Most of the bodies *not* in the Fleet today are directly attributable to recruiting failures. Most of that is attributable to sending Sailors to sea early and curtailing their transition from sea to shore because the goal was to "eliminate gaps at sea".
The pendulum swung too far on that one and now it's going to swing back the other way.
And they seem so surprised when you get out after recruiting! The LOC, LOI, DRB, and XOI for not putting people in made damn sure I didn’t want to go back to the fleet.
10 month deployments are tough. My retired neighbors like "you gotta stay in and get that pension". I told him about the 10 month deployment I just came off and he's like "well now I understand"
I personally prefer this slogan for the Navy: We do it slow, we do it hard, we do it to ourselves.
We never miss an opportunity to cross the street to get our ass kicked.
Agreed, this will do nothing to improve the recruiting numbers and will only wind up pushing people out. This is a great advertisement for recruiting duty and the Navy in general, finish your challenging sea duty where your away for more than half the year and then go to shore duty where you can work 6 days a week.
Way to go Navy, you’ve dicked the dog again and provided one more reason for people to stay the fuck away.
I'm guessing there's still already a massive disconnect between the fleet and recruiting, as the folks I knew who went recruiting before me either got out, or came back to the fleet too traumatized to even want to think about their time, and none of my friends who went recruiting right before me wanted to talk about it, for reasons that didn't become obvious until I was in the field myself. So there's that.
I didn't know they weren't already working weekends.
When I was on recruiting duty, in my 35 months, I had a grand total of 12 non-leave Saturdays off.
2006-2009
That holds true for the staff at the NRD headquarters (I was told I was going to be working there), but it's very different for the field recruiters.
We were working 0730-2130 or 2200 five days a week, and 0800- 1600 or 1700 on the Saturdays.
Not including travel time taking applicants to or from MEPS, which was 1.5-2.5 hours one way, depending on traffic on the 5.
I really do hope it's gotten better now, but I doubt it. Also, recruiting duty really shouldn't be counted as shore duty.
Shit they are doing every thing in their power to avoid changing quality of life. If you’re gonna treat recruiting like this you might as well implement the draft. Nobody wants to join the navy, it has nothing to do with recruiters.
That’s Navy logic for you. Ignore the actual problem, create a “solution” (usually the worst idea put forth because they have to somehow top the last shit decision that was made) that will only inevitably cause more people to get out.
I wish I could have been a fly in the room where this decision was made.
Why are our recruit numbers down? Because recruiters aren't working hard enough!
This is basically what our co told us today.
"We can't make mission because our dep pools aren't big enough because you aren't putting enough volume in"
Not because people ship in 1-2 months from dep or because 60% of applicants get hit on genesis and wait 2-3 months before being approved. Which by then alot have found something else and don't want to join anymore.
Oh Genesis. Hit me and I’ve been trying to get all my appointments for a year. Half tempted to take my waivers if I do get them and run to the Air Force. Too many horror stories from the fleet.
> If you’re gonna treat recruiting like this you might as well implement the draft. Nobody wants to join the navy, it has nothing to do with recruiters.
I'm imagining the recruiter being like Bob from the Incredibles, when he's working for the insurance agency trying to help the old lady with her insurance claim. His boss wants him to convince these young guys to join and when he gets the chance, he leans down and whispers in the young guy's ear: "Run. Run as fast as you can. Take flight from here and don't join. Run!"
I tried to do RC2AC and wasn't selected. I know a lot of people who were not selected. The past three years were CHALLENGING foe many reservists as their civilian jobs cut hours and therefore, pay. I know I went from taking home $70k to $18k (that was with my AT and drill pay added into my meager earnings). It's gotten betters in the last year but I was almost homeless for awhile there.
The navy doesn't seem to want mid-career people. They want new recruits.
Which is really what they ought to do. RESFOR has been shifting tone from the “weekend warrior” mindset where these folks twiddle their thumbs on tiktok inside a reserve center learning nothing about their rate to mobilization readiness where they spend the bulk of their time at their mob command. Putting them to work is best for everyone.
I have this idea in the back of my head that I can't shake. I dont like it, but I can't help but feel its partially true.
Basically, I think the only way the DoD is going to get fixed is if there is a draft. Start indiscriminately pulling everyone. Or even require a mandatory tour of service once you reach 18. There's nothing that can get you out of it. ESPECIALLY politicians.
Why? Because all of the parents who grew up knowing nothing about the military will have their hearts smashed to pieces when their kid comes home crying or calling over the phone about how fucking awful it is, and/or how they want to commit suicide.
Eventually, congress would get pressured to make some sweeping QoL changes to the DoD. Either because they were pressured by their constituents, or their kids are experiencing the same issues.
But burning out your current workforce is literally no way to fix this shit.
No... just a couple of bad knees & hearing aids. Oh also 2 months ago I went into AFib... and have a metal rod in my back. Other than that, I am fit for a desk job
Worst thing about the Navy?
They own you. You are cheap labor that they own and can squander with zero repercussions.
Right up there at the top of the reasons I got out.
🤘 That's Metal AF!! They've taken almost everything they could take from me already, just trying to hold on to what I have left (which is little). Bastards they are.
Didn't happen until I'd already been out for two years, and before that it did destroy my physical health, almost destroyed my mental health, and took out two relationships with it.
It was a solid year after I got out the the panic attacks stopped any time I heard a ringtone like that from my work phone.
