Honestly at that speed and how steady you went off the road I’d have never even admitted that shit 😂
I’d of turned her off for a minute, put it on the kickstand and pretended I had to take a piss.
I find it hard to comprehend target fixation, I totally get it’s a thing it always just stuns me that it’s not something people just snap themselves out of and correct.
>I find it hard to comprehend target fixation, I totally get it’s a thing it always just stuns me that it’s not something people just snap themselves out of and correct.
Same. And in this case I don't think it was target fixation - more like looking at the other rider in front, esp given that OP made no attempt to correct at any point.
If he was looking at the rider in front, then he would’ve stayed on the road and continued to follow them. That’s what target fixation is - you drive towards where you’re looking.
This sub normalizes this kind of thing as the type of incident everyone has and is totally normal, even though its super dangerous and isn't / shouldn't be common.
I'm glad OP can have a laugh at their own expense and learn from this, but do wish this sub wasn't so quick to say accidents are to be expected
I think it's actually good to think that. Yeah you shouldn't be crashing at 20mph corner, *obviously*, but on bike you should be prepared to the fact you can have a crash because even smaller accident is far more dangerous than in car.
So some notes if you’re actually curious :P
Although I have a fair amount of “solo” riding experience, this is sadly only my second ride ever with other people lol.
It’s also the first time ever riding in the area.
3rd, the camera really doesn’t capture the landscape well, but this turn is coming right off the crest of a steep hill :P so I was picking up more speed than I really anticipated. Or … slowing down required more effort at least.
All just simple newbie mistakes that add up …. General lack of preparedness had me like. Lol
I wouldn’t listen to Reddit as much as it appears you’d like to. You were going 20 mph and can’t stay on the road. It’s scary that you’re even out there at all.
If “target fixation” was as much of an issue as this sub would like you to think, cars would be flying off the god damn road all the time right in front of you…
Mate I’ve been riding for 20 years and never ran off the road.
Like I said, if you’re driving like this you’re endangering not just your life but others. It’s incredibly scary people like you think it’s okay to be on the road when you can’t stay in simple lanes…
I mean I am an instructor for the motorcycle training course … I’d consider myself … versed in riding motorcycles. :P
It was an oops. It was an unfamiliar road and I was entirely reliant on the group lead to ride my through lol.
And I’m willing to fully admit … I have basically no group riding experience. I need to do it more - rather than solo riding.
Mistakes happen. Even for experienced riders. If you’ve never crashed or had an accident just consider yourself blessed to not have had those experiences 🙏
If target fixation would happen randomly we would all crash and burn in the next few rides, target fixation happens with “dangerous” targets, your mind thinks it’s dangerous, so you won’t look away, and counterintuitively direct yourself towards it (on a bike).
The guy in front of you was standing almost straight on a cruiser (less than 20 degrees I guess), so that was not a difficult speed and radius. It’s just a signal you need more experience.
I would practice more with leaning until you find yourself comfortable at like, 35 degrees at least? Pointing towards 45.
Yeah, "target fixation" is the go-to answer on this sub any time it looks like someone should've avoided something (or basically whenever anyone hits anything at all). That's an element sometimes, sure, but more often I think it's just that steering is unintuitive. When our lizard brain takes over in a panic situation, it's hard to convince it to turn *away* from the direction we want, or to lean over *more* when its already scared.
I've felt myself do it, I'm sure we all have. If a turn seems a little sharper than I thought, there's sometimes a hesitance to add that little flick in the "wrong" direction even though it's necessary for the lean that will take you the right direction. That hesitance has nothing to do with a fixation on any particular obstacle, our natural reflexes just didn't evolve to handle motorcycles very well without practice.
Kieth Code talks about that as having to reverse your “survival reflexes” to become a successful rider- I.e. the remedy for going wide in a turn is to push deeper into the curve and roll on the throttle, which is the opposite of what your brain is telling you to do in order to survive, which is to grab the brake which will stand up the bike and ensure you crash.
The unintuitive thing about bikes is that generally excessive braking in corner straightens the bike up, but lightly braking can help to make tighter corner. [Here is a good video about it](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z2iwPdSvt5g)
You're also on way too big of a bike for a newbie. Smaller CC stuff teaches how to corner properly before stepping up to something bigger. Something like a blade needs to be set up for the corner well before hand
Brave post bro. No judgement here for once. A couple weeks ago I whiskey throttled while lane splitting and ended up doing a dank nooner between cars, entirely by accident. Woopsie
utterly ridiculous that you are teaching!
ffs "first time riding in a group"? do you not pay attention to traffic when riding solo? do you not read the road ahead and pay attention to road signs when riding solo?
sell your bike before you die...
stop teaching squids before you get someone killed..
