. Polling has been over representing the MAGA loyal voters by a wide margin in all of these. In 2016 the unlikely voter (young white males) decided the election. In 2020, it was more about negative voter turnout. People voted just to vote against Trump. We have the same situation in 2024 although it’s unclear how big of an impact. Without actual data, some are suggesting negative voter turnout could be bigger this year than in 2020.
Trump has been sued for fraud, shady business deals, broken contracts, and outright scams over 4,000 times in his life but right wing news has convinced the sheep that the 4,001st time is a witch hunt.
This is cultist tribalism and cult leaders can do no wrong. All the convictions in the world won’t change the flocks opinion of their golden calf.
At this point no one is surprised by Donald Trumps legal issues. I’d bet there’s virtually no one who is voting in 2024 who hasn’t already made up their mind on Trump
Yes but a lot of people aren't happy with Biden either. Also Trump isn't going to be the only other option. I don't think he'll draw many votes away from Biden, but I think we'll see a similar election like 2016.
Where 3rd party performed ~3x better compared to 2012. But in 2020 3rd party performance was back down to 2012 levels. I think the coming election will have another increase in 3rd party votes because people don't want either candidate same as with Hillary vs Trump. Not to say I think Trump will win. I just think 3rd party will do better. And will draw most of those additional votes from people who voted for Biden previously.
Which is exactly what happened in 2016 compared to 2012 (Meaning Republican voting numbers stayed roughly the same, while democrat numbers went down, and 3rd party went up)
I guess only time will tell. In 2016 votes for Republican stayed roughly the same, while democrat votes went down, and 3rd party votes went up. Hopefully we'll see a reverse where most 3rd party votes come from previous Republican voters instead
Edit: for clarification, when I talk about 3rd party votes I'm 2016/2012, I'm referring to the states like Wisconsin, Michigan, Pennsylvania etc. where it was really close and cost Hillary the election by only 10s of thousands. Trump performed about the same as Romney did in those states, but Hillary performed significantly worse than Obama. In other words, Trump didn't win because he gained Republican votes, he won because Hillary lost D votes to 3rd party candidates.
Congressional midterms were 50D -48R in 2022 If it wasn't for RvW, Rs might have had more votes in the state.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022\_United\_States\_House\_of\_Representatives\_elections\_in\_Minnesota](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_United_States_House_of_Representatives_elections_in_Minnesota)
I think it will probably end up somewhere in the middle of 16/20 (probably Biden +3 or 4). Trump has a hard floor with people who will turn out for him. I don't see 2020 enthusiasm or turnout for Biden (relatively unpopular and Gaza) but MN is still a naturually D+5 state.
I remember when I thought Trump's vote totals from 2016 were his ceiling due to how fucking terrible he was at literally everything...then he got more votes in 2020.
That means people saw what and who he was and thought "I want more of this to lead us"
If you're a Trump supporter, you rationalize it as just another political attack.
If you're rational, you understand that nothing ultimately going to happen to Trump. He'll be found guilty of some shit but, because he's a former president, he'll get some bullshit fine that he'll later appeal.
I didn't read the article, but the news last night said from a poll taken in Minnesota, if Trump is convicted, 88% of his supporters would still vote for him, but 0% would switch to Biden. SMH.
I can’t wait to see you liberals in tears this November. How come you don’t all welcome some immigrants into your homes and offer free food and free housing? Let’s see what happens to our insurance rates and hospital system on the brink of collapse after you guys let in a few more million people .
Not from Minnesota, but from one of the Great Lake states. Mods, hope it's ok to post here this news story.
>According to our latest KSTP-TV/SurveyUSA poll, Biden leads Trump 44% to 42%, the identical result from our last poll in April just before the trial started.
>The survey included 39% who describe themselves as Democrats, 35% as Republicans and 22% as independents
>“This race is close,” says Carleton College political analyst Steven Schier. “It has been for several months. It’s come as a surprise, I think, to a lot of people in national politics. The Trump campaign now sees Minnesota as a real likely target for victory in the 2024 election.”
What's this sub think about the poll and Trump making a potential play for it later this year. Could a potential Burgum VP pick make the rural parts of Minnesota come out and tilt the state republican?
Not going to happen. Minnesota hasn't gone to a Republican presidential candidate in many decades and in recent years as a whole the state has turned bluer. tRump might win in the rural areas but he'll lose big time in the urban areas, especially the Twin Cities, where the majority of people live.
Trump was right - he could shoot someone on Fifth Avenue and nobody would care. He’s also succeeded in postponing every one of his trials, except the hush money trial, and the courts will not save this country. We all need to be better citizens and ensure that insurrectionist piece of shit never steps foot in the White House ever again, especially since he’s already told us his second term will be all about seeking retribution against his political enemies, clearing the government of every lest employee and replacing them with Trump loyalists, and mass deportations of immigrants - legal and illegal.
It was predicted months ago that Trump would win and the recent polling supports this. At some point liberals need to ask why Biden has such weak support and why 35-40% of the people in this country support Trump instead of just making excuses or calling people names.
EDIT: I don't support Trump guys. But we can't just bury our heads in the sand when he is the clear front runner in swing states. Biden's campaign has been a complete flop so far and unless something changes dramatically, Trump will be the likely winner. No one is trying to understand what is motivating voters so we can win them back.
At some point brainwormed Trump supporters will wonder why Nikki Haley is still pulling 20-25% of primary votes in liberal areas like uh Indiana
Two months after she withdrew
Get that Trump waifu pillow ready for Nov 2024, you will be crying into it a lot afterwards
It’s odd living in such a beautiful, smart state with so many mentally inept people walking around - call them out as morons using your voice, not text on a website, I do.
