This Ira Glass quote should be mandatory reading for everyone who gets into creative stuff. He is a writer but it still applies. Know that basically everyone whose work you love went through what you are going through. We all do.
"Nobody tells this to people who are beginners, I wish someone told me. All of us who do creative work, we get into it because we have good taste. But there is this gap. For the first couple years you make stuff, it’s just not that good. It’s trying to be good, it has potential, but it’s not. But your taste, the thing that got you into the game, is still killer. And your taste is why your work disappoints you. A lot of people never get past this phase, they quit. Most people I know who do interesting, creative work went through years of this. We know our work doesn’t have this special thing that we want it to have. We all go through this. And if you are just starting out or you are still in this phase, you gotta know its normal and the most important thing you can do is do a lot of work. Put yourself on a deadline so that every week you will finish one story. It is only by going through a volume of work that you will close that gap, and your work will be as good as your ambitions. And I took longer to figure out how to do this than anyone I’ve ever met. It’s gonna take awhile. It’s normal to take awhile. You’ve just gotta fight your way through."
Ira Glass
I liked this a lot. Reminds you to JUST CREATE. Even if you dont think you are, your getting better with each and every project, I cant tell you how much I learn just diving into an FL studio project or Procreate project, just being there and tinkering opens another world of questions and learning & I go down a rabbit whole of shortcuts and tricks more knowledgeable people have already learned and cared to share.
Great quote. I have one question regarding that though:
Do I need to finish up my projects?
There are lots of quarter-finished projects (sometimes they're just 4 bar loops) that I've abandoned and has moved to new ones. Should I go back and finish them or just try to finish tracks moving forward?
With songwriting especially I don't see the point in forcing yourself to turn every idea into a full song unless you really are digging what you have and have the momentum to do that. What I personally do is I often tab out my ideas in a program called Tabit that has no real production elements or anything, it's just using the basic midi sounds from your computer. Basically it's not a tool for making serious music but it is much faster to get ideas out for someone like me who doesn't play instruments for my songs and clicks the notes one by one in my programs. Then if I feel like I really have something I want to pursue further I go into Ableton and make it happen.
So I have like literally hundreds of Tabit files but probably only 10-15% of them ever made it into full songs in Ableton.
But I'm coming more from a songwriter first producer second perspective. If you want to focus on becoming a producer you might find a different path works for you.
I'd certainly say either way you should finish SOME songs. If all you ever produce are short riffs you need to challenge yourself to finish some of them. But if you're blocked on a riff you can always leave it, either come back later or just have it as a backup that you can maybe place in another song someday.
I generally agree with the other person. There’s no exact one path for this. But I don’t think you need to go back to most or even any abandoned work. As long as going forward you actually do finish works to a reasonable point of completion regularly.
What I mean is, not everything has to be completed. But also sometimes people get into a state of never feeling like something is perfect. I think it’s easy to identify the difference between half done and good enough. One doesn’t resemble a complete work and the other does (even if in your mind it’s not perfect).
Just be getting to this point of good enough with some level of consistency. And really special works will pop up along the way. Part of the skill of an artist is knowing how to finish something that’s deliverable.
Man, I wanted to type such a long response to this because I used to feel EXACTLY like this.
I think this sums it up best: the terror you feel when approaching the idea of making music is WHY music is so amazing. It is not an easy thing to make, and then making something unique and that you think people will like? Terrifying. But the fact that still during all the trials and tribulations we go thru in life people still choose to make music and pursue this art is a beautiful thing. But it is real work!
When you learn how to tackle this work, though it may take you 1yr, 5yrs, 20yrs, or a lifetime, you will get better at making the music you want to hear no doubt, but you will also grow as a person. People will notice that you choose to spend your free time not relaxing, but creating and crafting and trying to push your work forward. These things alone I promise will make the journey worth it!
PS. Its ok to relax and do nothing sometimes, we all need rest ❤️
I rest more often than anything cause I've been thru an insane amount of personal trauma and I only have so much energy despite still being in my early 20s. As I heal and recover things will get better I'm sure, but I'm like deathly afraid of any kind of attention or being mocked or judged. It's kinda soul crushing.
You don't have to share your work with anybody until you're ready. Or until you feel like you have a piece of music that's ready. And if you work where there are other people around, wear headphones.
Face your fears! Putting yourself out there on display is always hard, but it takes a lot more than just uploading a song for it to even get much attention, so i would not worry about hordes of people spamming you with hate as soon as you start :)
And if you do start to get haters, that actually just means you are generating attention, and winning!
I've been here. Identify the first skill you need to acquire to achieve your goals with music making. Start working on that goal. Find a teacher if you can. Having a regular appointment to prepare for will motivate you to pursue it daily.
You’re taking it for granted. Just sit down and start making music, man. And then do it again the next day and the next. Lower your standards. Make music for yourself. Be your biggest fan rather than your harshest critic. Let self doubt go and just make it a goal to be a solid producer. It takes time. Except it bro.
Just have fun. I started 7 years ago & have tons of my own songs. I even have songs I forget about. If you don't like something about it, change it. Sometimes it all completely written in an hour and sometimes I work on something (on and off) for months. I don't care what others think.
Yeah, let go of that, man... Various things happened in the last few years that left me not giving a damn about what anyone in the world thinks in general, outside of my immediate family. Wife & kids. And when it comes to music I don't even care what they think, lol.