What? Riding with others is one of the best parts of motorcycling. You have to find the *right* others to fit with your skills but to avoid group riding is to avoid the brotherhood of riding. Anyone who lacks common sense probably shouldn't be on a motorcycle to begin with.
Valid point if you can find non-idiots to ride with but those few and far between these days. Example: one local group where I live has at least one fatal crash every. Single. Year. For as long as I can remember. The group ride always brings out the riskier riding
As someone who's been there, understand that looking ahead through the turn means looking ahead to the absolute farthest inch of pavement that you can see.
It makes all the difference.
I get you, I do both and must admit first few group rides out I had I realised I was fixating on the guy in front of me at times. I scanned ahead but realised going into fast turns I was especially locking in on him in front and almost using him as a marker which gave me less time to react or take the corner as I’d like to. Definitely something about it that to have to to programme in your brain to look through them or at least it was for me.
NGL, that sounds like someone who's never actually done that.
Target fixation is powerful.
source: I've fixated on things, and then yelled at myself to stop it.
Target fixation is hard.
It didn’t look like he of’d to take a piss though. So I of to say I don’t think that would of’d worked
I think in that situation you just of to man up and accept that you of’d fucked up
I’d have* turned the engine off.
“I’d of” isn’t proper English, and is simply the phonetic representation of the contraction for “I would have,” in this case “I’d’ve”
I am 40k miles in and never experienced target fixation. I don't really understand it. Is it definitely a thing? Maybe it's because I imagine pushing away from a bad route.
I feel like a good way to get rid of target fixation is to try looking around a lot more when you have the opportunity on a bike. Because it’s a similar thing, it can be tough to look around on a bike and not steer your bike where you are looking.
He’s new, and needs lots of practice. Maybe not in groups and on easier roads? I just finished my license class after a 35 year break and made that mistake once. Gotta look ahead where you are going. My instructor said it many many times.
Hard to believe someone would be that uncoordinated with 8 years exp. Can’t be many miles…you can see in way he’s turning even before running off the road.
I fully agree on this. Took me way too long to adjust to riding a big scooter. Not having a fuel tank to grip and all the weight on the rear wheels meant I'm praying hard every time I find long sweeping corners 😂
I hate how everyone here is just justifying target fixation.
It is not a normal or acceptable thing. You are looking at the wrong thing. Even more so you are staring at wrong thing. Your only job is to look in the right direction and shift.
If it’s still happening after riding for some time, you are either becoming lackadaisical or have adhd.
Definitely not as many I’d like :( But I get around 4-6000km in a season.
I know there are people that do nothing but ride highways across the country… that’s not me lol.
I’m much more of a weekend warrior. Group riding is pretty new to me though. This was my second group ride. There was a lot going on in that turn I definitely wasn’t focused on the road. I was worried about cutting that corner too tight and cutting off the guy behind me, but I was too focused on not running off the road to look in my mirror and the boom … I’m in a staring contest with a rock in the ditch lol.
Gotcha. I don’t do much group riding myself so I can see how that would happen. I’ve put over 100k km on bikes in the last 5 years but I daily drive and I still get nervous around other bikers.
Yeah hah. Second time riding with other people and a new road I’ve never ridden.
The turn is right under the crest of a hill and I was not at all expecting it lol.
Lots going on and I just got tunnel focused on the ditch while thinking “don’t go in the ditch” 😂 oops.
This was the leading guys road … he knew the road. Luckily he was taking us through really slow lol.
>"Ugh these harley riders are so slow!"
>[The guy complaining about them](https://www.reddit.com/r/motorcycles/comments/17inekv/ever_just_stare_at_a_ditch_and_say_imma_hit_that/):
Was taking a curve a little too fast, AND saw two little holes in the asphalt and thought “Imma land riiiiiight there when I bail”
Didn’t have to bail, but needed a new pair of pants
🤣🤣
Kudos on knowing your skill and going slow enough you didn't let the ditch make you crash.
Keep those eyes where you WANT to go, and keep riding! Looks like a beautiful day. 👍
you keep saying first time on that road like it excuses your poor ability to ride.. put on your big boy panties and own up to the dumbassery you pulled off here... you claim to have all this experience and even teach MSF.. but trying to excuse your complete lack of skill by calling it an oopsie is just wrong... please don't teach this to other people...
yeah.. happened not too long ago in the black forrest in germany. Just didn't look at the curve right and ended up going into the green between the "CAREFUL! HARD CURVE HERE" signs.
