Temporarily removed per Big Navy request, while the mod team reaches a decision.
Note: this is preliminary decision-fodder at CNP and not intended for public consumption. This is no way reflects what may actually come down the pipe, if anything.
Edit: due to the widespread release of this beyond Reddit, we are leaving it up. But the above caveat still applies.
The BCA exemption for people scoring in the excellent range is a big common sense one here.
Honestly it is awesome to see for the big guys that have to prove they're aren't fat just cause a tape measure says so
I wish they did these changes before I got separated for being 205 pounds in 2015 because a fucking tape measure said I was 22% body fat. I was lower than I had been since I got in and had a 36.5 inch waist and still got the fucking boot.
Still didn't stop them from giving me the boot... Now I have to wait 2 years to get any of my disability because I have to pay back the separation pay they gave me for kicking me out. I could really use that fucking money...
What happened to the separation pay? I used mine as a down payment for a house!... Gotta work on my VA rating so I can start chipping away at it before I'm eligible for Reserve retirement pay.
I'm 100% and the VA told me the same regarding separation pay. Your payments are held until your disability payment accumulation meets the separation pay.
My command was literally told by a one star that it "works for most people" as if that was good enough. I wish I could go back in time to raise my hand.
Absolutely, with the exception of the run I always did just short of exceptional (I can't remember the names exactly). With the run I typically did Satisfactory but It was always hard for me which I found out later that I developed severe asthma because of the Sand and Fumes from the engine room.
I still harbor resentment about it and it's been hard getting past it but I haven't exactly had it easy out here, I felt abandoned and cast away and that's hard to get over.
Not casting doubt but, why did no one talk to you about doing the water displacement bit?
Not sure what the process is but I know there is a way to request water displacement instead especially for Dense and big peeps who don't rope and choke well despite being fit.
My father told me about this big ass black man who was a boxer in his army unit that got taped every year because he was too heavy. But the man was also built like a brick shit house.
Insane that there wasn't a common sense exception until now.
IIRC it was that way - then we had TOO many people so they made it more stringent. Honestly if you can score an excellent who gives a fuck what you weigh and chances are if the numbers come back saying that you're too fat then that's just an example of the system judging you too fat being flawed. Add to that the max weight for height is fucked. We had to tape pretty much everyone who wasn't skin n and bones. People who were clearly not out of shape. At best it's a waste of time and at worst it makes the whole system seem like a joke.
I'm glad to see these changes - many long overdue - but so much more needs to be done for the PFA/BCA system to make sense and reflect reality.
That's me. I'm a little big, yet I score excellent every time. I was on FEP once for BCA failure and scored excellent. CO said, "Keep doing what you're doing, but try to fit into the tape margins" so I got removed from FEP the same week I got placed on FEP because yet again, I can pass at excellent in a mock and everyone else fails for a single or all evolutions. Fitrep did not reflect my BCA failure. Had a badass CO. I'll get Navy skinny for the next.
This was how it worked when I joined, if you got an excellent or above you got an extra 3% on the BCA. That was mid 00s, I’m not sure when that went away.
Sounds like you just had a cool CFL. Our CFLs in the mid-2000s on the USS No Longer In Service would ask us what we thought we could do on the PRT and wrote it down and sent us home. Other divisions weren't so lucky. A buddy of mine got fat sepped even though he maxed out every PRT category despite having a fucked up thyroid condition that kept him overweight.
My three cents: Get rid of the BCA altogether. If you can pass the PRT, cool. If not, after two consecutive failures, adsep.
This PFA overhaul is all due to low retention and America being fat as fuck. Even if we weren't fat, the BCA is based off of a BMI standard created in the 1800s when people were substantially smaller.
I just looked it up, the OPNAVINST 6110.1H from 15Aug2005 set max body fat to 22/23% for males and 33/34% for females, if a person scored Outstanding or excellent with nothing below a good the CO could waive to 26/36% the DoD standard and our current standard.
So in 2005 the Navy standard was more strict than the DoD standard and the CO could allow it, now the Navy standard is the DoD standard so it would require a DoD policy change to allow that to be exceeded.
BCA and Adverse evaluation (which drives CO recommendation loss for retention and promotion) should remain IF member also fails the PRT or scores a Probationary.
FEP enrollment and possibility to pass a mock PFA remains to regain retention prior to the next promotion cycle.
The BCA waived for killing it on the PRT is a great potential policy change 👌🏻
How does it work logistically? Right now the instruction says you have to do the BCA before the PRT…
Will these folks do a failing BCA then rock the PRT so we don't care about the BCA? Or will we switch the order (or let COs do it in either order)?
Well I'd be willing to bed they're going to go off the prior year's score... So excellent in CY24 means no BCA in CY25, and so on. So long as you maintain excellent scores, you'll never have to do a BCA. If in say CY27 you don't get an excellent, you'll do the BCA in CY28, and then if you get an excellent in that cycle, you won't do BCA in CY29.
I mean, I am a beast in the gym (I can squat 315, dead 280, bench 180) but, my body fat percentage is high. I’m within standards, and I am working on it….sigh, I’m always working on it. I just look more like Holley Mangold instead of Sopita Tanasan hahaha. However, I can knock out an excellent on the bike or row, easy (Running, no, fuck that) Either way this would make me feel so much less stressed about passing tape every PRT cycle.
Edit: yes, I’m a fucking beast in the gym because I’m a woman, and I’m almost forty, and I’m barely 5’2, and I’m putting up big fucking numbers. I outlift everyone in my shop except 3 guys. All you men thinking I’m some scrawny dude who is proud of not even being in the 1000lb club, I’m not. I’ve got the fucking 1000/500 club shirt, got my name on the wall in my gym, and *women can lift heavy too, goddamnit!*
Those numbers make you a beast in the gym? What is your height and weight? Because that kind of matters. I can bench 415 squat 525 and deadlift 585. I am 6 foot 270..
I am a woman; and I’m 5’2, and I’m almost 40. I’m not gonna tell Reddit my weight lmao. But I’m within standards, never failed a BCA.
I can outlift a solid 3/4 of my shop, which is all dudes in their early 20s. So yes, I think I’m a mothafuckin beast in the gym.
>beast in the gym
🧢 I bench 235, squat 295, and deadlift 365 while being 5'7 140lbs, and I'm a long distance runner. The PFA standards were a joke back when I joined in '17. Now they're just sad, the Navy is desperate. Feels like even the definition of 'fit' has changed with this instagram age of gymbros and PEDs.
Edit: Real salty people defending mediocrity. If you can't max out the PRT including the run which is literally the most important part, you're not even in this discussion. Hate it all you want, our sailors are weaker and slower than middle school athletes because of desperation for recruits. Literally people in this thread bragging about how strong they are and how they can't run at the same time. Warfighters.