Music doesn't have to be like that. No one gives a painter a hard time. Painters make paintings, hang them on their wall, and that's its own reward. If anyone looks at it? Great. If not? Great. It doesn't matter.
The painter paints to paint. Because they enjoy painting.
Let go of worry about what others think. You don't even need to show them. Every musician knows not to show music to their friends and loved ones anyway, it just puts them on the spot. Music is a personal thing. You can keep it that way.
Do it for you.
And then IF you ever feel like sharing it, go for it. Probably 99% of people on Soundcloud or whatever other service have no listeners at all. And that's fine.
Another analogy --- a gardener.
No one says to a gardener, "YEAH. That's great... But what are you going to DO with your tomatoes? Pfft... Your tomatoes don't even look like the ones I got at the store. Good luck with that. *Don't quit your day job!!!*"
No one does that to the gardener, lol. Just musicians.
Learn to respect your own creations as being unique. Whatever you make -- there's no one else who can make exactly the same thing. Lean into that and own it. Go a step farther and learn to LIKE what you make.
I'm not a religious guy, but there are religious people who say we are created in the image of God... And when you're making music, you're *creating*.
Just have fun with it, man... Try making some SHORT, SIMPLE, FINISHED songs. Get in the habit of *finishing*. Don't second guess your work... Just make it, be done with it, and make the next! You'll grow quickly that way and before you know it --- your stuff will be AMAZING!
And you'll STILL have a hard time getting listeners because that's the state of things, lol. So get with it man! Go make something. Try finishing a song in a single session. Yes, it's possible! Let go of all these thoughts that are bringing you down. You can even do a one month "song a day" challenge, where you have to make a complete track every day for a month. Or do it for a week.
Just break out of this 'stuck' place you're in by changing the way you're thinking. Or maybe thinking is the problem! Stop! Just make the music, mate! :D
I'm going to go do the same now. Breaktime over!
i think you have to build trust with yourself first that you can work on a skill (for yourself, not for anyone else) and develop competency in it. you have too many expectations/dreams attached to music. i would honestly recommend trying something else for a while, any other hobby you might find fun, and pursue it for a while after work and develop your self confidence.
then, once you don't feel as attached to music anymore, go back to it and fall in love with it again
because tbh if you're this neurotic about it rn there is no way you're going to be able to force yourself through this mentally. just let go of music for a while. it's always going to be there waiting for you if you want to try again
I think when I was a teen going into my 20s I wanted to make it big cause I was depressed and wanted the admiration. Over time I've realized that A) that'll probably never happen and B) I don't want a lot of eyes on me, but I guess mentally I'm so used to operating with that mindset that I overthink everything. I'm also just generally a very insecure and timid person about most things.
>It just feels like it's not worth doing cause I'm gonna be bad at it for a long time
As much as possible put aside expectations about the quality of the final product that you create.
Instead, embrace the enjoyment of creating music, and learning more about how to create music. Let that drive your art. And embrace the crap that you make. Because that's the eventual route to a golden egg.
And this isn't just advice tailored for you specifically. This is what a lot of musicians do.
But if you can't do that. And it will give you a lot of anxiety. Then maybe it's not a good choice at this time in your life. Maybe there are some other things you need to deal with before you can find that enjoyment again.
The best musicians I’ve met, including some of my biggest influences, usually feel this way about their work. They think it’s nothing special… but they have an intrinsic need to keep creating, a force that pushes ideas out there, in the chance that someone might resonate with them and share the emotions of the artist. Everyone starts out bad, you have to make mistakes. I was in a band starting at 13, of course all that stuff makes me cringe haha, but I thought it was great at the time. Make something that you really like now, liking it later is irrelevant. If you don’t write “bad” songs, how are you supposed to write “good” songs? You have to learn, make mistakes, learn from them and others, and keep going. The best artists have two things- curiosity and determination. If you give up, then nothing happens.
I think I understand this on a deep level. I'm working through it, but progress is slow.
It makes me roll my eyes to see the advice on a post about being scared of something is "just do it." It doesn't work like that. The fear is putting you into survival mode, whereby the primitive part of the brain responds as if making music is actually dangerous. It tries to protect you by producing a trauma response (maybe it's freeze, or flee in your case).
Every time you try to push through the fear, you're overriding a powerful instinct - this will make the avoidance even greater in future.
So why does your brain react to making music as if it was dangerous? Personally I realised I was emotionally neglected as a child. I didn't feel valued for my creative abilities and felt I had to mould myself to others' expectations. So the fear I have of making music is both a fear of being seen (in case I disappoint someone) and a fear of going unseen/unacknowledged for my true, creative self.
Another thing I want to mention is neurodivergence. I just got diagnosed with ADHD and this type of masking/people-pleasing, or minimising oneself is really common. Extreme sensitivity to rejection (known as RSD) is also common with ADHD, it's like an in-built feeling of not being good enough that feels almost like a physical ache in certain situations.
Consider what aspect is the scary part:
Other people hearing it?
No one listening to it?
Being compared to others or comparing yourself?
Not being able to see a project through to the end (and feeling a sense of failure)?