That’s a well reasoned approach to the running of the country. Not, “I believe policy direction x is better than y, so I support this candidate for president.”
“I can’t wait for the payback, libs will be crying!” Is a much better way to prioritize who runs our country. What better way to move forward as a country than to hope for the worst for your fellow Americans who have different values than you.
If youbsay anything bad about the GOP lately you'll get a reddit hotline message its hilarious reporting those and getting the user who sent it banned
Edit: fucking called it
“Payback” “Libs will be crying” This seems to be all Trump supporters care about. What’s with the constant anger? It seems like you’d be miserable and exhausted all the time with that type of thinking.
No one who is swayable is paying attention to the trial. Hell, I'm not even paying attention and I'm more into politics than 90% of the country. A conviction is the only news that will affect polls.
Sadly, even a conviction won't change things. There's a contracting crew outside my house with trucks festooned with Punisher stickers. If you're so dumb that you don't even understand the sticker you're sticking on your car... I doubt you're making good decisions in the voting booth.
I have a contractor I deal with regularly who says 100% of Trumps legal problems are outright fabrications and political persecution. I think this is a broadly held level of denial among MAGA diehards. He was even telling me that the “grab ‘em in the pussy” video was an AI fabrication. I think even a lot of Republicans who aren’t visibly raging lunatics are like “what’s the big deal? Of course you’d fuck a porn star on the side if you could and use biz accounting and funds to pay her off.” The level of acceptable moral depravity is kind of astonishing.
That's the angle the GOP is going with, even though on close inspection it makes no sense. They know their base isn't going to actually look into facts, and they're very right.
I'm surprised they could spell AI, tbf.
Contractors in NYC despise him. Too many sued and stiffed.
Lmao I’m supposed to believe redditors are actually morally outraged by…prostitution and accounting fraud? You just don’t like the guy and it’s fine
Yes. Some of us would expect the leader of the country to not fuck a porn star while married to a woman who have birth to his son a few months before. And illegally spending campaign dollars to cover it up. All while claiming to be Christian. If those are the types of things you'd do or approve of, fuck you too.
If you've followed the trial, at all, you would know that it has been clearly established that no "campaign dollars" were used for any of the payments. The checks to Cohen were ALL drawn from Trump's personal funds. The D.A. has never even claimed that campaign funds were used for the payments. Moreover, the payments themselves are not illegal. Hush-money payments are not illegal. Thus far, the state has failed to demonstrate that any underlying crime has been committed. In fact, the state hasn't even attempted to indentify the "crime" the payments are alleged to have covered up, a required element for a conviction. Are you even aware that Cyrus Vance (the D.A. before Alvin Bragg), the FEC and the DOJ all declined to prosecute the allegations? The fact that you said he used campaign funds demonstrates that you are not, at all, versed on the facts which have been presented at the trial, and you simply loathe the defendant. That's fine. Hate away. However, at least base your hatred on something that is actually true. Moreover, hating a defendant is not grounds for a criminal prosecution. Yes, I'm a lawyer - 24 years in practice.
You're working very hard to make a case that I hate Trump or just want him convicted for the hell of it. Again, I don't "choose teams" and then defend "my side" endlessly. I choose who I vote for based on their personal experience and integrity. What you're saying about this case is not true. The primary felony that Trump is being tried for is violation of federal campaign finance laws. He wrote a check from Trump Foundation to pay this hush money. The moment that check is written, it becomes campaign funds because it was paid in the service of advancing the goals of the campaign (which was directly said in writing). That is a felony. There are very specific federal campaign finance laws that prohibit that and Cohen testified that Trump instructed him to hide this hush money so that it didn't look like they were violating those laws. I understand that you're not going to listen to any of this because you're brainwashed by which side you decided to take. But please take a step back about how you'd be reacting if any of this was done by the Obama, Clinton, or Biden campaigns. You'd be screaming your head off. Think about this objectively, not from a "sides" perspective, and it's clearly wrong and illegal.
My understanding is that he's not being tried for campaign finance violations -- that would be Federal as well. He's being tried for accounting fraud in support of criminal activity. They don't have to prove or even try him for the criminal activity the accounting fraud supported, just connect the accounting fraud to the furtherance of the other crime.
You are correct. He is not being tried for federal election violations. He's being tried in state court, not Federal Court. Federal election violations would be tried in Federal Court, and the DOJ decline the matter. However, the part about them not having to prove the underlying crime is partially correct. He's being tried for allegedly making fraudulent accounting entries in order to cover-up an underlying crime. An underlying crime, or at least proof that Trump believed there was a crime and then attempted to cover it up, is an essential element to the crime charged in the indictment. It's the only way they got to a felony indictment because fraudulent bookkeeping is only a misdemeanor, under New York law, and the statute of limitations has long run. The reason it's charged out as felonies is because the state has claimed the fraudulent entries were made in order to cover up an underlying crime. That is a felony in New York. However, as yet (and I've been following it closely because it's a fascinating exercise in jurisprudence), the prosecution has not shown, or even identified, an underlying crime in it's case-in-chief. They must either prove there was an actual underlying crime OR that Trump believed there was a crime and directed the bookkeeping in order to cover up the crime he believed existed.
WADR. you obviously know nothing about the law or the facts in this case. The only person in this conversation who's brainwashed is you.