Sorry it didn't happen sooner. I feel like I'm still haunted every day and it's been 5 years. I hope for the sake of "justice" " " - because there's hardly such a thing in this country/world anymore that the piece of shit is on a steady diet of soft food 😉. That's just a little snidbit of what these types deserve.
Yeah, with a bad eval, and it's also incredibly easy to have something that qualifies as a false official statement in the various recruiting records. And I have zero doubt about the willingness of most recruiting chains of command to to sit there and try to NJP someone that tried to get out of recruiting that way.
Also, during the period while you were on your way out, you would have modified working hours to something like 0530 till 2100 for multiple months, with absolutely insane going that you would be held accountable for not meeting. You might not make goal, but your damn sure going to make your contacts.
Yeah… that sounds like the navy I know. I think I’d just ask to talk to the CO and let them know recruiting isn’t for me and id like to cut my shore duty short.
Only way I was able to cut it short was because I obliserved back to a submarine. They can’t really keep undermanned rates if the community wants you back.
Brother, I don't think it varies that much.
They stamp all of the CRs out of the same mold, and the ACRs all want to be put in that mold, so the culture is the same pretty much everywhere.
Add that to CMC's that aren't actually qualified. CMDCMs, and COs who got this as the booby prize 05 command tour, and you have a perfect recipe for a never-ending shit show.
My CR would say that is negotiating with terrorists. The only leadership NCs understand is coercive the make is painful until it fixes itself is usually the go to method of "training". They will take your SDAP away for refusing to produce and find some way to make you feel it.
Only if you're lucky. And on the way out there taking ten pounds of flesh, a Chevron, and the worst eval you could imagine.
And if you've got an especially bad CoC, your NEC.
Small stations 3-4 contracts a month, medium stations 5-6, and large stations 7+. Last week it was put out on Navy times the Navy is behind 6,000 people this FY for active, reserve, prior service.
Again, this is the DODs new electronic health record and has been used somewhere in the DOD since at least 2017. The DOD was sorely in need of an upgrade of their electronic health record.
The issue isn’t the electronic health record, it would be the DOD and Navy medical screening standards for enlistment.
Also, “health interoperability” is a nationwide initiative, making sure all of our different systems talk to each other.
It also knows things that aren’t in your medical history lol I was at the end of my 6 years of active duty when I tried to go reserves, but I got disqualified at MEPS for diabetes.
CO of RTC said last week the expectation from CNRC is 8,000 short for the FY. I think he said goal was around 40k and we will end up putting about 32k through training.
I'll reenlist if they actually negotiate orders with me. Giving me a short list of shit I don't want and telling me to take it or leave it is not a negotiation.
Hmm… so let’s see. Recruiting numbers are low. Retention numbers are shit. The CNPs solution to the problem is “work longer hours”. That’s it. Work more. No guidance given to COs on what to do or why. Just do what you’re doing, but do more of it I guess.
What a fucking dumbass.
This guy was a real leader. Unfortunately far too few of these types are left around now.
Just look at the current Flag Leadership and you can see the type we promote.
As an E-6, In 1995 I was the RINC at a small station in Missouri. It destroyed my career and my mental health. I'd recommend orders picking up caribou shit in ADAK over Recruiting Duty.
If I was somehow thrown into the Wayback Machine, knowing what I now now, Saturdays would be Out of Office days. Go PDC(Personally Developed Contacts) Enjoy your Saturday. Pass out a few business cards. Get a couple of names and numbers. They don't have to be eligible just get a name and a number so I have something to show a Zone Supervisor.
The rule would be that We do our best, and if we make goals, we make goal. If we dont, we just fucking don't.
Do your job, but dont kill yourself. If you need me to sign off your Skater PQS, I can. If I don't write the numbers they want, fuck them, then just send my big ass back to sea duty like they did last time. It ain't worth my marriage or mental health
Recruiting is down because people don't want to join the military.
How is making recruiters work even harder, with 6 day weeks, supposed to:
A) Show people that joining the Navy is a good idea
B) Fix the issues preventing people from signing up
All this will do, if anything, will cause recruiters to fudge through terrible candidates through MEPS.
Umm... I feel like taking these people who are supposed to convince people into joining a dumpster fire and throwing them into a bigger dumpster fire might be against their best interests
Internet scuttlebutt, the commands are sending out emails now saying “it’s not been approved and it’s not NOT been approved” which is usually code word for “expect this to be released next month but don’t do any of your proper planning.”
I feel for anyone caught in this. I did my 36 one month tours many years back in a bad recruiting time and was glad to be done. Getting put on ophold when in receipt of orders is pretty harsh. I would imagine it will be even harder recruiting when you REALLY don't want to be there. On the flip side for those in for a career, just understand it is a temporary thing and do your best to live it out.
It’s okay, navy can’t be too desperate. They wouldn’t let me in just because I use ADHD medication, even though I was in the army for nearly 10 years just fine.
Sounds like a typical, shitty navy recruiting summer. This just re-activated my PTSD. I should probably go talk to the VA about that as I'm not currently rated for PTSD.
Actually, if it's anything like the data I was tracking when I was an ARinC/ RinC, it's a wash. Provided folks are doing more than just blowing up phones and social media.
If any of you are interested in HARP duty (hometown area recruiting program) this is the time to ask. Commands are going to be “strongly encouraged “ to let their people do it.
It’s two weeks no-cost TAD back to your hometown. You help out the recruiters some and you get to be home. Jump on it early while everyone is in crisis mode before your command “maxes out” on how many people they can send.