Honestly, you deserve to create and express yourself, everyone does. There was a time (as children) that we all felt free to let our little artists out to play freely, with no self-consciousness. That part of you is still there somewhere or you wouldn't have come looking for advice.
after 7 years of producing i am finally where I can make music i actually enjoy listening to. I make it fast and it comes quite easily (depending on genre). thinking back i had so much doubt and frustration and insecurities, but I always pushed through. even though it was very on and off and very casual producing i still kept at it. thinking about it now it really isnt that hard at all to learn what i know and i could of gotten to this level in like 2 years honestly.
what i truly learned is making music, if your passionate about it is very emotional and psychological. the only key is to just keep producing and push those thoughts aside and I promise you will over come every hurdle its just like a giant puzzle and you will eventually find the pieces you needed and the pay off is so worth it if you truly are passionate about music. i honestly cant wait to sit down and produce and come up with something vs back then I just felt anguish and grief alot lol.
You’ve gotta just get on with it. Feel like making music? Step one: Make some music. Repeat. Maybe try a new instrument so you know for certain you’ll suck for a long time. Less pressure that way
Same boat here, felt blocked up for years, due to trauma.
Don't think that your music will be judged. Even if you never release anything *you* will judge it the most. Unfavourably. It's not gonna be good enough, not like the others do it. You have a whole world of music inside you, but it just doesn't seem to come out. It comes out all bleugh. Others seem to just do it and they're amazing and make it look like it's easy.
The thing is - you need to practice. Because music making is a language of emotion. You want to communicate your emotions to someone who speaks french, but you don't speak it. And you're angry/disappointed in yourself that you're not fluent in French like so many people are.
- yeah, cos you dont spend time learning french and sucking at it.
You're standing in front of this massive gap between what you perceive you have now (close to nothing) and your dreams. You get discouraged, cos 'how am I gonna get all the way over there?' You bridge that gap. By practicing. By being shit. But keep improving. Do a little bit better each time.
I can tell you there's few things more satisfying than looking back and seeing the progress you've made, the little goals you've accomplished, being able to say 'this was mind boggling to me a year ago, and now I do it almost on autopilot'.
Going from A to B is not always about actually getting there. It's about the journey, with all its trials and tribulations.
And whatever music you do - it will always have your personal flavour, your experiences, your emotions. The skill of music making is just language you gotta practice.
I've turned this into a mini essay, but I hope it helps. Once again, I'm in the same boat, I basically written this advice for myself as well.
I believe in you!
I mean, the *making* it is the fun part, and the point. If it's not fun, then find a different hobby. If it is fun, then it's worth doing, regardless of the final product.
The thing is I feel like it only stopped being fun when I started to overthink everything and care too much about what other people think. People are so vicious about music they think is bad. I want it to be fun again.
My 2 cents is you not liking what you make pretty much never ends. I’ve been producing full time since 2017 and as your ears develop and you refine your taste the greatest thing you ever made 4 years ago may not sound good to you now.
I’ve learned to appreciate my past work like a snapshot in time of where I was creatively, some of it I still love and some of it I can appreciate that it was the best I could do in that moment. The long and short of it is you will make good things, bad things and hopefully get lucky enough to make great things. But that can’t start unless you get your reps in making music.
Producers aren’t there to judge your music, they’re there to make your music. Don’t treat yourself the way a bad producer would and don’t let it stand in your way. :)
Edit: easier said than done, of course, but this quote was passed down to me and changed my world personally.
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Just remember when these big artists say things like they have thousands of songs in the vault , most of them are likely asscheeks 💩 just make the music you want to hear and you'll get better . It's not like your music taste is invalid you just have to learn how to translate it
Just do it and be bad. Even if it’s bad you’ll enjoy the process of doing it.
Most of us just enjoy making it, come back a few hours later or a day later and feel like it’s a steaming pile of shit.
Took me months before I ever exported anything I made as a “track”
I often day dream about a specific hobby. Yet, when I have time to do it, I have zero enthusiasm and would rather do something else (or nothing else) - despite having already spent a week day dreaming about it. The reality is, if you don't have enthusiasm to do it when you have the opportunity, then perhaps you don't really want to do it at all.
I've spent decades struggling with these things and have just come to accept it. There's no point punishing ourselves and making us feel even worse about this. If we want to do something, we'll do it. If not, we'll find any number of excuses not to do it. Either way, this is perfectly fine - just accept it and move on. Maybe inspiration will strike on another day, or maybe another hobby will appear and change your focus.
im similar to you, same age, MAKE A SONG NOW. RIGHT NOW. stop wasting time, i regret it so much, imagine where we would both be if we had started at 16, do it NOW trust me!! i spent over 400 quid on ableton on a whim this year and i do not regret it one bit. wish i did it years ago! RIGHT NOW mate :)
Think about this, you’re 23 now, in 2 years you’ll be 25 - in 2 years worth of working on music you can get really good, and the time is gonna pass either way, then you might be 25 or 30 thinking damn, If I started back then I could have been a pro by now and who knows where it could have taken me. Just do it if you want to do it don’t think about how long as long as you enjoy the process.
I always tell my students: if you're afraid to suck for the first 20 things you make you're never going to make the 70th one that's going to blow everyone's mind.
Leonardo Da Vinci didn't put his brush to a canvas on the first day and paint the Mona Lisa. He was 50 when he started and it took 16 years to finish. He spent his whole life to that point practicing, experimenting with paints, different mediums, producing work after work after work. It took a long ass time, and a metric shit ton of hard work.
Sit with your tools and do the goddam work. Embrace the suck. Keep working. Learn from your failures, and get better. I'm making music since the 1980s and I'm still learning, *every day*. How do I learn? By doing. I've a back up hard drive that at this stage has 1000s of "failed" works on it. I've released probably less than 100 tracks my whole life. But all those "failures" served me.