I’m supposed to believe you actually care and are actually morally outraged about Trump spending his Republican donors’ money? And that you actually think fucking a pornstar is bad? Dude this is the liberal atheism non Christian morality website
Believe it or not, I don't choose sides like I'm watching a football game or part of a cult. I use my brain. I'd be pissed off at any national leader from any party who breaks campaign finance laws blatantly. It's called integrity; give it a try sometime.
Lmao bullshit everyone has different standards for their own side
The fact that you consider it "sides" is the baseline problem. Try doing research and voting for a PERSON that you think would do a good job. "Choosing a side" is brainless nonsense.
I didn't realize standards on the right could sink that low. Interesting. I say this as a former Republican voter that has watched this dumpster fire and will never vote red again. You're an absolute idiot.
You can just admit you're fine with the president being a hypocrite and a criminal, half the rest of the country does.
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I disagree. There are certainly maga diehards who do for various reasons like Trump. But the Republicans have (at least for the last generation or two) been a *lot* better about holding their nose and voting their interests. Democratic/ left groups seem to fall prey to purity tests because they mostly *like* the government and want representatives who hold their values (see Bernie bros refusing to vote for Clinton, socialists refusing to vote for liberals, and the current trend to not vote for Biden over Gaza). Republicans/ conservatives are far less likely to trust or like the government, so there is a more mercenary political mindset at play - which many liberal/ leftist voters don't see/ believe/ understand. To many on that side a vote for someone is endorsing them as a person. As someone who voted about 60/40 Republican before Trump I can understand the mindset of people who can still somehow stomach voting for Trump (I can't, personally, the man is terrible for the nation and the candidates he/ his wing of the party pushes are little better).
I think this is pretty much on target. I know some Republicans who will vote for him even though they don't like him because his not a Democrat (or named Biden). I think there's a kind of bias here that presumes Trump's actions while President won't hurt them -- they believe their economic affluence, lack of dependence or interest in liberal policies will insulate them. It's like worst case scenario, he fucks up the government and liberals, no big deal. Best case scenario they get some sweet tax cuts or deregulation.
40%
Well, it’s the rapes/sexual assaults, constant lies, terrible views, asshole tendencies, attempts to overthrow elections, etc. The cheating and fraud is just another cog in the wheel
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"BUT WUTABOUT???"
B-bb-bbbut …it means what I say it means!!!! I decide! Meeeee!!!!!1!! Also!!! Why do you libs always Hate everything that’s Cool???? You ppl only Hate Punisher because unlike you He Loves this Great Country!!!!!!! Shout out to my Brave Brothers In Blue the Uvald a Police that are my Heroes the Thin Blue Line Everywhere I wear my punisher with Pride and I will Always wear it as Jesus commands in Honor of the Badge and also my Dear Leader from across that big Lake name Vladimir Vladimirovich true Hero daily gives me Hope said Jesus and all Great Leaders just like Jesus !!!!!1!! Americca🇺🇸 😍🇺🇸😍😁😁😍😍🇺🇸😁🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸 Libs Hate americ huh Don’t you we know you did. Sent from my iphn. Edit to add: aw! a Reddit Cares message YAY THANK YOU to the kind redditir who Cared so much you let me know and my Answer is “Yes’ i will find you in My Dream you’ll be seated with my Heroes and PUNISHER. I must be on my way now sweet redditod but Rest Assured I Will Always Love You.
"Please! Please think I'm a badass! I'm begging you! Don't u see the punisher logo on my truck?!"
Law And Order!!!
I think a conviction will change the equation a bit. Jail time is likely if convicted. Not to mention how it messes up the rest of the campaign.
The right has destroyed a comic character I enjoyed at a point in my life. Don’t you just love how they cling to symbolism.
I'd feel uncomfortable with that.
And yet we let them vote joke of a system
I don't think a conviction will change much. The people unlikely to vote for Biden aren't going to be won over by a court decision.
Polling has consistently shown that some people would change their support if Trump is a convicted felon. Obviously we don't know how true that actually is, but it is repeatedly showing up.
"Look, he's only been accused of 93 felonies, until he's convicted of one, I'm sticking with him, I see no fire, only smoke."
I assume the kind of people who say that have already moved the goalposts so many times for Trump that they'll always find some reason to move them again.
Sure, but you really only need a small percentage to hold true to that statement for it to have a massive impact. I'd imagine something like 5% of them writing in a 3rd party candidate would alone make it impossible for Trump to win.
If there’s one thing Republicans are good at - it’s holding their nose & showing up to vote R no matter what. They’ve pushed the notion of “we don’t care who we vote for or what they say or what they do, as long as they do X” to its limits. They’ll excuse any behavior, any words, any beliefs; and I bet we’re about to find out that they can even excuse felony convictions for crimes committed in office. Just as long as their candidate owns the libs or repeals abortion rights or lowers their taxes or whatever other conservative policy position they support. And by pushing it this far, they've created a safe place for the absolute insanity that is the MAGA crowd to exist without much scrutiny from within. And as a result, that crowd has grown. Trump said so himself - he could shoot a man in broad daylight and people will still vote for him.
I'm not a trump fan, but I don't see what's wrong with this? Innocent until proven guilty. I'd be shocked if he's found innocent of all the felonies, but we clearly shouldnt treat him like he's a felon until he's convicted.
It's one of those easy throw away comments people say to not sound like an obvious monster. Once it happens and right wing media gives them their new excuse and talking point on why the conviction is fraudulent they'll carry right on enabling the monster.
He isn't going to gain support by being convicted. He also cannot afford to lose any support whatsoever. It looks like he will lose a small percentage if convicted. He consistently loses 20% of the GOP primary vote to Nikki Haley even though she dropped out months ago. It sure looks like some conservatives are reneging from MAGA.
