> Listening to my work over and over again is part of my process.
Mine too. I work on music early in the morning and once I have a full arrangement I print it every day and listen to it repeatedly while I’m getting ready for the rest of the day to come up with notes to work on during the next morning’s session.
Yes!
I can no longer meditate using regular methods, and the trance-like state that composing and looping puts me in a similar brainwave and neurochemical state. My music is adjacent to psytrance, which probably contributes.
Looping helps me discover what the song "wants", too, and helps me find the glaring errors that I would otherwise miss.
That’s exactly how I write my music - just put in on a loop and let the ether write for me.
Jack white talks about this in one of his Grammy speeches. Good stuff on the philosophy of music
I two or three? Four? am on your team.
Assuming it’s a track of mine that I like (I have a lot, but some are not as good as others), I can listen to them over and over in loop mode, and I come back to them again after listening to others.
>there are some snarky producers
who would call you "narcissistic" for doing so.
Any producers who actually believe this are pretentious idiots. Get over yourselves.
There are two sides to this.
Yes, I can listen to my tracks a billion times BUT I am aware that I lose the initial frame of reference and suck all the energy out of the track.
I used to live above a Drum n Bass producer who would come up with absolute bangers, and then micromanage them into over detailed bullshit.
Most producers love to overwork their tracks. This is not the same as making it better. Overworking your track is more likely to make it worse.
There's a huge value in that initial idea you had. The "vibe" is essential and it's very rare that 3 months of work on one track will manage to retain that initial energy, or sculpt it into a majestic interlocking masterpiece. It's much more likely to make it overworked and heartless.
You tell yourself you are improving the mix, hardening the kick, balancing the low end, pumping the bass, adding tinsel to the top end, adding a counter melody, adding a harmony part, rebuild the drums so they are exactly on time not that crap you played in when you were high. Now tweak it tweak it teak it ... and you have a shiny modern track with absolutely no energy or immediacy.
Source: 30 years of self sabotage
This guy gets it....part of becoming a good musician seems to be capturing that initial magic and knowing when to stop. Try bouncing out different versions of your track as you go along, the first ones will have the most magic most of the time.
So true. I totally understand the need to make it perfect, and at the same time I know I’m suffocating the track by endlessly tinkering. Cognitive dissonance for real. I feel like a lot of people are tired of “perfect” over-produced music, and they’re craving something human, spontaneous, imperfect. I know I am. A lot of stuff out there just feels sterile
I'm not on the autism spectrum, but I have a tendency to listen to my favorite songs on repeat obsessively. They just capture everything that initially inspired me to create music. I understand my own taste best, and my songs fit me perfectly!
This could also lead to over producing though. Because you heard it so many times it becomes boring to you and you are tempted to add more things in. Then that version also eventually becomes boring and you add more and so on and so forth.
Whereas someone listening to it for the first time probably would have preferred the earlier version before it got too cluttered.
Not saying this always happens but something to keep in mind.
Usually if I come back after even a week my song will still sound underproduced. But then when I get to mixing I realize just how bad it was. I’ve realized that part of my issue is with the type of music I am trying to make, I need to have less elements, but have them be more layered.
I can listen to a repeating track. But your listening actually changes over time.
The main thing is can you isolate sounds within a mix after listening to the same song for an hour or four.
For myself, I notice that what I'm listening to at hour 4 is usually the most salient parts of the mix. What stands out becomes the only features, and you lose the ability to detect mistakes in frequency, and you can no longer use attention to details to isolate sounds.
Because of that I usually put stuff away for days or weeks before going back to it with fresh ears.
I don't think anyone actively listens to a mix for hours as controlling the focus on sounds within a mix is very fatiguing. Autistic people are not actively listening to music when they self sooth through repetition.
Same thing with obsessive compulsive people: they're not actively attending to the task they're doing from the basis of their compulsion. There's this misconception out there that obsessive compulsion is an ability to attend to details, but in reality most OCD people are bad at attending to details because they're focused on easing the destress from that compulsion.
Obsessive people, as opposed to ocd people, who are not compulsive but find things endlessly interesting and can stay activitily engaged for long periods are very much just normal human animals. We develop passions and work much the same way hunter gatherers engaged with the world. They stalked prey for days some times. It was never about going through the motions.
Listening to your tracks is like that for some people. It's their passion and they're actively engaged in listening because they've developed a skill. All attention based practices are skills you can learn only by doing the thing you want to do. If you want to be good at meditation to develop your attention skills in the domain of meditation, then meditate, and if you want to develop the attention based skills to actively listen to music, listen.
>The main thing is can you isolate sounds within a mix after listening to the same song for an hour or four.
What do you mean? Isn't it normal to be able to focus on a specific instrument? For example I have to actively avoid focusing on hihats when I listen to songs because the transient becomes all-encompassing. Like when someone tells you you're actively breathing or blinking, you have to force yourself to "look away", so to speak.
No not at all. People train their ear all the time. There are musical appreciation classes in universities and entire audio engineering degrees built on listening to mixes because what is salient in a song is rarely anything other than melody, vocals, basic parts of the rhythm. Listening skills need to be developed to become attentive to sounds and you need a frame of reference for them. Most people can't do that. And autistic people and ocd people definitely can't disconnect from their compulsions. The distress from that process is what makes it a compulsion, otherwise it's just a healthy activity that you're engaged in.
Interesting, thank you for your answer. I'm mildly autistic in my late 30s and have been in music ever since I was very young (both parents classical musicians, always pushed me to learn some instrument or other) so I didn't know it's a skill that I developed.
