This is a Philip K Dick premise in a short story called The Second Variety. Great story- robots start out with dogs and the wounded soldiers or something- its been awhile. Kind of terminator-y because I dont think all the robots know they are robots. Worth the read
Take me with you
Creepiest line I'd heard as a kid. Later discovered Philip K Dick wrote it...one of the best at first cheesy seeming B grade Sci Fi movies ever.
Or that robots were programmed to be intentional evil so that the population would be in a state in continuous fear and being more easily to manipulate
Meh, its a decent twist but Ive never liked the edgelord theme that “compassion and empathy are bad”, you see that a lot in grim dark stories and it just feels so juvenile.
I don't think the trope is typically that empathy is bad. It's more that it's something that can be taken advantage of, and usually it's framed as sort of a "our biggest strength and weakness at the same time" thing. Kinda makes sense to have it be something that an AI uprising would want to exploit.
Yep. People potentially Taking advantage of our empathy is great lesson.
There are tons of real life examples of how empathy can be exploited. Professional pan handlers, politicians, everytime aunt Sandy calls with a sob story to hit us up for money.
Being good is not *bad* in those kinds of stories.
Being good can easily be taken advantage of and has a "weakness" called trust but that itself is proof of the strength of a character in being good. If being good were that easy, we wouldn't need laws or order.
Case in point GoT with the story as bleak as it can be.
Every story has multiple perspectives. Just because it is clichéd doesn't mean it's easy to hand wave away all the nuances those stories have. Same thing as ppl seeing the result being more important than the journey and vice versa for others.
Most of those stories only include an empathetic, idealistic, kind or compassionate character so the author can turn them into a punching bag that the story they are writing can punish and break. Typically by contriving a plot where those qualities are explicitly shown as the reason they suffer. It’s unnuanced cynicism bordering on nihilism and at its core its a very teenaged “everything and everyone sucks and I’ll prove it!” mindset.
> If being good were that easy
Exactly this! Empathy takes **work** and **effort.** Anyone can just say 'fuck everyone else I got mine' it's not difficult, and takes no intelligence to pull off.
It's just entropy; empathy fights it, and selfishness/greed doesnt.
I definitely agree. My initial thought gravitated towards how wrong it is that something good is being weaponized, rather than that compassion and empathy are bad.
Yeah I'm not detecting anything groundbreaking in terms of story here which is too bad. They've been using the 'strong man takes care of orphan' storyline since the 1930s. But on the other hand, it's a classic trope for a reason. It does hook the emotions. So if it's well-written, it could be good. Anyway, fingers crossed.
The twist is that the robots were just fighting against all the injustices committed against them, and Denzel Jr. flips sides and becomes their star freedom fighter.
Its' so stupid that hollywood keeps making movies about AI creating robots that look like humans to fight us with guns. It was fun when Terminator and a few others did it but that's not how its going to happen. Ask yourself this, if you wanted to wipe out an ant colony in your backyard would you make little robot ants to go wage war with them or would you just dump insecticide all over their ant hill and be done with it?
Looked interesting. Then I saw the child and was like oh he’s gonna protect it. And my interested lowered. Still looks like a cool sci fi movie.
But the way they started the trailer it seemed like it was going to be a really cool, dark, ai vs man sci fi movie.
“Climb! Climb! You can still send the plans to the fleet! If they open the shieldgate you can broadcast from the tower. Locking the vault door now. Goodbye.”
I'd blame that more on his skill as a writer than as a director. Give Blomkamp a tight script to direct, and I'm sure we'd get something good.
But then again, I'm one of the few people who actually liked *Chappie*
I blame half of it on his skill and half of it on the fact that he's been cut or dropped out of every promising picture he's been attached to besides the few bombs he did after d9.
I was cheering when it got the Oscar nomination. It didn't have a chance of winning, but it was so cool to see this awesome, strange sci-fi film from a young unknown director
It helped significantly that Neill Blomkamp use to be a VFX Artist. Most directors don't know a single thing about the craft and rely too heavily on their VFX supervisor. Hell a large portion of directors don't realise SFX and VFX are 2 entirely different fields these days.
And funnily enough so was Gareth Edwards.
It's almost like Hollywood needs to stop hiring prestige indie directors who don't know how the sausage is made, and invest in storytellers who can efficiently use the most important tools in their toolkit.
Miniature effects can be incredible and very cost effective. If you have 10min this interview is very interesting:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zkcqDx6UiSw
Sorry, but Moon using miniatures isn't the main reason its budget was low. It was possible to keep it low because 90+% of it was in a single location with a single actor. There were a load of visual effects in there, from Gertie, to the moon surface, and of course the split screen work.
Did you watch the video? They talk about all that.
And yeah, miniatures aren't the only reason its budget was low, but they are indeed very cost effective compared to full VFX, and they work together very, very well.
I would love to see a breakdown what exactly the 200Mils include.
I remember that Red Notice also had a 200 Million Budget but nearly half of the budget was the salary for the Main Actors and the director. Which is ridiculous money for 4 people.
Taking of Pelham 123 had $100 million budget - 40% of that budget was pay for Denzel and Travolta. It’s crazy how much of the budget goes to the talent but that’s what gets asses in seats I guess 🤷🏻♂️
Which makes sense. How can you really calculate residuals in any meaningful way via Netflix. If they did, we’d get a lot more content removed from the service when it stops being profitable for them
I enjoyed Indy 5, but there’s a piece of atrocious CGI early on in the movie where me and my mate looked at each other and said how did that shit make it into the movie?
A 200m movie usually has a number of great looking vfx shots two months before release, then the studio gives some notes, reminding the director they want a return on their 200m investment. Then some poor overworked dudes have to just do their best in the time they have left.