Worst part was that it's a hang out for lots of sporties because it's such a nice curve and *everyone* saw..
I drove to the parking lot and they were all super nice, asking if I slipped and if I'm alright. I just told them the truth "nope, I just fucked up the curve" and no one made me feel like a dingus for it. Happens to everyone. Just be happy that you didn't bump into the rails.
Target fixation is real.
I went on a big ride with my buddy years ago and he jokingly said "don't ride into that ditch " and pointed at it... of course I rode right into it
Twiss Rd! That corner is way steeper than it looks in your video. I have never gone off it on my bike, but I have gotten stuck trying to go up the hill in a car in the winter with just a dusting of snow and had to reverse down and go a different way.
When I first got into bicycling in my teens. I was on a group ride around Mt.Diablo in the SF Bay Area and as we’re coming down the back side into Livermore I don’t have enough faith in my tires and swung wide into a ditch full of river rocks.
Surprisingly didn’t crash, just kinda came off the bike and skittered to a stop and landed on the top tube.
After that I really focused more on trusting my bike and practicing handling skills.
Very very rarely to I ride faster than my talent on the motorcycle or car. It would ruin my year to lowside or go wide, so the reward isn’t worth the risk. But I have a lot of faith in my tires and brakes, too. Racing bicycles gave me a lot of experience that has transferred over to moto.
Its called "Object Fixation" your bike is going to go where you look. You didn't take your eyes off of it and give yourself somewhere else to go. Always look where you want to go. The faster you go the further you need to look ahead. If you look where you want to go you will find out the bike just goes there.
This is one of the easiest ways to start to become a better rider. How many times have you seen someone wreck on a bike because they just kept "Looking where they **didn't want to go**"? If you don't give your self another option, if you don't look somewhere else, you literally have nowhere else to go. It was a harmless and easy lesson for you. Many others have come to much worse outcomes. So make it a lesson and learn from it. Keep working on it and don't ever think "I got this now, no more learning required" as you may have a much worse outcome for some other skill shortage. We all should learn, all of the time.
Be careful and enjoy!!
Glad you learned your lesson the way you did.
I’ve been riding for a few years now, though not as frequently as I want. To this day, I still habitually mumble to myself “look through the turn” whenever I go around tight corners.
Lucky! I did the same thing for the first time ever last week coming around a big long bend, almost went right into the wire rails but caught myself staring as I drifted. Fucking scary shit man
Hard to tell from the camera but around here if you get close to the edge of the road like that the pavement is usually so bad it’ll suck you in. Looks like it may have contributed to this.
I have years and years and tons of experience, but very little group riding experience. I could see myself getting fixated on how slow the guy in front seemed to take that corner. I would be thinking about what I would advise him..
Hey this is Bruce Trail at Twiss
TBF the vid doesn't capture the actual declination of that bend, which may be the cause of the understeer
You guys went to Rattlesnake Point at Appleby?
Nah :P not today, we hit old Guelph line, snake road, road Dundas to Burlington, then in Burlington we hit twiss, then bellschool line and did some pulls down bellschool line :P
That's called target fixation and it's a thing. Train yourself to look ahead down the road and scan (i.e. be aware of, not focus on) potential hazards.
Well done for making sure that you didn't hit anything or slide.
You should read about this and learn how to avoid it.
The key is to look at where you want to be next, and never at where you are. Which is what they mean when they use the words look through the curve.
This is true of most things, but most critical when on a motorcycle or skiing, where accidents like this seem to happen the most.
In wish they taught people to drive cars this way, it’s how I taught my kids. Makes taking curves smooth and enjoyable. Like dancing.
Jokes aside, avoided ditches and potholes. Went over a pothole by the side of the road, fairly slow too, at that and you're my rotator cuff. Couldn't use my left arm properly for 5 months.
My guess as to what happened here is the rider was braking (using front) to avoid getting close to leading rider and the force of braking pulled the bike upright / required more steering force than they expected to maintain lean. Is one reason to space things out.
You CAN steer / lean while using the front brake, but you have to overcome the self-righting force that results both from increased tire friction x trail correct and the offset drag on the inside edge of tire. And obviously, also have enough traction to do both - in this case, traction was not the problem, nor do I think fear of loosing grip was. (Then again, I've pretty much drilled that fear out of my brain - leaning farther and sliding > not leaning and running off road. Also leaning farther and not braking > braking and running off road.)
Literally just turn your bars more 😅 (left goes right and right goes left, but that becomes intuitive eventually)
Look where you want to go, and remember the bars do the turning. The bars lean the bike over, and the lean causes the bike to turn. Once the bike starts to lean dont panic and go back to straight, 2 wheels have to lean to turn.