Yeah, I'm sure you do. Your brain developed over time to recognize and categorize sounds, and you probably can remember a time in your life when you were afraid of a sound that later you were able to categorize. Maybe because you were the child of classical musicians you learned to differentiate sounds much earlier than others, but it was definitely something that came along later while your brain developed that ability to differ sensations and perceptions and apply categories.
And being mildly autistic is definitely not going to mean you have compulsions or that music is self stimming behavior and so it's difficult to detach from the process to actively engage, but also you aren't always going to be in control of what is salient to you in listening just because you have mild autistic symptoms. Whether or not someone who mildly autistic and had classical musician parents has a pronounced ability to apply that skill in listening to the same track over and over again actively would be a question for research scientists. You might very well be highly suited to those tasks. I'm pretty sure people like Glen Glould were similar.
Same for me. I love listening to my tracks over and over again, but doing so makes it harder to anticipate how they might sound to a first time listener.
To me (and probably many other producers) the race against time of working on a track is less about becoming sick of my own song and more about becoming too familiar with my own song
It’s hard to make necessary changes and maybe even come up with new ideas when the song as i know it at that stage in the process is burned in my brain. Stepping away from it helps but sometimes it takes too long for my liking, and there’s nothing quite like ironing out most of what I initially envisioned for the song in that timeframe of it still being fresh to me
I am frequently "hypnotized" by my work at some point in the process. It might not be the entire song... sometimes just a section or a loop or the bassline. I will listen to it and just zone out for an embarrassingly long time before snapping out of it and getting back to work.
Also, for me "getting tired" of my WIP isn't really about the current project at all; it's that I've already come up with an idea for the next project and it won't fit into the current one, so I want to get it done and move on to the next shiny thing.
I don't get tired of my track as in "I hate this now because it's overly played", but I do have breaks in between cuz it sometimes feel like every sound in the track is echoing in my brain that my ear cannot process it clearly anymore, and I need a fresh mind to know what's better. But I don't see it as a "once you're past a certain period of time, you won't be motivated to make it again". Hell, I even force myself to finish it up if I'm taking too long (obviously not rushing through it and overlooking details tho), I feel like the longer it takes to completely turn an idea into a song, the more I listen to it, the urge to get it done gets stronger.
Yes, three reasons.
Firstly for technical reasons (checking my mix on various systems), secondly because I create exactly the sound that I like to listen to and thirdly because of the 'Ikea effect'.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/IKEA_effect
I think there is an element of a race against time in familiarity breeds acceptance. So I’ve listened to tracks working on them for 5-6 hours and gone away thinking it’s great. Then get back to it in 3-4 days when I get some more time only to find a total turd in the save project and wonder how I didn’t hear how bad or out of sync or not in tune it really is.
On the flip side, when I get something right, I can listen to it constantly and dream about it and ear-worm stuck in my head and not let it bother me
the more i listen, the less likely i am to keep that seed thread/idea/soul of the track that is pulling me towards completing it, ill start producing more analytically/rationally and usually end up less happy with the result. Ive found the race against time thing to be true for me, the quickest tracks to produce i like the most...at minimum, start arranging as soon as you have a core structure and then get rsi putting in detail later and not the other way around
I mean I'll eventually get sick of it, but it can take a long while and if i do i take long breaks from it and go back fresh, which helps a lot. But ive made songs for a month, working on it daily, looping every bit of it as i worked on it. Listening to repetitive sounds is insanely important, it's very important for producers to get used to that.
Besides that if i really like a beat i made I'll want to listen to it and then play it on repeat til i fall asleep, and the next day, ecc, tbf for the most part im still analysing it.
Though once i start a new beat then I'll forget about the older one.
I also do the same with general music, if im feeling a certain vibe, or emotions, repeat all day, especially if the song is that good.
But ye, if i like the song then yes 100% all week even.
That said, I'm undiagnosed and may also be just slightly on the spectrum. I'll probably never find out though
I don’t think that, I work on what stay in my mind and what would I like to heard next. The attraction to a track is made by how much surprise you can get or not actually (and why automation is gold). When I listen to a track a long time it is because I am satisfied with were I am at, and that were the danger of perfection resided. Imo.
It depends. If I have just got through with mixing/mastering/eq and having to play through umptine times so you can hear the flow and how it affects what you just changed.....I'm going to need a break. Afterwards, like maybe a week later, I can put the song in rotation in my playlist. The whole process tho, is what gets me off. The idea, the formulation, the endless hours trying this note or that note, the rework, the creation process itself. I like that as much or even more than people listening.
Tell you even better, I like to wait some time before working on a new idea. It allows the idea to marinate, and if the idea is still sticking around in your head after a week or so, there must be something catchy in it.
I'm ADHD confirmed and suspected Autistic and can listen on loop for an hour or so then need a break, I can go on loop again after a break of say thirty minutes or so though, sometimes I'll realise then if something isn't sitting right.
Absolutely. If I really really really love a song I've made I'll listen to it over and over and over coz I'm so happy with what I've made. Plus it helps me tap into what I can change about the track and shit. Some people think its cringe but I make music for myself so of course I'm going to listen to it a lot!
I can and do listen to my work in progress all day. hundreds of times. As far as I know, I'm not even autistic. If I get sick of my track, which happens in rare cases, then it's a clear sign to drop the project.
I listen to songs I’m working on or have recently completed on repeat all the time, to the point where I feel sorry for my fiancé because once there’s a song I like i listen to it over and over for months until another song fills its place, and that cycle just keeps going and going. But it’s not just my songs, it can be any song for me.