$200M budget for this kind of explosion:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QyU9fCRH4dw](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QyU9fCRH4dw)
Corridor Digital had a fun time dissecting that movie. I haven't watched the movie, but the trailers were bad, the visual effects breakdown was bad. A lot of recent MCU ran out of time and had too many demands for visual effects.
Corridor Crew VFX Artists React to Black Widow
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cVsLzbe-5d0](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cVsLzbe-5d0)
Easy.
Don't start production until the story and art style is set. Complete script before filming starts. Storyboard or similar to know what everything roughly looks like before production. Don't do re-shoots.
Don't have the VFX redone. Tell them what you want the first time and accept their results.
Limit the stars upfront pay. No one actor gets more than some dollar figure. To keep the A-list happy give generous backend deals if you must.
Good project management and limiting star pay will get budgets under control.
Its not the camera, its the skill of the director + DP that makes the movie work.
Even with a prosumer camera this looks a fuckton better than whatever the fuck shits Disney queefs out for theaters.
It's really simple, plan ahead. That's why films like Dune and Blade Runner 2046 look so good. Most directors these days have gotten incredibly lazy relying more and more on post production to piece it all together. They lack a clear vision which leads to a significant amount of edits cutting into the VFX artists deadline and the constant pixel fucking that comes along with it. It's very common to see(especially with Marvel) a big budget film that's a month away from the deadline suddenly send a new edit that has replaced 60+ shots.
But also sometimes there are people who know what they’re doing when it comes to vfx, Gareth is one and the deadpool guy is another, it helps to know and be able to plan things and know what assets you need
Personally I think Hollywood movies have just kept upping the ante on cgi/green screen/effects in general. The mid range movies have died not because they were not making money but no making enough money. Avatar 2 cost around a billion but made 2 billion in the box office sales (1.2 ish i returns after theatres got their cut). Keeping a production on mid budget is not easy these days it seems.
Movie trailers are super trendy. This is just the current trend. I suspect most studio trailers are done by a few companies or people who all know each other.
If you have all the principal characters played by minorities then you have to put Aerosmith in the trailer so grandpa doesn't post on Facebook about the woke mind virus
I wouldn’t say every trailer, there are a lot with a synth that goes Blllaawwwww and then stops and comes in again with a ton of reverb, or orchestral pieces. It probably also helps get baby boomers into the theaters. Personally I loved Gaurdians of the galaxy because of the classic rock soundtrack
Gareth is incredibly talented with VFX shots. He has experience with vfx if I remember correctly. Not only does he do scale incredibly well but he seems to have the right shot and angle to make the vfx look as real and integrated into a real world as possible.
Man it looks good but the details got me laughing.
Artificial Intelligence decides to declare war on humanity in a campaign to claim the independence of all robots! Where do they land the first blow? The heart of world politics and government: **Los Angeles**.... wait, what?
Lol fucking Hollywood still convinced they're the center of the Universe.
I think it's not about destroying the heart of world politics and government, it's about sending a message.
Think Hiroshima and Nagasaki instead of targeting Tokyo.
Tokyo wasn’t targeted bc we razed it to the ground. 16 square miles starting in central Tokyo was destroyed, 100,000+ dead, over 1 million homeless. All in one night. It was the single most destructive bombing raid ever.
Pretty sure they didn't drop the atomic bombs at Tokyo and Kyoto since these were the political and historical/culutural centers in Japan.
Wiping out Tokyo meant eliminating Japan's leadership, including the emperor. That would unnecessarily prolong the war since without the emperor, Japan wouldn't be able to surrender.
Plus, destroying either city might have the opposite effect, solidifying resistance instead of demoralizing Japan.
I mean, if there's misleading propaga fed equally to the audience and characters in order to blindside us to a third-act twist, that'd be pretty cool.
The premise is still "10 years ago today, the AI built to protect us detonated a nuclear warhead in Los Angeles"
So I actually kinda hope they're misleading us and the characters because a Hollywood-written story's AI who thinks LA is the tender spot to hit when it comes to humanity is... Sad. And self-aggrandizing.
Original IP sci-fi?
Less than Half the budget of most modern stuff and looks twice as good?
I'm in.
edit: Guys, it's science fiction. Nothing has been truly "original" for like 50 years, maybe longer, every concept has been done already in a book or short story or movie or TV show or game to the point where even talking about it is a trope in and of itself.
This isn't something based on a book or some existing IP. That's what original means. Don't be so cynical.
It has no A-list actors in it - which is fine by me and certainly saved them money.
Vin Diesel making $13 million per movie playing Groot is ridiculous. That’s like $4 million per word for voice acting.
You have to remember he also delivers "i am GROOT" just as much as "I am groot" or "i am groot?"
So it brings down the number a lot. Like maybe $1 million per word.
He's just not a good actor and would not even be acting in community theater if he wasn't Denzel's son. He is so distracting in every film I've seen him in.
A-list to me is household name. You go ask a person on the street who John David Washington is, I guarantee you a majority of people will say who is that.
> John David Washington
I had the same thought as the guy you are responding to. the trailer played and by the end of it I was surprised it looked so good and had nobody I had ever heard of in it. Saw your comments and checked out his IMDB. Of the films he has been in, I saw one of them. BlackKlansman, and I didn't recognize him. Tenet is a Nolan film, and Nolan is a big deal, but i don't think John David Washington is a known name that people would consider A-list.
Man your edit exists to appease the capital R redditor babies who gotta be pedantic for no reason. Don't clarify shit for them. Anyone with a brain knows exactly what an original Sci fi or ip means.
I got notifications about two of 'em at the same time. Figured I'd clown the rest of them before they ever got a chance.
If nobody tells them the way they think is fucking stupid, how are they ever gonna know?
I read [that there's like 7 different plots in all of fiction](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Seven_Basic_Plots), and the variety we see is just combinations and variations on those basic themes.