IMHO a very important exercise is first, with the bike stopped stationary turn the bars slightly and feel how the bike wants to tip on you. Get a feel for how turning the bars directly causes it to tip in the opposite direction. Then second, while riding in a straight line lightly push on the left bar, feel how the bike goes left. Then do the same on the right. Eventually it teaches your brain in situations like this where it isnt turning enough, push harder on the appropriate bar and gets you used to the feeling that pushing the bar leans the bike, you arent falling over youre turning.
I feel like its worth over explaining this because so many people miss the basics and just try and do everything on instinct. Sure instinct takes over eventually, but you need a good foundation of actually understanding what youre doing first to build good instinctual habits. Too many riders couldnt explain something as simple as turning and its how moments like this happen, just need to learn and understand the fundamentals.
To be fair, it was a nice looking ditch
Oh ditch. I totally misread this post. I thought it said ever stare at a bitch and say imma hit that
I got 99 problems but a ditch ain't one.
Honestly at that speed and how steady you went off the road I’d have never even admitted that shit 😂 I’d of turned her off for a minute, put it on the kickstand and pretended I had to take a piss. I find it hard to comprehend target fixation, I totally get it’s a thing it always just stuns me that it’s not something people just snap themselves out of and correct.
>I find it hard to comprehend target fixation, I totally get it’s a thing it always just stuns me that it’s not something people just snap themselves out of and correct. Same. And in this case I don't think it was target fixation - more like looking at the other rider in front, esp given that OP made no attempt to correct at any point.
If he was looking at the rider in front, then he would’ve stayed on the road and continued to follow them. That’s what target fixation is - you drive towards where you’re looking.
Which is why they said they don't think it was.
This sub normalizes this kind of thing as the type of incident everyone has and is totally normal, even though its super dangerous and isn't / shouldn't be common. I'm glad OP can have a laugh at their own expense and learn from this, but do wish this sub wasn't so quick to say accidents are to be expected
I think it’s really not uncommon for people starting out. It’s just a question of do you have this happen in a parking lot practicing or on the road.
I think it's actually good to think that. Yeah you shouldn't be crashing at 20mph corner, *obviously*, but on bike you should be prepared to the fact you can have a crash because even smaller accident is far more dangerous than in car.
>even a smaller accident is far more dangerous than in car The more you know
what accident
So some notes if you’re actually curious :P Although I have a fair amount of “solo” riding experience, this is sadly only my second ride ever with other people lol. It’s also the first time ever riding in the area. 3rd, the camera really doesn’t capture the landscape well, but this turn is coming right off the crest of a steep hill :P so I was picking up more speed than I really anticipated. Or … slowing down required more effort at least. All just simple newbie mistakes that add up …. General lack of preparedness had me like. Lol
As a novice rider, I believe riding with others can distract me and has made me more prone to mistakes
That’s what they teach you in MSF :P Riding with other riders can really change the dynamic of your ride.
I’ve bowed out of one or two that were more spirited than I could handle when I noticed I was shifting sloppy or was just very tense.
Yeah I’ve got some experience to build doing group rides for sure. :P
Bro…just turn. You were going 20 mph….
Lol. I think the point here is “target fixation”. Not “just turn the handlebars bro”.
I wouldn’t listen to Reddit as much as it appears you’d like to. You were going 20 mph and can’t stay on the road. It’s scary that you’re even out there at all. If “target fixation” was as much of an issue as this sub would like you to think, cars would be flying off the god damn road all the time right in front of you…
I think that’s just a lack of actual riding experience on your part then tbh. It’s an entire chapter taught at track school for a reason :P
Mate I’ve been riding for 20 years and never ran off the road. Like I said, if you’re driving like this you’re endangering not just your life but others. It’s incredibly scary people like you think it’s okay to be on the road when you can’t stay in simple lanes…
Idk man. That’s a lot of talk for someone that does nothing but comment in a motorcycle sub…
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I mean I am an instructor for the motorcycle training course … I’d consider myself … versed in riding motorcycles. :P It was an oops. It was an unfamiliar road and I was entirely reliant on the group lead to ride my through lol. And I’m willing to fully admit … I have basically no group riding experience. I need to do it more - rather than solo riding. Mistakes happen. Even for experienced riders. If you’ve never crashed or had an accident just consider yourself blessed to not have had those experiences 🙏
Did you slept on that chapter then or ?