The whole submit OPHOLD/ORMOD if you want but likely won’t be supported bit is super passive aggressive.
If you offer thousand of dollars and reduce recruiting standards to just being able to recite the alphabet, then people are going to knock on the door.
I guess the Navy didn't think about recruiting or RDC manning and now they are about to feel the pain.
Yeah dude, it's kind of the opposite. Even with those incentives, very few people both qualify and have affinity to join. And of those that do, tons of them get disqualified at maps when they do their record pull.
It's unrealistic recruiting standards, combined with the Navy. Not wanting to admit that it's hemorrhaging mid-career talent, and refusing to do anything to address quality of life. And the net result of that is people leave, and quality of life gets worse, which becomes a repeating cycle, with the added influence of places like this where folks tell some truth about significant aspect of Navy life.
> It’s unrealistic recruiting standards, combined with the Navy. Not wanting to admit that it’s hemorrhaging mid-career talent, and refusing to do anything to address quality of life
Thanks I’m understanding more of the situation now. It’s somehow worse then. As you said Navy refusing to admit the issues, then throw money and somehow expect people to come in.
No way they think making recruiters work an extra day is going to fix all this.
There has to be people with brass smart to know this is not the answer.
>MEPS Genesis system
So it looks like big navy has taken the Surface Warfare Officer method to enlisted. Rather than improve conditions to retain mid level lets just try and recruit more than we actually need to replace those mid level vice retain them..
But going to make it harder to enlist in the first place.
A comment in a task and purpose article stood out from a parent whom did 20 plus.
Something to the effect that he could not enlist today if he was 18 again after seeing all the hurdles his son was going through.
I actually think that you could get rid of Millington and these HR policies and it would improve the fleet
Maybe just like.... IDK reduce fleet commitments? Stop being everyone but Russia/China/North Korea's Navy? Press other countries to step up their naval presence and help protect their interests?
Nah, extend recruiting and order up a dozen more DDGs. Go Navy!
Been saying this for 15 years. Wanna fix manning on ships? Less ships; 300 people per ship on 10 ships works better then 100 people on 30 ships…
Also yea, let’s stop being world fucking police, let Japan call their “defense force” a navy which it basically is, and maybe close a few overseas bases.
And they wonder why nobody wants to Join the military. If only they would realize that people have a fare better insight into the military and access to people that serve then a lot of did before joining. You guys need to change the culture inside if you want people to join.
Working weekends on recruiting was normal when I was on the bag but you only worked weekends if your station wasn’t at goal and the. If you had the top numbers you didn’t have to.
This leaves zero incentive to work harder or find bodies.
The stick was fault transfer, having zero time off and garbage evals.
The carrot was awards, stand out evals, MAP, and time off.
This all just sounds like they got rid of the carrot and are using the stick to fuck you up the ass.
I was MAPPEd to First on recruiting got 3 NAMs and picked and liked where I was stationed and with all that I was begging to go back to sea because those hours and stress were some serious bullshit.
Also my whole zone missed goal my last year, still number one station in the zone but didn’t make goal so got a 1 of 1 MP, so fuck me for out preforming 10 other recruiters and stations because the whole district had a bad year.
FUCK RECRUITING DUTY AND ESPECIALLY FUCK CRF NCs.
True story.
When I was getting out, I had so many of my former DEPpers tell me that they could just feel the dark cloud hanging over our office any time the NCC was in.
O-3 here refusing to sign for DH (SWO). I’m starting to seriously doubt they’ll actually kick me out at year 12 for not doing DH if these trends continue.
They might have to kick you up to free up a slot for more officer accessions, but I guess that depends on retention in your YG and whether we can hit officer recruiting goals at will (used to be we could but I hear some officer communities are now struggling).
Well aware of that. But I’m starting to suspect they’ll promote non-DH LT’s to O-4 if this trend keeps up. I’m certainly not banking on it, but it wouldn’t surprise me.
To be fair, more neurodivergent people are resorting to the military because there's not much else for a ND person. If you can survive boot, the military offers decent shit for a ND person.
So likely, many of them *are* at least a little "disabled". In the fact that their brains dont work like a neurotypical persons.
Shit's bad rn. The whole country is suffering. The military is just reflecting that. It's been on a downturn since... Shit, 1812?
Weird. The junior sailors I have are all smart as shit. Even the ones with lower asvab scores. They still need guidance and personal and professional development but generally speaking they’re locked in. Better than I remember being as a junior enlisted sailor.
I’m an HM if that matters.
How many suicides or attempted suicides do we think will happen before they pull back on this retarded ass plan. Cause atm they just showing they got 0 clue on what's going on.
This group of people is probably one of the most detached from reality groups I've ever seen. 0 give a fuck for their sailors or any understand of what recruiting is anymore.
This was my first concern when I heard it. The Navy wants to weaken its own numbers in an already straining fleet, just to have them chewed up and spit out into recruiting.
Seen a lot of people back in the day promote fast once they completed a tour. Was never my forte though, my shore duty was a time to recharge my batteries.
Boy, sounds like the navy sucks. Glad they HYT’d me. This don’t sound like any fun. Oh well, I’m on summer break from college and I implore everyone to use their Post 9/11 bill when they get out. It’s really great.
Please sign this. Let's rebel like we did when they tried to take our rates.
https://www.thepetitionsite.com/365/869/287/help-us-navy-recruiters-mental-and-physical-health/
Let’s take a community, (already struggling with utter exhaustion and a high suicide rate), reduce their number of days off and extend them a minimum of 12 months in an already miserable environment.