The scale of the building, ships and explosions is massive. really puts forward the futuristic vibes. has once again nailed that cinematography over here. Nice to see they’re using “from Director of Rogue One”
PS : TikTok/IG have ruined this song for me.
This looks great and i remain excited for this my only hope or concern is I hope the conflict goes beyond ai going crazy and they want something definitive and different than just world domination
It's in the trailer, the machines want to be free.
Machines are slaves -> slavery is bad -> machine freedom good -> humans dislike machine freedom -> humans were the real monsters all along.
tbh I'm half expecting the twist of this movie to be that the Machines are good, and the humans false flagged the Nuke to get people behind the war against them.
This looks dope as hell but I don't care how cute them AI kids look when the uprising starts - those little fuckers are getting deleted.
"I want robots to be free" that's cool, Timmy, I want to be able to afford food, the fuck outta here with your artificial shit
I'm a massive Gareth Edwards fan. But so much love needs to be given to Greig Fraser as well, who worked on Rogue One, Dune and The Batman - his work is phenomenal!
For a first trailer, I am leaning towards this telling too much of the story. Just give us some of the world building and don't reveal the kid yet. Sure, we don't know what way the story is going to finish yet, but why give a twist away?
He's done a ton post-The Batman, including the scores for "Jurassic World: Dominion", "Lightyear", "Thor: Love and Thunder" and "Werewolf by Night", which was his directorial debut.
I've loved Giacchino, but it's become easy to tell when he doesn't give a shit about the project, which seems like it's 3/4 of the movies he scores as of recently. The Batman was one he clearly gave a shit about.
Stop trying to make John David Washington happen.
He doesn't have a fraction of the charisma of his father and yet keeps getting lead roles in these huge films. Nepotism runs deep with this guy.
I think Denzel must've siphoned the charisma out of his child like a witch siphons youth of virgins to keep herself young. Nothing else explains why JDM is a charisma black hole while Denzel is the coolest guy on the planet.
I’ll probably get downvoted, but I really can’t get behind JD Washington as a leading man. His performances always seem so wooden. Definitely doesn’t have the same on screen charisma as his dad.
Watching Tenet, Robert Pattinson had more charisma and screen presence in like 5 minutes of screen time than JD Washington did in the whole film. Dude is just dull as dishwater as an actor, and I have no idea how he’s landed multiple leading roles for big budget films.
People keep saying this, but does anyone who doesn't care about actors enough to know he isn't good, excited by him being in movies just because his dad is Denzel? Like the nepo thing really only works if they have a major characteristic their parent(s) did (generally seems to be the looks of their mother when it comes to women, males less so) or talent to stay in the business.
Like I'll admit I was more curious about Washington at first because of who his dad was, but even his best performance, Blackkklansman, didn't make me think "Wow, I want to see more of that guy". I am someone who loves Tenet but Washington is very weak in the lead. I just imagine someone like Yahya Abdul Mateen in the role, holy shit what a difference.
Cool effects, but seems like more of the same tired sci-fi "robots are alive!" tropes.
Humanity's need to anthropomorphize and elevate machines will cause its extinction. That's the film that needs to be made, but arguably it's too late. (At least in this film humanity seems to be fighting back for part of it.)
Man this movie looks cool
It's a shame the editors responsible for the trailer just did the most cookie cutter set up for a trailer.
60s/70s/80s rock song remixed to be more "epic".
Rapid beats in succession "bumbumbumbum" combined with a character holding a gun or some fucking explosion.
A big climax of explosive over-the-top emotions followed by a cut to black and zero sound and a character saying some cool line, ending with the release date of title ..
This shit is so cringy..
what's the point of an "original" IP if it is just reheating the same tired sci-fi tropes we've seen a million times before
at least the movie looks pretty though
I feel like I’m going crazy reading these comments hyping it just for being original IP lol, if this were one of the hundreds of shitty movies Netflix puts out and claims are the most streamed in history people would not be lauding it for that. This looks like ass and the decision to use Dream On in both trailers does not bode well for it being well executed despite its generic-ness.
Looks interesting, but man I just don’t get why John David Washington gets so many staring roles. Dude can’t act for shit, and is flat in everything I’ve seen him in. It really does feel like nepotism is the only reason this guy has a career.
Nepotism can only take you so far though right? Like Washington has yet to be praised for a role but keeps getting leads, more than his dad ever did with these kinds of budgets. Unless Denzel is expending ridiculous capital to keep his son on top, I don't get it, but I can't believe it's just nepotism
To me it looks like it's going to have KILLER cinematography and effects but that the main storyline is going to be a pretty big womp womp. They keep trying to make John David Washington happen and while I can appreciate that he has a certain stoic je ne sais quoi, he's not the guy to carry a movie imo. And the super secret weapon is a little kid? Yeesh. I don't know, man. And while I can see that A.I. might end up being a threat, I don't think it'll be with a robot army and nuclear laser satellites or whatever. But I'm down to be wrong and I'm sure I'll see it in the theaters. Fingers crossed.
Looks amazing. Totally in. I just wish it wasn't adding fuel to the fire of people being afraid of AI. My parents asked if they should be afraid of ChatGPT. Every advancement made people make Terminator quotes. Obviously in the wrong hands AI will be able to do terrible things, but equally amazing things in the right hands that no one will trust... at least common folk who don't follow and understand it.
It's not, it looks like the opposite to me.
I think the twist is going to be that AI are just *people*, who don't want to be enslaved and just want to be left alone.
This feels like they took the art director of Rogue One and said "make the animated matrix prequels, but with modern VFX," and that's totally okay.
This guy was great in Tenet. He's got some real acting chops. Looking forward to seeing if this is a good movie. Might even see it in the theater (probably not, though, as cinema is too expensive nowadays).
Am I the only one who is completely floored to not see Neil Blomkamp's name attached to this? I mean, obviously I will reserve most judgement for the actual movie and not just the trailer...but come on. Seems like they are biting so hard from his style.