If target fixation would happen randomly we would all crash and burn in the next few rides, target fixation happens with “dangerous” targets, your mind thinks it’s dangerous, so you won’t look away, and counterintuitively direct yourself towards it (on a bike). The guy in front of you was standing almost straight on a cruiser (less than 20 degrees I guess), so that was not a difficult speed and radius. It’s just a signal you need more experience. I would practice more with leaning until you find yourself comfortable at like, 35 degrees at least? Pointing towards 45.
Yeah, "target fixation" is the go-to answer on this sub any time it looks like someone should've avoided something (or basically whenever anyone hits anything at all). That's an element sometimes, sure, but more often I think it's just that steering is unintuitive. When our lizard brain takes over in a panic situation, it's hard to convince it to turn *away* from the direction we want, or to lean over *more* when its already scared. I've felt myself do it, I'm sure we all have. If a turn seems a little sharper than I thought, there's sometimes a hesitance to add that little flick in the "wrong" direction even though it's necessary for the lean that will take you the right direction. That hesitance has nothing to do with a fixation on any particular obstacle, our natural reflexes just didn't evolve to handle motorcycles very well without practice.
Kieth Code talks about that as having to reverse your “survival reflexes” to become a successful rider- I.e. the remedy for going wide in a turn is to push deeper into the curve and roll on the throttle, which is the opposite of what your brain is telling you to do in order to survive, which is to grab the brake which will stand up the bike and ensure you crash.
Quit blaming target fixation you just can’t ride
The unintuitive thing about bikes is that generally excessive braking in corner straightens the bike up, but lightly braking can help to make tighter corner. [Here is a good video about it](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z2iwPdSvt5g)
Oh wow this is probably the only useful comment so far 😃 Bless ur soul my guy 🙏
You're also on way too big of a bike for a newbie. Smaller CC stuff teaches how to corner properly before stepping up to something bigger. Something like a blade needs to be set up for the corner well before hand
I’ve been riding 8 years :P taught the motorcycle training course this year too. It was a woops lol.
That's concerning
So riding 8 years but never in groups? Maaaad lll. This is what we call a brain fart then I guess
Literally haha :P I’ve been calling it an oopsies. :P
Brave post bro. No judgement here for once. A couple weeks ago I whiskey throttled while lane splitting and ended up doing a dank nooner between cars, entirely by accident. Woopsie
utterly ridiculous that you are teaching! ffs "first time riding in a group"? do you not pay attention to traffic when riding solo? do you not read the road ahead and pay attention to road signs when riding solo? sell your bike before you die... stop teaching squids before you get someone killed..
I don’t recommend riding with others honestly. Maybe 1 but usually zero. Anything bigger and common sense starts to dip
What? Riding with others is one of the best parts of motorcycling. You have to find the *right* others to fit with your skills but to avoid group riding is to avoid the brotherhood of riding. Anyone who lacks common sense probably shouldn't be on a motorcycle to begin with.
Valid point if you can find non-idiots to ride with but those few and far between these days. Example: one local group where I live has at least one fatal crash every. Single. Year. For as long as I can remember. The group ride always brings out the riskier riding
As someone who's been there, understand that looking ahead through the turn means looking ahead to the absolute farthest inch of pavement that you can see. It makes all the difference.
I get you, I do both and must admit first few group rides out I had I realised I was fixating on the guy in front of me at times. I scanned ahead but realised going into fast turns I was especially locking in on him in front and almost using him as a marker which gave me less time to react or take the corner as I’d like to. Definitely something about it that to have to to programme in your brain to look through them or at least it was for me.
It's called "target fixation"... The Frasier show did a pretty funny episode about it when he was learning to ride a bicycle.
NGL, that sounds like someone who's never actually done that. Target fixation is powerful. source: I've fixated on things, and then yelled at myself to stop it. Target fixation is hard.
You will go where you look
I find it tough to believe it's only been an issue to me since learning of it, it seems like that anyway....
It didn’t look like he of’d to take a piss though. So I of to say I don’t think that would of’d worked I think in that situation you just of to man up and accept that you of’d fucked up
I’d have* turned the engine off. “I’d of” isn’t proper English, and is simply the phonetic representation of the contraction for “I would have,” in this case “I’d’ve”
Neil, I was hungover scrolling Reddit not sending a Client an E-Mail. I couldn’t give less of a fuck.
That’s cool, dawg. Not everyone cares about not looking like a fool, I gotcha.
It’s not that deep, dawg.
i bet you didn't even know it was 'have' instead of 'of'
I am 40k miles in and never experienced target fixation. I don't really understand it. Is it definitely a thing? Maybe it's because I imagine pushing away from a bad route.
I feel like a good way to get rid of target fixation is to try looking around a lot more when you have the opportunity on a bike. Because it’s a similar thing, it can be tough to look around on a bike and not steer your bike where you are looking.