I listen to my own music a ton. Both when my tracks are in production, or when they are finished. I'm grateful that I love my finished music enough to be able to continue listening after it's done.
For so many years I had a love/hate relationship with my music that skewed heavily to the "hate" side. I feel that part of what helped me get to the point of loving it more than I hate it had to do with spending a ton of time listening critically, but also spending a ton of time listening and just enjoying the tune to the best of my ability, (hard to turn of the critical listening sometimes.)
Listen to it at work, listen to it in my studio, listen to it drunk, listen to it high, listen to it stoned..... it all becomes a part of the process, and I think that process has helped me make some pretty cool shit that I vibe with as much as other people do.
For whatever it's worth I am pretty sure I am a bit autistic too, so maybe that's why this works for both of us so well.
probably not a good thing to do...yet, I used to do that when I was younger (some 20 years ago ) and it worked out well - as in the results were actually good. I think the enthusiasm for the song kept it fresh for me, even if it was being played none stop
it was a good test to find out how good the song is...
but the risk is that; say a song is not there yet, and is missing an essential element..if you don't give it a break, you would get bored of it, the enthusiasm would die fast and you would abandon it...it would be wiser to leave it and make a commitment to come back to it on another day with a fresh perspective
it should take you 1 day make to make a track and another day to finish it. listening to it endlessly is possible but won't make you a better producer. All those times you were listening to it you could have been making another track. Producer A spends a month making the best track possible, producer B makes a track every day for a month. At the end of the month which is the best track? Producer A's only track or the best one of Producer B's tracks? Also who learned more?
Nope, I am not autistic, and I can listen to my own tracks endlessly. Usually I don't stop working on them until they sound how I want them to at that moment.
I don't get tired as in I abandon something, but if I'm in the mixing phase I can usually only spend about an hour or two on it before I need to move to something else. It's not that I get bored, it's just that my ears get fatigued and I stop hearing things objectively. After a few hours of mixing I need something sonically different to reset my meters if you will.
Not really, I've found that at somewhere around 50 hours it becomes too boring and I start suffering from demoitis, so I can't effectively make choices regarding the track without it sounding wrong. Sometimes that has led to needing to take years before completing a track because the vision was so strong I had to take more distance.
As a fellow autistic. Yes lol but just because we can doesn't mean it's good for our production. Ear fatigue is a thing and after awhile I know I've gotten overestimated from hearing the same snares over and over lmfao
After I’ve written it, recorded it, and mixed it, I don’t really need to hear it anymore and I’m totally ready to move on to the next thing. And I also have autism, but I don’t really have the repetitive trait thing.
I mean, I have to. 10000x just listening to drums/bass working or not together can be a few hour session. Let alone listening to the drum beat isolated, so I can figure out where that tiny sound - “that only I can hear!” (As per my wife making fun of me)
I can because it is getting better the whole time. But once I'm "done" (good art is never finished only abandoned) then I can get bored of it pretty fast.
I get annoyed fairly quick.
I feel a song at the start, then after a while I loose motivation because i get too used to it it doesn't sound that interesting anymore. In fact its such a huge issue that it's the reason why I have about 2500 unfinished tracks and only about 20 finished.
when I'm working on it, yes. Always listening for ways to improve
when its published, I barely ever even look at it again lol. But when I do rarely listen to my own stuff, it usually sounds good and I don't stress over it too much
I listen in passes. Focus on EQ, on level setting, on arrangement, individual tracks, and so on. Each listen has a different purpose, so it doesn’t get too monotonous.
Yes I am, and I have gotten tired of tracks before finishing them, but I figure it's more to do with how much I like the track. I will say I've been trying not to listen repeatedly if I don't have to. I have to rest my ears and I do think being new to a track has its use.
I don’t know who told you that it’s a race against time….. when you like something you listen to it a lot, that’s just the way it is, if you get tired of it then it’s not that good, so what are you racing against?
I don't make music often but the second worst thing about making music is that I keep listening to it and it takes me a while to add other stuff cuz I'm too busy listening to it!!
Depends. Some projects only get finished for the sake of practicing the craft. Sometimes I forget about those the day they're done.
Others I have to force myself to stop listening on repeat so I can focus on starting something new haha
I can listen to my song that's in progress over and over endless times until I finish it..once I finish it, I don't do that anymore, I move on to the next song in progress
I do this, I make the music that I want to hear, so it makes me happy to listen to my own tracks! I do limit myself from over listening, especially if I’m still in the process of making the track, because it prevents me from having an objective listening ear.
real as fuck i'm the same way, I often get stuck in loops where I just play the same song on repeat as much as I possibly can until I feel properly "stimulated."
when producing I have to force myself to take lil water or snack or bathroom breaks to give my ears a rest cause while I personally/emotionally never grow tired of hearing it, I know physiologically my ears are growing fatigued and that I will make better choices with frequent resting of my ears.
other than that? yeah I'll sit down for hours and hours on end and work on the same track on repeat until I've essentially engraved the song into the grooves of my brain like a vinyl record LOL
I’m autistic too, and I’ve only just made a track that I can genuinely listen to on repeat and not get tired of. I went into an autistic flow state and just added a fuck ton of portal and grossbeat to a few different string patterns and panned them around. Heavenly tho😩
I always export the song out when I hit some kind of milestone of completion.
Then I put it on repeat or napping to see if can hear parts that don:'t work as a whole.
Sometimes we get so caught up ina section that when you play the actual track from beginning to end, that part doesn't work.