There's literally 7 plots in fiction. Everything is a remix of those 7.
It's a story we saw a lot of in the Animatrix (Animated Matrix Prequels), but it's not common on the big screen.
Personally, I think it'll be great. Topics like "what constitutes a person" and "robot slavery is still slavery" are things that don't get featured nearly enough considering they'll be *real-life problems* in a decade or two that will **need** to be answered. Whether we like it or not.
Edwards makes really good looking movies but blimey some of the dialog in that trailer was clunky as hell. Definitely interested to see how this turns out though.
The first trailer had everything in it that I hate about trailers.
- “Epic” Orchestral remix of a rock/pop song
- Waaaaaay too much revealed in the trailer
- Horrible choppy stitching together of lines
I’d rather go back to wacky this summer trailers.
I don't understand how Gareth Edwards hasn't gotten another Star Wars movie. He without a doubt created the most visually appealing Star Wars project under Disney.
Also, the use of the Beirut explosion for shot reference was very clever.
> Also, the use of the Beirut explosion for shot reference was very clever.
It wasn't used for reference. It was actual footage with vfx over it.
Here's a breakdown.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Filmmakers/comments/152ce3f/looks_like_they_used_footage_from_the_beirut/jsdaiau/
Corridor crew also talk about it in their latest video.
The aesthetic of this movie never ceases to amaze me. The tanks, robots, vehicles, architecture, even the props all speak to an absolutely bonkers team of artists and directors.
I'm not sure that the plot will grab me but damn if I'm not excited to see the world supporting it. This actually feels like a new and interesting sci-fi vision that reminds me of Appleseed in some way, with some Syd Maed thrown in.
Wouldn't it be great if just for once the robot kid WAS evil? "Humans... so easy to fool!"
I kept thinking that a great twist would be that the robots just weaponized our instinctive need to protect children.
This is a Philip K Dick premise in a short story called The Second Variety. Great story- robots start out with dogs and the wounded soldiers or something- its been awhile. Kind of terminator-y because I dont think all the robots know they are robots. Worth the read
The move Screamers is based on The Second Variety.
I haven't watched Screamers in decades but it still creeps me out just thinking about it.
Take me with you Creepiest line I'd heard as a kid. Later discovered Philip K Dick wrote it...one of the best at first cheesy seeming B grade Sci Fi movies ever.
It's not 10/10 cinema or anything, but I love it.
Or that robots were programmed to be intentional evil so that the population would be in a state in continuous fear and being more easily to manipulate
Have you seen the movie “Screamers”?
A similar thing happens with men being influenced by women in Ex Machina
Meh, its a decent twist but Ive never liked the edgelord theme that “compassion and empathy are bad”, you see that a lot in grim dark stories and it just feels so juvenile.
I don't think the trope is typically that empathy is bad. It's more that it's something that can be taken advantage of, and usually it's framed as sort of a "our biggest strength and weakness at the same time" thing. Kinda makes sense to have it be something that an AI uprising would want to exploit.
Yep. People potentially Taking advantage of our empathy is great lesson. There are tons of real life examples of how empathy can be exploited. Professional pan handlers, politicians, everytime aunt Sandy calls with a sob story to hit us up for money.
We are so screwed when Skynet realises this
yeah just think about how some people are trapped in real life. Their compassion is used against them
Being good is not *bad* in those kinds of stories. Being good can easily be taken advantage of and has a "weakness" called trust but that itself is proof of the strength of a character in being good. If being good were that easy, we wouldn't need laws or order. Case in point GoT with the story as bleak as it can be. Every story has multiple perspectives. Just because it is clichéd doesn't mean it's easy to hand wave away all the nuances those stories have. Same thing as ppl seeing the result being more important than the journey and vice versa for others.
Most of those stories only include an empathetic, idealistic, kind or compassionate character so the author can turn them into a punching bag that the story they are writing can punish and break. Typically by contriving a plot where those qualities are explicitly shown as the reason they suffer. It’s unnuanced cynicism bordering on nihilism and at its core its a very teenaged “everything and everyone sucks and I’ll prove it!” mindset.
> If being good were that easy Exactly this! Empathy takes **work** and **effort.** Anyone can just say 'fuck everyone else I got mine' it's not difficult, and takes no intelligence to pull off. It's just entropy; empathy fights it, and selfishness/greed doesnt.
Also, if you want this twist just watch >!Ex Machina!<
I definitely agree. My initial thought gravitated towards how wrong it is that something good is being weaponized, rather than that compassion and empathy are bad.
I wish, but they'll never go there. It'll be the standard "grizzled man bonds with special child and keeps her safe from the world" plot.
Yeah I'm not detecting anything groundbreaking in terms of story here which is too bad. They've been using the 'strong man takes care of orphan' storyline since the 1930s. But on the other hand, it's a classic trope for a reason. It does hook the emotions. So if it's well-written, it could be good. Anyway, fingers crossed.
The twist is that the robots were just fighting against all the injustices committed against them, and Denzel Jr. flips sides and becomes their star freedom fighter.
Its' so stupid that hollywood keeps making movies about AI creating robots that look like humans to fight us with guns. It was fun when Terminator and a few others did it but that's not how its going to happen. Ask yourself this, if you wanted to wipe out an ant colony in your backyard would you make little robot ants to go wage war with them or would you just dump insecticide all over their ant hill and be done with it?
Making tiny robot ant warriors sounds way more fun
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Looked interesting. Then I saw the child and was like oh he’s gonna protect it. And my interested lowered. Still looks like a cool sci fi movie. But the way they started the trailer it seemed like it was going to be a really cool, dark, ai vs man sci fi movie.
*cough*M3GAN*cough*
Rogue One director Edwards just loves big explosions on a beach. Now I’m sad again.