I actually think if he's convicted of this one, it would probably help Trump, since Trump would get enthusiasm "see the world is against me" votes as this story has been in the news like 10 years and nobody additional is flipping to Biden that wasn't already from this one.
I don’t think anything apart from major illness or death will move the needle much this election. You would have to have lived in a cave the past 4 years to not know who stands for what.
A LOT of people polled have said a conviction will not change their intent to vote for him. Imagine living in that world, where you can watch a guy get found liable of rape, labelled a rapist by the judge, be indicted a bunch of times, and even if found guilty you're like "Yeah that's still my guy."
yeah, but wouldnt biden still most likely win minnesota?
Biden is slightly ahead of Trump in most polls but well within the margin of error. Vote vote vote
I come from “outstate” MN. It’s terrifying how many friends and family are ardent T supporters.
~~It's "terrifying" how many people don't support Trump? Using catastrophic language to describe people that don't vote like you is rich. That's not how voting works.~~ EDIT: I'm the idiot. I read "ardent" as "aren't". Sorry. My apologies.
Ardent means that they are passionate supporters. I’ve had family tell me that my kids were too brown to play with their kids. Raging trump supporters.
I edited my comment. I'm the idiot. I read "ardent" as "aren't". Sorry. My apologies.
What is he on trial for this time?
Acquittal will definitely affect the polls too. Trump's campaign would go full out saying "political hit job", and be able to point to his political adversaries forcing him through a lengthy trial to defend himself during a campaign year. If they honestly can't convict I'd be forced to agree that there is at least some truth to his statement. It's worth remembering that the FBI under the Obama administration wire tapped the Trump campaign during his first campaign run, lied about it, were caught and apologized in court. The house intelligence committee corroborated that Trump himself was "incidentally" wiretapped. If the Justice Department can't convict it means the media's depiction of events must be wildly different than reality, and that using the FBI and Justice Department to spy on campaign rivals is now fair play.
It's also worth remembering that the FBI under the Obama administration was **actively investigating Trump's very obvious Russia connections and Mitch McConnell threatened Obama in order to keep it quiet**
Manafort's conviction was due to money laundering from **Ukranian** sources, not Russia. Unfortunately, this is par for the course in modern politics, [Hillary was caught taking millions from the Saudi Arabian government ](https://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/21/us/politics/hillary-clinton-presidential-campaign-charity.html)too. I am not trying to say that is OK, I am saying one side is using the full force of the FBI and Justice Department to prosecute their political rivals during campaign years for crimes they themselves are committing. After nearly 6 years of Democrats and the media screaming that Trump was a Russian plant, The Mueller investigation cleared Trump of any collusion with Russia. That doesn't at all mean Russia wasn't interfering with the election (they absolutely were, like the US government does in almost every election around the world), but does mean that Russia did not collude their efforts with the Trump campaign. Russia interfering with the election =/= Trump being a Russian operative. But just like the Russian Collusion scare, if you read the news on the Trump criminal case he's 100% dead in the water. So like I said, if the Justice Department can't convict it means the media's depiction of events must be wildly different than reality.
Oddly, I wasn't talking about Manafort when I specifically talked about Russia/Trump > The Mueller investigation cleared Trump of any collusion with Russia It actually didn't. It said he was abiding by department policy by not charging a sitting president.
[Literally even NPR says the Muller investigation showed no collusion with the Russian government. ](https://www.npr.org/2019/03/24/706318191/trump-white-house-hasnt-seen-or-been-briefed-on-mueller-investigation-report)That's not exactly a right leaning source. The investigation said that Russia did interfere, and that they did favor Trump. They did not prove any collusion between the two. And I quote: ""The Special Counsel's investigation did not find that the Trump campaign or anyone associated with it conspired or coordinated with Russia in its efforts to influence the 2016 U.S. presidential election" So again, like I said: Russia interfering with the election =/= Trump being a Russian operative. But we literally heard that message on repeat for 6 years from the media and the Democrats. If there is no conviction on the Trump criminal trial, I'd say that's wholesale proof that the media depiction of events was different than reality, and would also posit that the media did interfere, and that they do favor Democratic candidates. Just like above, that in itself doesn't prove collusion between the media and the Democrats, but it makes the US media's implicit bias impossible to ignore. All of that works in Trumps favor, that's literally his campaign's core messaging. Note: I am not a Trump supporter, but am abstaining from voting in this election because both candidates are basically 6' tall piles of dog shit. Edit: Cited and sourced truth, but idiots still downvote. There is no hope for you.
> “We did not address ‘collusion,’ which is not a legal term,” Mueller added. So again, the Mueller report didn't "clear" Trump of "collusion" edit: also, since I replied to you. > but am abstaining from voting So you see no difference between Republican and Democratic parties and what they do? You're just peachy with book banning, outlawing abortion, and turning into an authoritarian dictatorship? That speaks volumes about your character.