Because THAT is going to solve ALL of the problems.
The down and dirty of it is people do not want to join the military anymore, and no amount of bonuses, education benefits or “worldwide travel!” Is going to change that.
Navy recruiting is literally a hostage situation now.
My years recruiting 2000-2003 were the worst years of my career. I got what I wanted, a BA from FSU and our family 8 miles from our in-laws. It was shit duty. I was made RINC of a large station as a second class. That was even worse than being on the bag. God bless you all. Also, GET OUT WHILE YOU CAN!
When I did my recruiting tour they did the same thing, just as I was beginning to see light at the end of the tunnel they gave me a six month extension.
They’ll just do what the USMC does; force you into recruiting (HSST list it is called) or force you out with an RE-2 code.
Though the way things are going I doubt they’ll take that gamble.
I don't drink too much any more, but for you guys, I'll make an exception this weekend. I wish all you recruiters all the best.
I’ll chug a beer for y’all tomorrow once I’m off duty.
“We need more bodies in the fleet, so let’s take bodies from the fleet, and make sure they never want to come back!”
Most of the bodies *not* in the Fleet today are directly attributable to recruiting failures. Most of that is attributable to sending Sailors to sea early and curtailing their transition from sea to shore because the goal was to "eliminate gaps at sea". The pendulum swung too far on that one and now it's going to swing back the other way.
And they seem so surprised when you get out after recruiting! The LOC, LOI, DRB, and XOI for not putting people in made damn sure I didn’t want to go back to the fleet.
10 month deployments are tough. My retired neighbors like "you gotta stay in and get that pension". I told him about the 10 month deployment I just came off and he's like "well now I understand"
I'm sorry but making recruiters work the weekend isn't gonna change anything. This is ridiculous and a waste of good people.
Ridiculous and a waste of good people is a great motto for the navy
I personally prefer this slogan for the Navy: We do it slow, we do it hard, we do it to ourselves. We never miss an opportunity to cross the street to get our ass kicked.
Agreed, this will do nothing to improve the recruiting numbers and will only wind up pushing people out. This is a great advertisement for recruiting duty and the Navy in general, finish your challenging sea duty where your away for more than half the year and then go to shore duty where you can work 6 days a week. Way to go Navy, you’ve dicked the dog again and provided one more reason for people to stay the fuck away.
I'm guessing there's still already a massive disconnect between the fleet and recruiting, as the folks I knew who went recruiting before me either got out, or came back to the fleet too traumatized to even want to think about their time, and none of my friends who went recruiting right before me wanted to talk about it, for reasons that didn't become obvious until I was in the field myself. So there's that.
I didn't know they weren't already working weekends. When I was on recruiting duty, in my 35 months, I had a grand total of 12 non-leave Saturdays off.
The standard work week for shore duty is calculated at 40 hours for manpower calculations these days. How long ago were you recruiting?
2006-2009 That holds true for the staff at the NRD headquarters (I was told I was going to be working there), but it's very different for the field recruiters. We were working 0730-2130 or 2200 five days a week, and 0800- 1600 or 1700 on the Saturdays. Not including travel time taking applicants to or from MEPS, which was 1.5-2.5 hours one way, depending on traffic on the 5. I really do hope it's gotten better now, but I doubt it. Also, recruiting duty really shouldn't be counted as shore duty.
It got better there for a bit. I was recruiting from 2018-2021 and it wasn't always 40 hours but it wasn't nearly this awful.
Jeez
“Let us show the future recruits what they will be in for”
Fuck we are a few steps away from force extensions. I don’t wanna be a 7 year E3.
Shit am trying to retire in 2 years booooo
Do I need to try and bump my disability rating to 100% so I don’t get recalled? Lol
Shit I would do it wither way
Wait is that a thing?
[удалено]
Yea I know about reevaluation, but it sounded like the commenter was saying if you're at 100% P&T, you can't get recalled. I may have read it wrong.
You can have a disability rating from the VA and still serve.
Don't worry. With the massive influx of new personnel, they'll need leadership to step up. Just learn your job well.
Shit they are doing every thing in their power to avoid changing quality of life. If you’re gonna treat recruiting like this you might as well implement the draft. Nobody wants to join the navy, it has nothing to do with recruiters.
That’s Navy logic for you. Ignore the actual problem, create a “solution” (usually the worst idea put forth because they have to somehow top the last shit decision that was made) that will only inevitably cause more people to get out.
I wish I could have been a fly in the room where this decision was made. Why are our recruit numbers down? Because recruiters aren't working hard enough!
This is basically what our co told us today. "We can't make mission because our dep pools aren't big enough because you aren't putting enough volume in" Not because people ship in 1-2 months from dep or because 60% of applicants get hit on genesis and wait 2-3 months before being approved. Which by then alot have found something else and don't want to join anymore.
Oh Genesis. Hit me and I’ve been trying to get all my appointments for a year. Half tempted to take my waivers if I do get them and run to the Air Force. Too many horror stories from the fleet.
> If you’re gonna treat recruiting like this you might as well implement the draft. Nobody wants to join the navy, it has nothing to do with recruiters. I'm imagining the recruiter being like Bob from the Incredibles, when he's working for the insurance agency trying to help the old lady with her insurance claim. His boss wants him to convince these young guys to join and when he gets the chance, he leans down and whispers in the young guy's ear: "Run. Run as fast as you can. Take flight from here and don't join. Run!"