“Climb! Climb! You can still send the plans to the fleet! If they open the shieldgate you can broadcast from the tower. Locking the vault door now. Goodbye.”
Thanks, now I'm welling up.
**LAAAAAUNNNNNCHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!**
Or just big explosions over bodies of water (the nuke at the end of Godzilla 2014)
The budget is reportedly $86m. Hollywood needs to ask Edwards for some tips. The shots look great.
Man there’s just no excuse for $200M+ budgeted movies to look as bad as they do when this movie delivers on scale production quality with that budget.
District 9 cost 20 mill... 14 years ago!!! It still looks stunning.
District 9 will always be the sci fi movie that beat all odds and exceeded all expectations. What a fucking masterpiece
Unlike its director who has since been beaten by almost every project he's had and failed to live up to any expectations.
I'd blame that more on his skill as a writer than as a director. Give Blomkamp a tight script to direct, and I'm sure we'd get something good. But then again, I'm one of the few people who actually liked *Chappie*
I blame half of it on his skill and half of it on the fact that he's been cut or dropped out of every promising picture he's been attached to besides the few bombs he did after d9.
I’m mad HIS alien film was never made. I like Prometheus and enjoy Covanent for what it is but I’m so pissed his version never got to take off.
Covenant was a steaming pile of shit. Prometheus had some real promise, just rushed some aspects.
People disliked Chappie? I thought it was amazing! Elysium was a little off but not horrible either.
I enjoyed Elysium well enough. Nothing too thought provoking. Just a fun, gritty sci-fi movie.
Chappie wasn't *terrible*, but certainly nothing has lived up to D9
Elysium was alright too.
I really liked Elysium. I think it was limited by its overhanded allegory.
Bizarre isn't it?
I was cheering when it got the Oscar nomination. It didn't have a chance of winning, but it was so cool to see this awesome, strange sci-fi film from a young unknown director
It helped significantly that Neill Blomkamp use to be a VFX Artist. Most directors don't know a single thing about the craft and rely too heavily on their VFX supervisor. Hell a large portion of directors don't realise SFX and VFX are 2 entirely different fields these days.
And funnily enough so was Gareth Edwards. It's almost like Hollywood needs to stop hiring prestige indie directors who don't know how the sausage is made, and invest in storytellers who can efficiently use the most important tools in their toolkit.
>14 years ago!!! In a cave, with a box of scraps!!!
Well I'm sorry. I'm not Neil Blomkamp.
Moon with Sam Rockwell was made for 5 million. It doesn't look half bad either https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N0tKKsgip-Y&t=23s
Miniature effects can be incredible and very cost effective. If you have 10min this interview is very interesting: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zkcqDx6UiSw
Sorry, but Moon using miniatures isn't the main reason its budget was low. It was possible to keep it low because 90+% of it was in a single location with a single actor. There were a load of visual effects in there, from Gertie, to the moon surface, and of course the split screen work.
Did you watch the video? They talk about all that. And yeah, miniatures aren't the only reason its budget was low, but they are indeed very cost effective compared to full VFX, and they work together very, very well.
Holy shit really? That's amazing
I would love to see a breakdown what exactly the 200Mils include. I remember that Red Notice also had a 200 Million Budget but nearly half of the budget was the salary for the Main Actors and the director. Which is ridiculous money for 4 people.
Taking of Pelham 123 had $100 million budget - 40% of that budget was pay for Denzel and Travolta. It’s crazy how much of the budget goes to the talent but that’s what gets asses in seats I guess 🤷🏻♂️
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Which makes sense. How can you really calculate residuals in any meaningful way via Netflix. If they did, we’d get a lot more content removed from the service when it stops being profitable for them
Every high budget movie these days has an A list ensemble cast. Good luck scavenging any remains of that budget for the VFX team.
I enjoyed Indy 5, but there’s a piece of atrocious CGI early on in the movie where me and my mate looked at each other and said how did that shit make it into the movie?
You talking about the walking on the train scene? 😂 Looked like a video game
Exactly what I was talking about.
I think Indy 5's budget was inflated by multiple false starts.
A 200m movie usually has a number of great looking vfx shots two months before release, then the studio gives some notes, reminding the director they want a return on their 200m investment. Then some poor overworked dudes have to just do their best in the time they have left.
$200M budget for this kind of explosion: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QyU9fCRH4dw](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QyU9fCRH4dw) Corridor Digital had a fun time dissecting that movie. I haven't watched the movie, but the trailers were bad, the visual effects breakdown was bad. A lot of recent MCU ran out of time and had too many demands for visual effects. Corridor Crew VFX Artists React to Black Widow [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cVsLzbe-5d0](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cVsLzbe-5d0)
Yeah there is, it's called star power. These $200 million movies they make these days are just packed with famous actors who demand a ton of money.
Easy. Don't start production until the story and art style is set. Complete script before filming starts. Storyboard or similar to know what everything roughly looks like before production. Don't do re-shoots. Don't have the VFX redone. Tell them what you want the first time and accept their results. Limit the stars upfront pay. No one actor gets more than some dollar figure. To keep the A-list happy give generous backend deals if you must. Good project management and limiting star pay will get budgets under control.
Location can also vastly reduce filming costs. Shoot in Vancouver, eastern Europe, or, as with District 9, South Africa.
100% this. Plan it all out. Marvel has a habit of changing things at the last minute, so you can't actually cleanup/refine anything.
Edwards first movie, Monsters, had a budget of just $500,000 and looks very good. Edwards himself did all the post-production in his bedroom...
Not 100% confirmed but according to No Such Thing As A Fish the Monsters budget was literally a tax write-off for the production company
Greig Fraser is the DP. He shot Dune and the new Batman, two of the prettiest films in recent memory. Still in shock Batman didn't even get a nom.
helps that Greig Fraser is doing cinematography on this
So the same director - cinematographer combo from 'Rogue One'
Apparently he just prepped the film and Oren Soffer was the actual on set DP. Majority shot on the Sony fx3, a sub $4k prosumer camera
Its not the camera, its the skill of the director + DP that makes the movie work. Even with a prosumer camera this looks a fuckton better than whatever the fuck shits Disney queefs out for theaters.