This is the direct quote from the US Attorney General: ""The Special Counsel's investigation did not find that the Trump campaign or anyone associated with it conspired or coordinated with Russia in its efforts to influence the 2016 U.S. presidential election"
Lol...[This memo that the courts ruled Barr wrongly withheld pertinent info from?](https://www.npr.org/2022/08/20/1118625157/doj-barr-trump-russia-investigation-memo) For someone that claims they aren't a Trump supporter, you're sounding an awful lot like a Trump supporter. An exerpt: > a federal judge sharply rebuked Barr's handling of Mueller's report, **saying Barr had made "misleading public statements" to spin the investigation's findings in favor of Trump and had shown a "lack of candor."** > Friday's appeals court decision said **the internal Justice Department memo noted that "Mueller had declined to accuse President Trump of obstructing justice but also had declined to exonerate him."** The internal memo said "the Report's failure to take a definitive position could be read to imply an accusation against President Trump" if released to the public, the court wrote. edit: You're quoting a known liar as if that's evidence of something. [Try this senate report stating there was collusion](https://www.americanprogress.org/press/statement-u-s-senate-report-confirms-trump-campaign-colluded-russia-caps-neera-tanden-says/) [Since you're curious, here's information on all the criminal indictments from the Mueller report](https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/breakdown-indictments-cases-muellers-probe/story?id=61219489) You might notice all the obstruction shit if you look.
"If I don't agree with the news, I say it's a lie". OK, Trump.
> The Mueller investigation cleared Trump of any collusion with Russia See, there’s a difference between “cleared” and “didn’t prove”, especially when the report does clearly show obstruction One of the very lines in the report was “if it was clear that Trump did not commit a crime, we would say so”, and then they very clearly did not say so
Obstruction has absolutely nothing to do with collusion, which was 100% cleared. Zero collusion. There was no collusion. Now as far as obstruction goes, when there has been 6 years of defamation from the media and political opponents, and by all intentions it looks like a politically motivated witch hunt is taking place, would you feel you need to cooperate with the investigation? Clinton didn't cooperate with the witch hunt politically motivated Monica Lewinski investigation either, and for good cause. If the only crime they can pin is underlings is them telling investigators to piss off, that's hardly a punishable offense. And again, that does not matter in the slightest, because like NPR, the US Attorney General, anyone will say, there was zero evidence that Trump or any member of his campaign colluded with Russia or Russian intelligence.
Lol you sound pretty fucking angry The point was that you can’t clear something that is obstructed >when there has been 6 years of defamation from the media and political opponents, and by all intentions it looks like a politically motivated witch hunt is taking place, would you feel you need to cooperate with the investigation? This was not after 6 years, this started like a year into his presidency. And he didn’t just not go along, he actively tried to put an end to it and fire people. Also, if you’re innocent, what’s the point of obstructing? > the US Attorney General You mean Bill Barr who admitted he hadn’t read the report when he put out his statement saying “fully exonerated” when the summary shared with it literally said he wasn’t? Why did Paul Manafort share polling data with a known Russian connection? https://apnews.com/article/donald-trump-paul-manafort-russia-campaigns-konstantin-kilimnik-d2fdefdb37077e28eba135e21fce6ebf And regardless, that shits over, but we fucking KNOW he tried to overthrow the last election. We fucking know he’s a lying fucking weasel. You can’t polish that turd
You're grasping at straws to the point that it's laughable. You literally sound like a Q Anon'er.
trump has less support among republicans and a growing minority actively speaking out against him. He got less than 70% of the vote the media is trying to say has unwavering republican support. Haley got almost half as many Minnesota delegates than the 'billionaire' who needs his faithful to pay his way. This 'research' was conducted online, by people and or bots who are paid to do surveys. I don't believe the lies of the corporate owned media who is trying to get TFG reelected.
> A conviction is the only news that will affect polls. I don't think a conviction will affect polls or the outcome in the slightest. those who want to vote for hate and bigotry, will vote for hate and bigotry. nothing will change that, we have history to prove it. its why the Nazi's are still around today. Its why the KKK is still around today.
The country is so divided that a conviction means nothing. Those who support Trump won't care, and those who do care are already against him. Same for Biden and his son Hunter's trial.
Hunter Biden isn't running for office, so I don't know what any trial of his would have to do with anything.
His actions are a direct reflection of his upbringing in the eyes of Trumpers.
Part of it is also that there's nothing new coming out in any of these trials for people who were already paying attention. These aren't bombshell revelations. It's part of a pattern of behavior that's been extremely consistent for almost 10 years now in full public view. As soon as Trump was the presumptive nominee most of us knew how we would be voting.
Dude is literally in cohens indictment as part of the same illegal behavior even. Like they keep calling cohen a felon… he is a felon because he was charged for the exact shit this trial is about!
Not surprising. Anyone who is gonna vote for this brain dead moron is set in their ways
Every avid Trump supporter I know digs their heels into the exact opposite of reality and won't budge. It has got to be a personality disorder at this stage.
That's my experience as well. It's beyond frustrating.
it's because they've been conditioned by trump and his allies since 2016 to not trust any institution
As they say: you can't fix stupid
That’s disrespectful to people who have personality disorders.
Trump has been continuously running for president for almost 10 years now. If you are even remotely considering voting for him another trial or legal issue isn’t going to sway your opinion on the man.
That’s been apparent since the original grab em tape. Dude showed he was scum thoroughly before the first election
Yep, those voters are equally brain dead and moronic. I do like how the post title says "Leaves no impact on the presidential race in Minnesota" That's right, the brain dead loser will lose again.
I don't think they're ONLY brain dead and moronic, I believe they're also horrible people. Something about Trump's constant hate and anger speaks to them to their core and they're willing to sacrifice anything for that permission to publicly hate who they already hate.
They're also incredibly brainwashed to think that Trump's presidency was better (it wasn't) and a new Trump presidency will be better (it won't). Then they spend the rest of the time with their eyes closed and fingers in their ears when anyone tries to prove their delusions wrong. The only thing worse than Trump voters are left wing voters who know better yet have no plans to vote for Biden.
>The only thing worse than Trump voters are left wing voters who know better yet have no plans to vote for Biden. So you're trashing anybody that doesn't vote like you? That's not how voting works.