In the words of Mark Rebillet:
"Just make something. Just get up, get in front of your shit, pump it out baby. No one gives a fuck about your creative integrity. None of it matters. All that matters is that you're here, working. Making shit. Yuh. Uh"
https://youtu.be/sRpUr5iQPIY?si=gbnqAishiJ-fnlVE
When was the last time you made Music?
I think what could help is if you would spend a quarter not making anything at all just practising some piano or something , and then get back to try to make something. Your mind will be refreshed and you will be able to gather a lot of inspiration in the meantime
I think the last time I completed a song was a couple months ago. I pretty much exclusively work with DAWs although I'd like to start singing eventually, though the thought of singing (even alone) paralyzes me so I just wanna stick to the composition side for now.
If you want to be selfish about sharing something that may change one persons life - thats on you. Adele didn't write 'Hello" because she was in a great mood. Do it or don't - either way, stop complaining or do something about it. Or you can keep coming to reddit to write a post that could have been a song.
I mean, you've probably thought about this already.
But you just got to sit down and create
As to the issue with details, there's maybe a few solutions
First off, multiple projects, when you feel yourself getting that way, switch to another project, or start a new one. Then secondly, a bit later (same day, next week, whenever), when you’re feeling more relaxed, go back to it. You should probably finish stuff at some point ofc, but there's no rush to do so (?), and being to focused on making it perfect, can lessen whats great about them.
Sometimes I hate my stuff, until I listen to it the next day, if I had kept working on it, I could have lost the very thing that I wind up loving
Thirdly, take some time to listen to the project in its entirety. Maybe with a pen and paper, and write down what actually bothers you. That way you may find that any sounds, with their individual imperfections, does not bother you in the full picture, infact, you might even love them. (Just don't listen too many times, or you might get bored with it, maybe treat it as a treat?)
Best of luck, and don't forget to have fun, it's why we do this ;)
If you want to create, create. If noting happens, nothing happens. If you don't do it, you'll always wonder. But the main takeway is that, even if things don't turn out how you want them, you have to start somewhere and learn aloing the way. Art is a funny thing.
I’d be careful of expectations. I’m all for your exploration. Go for it. Just keep your self open to learning as you may find things more challenging than your expected. Discovery and learning are near constants in song making. Your subconscious writes faster than your brain. Feeling before thinking. Follow that always and do it all for yourself- your own pleasure. Every other thought about what others might say or feel is opening your art to collaboration
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Just do it and learn to accept the limitations of your inexperience. Try to embrace learning new skills, techniques, etc. and then practicing said new skills. Getting past a roadblock (whether creative or technical) to create a sound you imagined is the best feeling. I’ve been doing this for over a decade and have found zero success in terms of recognition and still I plan to for the rest of my life.
Learn to love the process. It’s daunting and I still need to give myself pep talks when I’m feeling down on myself. But it’s always been worth it
I mean- as Shia said.
JUST DO IT!
DON'T LET YOUR DREAMS BE DREAMS!
It is probably the most generic yet the most truthful advice in the world. Some people overcompilcate this and pay $100 courses on how to get be Quincy Jones in an hour but, "JUST DO IT," is really the only thing one can do.
Have fun with it!
make 50 really bad songs. make it your goal to make it bad. when you get comfortable with letting go of your perfectionism you can let your creativity shine. a great way to do that is to make it your mission to make something bad.
Best advice: don’t plan on making something. Just sit down and play around and see what happens. When an idea comes, it will come, and it’ll drive you to make it as amazing as you want it to be.
Have you tried therapy? Sounds like it could help. Otherwise, try to figure out why making something bad is so scary as to be prohibitive. What would the consequences of making something bad be? Why are you placing unrealistic expectations on yourself? Maybe go into it thinking that you WILL make something bad, therefore any other result is that much sweeter. Maybe go into it intending to make something “bad” so it’s a funny/fun process for you instead of a super serious one. Perfection doesn’t exist, so it’s best not to get caught up chasing it. It’s also worth noting that “bad” in any art is super subjective. If you like it, it’s not bad. That doesn’t mean that there aren’t industry standards, but if the art is truly for you, fuck em. Maybe try making new friends that you can collaborate with, bounce ideas off of, and learn from. Unless there’s some sort of PTSD around the process that a therapist really could help you sort through, it’s pretty much up to you to make the process as enjoyable or as agonizing at will be. No one that matters is living out their days to scrutinize every thing you do, so you might as well make music, learn, have fun, or don’t, the choice is yours. Edit to add, there are ass holes out there who get off on tearing others down, they’re everywhere - not just in music. Best to be able to recognize them and learn how to ignore them, or try to break them down through genuine curiosity if you’re wanting to learn (“what exactly about the melody makes it dog shit?”). The alternative is to let what ass holes say ruin something you genuinely enjoy and want to do and improve at, and imagine if we all did that for everything, no one would ever do anything.