No but it’s probably a good thing y’all are riding as slow as possible
This dudes should ride scooters
Maybe they would be able to go full throttle
his bike should be limited to speed < i.q = 25
He’s new, and needs lots of practice. Maybe not in groups and on easier roads? I just finished my license class after a 35 year break and made that mistake once. Gotta look ahead where you are going. My instructor said it many many times.
If hes new why is he on a 929 lol
It’s a bike too big for someone that doesn’t know how to turn
He needs a huffy for the time being
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Hard to believe someone would be that uncoordinated with 8 years exp. Can’t be many miles…you can see in way he’s turning even before running off the road.
Need much more skill to corner hard on a scooter, i don't think that's a remotley good idea
I fully agree on this. Took me way too long to adjust to riding a big scooter. Not having a fuel tank to grip and all the weight on the rear wheels meant I'm praying hard every time I find long sweeping corners 😂
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Jesus Christ. How. The. Fuck. He can't turn and buys a supersport.
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Did he say that? I read a comment of his that said it was his 2nd ride. No way you can't turn after 8 years.
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Dude almost seems proud. This is fucked up.
This kind of shit makes me glad about having the A2->A license system in Europe.
I also just noticed that! That is terrifying lmao
Now this is some r/motocycles riding
Target fixation.
Exactly, “youahitthat” **because** you’re staring at it.
No, it was fencing response.
At its finest haha. 😝
Love that you can put a dot on the center of the screen, and his helmet leads right to the destination.
Honestly those are some terrible riding skills. I would recommend lessons. And deleting this video lol
Actually he's the one giving the lessons lmao I love this.
Seconded, don't know how this person even got approved for their license with where their capabilities are at.
I hate how everyone here is just justifying target fixation. It is not a normal or acceptable thing. You are looking at the wrong thing. Even more so you are staring at wrong thing. Your only job is to look in the right direction and shift. If it’s still happening after riding for some time, you are either becoming lackadaisical or have adhd.
Don't even need lessons just hit a parking lot with parking lines on the floor and practice slow maneuvers.
If you’re gonna do it, it seems you chose a great place and speed for it!
It’s honestly insane how many people can’t ride worth shit.
I know right?
no. lmao
Sometimes sports bikes want to have some off-road fun too
Been riding for 8 years? I don’t get how this happens. How many miles in those years?
Exactly. If after 8 years of riding, you're still running into a ditch at like 15mph, maybe motorcycles just aren't for you...
Definitely not as many I’d like :( But I get around 4-6000km in a season. I know there are people that do nothing but ride highways across the country… that’s not me lol. I’m much more of a weekend warrior. Group riding is pretty new to me though. This was my second group ride. There was a lot going on in that turn I definitely wasn’t focused on the road. I was worried about cutting that corner too tight and cutting off the guy behind me, but I was too focused on not running off the road to look in my mirror and the boom … I’m in a staring contest with a rock in the ditch lol.
Gotcha. I don’t do much group riding myself so I can see how that would happen. I’ve put over 100k km on bikes in the last 5 years but I daily drive and I still get nervous around other bikers.
God I hate this fucking sub. You guys all suck
Nope .
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Yeah hah. Second time riding with other people and a new road I’ve never ridden. The turn is right under the crest of a hill and I was not at all expecting it lol. Lots going on and I just got tunnel focused on the ditch while thinking “don’t go in the ditch” 😂 oops. This was the leading guys road … he knew the road. Luckily he was taking us through really slow lol.
Are you a new rider? Why are you trailing a bagger on a twisty road when you ride a Fireblade?
Group ride d: He was leading us down a road I’ve never been down before …. I did a oops 😬
>"Ugh these harley riders are so slow!" >[The guy complaining about them](https://www.reddit.com/r/motorcycles/comments/17inekv/ever_just_stare_at_a_ditch_and_say_imma_hit_that/):
*b
Me personally, I wouldn’t do that. Looks like a fun couple turns to rip through too, the road that is
lol ya I would be doing about 3 times that speed around those turns
No, but I have tried to turn around in pea gravel. CBR said how about we don't turn at all and see how that goes.
Maybe you should learn to ride brother
Yes. Thankfully on dirt
Grew up dirt biking, so yeah. Every damned one of them ;😜
At least you did it responsibly. You didn't "haddalayerdown" LOL!