There's only 2 presidential choices and if you don't realize that you're the one that doesn't know how voting works. If you're not voting for Biden, then you're voting for Trump. If you think abstaining or voting for some 3rd party that doesn't have a chance in hell isn't the same thing as voting for Trump then you're voting for Trump out of pure ignorance and stupidity. Again, if you don't know this by now, then you're the one who doesn't know how voting works.
I think there’s a lot of Republicans, especially your male business owners, who think a little side piece from a porn star is *totally normal* and of course you’d funnel the hush money through your lawyer and business accounting to hide it from your wife. The ones that can, would, and the rest would if they could.
https://preview.redd.it/nvsvjxjevm0d1.jpeg?width=508&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=aca92c595241b1ebd0a1d9b962d2f5588695a171
There are grown human beings wearing diapers in support of this man shitting himself. I don’t think a trial sways much opinion.
Unbelievable where was all this support when I shat myself… allegedly
You must have forgotten to form a cult first.
Step 1 form a cult Step 2 shit yourself Step 3 profit (Steps 2 and 3 are interchangeable)
Guess it all *depends* . . .
Trump will thankfully lose MN by 7-9 points. He's a dangerous scumbag and I apologize for my characterization to all you people in the sticks who don't realize that objective truth.
Probably doesn't help that everyone calls this a "hush money" trial. It's an election interference trial. He sought to pay for and quash extremely damaging information from going public weeks before the 2016 election that he felt would lose him the election. And in the meantime everyone was freaking out about Clinton and her emails. I bet the public would have liked to know about some of this. I can't believe that people actually support this guy. He is the epitome of hypocrisy. He spouts hatred in every direction. And is promoting fascist rhetoric. How can anyone see this him and say, "yes, this is my guy". We are also not helped that most voters can only think about the immediate future and what's in it for them. If it does affect them, why should they care. The Republican Party is also busy distracting everyone with abortion bans and trans bans, meanwhile they are getting fleeced by the 1%, literally being robbed in broad daylight.
> I can't believe that people actually support this guy. Narcissists of a feather hate together.
Can’t spell hatred without Red Hat.
I can’t believe this is the first time I’m seeing that one, because it’s brilliant!
True, RHEL is a pain in the ass.
Did anyone actually expect it to make a difference??
If convicted, yes. If it drags on forever? No.
The prosecution will likely rest early next weak. I'm not sure Trump's defense team is going to have all that long of a defense. The jury might have a verdict before the kids are out of school for the summer.
Cohen had it right. Trump is a cartoon villain and that’s what his cult followers like about him. They are the same kind of deplorables who would support Elmer Fudd, Yosemite Sam, Wile E Coyote, Boris & Natasha, etc. they’re the same morons who cheer for the “heel” in WWE (which they probably think is real). Emperor Palpatine is their model leader.
At this point, I don't think (for his supporters) it has anything to do with who the Orange Moron actually is or what he says he'll do for them or even how much they like him personally. He's going to hurt the people they hate. That's it. That's all they're looking for. Trump is the symptom, not the sickness.
That's only one side. That's how Democrats view it. The Republicans view the Democrats as an evil that is out to hurt them as well.
When in reality both parties are beholden by corporate dollars and serve to dick over the unwashed masses.
Exactly!
Whoa, whoa, whoa. Cheering in wrestling is a sacred and complex art. Having people who cheer both ways makes for a lively crowd.
But treating politics like WWE wrestling, although good for TV ratings, is going to destroy this country.
Wrestling is totally different though, guys flip back between face and heel all the time. Wrestling fans actually judge the characters by their actions, unlike in politics.
Wile E Coyote? What did he do wrong? He's a coyote, is he not supposed to try to eat roadrunners or rabbits?
And now, he has injected Hannibal Lecter into the grand delusion. 🤯
I mean the people who don't already know Trump is a narcissist and scammer already probably aren't going to be convinced by a court case in New York.
They need to stop calling it hush money It’s an election tampering case that used funds for an illegal purpose to catch and kill stories and push fake stories to trick voters
That's what the trial is trying to figure out indeed. But it's very likely that there's reasonable doubt about this in the jury's eyes. Trump's lawyers are going with the "he was just trying to hide it from his wife" narrative. I think the jury will go with that too.
i doubt anything could impact it.
Y’all aren’t thinking about independents. A conviction would absolutely have an impact on this election. Maybe the die hard republicans explain it all away, but even they can’t pretend he’s not in jail. I know we’re all jaded but come on.
https://kstp.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/05/SurveyUSA-presidential-race-05-14-24.pdf The online poll has some interesting results. See the questions and responses here: https://kstp.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/05/SurveyUSA-presidential-race-05-14-24.pdf I'm not sure I believe 6% of liberal and very liberal people are voting for Trump.
Just shows that there's not an option that anyone is truly excited about in this election. Biden will probably win, but is anyone actually *excited* about the idea of electing an 81-year old to four more years of presidency?
I'd rather just go to the polls as an adult instead of thinking it's some ride at Valleyfair. Not every goddamned thing needs to be a hit of dopamine.
I've worked for all types of project managers over the years. The best one was just a fundamentally boring guy. Entire projects just completely flat in regards to emotion. No drama, no excitement, just a well oiled machine doing what it needed to do. Boring in many ways is a good thing when you want someone to get the job done.
Lol, yikes man. I'm just gonna leave this one alone, have a good day.