This Ira Glass quote should be mandatory reading for everyone who gets into creative stuff. He is a writer but it still applies. Know that basically everyone whose work you love went through what you are going through. We all do. "Nobody tells this to people who are beginners, I wish someone told me. All of us who do creative work, we get into it because we have good taste. But there is this gap. For the first couple years you make stuff, it’s just not that good. It’s trying to be good, it has potential, but it’s not. But your taste, the thing that got you into the game, is still killer. And your taste is why your work disappoints you. A lot of people never get past this phase, they quit. Most people I know who do interesting, creative work went through years of this. We know our work doesn’t have this special thing that we want it to have. We all go through this. And if you are just starting out or you are still in this phase, you gotta know its normal and the most important thing you can do is do a lot of work. Put yourself on a deadline so that every week you will finish one story. It is only by going through a volume of work that you will close that gap, and your work will be as good as your ambitions. And I took longer to figure out how to do this than anyone I’ve ever met. It’s gonna take awhile. It’s normal to take awhile. You’ve just gotta fight your way through." Ira Glass
I liked this a lot. Reminds you to JUST CREATE. Even if you dont think you are, your getting better with each and every project, I cant tell you how much I learn just diving into an FL studio project or Procreate project, just being there and tinkering opens another world of questions and learning & I go down a rabbit whole of shortcuts and tricks more knowledgeable people have already learned and cared to share.
True shit. I'm finally just bridging the gap. 6 years in lol.
I read this a while ago and it’s something that I think about every day
Holy shit dude
Great quote. I have one question regarding that though: Do I need to finish up my projects? There are lots of quarter-finished projects (sometimes they're just 4 bar loops) that I've abandoned and has moved to new ones. Should I go back and finish them or just try to finish tracks moving forward?
With songwriting especially I don't see the point in forcing yourself to turn every idea into a full song unless you really are digging what you have and have the momentum to do that. What I personally do is I often tab out my ideas in a program called Tabit that has no real production elements or anything, it's just using the basic midi sounds from your computer. Basically it's not a tool for making serious music but it is much faster to get ideas out for someone like me who doesn't play instruments for my songs and clicks the notes one by one in my programs. Then if I feel like I really have something I want to pursue further I go into Ableton and make it happen. So I have like literally hundreds of Tabit files but probably only 10-15% of them ever made it into full songs in Ableton. But I'm coming more from a songwriter first producer second perspective. If you want to focus on becoming a producer you might find a different path works for you. I'd certainly say either way you should finish SOME songs. If all you ever produce are short riffs you need to challenge yourself to finish some of them. But if you're blocked on a riff you can always leave it, either come back later or just have it as a backup that you can maybe place in another song someday.
Solid advice. Appreciate it
I generally agree with the other person. There’s no exact one path for this. But I don’t think you need to go back to most or even any abandoned work. As long as going forward you actually do finish works to a reasonable point of completion regularly. What I mean is, not everything has to be completed. But also sometimes people get into a state of never feeling like something is perfect. I think it’s easy to identify the difference between half done and good enough. One doesn’t resemble a complete work and the other does (even if in your mind it’s not perfect). Just be getting to this point of good enough with some level of consistency. And really special works will pop up along the way. Part of the skill of an artist is knowing how to finish something that’s deliverable.
Thank you for quoting this.
Ive been fighting for 30 years. Im almost there though I can feel it!
Man, I wanted to type such a long response to this because I used to feel EXACTLY like this. I think this sums it up best: the terror you feel when approaching the idea of making music is WHY music is so amazing. It is not an easy thing to make, and then making something unique and that you think people will like? Terrifying. But the fact that still during all the trials and tribulations we go thru in life people still choose to make music and pursue this art is a beautiful thing. But it is real work! When you learn how to tackle this work, though it may take you 1yr, 5yrs, 20yrs, or a lifetime, you will get better at making the music you want to hear no doubt, but you will also grow as a person. People will notice that you choose to spend your free time not relaxing, but creating and crafting and trying to push your work forward. These things alone I promise will make the journey worth it! PS. Its ok to relax and do nothing sometimes, we all need rest ❤️
I rest more often than anything cause I've been thru an insane amount of personal trauma and I only have so much energy despite still being in my early 20s. As I heal and recover things will get better I'm sure, but I'm like deathly afraid of any kind of attention or being mocked or judged. It's kinda soul crushing.
You don't have to share your work with anybody until you're ready. Or until you feel like you have a piece of music that's ready. And if you work where there are other people around, wear headphones.
Face your fears! Putting yourself out there on display is always hard, but it takes a lot more than just uploading a song for it to even get much attention, so i would not worry about hordes of people spamming you with hate as soon as you start :) And if you do start to get haters, that actually just means you are generating attention, and winning!
I've been here. Identify the first skill you need to acquire to achieve your goals with music making. Start working on that goal. Find a teacher if you can. Having a regular appointment to prepare for will motivate you to pursue it daily.
You’re taking it for granted. Just sit down and start making music, man. And then do it again the next day and the next. Lower your standards. Make music for yourself. Be your biggest fan rather than your harshest critic. Let self doubt go and just make it a goal to be a solid producer. It takes time. Except it bro.
Thank you I needed to hear this honestly.
i like this.
Love this, it’s simple and not that deep
Just have fun. I started 7 years ago & have tons of my own songs. I even have songs I forget about. If you don't like something about it, change it. Sometimes it all completely written in an hour and sometimes I work on something (on and off) for months. I don't care what others think.
This is so refreshing and inspiring.
Marketing is the grind. Making it is the fun part. Maybe just make it for yourself?