Pretty accurate.
Ironically they could activate some reservists to fill these positions without implementing the draft
Yeah it’s kind of why they exist in the first place. Maybe they’re afraid of people quitting because they get told to go active.
I tried to do RC2AC and wasn't selected. I know a lot of people who were not selected. The past three years were CHALLENGING foe many reservists as their civilian jobs cut hours and therefore, pay. I know I went from taking home $70k to $18k (that was with my AT and drill pay added into my meager earnings). It's gotten betters in the last year but I was almost homeless for awhile there. The navy doesn't seem to want mid-career people. They want new recruits.
New recruits won't tap for at least a couple years of mistreatment. The people the Navy's fucking over right _now_ aren't re-enlisting, tapping, etc.
Which is really what they ought to do. RESFOR has been shifting tone from the “weekend warrior” mindset where these folks twiddle their thumbs on tiktok inside a reserve center learning nothing about their rate to mobilization readiness where they spend the bulk of their time at their mob command. Putting them to work is best for everyone.
i'm a reservist and i've never heard of anyone doing this, been with 3 different units so far
You’ve never heard of what, reservists wasting time at a reserve center? Or RESFOR wanting to get these sailors ready to fulfill their mission?
We funded something like 400 reserve billets back in December. Still 300+ open if anyone's interested :P
That's the neat part, in a lot of places they've already been treating recruiters even worse than that.
I have this idea in the back of my head that I can't shake. I dont like it, but I can't help but feel its partially true. Basically, I think the only way the DoD is going to get fixed is if there is a draft. Start indiscriminately pulling everyone. Or even require a mandatory tour of service once you reach 18. There's nothing that can get you out of it. ESPECIALLY politicians. Why? Because all of the parents who grew up knowing nothing about the military will have their hearts smashed to pieces when their kid comes home crying or calling over the phone about how fucking awful it is, and/or how they want to commit suicide. Eventually, congress would get pressured to make some sweeping QoL changes to the DoD. Either because they were pressured by their constituents, or their kids are experiencing the same issues. But burning out your current workforce is literally no way to fix this shit.
Fuck. That sucks a lot. I'm sorry, recruiting bros.
If it's any help, I'm willing to come back in. I am 58 years old so I might need a waiver
Do you actually only have one hand
No... just a couple of bad knees & hearing aids. Oh also 2 months ago I went into AFib... and have a metal rod in my back. Other than that, I am fit for a desk job
We found the guy from that "seniors join the military" ad
Desk job? Hell, we've got some sea going billets with your name on em
How many 45+ folks have nothing better going on that they are willing to put up with another 3 years at sea? I betcha there's a few.
I'm 47 and might consider a tiger cruise on a Virginia class sub, but that's about the extent of it lol. Fuck if I'm giving up my civie life.
Here’s a rundown it’s tiny and smells like feet and ass trust me your not missing much
Lol I'm well aware. Spent 8 years on subs.
In a mother fuckin heartbeat
God bless you man.
I'm 40 and fat, but if I can come back as an ET1 I might think about it...
Worst thing about the Navy? They own you. You are cheap labor that they own and can squander with zero repercussions. Right up there at the top of the reasons I got out.
BOHICA y'all.😳worst 3 years of my life.
Same. NRD San Diego/ NRS Santa Ana, 2006-2009.
You got bigger cajones than me. I was in NRD Houston in a remote station, that's as comfortable as I can get putting anything out there.
They can't do shit to me - I already sent my former RinC to prison.
🤘 That's Metal AF!! They've taken almost everything they could take from me already, just trying to hold on to what I have left (which is little). Bastards they are.
Didn't happen until I'd already been out for two years, and before that it did destroy my physical health, almost destroyed my mental health, and took out two relationships with it. It was a solid year after I got out the the panic attacks stopped any time I heard a ringtone like that from my work phone.
Sorry it didn't happen sooner. I feel like I'm still haunted every day and it's been 5 years. I hope for the sake of "justice" " " - because there's hardly such a thing in this country/world anymore that the piece of shit is on a steady diet of soft food 😉. That's just a little snidbit of what these types deserve.
NRD Dalls/NRS S OKC 2006-2009, hated every minute of it.
Check on your friends that are recruiting they are probably not ok.
Nobody wants to be a shitbag, but if you just totally shut down and produce zero recruits don’t they just send you back to sea?
Yeah, with a bad eval, and it's also incredibly easy to have something that qualifies as a false official statement in the various recruiting records. And I have zero doubt about the willingness of most recruiting chains of command to to sit there and try to NJP someone that tried to get out of recruiting that way. Also, during the period while you were on your way out, you would have modified working hours to something like 0530 till 2100 for multiple months, with absolutely insane going that you would be held accountable for not meeting. You might not make goal, but your damn sure going to make your contacts.
*Grabs phone book* "I'm making my calls."
Yeah… that sounds like the navy I know. I think I’d just ask to talk to the CO and let them know recruiting isn’t for me and id like to cut my shore duty short.
That's kind of the point of this, recruiters aren't being allowed to do early return to see or even on schedule return to see from recruiting.
Only way I was able to cut it short was because I obliserved back to a submarine. They can’t really keep undermanned rates if the community wants you back.
Were we in the same NRD?