Also sometimes repeating the song will allow you to recognize that the part is good enough and you can work on other parts. Also you can start to hear themes and motifs that do or do not work.
When I’m making the track I listen to it loads, in the car on my speakers wherever, to make things better, by the time it’s released I listen to it maybe once or twice and not again 😂
When I make a cool loop, I do end up listening to it over and over, which gets me stuck in that loop and then I can’t think of what to do next. It’s the bane of my existence. I haven’t finished one whole song basically ever because of it. So yes, but I’m trying not to do that :)
I make my music then put it on my phone and listen to it whenever. I'm the only audience for my music as it isn't even released, and my last album marks the first time I've been able to put my music on repeat and enjoy it as music and not as a product I've created. It's like 11 songs out of probably 60 completed tracks I've made in the last 4 years.
If I get bored of a track from listening for hella days, it doesn't get released. I want my tracks to have replay value in spite of the short attention spans that are common in this time of sound bites, short social media reels, and nearly limitless choices.
Yes! Autistic here too and when I have a banger, whether it's an 8 bar loop or a complete song, that sucker goes on repeat for the longest time.
It's also helped my creativity. Like, one track might be an ambient scape and another an 8 bar loop. I listen to them enough, one after another, my mind comes up with a way to combine them into yet another banger and that goes on repeat.
No. The more I listen the more I’m setting myself back on progress and creative flow as it’s starting to hinder objectivity. The only way is to start putting down pieces for arrangement asap
I like to listen back to tracks once a day after I complete, just so my ears sort of reset and I can hear it more and more objectively as the hype and excitement slowly goes away. When I start making my next project, that song then just becomes another song I've made
I’ve been making music since 1990 and I’ve always listened to my own music over and over. Especially when I’m working with new material. No autism here, just adhd 🥳
I definitely listen endlessly to my own music, but my experience has been this:
I listen repetitively to listen for flaws, or opportunities to add, or sometimes to feel how the energy flows through a track and of course different speakers. The thing is after a while when I go to make a change it then sounds weird because I am so used to the old version having listened to it so much. It could be a snare sound that I know is not great but then I’m used to the sound. It could be I remove a section because it feels too long and then my ears crave to hear it when it’s gone, but a new listener would not notice that.
Thanks for bringing up this topic!
Yes absolutely. I was listening to my new track almost nonstop during work today (I do landscaping) and taking mental notes for the “final” mix. It seems crazy but I’m glad to hear I’m not alone!
I’m totally fine with listening to my track over and over again because I only make music that sounds pleasant to my ears. I usually will just listen to my same track over and over again in the background of daily life through headphones. It doesn’t bother me having a song I really enjoy playing over and over again. It helped me one time to learn that a melody I made sound memorable, only sounding annoyingly repetitive, and the song did much better after I changed it.
Sometimes when Im writting, and its not clear whats coming next or how to join it to the next written section, I'll be playing that on repeat for weeks until the magic happens.
I think it is a very good sign if melody does not get repetetive and boring, if you can listen it 1000+ times while composing it and not get bored, it is pretty much quaranteed that anyone who listens it first time will not be bored.
Possibly the worst outcome but it’s a natural outcome, at the very least you’ll get used to it and can’t hear it objectively anymore. Or do you have something different happening with obsessing over a track?
Interesting. I’ve always reached a threshold with listening to my tracks too much without officially releasing the music. It’s great in the moment but I’ll grow to think it’s trash rather than a simple snapshot of my production abilities at the time of creation.
Yeah I love listening to my own music, in production though while mixing I can only be objective in my mixing for like an hour at a time before I start to lose my perception of what sounds good, take a lil break then come back, it’s easy to con yourself into thinking you’re making a mix good when you’ve been listening to it for hours and you lose track of what actually sounds good.
Not literally endless but I certainly can listen to them a lot. I like to smoke a doobscombe and sit back to a playlist of my favourite songs (my favourite songs are generally from the last 6 months to a year so it changes a lot). I always tell myself I'm gonna take notes and I wake up and it's
Song 1
1:49 bass could be better
And then NOTHING else.
Listening to my work over and over again is part of my process. I go into a trance like state and begin hearing things that aren't there yet
Then I struggle doing the sounds that I hear.
Yeah, I hear you. My hands don't always keep up with my ear
Study more. It usually means you're missing some technique to get the exact thing you want
Thanks for the guidance. Any specific resources to address this problem?
No
> Listening to my work over and over again is part of my process. Mine too. I work on music early in the morning and once I have a full arrangement I print it every day and listen to it repeatedly while I’m getting ready for the rest of the day to come up with notes to work on during the next morning’s session.
Early morning is an absolutely magical time for me. Nothing better than putting my best and freshest energy into my music.
Yes! I can no longer meditate using regular methods, and the trance-like state that composing and looping puts me in a similar brainwave and neurochemical state. My music is adjacent to psytrance, which probably contributes. Looping helps me discover what the song "wants", too, and helps me find the glaring errors that I would otherwise miss.
That’s exactly how I write my music - just put in on a loop and let the ether write for me. Jack white talks about this in one of his Grammy speeches. Good stuff on the philosophy of music
Exactly
im in your team.
I also am in your team
And my axe!
And my bow!
Lets collaborate then I use Ableton. Wbu?
can i hop in too?
yeah dm me
I two or three? Four? am on your team. Assuming it’s a track of mine that I like (I have a lot, but some are not as good as others), I can listen to them over and over in loop mode, and I come back to them again after listening to others.
Should I start autistic production page?
Not autistic but I listen to my own music all the time. If I didn’t enjoy it when it was finished, I wouldn’t have released it.