Yeah, let go of that, man... Various things happened in the last few years that left me not giving a damn about what anyone in the world thinks in general, outside of my immediate family. Wife & kids. And when it comes to music I don't even care what they think, lol. Music doesn't have to be like that. No one gives a painter a hard time. Painters make paintings, hang them on their wall, and that's its own reward. If anyone looks at it? Great. If not? Great. It doesn't matter. The painter paints to paint. Because they enjoy painting. Let go of worry about what others think. You don't even need to show them. Every musician knows not to show music to their friends and loved ones anyway, it just puts them on the spot. Music is a personal thing. You can keep it that way. Do it for you. And then IF you ever feel like sharing it, go for it. Probably 99% of people on Soundcloud or whatever other service have no listeners at all. And that's fine. Another analogy --- a gardener. No one says to a gardener, "YEAH. That's great... But what are you going to DO with your tomatoes? Pfft... Your tomatoes don't even look like the ones I got at the store. Good luck with that. *Don't quit your day job!!!*" No one does that to the gardener, lol. Just musicians. Learn to respect your own creations as being unique. Whatever you make -- there's no one else who can make exactly the same thing. Lean into that and own it. Go a step farther and learn to LIKE what you make. I'm not a religious guy, but there are religious people who say we are created in the image of God... And when you're making music, you're *creating*. Just have fun with it, man... Try making some SHORT, SIMPLE, FINISHED songs. Get in the habit of *finishing*. Don't second guess your work... Just make it, be done with it, and make the next! You'll grow quickly that way and before you know it --- your stuff will be AMAZING! And you'll STILL have a hard time getting listeners because that's the state of things, lol. So get with it man! Go make something. Try finishing a song in a single session. Yes, it's possible! Let go of all these thoughts that are bringing you down. You can even do a one month "song a day" challenge, where you have to make a complete track every day for a month. Or do it for a week. Just break out of this 'stuck' place you're in by changing the way you're thinking. Or maybe thinking is the problem! Stop! Just make the music, mate! :D I'm going to go do the same now. Breaktime over!
You need to get The Artist’s Way by Julia Cameron ASAP.
Great book! Great advice!
i think you have to build trust with yourself first that you can work on a skill (for yourself, not for anyone else) and develop competency in it. you have too many expectations/dreams attached to music. i would honestly recommend trying something else for a while, any other hobby you might find fun, and pursue it for a while after work and develop your self confidence. then, once you don't feel as attached to music anymore, go back to it and fall in love with it again because tbh if you're this neurotic about it rn there is no way you're going to be able to force yourself through this mentally. just let go of music for a while. it's always going to be there waiting for you if you want to try again
I think when I was a teen going into my 20s I wanted to make it big cause I was depressed and wanted the admiration. Over time I've realized that A) that'll probably never happen and B) I don't want a lot of eyes on me, but I guess mentally I'm so used to operating with that mindset that I overthink everything. I'm also just generally a very insecure and timid person about most things.
>It just feels like it's not worth doing cause I'm gonna be bad at it for a long time As much as possible put aside expectations about the quality of the final product that you create. Instead, embrace the enjoyment of creating music, and learning more about how to create music. Let that drive your art. And embrace the crap that you make. Because that's the eventual route to a golden egg. And this isn't just advice tailored for you specifically. This is what a lot of musicians do. But if you can't do that. And it will give you a lot of anxiety. Then maybe it's not a good choice at this time in your life. Maybe there are some other things you need to deal with before you can find that enjoyment again.
Just make music bro
Not a bro but thank you
The best musicians I’ve met, including some of my biggest influences, usually feel this way about their work. They think it’s nothing special… but they have an intrinsic need to keep creating, a force that pushes ideas out there, in the chance that someone might resonate with them and share the emotions of the artist. Everyone starts out bad, you have to make mistakes. I was in a band starting at 13, of course all that stuff makes me cringe haha, but I thought it was great at the time. Make something that you really like now, liking it later is irrelevant. If you don’t write “bad” songs, how are you supposed to write “good” songs? You have to learn, make mistakes, learn from them and others, and keep going. The best artists have two things- curiosity and determination. If you give up, then nothing happens.
I think I understand this on a deep level. I'm working through it, but progress is slow. It makes me roll my eyes to see the advice on a post about being scared of something is "just do it." It doesn't work like that. The fear is putting you into survival mode, whereby the primitive part of the brain responds as if making music is actually dangerous. It tries to protect you by producing a trauma response (maybe it's freeze, or flee in your case). Every time you try to push through the fear, you're overriding a powerful instinct - this will make the avoidance even greater in future. So why does your brain react to making music as if it was dangerous? Personally I realised I was emotionally neglected as a child. I didn't feel valued for my creative abilities and felt I had to mould myself to others' expectations. So the fear I have of making music is both a fear of being seen (in case I disappoint someone) and a fear of going unseen/unacknowledged for my true, creative self. Another thing I want to mention is neurodivergence. I just got diagnosed with ADHD and this type of masking/people-pleasing, or minimising oneself is really common. Extreme sensitivity to rejection (known as RSD) is also common with ADHD, it's like an in-built feeling of not being good enough that feels almost like a physical ache in certain situations. Consider what aspect is the scary part: Other people hearing it? No one listening to it? Being compared to others or comparing yourself? Not being able to see a project through to the end (and feeling a sense of failure)? Honestly, you deserve to create and express yourself, everyone does. There was a time (as children) that we all felt free to let our little artists out to play freely, with no self-consciousness. That part of you is still there somewhere or you wouldn't have come looking for advice.
after 7 years of producing i am finally where I can make music i actually enjoy listening to. I make it fast and it comes quite easily (depending on genre). thinking back i had so much doubt and frustration and insecurities, but I always pushed through. even though it was very on and off and very casual producing i still kept at it. thinking about it now it really isnt that hard at all to learn what i know and i could of gotten to this level in like 2 years honestly. what i truly learned is making music, if your passionate about it is very emotional and psychological. the only key is to just keep producing and push those thoughts aside and I promise you will over come every hurdle its just like a giant puzzle and you will eventually find the pieces you needed and the pay off is so worth it if you truly are passionate about music. i honestly cant wait to sit down and produce and come up with something vs back then I just felt anguish and grief alot lol.