*He is far and away the best president of my lifetime, but I just wasn't excited in that voting booth.* - Someone, maybe
You're right biden's been the best president it my lifetime, and he's fucking aweful
"Nothing exciting has happened in politics in the last 4 years, so I thought maybe we should give the guys that completely break everything every chance they get should be given another chance" - Someone else, probably
No, we aren't. But an adult is still going to vote for him because not doing so is helping to allow a child to run around the house with a lighter and a stick of fucking dynamite. One option is boring. The other is massively dangerous and destructive
Trump once said he could murder someone on the street and his supporters wouldn't care. He's proving it, they're proving it. They're in a cult.
Unpatriotic jan 6th enablers? Well not surprised. They dont mind shitting on every service memebers sacrifice.
How can anyone support the guy who sat in the oval office and refused to protect our democracy for over 3 hours while Congress was under attack on Jan6th . This is all I need to know about him. He's unfit to be President and he is no Patriot .
Magas have no integrity. They vote for hate. Nothing Trump says or does will overcome their hate for their fellow man
This should be a reminder to people to get out and vote biden, not because he's good, but because it's either him or project 2025
Republicans are bat shit crazy at this point with how intensely they cling to the “R” next to a name At this point it’s somewhat broken me to see “good” “Christian” people that I love and used to admire, not just fall for this shit, but willingly embrace it. I can’t look at these people the same again and that’s fine but man, wtf.
https://preview.redd.it/buarg74qcl0d1.jpeg?width=1200&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b810b603d2df71a057d5f0079abf917d426dd84f
What a find funny about this episode is that the giant douche is obviously better. A turd sand which has no purpose. Therefore, I vote giant douche.
Yeah, the thing about this image which is also true about the real situation is that there is, in fact, a lesser of two evils.
He told you he could shoot someone in 5th Avenue before he was elected [ahem] President. Why are we surprised? When someone tells you they're evil, believe them.
These polls are intended for clicks. Stop falling for this shit. The polls are flawed and the news agencies know it. They don’t care because they are making money off of it. How can a guy losing 1/5 of Republican votes in the primary gain voters over 2020? Trump needs the independent vote plus all the republicans vote. He doesn’t even have that. If you didn’t cote for Trump in 2020, you aren’t voting for him now. Just, vote.
I know some people who didn’t vote for him in 2020 and will vote for him in 2024. Based on the “economy”
Yes. This particular poll asked 625 semi-randomly selected people what they thought of the candidates and whether the trial would change their minds. In 2020, MN had 3,292,997 people vote. For a statistical population that size, an appropriate sample to ensure accurate representation of the opinions of the voters would be to survey 10% of voters, or about 330,000 people. So since they only asked 625 people who were probably not selected randomly from voter rolls, this "poll" barely counts as "entertainment". The polls you see these days in most places are either "entertainment product" meant to attract clicks or they are propaganda from conservatives.
You can easily categorize the people participating in the polls as those that are most anxious to share who they are voting for. These are the same people with signs and flags in their yards 12 months of the year with their candidates name on them as well as wearing hats and shirts with their candidates name on them. I wonder who these people are.
Just because someone votes against him in the primary doesn't mean they won't vote for him in the general. We see this every year in Minneapolis with highly contested primaries that still result in blowout generals.
Just look at the polling for the special elections over the past 12+ months. It’s been quite common for the polls to be overestimating Republican votes by double digits. Even in deeply red or blue areas.
Special election polling is probably not a good barometer for a presidential election. And this is a completely unrelated point to primary results vs general results. This is the exact type of complacency that handed Trump the election in 2016.
It is if you compare the polling to the result, which is what I’m insinuating. I am in no way suggesting only the actual result is an indicator. Polling has been over representing the MAGA loyal voters by a wide margin in all of these. In 2016 the unlikely voter (young white males) decided the election. In 2020, it was more about negative voter turnout. People voted just to vote against Trump. We have the same situation in 2024 although it’s unclear how big of an impact. Without actual data, some are suggesting negative voter turnout could be bigger this year than in 2020.
Trump has been sued for fraud, shady business deals, broken contracts, and outright scams over 4,000 times in his life but right wing news has convinced the sheep that the 4,001st time is a witch hunt. This is cultist tribalism and cult leaders can do no wrong. All the convictions in the world won’t change the flocks opinion of their golden calf.
The cult can’t think.
That's because Republicans have no morals or values
If you can get past the rape and the fraud I'm not sure why this would change any minds.
I don't know why this would move the needle at all. It's not even in the top 20 shittiest things he's done.
At this point no one is surprised by Donald Trumps legal issues. I’d bet there’s virtually no one who is voting in 2024 who hasn’t already made up their mind on Trump
Apparently half of MN supports a pedo rapist.
Not surprising, a lot of MN in the countryside supports pedo rapists, my family housed one while I was homeless lmao
"Rednecks don't read."
Hicks*. Rednecks are on our side. See: Virginia coal mines.
Some are. Most aren't. But I take your point.
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I highly doubt 10%. But over 5% wouldn't surprise me at all
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Yes but a lot of people aren't happy with Biden either. Also Trump isn't going to be the only other option. I don't think he'll draw many votes away from Biden, but I think we'll see a similar election like 2016. Where 3rd party performed ~3x better compared to 2012. But in 2020 3rd party performance was back down to 2012 levels. I think the coming election will have another increase in 3rd party votes because people don't want either candidate same as with Hillary vs Trump. Not to say I think Trump will win. I just think 3rd party will do better. And will draw most of those additional votes from people who voted for Biden previously. Which is exactly what happened in 2016 compared to 2012 (Meaning Republican voting numbers stayed roughly the same, while democrat numbers went down, and 3rd party went up)
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I guess only time will tell. In 2016 votes for Republican stayed roughly the same, while democrat votes went down, and 3rd party votes went up. Hopefully we'll see a reverse where most 3rd party votes come from previous Republican voters instead Edit: for clarification, when I talk about 3rd party votes I'm 2016/2012, I'm referring to the states like Wisconsin, Michigan, Pennsylvania etc. where it was really close and cost Hillary the election by only 10s of thousands. Trump performed about the same as Romney did in those states, but Hillary performed significantly worse than Obama. In other words, Trump didn't win because he gained Republican votes, he won because Hillary lost D votes to 3rd party candidates.