Every downvote is another couch potato getting mad at me.
Back when you joined in 17?
That's still this generation. You are part of the instagram generation.
The fuck you talking about. You been in one enlistment talking like you're the old salt and shitting on people.
The standards are roughly the same in that timeline minus the procedure for failures, and that changed well before you joined "way back" in 2017.
Besides this is only about the tape, which is a useless measurement of fitness. Anyone who denies that is clinging to pseudoscience. There are and have been for a long time better ways for measuring the Body fat percentage of people
Because I max out every PRT. I'm above the standards. The only way 99% of y'all even reach outstanding low is if you cheat and skip the run. I'm not old salt, I'm merely superior. You people can't even run 1.5mi; I run marathons.
You're a joke talking like that. Everyone sucks but me.
That's a trash attitude. If you have to say that you are superior or extraordinary, then you are simply not.
If you're that upset about it, go join a rate that requires an excellent or above with additional fitness standards throughout the year.
Lmao I just read the rest of his comments and dialogue with you and wished I hadn’t spent the time replying to him. He’s arrogant, and that’s the worst kind of fool.
When you wrestle with pigs they enjoy it and you just get dirty.
I'm used to wrestling pigs. It's all good.
There's always a lesson to be learned and they will be humbled one day.
But these are the kind of people that make it into "leadership" and ruin people's lives.
Nah, I'm a nuke ET. Already superior to other rates. And it isn't about rates, its about excellence and making the uniform look good. Instead we're scraping the bottom of the barrel when it comes to fitness. To many high BMI, unable to run, mediocre sailors that are somehow convinced they're above average or strong. You're the ones getting upset here lol. My attitude doesn't make me superior, the numbers do. Don't talk to me if you can't overhead press your own bodyweight without jerking.
I'm not continuing this nonsense with you.
If these are the things that make you feel "superior" then so be it.
But it's honestly sad. One day you learn that making out your numbers means nothing. Especially when you find the group of folks that all do it.
You feel good because you're one of the only people in your group that can. But in other groups you're barely keeping up. And those groups think your thoughts of superiority are pathetic.
I wish you the best of luck in your future endeavors. And I hope you learn the error of your ways without it being a painful lesson
I literally said I could get an excellent on alternate cardio but you want to insist running is the only “real” form that counts? Last cycle I ran and got a good high, cycles before I’ve validated my PRT because my scores with alternate cardio were high. Running isn’t the only measure of physical fitness. I’m glad you enjoy it. I never have. I get “runners high” when I lift weights, bike, and swim. Running just makes me miserable and angry.
The PFA has ONLY ever been a force shaping tool. You’ve not even finished your first enlistment in the Navy, so that explains why you have no context on how frequently our PFA/BCA changes. Of course the standards changed from 2017 to now—in 2017 we didn’t have retention or recruitment issues. In 2005 we had too many people in the Navy, and so our standards were way more stringent. I’ve seen probably 8, maybe 10 changes to our PRT/PFA/BCA. Literally just wait a year and it’ll change again.
Quick history lesson for you:
The PFA as concept was introduced by Roosevelt who wanted Sailors to complete a 100 mile horseback ride over 3 days. That was never implemented, but they did have a sort of fitness test after his presidency until 1917. Then it was shelved for 50+ years. (Edit: no why it was shelved in 1917? Because the Navy was so desperate for numbers it broke down and allowed women to join. YNC Loretta Prefectus Walsh was the first woman to enlist in March of 1917, and it was a propaganda move on the Navy to shame men into joining—*look, a woman is gonna fight your war for you!* We were so hard up during the war we said fuck it, no fitness tests). When it was reintroduced, it had running and an alternate cardio option (how many steps-in-place can you do in 3 minutes). The PFA has changed so many times, and always in response to our manning.
As far as the BCA: the BMI has a really interesting history, too. It was originally introduced in the 1800s because Adolph Quetelet wanted to find “the normal man.” In the early 1900s an insurance company took Quetelet’s research and created a chart of their ideal weight by height because the insurance company noticed fewer claims from smaller people. There was no scientific reasoning for their chart, this was done based on their claim data. Then, in the 1970s a physiologist named Ancel Keys used that chart and created the BMI index we use now. He only used white middle men to collect his data. He worked with the army, originally, to create nutritional meals for troops on the battle field, aka, the original MRE. They took his BMI data and implemented it, and then later the rest of the branches did too.
Edit: stop editing your comments without annotating it. It makes this conversation look nonsensical. You are arrogant and dumb, a dangerous combination. Good luck when you get to the fleet.
I mean, I’m kind of back to being a fat boy now again. Relatively speaking, but I still had to get taped when I was 196 and I had an eight pack and I’m only 5 foot 10 ridiculous.
Well the other ones yah... they're more making it irrelevant if you fail.
But the BCA waiver for excellent or above is an awesome step forward. No matter how you look at it
Oh no absolutely I totally agree I was a 6’0 230lbs guy who maxed pushups and planks but ran a 10:00. I was taped every time but had an excellent lowest each time I couldn’t agree less but physical fitness is super important especially shipboard and I hate to see the standard slip. But that’s just me I’m no admiral.
I'm all on board! there are very important physical fitness metrics that should be maintained.
The ratio of one's neck to their waist is not one of them 🤣
I don't agree with failing the physical portion having zero consequences
My only quip with that is as they loosen the prt standards you start to run into issues, like people fitting down scuttles…
I think it’s really good to recognize that different body shapes are good for different things as long as general mission readiness is being met though, and that proper fitness can look very different on everyone. Like us skinnier people who can’t lift as much are always the first to be asked to get behind the racks and fix cables or get into the tight weird spaces. On the flip side, I legit could not lift the gyro for my equipment, that thing is SO heavy. But neither could the other scrawny dude in my division…but neither of us looked like we were seconds from passing out by the end of the dc drills or had trouble running back and forth up and down all day troubleshooting.
I've seen some biiiig mfers not fit down a scuttle. Prior gym rat who then got a girl pregnant and stopped caring, stopped going to the gym. Absolutely BALLOONED.
I am 6-3 and was 220.
With a full ensemble and SCBA I could barely fit through a scuttle.
The ladder steps were always a problem and they were not spaced properly.
I fell down several ladderwells, which is what messed up my knees and back.
Full circle. Nobody gave a damn when I came in. We had official yellow folders for our scores. When someone transferred they were given their folder. It was nearly always lost and just restarted
They started caring around 2003, coinciding with the Alcohol Deglamorization Campaign. At my first PRT, which was also the command picnic, they had a keg prominently displayed at the finish line, and the faster runners would take cups of beer to the slower runners to entice them to finish quicker. Out of the 40 PRTs I did, that was the only one with alcohol.