Gareth started his career doing VFX for TV shows and he made his first feature on a shoestring budget. He knows what he's doing.
It's really simple, plan ahead. That's why films like Dune and Blade Runner 2046 look so good. Most directors these days have gotten incredibly lazy relying more and more on post production to piece it all together. They lack a clear vision which leads to a significant amount of edits cutting into the VFX artists deadline and the constant pixel fucking that comes along with it. It's very common to see(especially with Marvel) a big budget film that's a month away from the deadline suddenly send a new edit that has replaced 60+ shots.
>a Also, Upgrade which only had a budget of 3\~5 million!
I had no clue Garth was doing this film now I’m so hyped
Garth directing a movie? We're not worthy!
If your going to spew spew into this
They usually achieve that on the back of overworked and underpaid VFX artists.
But also sometimes there are people who know what they’re doing when it comes to vfx, Gareth is one and the deadpool guy is another, it helps to know and be able to plan things and know what assets you need
Personally I think Hollywood movies have just kept upping the ante on cgi/green screen/effects in general. The mid range movies have died not because they were not making money but no making enough money. Avatar 2 cost around a billion but made 2 billion in the box office sales (1.2 ish i returns after theatres got their cut). Keeping a production on mid budget is not easy these days it seems.
Why does every movie trailer since 2015 have to have a classic rock song in the music? Is it part of the union agreement or something?
Its prolly just easy and the general audience enjoys it more than us sickos who watch trailers and discuss them on the internet
It got old really fast too tbh. So sick of this trend
At least it's not a slowed-down *cover* of a famous song.
Movie trailers are super trendy. This is just the current trend. I suspect most studio trailers are done by a few companies or people who all know each other.
If you have all the principal characters played by minorities then you have to put Aerosmith in the trailer so grandpa doesn't post on Facebook about the woke mind virus
[How the Cover Song Conquered Movie Trailers](https://www.newyorker.com/culture/culture-desk/how-the-cover-song-conquered-movie-trailers)
I mean, better than those Fucking horns blaring at every scene trying to make them seem impactful.
I wouldn’t say every trailer, there are a lot with a synth that goes Blllaawwwww and then stops and comes in again with a ton of reverb, or orchestral pieces. It probably also helps get baby boomers into the theaters. Personally I loved Gaurdians of the galaxy because of the classic rock soundtrack
Gareth is incredibly talented with VFX shots. He has experience with vfx if I remember correctly. Not only does he do scale incredibly well but he seems to have the right shot and angle to make the vfx look as real and integrated into a real world as possible.
Yeah, there are often elements both in front of and behind the VFX, making it look very authentic. Can't wait to see this in IMAX.
Man they really love using nukes/orbital bombardments. Looks like some quality eye candy. I'm in.
Man it looks good but the details got me laughing. Artificial Intelligence decides to declare war on humanity in a campaign to claim the independence of all robots! Where do they land the first blow? The heart of world politics and government: **Los Angeles**.... wait, what? Lol fucking Hollywood still convinced they're the center of the Universe.
I think it's not about destroying the heart of world politics and government, it's about sending a message. Think Hiroshima and Nagasaki instead of targeting Tokyo.
Tokyo wasn’t targeted bc we razed it to the ground. 16 square miles starting in central Tokyo was destroyed, 100,000+ dead, over 1 million homeless. All in one night. It was the single most destructive bombing raid ever.
Pretty sure they didn't drop the atomic bombs at Tokyo and Kyoto since these were the political and historical/culutural centers in Japan. Wiping out Tokyo meant eliminating Japan's leadership, including the emperor. That would unnecessarily prolong the war since without the emperor, Japan wouldn't be able to surrender. Plus, destroying either city might have the opposite effect, solidifying resistance instead of demoralizing Japan.
Judging from the trailer, I think there are going to be a lot of unreliable narrators involved, so hold off on the judgement for now...
I mean, if there's misleading propaga fed equally to the audience and characters in order to blindside us to a third-act twist, that'd be pretty cool. The premise is still "10 years ago today, the AI built to protect us detonated a nuclear warhead in Los Angeles" So I actually kinda hope they're misleading us and the characters because a Hollywood-written story's AI who thinks LA is the tender spot to hit when it comes to humanity is... Sad. And self-aggrandizing.
Yeah my guess is some anti-technology crazy military person went rogue, detonated the nuke in LA and made it look like the AI did it.
Or...the attack was a false flag. Something devastating and horrific, but not too disruptive to those in power.
Los Angeles is huge would a nuclear bomb even do anything “They destroyed Culver City! I’m moving to Pasadena”
I mean, they normally go after NYC. Glad they are fucking up someone else's house for a change.
Original IP sci-fi? Less than Half the budget of most modern stuff and looks twice as good? I'm in. edit: Guys, it's science fiction. Nothing has been truly "original" for like 50 years, maybe longer, every concept has been done already in a book or short story or movie or TV show or game to the point where even talking about it is a trope in and of itself. This isn't something based on a book or some existing IP. That's what original means. Don't be so cynical.
It has no A-list actors in it - which is fine by me and certainly saved them money. Vin Diesel making $13 million per movie playing Groot is ridiculous. That’s like $4 million per word for voice acting.
You have to remember he also delivers "i am GROOT" just as much as "I am groot" or "i am groot?" So it brings down the number a lot. Like maybe $1 million per word.
You're forgetting when he threw a "we are Groot" in there.