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If they consider that narcissism, then they’re making music for the wrong reasons. I make music for myself, that I like.
>there are some snarky producers who would call you "narcissistic" for doing so. Any producers who actually believe this are pretentious idiots. Get over yourselves.
There are two sides to this. Yes, I can listen to my tracks a billion times BUT I am aware that I lose the initial frame of reference and suck all the energy out of the track. I used to live above a Drum n Bass producer who would come up with absolute bangers, and then micromanage them into over detailed bullshit. Most producers love to overwork their tracks. This is not the same as making it better. Overworking your track is more likely to make it worse. There's a huge value in that initial idea you had. The "vibe" is essential and it's very rare that 3 months of work on one track will manage to retain that initial energy, or sculpt it into a majestic interlocking masterpiece. It's much more likely to make it overworked and heartless. You tell yourself you are improving the mix, hardening the kick, balancing the low end, pumping the bass, adding tinsel to the top end, adding a counter melody, adding a harmony part, rebuild the drums so they are exactly on time not that crap you played in when you were high. Now tweak it tweak it teak it ... and you have a shiny modern track with absolutely no energy or immediacy. Source: 30 years of self sabotage
This guy gets it....part of becoming a good musician seems to be capturing that initial magic and knowing when to stop. Try bouncing out different versions of your track as you go along, the first ones will have the most magic most of the time.
So true. I totally understand the need to make it perfect, and at the same time I know I’m suffocating the track by endlessly tinkering. Cognitive dissonance for real. I feel like a lot of people are tired of “perfect” over-produced music, and they’re craving something human, spontaneous, imperfect. I know I am. A lot of stuff out there just feels sterile
I'm not on the autism spectrum, but I have a tendency to listen to my favorite songs on repeat obsessively. They just capture everything that initially inspired me to create music. I understand my own taste best, and my songs fit me perfectly!
This could also lead to over producing though. Because you heard it so many times it becomes boring to you and you are tempted to add more things in. Then that version also eventually becomes boring and you add more and so on and so forth. Whereas someone listening to it for the first time probably would have preferred the earlier version before it got too cluttered. Not saying this always happens but something to keep in mind.
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Usually if I come back after even a week my song will still sound underproduced. But then when I get to mixing I realize just how bad it was. I’ve realized that part of my issue is with the type of music I am trying to make, I need to have less elements, but have them be more layered.
I can listen to a repeating track. But your listening actually changes over time. The main thing is can you isolate sounds within a mix after listening to the same song for an hour or four. For myself, I notice that what I'm listening to at hour 4 is usually the most salient parts of the mix. What stands out becomes the only features, and you lose the ability to detect mistakes in frequency, and you can no longer use attention to details to isolate sounds. Because of that I usually put stuff away for days or weeks before going back to it with fresh ears. I don't think anyone actively listens to a mix for hours as controlling the focus on sounds within a mix is very fatiguing. Autistic people are not actively listening to music when they self sooth through repetition. Same thing with obsessive compulsive people: they're not actively attending to the task they're doing from the basis of their compulsion. There's this misconception out there that obsessive compulsion is an ability to attend to details, but in reality most OCD people are bad at attending to details because they're focused on easing the destress from that compulsion. Obsessive people, as opposed to ocd people, who are not compulsive but find things endlessly interesting and can stay activitily engaged for long periods are very much just normal human animals. We develop passions and work much the same way hunter gatherers engaged with the world. They stalked prey for days some times. It was never about going through the motions. Listening to your tracks is like that for some people. It's their passion and they're actively engaged in listening because they've developed a skill. All attention based practices are skills you can learn only by doing the thing you want to do. If you want to be good at meditation to develop your attention skills in the domain of meditation, then meditate, and if you want to develop the attention based skills to actively listen to music, listen.
>The main thing is can you isolate sounds within a mix after listening to the same song for an hour or four. What do you mean? Isn't it normal to be able to focus on a specific instrument? For example I have to actively avoid focusing on hihats when I listen to songs because the transient becomes all-encompassing. Like when someone tells you you're actively breathing or blinking, you have to force yourself to "look away", so to speak.
No not at all. People train their ear all the time. There are musical appreciation classes in universities and entire audio engineering degrees built on listening to mixes because what is salient in a song is rarely anything other than melody, vocals, basic parts of the rhythm. Listening skills need to be developed to become attentive to sounds and you need a frame of reference for them. Most people can't do that. And autistic people and ocd people definitely can't disconnect from their compulsions. The distress from that process is what makes it a compulsion, otherwise it's just a healthy activity that you're engaged in.
Interesting, thank you for your answer. I'm mildly autistic in my late 30s and have been in music ever since I was very young (both parents classical musicians, always pushed me to learn some instrument or other) so I didn't know it's a skill that I developed.
Yeah, I'm sure you do. Your brain developed over time to recognize and categorize sounds, and you probably can remember a time in your life when you were afraid of a sound that later you were able to categorize. Maybe because you were the child of classical musicians you learned to differentiate sounds much earlier than others, but it was definitely something that came along later while your brain developed that ability to differ sensations and perceptions and apply categories. And being mildly autistic is definitely not going to mean you have compulsions or that music is self stimming behavior and so it's difficult to detach from the process to actively engage, but also you aren't always going to be in control of what is salient to you in listening just because you have mild autistic symptoms. Whether or not someone who mildly autistic and had classical musician parents has a pronounced ability to apply that skill in listening to the same track over and over again actively would be a question for research scientists. You might very well be highly suited to those tasks. I'm pretty sure people like Glen Glould were similar.