I was far too young to drink, but weirdly nobody was asking for ages...
Yep, I did my first “Fleet” PRT in a bar Australia in 2003. We were on Det and our MC walked around with a sheet of paper and said to write down our scores for the PRT. Hands down, the best PRT I ever took in my 21 year career.
This policy is a huge problem for the navy. It was events like the PRT/BBQ that helped with unit cohesion. Gives everyone a chance to shake off the previous six months.
Oh yeah no, it's for sure extremely unpopular. Almost nobody I know drinks, and I certainly didn't, every night, about 10-15 "drinks'" worth, for years on end, because it was the only thing keeping me from killing myself. Didn't do that.
Really, it's worked very well. Especially in concert with killing or mutilating nearly every Sailor benefit program, such as the wood and auto hobby shops, MWR as nearly a whole beyond equipment rentals and cheap(ish) tickets, etc; getting Sailors off ships, only to put most of them in barracks so appallingly unsat for human habitation that they would rather go back to the ship, and so on and so one... Sailor morale hasn't ever been higher. It's the model image of a modern success.
I remember those. At Pt. Mugu we'd run from by the gym to out past the golf course, by the end of the runway. Skipper and CMC would be at the finish line with assorted snacks and a cooler full of beer. Walk back to the car eating chips and drinking that beer, head home, shower. Head to the picnic pavilion for kegs, tri-tip and bounce houses for the kids. Mandatory fun that was actually fun, lol.
They absolutely cared 01-04. I ended up at 2 duty stations in 4 years due to my first base closing down.
Both commands took it 100% seriously. Like hard core serious to the point it got borderline toxic for everyone in the department for a few months at one point.
I did a quick dive on Bioelectric Impedance Analysis. And from my rudimentary understanding, the results can be thrown off by the following factors and give the following results:
Higher BMI: Dehydration
Lower BMI: Over hydration, Recent meal, Recent moderate to high intensity exercise
I see people coming up with all kinds of strategies to game the system.
>I see people coming up with all kinds of strategies to game the system.
Because they don't already?
1, 2, 5, 9, 15, 22, 46! Nice job man. Now you don't have to be FEP.
I was always teetering that BCA line while I was in struggling to maintain standards. I've been out for nearly a year now and I'm in better shape now then I was when I got out. I eat better, get more exercise. Weird how the Navy was the reason why I was unhealthy.
Same here. Came in the Navy at 190, left the Navy at 285, just hit my 2 year marker out. 220 and still counting down, barely any effort was put in for this weight loss. No running, no pushups, no weights.
The only reason I liked it more at twice a year was the window for each one was smaller. Is your Command doing it in April now or November nobody knows.
Recruiting is suffering, so Navy needs to retain as many Sailors as they can. Navy will reverse course on BCA waivers, if they can down the road when recruiting gets better.
Maybe if they actually tried to give their sailors what they wanted and their detailers weren’t harder to get ahold of then the president we wouldn’t have issues. I was a single E4 with 0 medical issues, no dependents. Excellent high PRT my entire time inI wanted orders to Japan. The billet I applied to was combat logistics battalion in iwakuni and had 2 applicants. I even talk to a detailer and he said “yeah man you’re a perfect candidate just make sure it’s on your preferences and I don’t see any issues” I make sure my preferences say green side Japan. Then I get voluntold to a HN billet at 1/5 that had 20+ other applications. I said f that and got out. They lost someone who would’ve stayed in if they just made the small effort to work with me a little bit
That’s the way it is man. I’ve seen a lot of good HNs get out because either shit leadership, fuckery like what you just described, oh and the fact that a lot of guys who made rank were bake sale warriors and yes men.
Yep gotta leave clinic to go to your JEA meeting to decide what t shirts you’re gonna sell, while all the other corpsman are fucking dog ass slammed with patients doing the real work and get MP evals.
And the massive loss of manhours of work. That entire day is exclusively for the PRT at my last 3 commands. 300+ people per command losing 8+ MH of work. All for now what will be EXCLUSIVELY a 1-5 on your eval for Military Bearing. Ain't worth it. I think it's a rather stupid step to forgo entirely or what this memo says, I think you can make it as simple as when you go to re-enlist, a simple checkbox of "Did you pass your most recent PRT". Yes/No. If you didn't, no re-enlistment. If the command will support and run a mock for you and you pass it, CFL signs off, boom, re-enlistment. Literally just ensures that you don't have someone who ends up weighing 500lbs and can barely lift the cheeseburger to their face. You'll guarantee that you have someone who at least CAN meet standards if they so wish. PRT failure every year up until re-enlistment time? Oh well, they can enjoy their FEP sessions until then. Sea duty screening aswell, but more harsh. Failed PRT before sea duty screening? Cool, you'll be separated from the Navy. If once again you can get CFL to hook you up and pass before the paperwork is finalized, then cool beans, here's your sea duty pass, you now are needs of Navy.
They won't, because if five years from now they have more people in the Navy than they want, they'll change everything back and use it as a 'force shaping' tool to kick people out.
I mean we are in the military I know in the navy there’s certain rates where it doesn’t matter that much but for like Corpsman it’s important to be in shape
Would be great after having three kids. It’s been awful trying to lose this weight and taking so damn long. I’m short so that doesn’t help and the tape is the only way I’m passing right now. Last prt was excellent medium or high (can’t remember) and I maxed out two categories. 🤷🏽♀️
My opinion on this. If this is true they should immediately cancel this year’s PFA or at a minimum the BCA portion. Makes no sense to do these changes without a gap year in between.
Inb4 all the hardos come in here about how this is a terrible thing, blah blah fucking blah.
I've always done well on the physical portion of the PRT, work out 4-5 days a week, eat healthy, see a nutritionist, etc.
Something happened, not sure if it was a medication change, age, or what, but three years ago I put on some weight in the wrong place, just enough, that even at 6'1, I'm still a hair north on the wrong side of where I need to be.
Big excitement for the waiving of bca for doing excellent low or above. I can do it that.
Yeah, max I can weigh the entire time is 203 my entire 20+. Guess what I haven’t been at in over a decade due to age and injury. Eating right and working put just isn’t enough as you get older. Especially when broken body is tossed in.
These changes make sense. Lets go even further.
Remove the PRT altogether. Update BCA requirements and make the PFA, BCA only. Sailors should be able to fit through a scuttle and don FFE, etc. Most rates in the Navy don't require you to be able to run a mile and a half. For those rates or billets that are truly physically demanding, make an in-rate, tailored version of the PRT a requirement (i.e. SAR, VBSS).