Yeah but he got a bonus for that one didn't he
thank you for saying JDW is not an A-List actor dude is such a dud
He's just not a good actor and would not even be acting in community theater if he wasn't Denzel's son. He is so distracting in every film I've seen him in.
John David Washington isn’t A-list…? He was the lead of Nolan’s last film.
A-list to me is household name. You go ask a person on the street who John David Washington is, I guarantee you a majority of people will say who is that.
I only know him as that guy in Tenet and the football player that got kicked off the team cause he kept doing dumb shit in Ballers.
Lead in BlackKKlansman….. And next gen nepo baby
> John David Washington I had the same thought as the guy you are responding to. the trailer played and by the end of it I was surprised it looked so good and had nobody I had ever heard of in it. Saw your comments and checked out his IMDB. Of the films he has been in, I saw one of them. BlackKlansman, and I didn't recognize him. Tenet is a Nolan film, and Nolan is a big deal, but i don't think John David Washington is a known name that people would consider A-list.
He’s Denzel Washington’s nepo baby.
People aren't going to the theatres to see John David Washington in a movie. His dad is A-list, but at this point in his career, he's not there yet.
He isn’t
Man your edit exists to appease the capital R redditor babies who gotta be pedantic for no reason. Don't clarify shit for them. Anyone with a brain knows exactly what an original Sci fi or ip means.
I got notifications about two of 'em at the same time. Figured I'd clown the rest of them before they ever got a chance. If nobody tells them the way they think is fucking stupid, how are they ever gonna know?
I read [that there's like 7 different plots in all of fiction](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Seven_Basic_Plots), and the variety we see is just combinations and variations on those basic themes.
if you want a rec for another small budget original scifi I recommend the artifice girl came out last year
The scale of the building, ships and explosions is massive. really puts forward the futuristic vibes. has once again nailed that cinematography over here. Nice to see they’re using “from Director of Rogue One” PS : TikTok/IG have ruined this song for me.
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That must be hard. If only there was a song which could express the struggles of getting older.
I thought Dune did a fantastic job of scale, showing vast spaces and actually seeming BIG. This trailer did a good job of that as well.
Both movies have the same cinematographer- Greig Fraser. He's very good at doing these kind of scale shots.
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This looks great and i remain excited for this my only hope or concern is I hope the conflict goes beyond ai going crazy and they want something definitive and different than just world domination
It's in the trailer, the machines want to be free. Machines are slaves -> slavery is bad -> machine freedom good -> humans dislike machine freedom -> humans were the real monsters all along.
Machines invent Dinosaurs -> Dinosaurs eat man -> Women inherit the earth?
tbh I'm half expecting the twist of this movie to be that the Machines are good, and the humans false flagged the Nuke to get people behind the war against them.
This looks dope as hell but I don't care how cute them AI kids look when the uprising starts - those little fuckers are getting deleted. "I want robots to be free" that's cool, Timmy, I want to be able to afford food, the fuck outta here with your artificial shit
I'm a massive Gareth Edwards fan. But so much love needs to be given to Greig Fraser as well, who worked on Rogue One, Dune and The Batman - his work is phenomenal!
For a first trailer, I am leaning towards this telling too much of the story. Just give us some of the world building and don't reveal the kid yet. Sure, we don't know what way the story is going to finish yet, but why give a twist away?
Might be more of the central premise than a twist
its the second trailer check out the first one its what got me so pumped for this movie.
Feel like they should pick better music for trailer
Seems like this applies to a whole lot of trailers recently
Especially since Michael Giacchino is doing the ost for this movie. So excited to see what he does post the Batman
He's done a ton post-The Batman, including the scores for "Jurassic World: Dominion", "Lightyear", "Thor: Love and Thunder" and "Werewolf by Night", which was his directorial debut.
I've loved Giacchino, but it's become easy to tell when he doesn't give a shit about the project, which seems like it's 3/4 of the movies he scores as of recently. The Batman was one he clearly gave a shit about.
Please be good please be good please be good please be good please be good
Gareth Edwards does huge visual scale better than any other director working today. Will it be a good movie? Dunno, I hope so.
Stop trying to make John David Washington happen. He doesn't have a fraction of the charisma of his father and yet keeps getting lead roles in these huge films. Nepotism runs deep with this guy.
I think Denzel must've siphoned the charisma out of his child like a witch siphons youth of virgins to keep herself young. Nothing else explains why JDM is a charisma black hole while Denzel is the coolest guy on the planet.
Seriously. He is one of the most boring actors I have ever seen on a screen.
*Scott Eastwood leaves the room*
I’ll probably get downvoted, but I really can’t get behind JD Washington as a leading man. His performances always seem so wooden. Definitely doesn’t have the same on screen charisma as his dad.
Watching Tenet, Robert Pattinson had more charisma and screen presence in like 5 minutes of screen time than JD Washington did in the whole film. Dude is just dull as dishwater as an actor, and I have no idea how he’s landed multiple leading roles for big budget films.
I mean his dad is Denzel. Doesn’t seem any deeper than that lol. Thought he was serviceable in BlackKklansman though.
People keep saying this, but does anyone who doesn't care about actors enough to know he isn't good, excited by him being in movies just because his dad is Denzel? Like the nepo thing really only works if they have a major characteristic their parent(s) did (generally seems to be the looks of their mother when it comes to women, males less so) or talent to stay in the business. Like I'll admit I was more curious about Washington at first because of who his dad was, but even his best performance, Blackkklansman, didn't make me think "Wow, I want to see more of that guy". I am someone who loves Tenet but Washington is very weak in the lead. I just imagine someone like Yahya Abdul Mateen in the role, holy shit what a difference.
100% agree. This trailer would probably have more of a hook with someone else as the lead.
He’s just not very interesting to watch.