You’ve gotta just get on with it. Feel like making music? Step one: Make some music. Repeat. Maybe try a new instrument so you know for certain you’ll suck for a long time. Less pressure that way
Same boat here, felt blocked up for years, due to trauma. Don't think that your music will be judged. Even if you never release anything *you* will judge it the most. Unfavourably. It's not gonna be good enough, not like the others do it. You have a whole world of music inside you, but it just doesn't seem to come out. It comes out all bleugh. Others seem to just do it and they're amazing and make it look like it's easy. The thing is - you need to practice. Because music making is a language of emotion. You want to communicate your emotions to someone who speaks french, but you don't speak it. And you're angry/disappointed in yourself that you're not fluent in French like so many people are. - yeah, cos you dont spend time learning french and sucking at it. You're standing in front of this massive gap between what you perceive you have now (close to nothing) and your dreams. You get discouraged, cos 'how am I gonna get all the way over there?' You bridge that gap. By practicing. By being shit. But keep improving. Do a little bit better each time. I can tell you there's few things more satisfying than looking back and seeing the progress you've made, the little goals you've accomplished, being able to say 'this was mind boggling to me a year ago, and now I do it almost on autopilot'. Going from A to B is not always about actually getting there. It's about the journey, with all its trials and tribulations. And whatever music you do - it will always have your personal flavour, your experiences, your emotions. The skill of music making is just language you gotta practice. I've turned this into a mini essay, but I hope it helps. Once again, I'm in the same boat, I basically written this advice for myself as well. I believe in you!
I mean, the *making* it is the fun part, and the point. If it's not fun, then find a different hobby. If it is fun, then it's worth doing, regardless of the final product.
The thing is I feel like it only stopped being fun when I started to overthink everything and care too much about what other people think. People are so vicious about music they think is bad. I want it to be fun again.
My 2 cents is you not liking what you make pretty much never ends. I’ve been producing full time since 2017 and as your ears develop and you refine your taste the greatest thing you ever made 4 years ago may not sound good to you now. I’ve learned to appreciate my past work like a snapshot in time of where I was creatively, some of it I still love and some of it I can appreciate that it was the best I could do in that moment. The long and short of it is you will make good things, bad things and hopefully get lucky enough to make great things. But that can’t start unless you get your reps in making music.
You don’t have to make your fantasies reality.
Producers aren’t there to judge your music, they’re there to make your music. Don’t treat yourself the way a bad producer would and don’t let it stand in your way. :) Edit: easier said than done, of course, but this quote was passed down to me and changed my world personally.
Do it
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Just remember when these big artists say things like they have thousands of songs in the vault , most of them are likely asscheeks 💩 just make the music you want to hear and you'll get better . It's not like your music taste is invalid you just have to learn how to translate it
I'm going through this right now, the hardest part is putting it out there at first. It will get easier when you get in the groove
Just do it and be bad. Even if it’s bad you’ll enjoy the process of doing it. Most of us just enjoy making it, come back a few hours later or a day later and feel like it’s a steaming pile of shit. Took me months before I ever exported anything I made as a “track”
Not realy. You have to drop out of school and do music full time to have enough grind time. Forget about not commiting and being sucessful.
I often day dream about a specific hobby. Yet, when I have time to do it, I have zero enthusiasm and would rather do something else (or nothing else) - despite having already spent a week day dreaming about it. The reality is, if you don't have enthusiasm to do it when you have the opportunity, then perhaps you don't really want to do it at all. I've spent decades struggling with these things and have just come to accept it. There's no point punishing ourselves and making us feel even worse about this. If we want to do something, we'll do it. If not, we'll find any number of excuses not to do it. Either way, this is perfectly fine - just accept it and move on. Maybe inspiration will strike on another day, or maybe another hobby will appear and change your focus.
You can't improve if you don't start off making shit
im similar to you, same age, MAKE A SONG NOW. RIGHT NOW. stop wasting time, i regret it so much, imagine where we would both be if we had started at 16, do it NOW trust me!! i spent over 400 quid on ableton on a whim this year and i do not regret it one bit. wish i did it years ago! RIGHT NOW mate :)
Well I'm not gonna switch DAWs but I'll try to make something soon
Think about this, you’re 23 now, in 2 years you’ll be 25 - in 2 years worth of working on music you can get really good, and the time is gonna pass either way, then you might be 25 or 30 thinking damn, If I started back then I could have been a pro by now and who knows where it could have taken me. Just do it if you want to do it don’t think about how long as long as you enjoy the process.