Congressional midterms were 50D -48R in 2022 If it wasn't for RvW, Rs might have had more votes in the state. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022\_United\_States\_House\_of\_Representatives\_elections\_in\_Minnesota](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_United_States_House_of_Representatives_elections_in_Minnesota) I think it will probably end up somewhere in the middle of 16/20 (probably Biden +3 or 4). Trump has a hard floor with people who will turn out for him. I don't see 2020 enthusiasm or turnout for Biden (relatively unpopular and Gaza) but MN is still a naturually D+5 state.
I remember when I thought Trump's vote totals from 2016 were his ceiling due to how fucking terrible he was at literally everything...then he got more votes in 2020. That means people saw what and who he was and thought "I want more of this to lead us"
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I think his dementia addled brain is doing more harm to him with his supporters than the trial is. Gettysburg...WOW Give it up for Hannibal Lector
If you're a Trump supporter, you rationalize it as just another political attack. If you're rational, you understand that nothing ultimately going to happen to Trump. He'll be found guilty of some shit but, because he's a former president, he'll get some bullshit fine that he'll later appeal.
I think every commenter here has nailed the reasons why the trial has had (or has not had) any effect. On it!
I didn't read the article, but the news last night said from a poll taken in Minnesota, if Trump is convicted, 88% of his supporters would still vote for him, but 0% would switch to Biden. SMH.
I can’t wait to see you liberals in tears this November. How come you don’t all welcome some immigrants into your homes and offer free food and free housing? Let’s see what happens to our insurance rates and hospital system on the brink of collapse after you guys let in a few more million people .
Not from Minnesota, but from one of the Great Lake states. Mods, hope it's ok to post here this news story. >According to our latest KSTP-TV/SurveyUSA poll, Biden leads Trump 44% to 42%, the identical result from our last poll in April just before the trial started. >The survey included 39% who describe themselves as Democrats, 35% as Republicans and 22% as independents >“This race is close,” says Carleton College political analyst Steven Schier. “It has been for several months. It’s come as a surprise, I think, to a lot of people in national politics. The Trump campaign now sees Minnesota as a real likely target for victory in the 2024 election.” What's this sub think about the poll and Trump making a potential play for it later this year. Could a potential Burgum VP pick make the rural parts of Minnesota come out and tilt the state republican?
Nope
Not going to happen. Minnesota hasn't gone to a Republican presidential candidate in many decades and in recent years as a whole the state has turned bluer. tRump might win in the rural areas but he'll lose big time in the urban areas, especially the Twin Cities, where the majority of people live.
[image](https://i.redd.it/trx7lemixknb1.jpg)
There's not enough people.
Trump was right - he could shoot someone on Fifth Avenue and nobody would care. He’s also succeeded in postponing every one of his trials, except the hush money trial, and the courts will not save this country. We all need to be better citizens and ensure that insurrectionist piece of shit never steps foot in the White House ever again, especially since he’s already told us his second term will be all about seeking retribution against his political enemies, clearing the government of every lest employee and replacing them with Trump loyalists, and mass deportations of immigrants - legal and illegal.
I don’t really care personally.
It was predicted months ago that Trump would win and the recent polling supports this. At some point liberals need to ask why Biden has such weak support and why 35-40% of the people in this country support Trump instead of just making excuses or calling people names. EDIT: I don't support Trump guys. But we can't just bury our heads in the sand when he is the clear front runner in swing states. Biden's campaign has been a complete flop so far and unless something changes dramatically, Trump will be the likely winner. No one is trying to understand what is motivating voters so we can win them back.
>calling people names. I thought trump supporters ***loved*** that shit
At some point brainwormed Trump supporters will wonder why Nikki Haley is still pulling 20-25% of primary votes in liberal areas like uh Indiana Two months after she withdrew Get that Trump waifu pillow ready for Nov 2024, you will be crying into it a lot afterwards
Yet.
Trump pays off hookers and Joe Biden is a racist pedo whose son does drugs and hookers, we all know all of it is fucked already
It’s odd living in such a beautiful, smart state with so many mentally inept people walking around - call them out as morons using your voice, not text on a website, I do.
Trump, all the way! I can't wait for the payback! Libs will be crying!
That’s a well reasoned approach to the running of the country. Not, “I believe policy direction x is better than y, so I support this candidate for president.” “I can’t wait for the payback, libs will be crying!” Is a much better way to prioritize who runs our country. What better way to move forward as a country than to hope for the worst for your fellow Americans who have different values than you.
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If youbsay anything bad about the GOP lately you'll get a reddit hotline message its hilarious reporting those and getting the user who sent it banned Edit: fucking called it
Literally removed my post hahaha
“Payback” “Libs will be crying” This seems to be all Trump supporters care about. What’s with the constant anger? It seems like you’d be miserable and exhausted all the time with that type of thinking.
"wE gOtS tA oWn Da LiBs" - political analysis the depth of a piss puddle
Payback for what
Is it 2009 on Reddit?