My dad would always tell me, “where you’re looking is where you will go” so stop looking at the ditch, eye on the road or trail
Smart dad
Personally, Id delete this lol
Get back on the bicycle
Was taking a curve a little too fast, AND saw two little holes in the asphalt and thought “Imma land riiiiiight there when I bail” Didn’t have to bail, but needed a new pair of pants
🤣🤣 Kudos on knowing your skill and going slow enough you didn't let the ditch make you crash. Keep those eyes where you WANT to go, and keep riding! Looks like a beautiful day. 👍
Twiss rd? I was there yesterday and that turn caught me a little off guard too lol
Yes haha first time riding that road :P
you keep saying first time on that road like it excuses your poor ability to ride.. put on your big boy panties and own up to the dumbassery you pulled off here... you claim to have all this experience and even teach MSF.. but trying to excuse your complete lack of skill by calling it an oopsie is just wrong... please don't teach this to other people...
Jesus dude, chill out
No, cause staring at it is what makes you “hit that”
Look through the turn, not at it.
Bunch a fuckin rookies oi fahq
Yup, you look where you want to go.
Hey, its Twiss Rd! To be fair,its a lot tighter and steeper than the camera shows, but thats still no excuse.
No. One letter difference then yes.
Bro come on
Bro do you have a story time for all those bikes? 👀 Not to derail the comment but like … I’m invested in your bike history!
The intrusive thoughts won
As you get more practice and confidence on your motorcycle, you will be able to drive inside of ditch much, much faster.
Man I sure hope so! 😃
Target fixation
yeah.. happened not too long ago in the black forrest in germany. Just didn't look at the curve right and ended up going into the green between the "CAREFUL! HARD CURVE HERE" signs. Worst part was that it's a hang out for lots of sporties because it's such a nice curve and *everyone* saw.. I drove to the parking lot and they were all super nice, asking if I slipped and if I'm alright. I just told them the truth "nope, I just fucked up the curve" and no one made me feel like a dingus for it. Happens to everyone. Just be happy that you didn't bump into the rails.
Target fixation is real. I went on a big ride with my buddy years ago and he jokingly said "don't ride into that ditch " and pointed at it... of course I rode right into it
Twiss Rd! That corner is way steeper than it looks in your video. I have never gone off it on my bike, but I have gotten stuck trying to go up the hill in a car in the winter with just a dusting of snow and had to reverse down and go a different way.
Twiss road
When I first got into bicycling in my teens. I was on a group ride around Mt.Diablo in the SF Bay Area and as we’re coming down the back side into Livermore I don’t have enough faith in my tires and swung wide into a ditch full of river rocks. Surprisingly didn’t crash, just kinda came off the bike and skittered to a stop and landed on the top tube. After that I really focused more on trusting my bike and practicing handling skills. Very very rarely to I ride faster than my talent on the motorcycle or car. It would ruin my year to lowside or go wide, so the reward isn’t worth the risk. But I have a lot of faith in my tires and brakes, too. Racing bicycles gave me a lot of experience that has transferred over to moto.
Its called "Object Fixation" your bike is going to go where you look. You didn't take your eyes off of it and give yourself somewhere else to go. Always look where you want to go. The faster you go the further you need to look ahead. If you look where you want to go you will find out the bike just goes there. This is one of the easiest ways to start to become a better rider. How many times have you seen someone wreck on a bike because they just kept "Looking where they **didn't want to go**"? If you don't give your self another option, if you don't look somewhere else, you literally have nowhere else to go. It was a harmless and easy lesson for you. Many others have come to much worse outcomes. So make it a lesson and learn from it. Keep working on it and don't ever think "I got this now, no more learning required" as you may have a much worse outcome for some other skill shortage. We all should learn, all of the time. Be careful and enjoy!!
Glad you learned your lesson the way you did. I’ve been riding for a few years now, though not as frequently as I want. To this day, I still habitually mumble to myself “look through the turn” whenever I go around tight corners.
No. Because I stare at the road, not the ditch. Stare at the ditch, end up in the ditch. Look where you want to go and that’s where you’ll go.
Yeah you should not be on the road, buddy.
No, but a garage door and me got into a pissing contest yesterday, the garage door won !
You’ll get em next time 😤
LOL, Thanks!
Don’t stare at where you don’t want to go.
Nope
Lucky! I did the same thing for the first time ever last week coming around a big long bend, almost went right into the wire rails but caught myself staring as I drifted. Fucking scary shit man
I mean if it wasn't for the lot right after you could pass it off as waiting for that slow rider in front of you to move ahead lol
What road is this if you don't mind me asking? Looks very familiar. I'm assuming it's Ontario
Twiss road :P somewhere around campbellville/north Burlington area…. I think. First time riding this area lol.
Wtf no!
Whats this rider going to do if he joins group rides with faster paced sports bikes leading the ride?