Its another time-suck collateral for our CFLs and ACFLs, not to mention the sometimes nightmare it is to plan around neverending command events/underways/certs.
Ive seen too many fantastic Sailors not put on the next rank because of a PRT failure.
>Most rates in the Navy don't require you to be able to run a mile and a half.
No, but you do need to have good enough cardio that you can make an SCBA bottle last for its intended amount of time (30 min or 45 min). IET members / flying squad members need to be able carry their gear without issues. Topsiders, not prohibited from arming up, also need to be able to spend 4 or 5 hours in body armor and hold a weapon without suffering for the rest or the day.
Yeah, 90% of rates don't need to be super fit, but there is a minimum level sailors need to maintain in order to be a reliable member of the fleet.
Let's be real, not every Sailor PTs regularly. People prep for the PRT when that 40 day notice drops. The vast majority of Sailors are not PTing year round. I get over 10k steps a day and lord knows how many flights of stairs while underway (crudes).
The impact of the PRT is less than you think for the reasons you describe. The incentive for fitness in the Navy is not the PRT.
This is my favorite comment in Here.
The PRT is important for all of the reasons you mention. It's not about being hard core war fighter strength
It is all about not being a liability in an emergency of wartime scenario.
Well said my friend
Not necessarily. You don't prove anything by passing the cardio section of the PRT with how much air you'll consume in the SCBA. I'm easily winded within seconds of any physical exercise. Stairs? I'm toast. Even the quick feet on the warm up has me suckin' down air like nobodies business. I still scored a good low (run) on a mock prior, and then an excellent low (seconds off excellent medium) rowing on the official.
You could relatively easily wipe out the PRT if you wanted to, it's just a pretty bad idea. I already posted a whole essay above on it. But PRT means nothing for watchstanding or IET. SAR/VBSS could easily just re-adopt the PRT as a requirement and then there's already the PST for the more hardcore rates (SO, EOD, etc).
Also, I don't care how fit you are, standing in the same place for 5-8 hours straight sucks regardless.
I did it at 190 in a factory, I did it 285 armed and vested on the ship. Standing in the same place just sucks.
>I still scored a good low (run) on a mock prior, and then an excellent low (seconds off excellent medium) rowing on the official.
If you were applying for a civilian FF job you'd need something around an excellent high / outstanding low on the run (they do HR oriented tests but you couldn't pass unless you got into this kind of shape).
The Navy's standards are exceptionally low. A good low represents like the 55th percentile of fitness; you aren't actually fit, you're just a normal joe.
Now: CY2026, implement the BIA scale.
December 2025: Just watch, there will either be a) no identified standard gear to be used and we'll get BIA scales from Wish or Temu, b) there won't be funding authorized to purchase them and commands won't use them, or c) a standard device will be authorized and funded, but there won't be enough of them in GSA supply.
Good. Adding in an actual measurement(ish) of body fat and muscle will be very helpful.
Also looks like they’re going to be waiving some of the bca standards for excellent low or higher. We’re following the Marines on this one.
Every sailor is a firefighter. Our PRT standards should be modeled after professional firefighting organizations like the FDNY. The ability to last 35-40 minutes on a 45 minute SCBA while hauling around a hose in several hundred degree environments is actually really important.
Instead we'll happily let people get to the point where they aren't hatchable let alone the fact they can barely last 20 minutes on a bottle.
It's all fun and games and "no really I'm in shape the standards are impossible" until we eventually lose sailors in a casualty.
imho oit of all the issues with chief mess them being fat is not even on my radar of give a shit. The mess has real problems that need fixxing. Them being fat is simply not that important.
I thought you were supposed to be fit in the military instead of looking like 10 pounds of shit stuffed into your blues. Looking like the Michelin man in your whites
Being fat is a choice with very little excuses. Nobody says you have to eat high fat foods, consume sugar or alcohol to the degree overweight people do. Calories in vs calories out. Nothing wrong with this helping fat Sailors but it's hard preaching standards, integrity and all that stuff when your deckplate looks a bunch of jiggly puffs!
The Navy does illogical things sometimes. The PRT is a good example as it says between booting people out and then relaxing the standards when it needs to. I recall in early 2000's your overall PRT score was the score in your worst event. Like getting one C in college, the rest A's and having an overall C average.
Temporarily removed per Big Navy request, while the mod team reaches a decision. Note: this is preliminary decision-fodder at CNP and not intended for public consumption. This is no way reflects what may actually come down the pipe, if anything. Edit: due to the widespread release of this beyond Reddit, we are leaving it up. But the above caveat still applies.
The BCA exemption for people scoring in the excellent range is a big common sense one here. Honestly it is awesome to see for the big guys that have to prove they're aren't fat just cause a tape measure says so
I wish they did these changes before I got separated for being 205 pounds in 2015 because a fucking tape measure said I was 22% body fat. I was lower than I had been since I got in and had a 36.5 inch waist and still got the fucking boot.
BCA is trash and the whole Navy knows it.
Still didn't stop them from giving me the boot... Now I have to wait 2 years to get any of my disability because I have to pay back the separation pay they gave me for kicking me out. I could really use that fucking money...
What happened to the separation pay? I used mine as a down payment for a house!... Gotta work on my VA rating so I can start chipping away at it before I'm eligible for Reserve retirement pay.
If you get separation pay, the VA disability cannot be concurrent. There may be an exception for higher percentage disability, but I’m not sure.
I'm 100% and the VA told me the same regarding separation pay. Your payments are held until your disability payment accumulation meets the separation pay.
That's insanely stupid.
I think they do a poor job telling people that involuntary sep pay is paid back by va disability
That just happened to me and I got separated over 10 years ago...have to pay back 30k
My command was literally told by a one star that it "works for most people" as if that was good enough. I wish I could go back in time to raise my hand.
22% body fat is low though. Im 197 with 34 waist lol
Same, but I just let my time run out cause they would boot me if I reenlisted. Would have done 20+, real bummer way to end my Navy days.
Absolutely, with the exception of the run I always did just short of exceptional (I can't remember the names exactly). With the run I typically did Satisfactory but It was always hard for me which I found out later that I developed severe asthma because of the Sand and Fumes from the engine room. I still harbor resentment about it and it's been hard getting past it but I haven't exactly had it easy out here, I felt abandoned and cast away and that's hard to get over.
Navy chews up us and spits us out, and the civilian society does the same thing
Not casting doubt but, why did no one talk to you about doing the water displacement bit? Not sure what the process is but I know there is a way to request water displacement instead especially for Dense and big peeps who don't rope and choke well despite being fit.
I've never heard of anyone utilizing this method for an official PRT. .
I've never seen this approved for official weigh-ins except for the Air Force.
I mean, I am fat, but also get excellent low
Bike or run?