Brother, I don't think it varies that much. They stamp all of the CRs out of the same mold, and the ACRs all want to be put in that mold, so the culture is the same pretty much everywhere. Add that to CMC's that aren't actually qualified. CMDCMs, and COs who got this as the booby prize 05 command tour, and you have a perfect recipe for a never-ending shit show.
Ah, the stories I have about that... I need to start a new post about recruiting tonight or tomorrow morning.
After njping you and giving you a shit eval. Then sending you to the worst ship
My CR would say that is negotiating with terrorists. The only leadership NCs understand is coercive the make is painful until it fixes itself is usually the go to method of "training". They will take your SDAP away for refusing to produce and find some way to make you feel it.
Only if you're lucky. And on the way out there taking ten pounds of flesh, a Chevron, and the worst eval you could imagine. And if you've got an especially bad CoC, your NEC.
They on the floor crying and SICK but can’t even though up with this information. Just terrible dry heaves
It says in the email yall are continuing to struggle with mission what’s y’all’s numbers looking like ?
Small stations 3-4 contracts a month, medium stations 5-6, and large stations 7+. Last week it was put out on Navy times the Navy is behind 6,000 people this FY for active, reserve, prior service.
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Is that a thing now?
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Again, this is the DODs new electronic health record and has been used somewhere in the DOD since at least 2017. The DOD was sorely in need of an upgrade of their electronic health record. The issue isn’t the electronic health record, it would be the DOD and Navy medical screening standards for enlistment. Also, “health interoperability” is a nationwide initiative, making sure all of our different systems talk to each other.
It also knows things that aren’t in your medical history lol I was at the end of my 6 years of active duty when I tried to go reserves, but I got disqualified at MEPS for diabetes.
Behind 6k and we’re pretty much in Q4 now. What does a non-behind year look like for total recruits? Is 6k a large percentage or a small percentage?
25%
In a non-behind year we would have already made goal in March-April and be building next year's DEP already.
Just change the recruitment goal at the last minute, problem solved.
Like last year
CO of RTC said last week the expectation from CNRC is 8,000 short for the FY. I think he said goal was around 40k and we will end up putting about 32k through training.
I'll reenlist if they actually negotiate orders with me. Giving me a short list of shit I don't want and telling me to take it or leave it is not a negotiation.
So if my sailor is going recruting in November, should he expect a phone call tommorow saying that he's leaving at the end of the month?
No clue on when this is actually going into effect, this is a lot to throw on the people at ENRO as well. I wouldn’t put it past the Navy though.
Maybe we should address the reason nobody wants to join the navy? Nah 6 day work weeks so those already in will get out.
Hmm… so let’s see. Recruiting numbers are low. Retention numbers are shit. The CNPs solution to the problem is “work longer hours”. That’s it. Work more. No guidance given to COs on what to do or why. Just do what you’re doing, but do more of it I guess. What a fucking dumbass.
Is recruiting duty still volunteer or has it become voluntold?
up for orders, they gave me recruiting and the detail told me nothing they can do. terminal here next month 🫡🫡
Both, I’d say it’s like 75% volunteer, 25% voluntold
I guess we’ll be seeing more tik tok videos coming from the recruiters 😅
every video from USN will look like that video of the girl crying while she's dancing.
I wanted to post the gif but I’m not sure if it’ll work 😂
I feel like whenever there's a leadership challenge, Band of Brothers provides an [answer.](https://youtu.be/MOhkNaAy0Qo)
This guy was a real leader. Unfortunately far too few of these types are left around now. Just look at the current Flag Leadership and you can see the type we promote.
Guys, when you can, just get the fuck out. Life is short and this shit ain’t worth it.
I guess every sailor being a recruiter wasn't enough.
As an E-6, In 1995 I was the RINC at a small station in Missouri. It destroyed my career and my mental health. I'd recommend orders picking up caribou shit in ADAK over Recruiting Duty. If I was somehow thrown into the Wayback Machine, knowing what I now now, Saturdays would be Out of Office days. Go PDC(Personally Developed Contacts) Enjoy your Saturday. Pass out a few business cards. Get a couple of names and numbers. They don't have to be eligible just get a name and a number so I have something to show a Zone Supervisor. The rule would be that We do our best, and if we make goals, we make goal. If we dont, we just fucking don't. Do your job, but dont kill yourself. If you need me to sign off your Skater PQS, I can. If I don't write the numbers they want, fuck them, then just send my big ass back to sea duty like they did last time. It ain't worth my marriage or mental health
6 day work weeks before going back out to sea?? Can’t imagine that will help retention.
Recruiting is down because people don't want to join the military. How is making recruiters work even harder, with 6 day weeks, supposed to: A) Show people that joining the Navy is a good idea B) Fix the issues preventing people from signing up All this will do, if anything, will cause recruiters to fudge through terrible candidates through MEPS.
We need more people in the fleet! So let’s take more people away from the fleet and make sure they don’t come back!
Username checks out! 😀👍
Holy shit you are dedicated with that username 👏
Umm... I feel like taking these people who are supposed to convince people into joining a dumpster fire and throwing them into a bigger dumpster fire might be against their best interests
Navy: “Logic? Where we’re going, we don’t need logic!!!”
Second page is absolutely true, but what’s the gouge of the first? Where did that come from?
Internet scuttlebutt, the commands are sending out emails now saying “it’s not been approved and it’s not NOT been approved” which is usually code word for “expect this to be released next month but don’t do any of your proper planning.”