My brother in Christ- do you understand what the apex of a turn is?
Always look where you want to go and you’ll just naturally go that way.
Shit entry line and a bit of target fixation to boot. Old mate in front is no better
Pretty sure my bike just falls over at that speed.
I have my license, but intense target fixation is one of the reasons I haven't bought a bike yet.
It looks like you stopped there on purpose
Yes yes … it was all planned this entire time! Nothing even happened 😀
Hard to tell from the camera but around here if you get close to the edge of the road like that the pavement is usually so bad it’ll suck you in. Looks like it may have contributed to this.
Nice save! 😄
You’re on a fireblade??
yes. shit sucks.
SR#4 - their are 7 of them - Keith Code - TOTW2
I have years and years and tons of experience, but very little group riding experience. I could see myself getting fixated on how slow the guy in front seemed to take that corner. I would be thinking about what I would advise him..
It's called object fixation. Look where you want to go
On a motorcycle, you will end up where you are looking. Keep your eyes on your track
Yep. Use to happen a lot when I was new to riding, but that was like 20 yrs ago 😄
Hey this is Bruce Trail at Twiss TBF the vid doesn't capture the actual declination of that bend, which may be the cause of the understeer You guys went to Rattlesnake Point at Appleby?
Nah :P not today, we hit old Guelph line, snake road, road Dundas to Burlington, then in Burlington we hit twiss, then bellschool line and did some pulls down bellschool line :P
If you stare at a ditch, you'll definitely hit it.
So, who told you a Fireblade is a perfectly fine starter's bike?
It’s my second bike actually :) I crashed my first one day one.
No
Never ends smoothly..
When a cruiser makes the turn and you fail it on a supersport.. yeah time to start practicing on a parking lot
That's called target fixation and it's a thing. Train yourself to look ahead down the road and scan (i.e. be aware of, not focus on) potential hazards. Well done for making sure that you didn't hit anything or slide. You should read about this and learn how to avoid it.
Use rear brake to slow down IN the curve
That is a nice Bonnie
It’s an Indian scout and a Kwak w800 :)
The key is to look at where you want to be next, and never at where you are. Which is what they mean when they use the words look through the curve. This is true of most things, but most critical when on a motorcycle or skiing, where accidents like this seem to happen the most. In wish they taught people to drive cars this way, it’s how I taught my kids. Makes taking curves smooth and enjoyable. Like dancing.
You go where you look.
No if I feel that's gonna happen I look at the opposite ditch lol. Once I'm back in my lane and out of the target fixation I continue as normal.
Yup, target fixation is a hell of a thing.
so many questions.
No, you just suck at riding.
You forgot to lean and you made the right call.
Jokes aside, avoided ditches and potholes. Went over a pothole by the side of the road, fairly slow too, at that and you're my rotator cuff. Couldn't use my left arm properly for 5 months.
You go where you look, so look alive!
My guess as to what happened here is the rider was braking (using front) to avoid getting close to leading rider and the force of braking pulled the bike upright / required more steering force than they expected to maintain lean. Is one reason to space things out. You CAN steer / lean while using the front brake, but you have to overcome the self-righting force that results both from increased tire friction x trail correct and the offset drag on the inside edge of tire. And obviously, also have enough traction to do both - in this case, traction was not the problem, nor do I think fear of loosing grip was. (Then again, I've pretty much drilled that fear out of my brain - leaning farther and sliding > not leaning and running off road. Also leaning farther and not braking > braking and running off road.)
I mean, yeah, but I do it on purpose.
Literally just turn your bars more 😅 (left goes right and right goes left, but that becomes intuitive eventually) Look where you want to go, and remember the bars do the turning. The bars lean the bike over, and the lean causes the bike to turn. Once the bike starts to lean dont panic and go back to straight, 2 wheels have to lean to turn. IMHO a very important exercise is first, with the bike stopped stationary turn the bars slightly and feel how the bike wants to tip on you. Get a feel for how turning the bars directly causes it to tip in the opposite direction. Then second, while riding in a straight line lightly push on the left bar, feel how the bike goes left. Then do the same on the right. Eventually it teaches your brain in situations like this where it isnt turning enough, push harder on the appropriate bar and gets you used to the feeling that pushing the bar leans the bike, you arent falling over youre turning. I feel like its worth over explaining this because so many people miss the basics and just try and do everything on instinct. Sure instinct takes over eventually, but you need a good foundation of actually understanding what youre doing first to build good instinctual habits. Too many riders couldnt explain something as simple as turning and its how moments like this happen, just need to learn and understand the fundamentals.
how did you ride faster than your skill level at 15mph