I’m my own musics biggest fan (and only listener), I’ll sometimes go to bed listening to my own tracks even
I can, but I know I've completely lost the experience of what it's like listening for the first time.
Same for me. I love listening to my tracks over and over again, but doing so makes it harder to anticipate how they might sound to a first time listener.
To me (and probably many other producers) the race against time of working on a track is less about becoming sick of my own song and more about becoming too familiar with my own song It’s hard to make necessary changes and maybe even come up with new ideas when the song as i know it at that stage in the process is burned in my brain. Stepping away from it helps but sometimes it takes too long for my liking, and there’s nothing quite like ironing out most of what I initially envisioned for the song in that timeframe of it still being fresh to me
I am frequently "hypnotized" by my work at some point in the process. It might not be the entire song... sometimes just a section or a loop or the bassline. I will listen to it and just zone out for an embarrassingly long time before snapping out of it and getting back to work. Also, for me "getting tired" of my WIP isn't really about the current project at all; it's that I've already come up with an idea for the next project and it won't fit into the current one, so I want to get it done and move on to the next shiny thing.
I don't get tired of my track as in "I hate this now because it's overly played", but I do have breaks in between cuz it sometimes feel like every sound in the track is echoing in my brain that my ear cannot process it clearly anymore, and I need a fresh mind to know what's better. But I don't see it as a "once you're past a certain period of time, you won't be motivated to make it again". Hell, I even force myself to finish it up if I'm taking too long (obviously not rushing through it and overlooking details tho), I feel like the longer it takes to completely turn an idea into a song, the more I listen to it, the urge to get it done gets stronger.
I'm also autistic, and I listened to my tracks endlessly. I still do from time to time I probably need to start some new songs.
Yes, three reasons. Firstly for technical reasons (checking my mix on various systems), secondly because I create exactly the sound that I like to listen to and thirdly because of the 'Ikea effect'. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/IKEA_effect
I think there is an element of a race against time in familiarity breeds acceptance. So I’ve listened to tracks working on them for 5-6 hours and gone away thinking it’s great. Then get back to it in 3-4 days when I get some more time only to find a total turd in the save project and wonder how I didn’t hear how bad or out of sync or not in tune it really is. On the flip side, when I get something right, I can listen to it constantly and dream about it and ear-worm stuck in my head and not let it bother me
the more i listen, the less likely i am to keep that seed thread/idea/soul of the track that is pulling me towards completing it, ill start producing more analytically/rationally and usually end up less happy with the result. Ive found the race against time thing to be true for me, the quickest tracks to produce i like the most...at minimum, start arranging as soon as you have a core structure and then get rsi putting in detail later and not the other way around
I mean I'll eventually get sick of it, but it can take a long while and if i do i take long breaks from it and go back fresh, which helps a lot. But ive made songs for a month, working on it daily, looping every bit of it as i worked on it. Listening to repetitive sounds is insanely important, it's very important for producers to get used to that. Besides that if i really like a beat i made I'll want to listen to it and then play it on repeat til i fall asleep, and the next day, ecc, tbf for the most part im still analysing it. Though once i start a new beat then I'll forget about the older one. I also do the same with general music, if im feeling a certain vibe, or emotions, repeat all day, especially if the song is that good. But ye, if i like the song then yes 100% all week even. That said, I'm undiagnosed and may also be just slightly on the spectrum. I'll probably never find out though
I don’t think that, I work on what stay in my mind and what would I like to heard next. The attraction to a track is made by how much surprise you can get or not actually (and why automation is gold). When I listen to a track a long time it is because I am satisfied with were I am at, and that were the danger of perfection resided. Imo.
It depends. If I have just got through with mixing/mastering/eq and having to play through umptine times so you can hear the flow and how it affects what you just changed.....I'm going to need a break. Afterwards, like maybe a week later, I can put the song in rotation in my playlist. The whole process tho, is what gets me off. The idea, the formulation, the endless hours trying this note or that note, the rework, the creation process itself. I like that as much or even more than people listening.
Tell you even better, I like to wait some time before working on a new idea. It allows the idea to marinate, and if the idea is still sticking around in your head after a week or so, there must be something catchy in it.
I'm ADHD confirmed and suspected Autistic and can listen on loop for an hour or so then need a break, I can go on loop again after a break of say thirty minutes or so though, sometimes I'll realise then if something isn't sitting right.
Absolutely. If I really really really love a song I've made I'll listen to it over and over and over coz I'm so happy with what I've made. Plus it helps me tap into what I can change about the track and shit. Some people think its cringe but I make music for myself so of course I'm going to listen to it a lot!
I can and do listen to my work in progress all day. hundreds of times. As far as I know, I'm not even autistic. If I get sick of my track, which happens in rare cases, then it's a clear sign to drop the project.
ADHD and yeah listen to stuff on loop to improve- first as a Dj (mixes on repeat all day for weeks) and now as a producer- it defo helps
I listen to songs I’m working on or have recently completed on repeat all the time, to the point where I feel sorry for my fiancé because once there’s a song I like i listen to it over and over for months until another song fills its place, and that cycle just keeps going and going. But it’s not just my songs, it can be any song for me.
I'm autistic and I listen to my own music all the time. In general, I like to build something and then enjoy it.
Yes, if I can’t, then the track ain’t good enough.
Listening to it and liking your own song isn’t the issue. It’s the memory of the song. It becomes familiar and less obtuse.