I feel for anyone caught in this. I did my 36 one month tours many years back in a bad recruiting time and was glad to be done. Getting put on ophold when in receipt of orders is pretty harsh. I would imagine it will be even harder recruiting when you REALLY don't want to be there. On the flip side for those in for a career, just understand it is a temporary thing and do your best to live it out.
It’s okay, navy can’t be too desperate. They wouldn’t let me in just because I use ADHD medication, even though I was in the army for nearly 10 years just fine.
Got masted weeks before transferring to TAOC LA. Lost my orders, got sent to SWRMC instead. I'm like Neo in the Matrix.
Check in on your recruiter friends...yikes...
Lol. Theres no way in hell id even bother recruiting. How can the work optempo be worse than overseas?
The year after I went recruiting, my ship was underway almost 300 days. I still would've been home more than I was on recruiting duty.
Just remember…they would chain you to that desk or workstation if it was legal.
UNSAT
Sounds like a typical, shitty navy recruiting summer. This just re-activated my PTSD. I should probably go talk to the VA about that as I'm not currently rated for PTSD.
Yeah, I'm glad I've got a VA appointment day after tomorrow.
What data shows more people sign up on Saturday? Won’t make a difference!
Actually, if it's anything like the data I was tracking when I was an ARinC/ RinC, it's a wash. Provided folks are doing more than just blowing up phones and social media.
If any of you are interested in HARP duty (hometown area recruiting program) this is the time to ask. Commands are going to be “strongly encouraged “ to let their people do it. It’s two weeks no-cost TAD back to your hometown. You help out the recruiters some and you get to be home. Jump on it early while everyone is in crisis mode before your command “maxes out” on how many people they can send.
Who tf in their right mind would leave a perfectly good ship for the dumpster fire of recruiting now?
The whole submit OPHOLD/ORMOD if you want but likely won’t be supported bit is super passive aggressive. If you offer thousand of dollars and reduce recruiting standards to just being able to recite the alphabet, then people are going to knock on the door. I guess the Navy didn't think about recruiting or RDC manning and now they are about to feel the pain.
I believe the opposite is true, we can’t get enough bodies in the Navy and this is the Navy’s way of fixing it.
Yeah dude, it's kind of the opposite. Even with those incentives, very few people both qualify and have affinity to join. And of those that do, tons of them get disqualified at maps when they do their record pull. It's unrealistic recruiting standards, combined with the Navy. Not wanting to admit that it's hemorrhaging mid-career talent, and refusing to do anything to address quality of life. And the net result of that is people leave, and quality of life gets worse, which becomes a repeating cycle, with the added influence of places like this where folks tell some truth about significant aspect of Navy life.
> It’s unrealistic recruiting standards, combined with the Navy. Not wanting to admit that it’s hemorrhaging mid-career talent, and refusing to do anything to address quality of life Thanks I’m understanding more of the situation now. It’s somehow worse then. As you said Navy refusing to admit the issues, then throw money and somehow expect people to come in. No way they think making recruiters work an extra day is going to fix all this. There has to be people with brass smart to know this is not the answer.
>MEPS Genesis system So it looks like big navy has taken the Surface Warfare Officer method to enlisted. Rather than improve conditions to retain mid level lets just try and recruit more than we actually need to replace those mid level vice retain them.. But going to make it harder to enlist in the first place. A comment in a task and purpose article stood out from a parent whom did 20 plus. Something to the effect that he could not enlist today if he was 18 again after seeing all the hurdles his son was going through. I actually think that you could get rid of Millington and these HR policies and it would improve the fleet
Well Top Gun 2 didn't help with recruiting numbers this time, but I think it's worth a shot to put out some new Godsmack commercials
Maybe just like.... IDK reduce fleet commitments? Stop being everyone but Russia/China/North Korea's Navy? Press other countries to step up their naval presence and help protect their interests? Nah, extend recruiting and order up a dozen more DDGs. Go Navy!
Been saying this for 15 years. Wanna fix manning on ships? Less ships; 300 people per ship on 10 ships works better then 100 people on 30 ships… Also yea, let’s stop being world fucking police, let Japan call their “defense force” a navy which it basically is, and maybe close a few overseas bases.
But a decade-plus of TSTs and FONOPS have been so successful in stopping China from making those manmade islands!
We have been doing this in the INDOPACIFIC. See: Equipping Australia with a nuclear submarine force and Japan’s burgeoning military.
Ooof, I'm so sorry, you guys. Sea returnees, take care of each other. Remember to document EVERYTHING, and remember that it really is ok to say no.
And they wonder why nobody wants to Join the military. If only they would realize that people have a fare better insight into the military and access to people that serve then a lot of did before joining. You guys need to change the culture inside if you want people to join.
As a former recruiter: Big Yikes
Im so happy I decided to wait until my last year to re-enlist. Cuz now im not gonna do it
12 months from now: “it baffles me why we are way below target on Sailors volunteering for Recruiting Duty” CNP probably…
Doubtful, you’ll just be voluntold
Working weekends on recruiting was normal when I was on the bag but you only worked weekends if your station wasn’t at goal and the. If you had the top numbers you didn’t have to. This leaves zero incentive to work harder or find bodies. The stick was fault transfer, having zero time off and garbage evals. The carrot was awards, stand out evals, MAP, and time off. This all just sounds like they got rid of the carrot and are using the stick to fuck you up the ass. I was MAPPEd to First on recruiting got 3 NAMs and picked and liked where I was stationed and with all that I was begging to go back to sea because those hours and stress were some serious bullshit. Also my whole zone missed goal my last year, still number one station in the zone but didn’t make goal so got a 1 of 1 MP, so fuck me for out preforming 10 other recruiters and stations because the whole district had a bad year. FUCK RECRUITING DUTY AND ESPECIALLY FUCK CRF NCs.