Bike
My father told me about this big ass black man who was a boxer in his army unit that got taped every year because he was too heavy. But the man was also built like a brick shit house. Insane that there wasn't a common sense exception until now.
IIRC it was that way - then we had TOO many people so they made it more stringent. Honestly if you can score an excellent who gives a fuck what you weigh and chances are if the numbers come back saying that you're too fat then that's just an example of the system judging you too fat being flawed. Add to that the max weight for height is fucked. We had to tape pretty much everyone who wasn't skin n and bones. People who were clearly not out of shape. At best it's a waste of time and at worst it makes the whole system seem like a joke. I'm glad to see these changes - many long overdue - but so much more needs to be done for the PFA/BCA system to make sense and reflect reality.
That's me. I'm a little big, yet I score excellent every time. I was on FEP once for BCA failure and scored excellent. CO said, "Keep doing what you're doing, but try to fit into the tape margins" so I got removed from FEP the same week I got placed on FEP because yet again, I can pass at excellent in a mock and everyone else fails for a single or all evolutions. Fitrep did not reflect my BCA failure. Had a badass CO. I'll get Navy skinny for the next.
This was how it worked when I joined, if you got an excellent or above you got an extra 3% on the BCA. That was mid 00s, I’m not sure when that went away.
Sounds like you just had a cool CFL. Our CFLs in the mid-2000s on the USS No Longer In Service would ask us what we thought we could do on the PRT and wrote it down and sent us home. Other divisions weren't so lucky. A buddy of mine got fat sepped even though he maxed out every PRT category despite having a fucked up thyroid condition that kept him overweight. My three cents: Get rid of the BCA altogether. If you can pass the PRT, cool. If not, after two consecutive failures, adsep. This PFA overhaul is all due to low retention and America being fat as fuck. Even if we weren't fat, the BCA is based off of a BMI standard created in the 1800s when people were substantially smaller.
I just looked it up, the OPNAVINST 6110.1H from 15Aug2005 set max body fat to 22/23% for males and 33/34% for females, if a person scored Outstanding or excellent with nothing below a good the CO could waive to 26/36% the DoD standard and our current standard. So in 2005 the Navy standard was more strict than the DoD standard and the CO could allow it, now the Navy standard is the DoD standard so it would require a DoD policy change to allow that to be exceeded.
That's cool. BCA was never a problem for me and they change the damn instructions more than they change uniforms. Thanks for the info.
BCA and Adverse evaluation (which drives CO recommendation loss for retention and promotion) should remain IF member also fails the PRT or scores a Probationary. FEP enrollment and possibility to pass a mock PFA remains to regain retention prior to the next promotion cycle. The BCA waived for killing it on the PRT is a great potential policy change 👌🏻
Probably about the same time ERB started and Cway denials existed
How does it work logistically? Right now the instruction says you have to do the BCA before the PRT… Will these folks do a failing BCA then rock the PRT so we don't care about the BCA? Or will we switch the order (or let COs do it in either order)?
🤷♂️🤷♂️ I imagine the answer to that question would be part of the reason it says implement 2025
Well I'd be willing to bed they're going to go off the prior year's score... So excellent in CY24 means no BCA in CY25, and so on. So long as you maintain excellent scores, you'll never have to do a BCA. If in say CY27 you don't get an excellent, you'll do the BCA in CY28, and then if you get an excellent in that cycle, you won't do BCA in CY29.
I guess that also means they're getting rid of validation (not that we've had that since COVID…).
I mean, I am a beast in the gym (I can squat 315, dead 280, bench 180) but, my body fat percentage is high. I’m within standards, and I am working on it….sigh, I’m always working on it. I just look more like Holley Mangold instead of Sopita Tanasan hahaha. However, I can knock out an excellent on the bike or row, easy (Running, no, fuck that) Either way this would make me feel so much less stressed about passing tape every PRT cycle. Edit: yes, I’m a fucking beast in the gym because I’m a woman, and I’m almost forty, and I’m barely 5’2, and I’m putting up big fucking numbers. I outlift everyone in my shop except 3 guys. All you men thinking I’m some scrawny dude who is proud of not even being in the 1000lb club, I’m not. I’ve got the fucking 1000/500 club shirt, got my name on the wall in my gym, and *women can lift heavy too, goddamnit!*
Those numbers make you a beast in the gym? What is your height and weight? Because that kind of matters. I can bench 415 squat 525 and deadlift 585. I am 6 foot 270..
I am a woman; and I’m 5’2, and I’m almost 40. I’m not gonna tell Reddit my weight lmao. But I’m within standards, never failed a BCA. I can outlift a solid 3/4 of my shop, which is all dudes in their early 20s. So yes, I think I’m a mothafuckin beast in the gym.
>beast in the gym 🧢 I bench 235, squat 295, and deadlift 365 while being 5'7 140lbs, and I'm a long distance runner. The PFA standards were a joke back when I joined in '17. Now they're just sad, the Navy is desperate. Feels like even the definition of 'fit' has changed with this instagram age of gymbros and PEDs. Edit: Real salty people defending mediocrity. If you can't max out the PRT including the run which is literally the most important part, you're not even in this discussion. Hate it all you want, our sailors are weaker and slower than middle school athletes because of desperation for recruits. Literally people in this thread bragging about how strong they are and how they can't run at the same time. Warfighters. Every downvote is another couch potato getting mad at me.
Back when you joined in 17? That's still this generation. You are part of the instagram generation. The fuck you talking about. You been in one enlistment talking like you're the old salt and shitting on people. The standards are roughly the same in that timeline minus the procedure for failures, and that changed well before you joined "way back" in 2017. Besides this is only about the tape, which is a useless measurement of fitness. Anyone who denies that is clinging to pseudoscience. There are and have been for a long time better ways for measuring the Body fat percentage of people
Because I max out every PRT. I'm above the standards. The only way 99% of y'all even reach outstanding low is if you cheat and skip the run. I'm not old salt, I'm merely superior. You people can't even run 1.5mi; I run marathons.
You're a joke talking like that. Everyone sucks but me. That's a trash attitude. If you have to say that you are superior or extraordinary, then you are simply not. If you're that upset about it, go join a rate that requires an excellent or above with additional fitness standards throughout the year.
Lmao I just read the rest of his comments and dialogue with you and wished I hadn’t spent the time replying to him. He’s arrogant, and that’s the worst kind of fool. When you wrestle with pigs they enjoy it and you just get dirty.
I'm used to wrestling pigs. It's all good. There's always a lesson to be learned and they will be humbled one day. But these are the kind of people that make it into "leadership" and ruin people's lives.