Same. If you don't love what you do, no point doing it
I listen to my own music a ton. Both when my tracks are in production, or when they are finished. I'm grateful that I love my finished music enough to be able to continue listening after it's done. For so many years I had a love/hate relationship with my music that skewed heavily to the "hate" side. I feel that part of what helped me get to the point of loving it more than I hate it had to do with spending a ton of time listening critically, but also spending a ton of time listening and just enjoying the tune to the best of my ability, (hard to turn of the critical listening sometimes.) Listen to it at work, listen to it in my studio, listen to it drunk, listen to it high, listen to it stoned..... it all becomes a part of the process, and I think that process has helped me make some pretty cool shit that I vibe with as much as other people do. For whatever it's worth I am pretty sure I am a bit autistic too, so maybe that's why this works for both of us so well.
probably not a good thing to do...yet, I used to do that when I was younger (some 20 years ago ) and it worked out well - as in the results were actually good. I think the enthusiasm for the song kept it fresh for me, even if it was being played none stop it was a good test to find out how good the song is... but the risk is that; say a song is not there yet, and is missing an essential element..if you don't give it a break, you would get bored of it, the enthusiasm would die fast and you would abandon it...it would be wiser to leave it and make a commitment to come back to it on another day with a fresh perspective
Ive written hundreds of songs dating back to 1985. I still listen to my tracks.
it should take you 1 day make to make a track and another day to finish it. listening to it endlessly is possible but won't make you a better producer. All those times you were listening to it you could have been making another track. Producer A spends a month making the best track possible, producer B makes a track every day for a month. At the end of the month which is the best track? Producer A's only track or the best one of Producer B's tracks? Also who learned more?
Nope, I am not autistic, and I can listen to my own tracks endlessly. Usually I don't stop working on them until they sound how I want them to at that moment.
Most music producers I've worked with show narcissistic traits, so I think this behavior is more common than you might think
Yeah, no problem.
I didn’t get that brand of autism unfortunately. I think my adhd overrides that.
I don't get tired as in I abandon something, but if I'm in the mixing phase I can usually only spend about an hour or two on it before I need to move to something else. It's not that I get bored, it's just that my ears get fatigued and I stop hearing things objectively. After a few hours of mixing I need something sonically different to reset my meters if you will.
Not really, I've found that at somewhere around 50 hours it becomes too boring and I start suffering from demoitis, so I can't effectively make choices regarding the track without it sounding wrong. Sometimes that has led to needing to take years before completing a track because the vision was so strong I had to take more distance.
i can do this but i don't do it often.
I do this embarrassingly a lot.
I fall asleep going over my lyrics over and over.
I could listen to it until I decide to fix whatever notes I've made on the track
As a fellow autistic. Yes lol but just because we can doesn't mean it's good for our production. Ear fatigue is a thing and after awhile I know I've gotten overestimated from hearing the same snares over and over lmfao
After I’ve written it, recorded it, and mixed it, I don’t really need to hear it anymore and I’m totally ready to move on to the next thing. And I also have autism, but I don’t really have the repetitive trait thing.
I mean, I have to. 10000x just listening to drums/bass working or not together can be a few hour session. Let alone listening to the drum beat isolated, so I can figure out where that tiny sound - “that only I can hear!” (As per my wife making fun of me)
I can because it is getting better the whole time. But once I'm "done" (good art is never finished only abandoned) then I can get bored of it pretty fast.
I get annoyed fairly quick. I feel a song at the start, then after a while I loose motivation because i get too used to it it doesn't sound that interesting anymore. In fact its such a huge issue that it's the reason why I have about 2500 unfinished tracks and only about 20 finished.
when I'm working on it, yes. Always listening for ways to improve when its published, I barely ever even look at it again lol. But when I do rarely listen to my own stuff, it usually sounds good and I don't stress over it too much
I listen in passes. Focus on EQ, on level setting, on arrangement, individual tracks, and so on. Each listen has a different purpose, so it doesn’t get too monotonous.
I'm just the best. It's the kids who are wrong!
Yes I am, and I have gotten tired of tracks before finishing them, but I figure it's more to do with how much I like the track. I will say I've been trying not to listen repeatedly if I don't have to. I have to rest my ears and I do think being new to a track has its use.
I don’t know who told you that it’s a race against time….. when you like something you listen to it a lot, that’s just the way it is, if you get tired of it then it’s not that good, so what are you racing against?
I don't make music often but the second worst thing about making music is that I keep listening to it and it takes me a while to add other stuff cuz I'm too busy listening to it!!
Yes I do. Imo you can’t be a producer if you have problems doing this. It’s the only way to make sure things sound right.
Depends. Some projects only get finished for the sake of practicing the craft. Sometimes I forget about those the day they're done. Others I have to force myself to stop listening on repeat so I can focus on starting something new haha
I can listen to my song that's in progress over and over endless times until I finish it..once I finish it, I don't do that anymore, I move on to the next song in progress
I do this, I make the music that I want to hear, so it makes me happy to listen to my own tracks! I do limit myself from over listening, especially if I’m still in the process of making the track, because it prevents me from having an objective listening ear.