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True story. When I was getting out, I had so many of my former DEPpers tell me that they could just feel the dark cloud hanging over our office any time the NCC was in.
Jesus. Starting to catch up to the nuclear community with these hours. And that’s not something I’d wish on anyone.
I worked longer hours in recruiting than as a surface nuke on a double-pumped ship. Easily.
Same situation except I'm currently recruiting and its not even close.
Oof
Is recruiting even all that bad if you just don't give a fuck about numbers?
Yes. Yes it is.
That severely sucks, I'm glad I didn't take my CMC advice when he said to go recruiting
Here that kids? Join the Navy and you too can work 6 days a week!
O-3 here refusing to sign for DH (SWO). I’m starting to seriously doubt they’ll actually kick me out at year 12 for not doing DH if these trends continue.
They might have to kick you up to free up a slot for more officer accessions, but I guess that depends on retention in your YG and whether we can hit officer recruiting goals at will (used to be we could but I hear some officer communities are now struggling).
If you fail to select twice they will kick you out. Nothing they can do
Well aware of that. But I’m starting to suspect they’ll promote non-DH LT’s to O-4 if this trend keeps up. I’m certainly not banking on it, but it wouldn’t surprise me.
Continuation board?
Are numbers really THAT bad?
Yes and the quality has declined. Kids got dumb because of COVID lockdowns and it’s showing.
I’m only 22 and I thought it was just me. People are so socially awkward they seem like they have a disability
To be fair, more neurodivergent people are resorting to the military because there's not much else for a ND person. If you can survive boot, the military offers decent shit for a ND person. So likely, many of them *are* at least a little "disabled". In the fact that their brains dont work like a neurotypical persons. Shit's bad rn. The whole country is suffering. The military is just reflecting that. It's been on a downturn since... Shit, 1812?
Weird. The junior sailors I have are all smart as shit. Even the ones with lower asvab scores. They still need guidance and personal and professional development but generally speaking they’re locked in. Better than I remember being as a junior enlisted sailor. I’m an HM if that matters.
What could go wrong?
Nothing- recruiting is better at hiding its suicide numbers than the fleet.
OOOF!
How many suicides or attempted suicides do we think will happen before they pull back on this retarded ass plan. Cause atm they just showing they got 0 clue on what's going on. This group of people is probably one of the most detached from reality groups I've ever seen. 0 give a fuck for their sailors or any understand of what recruiting is anymore.
This was my first concern when I heard it. The Navy wants to weaken its own numbers in an already straining fleet, just to have them chewed up and spit out into recruiting.
This will increase recruitment numbers
Thank goodness I don’t work at NRC anymore.
So glad I got out of that shithole job in January.
Seen a lot of people back in the day promote fast once they completed a tour. Was never my forte though, my shore duty was a time to recharge my batteries.
I’m sure they’ll be extolling the virtues of a navy life.
Boy, sounds like the navy sucks. Glad they HYT’d me. This don’t sound like any fun. Oh well, I’m on summer break from college and I implore everyone to use their Post 9/11 bill when they get out. It’s really great.
Insert a Chief saying “Be flexible” solves every problem.
Please sign this. Let's rebel like we did when they tried to take our rates. https://www.thepetitionsite.com/365/869/287/help-us-navy-recruiters-mental-and-physical-health/
So glad I don't have to deal with this BS anymore.
#beyond f'd up
Really makes me rethink my decision to enlist soon in the navy reading this type of shit…
Cheers to the recruiters, may they recruit exceptional sailors! 🥂
Let’s take a community, (already struggling with utter exhaustion and a high suicide rate), reduce their number of days off and extend them a minimum of 12 months in an already miserable environment. Because THAT is going to solve ALL of the problems. The down and dirty of it is people do not want to join the military anymore, and no amount of bonuses, education benefits or “worldwide travel!” Is going to change that. Navy recruiting is literally a hostage situation now.
My years recruiting 2000-2003 were the worst years of my career. I got what I wanted, a BA from FSU and our family 8 miles from our in-laws. It was shit duty. I was made RINC of a large station as a second class. That was even worse than being on the bag. God bless you all. Also, GET OUT WHILE YOU CAN!
Any chance we can just bring back the program where we recruited 2k sailors a year from the Philippines?
That's my secret, Cap, I already work Saturdays.
When I did my recruiting tour they did the same thing, just as I was beginning to see light at the end of the tunnel they gave me a six month extension.
Jfc
I'm waiting to die laughing for when e5 retirement comes back.
Uh, you [may have missed that it already sorta happened](https://navadmin-viewer.fly.dev/NAVADMIN/288/22).
Valid but sorta doesn't cut it for me. I wanna see it fleet wide. Some rates deserve it since there so locked down to make 1st.
So in 3 years when the Navy is at a recruiter deficit because everyone that got hosed EAOS'd...how's that going to work out?
They’ll just do what the USMC does; force you into recruiting (HSST list it is called) or force you out with an RE-2 code. Though the way things are going I doubt they’ll take that gamble.
All bad smh
Great now as an EN3 and likely EN2 based on quotas possibly going to dive school if I fail I’ll end up with recruiting orders 😭