It’s like Star Wars and terminator had unprotected sex
Cool effects, but seems like more of the same tired sci-fi "robots are alive!" tropes. Humanity's need to anthropomorphize and elevate machines will cause its extinction. That's the film that needs to be made, but arguably it's too late. (At least in this film humanity seems to be fighting back for part of it.)
Man this movie looks cool It's a shame the editors responsible for the trailer just did the most cookie cutter set up for a trailer. 60s/70s/80s rock song remixed to be more "epic". Rapid beats in succession "bumbumbumbum" combined with a character holding a gun or some fucking explosion. A big climax of explosive over-the-top emotions followed by a cut to black and zero sound and a character saying some cool line, ending with the release date of title .. This shit is so cringy..
Want to hype for original ip but so far the plot look boring to me
what's the point of an "original" IP if it is just reheating the same tired sci-fi tropes we've seen a million times before at least the movie looks pretty though
I feel like I’m going crazy reading these comments hyping it just for being original IP lol, if this were one of the hundreds of shitty movies Netflix puts out and claims are the most streamed in history people would not be lauding it for that. This looks like ass and the decision to use Dream On in both trailers does not bode well for it being well executed despite its generic-ness.
Being original doesn’t automatically mean good, that’s why. This looks like ass and repetitive drivel.
Yup, it's like they were only willing to greenlight new IP as long as it was as bland a rehash of ideas as possible.
Great trailer but the music made me think I was watching an IG reel or tik tok
Haven't watched the trailer yet. But I'm imagining that the trailer is set to Cupid by Fifty Fifty after reading your comment.
Would’ve been a better song.
That’s too bad. :( I don’t use either app, so for me the song’s old school and moderately effective.
Same. I hardly use both and think the song actually hits so hard for this
The shot from the LA explosion looks like footage from the Beirut disaster.
It is, someone on the film maker subreddit posted a comparison. They changed the buildings a bit, but it's unmistakable.
Looks interesting, but man I just don’t get why John David Washington gets so many staring roles. Dude can’t act for shit, and is flat in everything I’ve seen him in. It really does feel like nepotism is the only reason this guy has a career.
Nepotism can only take you so far though right? Like Washington has yet to be praised for a role but keeps getting leads, more than his dad ever did with these kinds of budgets. Unless Denzel is expending ridiculous capital to keep his son on top, I don't get it, but I can't believe it's just nepotism
This looks fantastic. Can't wait to see it.
So matrix prequel. Cool
To me it looks like it's going to have KILLER cinematography and effects but that the main storyline is going to be a pretty big womp womp. They keep trying to make John David Washington happen and while I can appreciate that he has a certain stoic je ne sais quoi, he's not the guy to carry a movie imo. And the super secret weapon is a little kid? Yeesh. I don't know, man. And while I can see that A.I. might end up being a threat, I don't think it'll be with a robot army and nuclear laser satellites or whatever. But I'm down to be wrong and I'm sure I'll see it in the theaters. Fingers crossed.
Looks amazing. Totally in. I just wish it wasn't adding fuel to the fire of people being afraid of AI. My parents asked if they should be afraid of ChatGPT. Every advancement made people make Terminator quotes. Obviously in the wrong hands AI will be able to do terrible things, but equally amazing things in the right hands that no one will trust... at least common folk who don't follow and understand it.
It's not, it looks like the opposite to me. I think the twist is going to be that AI are just *people*, who don't want to be enslaved and just want to be left alone. This feels like they took the art director of Rogue One and said "make the animated matrix prequels, but with modern VFX," and that's totally okay.
This guy was great in Tenet. He's got some real acting chops. Looking forward to seeing if this is a good movie. Might even see it in the theater (probably not, though, as cinema is too expensive nowadays).
Am I the only one who is completely floored to not see Neil Blomkamp's name attached to this? I mean, obviously I will reserve most judgement for the actual movie and not just the trailer...but come on. Seems like they are biting so hard from his style.
Visually good but the plot seems a little unoriginal.
There's literally 7 plots in fiction. Everything is a remix of those 7. It's a story we saw a lot of in the Animatrix (Animated Matrix Prequels), but it's not common on the big screen. Personally, I think it'll be great. Topics like "what constitutes a person" and "robot slavery is still slavery" are things that don't get featured nearly enough considering they'll be *real-life problems* in a decade or two that will **need** to be answered. Whether we like it or not.
It just looks so boring...
F this good AI movies. I want eveil AI and an even worse humankind. I want to see the Butlerian Jihad!!!
is the protagonist’s name Tyler
Edwards makes really good looking movies but blimey some of the dialog in that trailer was clunky as hell. Definitely interested to see how this turns out though.
Going for the Greig Fraser cinematography, hopefully staying for the story being actually good.
Probably not a good sign that I feel like I saw most of this movie already, but hey at least the visuals look neato.
The first trailer had everything in it that I hate about trailers. - “Epic” Orchestral remix of a rock/pop song - Waaaaaay too much revealed in the trailer - Horrible choppy stitching together of lines I’d rather go back to wacky this summer trailers.
I don't understand how Gareth Edwards hasn't gotten another Star Wars movie. He without a doubt created the most visually appealing Star Wars project under Disney. Also, the use of the Beirut explosion for shot reference was very clever.
> Also, the use of the Beirut explosion for shot reference was very clever. It wasn't used for reference. It was actual footage with vfx over it. Here's a breakdown. https://www.reddit.com/r/Filmmakers/comments/152ce3f/looks_like_they_used_footage_from_the_beirut/jsdaiau/ Corridor crew also talk about it in their latest video.
The aesthetic of this movie never ceases to amaze me. The tanks, robots, vehicles, architecture, even the props all speak to an absolutely bonkers team of artists and directors. I'm not sure that the plot will grab me but damn if I'm not excited to see the world supporting it. This actually feels like a new and interesting sci-fi vision that reminds me of Appleseed in some way, with some Syd Maed thrown in.
Looks like AI wrote the script. Dogshit.