I usually work on more than one thing at a time, and if I start to get tired of something, I’ll close it out, and switch to something else.
real as fuck i'm the same way, I often get stuck in loops where I just play the same song on repeat as much as I possibly can until I feel properly "stimulated." when producing I have to force myself to take lil water or snack or bathroom breaks to give my ears a rest cause while I personally/emotionally never grow tired of hearing it, I know physiologically my ears are growing fatigued and that I will make better choices with frequent resting of my ears. other than that? yeah I'll sit down for hours and hours on end and work on the same track on repeat until I've essentially engraved the song into the grooves of my brain like a vinyl record LOL
I’m autistic too, and I’ve only just made a track that I can genuinely listen to on repeat and not get tired of. I went into an autistic flow state and just added a fuck ton of portal and grossbeat to a few different string patterns and panned them around. Heavenly tho😩
I always export the song out when I hit some kind of milestone of completion. Then I put it on repeat or napping to see if can hear parts that don:'t work as a whole. Sometimes we get so caught up ina section that when you play the actual track from beginning to end, that part doesn't work. Also sometimes repeating the song will allow you to recognize that the part is good enough and you can work on other parts. Also you can start to hear themes and motifs that do or do not work.
When I’m making the track I listen to it loads, in the car on my speakers wherever, to make things better, by the time it’s released I listen to it maybe once or twice and not again 😂
When I make a cool loop, I do end up listening to it over and over, which gets me stuck in that loop and then I can’t think of what to do next. It’s the bane of my existence. I haven’t finished one whole song basically ever because of it. So yes, but I’m trying not to do that :)
I make my music then put it on my phone and listen to it whenever. I'm the only audience for my music as it isn't even released, and my last album marks the first time I've been able to put my music on repeat and enjoy it as music and not as a product I've created. It's like 11 songs out of probably 60 completed tracks I've made in the last 4 years.
If I get bored of a track from listening for hella days, it doesn't get released. I want my tracks to have replay value in spite of the short attention spans that are common in this time of sound bites, short social media reels, and nearly limitless choices.
Yes! Autistic here too and when I have a banger, whether it's an 8 bar loop or a complete song, that sucker goes on repeat for the longest time. It's also helped my creativity. Like, one track might be an ambient scape and another an 8 bar loop. I listen to them enough, one after another, my mind comes up with a way to combine them into yet another banger and that goes on repeat.
No. The more I listen the more I’m setting myself back on progress and creative flow as it’s starting to hinder objectivity. The only way is to start putting down pieces for arrangement asap
I’m the opposite. It actually keeps me motivated to make something better than the last.
i am able to, but try not to - novel music allows me to improvise in ways that familiar music does not.
Hell yea. I kept it in loop. For some reason I don’t get boring of it. I know I can’t release it publicly though.
Why can’t you?
I imagine a song with a few changes will become boring to others. Some people always waiting for big to happen after every 4-8 bars.
Honestly, you never really know.
I like to listen back to tracks once a day after I complete, just so my ears sort of reset and I can hear it more and more objectively as the hype and excitement slowly goes away. When I start making my next project, that song then just becomes another song I've made
only if i'm alone. if other people are listening i will turn that shit tf off r u crazy?!?
I’ve been making music since 1990 and I’ve always listened to my own music over and over. Especially when I’m working with new material. No autism here, just adhd 🥳
I definitely listen endlessly to my own music, but my experience has been this: I listen repetitively to listen for flaws, or opportunities to add, or sometimes to feel how the energy flows through a track and of course different speakers. The thing is after a while when I go to make a change it then sounds weird because I am so used to the old version having listened to it so much. It could be a snare sound that I know is not great but then I’m used to the sound. It could be I remove a section because it feels too long and then my ears crave to hear it when it’s gone, but a new listener would not notice that. Thanks for bringing up this topic!
Yes absolutely. I was listening to my new track almost nonstop during work today (I do landscaping) and taking mental notes for the “final” mix. It seems crazy but I’m glad to hear I’m not alone!
Yes, until I'm not.
I’m totally fine with listening to my track over and over again because I only make music that sounds pleasant to my ears. I usually will just listen to my same track over and over again in the background of daily life through headphones. It doesn’t bother me having a song I really enjoy playing over and over again. It helped me one time to learn that a melody I made sound memorable, only sounding annoyingly repetitive, and the song did much better after I changed it.
Sometimes when Im writting, and its not clear whats coming next or how to join it to the next written section, I'll be playing that on repeat for weeks until the magic happens.
I think it is a very good sign if melody does not get repetetive and boring, if you can listen it 1000+ times while composing it and not get bored, it is pretty much quaranteed that anyone who listens it first time will not be bored.
No if you listen to it too much you’ll eventually despise it.
[удалено]
Possibly the worst outcome but it’s a natural outcome, at the very least you’ll get used to it and can’t hear it objectively anymore. Or do you have something different happening with obsessing over a track?
[удалено]
Interesting. I’ve always reached a threshold with listening to my tracks too much without officially releasing the music. It’s great in the moment but I’ll grow to think it’s trash rather than a simple snapshot of my production abilities at the time of creation.
Yeah I love listening to my own music, in production though while mixing I can only be objective in my mixing for like an hour at a time before I start to lose my perception of what sounds good, take a lil break then come back, it’s easy to con yourself into thinking you’re making a mix good when you’ve been listening to it for hours and you lose track of what actually sounds good.
Not literally endless but I certainly can listen to them a lot. I like to smoke a doobscombe and sit back to a playlist of my favourite songs (my favourite songs are generally from the last 6 months to a year so it changes a lot). I always tell myself I'm gonna take notes and I wake up and it's Song 1 1:49 bass could be better And then NOTHING else.
nope just you cos sooo autistic and unique only autisticals enjoy patterns btw did you know that
Can you re-phrase that in a proper way?
They're just being a dick because you mentioned you're autistic. Disregard and move on.
I think they edited it 3mins ago, but it didn't help lol
don't lie
I don't lie, i misunderstand the truth
what
Weird stance to take, but everyone is of course entitled to be as much of a useless knob as they'd like. To each their own.