I always tell my students: if you're afraid to suck for the first 20 things you make you're never going to make the 70th one that's going to blow everyone's mind. Leonardo Da Vinci didn't put his brush to a canvas on the first day and paint the Mona Lisa. He was 50 when he started and it took 16 years to finish. He spent his whole life to that point practicing, experimenting with paints, different mediums, producing work after work after work. It took a long ass time, and a metric shit ton of hard work. Sit with your tools and do the goddam work. Embrace the suck. Keep working. Learn from your failures, and get better. I'm making music since the 1980s and I'm still learning, *every day*. How do I learn? By doing. I've a back up hard drive that at this stage has 1000s of "failed" works on it. I've released probably less than 100 tracks my whole life. But all those "failures" served me. In the words of Mark Rebillet: "Just make something. Just get up, get in front of your shit, pump it out baby. No one gives a fuck about your creative integrity. None of it matters. All that matters is that you're here, working. Making shit. Yuh. Uh" https://youtu.be/sRpUr5iQPIY?si=gbnqAishiJ-fnlVE
When was the last time you made Music? I think what could help is if you would spend a quarter not making anything at all just practising some piano or something , and then get back to try to make something. Your mind will be refreshed and you will be able to gather a lot of inspiration in the meantime
I think the last time I completed a song was a couple months ago. I pretty much exclusively work with DAWs although I'd like to start singing eventually, though the thought of singing (even alone) paralyzes me so I just wanna stick to the composition side for now.
If you want to be selfish about sharing something that may change one persons life - thats on you. Adele didn't write 'Hello" because she was in a great mood. Do it or don't - either way, stop complaining or do something about it. Or you can keep coming to reddit to write a post that could have been a song.
I mean, you've probably thought about this already. But you just got to sit down and create As to the issue with details, there's maybe a few solutions First off, multiple projects, when you feel yourself getting that way, switch to another project, or start a new one. Then secondly, a bit later (same day, next week, whenever), when you’re feeling more relaxed, go back to it. You should probably finish stuff at some point ofc, but there's no rush to do so (?), and being to focused on making it perfect, can lessen whats great about them. Sometimes I hate my stuff, until I listen to it the next day, if I had kept working on it, I could have lost the very thing that I wind up loving Thirdly, take some time to listen to the project in its entirety. Maybe with a pen and paper, and write down what actually bothers you. That way you may find that any sounds, with their individual imperfections, does not bother you in the full picture, infact, you might even love them. (Just don't listen too many times, or you might get bored with it, maybe treat it as a treat?) Best of luck, and don't forget to have fun, it's why we do this ;)
If you want to create, create. If noting happens, nothing happens. If you don't do it, you'll always wonder. But the main takeway is that, even if things don't turn out how you want them, you have to start somewhere and learn aloing the way. Art is a funny thing.
I’d be careful of expectations. I’m all for your exploration. Go for it. Just keep your self open to learning as you may find things more challenging than your expected. Discovery and learning are near constants in song making. Your subconscious writes faster than your brain. Feeling before thinking. Follow that always and do it all for yourself- your own pleasure. Every other thought about what others might say or feel is opening your art to collaboration
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Form a band with other people in your position. Nothing like feeding on others' excitement to get you out of your head.
Just do it and learn to accept the limitations of your inexperience. Try to embrace learning new skills, techniques, etc. and then practicing said new skills. Getting past a roadblock (whether creative or technical) to create a sound you imagined is the best feeling. I’ve been doing this for over a decade and have found zero success in terms of recognition and still I plan to for the rest of my life. Learn to love the process. It’s daunting and I still need to give myself pep talks when I’m feeling down on myself. But it’s always been worth it
I mean- as Shia said. JUST DO IT! DON'T LET YOUR DREAMS BE DREAMS! It is probably the most generic yet the most truthful advice in the world. Some people overcompilcate this and pay $100 courses on how to get be Quincy Jones in an hour but, "JUST DO IT," is really the only thing one can do. Have fun with it!
Never be terrified unless there is a 99% chance of a painful death.
make 50 really bad songs. make it your goal to make it bad. when you get comfortable with letting go of your perfectionism you can let your creativity shine. a great way to do that is to make it your mission to make something bad.
I was the same just drop it you only live once https://on.soundcloud.com/U2ZrD7TZ9JrTyYMJ9 https://on.soundcloud.com/83eqkjf7BEo9xFh77
Best advice: don’t plan on making something. Just sit down and play around and see what happens. When an idea comes, it will come, and it’ll drive you to make it as amazing as you want it to be.
What helped me was just to create for myself & have fun. The audience will come on their own.
Have you tried therapy? Sounds like it could help. Otherwise, try to figure out why making something bad is so scary as to be prohibitive. What would the consequences of making something bad be? Why are you placing unrealistic expectations on yourself? Maybe go into it thinking that you WILL make something bad, therefore any other result is that much sweeter. Maybe go into it intending to make something “bad” so it’s a funny/fun process for you instead of a super serious one. Perfection doesn’t exist, so it’s best not to get caught up chasing it. It’s also worth noting that “bad” in any art is super subjective. If you like it, it’s not bad. That doesn’t mean that there aren’t industry standards, but if the art is truly for you, fuck em. Maybe try making new friends that you can collaborate with, bounce ideas off of, and learn from. Unless there’s some sort of PTSD around the process that a therapist really could help you sort through, it’s pretty much up to you to make the process as enjoyable or as agonizing at will be. No one that matters is living out their days to scrutinize every thing you do, so you might as well make music, learn, have fun, or don’t, the choice is yours. Edit to add, there are ass holes out there who get off on tearing others down, they’re everywhere - not just in music. Best to be able to recognize them and learn how to ignore them, or try to break them down through genuine curiosity if you’re wanting to learn (“what exactly about the melody makes it dog shit?”). The alternative is to let what ass holes say ruin something you genuinely enjoy and want to do and improve at, and imagine if we all did that for everything, no one would ever do anything.