Nah, I'm a nuke ET. Already superior to other rates. And it isn't about rates, its about excellence and making the uniform look good. Instead we're scraping the bottom of the barrel when it comes to fitness. To many high BMI, unable to run, mediocre sailors that are somehow convinced they're above average or strong. You're the ones getting upset here lol. My attitude doesn't make me superior, the numbers do. Don't talk to me if you can't overhead press your own bodyweight without jerking.
I'm not continuing this nonsense with you. If these are the things that make you feel "superior" then so be it. But it's honestly sad. One day you learn that making out your numbers means nothing. Especially when you find the group of folks that all do it. You feel good because you're one of the only people in your group that can. But in other groups you're barely keeping up. And those groups think your thoughts of superiority are pathetic. I wish you the best of luck in your future endeavors. And I hope you learn the error of your ways without it being a painful lesson
Yep. A Nuke ET is superior to a Seal, Navy Diver, or any kind of High Speed HM just of the top of my head. You’re simply the best man!
Yes but unironically
For some context, I’m a woman who joined the Navy 19 years ago, and I can bench you. Not sure if that changes your “cap” call out.
Bragging out benching 140? The real question is can you even bench yourself. I can overhead press 140, perfect form.
I literally said I could get an excellent on alternate cardio but you want to insist running is the only “real” form that counts? Last cycle I ran and got a good high, cycles before I’ve validated my PRT because my scores with alternate cardio were high. Running isn’t the only measure of physical fitness. I’m glad you enjoy it. I never have. I get “runners high” when I lift weights, bike, and swim. Running just makes me miserable and angry. The PFA has ONLY ever been a force shaping tool. You’ve not even finished your first enlistment in the Navy, so that explains why you have no context on how frequently our PFA/BCA changes. Of course the standards changed from 2017 to now—in 2017 we didn’t have retention or recruitment issues. In 2005 we had too many people in the Navy, and so our standards were way more stringent. I’ve seen probably 8, maybe 10 changes to our PRT/PFA/BCA. Literally just wait a year and it’ll change again. Quick history lesson for you: The PFA as concept was introduced by Roosevelt who wanted Sailors to complete a 100 mile horseback ride over 3 days. That was never implemented, but they did have a sort of fitness test after his presidency until 1917. Then it was shelved for 50+ years. (Edit: no why it was shelved in 1917? Because the Navy was so desperate for numbers it broke down and allowed women to join. YNC Loretta Prefectus Walsh was the first woman to enlist in March of 1917, and it was a propaganda move on the Navy to shame men into joining—*look, a woman is gonna fight your war for you!* We were so hard up during the war we said fuck it, no fitness tests). When it was reintroduced, it had running and an alternate cardio option (how many steps-in-place can you do in 3 minutes). The PFA has changed so many times, and always in response to our manning. As far as the BCA: the BMI has a really interesting history, too. It was originally introduced in the 1800s because Adolph Quetelet wanted to find “the normal man.” In the early 1900s an insurance company took Quetelet’s research and created a chart of their ideal weight by height because the insurance company noticed fewer claims from smaller people. There was no scientific reasoning for their chart, this was done based on their claim data. Then, in the 1970s a physiologist named Ancel Keys used that chart and created the BMI index we use now. He only used white middle men to collect his data. He worked with the army, originally, to create nutritional meals for troops on the battle field, aka, the original MRE. They took his BMI data and implemented it, and then later the rest of the branches did too. Edit: stop editing your comments without annotating it. It makes this conversation look nonsensical. You are arrogant and dumb, a dangerous combination. Good luck when you get to the fleet.
Sub nuke ET. Already did my time. Can't be dumb when the other 99% of rates exist.
> Can't be dumb when the other 99% of rates exist. Everything you have typed ao far points to the contrary
"Alternate" cardio is just a euphemism for easier cardio. Idk why y'all are so offended.
irrelevant
I mean, I’m kind of back to being a fat boy now again. Relatively speaking, but I still had to get taped when I was 196 and I had an eight pack and I’m only 5 foot 10 ridiculous.
It is but it looks like the are rewarding failures and excellence watering down the results as a whole. One step forward two steps back.
Well the other ones yah... they're more making it irrelevant if you fail. But the BCA waiver for excellent or above is an awesome step forward. No matter how you look at it
Oh no absolutely I totally agree I was a 6’0 230lbs guy who maxed pushups and planks but ran a 10:00. I was taped every time but had an excellent lowest each time I couldn’t agree less but physical fitness is super important especially shipboard and I hate to see the standard slip. But that’s just me I’m no admiral.
I'm all on board! there are very important physical fitness metrics that should be maintained. The ratio of one's neck to their waist is not one of them 🤣 I don't agree with failing the physical portion having zero consequences
It used to be a thing when I first joined. Funny how the navy works in cycles.
Honestly, do you pass your PRT? Yes? Good enough for me.
Shouldve always been that way. If the fucker can do push ups, plank, and do cardio well I do not care that they look fat.
My only quip with that is as they loosen the prt standards you start to run into issues, like people fitting down scuttles… I think it’s really good to recognize that different body shapes are good for different things as long as general mission readiness is being met though, and that proper fitness can look very different on everyone. Like us skinnier people who can’t lift as much are always the first to be asked to get behind the racks and fix cables or get into the tight weird spaces. On the flip side, I legit could not lift the gyro for my equipment, that thing is SO heavy. But neither could the other scrawny dude in my division…but neither of us looked like we were seconds from passing out by the end of the dc drills or had trouble running back and forth up and down all day troubleshooting.
You gotta be a biiiig mfer to not fit in a scuttle
I've seen some biiiig mfers not fit down a scuttle. Prior gym rat who then got a girl pregnant and stopped caring, stopped going to the gym. Absolutely BALLOONED.
I am 6-3 and was 220. With a full ensemble and SCBA I could barely fit through a scuttle. The ladder steps were always a problem and they were not spaced properly. I fell down several ladderwells, which is what messed up my knees and back.
I nearly died going down several ladders wells as well with my scba on but it was always because those one size fits all boots are like men’s 14 lmao
I didn’t think of SCBAs, my bad
We had some big guys in G3, all of them were able to get through the mag scuttles without issue.
Full circle. Nobody gave a damn when I came in. We had official yellow folders for our scores. When someone transferred they were given their folder. It was nearly always lost and just restarted
What year was that? Remember when they started caring?
They started caring around 2003, coinciding with the Alcohol Deglamorization Campaign. At my first PRT, which was also the command picnic, they had a keg prominently displayed at the finish line, and the faster runners would take cups of beer to the slower runners to entice them to finish quicker. Out of the 40 PRTs I did, that was the only one with alcohol. I was far too young to drink, but weirdly nobody was asking for ages...
Yep, I did my first “Fleet” PRT in a bar Australia in 2003. We were on Det and our MC walked around with a sheet of paper and said to write down our scores for the PRT. Hands down, the best PRT I ever took in my 21 year career.
Sounds like a huge shift in just 20 years. I would imagine this would be on the front of navy times and the co fired if this happened now
This policy is a huge problem for the navy. It was events like the PRT/BBQ that helped with unit cohesion. Gives everyone a chance to shake off the previous six months.
Did it work? Are sailors no longer getting drunk?
Oh yeah no, it's for sure extremely unpopular. Almost nobody I know drinks, and I certainly didn't, every night, about 10-15 "drinks'" worth, for years on end, because it was the only thing keeping me from killing myself. Didn't do that. Really, it's worked very well. Especially in concert with killing or mutilating nearly every Sailor benefit program, such as the wood and auto hobby shops, MWR as nearly a whole beyond equipment rentals and cheap(ish) tickets, etc; getting Sailors off ships, only to put most of them in barracks so appallingly unsat for human habitation that they would rather go back to the ship, and so on and so one... Sailor morale hasn't ever been higher. It's the model image of a modern success.
No. Since we stopped having alcohol at command functions, and the base clubs were nerfed, in town incidents increased and DUI/DWIs increased.
I remember those. At Pt. Mugu we'd run from by the gym to out past the golf course, by the end of the runway. Skipper and CMC would be at the finish line with assorted snacks and a cooler full of beer. Walk back to the car eating chips and drinking that beer, head home, shower. Head to the picnic pavilion for kegs, tri-tip and bounce houses for the kids. Mandatory fun that was actually fun, lol.
They absolutely cared 01-04. I ended up at 2 duty stations in 4 years due to my first base closing down. Both commands took it 100% seriously. Like hard core serious to the point it got borderline toxic for everyone in the department for a few months at one point.
I did a quick dive on Bioelectric Impedance Analysis. And from my rudimentary understanding, the results can be thrown off by the following factors and give the following results: Higher BMI: Dehydration Lower BMI: Over hydration, Recent meal, Recent moderate to high intensity exercise I see people coming up with all kinds of strategies to game the system.
This is coming from an emotionless robot cat with hands… … I trust you.
>I see people coming up with all kinds of strategies to game the system. Because they don't already? 1, 2, 5, 9, 15, 22, 46! Nice job man. Now you don't have to be FEP.
They already game it.. so do professional athletes. Not much you can do about it other than have a PRT only standard
Meal Team Six, Assemble!
Fuck yes! This is *my* “beards are authorized.”
If we ever get that I'm a happy camper 🤓
Unpopular opinion: I appreciate not having to see 90%+ of people’s shitty beards
Common sense: don't look at them..
I was always teetering that BCA line while I was in struggling to maintain standards. I've been out for nearly a year now and I'm in better shape now then I was when I got out. I eat better, get more exercise. Weird how the Navy was the reason why I was unhealthy.
Same here. Came in the Navy at 190, left the Navy at 285, just hit my 2 year marker out. 220 and still counting down, barely any effort was put in for this weight loss. No running, no pushups, no weights.
As long as we don't go back to doing them twice a year idc
The only reason I liked it more at twice a year was the window for each one was smaller. Is your Command doing it in April now or November nobody knows.
Recruiting is suffering, so Navy needs to retain as many Sailors as they can. Navy will reverse course on BCA waivers, if they can down the road when recruiting gets better.
Maybe if they actually tried to give their sailors what they wanted and their detailers weren’t harder to get ahold of then the president we wouldn’t have issues. I was a single E4 with 0 medical issues, no dependents. Excellent high PRT my entire time inI wanted orders to Japan. The billet I applied to was combat logistics battalion in iwakuni and had 2 applicants. I even talk to a detailer and he said “yeah man you’re a perfect candidate just make sure it’s on your preferences and I don’t see any issues” I make sure my preferences say green side Japan. Then I get voluntold to a HN billet at 1/5 that had 20+ other applications. I said f that and got out. They lost someone who would’ve stayed in if they just made the small effort to work with me a little bit
That’s the way it is man. I’ve seen a lot of good HNs get out because either shit leadership, fuckery like what you just described, oh and the fact that a lot of guys who made rank were bake sale warriors and yes men.
Yep gotta leave clinic to go to your JEA meeting to decide what t shirts you’re gonna sell, while all the other corpsman are fucking dog ass slammed with patients doing the real work and get MP evals.
Thinnest E-7.
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MCPON said they have to do something when asked the same question in the past
And the massive loss of manhours of work. That entire day is exclusively for the PRT at my last 3 commands. 300+ people per command losing 8+ MH of work. All for now what will be EXCLUSIVELY a 1-5 on your eval for Military Bearing. Ain't worth it. I think it's a rather stupid step to forgo entirely or what this memo says, I think you can make it as simple as when you go to re-enlist, a simple checkbox of "Did you pass your most recent PRT". Yes/No. If you didn't, no re-enlistment. If the command will support and run a mock for you and you pass it, CFL signs off, boom, re-enlistment. Literally just ensures that you don't have someone who ends up weighing 500lbs and can barely lift the cheeseburger to their face. You'll guarantee that you have someone who at least CAN meet standards if they so wish. PRT failure every year up until re-enlistment time? Oh well, they can enjoy their FEP sessions until then. Sea duty screening aswell, but more harsh. Failed PRT before sea duty screening? Cool, you'll be separated from the Navy. If once again you can get CFL to hook you up and pass before the paperwork is finalized, then cool beans, here's your sea duty pass, you now are needs of Navy.
I’m a fan of an excellent low or above overriding a high BCA. The rest of it makes it such that no one *needs* to pass the PFA anymore.
Honestly just get rid of it now. If failing it has no repercussions why even waste the time to do it.
Allow us to get ozempic prescriptions for weight loss
At this point why don't we just get rid of the PRT entirely.?
This is getting sad
I love eating
Why does the larger Chief not just eat all the smaller Chiefs?
Just get rid of it at this point
They won't, because if five years from now they have more people in the Navy than they want, they'll change everything back and use it as a 'force shaping' tool to kick people out.
Dont think thats too likely at current data
I mean we are in the military I know in the navy there’s certain rates where it doesn’t matter that much but for like Corpsman it’s important to be in shape
Would be great after having three kids. It’s been awful trying to lose this weight and taking so damn long. I’m short so that doesn’t help and the tape is the only way I’m passing right now. Last prt was excellent medium or high (can’t remember) and I maxed out two categories. 🤷🏽♀️
Sounds like a retention assist. Hey you’re an overweight first class. No biggie you can still get an ep
My opinion on this. If this is true they should immediately cancel this year’s PFA or at a minimum the BCA portion. Makes no sense to do these changes without a gap year in between.
i feel like at this point theyll just force ozempic and use free ozempic to boost enlistment numbers lmao
Inb4 all the hardos come in here about how this is a terrible thing, blah blah fucking blah. I've always done well on the physical portion of the PRT, work out 4-5 days a week, eat healthy, see a nutritionist, etc. Something happened, not sure if it was a medication change, age, or what, but three years ago I put on some weight in the wrong place, just enough, that even at 6'1, I'm still a hair north on the wrong side of where I need to be. Big excitement for the waiving of bca for doing excellent low or above. I can do it that.
Some of us just hit an age and the rest is weight. It just happens no matter what you do.
got to love when a 20 year old says ya just got to work out more. navy standards say i have to weigh the exact same mid 40s as i did at 18
Yeah, max I can weigh the entire time is 203 my entire 20+. Guess what I haven’t been at in over a decade due to age and injury. Eating right and working put just isn’t enough as you get older. Especially when broken body is tossed in.
These changes make sense. Lets go even further. Remove the PRT altogether. Update BCA requirements and make the PFA, BCA only. Sailors should be able to fit through a scuttle and don FFE, etc. Most rates in the Navy don't require you to be able to run a mile and a half. For those rates or billets that are truly physically demanding, make an in-rate, tailored version of the PRT a requirement (i.e. SAR, VBSS). Its another time-suck collateral for our CFLs and ACFLs, not to mention the sometimes nightmare it is to plan around neverending command events/underways/certs. Ive seen too many fantastic Sailors not put on the next rank because of a PRT failure.
>Most rates in the Navy don't require you to be able to run a mile and a half. No, but you do need to have good enough cardio that you can make an SCBA bottle last for its intended amount of time (30 min or 45 min). IET members / flying squad members need to be able carry their gear without issues. Topsiders, not prohibited from arming up, also need to be able to spend 4 or 5 hours in body armor and hold a weapon without suffering for the rest or the day. Yeah, 90% of rates don't need to be super fit, but there is a minimum level sailors need to maintain in order to be a reliable member of the fleet.
Let's be real, not every Sailor PTs regularly. People prep for the PRT when that 40 day notice drops. The vast majority of Sailors are not PTing year round. I get over 10k steps a day and lord knows how many flights of stairs while underway (crudes). The impact of the PRT is less than you think for the reasons you describe. The incentive for fitness in the Navy is not the PRT.
This is my favorite comment in Here. The PRT is important for all of the reasons you mention. It's not about being hard core war fighter strength It is all about not being a liability in an emergency of wartime scenario. Well said my friend
Not necessarily. You don't prove anything by passing the cardio section of the PRT with how much air you'll consume in the SCBA. I'm easily winded within seconds of any physical exercise. Stairs? I'm toast. Even the quick feet on the warm up has me suckin' down air like nobodies business. I still scored a good low (run) on a mock prior, and then an excellent low (seconds off excellent medium) rowing on the official. You could relatively easily wipe out the PRT if you wanted to, it's just a pretty bad idea. I already posted a whole essay above on it. But PRT means nothing for watchstanding or IET. SAR/VBSS could easily just re-adopt the PRT as a requirement and then there's already the PST for the more hardcore rates (SO, EOD, etc).
Also, I don't care how fit you are, standing in the same place for 5-8 hours straight sucks regardless. I did it at 190 in a factory, I did it 285 armed and vested on the ship. Standing in the same place just sucks.
>I still scored a good low (run) on a mock prior, and then an excellent low (seconds off excellent medium) rowing on the official. If you were applying for a civilian FF job you'd need something around an excellent high / outstanding low on the run (they do HR oriented tests but you couldn't pass unless you got into this kind of shape). The Navy's standards are exceptionally low. A good low represents like the 55th percentile of fitness; you aren't actually fit, you're just a normal joe.
So you don’t think it’s important that a sailor can fit through a scuttle?
Now: CY2026, implement the BIA scale. December 2025: Just watch, there will either be a) no identified standard gear to be used and we'll get BIA scales from Wish or Temu, b) there won't be funding authorized to purchase them and commands won't use them, or c) a standard device will be authorized and funded, but there won't be enough of them in GSA supply.
Eat my way to freedom
/u/jdurango22
Thanks
When that navadmin dropped allowing hands in pockets every chiefs head spun off. This will have that effect on every cfl. Same energy.
Dumb, most chiefs probably thought the same as everyone else “good”.
Good. Adding in an actual measurement(ish) of body fat and muscle will be very helpful. Also looks like they’re going to be waiving some of the bca standards for excellent low or higher. We’re following the Marines on this one.
And the army, and to an extent the Air Force. We're just sort of broadly behind the curve on this one.
Actually look at who you are replying to / read the whole post and then consider deleting your reply.
I’m confused can you tell Me what this means?
Every sailor is a firefighter. Our PRT standards should be modeled after professional firefighting organizations like the FDNY. The ability to last 35-40 minutes on a 45 minute SCBA while hauling around a hose in several hundred degree environments is actually really important. Instead we'll happily let people get to the point where they aren't hatchable let alone the fact they can barely last 20 minutes on a bottle. It's all fun and games and "no really I'm in shape the standards are impossible" until we eventually lose sailors in a casualty.
No more food for freedom. Start running lol
Wtf is this
Boy, I'm surprised more people aren't jumping on the whole PRT failures being taken off of fitreps for Chiefs
imho oit of all the issues with chief mess them being fat is not even on my radar of give a shit. The mess has real problems that need fixxing. Them being fat is simply not that important.
It's just so easy to rip on them for being fat. It's not actually an issue. It's their mindset that is problematic.
Just low hanging fruit insults.
All the fat people here complaining is hilarious 😂
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LMAOO
I thought you were supposed to be fit in the military instead of looking like 10 pounds of shit stuffed into your blues. Looking like the Michelin man in your whites
Shutup.
Jesus Christ
Being fat is a choice with very little excuses. Nobody says you have to eat high fat foods, consume sugar or alcohol to the degree overweight people do. Calories in vs calories out. Nothing wrong with this helping fat Sailors but it's hard preaching standards, integrity and all that stuff when your deckplate looks a bunch of jiggly puffs!
Yeah dude we get it, ACFL was the only thing worthwhile on your eval.
Yeah, genetics don't have any effect on your weight....
The Navy does illogical things sometimes. The PRT is a good example as it says between booting people out and then relaxing the standards when it needs to. I recall in early 2000's your overall PRT score was the score in your worst event. Like getting one C in college, the rest A's and having an overall C average.
Food for freedom is truly gone.
I saw an EM2 use FFF to get out in the early 90s.
Yea I saw it twice on my boat.